Dale Thomas

[socrates]

What r ur thoughts about this bold move taking thomas at 2? Glad we picked him up but i still believe he would have been there at 5. Never the less young Thommo will be a huge bonus for the pies in years to come. Very exciting and enthusiastic player.

[Woodstock..]

Will be a very good player in the mode of Gary Ablett Jnr. Even some people compare him to a James Hird style forward

[mattyc2422]

Can play, all depends on whether he can be moulded into a midfielder though by increasing his engine etc. If his body doesn't allow it, then they still have a nifty HFF on their hands, but they need to turn him into a midfielder.

[coasting]

From what I heard they had always planned to take Pendlebury at 5 and that they thought Dale Thomas offered something a bit different as opposed to Ellis.

[F-U]

Cant help but think they picked him based on one good game, definetly not a top 10 pick, If he is like Gary Ablett that means he isnt a midfielder, pick 2 is a big price to pay for a half forward flanker.

[Lica]

I just hope he doesn't turn into another Neon Leon. Has the "X" factor and can win a game off his own boot but can't do it week in, week out.
Last thing we need is another inconsistant player on our list.

[Nightwolf]

At worst he'll be another Didak...

[F-U]

I just hope he doesn't turn into another Neon Leon. Has the "X" factor and can win a game off his own boot but can't do it week in, week out.
Last thing we need is another inconsistant player on our list.

Thats my main concern bout him, has the X factor but also seems quite inconsistent. The pick still bafffles me, where does this leave Didak now, and Buckley...

[mcphee_is_a_gun]

Will be a very good player in the mode of Gary Ablett Jnr. Even some people compare him to a James Hird style forward
thats a huge call, it'd be a good pickup if he was half as good as Hird.

[Woodstock..]

thats a huge call, it'd be a good pickup if he was half as good as Hird. Wouldent it ever:D

[vinnie_vegas69]

Thats my main concern bout him, has the X factor but also seems quite inconsistent. The pick still bafffles me, where does this leave Didak now, and Buckley...
If you think he's inconsistent, then you haven't watched enough of his games. He never had less than 10 possessions in a game all season in the TAC Cup - Doesn't sound like inconsistency.

One of the reasons we rate him so highly is his consistent and hard efforts on the footy field.

People think because he's played forward and he had a great Grand Final that that makes him inconsistent, rather than just making him a player who steps up in big games.

Thomas will become a midfielder. The reason the club chose him over Ellis is that they believe he's more of a midfielder. That would imply that they will not be content to leave him as a flanker.

As for where this leaves Didak, and for everyone implying that Didak is simply a flanker, late in 2004 Didak was playing full time on the ball, and was actually starting to control games in there, until a horrific stretch of injuries hit him:

R15 2004: Broken Jaw - out for 4 weeks
2004 International Rules series: Hurts knee - Restricted pre-season
2005 Pre-Season: Aggravates knee injury and opts for surgery - out until R5
R17 2005: Rolls ankle - misses one week
R19 2005: Irregular heartbeat cause collapse on-field - ends season

So since round 15 2004, he hasn't been fit or healthy enough to play in the midfield.

As for Buckley - He's 33 years old and likely to move into a forward role - that hardly effects Thomas as a midfield proposition.

[Sylvia Saint]

Cant help but think they picked him based on one good game
You really think a professional recruiting manager would use a pick as a high as #2 to draft someone based on one good game?

[coasting]

If you think he's inconsistent, then you haven't watched enough of his games. He never had less than 10 possessions in a game all season in the TAC Cup - Doesn't sound like inconsistency.

By that logic Andrew Embley is consistent but you claimed he was inconsistent in the Pendlebury thread on the Collingwood board?

[goalpie]

Sounds like a whole lot of sour grapes. Thomas is a Pie.:)

[Murray]

Cant help but think they picked him based on one good game, definetly not a top 10 pick, If he is like Gary Ablett that means he isnt a midfielder, pick 2 is a big price to pay for a half forward flanker.

Two newspapers rated him top 10

[saintlynewby]

Cant help but think they picked him based on one good game, definetly not a top 10 pick, If he is like Gary Ablett that means he isnt a midfielder, pick 2 is a big price to pay for a half forward flanker.
Have to say, Daisy had more than one good game. He is a very committed kid, handles himself well on and off the field, has discipline, and is a good team player, all a big part of the reason he was drafted, as well as his obvoius talent. It's the whole package they look at, not just the skills.

