View Full Version : Worst team we have ever put on the field
smilingassassin
24 Jun 2004, 19:16
Yeah I know we had our low spots in the 80's and I know we had bad days under Ken Judge but I don't believe we've ever been this low in talent.
In my opinion we are now putting our worst ever team on the field since our inception into the AFL.
I love Woosha and belive he'll eventually deliver the goods but it's time to put the blow tourch on a few hairy ars*s.
And I agree with those Purple Pansies fans who whinge about all the criticism they get when Freo plays badlywhile the WCE's escape such negative scrutiny.
Black JuJu
24 Jun 2004, 20:00
This is not the worst team we have put on the field...
Jeez..
bunsen burner
24 Jun 2004, 20:12
Originally posted by smilingassassin
And I agree with those Purple Pansies fans who whinge about all the criticism they get when Freo plays badlywhile the WCE's escape such negative scrutiny. I disagree. Whilst we are underperforming and down on confidence, we don't have a spine. Freo on the other hand have a team that should be top 4. They have been a huge let down this year.
Originally posted by smilingassassin
In my opinion we are now putting our worst ever team on the field since our inception into the AFL.
I suspect you've forgotten just how bad the Judgement days actually were. I refer you to our results sheet from 2001:
- we lost 17 of our 22 games with an average losing margin in those games of 62 points.
- including our occasional wins, for the season our average result was a 40 point loss.
- We lost two games by over 110 points, six by over 80 points and ten by more than 10 goals.
Originally posted by Mr Q
I suspect you've forgotten just how bad the Judgement days actually were. I refer you to our results sheet from 2001:
- we lost 17 of our 22 games with an average losing margin in those games of 62 points.
- including our occasional wins, for the season our average result was a 40 point loss.
- We lost two games by over 110 points, six by over 80 points and ten by more than 10 goals.
I agree with that
In essence, any team picked under Judge was a disaster!
Not even close to being our worst side. Were in 10th at the moment and have been pretty competitive all year. In all honesty we are a fit and firing Gardiner away from being a possible top 4 side but definite top 6 side.
The Mission Man
25 Jun 2004, 12:30
Q, just because WC fans can't help but ejaculate the words "Top 4" at seemingly random intervals doesn't give you the right to describe Freo's list as Top 4 material. That's your prerogative as a WCE fanboy for your own team. (viz Jod23)
We were always going to be light on in the full forward and centre half forward departments. We had the cattle to put there, they just had to learn the roles. Pretty tricky roles to learn as well.
Simmo is doing a pretty good job of transforming himself into a power leading forward and should have pretty much mastered it when we make our scheduled tilt for the four - next year.
This is a consolidation year for Fremantle. Always has been. Keep in the eight, improve percentage, win a few more away games, solidify the spine and get some games into the kids through the middle.
So far we're on track.
daddy_4_eyes
25 Jun 2004, 12:56
Originally posted by The Mission Man
This is a consolidation year for Fremantle. Always has been. Keep in the eight, improve percentage, win a few more away games, solidify the spine and get some games into the kids through the middle.
So far we're on track.
So Connolly's 8yr plan is coming along nicely?
The Mission Man
25 Jun 2004, 13:02
No such beast. You're getting the messages wrong, which is to be expected. "We keep this playing group together for 8 to 10 years." That's probably where you got the whole 8-year idea from but who knows with you guys, you only listen to what you want to hear.
Top 4
Top 4
Top 4
Top 4
Originally posted by smilingassassin
And I agree with those Terrific Purple People who whinge about all the criticism they get when Freo plays badlywhile the WCE's escape such negative scrutiny.
Good post.
This is such a good thread that I thought it should be bumped back up.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
Simmo is doing a pretty good job of transforming himself into a
power leading forward
what is a "power leading forward"?
The Mission Man
25 Jun 2004, 14:49
Also known as a "fat forward" the power forward uses size and speed to get to the pill rather than guile, wrestling ability or streetsmarts.
McDougall is a leading forward but he is not a power leading forward. More a powderpuff leading forward.
He's a big boy, is Simmo, and mighty swift off the mark. He is also a handy kick anywhere out to about 55 metres out.
He's getting his leads right more often than not.
He just needs a few more to stick in his hands when burning off some hack defender who normally only sees that amount of determined beef on the hoof when they're watching wildlife docos on the Discovery Channel.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
Also known as a "fat forward" the power forward uses size and speed to get to the pill rather than guile, wrestling ability or streetsmarts.
McDougall is a leading forward but he is not a power leading forward. More a powderpuff leading forward.
He's a big boy, is Simmo, and mighty swift off the mark. He is also a handy kick anywhere out to about 55 metres out.
He's getting his leads right more often than not.
He just needs a few more to stick in his hands when burning off some hack defender who normally only sees that amount of determined beef on the hoof when they're watching wildlife docos on the Discovery Channel.
