View Full Version : what will Essendons alternative strip look like in you guys opinions
Its gonna happen for sure, sooner or later, probably sooner
I reckon maybe all black would look cool
I shall quote from the Constitution of the Essendon Football Club, which was approved after the 2000 season and accepted by the AFL.
Name:
2 - The name of the Club or its colours will not be changed except by Special Resolution.
Motto, Colours, Uniform and Home Ground:
4 - Colours The Colours of the Club will be red and black
5- Uniform The uniform for the AFL Premiership season will consist of a black jumper or guernsey with a red sah, red and black socks and white or black shorts. Such uniform will be worn at all matches subject to the rules and directions of the AFL.
So basically, the members of the club MUST agree to any change before it comes in...and I am quoting from the hard copy of the club's constitution, which is covered under Corporations law, as we a public company, limited by guarantee.
That dosen't mean it can't happen pazza. The sooner it does the better.
SydneyBomber
14 Dec 2004, 18:06
I shall quote from the Constitution of the Essendon Football Club, which was approved after the 2000 season and accepted by the AFL.
Name:
2 - The name of the Club or its colours will not be changed except by Special Resolution.
Motto, Colours, Uniform and Home Ground:
4 - Colours The Colours of the Club will be red and black
5- Uniform The uniform for the AFL Premiership season will consist of a black jumper or guernsey with a red sah, red and black socks and white or black shorts. Such uniform will be worn at all matches subject to the rules and directions of the AFL.
So basically, the members of the club MUST agree to any change before it comes in...and I am quoting from the hard copy of the club's constitution, which is covered under Corporations law, as we a public company, limited by guarantee.
and so say all of us.
call me a sad old man, but I'll be voting no next time it's raised.
:)
If a suitable alternative jumper could be made, I would consider it at a vote, but, the alternative would want to be the best it could be otherwise the backlash could be a lot worse.
missionpossible
14 Dec 2004, 20:32
I would have thought the simple solution for an alternative strip would have been red with a black sash.
Napier_Street
14 Dec 2004, 22:35
I am neither for nor against - although I cant understand the rabid reaction you get from some Bomber fans whenever this subject is brought up - I mean its not like the traditional guernsey will ever be fully replaced.
I like the idea of all black with red trim around the collar and the cuffs. Simple but bloody intimidating
EssendonPride
14 Dec 2004, 23:16
http://www.sportscapital.com.au/catalog/images/essejersey.jpg
I think that could make quite a nice alternative strip.
Pfft if theres a clash get the other team to change. We dont want to :p
[Edit] Ooh there we go dont think i could have made my 100th post any more useless and stupid than that. Go me
Napier_Street
15 Dec 2004, 09:27
http://www.sportscapital.com.au/catalog/images/essejersey.jpg
I think that could make quite a nice alternative strip.
Pfft if theres a clash get the other team to change. We dont want to :p
[Edit] Ooh there we go dont think i could have made my 100th post any more useless and stupid than that. Go me
Cant argue with that - maybe post 200 will be a little more imaginative
Pevers-Legend
15 Dec 2004, 09:35
Let everyone else change their guernsey. We haven't in over 100 years. Perhaps we cna change the colour of the 3 logo. Aways games we could say use a green logo.
Alternative strip - how about the centenary strip - the smaller sash - thats all I would accept.
Otherwise go get f......... :D
bOmBeR_BoY1
15 Dec 2004, 10:32
Why has this suddenly become an issue all of a sudden?
For over 100 years now, Essendon has used the same guernsey against 'clash' teams like St Kilda & Melbourne... why has it suddenly become so imperative to change? Did you hear people 10 years ago complain? 20? 30?
Best Guy Ever
15 Dec 2004, 10:37
why dont you guys want one, that black guernsey with red trimmings would look really scary and awesome. Your club might make some money, get it back on par with Collingwood
That dosen't mean it can't happen pazza. The sooner it does the better.
Agreed. I can't believe that we haven't got one already. It will avoid clashes and make it easy for spectators to pick up players when we play Richmond and Melbourne.
But yeah...this has already been done to death.
gPhonque
15 Dec 2004, 18:12
Agreed. I can't believe that we haven't got one already. It will avoid clashes and make it easy for spectators to pick up players when we play Richmond and Melbourne.
Richmond wouldn't be a problem if they hadn't gone and changed THEIR guernsey a few years ago and got rid of the yellow sash on the back.
The thing that annoys me about this is the fact that all the other clubs have gradually made their guernseys DARKER and MORE CLUTTERED over the past 10 years....
....and now WE are expected to change for THEM?
It really doesn't help when the other club guernseys now have all kinds of ugly and ridiculous logos and symbols all over them.....cluttering them up so much that the actual colours are not seen as well. This is a big part of the problem these days, and a big reason why we should tell everybody to stick it up their orse.