[NICK THE PIE MAN]

I know it is only one game, but he was fantastic in the TAC Cup GF. I just watched the first half again on Fox Footy and he just looks very impressive. Being in QLD, it's the only time I've seen him so all I can do is take him on what I see.

I also like the fact he stepped up when the stakes were high. I can see him being a big game player, which will be handy on days like ANZAC day and finals (if we ever get back there!).

Love his pace, footy smarts and also is not at all soft. Doesn't mind getting in there hard.

[Johnson#26]

Very pleased with his selection. Yes, slightly from left field, but after doing some more research on him and watching more clips, he appears a very very good player - one who has the 'spark' which our side despiritly requires. Another upside is that The Wiz has written in his report that he rarely plays a bad match. Not sure whether that will translate into AFL, but it is a solid starting block.

Very happy with our selections indeed.

[skywalk750]

Never worth pick #2

[philhawk]

Get over it you lot - he could be the best player from this draft , he could break his leg in the pre-season and never play again - who knows - he hasnt played one game yet at AFL level - and I for one cant wait to watch his debut ...

[Murray]

Never worth pick #2

Based on what?

[Lica]

Get over it you lot - he could be the best player from this draft , he could break his leg in the pre-season and never play again - who knows - he hasnt played one game yet at AFL level - and I for one cant wait to watch his debut ...

YOU get over it. Everyone is talking about who the picked up and have been talking them up. I have seen a few posts from Hawks fans saying how they are sooooo happy that they got Ellis and how dumb Collingwood was to let him passed. Don't come on here and into a thread about Dale Thomas and bag pies fans just because they are excited about the prospects of a future player. Go over to a Hawthorn thread and join your other baby poo brown and spew yellow followers and talk up your players. W.a.n.k.e.r

I must say that the more I hear about Dale Thomas the more I like. I spoke to a co-worker today, their son played on him this year in the TAC cup and said he was just awesome. Great player and could read the play beautifully. Had really good evasive skills coming out of the centre into the foward line. I am smiling just thinking about it.

[LukeHodge15]

huge price to pay 4 maybe just a hff. like hawks did with taking ellis at 3 imo.

picks of the calibre of 1-6 should be reserved for kpp and outstanding ruckman or outstanding mids. imo ellis and thomas don't fall in2 either of those catergories.

time will tell though.:D

[The Opposition]

If you think he's inconsistent, then you haven't watched enough of his games. He never had less than 10 possessions in a game all season in the TAC Cup - Doesn't sound like inconsistency.
Did you see the prelim final against Knights? 9 possies......big game player?:o
But...good luck to him, good bloke and will be a player

[Lica]

huge price to pay 4 maybe just a hff. like hawks did with taking ellis at 3 imo.

picks of the calibre of 1-6 should be reserved for kpp and outstanding ruckman or outstanding mids. imo ellis and thomas don't fall in2 either of those catergories.

time will tell though.:D

Hear what your saying but obviously collingwood rate their foward line highly and maybe thought that for the next few years they have KPP and ruck stocks set up in Richards, C Cloke, T Cloke, Rocca, Tarrant, Fanning, Fraser, Rusling, Obrien etc, etc

The midfield is where it all starts. If you can't get it out of the centre what hope do you have in the first place. I know people say to take the best player regardless of what you need but this draft seemed to be even across the board so only time will tell as you said whether or not the pies have stuffed up with their train of thought.

[vinnie_vegas69]

By that logic Andrew Embley is consistent but you claimed he was inconsistent in the Pendlebury thread on the Collingwood board?
I said he was up and down, didn't I?

[Crow-mosone]

Burgan was absolutely certain that he was going top 5, which suggests that more than one club has a high opinion of him.