Just love the way Dockers fans pump up their own.
The Mission Man
25 Jun 2004, 15:32
It's almost as good as watching you freaks savage one of your own.
Carroll? Kill him.
Green? Dog meat.
Collica? G-O-R-N.
Morrison? Soft.
Wirrpunda? Lazy.
Chambers? Inconsistent hack.
Banfield? Not a small defender's ********.
In go the slippers but apparently the only reason you're ninth is Gardy's injury.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
Q, just because WC fans can't help but ejaculate the words "Top 4" at seemingly random intervals doesn't give you the right to describe Freo's list as Top 4 material. That's your prerogative as a WCE fanboy for your own team. (viz Jod23)
Three little things Mish:
1) Point out to me where I described your team as top 4 material in this thread (I believe you'll find that it was bunsen). Quite clearly at the moment it's not.
2) Explain to me why if I so choose I don't have the right to describe Freo's list however I like. This isn't Dockerland. I can discuss the merits or otherwise of the lists of any team I like.
3) I just had a look through the Dockerland Vault. Ignoring predictions made late, the average predicted finish for Freo was 3.9. That seems like top four to me*. Since noone else is allowed to comment, sounds like the Dockers should have been a top four side.
*I sampled 40 entries - only six tipped the Dockers not to make the top four.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
In go the slippers but apparently the only reason you're ninth is Gardy's injury.
Actually we're 11th, I'd expect you to know that seeing how much you hang around Eagles forums.
Originally posted by Mr Q
the average predicted finish for Freo was 3.9. That seems like top four to me*. [/SIZE]
It seems that way but when multipied by the "supporters wishful thinking index" which is currently 1.5 it works out to be 5.85.
Streaker
25 Jun 2004, 16:40
Originally posted by RIPPER_46
It seems that way but when multipied by the "supporters wishful thinking index" which is currently 1.5 it works out to be 5.85.
You also need to add on the " My shyte don't stink player index" which is 1.3 so that puts you at 7.15 which means you might finish just inside the 8 or about where you are now.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
It's almost as good as watching you freaks savage one of your own.
Carroll? Kill him.
Green? Dog meat.
Collica? G-O-R-N.
Morrison? Soft.
Wirrpunda? Lazy.
Chambers? Inconsistent hack.
Banfield? Not a small defender's ********.
In go the slippers but apparently the only reason you're ninth is Gardy's injury.
And Dockers fans don't?
Trent Croad ring a bell?
Clive, Cunningham, J&T Longmuir, Medhurst, Siegert and Parker have all come in for plenty from some of your confreres.
Originally posted by Exeter
And Dockers fans don't?
Trent Croad ring a bell?
Clive, Cunningham, J&T Longmuir, Medhurst, Siegert and Parker have all come in for plenty from some of your confreres.
True , but I think you will find that most of the critic's are newbies who have picked up bad habits from your mob.
The big difference is there is usually as many or more spring to defend them.
The Mission Man
25 Jun 2004, 16:57
Originally posted by Mr Q
Three little things Mish:
1) Point out to me where I described your team as top 4 material in this thread (I believe you'll find that it was bunsen). Quite clearly at the moment it's not.
Woops. Sorry. And, yes, it's not - and that's my chief point. Believing that a list is top 4 material and then saying they are a disappointment when they're not, may say more about you.
Originally posted by Mr Q
2) Explain to me why if I so choose I don't have the right to describe Freo's list however I like. This isn't Dockerland. I can discuss the merits or otherwise of the lists of any team I like.
Refer to above. You can do what you like but why hold it against an opposition team when they don't meet your expectations? I was saying that Weavils fans love to slap the top 4 label on their team and that your fondness for doing so shouldn't extend, in that frontrunning way of yours, to Fremantle.
Originally posted by Mr Q
3) I just had a look through the Dockerland Vault. Ignoring predictions made late, the average predicted finish for Freo was 3.9. That seems like top four to me*. Since noone else is allowed to comment, sounds like the Dockers should have been a top four side.
*I sampled 40 entries - only six tipped the Dockers not to make the top four.
You presume that I said no-one else is allowed to comment. Creating false premises is always a good way to win arguments but here you lose again. Why? (Other than the season not being over yet.)
Given you like to point the hypocritical finger when it comes to hanging around at opposition forums, if you knew anything about Dockerland - which, it seems, you quite plainly don't - you'd know the vault is more like a comedy improv night than a serious expression of football prognostication.
I don't think I said we'd be top 4. I can't remember but I reckon I would have had us between 5 and 8 but what do I know - I've been tipping Richmond for the top 4 for as long as I can remember.
fitzmantle
25 Jun 2004, 17:04
Trent Croad ring a bell?
Who knows what he's doing back in Melbourne these days? Maybe it was Trent who had his bell confiscated at the Ess game.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
I've been tipping Richmond for the top 4 for as long as I can remember.
