Aussies are sooks - Bob Simpson

[Renegade]

http://content-aus.cricinfo.com/vbseries/content/story/233599.html

Bob Simpson has joined a chorus of former Test captains to condemn Australia's behaviour and believes the players are acting like "small children". Simpson, one of the country's most decorated figures as a former captain, coach and selector, is concerned the on-field acts are being replicated in junior matches and finds the pre-series wars of words "distasteful".

Writing in his Indian Sports Star column, Simpson said the most upsetting aspect was Ricky Ponting did not see anything wrong with his side's sledging and Steve Waugh felt it attracted more spectators to the game. "I have been very disappointed with these comments," he said, "for they seem to show a lack of leadership and concern for the game."

Brett Lee, Adam Gilchrist and Glenn McGrath have been reported for poor behaviour in the past month and the former Test captains Mark Taylor and Tony Greig have also complained about the antics of the Australians. "While present-day cricketers promote the need for the spirit of cricket to be adhered to," Simpson said, "many of them do not follow in action this norm, which they publicly endorse in words.

"This not only includes sledging but excessive appealing, disrespecting the umpiring decisions and using their well-paid, generally ghost-written columns to bait opposition teams and players. Public criticism of the opposition now seems to be part of the team tactics. All this reminds me of the behaviour of small children and the bravado they use to disguise their own fallibilities."

Spot on there Bobby. Aussies are the worst sportmen in the world when something doesn't go their way. And they call Poms whingers :D Couldn't find a more pathetic bunch of role models for kids getting into the game, umpire abuse, crowd abuse, opposition abuse, excess appealing, you name it. Then off the field their cheating on their wife, taking banned drugs, talking to bookies about pitch conditions, have gambling problems, turn up to training sessions drunk.... PATHETIC!

[Squizza]

Spot on there Bobby. Aussies are the worst sportmen in the world when something doesn't go their way. And they call Poms whingers :D Couldn't find a more pathetic bunch of role models for kids getting into the game, umpire abuse, crowd abuse, opposition abuse, excess appealing, you name it. Then off the field their cheating on their wife, taking banned drugs, talking to bookies about pitch conditions, have gambling problems, turn up to training sessions drunk.... PATHETIC!
Well if you don't want your argument turning pathetic I suggest you don't mention soccer or any other cricketing nation in the world.

[Renegade]

Well if you don't want your argument turning pathetic I suggest you don't mention soccer or any other cricketing nation in the world.
I'm simply mentioning the article written about Bob Simpson's view on Australia's pathetic sportsmenship. Anyone talking about any other sport or cricket team not related to it obviously can't handle the truth about the Aussies.

[Power21]

I'm simply mentioning the article written about Bob Simpson's view on Australia's pathetic sportsmenship. Anyone talking about any other sport or cricket team not related to it obviously can't handle the truth about the Aussies.

You dont support Australia, are you even Australia, if you arent, why are you here, and why are you bringing this to our attention, obvious troll attempt that has backfired.

[TheColeTrain]

http://content-aus.cricinfo.com/vbseries/content/story/233599.html

Bob Simpson has joined a chorus of former Test captains to condemn Australia's behaviour and believes the players are acting like "small children". Simpson, one of the country's most decorated figures as a former captain, coach and selector, is concerned the on-field acts are being replicated in junior matches and finds the pre-series wars of words "distasteful".

Writing in his Indian Sports Star column, Simpson said the most upsetting aspect was Ricky Ponting did not see anything wrong with his side's sledging and Steve Waugh felt it attracted more spectators to the game. "I have been very disappointed with these comments," he said, "for they seem to show a lack of leadership and concern for the game."

Brett Lee, Adam Gilchrist and Glenn McGrath have been reported for poor behaviour in the past month and the former Test captains Mark Taylor and Tony Greig have also complained about the antics of the Australians. "While present-day cricketers promote the need for the spirit of cricket to be adhered to," Simpson said, "many of them do not follow in action this norm, which they publicly endorse in words.

"This not only includes sledging but excessive appealing, disrespecting the umpiring decisions and using their well-paid, generally ghost-written columns to bait opposition teams and players. Public criticism of the opposition now seems to be part of the team tactics. All this reminds me of the behaviour of small children and the bravado they use to disguise their own fallibilities."