[philhawk]

YOU get over it. Everyone is talking about who the picked up and have been talking them up. I have seen a few posts from Hawks fans saying how they are sooooo happy that they got Ellis and how dumb Collingwood was to let him passed. Don't come on here and into a thread about Dale Thomas and bag pies fans just because they are excited about the prospects of a future player. Go over to a Hawthorn thread and join your other baby poo brown and spew yellow followers and talk up your players. W.a.n.k.e.r

I must say that the more I hear about Dale Thomas the more I like. I spoke to a co-worker today, their son played on him this year in the TAC cup and said he was just awesome. Great player and could read the play beautifully. Had really good evasive skills coming out of the centre into the foward line. I am smiling just thinking about it.

Right - your smiling at the sound of a player that youve never seen play but "like the sound of" - :thumbsu:

[philhawk]

Oh and do learn how to read Lica , noone is bagging Collingwood fans for hyping up their player , I said I could not wait to watch his debut. Knob :D

[thekid178]

i think its pretty hard to say whos a bargain and who was too high at this early stage seemings majority of us havent seen the kids play yet... from what i gather coll liked his hardness at the ball and versatility...and im also lead to believe there wasnt much between the top couple of on ballers in the draft, even higgins at 11 was a steal... so lets give it a year and then look at it...

[philhawk]

i think its pretty hard to say whos a bargain and who was too high at this early stage seemings majority of us havent seen the kids play yet... from what i gather coll liked his hardness at the ball and versatility...and im also lead to believe there wasnt much between the top couple of on ballers in the draft, even higgins at 11 was a steal... so lets give it a year and then look at it...

exactly!

[Jabso]

Lica I don't think you read philhawks post at all. It says noone really knows if Ellis or Thomas is better becuase they haven't even played a game yet have they?

[Deej]

Don't know if anyone else agrees but pies apparently reckon thomas is like a doug hawkins type.

[NorthBhoy]

I have seen Thomas play one game. He has undoubted ability. Showed all the skills that could make him a quality league player. I just don't know if he has that 'superstar' quality you want with a no.2 pick, but again, 'twas one game.

That goal he kicked from the boundary in the TAC Cup GF was sensational. Not the kick so much, it was the gather while looking for room to move. He swooped on the footy and was playing a differen't game to the other kids for that period.

Then again, Mick Stevens was BOG in the same game in his year.

He will be a good player, no doubt.

[Hoggy]

All I know is, I watched the 1st half of the U18 GF yesterday, and he was on the ball the entire first half, and was in the centre square for every single centre bounce.

So hardly sounds like a pure half forward flank.

[Ferga18]

2 weeks ago i was playing frisbee at the Drouin Footy Ground with Dale and couple of mates, and he knew then he was going to Collingwood and they told him it will most likely be at number 2, so he kinda knew, but didnt wanna get to excited because clubs do say a lot of things around draft time.

[Murray]

2 weeks ago i was playing frisbee at the Drouin Footy Ground with Dale and couple of mates, and he knew then he was going to Collingwood and they told him it will most likely be at number 2, so he kinda knew, but didnt wanna get to excited because clubs do say a lot of things around draft time.

What colour was the frisby?

[Lica]

Oh and do learn how to read Lica , noone is bagging Collingwood fans for hyping up their player , I said I could not wait to watch his debut. Knob :D


I miss read your last comment about seeing his debut as being sarcastic sorry. I thought you were saying that in negative way.

By the way I have seen footage of the TAC CUP grand final. Nothing wrong with being happy and excited at the thought of a player kicking a.r.s.e for your side is there?

sooooo your a w.a.n.k.e.r and I'm a knob. Lets call it even shall we.:p

[philhawk]

lol its all good mate :D - Collingwood vs Hawks next year - gonna be brilliant!

[cschreuder61]

looks a good player, i'd be happy enough if we picked him up at 6, was surprised to see him at 2, but still a good pick-up.

[Lica]

lol its all good mate :D - Collingwood vs Hawks next year - gonna be brilliant!


For sure! Wouldn't it be good to see Thomas and Ellis line up on each other. Ellis at HBF and Thomas at HFF.
Wont happen because of Ellis doing year 12 but it would make for good publicity and interesting viewing.
X team mates, pick 2 verses pick 3.

