View Full Version : Real Cleanout
goalpie
21 Aug 2005, 17:12
What Collingwood really needs is a real cleanout. There are many players that are going to go and with early picks, its a good time clean out the current coaching structure and have a fresh start.
Things will otherwise keep going along the same way otherwise.
So where do you intend to get the replacement players.
Oh I know off the "Footy players" tree in the garden out the back of the LEXUS centre
Rozza44
21 Aug 2005, 18:44
The tree also has structure and an injury fixing magic wand i heard.
Who does everyone wanna get rid of?
RuZZa#28
21 Aug 2005, 20:04
walker
jimmy_c8
21 Aug 2005, 20:37
Lokan
The Schammerman #3
21 Aug 2005, 20:52
williams
Rozza44
21 Aug 2005, 22:15
Billy Morrison
Daicosian Didak
21 Aug 2005, 23:30
David King
I just conducted a litle experiment. Coped and pasted our list into notepad, and deleted the players that DONT have a question mark on their playing futures (expected retirees excluded)
This is what i have left.
Cole, Richard
Promised so much.. showed so little. I can't see him being on our list next year. Perhaps the one player we might actually get something for in a trade.
Davidson, Tom
Obvious reasons. MM looks like he's persisting with this kid though, so we'd like to see him actually play some games some time soon. If he does get delisted this season i will be disgusted though. If they were going to delist him they shouldve done it last year. We've basically carried an extra name on our list for a season for nothing.
Davis, Leon
Possible trade bait, but i'd keep him. Has really lifted his attitude/game in the 2nd half of the season.
Hall, Brent
Doesnt really seem like we're going to get anything out of him, ever.
King, David D
Read Brent Hall. I havent really seen to much of him myself, but doesnt seem to have many fans.
Leonard, Zane
Think his rookie listing expires anyway. I would be absolutely astounded if we retain him.
Lockyer, Tarkyn
This is the type of player we should be looking to trade. It's time to bite the bullet. He has trouble hitting targets WAY to often, and has a habit of bobbing up when the games pretty much over. We might actually get something of value for him.
Lokan, Matthew
Looks to be a goner
Lonie, Ryan
Read Richie Cole.
Morrison, Billy
Read Brent Hall.
Morrison, Chad
Even though we didnt really lose anything for him, to me he seems to be a waste of space on the list. I'm not a fan. He is by no means our worst player, but he aint a great contributer. He'd be a good depth player for a good side. Unfortunately we dont have that, and by the time we do he'll be long into retirement.
O'Bree, Shane
Not a fan. Read Tarkyn Lockyer. for someone who's pretty good at finding the ball, he's got shocking disposal. Pretty unaccountable, he ain't gonna help us climb the ladder much.
Richards, Guy
Has got to be challenging Lee walker for the most injury prone player to pull on the black and white. Seriously should consider as trade bait. If not, and he has another injury interupted season next year, then he simply has to go. Shame cause he seems like he has abit of talent.
Shaw, Brayden
Obviously already gone...
Walker, Tristen
I'm actually one of the few that don't mind him too much. I dont know what i see in him, but i've seen him do some pretty good things. There's definitly players on our list with worse skills than him, his height is very handy. That said i havent seen much of his williamstown form which seems to have disgusted anyone. Not too sure on him.
Williams, Andrew
Why oh why we retained him is beyond me. Cost us 1 year development of a youngster.
Woewodin, Shane
Had enough of this guy. Couldnt play with any less heart if he tried. Holds the ball up way too much, for someone of his experience and age, he is way too indecisive. Soft. Won a brownlow for his "slick skills", yet seems to not mind the odd turnover. Gotta go down in history as one of the worst brownlow medallists. His contract is not worth renewal, If so only for one season, and only as a depth player.
Gee Nardz, you must have been bored.
Gee Nardz, you must have been bored.