Now that's funny!
Can't say I've done that in the last 20 years.
The Mission Man
25 Jun 2004, 17:08
See? Any Richmond top4 prediction is instant comedy hour.
And I see I tipped us for 6th or 7th.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
See? Any Richmond top4 prediction is instant comedy hour.
And I see I tipped us for 6th or 7th.
Coincidently, so did I.
Mind you I also tipped the Eagles at 8 and Melbourne to finish last
The Mission Man
25 Jun 2004, 17:30
I had the Saints in the eight but not top - obviously.
Geelong I also had in the eight.
I had Adelaide and you blokes falling out of last year's eight - and everyone else the same. I didn't think Colon Wood would side that far although I thought they would slide.
You blokes I tipped for ninth - where you may be for years if you don't bite the bullet and bounce along the bottom for a while.
I didn't really have Richmond top 4. I didn't do the bottom 8 as they don't count.
11th, eh?
Biting bullets and bouncing along bottoms is a mixed metaphor I'd rather not entertain thankyou.
Just looking at my preseason, end of 22 round prognostication and it looks like this:
Port Adelaide
Sydney
Brisbane
Collingwood
Saint Kilda
Adelaide
Fremantle
West Coast
Essendon
Hawthorn
Western Bulldogs
Kangaroos
Geelong
Richmond
Carlton
Melbourne
A sterling example of why I'm not a punter of any note.
Frankly, Colonwood can't slide far enough as far as I'm concerned.
I've said elsewhere that we've invested heavily in a high risk strategy for a few years - namely not trading to any great extent and hoping our players, particularly our talls will come on.
Yes, we could benefit from finishing last and creaming draft picks - but that's foreign to our culture.
I know realistic assessments of the Eagles squad are not fashionable amongst Dockers fans - they're too busy guffawing at our indisposition, but I fully expect, with a few changes to the squad, that we'll be top eight again next year and, if we're serious, top four contenders the year after.
If not, all positions at the club - coaching staff, playing group and mangement, are up for grabs.
Much like the Dockers in fact.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
Woops. Sorry. And, yes, it's not - and that's my chief point. Believing that a list is top 4 material and then saying they are a disappointment when they're not, may say more about you.
If you believe a team is top four material and they don't get there it may be disappointing or exhilarating depending on which team it is. Since most pundits had Freo as a top 4 side you'd have to say they've let those pundits down - albeit not as much as Colonwood have.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
Refer to above. You can do what you like but why hold it against an opposition team when they don't meet your expectations? I was saying that Weavils fans love to slap the top 4 label on their team and that your fondness for doing so shouldn't extend, in that frontrunning way of yours, to Fremantle.
I'm not holding it against you. Don't think bunsen was either.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
You presume that I said no-one else is allowed to comment. Creating false premises is always a good way to win arguments but here you lose again. Why? (Other than the season not being over yet.)
You wrote (and I quote:) "just because WC fans can't help but ejaculate the words "Top 4" at seemingly random intervals doesn't give you the right to describe Freo's list as Top 4 material". Now I was assuming that you meant supporters of other clubs weren't allowed opinions on Freo, or at the minimum that Eagles supporters weren't allowed opinions on Freo. Guess it must just be me that you object to. Which is very odd since I never expressed the opinion in the first place.
Incidentally when was the last time you heard Eagles supporters talking about "Top 4" anyway other than as a reference to other clubs?
Originally posted by The Mission Man
Given you like to point the hypocritical finger when it comes to hanging around at opposition forums, if you knew anything about Dockerland - which, it seems, you quite plainly don't - you'd know the vault is more like a comedy improv night than a serious expression of football prognostication.
Well I know that Dockerland is the home of shane's best deletin' finger and that it has a fairly high feral content.
FYI, I looked through a lot more than 40 of the options, but I eliminated most of the ones that sounded like someone was pulling the ****.
As for hypocracy, I asked why you hung around Eagles boards when you clearly don't think other supporters have the right to express what they think about your team. Since I don't hold that opinion, its not hypocracy for me to look at other club boards.
Originally posted by The Mission Man
I don't think I said we'd be top 4. I can't remember but I reckon I would have had us between 5 and 8 but what do I know - I've been tipping Richmond for the top 4 for as long as I can remember.
Well whoop-de-doo.
Mark Viduka
27 Jun 2004, 15:20
Carlton 3.4 10.8 16.10 21.16 142
Brisbane Lions 2.3 3.7 8.11 9.14 68
Date: 19-May-2001 Att. 21,997 Played at: Princes Park
Remember that day... they called the side that Brisbane had in as one of the worst sides ever. This was their team that day.