[samthemanlonergan]

Has skilland class, but how he is worth pick 2 baffles me. Rarely gathers more than 20 touches a game, plays mainly as a forward flanker, and really doesn't kick too many goals.
Here is his season for Gippsland:
Games:18
Goals:28
Number Best:5(!!)
Ave Disposlas a game: 17.9
Best Game stat wise:25 possesions and 2 goals Vs Northen Knights
Best Game: TAC cup grand final (20 possies, 7 marks, 6 tackles, 4 goals, BOG)

I seems to me Malthouse saw this game and fell in love with Thomas, and when Hawthorn bluffed Collingwood into taking him at 2, leaving Ellis for them at 3, they got scared and took him at 2 I would have said a fair place for Thomas would have been between 5-15. I think he will be a good player, but not in the mould of previous no.2's Luke Ball, Daniel Wells,Luke Power etc.

As for thier pick of Pendelbury at 5.....LOL

[Murray]

Has skilland class, but how he is worth pick 2 baffles me. Rarely gathers more than 20 touches a game, plays mainly as a forward flanker, and really doesn't kick too many goals.
Here is his season for Gippsland:
Games:18
Goals:28
Number Best:5(!!)
Ave Disposlas a game: 17.9
Best Game stat wise:25 possesions and 2 goals Vs Northen Knights
Best Game: TAC cup grand final (20 possies, 7 marks, 6 tackles, 4 goals, BOG)

I seems to me Malthouse saw this game and fell in love with Thomas, and when Hawthorn bluffed Collingwood into taking him at 2, leaving Ellis for them at 3, they got scared and took him at 2 I would have said a fair place for Thomas would have been between 5-15. I think he will be a good player, but not in the mould of previous no.2's Luke Ball, Daniel Wells,Luke Power etc.

As for thier pick of Pendelbury at 5.....LOL


And which club do you recruit for?

[FIGJAM]

Has skilland class, but how he is worth pick 2 baffles me. Rarely gathers more than 20 touches a game, plays mainly as a forward flanker, and really doesn't kick too many goals.
Here is his season for Gippsland:
Games:18
Goals:28
Number Best:5(!!)
Ave Disposlas a game: 17.9
Best Game stat wise:25 possesions and 2 goals Vs Northen Knights
Best Game: TAC cup grand final (20 possies, 7 marks, 6 tackles, 4 goals, BOG)

I seems to me Malthouse saw this game and fell in love with Thomas, and when Hawthorn bluffed Collingwood into taking him at 2, leaving Ellis for them at 3, they got scared and took him at 2 I would have said a fair place for Thomas would have been between 5-15. I think he will be a good player, but not in the mould of previous no.2's Luke Ball, Daniel Wells,Luke Power etc.
You admit he's got a low possession rate for a midfielder, then concede he plays mainly on the forward flank. Confusing! Would you also concede that if he can get bigger and develop his tank, combined with his consistent committment and roving ability, might just see him become a half decent midfielder?

Averaging over 1.5 goals a game...just how many should a half forward flanker average? I'd have thought that's a reasonable return, especailly when you're doing plenty of work further up the ground (see 18 possie average for a HFF).

As for Pendlebury at 5, he averaged 23 possies and became Gippsland's best midfielder, in his first season of footy since he grew pubes.

The likes of you have to realise that it ain't a present market value, it's a future market value that you're interested in. I reckon we've taken the two kids we wanted and are very happy.

[jimmy35]

And the Dons got the best player in the draft with their first pick. Go figure samtheman.

[samthemanlonergan]

You admit he's got a low possession rate for a midfielder, then concede he plays mainly on the forward flank. Confusing! Would you also concede that if he can get bigger and develop his tank, combined with his consistent committment and roving ability, might just see him become a half decent midfielder?

Averaging over 1.5 goals a game...just how many should a half forward flanker average? I'd have thought that's a reasonable return, especailly when you're doing plenty of work further up the ground (see 18 possie average for a HFF).

As for Pendlebury at 5, he averaged 23 possies and became Gippsland's best midfielder, in his first season of footy since he grew pubes.

The likes of you have to realise that it ain't a present market value, it's a future market value that you're interested in. I reckon we've taken the two kids we wanted and are very happy.

I never once said he was a midfielder.....perhaps you should re-read my post. I don't think any HFF is worth pick no.2 no matter how much "x" factor Malthouse clamis he has.