Very.
tomaraya
22 Aug 2005, 02:52
Would like to see the following delistings:
Williams
Lokan
Shaw. B (already confirmed)
Walker
King
Morrison. B
Morrison. C
Hall
Would like to see the following players traded for REASONABLE return:
Lockyer
Cole
Davis
Woewodin (if not traded, keep on a heaviliy reduced contract)
Holland (Licuria must be returned to his run with role full time. Not knocking Holland's contributions, I just think he's expendable and may get us a good return)
Players who should be on their LAST CHANCE (not negotiable)
Lonie
O'Bree
Cloke. J
Cole (if not traded)
Woewodin (if not traded)
Lockyer (if not traded)
Davis (if not traded)
Davidson
Safe as houses (for next year at least)
Buckley
Burns
Caracella
Clement
Cloke. C
Cloke. T
Didak
Egan
Fraser
Iacobucci
Johnson (although his current situation has me a little worried)
Licuria (especially if he reverts to a full time run with role)
Maxwell
Prestigiacomo
Richards (would like to see 1 injury free season at least)
Rocca
Rowe (although he is a hope and pray inclusion.Needs to work on disposal)
Rusling
Shaw. H
Shaw. R
Swan
Tarrant
Wakelin
goalpie
22 Aug 2005, 08:49
Malthouse should be on his last chance. Another bad year would just be a joke. The other coaches add very little to the side especially Gotch who cant develop young players.
Malthouse should be on his last chance. Another bad year would just be a joke. The other coaches add very little to the side especially Gotch who cant develop young players.
And the 20 players on our injury list is all MM's fault.
Try thinking about things it is a marvellous feeling
goalpie
22 Aug 2005, 09:43
And the 20 players on our injury list is all MM's fault.
Try thinking about things it is a marvellous feeling
Keep sticking you head in the sand.
We had 22 players on Saturday. The problem is we didnt have 22 players who even tried.
Also, we didnt have a game plan and Murray, whos fault is that.
And dont forget, Davies 9 marks and Shaw 9 marks. These 2 players are first year players and did a better job than 100+ players. Now why would that be.
Keep sticking you head in the sand.
We had 22 players on Saturday. The problem is we didnt have 22 players who even tried.
Also, we didnt have a game plan and Murray, whos fault is that.
And dont forget, Davies 9 marks and Shaw 9 marks. These 2 players are first year players and did a better job than 100+ players. Now why would that be.
How do you know we didn't have a game plan?
What you really mean is our game plan on the day failed. They are different things.
Shyte how old are you?
Your last point agrees with me and contradicts yourself.
Go back to blaming Islam for all the ills of the world
goalpie
22 Aug 2005, 11:19
How do you know we didn't have a game plan?
What you really mean is our game plan on the day failed. They are different things.
Shyte how old are you?
Your last point agrees with me and contradicts yourself.
Go back to blaming Islam for all the ills of the world
Well what was our game plan then. Maybe it was not to have a game plan. That could pass as a game plan.
As for your point, who the hell would know what that is.
Go cuddle your beloved terrorists, doesnt worry me.
pieman1
22 Aug 2005, 14:09
Keep sticking you head in the sand.
We had 22 players on Saturday. The problem is we didnt have 22 players who even tried.
Also, we didnt have a game plan and Murray, whos fault is that.
And dont forget, Davies 9 marks and Shaw 9 marks. These 2 players are first year players and did a better job than 100+ players. Now why would that be.
Just what is a game plan? What do Collingwood like to do? About the only difference in teams game plans is how sides deliver the ball forward. Every side keeps possession coming out of the back half, and we like to hit targets inside 50 rather than kick to a spot. In our current team you gather the ball accross half back or the center and who do you see? an empty void! And when Josh is in the ruck he is effectively another onballer who can kick goals and without him we are operating with 1 short in our midfield. Yes our midfield needs to be rebuilt but we are not a complete mess like say a Carlton.
WhyWilliams
22 Aug 2005, 14:25
Like everyone
Williams
Lokan
B Morrison
Hall
B Shaw
then either King, Woewodin, H Shaw
We need 5 new players not just Harry, Fanning and Davies
Draft picks 2, 5, 23, 39 then name our rookies although Davies and Harry should be able to stay as rookies.
If we take any more 18 year olds they will get beaten up like Egan, Rusling and T Cloke have this year. They just need big bodies around them. The Big Italian would be a start, Josh would help then you can include other solid bodies even young Cam Cloke likes to throw his weight around.