I do not understand the stupidity of the people who make these decisions sometimes.....
Why create a fancy logo for a football guernsey that cannot be seen by ANYBODY at the ground and which only succeeds in covering up the parts of the guernsey that ARE recognisable at the ground (that being the COLOURS!) .......and then complain about Essendon's simple and easy to recognise guernsey?
It's like drinking a slab of beer rather than staying content with the six-pack you usually drink.......and then complaining about being too drunk!
The AFL have only themselves to blame.
So I say phuk em.
I think you misunderstand, or do not know the AFL's intention on Clash jumpers.
If the AFL decreee multiple jumpers are required, they must be predominantly in supposed non-clash colours.
Therefore, our jumpers will not be allowed to be predominantly Black, Red, Navy, Yellow or White.
While clubs can make their own, they will be in team colours, like Melbourne's was when they played earlier this year.
Which begs the question, did they look that much different from us, from their Blue jumper they wore in the finals?
Essendon's Clash jumper would have to be Sky Blue, or Lime Green, or similar unused AFL colour. Black and Red might make it onto the collar or the club logo might be on the front.
Something like this:
http://home.iprimus.com.au/teagloccal/EssClash.gif
If the AFL don't decree Clash jumpers, no Essendon board will have the guts to even raise it at a level where a vote is taken on it. It will remain Black with a Red Sash.
I shall quote from the Constitution of the Essendon Football Club, which was approved after the 2000 season and accepted by the AFL.
Name:
2 - The name of the Club or its colours will not be changed except by Special Resolution.
Motto, Colours, Uniform and Home Ground:
4 - Colours The Colours of the Club will be red and black
5- Uniform The uniform for the AFL Premiership season will consist of a black jumper or guernsey with a red sah, red and black socks and white or black shorts. Such uniform will be worn at all matches subject to the rules and directions of the AFL.
So basically, the members of the club MUST agree to any change before it comes in...and I am quoting from the hard copy of the club's constitution, which is covered under Corporations law, as we a public company, limited by guarantee.
"Such uniform will be worn at all matches subject to the rules and directions of the AFL"
If the AFL rules state that we are compelled to use a clash jumper when playing away against team X, it would not be a breach of our constitution to abide by those rules. If the AFL rules state that we must play in a T-shirt and a tutu, our constitution would allow us to play in an orange T-shirt, and gold tutu.
I really don't think that these "rules" or "directions" would have to be entirely formal or even written down. If there was a general convention of utilising a clash jumper, I think a wide interpretation of the Essendon FC constitution would allow for the use of a clash jumper.
Pevers-Legend
16 Dec 2004, 11:31
Richmond wouldn't be a problem if they hadn't gone and changed THEIR guernsey a few years ago and got rid of the yellow sash on the back.
The thing that annoys me about this is the fact that all the other clubs have gradually made their guernseys DARKER and MORE CLUTTERED over the past 10 years....
....and now WE are expected to change for THEM?
we have a winner - everyone can change theirs to lok more like ours, but we have to then change for them - change back.
"Such uniform will be worn at all matches subject to the rules and directions of the AFL"
If the AFL rules state that we are compelled to use a clash jumper when playing away against team X, it would not be a breach of our constitution to abide by those rules. If the AFL rules state that we must play in a T-shirt and a tutu, our constitution would allow us to play in an orange T-shirt, and gold tutu.
I really don't think that these "rules" or "directions" would have to be entirely formal or even written down. If there was a general convention of utilising a clash jumper, I think a wide interpretation of the Essendon FC constitution would allow for the use of a clash jumper.
You mention 'a wide interpretation' would allow for a Clash jumper.
What do you base your interpretation on?
Constitutional law?
It is written down, in plain English, and was in 1873, that Essendon shall wear black with a red sash. Only.
To change it, would require changes at the constitutional level, by a majority vote of members.
Now, if the AFL decrees all teams shall play in a Clash jumper, and lose the points if they don't. Then the majority of members will vote for it.
Until then, our jumpers will remain Black with a Red sash.
Diamond_Joe
16 Dec 2004, 15:41
Now, if the AFL decrees all teams shall play in a Clash jumper, and lose the points if they don't. Then the majority of members will vote for it.
Is that before or after we take the AFL to court?? We or should I say, I as a paid up member have the vote, not the bloody AFL. Might as well count me in as the minority cause it would take an act of god for me to agree to change our famous jumper. Black and Red from the start, black and red till the end of time (not till I die)
Stealth bomber
16 Dec 2004, 15:59
FWIW, I think I saw that Richmond was bringing back the sash on the back again for next year.