[samthemanlonergan]

And the Dons got the best player in the draft with their first pick. Go figure samtheman.

I am quite content with Ryder at 7, some may have said he was the best in the draft, me I don't think he was. But i believe he is better than Thomas, and has further scope for improvement than Thomas. So there you go.

(Also I'm pretty with Lonergan at 50, if you hadn't noticed)

[FIGJAM]

I never once said he was a midfielder.....perhaps you should re-read my post. I don't think any HFF is worth pick no.2 no matter how much "x" factor Malthouse clamis he has.
You were saying because he wasn't getting 20+ possies, whicch I would consider a midfielder's rate, that he's not getting enough ball.

As a HFF, why is a just below 20 possie rate poor?

And why do you think he is a permanent HFF??

I reckon MM would be more in love with his continual committment at the pill than his "X-factor".

[Coin_Toss]

but how he is worth pick 2 baffles me.

It doesn't baffle me.

Hawthorn said they would've drafted Thomas at #3 if Ellis was gone.
Thomas wouldn't have lasted to #4 if this had happened.

[Coin_Toss]

By the way, Hawthorn rated Thomas higher than Ellis in the draft. Murphy, Thomas, Ellis was the order of Hawthorn's top 3 apparently.

[jimmy35]

I am quite content with Ryder at 7, some may have said he was the best in the draft, me I don't think he was. But i believe he is better than Thomas, and has further scope for improvement than Thomas. So there you go.

(Also I'm pretty with Lonergan at 50, if you hadn't noticed)

Speculation is a wonderful tool...........

[samthemanlonergan]

I see Thomas as having a good future, he will play more than 150 games for Collingwood. He is a good player, who may become great. but IMO he wasn't worth pick 2.
*here is totally my opinion
-Had a reasonable, but not outstanding u18 carnival. wasn't his teams best player.(Ellis,Selwood,Drum)
-Wasn't Gippsland's best player throughout the season (Ellis,Delphine)
-Has poor indurance, so this would need to improve massivly for him to take a huge step up and become a AFL midfielder.

So if he wasn't the best in any of these areas, how was he the second best availabe at the draft.

I would not be the only one to question Collingwoods recruiters
2001-They "super draft"
11.R.Cole:Traded
27.T.Davidson: Delisted
M.McGough: Delisted

2002
21.B.Nixon: Delisted
29.L.Shackleton: Delisted
D.King: Delisted
M.Lokan: Delisted

2003:
17.W.Morrison: Delisted
32.B.Shaw: Delisted
B.Hall: Delisted

2004:I think you did a good job (at least they have survived the chop), got some talent.
but....
Chris Egan:Head case (ie. giving finger to crowd in first match wtf)
Sean Rusling:Athlete, not a footballer. How can you use pick 23 on a player that played 1 game for the year just to qualify
T.Cloke:Good future
Adam Iacobucci:Good name, good player, good pick

I see your pick 2 as similar to your pick 3 in 2000. Alan Didak-good player, but not a great, which is what you would expect form the second best pick in the National draft.

[Back Pocket Rocket]

By the way, Hawthorn rated Thomas higher than Ellis in the draft. Murphy, Thomas, Ellis was the order of Hawthorn's top 3 apparently.

No we were only gonna take Thomas at 3 because we assumed that Ellis would not be there. I think you'll find the Hawks would have went:

1 Murphy
2 Ellis
3 Thomas

[Coin_Toss]

No we were only gonna take Thomas at 3 because we assumed that Ellis would not be there. I think you'll find the Hawks would have went:

1 Murphy
2 Ellis
3 Thomas

If you don't believe me, read all of the following article: http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2005/12/02/1133422112948.html

[Hard Yakka]

No we were only gonna take Thomas at 3 because we assumed that Ellis would not be there. I think you'll find the Hawks would have went:

1 Murphy
2 Ellis
3 Thomas

I'm not sure that the Hawks have publicly rated their top 3, other to say that it included Murphy, Thomas and Ellis.

The point is though, Thomas was rated top 3 by both Hawthorn and Collingwood. It simply came down to each clubs preference.

The best of the top 3 (and others) will be determined in the years to come, not based on draft order.