Spot on there Bobby. Aussies are the worst sportmen in the world when something doesn't go their way. And they call Poms whingers :D Couldn't find a more pathetic bunch of role models for kids getting into the game, umpire abuse, crowd abuse, opposition abuse, excess appealing, you name it. Then off the field their cheating on their wife, taking banned drugs, talking to bookies about pitch conditions, have gambling problems, turn up to training sessions drunk.... PATHETIC!
you seem to hate australia and its people a lot, all you do is ********ing whinge about Australia on this board, why dont you ******** off to England so you wont have to complain about Australia so much, but being in england you would still have something to whinge about

[Renegade]

You dont support Australia, are you even Australia, if you arent, why are you here, and why are you bringing this to our attention, obvious troll attempt that has backfired.
Troll attempt? Simply bringing up quotes from the former Australian captain and coach.
Someone having a tough time seeing one of their own have something negative to say about his team? Diddums.

[Power21]

Troll attempt? Simply bringing up quotes from the former Australian captain and coach.
Someone having a tough time seeing one of their own have something negative to say about his team? Diddums.

No i just disagree with the article, doesnt mean i cant handle what is written i just dont see the point in bringing it ehre then adding your own paragraph of crap at the end, you clearly did it to incite arguments, no other reason to post this rubbish is there.

[Freo Big Fella]

Look at Australias success over the past 20 years, then compare it with any other side. Aggression breeds success, anything else is irrelevant.

[gerta]

I think what Bobby has said is spot on the money and i think there is a growing number of people who agree with him...

Not sure about the bit tacked on the end by Renegade, but i agree 100% with Bob...

[Renegade]

Not sure about the bit tacked on the end by Renegade, but i agree 100% with Bob...
I was only pointing out the things Bobby mentioned and the off field antics that are connected with being poor role models.

[funkyfreo]

Aggression breeds success, anything else is irrelevant.

I don't know that Simpson is singling out Aggression though.

"This not only includes sledging but excessive appealing, disrespecting the umpiring decisions and using their well-paid, generally ghost-written columns to bait opposition teams and players. Public criticism of the opposition now seems to be part of the team tactics. All this reminds me of the behaviour of small children and the bravado they use to disguise their own fallibilities."

Nothing about agressive cricket there.

[Adelaide Hawk]

As an Aussie supporter, I love the Australian aggression and fierce determination to succeed. However, I will say there are times when I would like to see them temper their approach to the umpires a little. I think Ponting needs to tighten the reign just a fraction and channel the Aussie aggression in a positive way.

Having said that, I think it is also time that the ICC issued a directive to both umpires and players about what information an umpire can or cannot offer a player, and what questions a player can or cannot ask an umpire. I feel inconsistencies in this area are partly to blame for acts of petulance among the players ... not all of them Australian I hasten to add.

[MR987]

You dont support Australia, are you even Australia, if you arent, why are you here, and why are you bringing this to our attention, obvious troll attempt that has backfired.

Um, troll attempt??

This was an article from the baggy green site which has taken quotes from Bob Simpson. Why are you getting so worked up over it??

[gerta]

As an Aussie supporter, I love the Australian aggression and fierce determination to succeed. However, I will say there are times when I would like to see them temper their approach to the umpires a little. I think Ponting needs to tighten the reign just a fraction and channel the Aussie aggression in a positive way.

Having said that, I think it is also time that the ICC issued a directive to both umpires and players about what information an umpire can or cannot offer a player, and what questions a player can or cannot ask an umpire. I feel inconsistencies in this area are partly to blame for acts of petulance among the players ... not all of them Australian I hasten to add.

:thumbsu: totally agree with this...

[F/D]

They arent good role models and most know it.

[skilts]

Having said that, I think it is also time that the ICC issued a directive to both umpires and players about what information an umpire can or cannot offer a player, and what questions a player can or cannot ask an umpire. I feel inconsistencies in this area are partly to blame for acts of petulance among the players ... not all of them Australian I hasten to add.

At last, somebody in Australia 'gets it'. I have no problem, as an umpire, being asked why a certain decision was given. The big however is, that this is not an invitation to a debate. It will eventually come to pass that umpires will no longer answer questions about decisions. If this happens there will be even more whingeing, but the players will only have themselves to blame. What is not readily understood is that the umpire is under no obligation to explain his decisions to anyone. They do so in the spirit of maintaining harmony with the players. It appears to be backfiring.