This was brought up at the AGM again tonight. The AFL can force us to change if they ammend their 'laws' as they own all insignia etc. that we signed in agreeance to in 1985. If that happens, the members vote means ******** all and the change will have to occur.(Essendons own legal advice was this).
At this stage, the AFL has not appeared to have bothered changing anything.
DONT NEED ONE!
DONT WANT ONE!
:mad: :mad: :mad:
slugger
17 Dec 2004, 11:12
Why do people bring up Richmond as a potential clash? To my mind, it's the red that causes the clash - Melbourne and St Kilda.
There's never a clash with Richmond - we're the team that's got the ball.
Why is it that Essendon has been playing Melbourne and StKilda for 130 and 110 years respectively, and yet it's only the last few years there seems to be a clash?
Does anyone remember the mud at Moorabbin?
Yet who complained about not telling one team from the other?
I think it's a beat up by clubs to try and produce another thing to sell in the club shops. (Including Essendon's management, who would like to be told to do it by the AFL, but until then, won't do anything as they will get voted out)
I personally can't see what the fuss is about. So we'll wear a different jumper for about two games at the most. Big deal.
maybe I'm looking at it too simplistically, but isn't the whole intention of different uniforms to be so that people could easily tell one team from another?
surely when the league first formed, uniforms were chosen/adapted so that all teams had quite unique uniforms. Then as new teams entered, they had to choose a uniform that was also unique and didn't clash. (Mero, you'll be the one with the knowledge to help me out with that!)
As gPhonque said, the problem has happened with others altering their original guernseys, and the colours have changed from the original non-clashing style.
So the answer to me seems quite simple - those clubs that have changed their guernseys so that they now clash - change them back so that they don't.
maybe I'm looking at it too simplistically, but isn't the whole intention of different uniforms to be so that people could easily tell one team from another?
surely when the league first formed, uniforms were chosen/adapted so that all teams had quite unique uniforms. Then as new teams entered, they had to choose a uniform that was also unique and didn't clash. (Mero, you'll be the one with the knowledge to help me out with that!)
As gPhonque said, the problem has happened with others altering their original guernseys, and the colours have changed from the original non-clashing style.
So the answer to me seems quite simple - those clubs that have changed their guernseys so that they now clash - change them back so that they don't.
Completely agree Koala.
Melbourne changed in 1987 back to Navy Blue, after being in Royal Blue from the advent of colour telly.
So they can bring out a lighter blue if they think there's a problem.
StKilda wore Yellow with Red and Black around the time of the 2nd World War.
Go back to that. They had more white in their jumper up until the 50's, and wore that in Heritage week, put that jumper on.
We wear Black with a Red sash, and have done since 1873.
Why should we change just because other clubs want to look like us?
I think it's a beat up by clubs to try and produce another thing to sell in the club shops.
Yet everyone was happy for us to prostitute our jumper into a walking billboard for anyone that would throw a dollar or two at us?
Is that before or after we take the AFL to court?? We or should I say, I as a paid up member have the vote, not the bloody AFL. Might as well count me in as the minority cause it would take an act of god for me to agree to change our famous jumper. Black and Red from the start, black and red till the end of time (not till I die)
You do realise the AFL owns everything that makes Essendon "Essendon", dont you?
Legally, the Essendon Football club cant do $h_it about it. Dont let anyone brainwash you otherwise.
maybe I'm looking at it too simplistically, but isn't the whole intention of different uniforms to be so that people could easily tell one team from another?
surely when the league first formed, uniforms were chosen/adapted so that all teams had quite unique uniforms. Then as new teams entered, they had to choose a uniform that was also unique and didn't clash. (Mero, you'll be the one with the knowledge to help me out with that!)
As gPhonque said, the problem has happened with others altering their original guernseys, and the colours have changed from the original non-clashing style.
So the answer to me seems quite simple - those clubs that have changed their guernseys so that they now clash - change them back so that they don't.
IMO the two biggest contributors of the Jumper clash are:
1. The new lycra type jumpers. They are a reflective material, and depending on angles of lights/sun, the colours often are very hard to distinguish. Watch older tapes in woolen jumpers, the colours are very much crisper and clearer, especially in periphial vision.
2. Jumpers arnt jumpers anymore, they are billboards. All clubs have all sorts of colours and designs splashed all over the front, back and shorts from companies who throw money at them. It obviously turns the jumper into a mess of colours, which obviously contributes.
Look at our jumper, even tho our colours are red and black, from behind, the most noticable and overwhelming colour is white....the number and the big white block with "three" written in it.
dogsbody
18 Dec 2004, 10:36
Look at our jumper, even tho our colours are red and black, from behind, the most noticable and overwhelming colour is white....the number and the big white block with "three" written in it.Especially if the number is 18 and its an away game. Toss in those particular shorts and any black or red is reduced to insignificance.