Hey but we need to get a couple a fast midfielders maybe a skinny Richie Cole and Didak with a full preseason and a little bit of common sense to put with his great talent (so no elbows or mouthing off) he needs to just get the ball and kick the goals which he was born to do.
tigerboyz
22 Aug 2005, 14:25
i'll trade ya tivendale for leon davis.
i'll trade ya tivendale for leon davis.
We have enough duds why would you think we will trade for yours?
tigerboyz
22 Aug 2005, 14:34
We have enough duds why would you think we will trade for yours?
what's the diff you don't lose anything a dud for a dud it might work out.
WhyWilliams
22 Aug 2005, 14:34
Deliedo ( how ever you spell it) would be a fair swap
Then Williams for Judd
Lokan for Cooney
It would help our mid field
what's the diff you don't lose anything a dud for a dud it might work out.
Ummm, no the idea is to have no duds.
Richmond people have grown up with the idea that duds are acceptable, I know but we don't want to have them at all.
tigerboyz
22 Aug 2005, 14:51
Ummm, no the idea is to have no duds.
Richmond people have grown up with the idea that duds are acceptable, I know but we don't want to have them at all.
too late you have plenty in your side already.
too late you have plenty in your side already.
Exactly. Why add yours to the list.
tigerboyz
22 Aug 2005, 15:09
Exactly. Why add yours to the list.
because our duds are better than yours, see. :p
Collingwood 8. 10. (58) def. by Richmond 13. 15. (93) at M.C.G. 2:10 PM AEST
what's the diff you don't lose anything a dud for a dud it might work out.
A Tiger who goes on a dud for dud recruiting strategy...is that you Mick???
because our duds are better than yours, see. :p
Collingwood 8. 10. (58) def. by Richmond 13. 15. (93) at M.C.G. 2:10 PM AEST
How's Nathan Brown travelling? What did he cost you per game this season?
tigerboyz
22 Aug 2005, 20:23
How's Nathan Brown travelling? What did he cost you per game this season?
even with only one good leg he could still run rings around your mob. ;)
even with only one good leg he could still run rings around your mob. ;)
keep telling yourself that :rolleyes:
keep telling yourself that :rolleyes:
Unfortunately it's true.
What Collingwood really needs is a real cleanout. There are many players that are going to go and with early picks, its a good time clean out the current coaching structure and have a fresh start.
Things will otherwise keep going along the same way otherwise.
Start with getting rid of Super Mick - he has had his used by date and has taken the club nowhere over the last couple of years. You need a new coach, new ideas and focus on getting kids.
goalpie
22 Aug 2005, 21:20
I dont know if its to get rid of Mick, Collingwood supporters just need something to happen. Its just hard to say what and frustrating the ******** out of everyone. Everyone has different opinions to what should be done and there is nothing wrong with that.
One thing all Collingwood supporters have is frustration and next year cant come faster enougth. The worst feeling is going to be after Friday night and I guess 8 clubs have just take it.
pieman1
22 Aug 2005, 22:42
Start with getting rid of Super Mick - he has had his used by date and has taken the club nowhere over the last couple of years. You need a new coach, new ideas and focus on getting kids.
Don't bring your West Coast hating phobia onto our board. I can recognise the signs, for years and years when Mick was at the helm of the Weagles he bent your sorry club over. I have much more faith in him than the theory man fool that is Connolly, in seven days time you'll be in the same position as us, no finals.
You just can't clean out players in a wholesale sense. The system doesn't work like that. You can't, say, delist ten or fifteen players and hope to get a better ten of fifteen back through the draft.
These days, the only way to make a big cultural change in any AFL club is to change the coach or the president. Or both.
Is Collingwood ready for that?
This is just my view. I'm not trolling. Adelaide was in a huge mess in 2004 and changed its coach and a few of its assistant coaches and a handful of its playing squad. It kept an underperforming team more or less intact... and has gone from a potential basketcase to a finals contender in 21 strange weeks.
You just can't clean out players in a wholesale sense. The system doesn't work like that. You can't, say, delist ten or fifteen players and hope to get a better ten of fifteen back through the draft.
Correct. Duds for rookie duds is stupid and wrong.
These days, the only way to make a big cultural change in any AFL club is to change the coach or the president. Or both.
Is Collingwood ready for that?