[gerta]

They arent good role models and most know it.

Most sport people aren't good role models and most don't want to be role models...

[F/D]

Most sport people aren't good role models and most don't want to be role models...
Shaun Pollock
Jacques Kallis
Jacques Rudolph
Boeta Dippenaar
etc etc

All good people and good sportsman.

[Cooldude]

Umpire's inability to stamp their authority on the players is also contributing to it.

Shep used to be very good at telling a player to put up or shut up and stop whinging, nowadays there're these bunch of wishy washy umps who are so keen on telling bowlers why exactly is a certain lbw not out, so when it backfires on them and the players demand an explanation of why it's not out, they don't like it.

The umps run things out there, if there are crap going on out there they're the ones who should be stopping it, but they're way too soft nowadays.

[beatnik]

Shaun Pollock
Jacques Kallis
Jacques Rudolph
Boeta Dippenaar
etc etc

All good people and good sportsman.

sure but let's not be selective...

what about cronje, gibbs or boje for match fixing? or ntini's rape conviction?

it was ridiculous for Renegade to brand the aussies as a "pathetic bunch of role models" when 4 of the 5 things he based the accusation on are attributable to one man - S.Warne (Australia's equivalent of Paul Gasgione)

so let's talk about warne if he's the one responsible for your regular hissyfits

yes he's is a magician and yes he's also a complete tool...

he's good for the sport in terms of sheer publicity but bad for it in other ways...particularly the subtler traditions surrounding the spirit of the game

but who are we really kidding? what chance do those traditions have in the commercial reality that world cricket has become?

we treat cricketers like rock stars or demi-gods, hanging off their every word (no matter how ill-equipped they are to speak on a subject)...we put crazy amounts of cash in their pockets, fast cars, fast women etc etc

i'm not defending warne but he is a product of the 'cult of celebrity' that seems to go hand in hand with big contracts and corporate sponsorship deals the world over

as for the rest of the Australian team - your accusations hold no water Renegade...

you are one of many who have resorted to cutting down the Aussie cricket side in the only way possible given their recent dominance

by attempting to apply some lofty though vaguely-defined 19th century nostalgic standards of virtue and courtesy and "the spirit of the game" even though sledging and aggressive cricket have been around through many cricketing dynasties

i remember border and his young team copping punding after pounding from the relentless West Indians of the 80s - i don't remember seeing any niceties thown around but I saw a lot of people getting hit in the head and a couple go toe-to-toe...is this the golden era to which you aspire?

or do you perhaps harken back to the good ol' days when English 'gentlemen' deliberately hospitalised Australian batsman in the interests of nullifying the sheer genius of Bradman and winning at any cost?

as for all this swearing and appealling crap is a direct result of beaming such clear audio of the middle of the pitch into the loungeroom - the scutiny is incredible compared to the good ol' days to which you always defer

they've stuck a microphone up the player's butts and now you complain they are farting on TV? please...

so why has all this moral grand-standing crept into the modern game (particularly amongst the ex-pat yarpies and poms who kick about on this board)?

simple...the sustained success of the Aussies over past 8-10 years has removed much of the competition from the game of cricket and it's logical that bored fans and reporters would try to invent and win all manner of relatively minor moral victories

I have a question...Aussies lord boonie, marsh, skull and dougie walters for their drinking prowess - did you really expect us to be shocked that Punter and Roy enjoyed a pint?

[Rob B]

Former umpire Lou Rowan unleashes as well......

Source: CricInfo (http://content-usa.cricinfo.com/australia/content/story/233695.html)

The 80-year-old former Test umpire Lou Rowan has branded Ricky Ponting a disgrace to his country and expressed his disgust at Australia's conduct this summer.

Rowan, a police detective who officiated in 25 Tests in the 1960s and 1970s (http://stats.cricinfo.com/guru?sdb=official;playerid=36674;class=testofficial;filter=b asic;type=0;team1=0;team2=0;notteam=0;homeaway=0;continent=0 ;country=0;notcountry=0;groundid=0;startdefault=1963-01-11;start=1963-01-11;enddefault=1971-02-17;end=1971-02-17;tourneyid=0;finals=0;daynight=0;season=0;result=0;schedul edovers=0;scheduleddays=0;viewtype=list;submit=1;.cgifields= viewtype), claims Ponting lacks class and authority as a captain, while stating that Australia's behaviour this summer has been an insult to former players.