The commercial realities are that if the AFL ordains that Essendon, or any club for that matter, adopt a "clash" or "away" strip, even one like Mero's, it won't matter what the constitution says, the team will wear the new jumper. Having said that, if Essendon doesn't want to wear any jumper but the black with red sash, then why should it ? This business about clashing colours etc is wildly over rated.
gPhonque
18 Dec 2004, 12:48
IMO the two biggest contributors of the Jumper clash are:
1. The new lycra type jumpers. They are a reflective material, and depending on angles of lights/sun, the colours often are very hard to distinguish. Watch older tapes in woolen jumpers, the colours are very much crisper and clearer, especially in periphial vision.
2. Jumpers arnt jumpers anymore, they are billboards. All clubs have all sorts of colours and designs splashed all over the front, back and shorts from companies who throw money at them. It obviously turns the jumper into a mess of colours, which obviously contributes.
They are exactly the 2 points I made.
(along with the general "darkening" of other teams guernseys)
I think you misunderstand, or do not know the AFL's intention on Clash jumpers.
If the AFL decreee multiple jumpers are required, they must be predominantly in supposed non-clash colours.
Therefore, our jumpers will not be allowed to be predominantly Black, Red, Navy, Yellow or White.
While clubs can make their own, they will be in team colours, like Melbourne's was when they played earlier this year.
Which begs the question, did they look that much different from us, from their Blue jumper they wore in the finals?
Essendon's Clash jumper would have to be Sky Blue, or Lime Green, or similar unused AFL colour. Black and Red might make it onto the collar or the club logo might be on the front.
Something like this:
http://home.iprimus.com.au/teagloccal/EssClash.gif
If the AFL don't decree Clash jumpers, no Essendon board will have the guts to even raise it at a level where a vote is taken on it. It will remain Black with a Red Sash.
That jumper is a good colour design, but I prefer simpler styles (such as stripes, or sashes) in a jumper.
The simplest and best jumper would be to replace the black with silver. After all, fighter jets are silver, right? It would look good, it wouldn't clash, for the 2 or 3 times it would needed to be used, and it would be another item to sell.
Essendon, is generally speaking one of the more forward thinking progressive clubs. We should have been the first team to do this back in the 60's or 70's when colour TV came in.
The fact we are the only team never to have changed is an absolute embarrassment to me. It reeks of arrogance and self-importance and paints the picture of a club unwilling to progress. We should have done this 30 years ago, before anyone else, and sadly (and pathetically), we look like being the last.
For those that don't want to change. What possible postives are there in refusing to change when there is a clash? If we do change 2 or 3 times a year, the positive is that a jumper clash makes it easier for the players and fans to differentiate.
Does keeping the same jumper help us win games? No. Does changing a jumper take away from history that has already happened? No. Does changing a jumper make fans less passionate? Of course not. Change the f**ing jumper, 2 or 3 times a year for God's sake. How hard is it? Just do it.
EssendonPride
20 Dec 2004, 21:47
Essendon, is generally speaking one of the more forward thinking progressive clubs. We should have been the first team to do this back in the 60's or 70's when colour TV came in.
The fact we are the only team never to have changed is an absolute embarrassment to me. It reeks of arrogance and self-importance and paints the picture of a club unwilling to progress. We should have done this 30 years ago, before anyone else, and sadly (and pathetically), we look like being the last.
Sorry i just found it funny how you're saying we should have changed when colour TV was brought in, yet you want to take the colour out of the jumpers :S (i assume by silver you mean grey, not shiny... After all its not a disco)
I dont think the silver stripe would look too good, the design Mero did would look much better imo.
You may think that changing the colour wont change history, but truth is, its become tradition. Traditions are just that because they arent changed "2 or 3 times a year".
Either way i wouldnt be too fussed if it was changed, just seeing it from both sides. Id always prefer it to stay the same, but with the other clubs jumpers becoming more like ours, it may be inevitable.
They are exactly the 2 points I made.
(along with the general "darkening" of other teams guernseys)
hence it should be no huge drama if we changed.
I cant believe the negative response this issue gets.
hence it should be no huge drama if we changed.
I cant believe the negative response this issue gets.
Because for 130 years we've worn the same colours and design.
No other club has done this. Probably in ANY sport.
And yet, because poorer clubs want to raise some revenue, and head off a backlash from their members, we are told we might have to change because they want something else to sell at their club shops.
To me, that's the issue. 130 years of no clash. And now, because 'jumpers are shiny' and 'the game is quicker', we have to disregard that 130 years and wear some cobbled together crap that Puma will design in Sydney and look like rubbish.
I don't accept that there are clashes, just as I didn't 5 years ago when noone mentioned the supposed problem.