This is just my view. I'm not trolling. Adelaide was in a huge mess in 2004 and changed its coach and a few of its assistant coaches and a handful of its playing squad. It kept an underperforming team more or less intact... and has gone from a potential basketcase to a finals contender in 21 strange weeks.
Why be single out the coach (clearly our pres is the best in the business)? The football department should be overhauled as something is clearly going wrong, but why one dude cops all the flack is beyond me.
You can't breathe life into a club with stuff all talent. And if you do, don't expect to do much better than Collingwood 2002-2003! Or you could have a great year like Richmond and finish in the slops at pick 11. What a great coup Wallace has been. In theory it would have been smarter to give Frawley another year as coach and get the better kids!!
The way I see it is it is the players on the day that really must take the blame for any major loss. A coach can make changes or instigate a 'game plan' but these don't equate to a 110 point drubbing. The players on the day must take responsibility.
I think we need to clean out the slower players. The one 'game plan' that seems prevelant in today's football is the ability to flood into the backline to help out - and then run forward in numbers once the ball is turned over.
We just don't have the players with the pace, stamina or discipline to do this. How many times on the weekend did the ball get turned over to Adelaide and they centred the ball only to have 2 or 3 running players go past the player who took the mark for a handball and then they keep running into the forward line. AND THEN TURN AROUND AND RAN BACK INTO POSITION, AND RAN FORWARD AGAIN, AND RAN BACK AGAIN and so on. Our players looked like they were jogging up and down on the one spot. Run Run Run Run - this is what we need.
We have some great big men who can act as real targets, we just need the in and under players and running players to compliment them. Players who will do this at every contest, in the backline, across the centre and in the forward line. Run to the contest - again and again.
Get rid of Williams, Lokan, B.Shaw, Walker (the Clokes have made him obsolete), B & C Morrison, Hall, Davis (has the pace but not the discipline), Woey and Lockyer.
licuriasgirl
24 Aug 2005, 11:37
i will thank you to leave jason cloke alone when is he ever given the chance to prove himself jason is a good kid but thanks to mick malthouses being stubbon he hardley gets a game so what do you expect him to do? i am just so glad paul is a talented footballer or he would be on your hitlist to get rid of next well you can all forget it he is staying at collingwood if paul and eddie are forced out of collingwood im going with them licuriasgirl
Cole, Richard
Davis, Leon
Hall, Brent
King, David D
Leonard, Zane
Lockyer, Tarkyn
Lonie, Ryan
Morrison, Chad
O'Bree, Shane
Richards, Guy
Walker, Tristen
Woewodin, Shane
updated list... 5 players already gone. Which of these players is next?? if any?
licuriasgirl
5 Oct 2005, 13:56
You just can't clean out players in a wholesale sense. The system doesn't work like that. You can't, say, delist ten or fifteen players and hope to get a better ten of fifteen back through the draft.
These days, the only way to make a big cultural change in any AFL club is to change the coach or the president. Or both.
Is Collingwood ready for that?
This is just my view. I'm not trolling. Adelaide was in a huge mess in 2004 and changed its coach and a few of its assistant coaches and a handful of its playing squad. It kept an underperforming team more or less intact... and has gone from a potential basketcase to a finals contender in 21 strange weeks.
OUR PRESIDENT IS STAYING RIGHT WHERE HE IS THANKYOU VERY MUCH YOUR WANT EDDIE TO OUIT COLLINGWOOD SO HE WILL QUIT LOOKING OUT FOR US (THAT WON'T HAPPEN EVEN IF HE IS'NT THE COLLINGWOOD PRESIDENT) AND GIVING YOU COMPLAINING INSECURE INTERSTATE CLUBS A HARD TIME AND AS FOR THE COACH I DON'T CARE WEATHER HE GOES OR NOT LICURIASGIRL :mad:
Crikey Licachick, way to dig up old an old relic!
http://collections.ic.gc.ca/artifacts/kosapsom/images/tools1.gif
pocketrocket#24
5 Oct 2005, 18:05
hahahaha, i was thinking the same thing...
why bring up this thread.....some things should be left alone
What Collingwood really needs is a real cleanout. There are many players that are going to go and with early picks, its a good time clean out the current coaching structure and have a fresh start.
Things will otherwise keep going along the same way otherwise.
So we can look forward to 2 Grand Final appearances in the next 4 years.