"Ponting is a smart arse and a disaster as leader. The conduct of him and his players is absolutely disgraceful," Rowan told Fox Sports. "He has no control over his players. It is an insult to former players and people associated with the game."


During a tempestuous series against South Africa, Adam Gilchrist, Brett Lee and Glenn McGrath have all been called to the match referee this summer, prompting angry and resentful comments from former players captains - and now umpires. Although Ponting - whose leadership came under increased scrutiny after Australia lost the Ashes last summer - conceded that his team's attitude and behaviour simply must change.


"It just hasn't looked good," he said. "Just a couple of things on telly, even though there have been some chats with the umpires, they just haven't looked good and the perception of it is it's a blight on the game.


"So I just had a chat with the guys this morning to make sure we are thinking about how bad it would look on the television if we do it. I have got no problem with the bowlers especially wanting to have a chat with the umpire and ask about certain decisions that have been made. But let's just make it one question and one answer, and then get on with it."



Rowan's abhorrence at Australia's antics have culminated in the extraordinary admission that he has now watched his last Test match.


"The standard of conduct that was common place in my time has been contemptuously trampled underfoot by certain Australian players who cannot grasp the significance of the honour bestowed on them by the baggy green cap," Rowan said.


"The ever-present and accepted practice of sledging, obscenities, excessive appealing, the questioning of umpires and the accompanying dissent leaves our Australian team quite correctly dubbed 'the ugly Australians'."


This debate is getting rather heated....

[eddiesmith]

Former umpire Lou Rowan unleashes as well......

Source: CricInfo (http://content-usa.cricinfo.com/australia/content/story/233695.html)




This debate is getting rather heated....
I was just going to post that one as well :)

Could this Australian team be the most hated ever? :p

[Rob B]

Seems they are struggling a bit to come to terms with being on the back foot more often.

"Whinging poms" :o Irony of all ironies.....

[eddiesmith]

Seems they are struggling a bit to come to terms with being on the back foot more often.

"Whinging poms" :o Irony of all ironies.....
I liked that umpires one as it focuses on Ponting, he is shocking lately :thumbsd:

[Adelaide Hawk]

They arent good role models and most know it.

So you are saying kids should be more like you?

[RogerC]

I don't think this Australian side is as ugly as the one running around a few years ago. I think McGrath is mouthing off a bit less than he used to, and now that Lee is bowling at the stumps more often than the batsman's head he's a bit less aggressive and a bit more useful. Ponting was a bit worse behaved as a mere team member than he is now that he is in charge,

But I do put this one squarely down to the ICC and the umpires. You have to report and, more importantly, punish bad behaviour on the pitch. Those players who are reported are getting away with a series of reprimands, which is essentially a green light.

Plus, now that the umpires are being seen more and more as fallible - thanks to slow-mo replays and multiple camera angles - the players are realising that they can doubt themselves. Constant pressure on umpires to justify their decisions can affect their judgment, making them second guess their decisions. And if they do stand firm, they run the risk of being crucified whenever they get it wrong.

There are a number of things that can be done. Excessive questioning of umpiring decisions - and that means asking more than once - should be heavily punished. And any player other than the bowler or the captain should be forced to stay clear of all such questioning. Any public statements by a cricketer that are derogatory of an opposition player ought to be outlawed. It should be reinforced that the umpire's decision - right or wrong - is final.

Sledging ought to be monitored. I think most people on this board are happy with sledging, and you're never going to stamp it out anyway. But umpires should have and exercise an authority to report it where it seems excessive to them. And the report must come from them, with no player making any public compaint about a sledging incident. This should help to reduce frivolous complaints to a minimum.

It's an aggressive game, and that's never going to change. But the players are only ever going to do what they're allowed to do. At the moment they're allowed to do too much.

[Wicked Lester]

I read Lou Rowan's outburst this morning with interest. in short I'm not sure what to make of it. Is he "in the know"? Is he speculating? Or is he a spent force who simply dislikes Ricky Ponting?