[pieman1]

I see Thomas as having a good future, he will play more than 150 games for Collingwood. He is a good player, who may become great. but IMO he wasn't worth pick 2.
*here is totally my opinion
-Had a reasonable, but not outstanding u18 carnival. wasn't his teams best player.(Ellis,Selwood,Drum)
-Wasn't Gippsland's best player throughout the season (Ellis,Delphine)
-Has poor indurance, so this would need to improve massivly for him to take a huge step up and become a AFL midfielder.

So if he wasn't the best in any of these areas, how was he the second best availabe at the draft.

I would not be the only one to question Collingwoods recruiters
2001-They "super draft"
11.R.Cole:Traded
27.T.Davidson: Delisted
M.McGough: Delisted

2002
21.B.Nixon: Delisted
29.L.Shackleton: Delisted
D.King: Delisted
M.Lokan: Delisted

2003:
17.W.Morrison: Delisted
32.B.Shaw: Delisted
B.Hall: Delisted

2004:I think you did a good job (at least they have survived the chop), got some talent.
but....
Chris Egan:Head case (ie. giving finger to crowd in first match wtf)
Sean Rusling:Athlete, not a footballer. How can you use pick 23 on a player that played 1 game for the year just to qualify
T.Cloke:Good future
Adam Iacobucci:Good name, good player, good pick

I see your pick 2 as similar to your pick 3 in 2000. Alan Didak-good player, but not a great, which is what you would expect form the second best pick in the National draft.
Recruiting is hardly an exact science, every club has had its hits and misses, lets take a closer look at Essendon
2002 Jason Winderlich (Still hasn't established himself)
Darren Walsh pick 27 (delisted)

2001 Shane Harvey pick 18 (gawn)
Joel Reynolds pick 31 (is he still on the list?)
Simon O'Keefe pick 34 (delisted)

2000 James Davies (delisted)
Ted Richards (traded, but has yet to show much)

And there have been some other gems, Mark Bolton taken 4th overall in 1997 and the Bombers first 2 picks in 1996 were Chris Heffernan (2nd overall) and Daniel McAlister (5th overall). Like I said every club has skeletons in the closet and you could argue the Bombers have drafted more duds than us.

[cschreuder61]

If you don't believe me, read all of the following article: http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2005/12/02/1133422112948.html
I think all that shows is that they expected Ellis to be taken at 2, and had to change strategy when he wasn't, as he was the best available.

[deck]

I think all that shows is that they expected Ellis to be taken at 2, and had to change strategy when he wasn't, as he was the best available.

Why would you need to change strategy when 1 of the 3 were still available. It seems most likely you rated thomas just ahead of ellis or else it would have been a no brainer when it came to your pick and ellis was still available.

[Lockyer24]

I see Thomas as having a good future, he will play more than 150 games for Collingwood. He is a good player, who may become great. but IMO he wasn't worth pick 2.
*here is totally my opinion
-Had a reasonable, but not outstanding u18 carnival. wasn't his teams best player.(Ellis,Selwood,Drum)
-Wasn't Gippsland's best player throughout the season (Ellis,Delphine)
-Has poor indurance, so this would need to improve massivly for him to take a huge step up and become a AFL midfielder.

So if he wasn't the best in any of these areas, how was he the second best availabe at the draft.

I would not be the only one to question Collingwoods recruiters
2001-They "super draft"
11.R.Cole:Traded
27.T.Davidson: Delisted
M.McGough: Delisted

2002
21.B.Nixon: Delisted
29.L.Shackleton: Delisted
D.King: Delisted
M.Lokan: Delisted

2003:
17.W.Morrison: Delisted
32.B.Shaw: Delisted
B.Hall: Delisted

2004:I think you did a good job (at least they have survived the chop), got some talent.
but....
Chris Egan:Head case (ie. giving finger to crowd in first match wtf)
Sean Rusling:Athlete, not a footballer. How can you use pick 23 on a player that played 1 game for the year just to qualify
T.Cloke:Good future
Adam Iacobucci:Good name, good player, good pick

I see your pick 2 as similar to your pick 3 in 2000. Alan Didak-good player, but not a great, which is what you would expect form the second best pick in the National draft.

I think you will find since 04 we have a new head of recruiting thus the improvement.....