I don't doubt for a minute the Essendon management would prefer to have one. But they can't be seen to want one, as people like myself outnumber people like yourself. And we'd vote them out.
Because for 130 years we've worn the same colours and design.
For the first year or two of existance we had red and black stripes.
I don't accept that there are clashes
that is the issue.
IMO there is a colour clash problem. Officials, players and many fans acknowlegde this. If you dont fine, but IMO the biggest contributors to the "clash" are the jumpers and advertising, and IMO we are as much to blame for those as any other club, no more, no less, just as much.
Also
1. You say no club has had the same jumper for 130 years - you are probably correct, and that includes Essendon. The Essendon football club has had other styles...think North Melbourne/Collingwood. Sure, it wasnt in the VFL, but the EFC has been around longer than the VFL/AFL.
2. Youre main theme of your post is to do with 130 years, tradition etc. Obviously, to you, our jumper is sacred, correct?
Well, thats one thing that makes my wanna puke when mates of mine tell me the same thing. We prostitute our jumper out to any company that will pay, front, back, it doesnt matter, that "sacred jumper" is up for sale.
Our jumper is not sacred, dont let anyone brainwash you otherwise. This was evident the day we first prostituted this apparently "sacred" jumper of ours. Just like you dont wanna buy the argument that there are clashes, I dont wanna hear anything of any sort that our jumper is sacred. It isnt, and it's a fact.
Raskolnikov
22 Dec 2004, 20:06
I would have thought the simple solution for an alternative strip would have been red with a black sash.
seconded -and bring back the red shorts :D
Because for 130 years we've worn the same colours and design.
Who the hell cares? As long as the team wins, who cares how long a particular jumper has been worn? That's nothing to be proud of. It doesn't take any extra effort to not change a jumper. In fact, it's lazy because no effort is required. Anyone can be lazy and NOT change. It takes a massive amount of effort, however, to win a premiership, and that is what we should be concerned about.
No other club has done this. Probably in ANY sport.
So what? That's nothing to be pround of. I want to be proud of a team that wins, not be pround of a team that wears the same jumper every game.
And yet, because poorer clubs want to raise some revenue, and head off a backlash from their members, we are told we might have to change because they want something else to sell at their club shops.
No. We (and this includes me) want to change to avoid jumper clashes. Extra revenue from extra jumper sales is an added bonus that shouldn't be snubbed either I might add.
To me, that's the issue. 130 years of no clash. And now, because 'jumpers are shiny' and 'the game is quicker', we have to disregard that 130 years..
No one is disregarding anything. Is Manchester United's history somehow tarnished because they wear different desings? Of course not. Wearing the same jumper every match is nothing to be proud of. Changing the jumper does not change history. History is history - it has already happened.
P.S. Essendon first jumper in the early 1870s was black and red vertical stripes. The fact that the club refused to ackowledge the clubs first ever strip for the two hertiage rounds in 2003 and 2004 shows a lack of respect for the traditions of the club in my opinion. If that was the ONLY different strip we have ever worn, and it also happened to be the first strip ever, why in the f*** wasn't it used for the heritage round?
Stealth bomber
23 Dec 2004, 21:48
Our jumper is not sacred, dont let anyone brainwash you otherwise. This was evident the day we first prostituted this apparently "sacred" jumper of ours.
I tend to agree. I think it pretty much lost sacred status when they began using it to advertise meat products, bricks, mobile phones, and questionable traffic authority concerns.
P.S. Essendon first jumper in the early 1870s was black and red vertical stripes. The fact that the club refused to ackowledge the clubs first ever strip for the two hertiage rounds in 2003 and 2004 shows a lack of respect for the traditions of the club in my opinion. If that was the ONLY different strip we have ever worn, and it also happened to be the first strip ever, why in the f*** wasn't it used for the heritage round?
Ever seen a photo from 1873 of the team wearing this supposed jumper?
Don't feel bad, noone else has either.*
The club were formed and the colours agreed upon, but all club records show the players only ever actually wearing black with a red sash in games.
That is why there's huge support for retaining the one jumper we've ever worn.
*If you doubt me, contact Gregor McCaskie, curator of the Hall of Fame, and he will confirm that there are no records of Essendon actually wearing Black and Red stripes in a game.
The club cannot wear stripes, as this violates the constitution, that members have to vote on alternate jumpers. Members may not vote on Heirtage jumpers as the AFL wants them kept secret until revelaed in Heritage week.(For reasons best known to them)
that is the issue.
IMO there is a colour clash problem. Officials, players and many fans acknowlegde this. If you dont fine, but IMO the biggest contributors to the "clash" are the jumpers and advertising, and IMO we are as much to blame for those as any other club, no more, no less, just as much.