Like a number of others on this board I've been frustrated at the arrogance and on field behaviour of a number of the Australians for quite a few years now. If there's an attitude problem though, its genesis lies not with the current team leadership but its predecessor. Tugga encouraged the whole notion of mental disintegration and pushing aggression to the very limits of tolerability. While he often remained relatively quiet on the field he did little to nothing to subdue the agressors, and became most agitated when the team was criticised for its behaviour.

At first I thought Ponting had realised how disliked the team had become (by certain crikecket tragics) under Waugh's stewardship and was working overtime to instill a better sense of on field balance.

Perhaps the loss of the ashes shook him up to the extent where he feels its better to be criticised by some and be winning than to be nice guys and losing. Certainly the last month or two has seen a decline in standards, particularly the niggling with the umpires. The niggle between the teams I'm prepared to dismiss as Graeme Smith played an instrumental role in fuelling tension. I didn't detect bad relations when the Windies were out.

As far as niggle with the umpires go, it seems to me that Warne is one of the main problems, McGrath on occasions and recently Gilly. As age creeps up on him and his abilities begin to diminish McGrath would be well advised to pull his head in (I actually think he already has to an extent). The same applies to Gilly. Nothing looks worth than a fading champion still trying to bully the opposition. Eventually Warne will have to learn the same lesson.

As for Ponting its a question of how far he publicly imposes himself on his team mates. Does he want to be seen to be publicly dressing a recalcitrant player on the field? His predecessor wouldn't do it.

[Ice goddess]

The Windies were sedate in all areas. Interesting to note though that South Africa has copped a lot of bad decisions but basically just got one with it, notably the Hussey non LBW when Nel went straight back to his mark. And that was the plumbest LB all summer. I think the Aussies have been used to getting their own way and bullying to an extent but also feel the tension fuelled between the two teams has sent our tempers over the edge.

[docker_azza]

Look at Australias success over the past 20 years, then compare it with any other side. Aggression breeds success, anything else is irrelevant.

Yeah, but I'm very certain that some of the same fans defending Auistralian players actions like this

"This not only includes sledging but excessive appealing, disrespecting the umpiring decisions and using their well-paid, generally ghost-written columns to bait opposition teams and players. Public criticism of the opposition now seems to be part of the team tactics. All this reminds me of the behaviour of small children and the bravado they use to disguise their own fallibilities."


would be getting stuck into other Australian sportspeople and international sportspeople for displaying the same brand of sportsmanship.

[The Majestic]

They arent good role models and most know it.

When did they ever say they wanted to be a role model?

[Renegade]

Former umpire Lou Rowan unleashes as well......

Source: CricInfo (http://content-usa.cricinfo.com/australia/content/story/233695.html)




This debate is getting rather heated....
hahahaha excellent article there.
It's only the arrogant Aussie fans that don't see what a disgrace they are to the game.

[The Majestic]

I wouldn't say they are a disgrace, I mean, they aren't cheating, or anything like that, they are just acting inapporiately.

I agree with that they need to cool some of it off, there are worse things that have happened.

[gerta]

Interesting to note though that South Africa has copped a lot of bad decisions but basically just got one with it, notably the Hussey non LBW when Nel went straight back to his mark. And that was the plumbest LB all summer. I think the Aussies have been used to getting their own way and bullying to an extent but also feel the tension fuelled between the two teams has sent our tempers over the edge.

I think thats a really interesting point... if it had have been warnie he would still been appealing for about 1 minute, glare at the umpire, look at the big screen for the replay and then glare at the umpire again and ask why wasn't it out...

Thats what i don't like about the way australia are playing at the moment...

The inability to accept the umpires decision, whether it's right or wrong...Respect the man in white...

[beatnik]

hahahaha excellent article there.
It's only the arrogant Aussie fans that don't see what a disgrace they are to the game.

since you love cricinfo so much, i'll let this article from Andrew Miller (the UK editor of cricinfo) show you you're full of it...


The behaviour of the Australian team
Aussie moralising smacks of double-standards

Andrew Miller

January 19, 2006

Ricky Ponting and Adam Gilchrist: under fire for their team's behaviour

It's funny how quickly things can change. It was only last summer that Australia's cricketers were being lauded as shining white beacons of virtue, as they contested an Ashes series for the ages which was embellished with some of the smiliest, most good-natured behaviour imaginable.