Would give up Pick 23 for Sean Rusling any day of the week

FWIW Im very happy with Thomas and Didak and the selections we used to get them, I have little doubt Thomas will succeed...from what I have seen he is very hard working and tenacious for a player of that type, and a consistent contributor

As for Didak he will explode next year, he just started to in 05 but every injury under the sun held him back a touch

[recon]

I see Thomas as having a good future, he will play more than 150 games for Collingwood. He is a good player, who may become great. but IMO he wasn't worth pick 2.
*here is totally my opinion
-Had a reasonable, but not outstanding u18 carnival. wasn't his teams best player.(Ellis,Selwood,Drum)
-Wasn't Gippsland's best player throughout the season (Ellis,Delphine)
-Has poor indurance, so this would need to improve massivly for him to take a huge step up and become a AFL midfielder.

So if he wasn't the best in any of these areas, how was he the second best availabe at the draft.

I would not be the only one to question Collingwoods recruiters
2001-They "super draft"
11.R.Cole:Traded
27.T.Davidson: Delisted
M.McGough: Delisted

2002
21.B.Nixon: Delisted
29.L.Shackleton: Delisted
D.King: Delisted
M.Lokan: Delisted

2003:
17.W.Morrison: Delisted
32.B.Shaw: Delisted
B.Hall: Delisted

2004:I think you did a good job (at least they have survived the chop), got some talent.
but....
Chris Egan:Head case (ie. giving finger to crowd in first match wtf)
Sean Rusling:Athlete, not a footballer. How can you use pick 23 on a player that played 1 game for the year just to qualify
T.Cloke:Good future
Adam Iacobucci:Good name, good player, good pick

I see your pick 2 as similar to your pick 3 in 2000. Alan Didak-good player, but not a great, which is what you would expect form the second best pick in the National draft.

some mighty poor recruiting, could have smashed the computer when they drafted shackelton at 29, they took thomas because of more x factor only time will tell if he is worth pick 2.

[samthemanlonergan]

Recruiting is hardly an exact science, every club has had its hits and misses, lets take a closer look at Essendon
2002 Jason Winderlich (Still hasn't established himself)
Darren Walsh pick 27 (delisted)

2001 Shane Harvey pick 18 (gawn)
Joel Reynolds pick 31 (is he still on the list?)
Simon O'Keefe pick 34 (delisted)

2000 James Davies (delisted)
Ted Richards (traded, but has yet to show much)

And there have been some other gems, Mark Bolton taken 4th overall in 1997 and the Bombers first 2 picks in 1996 were Chris Heffernan (2nd overall) and Daniel McAlister (5th overall). Like I said every club has skeletons in the closet and you could argue the Bombers have drafted more duds than us.

Yes I agree, every club hits and misses.
But as you have found out the Pies have missed more than us.
*Yes Reynolds is still on the list, has yet to prove himself.
*Winderlich, this year or next he will come through.
*Ted Richards-drafted 27, traded 19, Profit???
*the rest-shockers

[Us3]

Yes I agree, every club hits and misses.
But as you have found out the Pies have missed more than us.
*Yes Reynolds is still on the list, has yet to prove himself.
*Winderlich, this year or next he will come through.
*Ted Richards-drafted 27, traded 19, Profit???
*the rest-shockers
would you consider putting four seasons into a player worth an 8 pick improvement?

[mediumsizered]

The sad part is, Ted Richards probably is a reasonable player but Sheedy couldn't see past his 2 love children, Bolton and Henneman, so poor old Ted didn't get a reasonable go. For his sake I hope Roos is a little more open minded.

[CyberKev]

Why would you need to change strategy when 1 of the 3 were still available. It seems most likely you rated thomas just ahead of ellis or else it would have been a no brainer when it came to your pick and ellis was still available.

Don't read too much into the wording...

Hawthorn ranked Murphy, Ellis & Thomas as their top 3 and simply assumed Murphy and Ellis would go 1 & 2.

When Collingwood opted for Thomas and 2, they simply ran with Ellis at 3.

Had Collingwood taken Ellis they would have taken Thomas, and had Murphy not been taken 1 or 2 they would have taken him at 3.

It wasn't a change of strategy per se, but rather an unexpected pick shift in accordance with an unexpected revision of the "preordained" draft order.