Also
1. You say no club has had the same jumper for 130 years - you are probably correct, and that includes Essendon. The Essendon football club has had other styles...think North Melbourne/Collingwood. Sure, it wasnt in the VFL, but the EFC has been around longer than the VFL/AFL.
2. Youre main theme of your post is to do with 130 years, tradition etc. Obviously, to you, our jumper is sacred, correct?
Well, thats one thing that makes my wanna puke when mates of mine tell me the same thing. We prostitute our jumper out to any company that will pay, front, back, it doesnt matter, that "sacred jumper" is up for sale.
Our jumper is not sacred, dont let anyone brainwash you otherwise. This was evident the day we first prostituted this apparently "sacred" jumper of ours. Just like you dont wanna buy the argument that there are clashes, I dont wanna hear anything of any sort that our jumper is sacred. It isnt, and it's a fact.
So are you saying my issue is with the Clashing jumpers? Or the tradition aspect?
It's actually the 130 years of not clashing, and now, suddenly, there is a problem.
OK, the games, quicker, and the material they're made of reflects the light.
But to me, people are being sold a problem that doesn't exist, simply to allow clubs more opportunity to get into our pockets.
I think I agree with you on the prostituting of the jumper.
But that doesn't make it right.
Surely you agree with me, that the jumper should be sacred, and we agree it isn't. But does that mean we should prostitute it further?
As I've said above, there's mention of the official colours originally being listed and Black and Red stripes, but the club website should now set you straight http://www.essendonfc.com.au/history/
The first game was played in the same jumper we wore in Heritage week last year.
Best Coast
27 Dec 2004, 23:20
come on melbourne and essendon clash just like west coast away and western bulldogs, youre gonna have to alternate who wears the alternative strip, I like the silver with red sash idea.
I also like the idea of inverted essendon uniform
OK, the games, quicker, and the material they're made of reflects the light.
But to me, people are being sold a problem that doesn't exist, simply to allow clubs more opportunity to get into our pockets.
Thats the main issue. Im as cynical as anyone when it comes to the AFL, wouldnt trust em as far as I could throw em...but I simply will not have that argument that the clash doesnt exist thrown down my throught. Why? Because I attend many games, have done so for years, and at certain games I am truly frustrated due to clashes. It is extremely obvious we clash with certain clubs.
There are many reasons as pointed out earlier why clashes are now more evident. It isnt a marketing ploy, it is a genuine problem and IMO is a problem the AFL should grab by the balls and do something about, because it makes its organisation look unproffesional IMO.
But does that mean we should prostitute it further?
Once a whore, always a whore. If a sheila is happy to live on her back at $200 an hour for 40 years, whats the difference if she gets another couple?
And while we didnt wear our "original" jumper it doesnt matter IMO. When our club was formed, the "official" jumper was red and black stripes. No, we didnt have an opportunity to wear it, but so what. Everyone cries "tradition", well tradition also states that when our club was FORMED, our official jumper was different. This is different to a jumper idea....we had an official jumper, we just didnt wear it.
Our jumper these days is hardly identical to our first one. The sash is that thick these days its hardly a true sash...and ads left, right and centre clearly give the jumper a totally different perspective.
The club cannot wear stripes, as this violates the constitution, that members have to vote on alternate jumpers.
That is hogwash and the fact that so many people blurt it out, show how gullible and impressionable many fans are.
That is purely false. If the AFL tells Essendon to change, there is nothing Essendon can do about it - that is a legal fact.
Again, our logo, emblem and anything that makes Essendon "Essendon" is owned by the AFL, NOT the Essendon Football Club. That is a fact and reality.
Unfortunately, it seems fans dont want to acknowledge this reality.
That is hogwash and the fact that so many people blurt it out, show how gullible and impressionable many fans are.
That is purely false. If the AFL tells Essendon to change, there is nothing Essendon can do about it - that is a legal fact.
Again, our logo, emblem and anything that makes Essendon "Essendon" is owned by the AFL, NOT the Essendon Football Club. That is a fact and reality.
Unfortunately, it seems fans dont want to acknowledge this reality.
And what evidence do you give for such assertions?
Or did you hear it from someone who sounded believable?
I'll offer company law and the Essendon Football Club constitution.
I agree, if the AFL tells Essendon to change, they will, but only after the members get told the club is gone unless they vote for the change.
Ever seen a photo from 1873 of the team wearing this supposed jumper?
Don't feel bad, noone else has either.*
So if we didn't see it, then it mustn't have happened?
If you doubt me, contact Gregor McCaskie, curator of the Hall of Fame, and he will confirm that there are no records of Essendon actually wearing Black and Red stripes in a game.