The respect was reciprocated all throughout the summer. There was Shane Warne congratulating Andrew Flintoff for his biffing at Edgbaston; there was Flintoff consoling Brett Lee after the two-run defeat in the same game. There were smiles and back-slaps aplenty, for Kevin Pietersen at The Oval and for England in general in victory.

In fact, the most notable moments of discord were prompted, by and large, by English actions - Simon Jones's shy at the stumps that struck Matthew Hayden on the shoulder at Edgbaston, the lack of concern for Ricky Ponting's cheek injury at Lord's and, if we are to stretch a point, England's contentious use of substitutes at Trent Bridge that caused Ponting to blow his top after being run out by Gary Pratt.

So how is it then, that the same team who grinned and bore it throughout the English summer are now being castigated Down Under for their lack of sportsmanlike behaviour? The whole situation smacks of double-standards, especially when men such as Bobby Simpson and Lou Rowan start to weigh into the debate.

Simpson, lest we forget, was the coach at the helm around the time that Allan Border decided that "no more Mr Nice Guy" was the best way forward for his team. His snappy, snarly approach to the 1989 Ashes - in which at Trent Bridge he responded to Robin Smith's not-unreasonable request for a glass of water with: "No you f***ing can't. What do you think this is? A f***ing tea party?" - resulted in a 4-0 hammering and instant legend status.

Border was the archetypal "little Aussie battler", a breed that has gone out of fashion of late, as Australia's effortless supremacy in world cricket has allowed them to buck their usual style and get, to borrow Michael Vaughan's phraseology, "a little cute with the game". Short-lived initiatives, such as taking the fielder's word on disputed catches, were only ever going to last as long as the Aussies were on top.

Such niceties are completely out of the window now. The Ashes have been lost and the realisation has dawned on Australia that the tried-and-tested method of getting them back is to get, well, a little bit ugly. The process began in that Trent Bridge flare-up, when Ponting and Simon Katich both lost their rag. Other sides might have folded at that moment - Australia on the other hand were galvanised, and almost fanned the flames of injustice into a thrilling final-day comeback.

As Lawrence Booth wrote in The Guardian last week, Australia have got a bit of the mongrel back in their game. The ICC made a laughable attempt to stamp out their war of words with South Africa - and specifically Graeme Smith - ahead of last month's Test series, but that is as nothing compared to the vitriol that will rain down on England in ten months' time, when the revenge Ashes get underway.

So when octogenarian Test umpires such as Rowan do their best Fred Trueman impersonations and start muttering "it weren't like that in my day," you can write their opinions off to forgetfulness. Rowan, after all, was an official for five of the seven Tests of the 1970-71 Ashes, one of the most filthy-tempered clashes of all time.

In that series, Ian Chappell took the art of sledging to new highs (or lows, depending on which side of the fence you are currently sat), England prevailed despite being denied a single lbw in seven matches, and Rowan's main contribution came at Sydney, when he called John Snow for intimidatory bowling. That decision inflamed an already feverish stadium and led to the infamous incident of Snow being grappled by a drunken spectator on the fine-leg boundary.

The mongrel was certainly present in that match, on the pitch and off it. But if the renewed hard-nosed approach has had the desired effect by this time next year, it's unlikely that many former pros will have much truck with the chosen method.

[Renegade]

since you love cricinfo so much, i'll let this article from Andrew Miller (the UK editor of cricinfo) show you you're full of it...


The behaviour of the Australian team
Aussie moralising smacks of double-standards

Andrew Miller

January 19, 2006

Ricky Ponting and Adam Gilchrist: under fire for their team's behaviour

It's funny how quickly things can change. It was only last summer that Australia's cricketers were being lauded as shining white beacons of virtue, as they contested an Ashes series for the ages which was embellished with some of the smiliest, most good-natured behaviour imaginable.

The respect was reciprocated all throughout the summer. There was Shane Warne congratulating Andrew Flintoff for his biffing at Edgbaston; there was Flintoff consoling Brett Lee after the two-run defeat in the same game. There were smiles and back-slaps aplenty, for Kevin Pietersen at The Oval and for England in general in victory.