[worthy]

It's safe to say that at least 2 clubs and probably more rated him top 3, love the sound of his attitude and work ethic, those 2 things go a long way to helping a player be successful, sounds like a good pick.

[powerpies]

Lucky we took dale, the hawks would have taken him at 3.

[InForAPenny]

2003:
17.W.Morrison: Delisted
32.B.Shaw: Delisted
B.Hall: Delisted


SamTheMan,

I get your point about recent Collingwood recruiting but I have to tell you that Brent Hall was training with the Pies as recently as this morning. He has not been delisted.

[samthemanlonergan]

would you consider putting four seasons into a player worth an 8 pick improvement?
I geuss we will find out in 3 years when Courtenay Dempsay starts having a regular run.

2003:
17.W.Morrison: Delisted
32.B.Shaw: Delisted
B.Hall: Delisted


SamTheMan,

I get your point about recent Collingwood recruiting but I have to tell you that Brent Hall was training with the Pies as recently as this morning. He has not been delisted.
My mistake, must have got carried away. I'm not really an expert on Collingwoods list, just had a quick glance through to see which players still remained on it.

[vinnie_vegas69]

It's safe to say that at least 2 clubs and probably more rated him top 3, love the sound of his attitude and work ethic, those 2 things go a long way to helping a player be successful, sounds like a good pick.
Agreed worthy.

And one thing is for sure, regardless of who ends up a better player, Dale Thomas is more likely to make a midfielder than Xavier Ellis is.

Xavier Ellis might be the greatest HBF in history, but you'd still need midfielders that are going to lineup for the centre bounce, and while Hawthorn has a few of those already between Mitchell, Lewis, and even young Tuck, Collingwood still needs to build a young midfield troupe.

Ellis may even become a great midfielder in the future, but I'd back Thomas to make it in there over Ellis because of his intensity, work ethic and tackling. Ellis will be great, possibly the best player from this draft, but I'd say, like a McCleod or Wanganeen (no reason I picked two Aboriginal players, just coincidence) he'll play his best footy off a flank or wing.

[stui magpie]

2003:
17.W.Morrison: Delisted
32.B.Shaw: Delisted
B.Hall: Delisted:eek:

.

When did we delist Hall?

[rusling_28]

2002
21.B.Nixon: Delisted -?
29.L.Shackleton: Delisted
D.King: Delisted
M.Lokan: Delisted

Must have delisted hall we we delisted Nixon, oh, wait, we traded him to hawthorn. And when we looked into the crystal ball and saw that all of Davidsons potentiatl would not be realised (yet...still hope we get him back) because of knee injuries and wentt ahead and drafted him.

but hey, lets not let the truth and facts get in the way of a good ol collingwood slag session shall we.

[Pharaoh]

The reality is that apart from Murphy, this draft did not have a stand-out top 5 like previous years. Thomas seems as good a choice as any at number 2 - both he and Ellis have some drawbacks, so it would be a toss of the coin.

As Hawthorn knows from last year, having pick 2 can be difficult. Regardless of the kid you pick, there will always be fans and 'experts' complaining about the others you overlooked. Pick 3 is easier, in a way, because the options have already been narrowed down - bit like Deledio, Roughead and Griffen last year.

Personally, I'm far more surprised/worried about Collingwood's OTHER draft choices this year. Thomas is certainly the safest pick of all of them.

[FIGJAM]

Personally, I'm far more surprised/worried about Collingwood's OTHER draft choices this year. Thomas is certainly the safest pick of all of them.
Pendlebury ended up being the #1 midfielder in the premiership winning TAC team, and as we all know, it was his first year back in footy for about five years. 23 possie average, good skills. Not perfect, but like you say, who were the standouts who were??

He's not exactly a Tom Williams speculative pick, even if he's a bit green.

Edit: And Stanley was anticipated to go top 30 (if not top 20), despite decision making and kicking queries. Anthony looks like he'll be a player. Cook is the "smokey". About the same age as Ellis and averaged 17.6 PPG, average 4.4 MPG, 1 GPG, 11 times in best in the second best team in the comp. Would have probably played wing if given another year at TAC, probably boosting those numbers and that's why we've got in early.