There are no records for lots of things. I'm sure they wore the stripes once in amatuer levels.
I agree, if the AFL tells Essendon to change, they will, but only after the members get told the club is gone unless they vote for the change.
Did you not read my post in regards to Peter Jacksons speech at the AGM? He made it quite clear that the AFL own everything logo's, jumper designs and if they had the balls to force us to wear anything but the sash, we'd have to bend over and comply. The members have no say in it at all.
Stealth bomber
28 Dec 2004, 13:00
Everyone says it's the red that's the problem, so how about a black jumper with a red sash so narrow, you can barely see it. Skinnier than the heritage one.
It's still a black guernsey with a red sash.
So if we didn't see it, then it mustn't have happened?
Correct, if noone saw it happen, and instead, they saw something else happen. Just hecause someone thought it a good idea, doesn't mean it happened if all evidence says otherwise.
There are no records for lots of things. I'm sure they wore the stripes once in amatuer levels. Even though there is no evidence for this what so ever? Apart from minutes from the initial meeting suggesting those colours.
Did you not read my post in regards to Peter Jacksons speech at the AGM? He made it quite clear that the AFL own everything logo's, jumper designs and if they had the balls to force us to wear anything but the sash, we'd have to bend over and comply. The members have no say in it at all.
The AFL have the power to instruct teams to wear Clash jumpers. They can also instruct them to wear jumpers of particular colours that don't clash. There would be certain punishments if we did not.
It is up to the members to vote on it though. And the members would only vote for it if it was neccessary.
Peter Jackson wants clash jumpers, so they can sell them for $120 each at the club shop. He's just not allowed to because the members would get rid of him if he introduced them. I consider whatever he says on the subject with that perspective in mind.
The AFL have the power to instruct teams to wear Clash jumpers. They can also instruct them to wear jumpers of particular colours that don't clash.
And force them to.
It is up to the members to vote on it though. And the members would only vote for it if it was neccessary.
No, it's up to the AFL, we sould our sole to them in 1985, as did other clubs. The only time the members decide would be if Peter Jackson decided to do it for next season. Whereas if the AFL made a rule for every team to have an alternate jumper, by law, we have to. Members mean jack.
And what evidence do you give for such assertions?
The fact the AFL owns our jumper/logo.
It stated in our constitution everything is subject to the laws of the AFL. In other words we are the AFL's b i t c h, every club is.
The fact the AFL owns our jumper/logo.
It stated in our constitution everything is subject to the laws of the AFL. In other words we are the AFL's b i t c h, every club is.
It's my understanding that it still has to go to the members, however, the point is moot.
There will be no clash jumper until/unless the AFL make us have one.
And whether a member vote is required or not, we'd then have to have one.
Until then, we won't.
[QUOTE=Mero]
There will be no clash jumper until/unless the AFL make us have one.
QUOTE]
Yep, until that fax lands.
It WILL happen...will it be sooner or later tho?
aj 2000
31 Dec 2004, 12:21
The AFL have always stated that its their preference to have an alternate jumper, however they have stopped short of requiring one.
I believe that it is as issue with the darker jumpers, especially with inclement conditions.
I think that with the vast majority of clubs selling out and changing their strips in the last 15 years, and introducing alternate jumpers they should be able to accommodate Essendon not changing like Melbourne did in Round 15 this season.
There have been some excellent points raised in this discussion, especially in relation to other clubs that have gone predominately darker with their jumpers (West Coast, Melbourne, Collingwood, Port Adelaide etc).
If we do have to introduce one, steer clear of a grey based jumper. Manchester United had a grey away strip that they had to change at half time against Southampton in 1996. They never won a game in that strip as they had difficulty seeing their team mates against the crowd.
Ever seen a photo from 1873 of the team wearing this supposed jumper?
Don't feel bad, noone else has either.*
What the hell are you talking about? Are you deliberatley being difficult? The history book of the Essendon Football club, "Flying Higher" records Essendon having worn red and black vertical stripes when the club first formed in the early 1870's.
And you have the audacity and the nerve to not believe this? Why? Because you don't want to believe it? Grow up, for God's sake.
That is why there's huge support for retaining the one jumper we've ever worn.
Not huge support from me. Using only one jumper for 130 years is nothing to be proud of. Exactly how does wearing one jumper and not having the foresightedness to change benefit anyone? How does it help win games? It is NOTHING to be proud of.
The club cannot wear stripes, as this violates the constitution, that members have to vote on alternate jumpers.
So, I suppose if Essendon, for 2005's heritage round decide to wear their first ever jumper (the stripes) for ONE game (nothing would be more appropriate for the heritage round, by the way) we will see the Essendon board and the AFL go to jail for the heinous crime. :rolleyes: How dare they damn it! Lock them up! The lot of 'em!!