12 Jason Akermanis
10 Marcus Ashcroft
20 Simon Black
16 Jonathan Brown
1 Des Headland
2 Chris Johnson
27 Clark Keating
41 Matthew Kennedy
45 Trent Knobel
44 Nigel Lappin
11 Alastair Lynch
43 Beau McDonald
15 Mal Michael
8 Tim Notting
24 Marcus Picken
13 Martin Pike
28 Ben Robbins
5 Brad Scott
22 Chris Scott
34 Aaron Shattock
3 Michael Voss
33 Darryl White
This side won the first of its 3 flags 4 months later.
Here is something else for you to mull over..... in 1998 the Brisbane Lions were universally regarded as one of the worst sides ever to play the AFL. They finished the 1998 season with only 5 wins on the bottom of the ladder. Here is a list of their players that they had in their team that year along with the amount of games they have played to that stage. The 18 Lions players listed all have become members of their premiership teams. I didn't include Lions players such as Craig Lambert, Jarrad Molloy, Brett Voss, Danny Dickfos. Shane O'Bree, Andrew Bews because they didn't play in the premiership teams... but they were a member of the sides in 1998 and some added 100's of games of experience. On the right is a comparison with the current Eagles players.
Marcus Ashcroft (197 games) Cousins, Ben (181)
Alistair Lynch (190 games) Chick, Daniel (176)
Shaun Hart (110 games) Matera, Phillip (150)
Darryl White (112 games) Morrison, Chad (138)
Nigel Lappin (102 games) Braun, Michael (127)
Michael Voss (101 games) Wirrpunda, David 118)
Chris Johnson(92 games) Jones, Rowan (100)
Justin Leppitsch (82 games) Fletcher, Chad (88)
Chris Scott (81 games) Embley, Andrew (86)
Craig McRae(73 games) Kerr, Daniel (75)
Jason Akermanis(72 games) Cox, Dean (68)
Brad Scott (41 games) Glass, Darren (61)
Clark Keating (41 games) Judd, Chris (58)
Daniel Bradshaw (35 games) Chambers, Callum (54)
Luke Power (9 games) Hunter, Adam (53)
Simon Black (9 games) Gaspar, Travis (26)
Tim Notting (5 games) McDougall, Andrew (24)
Beau McDonald (3 games) Lynch, Quinten (23)
Staker, Brent (17)
Nicoski, Mark (9)
Jones, Brett (7)
Seaby, Mark (7)
Selwood, Adam (5)
Waters, Beau (4)
Butler, Sam (4)
Hansen, Ashley (3)
My point being that Premiership teams are not made overnight. That 1998 Lions team was universally acknowledged one of the worst ever yet you look at the names of the players and they made up the core of the premiership teams now. The problem was that they were just starting out their careers and in the case of Voss,Lappin,White, Leppitch, Scott, Akermanis etc they were in their 4th to 5th year of football and were nowhere near the players they are now. Look at our team we are playing and 10 of them havent even played 10 games yet!!!!!!!!!!!
I've been around long enough to know that what Worsfold is doing may be giving us short term pain... but in the longterm it could turn into something beautiful. My advice when you watch our team is to just to sit back, not worry about winning and just enjoy watching these young guys improve and turn into the side for the next 10 years.
The Mission Man
28 Jun 2004, 13:36
Originally posted by Mr Q
You wrote (and I quote:) "just because WC fans can't help but ejaculate the words "Top 4" at seemingly random intervals doesn't give you the right to describe Freo's list as Top 4 material". Now I was assuming that you meant supporters of other clubs weren't allowed opinions on Freo, or at the minimum that Eagles supporters weren't allowed opinions on Freo.
Yes, you were assuming. A tad presumptuous of you, really.
Originally posted by Mr Q
Incidentally when was the last time you heard Eagles supporters talking about "Top 4" anyway other than as a reference to other clubs?
Are you even remotely serious?
Originally posted by Mr Q
Well I know that Dockerland is the home of shane's best deletin' finger and that it has a fairly high feral content.
Still banging on about "deleting fingers"? You must have been hurt terribly. What's the matter, did you actually say something worthwhile?
And when it comes to the tribalism of football, "feral" is a compliment. It's probably not the done thing when you're trying to impress someone while driving Mum's Volvo to UWA, but being extraordinarily unreasonable in your commitment to your football team is alright by me. It's what has spun the wheels of the Great Game for a century or so. And long may it be so.
Originally posted by Mr Q
As for hypocracy, I asked why you hung around Eagles boards when you clearly don't think other supporters have the right to express what they think about your team. Since I don't hold that opinion, its not hypocracy for me to look at other club boards.
Hey, joke-not-getter, you are the one saying I don't think other supporters have a right to express an opinion "what they think" about my team. I said Weavils supporters shouldn't apply their perennially over-optimistic expectations to Fremantle - nothing even remotely like the handing-down of some fatwah against the expression of these valuable opinions.
You have, dare I say it, gone out on a frolic of your own. Again.