Napier_Street
1 Jan 2005, 10:03
Why has this suddenly become an issue all of a sudden?
For over 100 years now, Essendon has used the same guernsey against 'clash' teams like St Kilda & Melbourne... why has it suddenly become so imperative to change? Did you hear people 10 years ago complain? 20? 30?
Actually ....yes.
I have been following the Dons for decades and its always been an issue - in fact if anything its not so bad nowadays as the guenersys are not as covered in mud as they once were
What the hell are you talking about? Are you deliberatley being difficult? The history book of the Essendon Football club, "Flying Higher" records Essendon having worn red and black vertical stripes when the club first formed in the early 1870's.
And you have the audacity and the nerve to not believe this? Why? Because you don't want to believe it? Grow up, for God's sake.
I'm not being difficult at all.
The history of the club is something I am very interested in.
The club was formed in 1872 and the intention was to wear black with red stripes.
In 1873, when they played, they wore black with a red sash.
It's that simple.
If Flying Higher says otherwise, it is incorrect, based on the documents available to Essendon Football Club.
Either that, or your reading of it is incorrect.
If my research is not suitable for you, you could go to the club's official website: http://www.essendonfc.com.au/history/
or call the club, and ask for Gregor McCaskie, curator of the Hall of Fame and he will tell you the same thing.
Now, you could argue that there was a junior team called Essendon who wore the stripes, but they are not senior team that was formed in 1872, that is the club we know today.
PS This would not preclude the club from wearing the stripes as a Heritage jumper, as most clubs wear jumpers that are combinations of two designs, or somewhat similar, but fairly different.
My website www.angelfire.com/ok/fbtmisc/merojumpers.html for further details on that.
CrackerJack
2 Jan 2005, 03:12
couldnt they jus swap the red with black so the stripes blak and the rest is red or insted of the sash a cross
nonchalance
2 Jan 2005, 08:50
couldnt they jus swap the red with black so the stripes blak and the rest is red or insted of the sash a cross
While in theory that sounds okay, if you mock one up, you will see that it looks like utter ********e.
nicho_magic
6 Jan 2005, 21:46
I think you misunderstand, or do not know the AFL's intention on Clash jumpers.
If the AFL decreee multiple jumpers are required, they must be predominantly in supposed non-clash colours.
Therefore, our jumpers will not be allowed to be predominantly Black, Red, Navy, Yellow or White.
While clubs can make their own, they will be in team colours, like Melbourne's was when they played earlier this year.
Which begs the question, did they look that much different from us, from their Blue jumper they wore in the finals?
Essendon's Clash jumper would have to be Sky Blue, or Lime Green, or similar unused AFL colour. Black and Red might make it onto the collar or the club logo might be on the front.
Something like this:
http://home.iprimus.com.au/teagloccal/EssClash.gif
If the AFL don't decree Clash jumpers, no Essendon board will have the guts to even raise it at a level where a vote is taken on it. It will remain Black with a Red Sash.
no way, allways have to keep the sash the only one would be to invert the normal jumper but we don't need an alternate strip we really don't clash badly with any other teams
eddiesmith
8 Jan 2005, 06:29
The stupidest thing ever was Melbournes 'clash' guernsey. Am I the only one who thinks that clashed more with Essendon than their normal one?
Essendon would be difficult to change as is Collingwoods. We have had a few go's at a different strip but when you have such a plain design and a long heritage it is difficult.
I have done the red with black sash and admit it is horrible, but wont any clash jumper look horrible to the traditionalist?
Personally Im a fan of pulling on the training jumper for one, maybe 2 games a year. I mean its not a new design and the players are used to it. Trialled in the Wizard Cup though. Maybe next year they should have a clash round. Play the teams that clash and make Collingwood, Essendon away teams v Port, Melbourne and tell them to find a different jumper.
?? Would you object to a change of jumper for the Wizard Cup? And is that covered by the Constitution? Of course if the AFL says do it, then both clubs have little choice
Its a tough choice, but it really is the new jumpers that make it harder, and sometimes the numbers are 2 large. Even Collingwood and Essendon can be hard from behind. Black backs, white numbers, large sponsor logos with Pies being a red sponsors logo giving some red to their jumper. Really we should revert back to the white background jumper as that would clash with no one.
If anyone will force a change of jumper its Andy D. Seems like an asshole. The AGM's at both clubs should be fun after a new jumper is called for.
If anyone will force a change of jumper its Andy D. Seems like an asshole. The AGM's at both clubs should be fun after a new jumper is called for.
Andy D. can take his wish of alternative strips for all clubs & shove it right up his fat bulbous backside! :mad:
As i keep saying .............if other clubs want to do it then fine.............but not at Essendon thank you very much.