In fact, the most notable moments of discord were prompted, by and large, by English actions - Simon Jones's shy at the stumps that struck Matthew Hayden on the shoulder at Edgbaston, the lack of concern for Ricky Ponting's cheek injury at Lord's and, if we are to stretch a point, England's contentious use of substitutes at Trent Bridge that caused Ponting to blow his top after being run out by Gary Pratt.

So how is it then, that the same team who grinned and bore it throughout the English summer are now being castigated Down Under for their lack of sportsmanlike behaviour? The whole situation smacks of double-standards, especially when men such as Bobby Simpson and Lou Rowan start to weigh into the debate.

Simpson, lest we forget, was the coach at the helm around the time that Allan Border decided that "no more Mr Nice Guy" was the best way forward for his team. His snappy, snarly approach to the 1989 Ashes - in which at Trent Bridge he responded to Robin Smith's not-unreasonable request for a glass of water with: "No you f***ing can't. What do you think this is? A f***ing tea party?" - resulted in a 4-0 hammering and instant legend status.

Border was the archetypal "little Aussie battler", a breed that has gone out of fashion of late, as Australia's effortless supremacy in world cricket has allowed them to buck their usual style and get, to borrow Michael Vaughan's phraseology, "a little cute with the game". Short-lived initiatives, such as taking the fielder's word on disputed catches, were only ever going to last as long as the Aussies were on top.

Such niceties are completely out of the window now. The Ashes have been lost and the realisation has dawned on Australia that the tried-and-tested method of getting them back is to get, well, a little bit ugly. The process began in that Trent Bridge flare-up, when Ponting and Simon Katich both lost their rag. Other sides might have folded at that moment - Australia on the other hand were galvanised, and almost fanned the flames of injustice into a thrilling final-day comeback.

As Lawrence Booth wrote in The Guardian last week, Australia have got a bit of the mongrel back in their game. The ICC made a laughable attempt to stamp out their war of words with South Africa - and specifically Graeme Smith - ahead of last month's Test series, but that is as nothing compared to the vitriol that will rain down on England in ten months' time, when the revenge Ashes get underway.

So when octogenarian Test umpires such as Rowan do their best Fred Trueman impersonations and start muttering "it weren't like that in my day," you can write their opinions off to forgetfulness. Rowan, after all, was an official for five of the seven Tests of the 1970-71 Ashes, one of the most filthy-tempered clashes of all time.

In that series, Ian Chappell took the art of sledging to new highs (or lows, depending on which side of the fence you are currently sat), England prevailed despite being denied a single lbw in seven matches, and Rowan's main contribution came at Sydney, when he called John Snow for intimidatory bowling. That decision inflamed an already feverish stadium and led to the infamous incident of Snow being grappled by a drunken spectator on the fine-leg boundary.

The mongrel was certainly present in that match, on the pitch and off it. But if the renewed hard-nosed approach has had the desired effect by this time next year, it's unlikely that many former pros will have much truck with the chosen method.

HAHAHAHAAH Andrew Miller, there's a reliable source. He's the most one eyed Aussie lover going around. Also, how does that show that i'm full of it? By 'you' you must mean Bob Simpson because that's who's quotes were brought up for this thread.
Andrew Miller, or a former Australian captain, coach and selector....gee....let me see who's opinion holds more weight here.... hahahaha ahhh can't help but laugh at some of you 'knowledgeable cricket fans'

[beatnik]

HAHAHAHAAH Andrew Miller, there's a reliable source. He's the most one eyed Aussie lover going around. Also, how does that show that i'm full of it? By 'you' you must mean Bob Simpson because that's who's quotes were brought up for this thread.

don't try and distance yourself from Simmo (a grumpy nostalgic old fart) - you started this f***ing thread!

Andrew Miller, or a former Australian captain, coach and selector....gee....let me see who's opinion holds more weight here.... hahahaha ahhh can't help but laugh at some of you 'knowledgeable cricket fans'

you dense pom

the point of the story is the double standards being applied to the Australian team (and Ponting in particular) by umpires, the ICC, the cricket media and spiteful little trolls like yourself

during and after the Ashes, Ponting's captaincy and the whole team were considered 'soft' and generally too nice...

afridi was busted for ball-tampering during the drinks break...tresgothick and dravid have both been fined for putting sticky lollies all over the ball

but it's the Aussies who're supposedly a disgrace?

for what? appealling? ffs

loser

[The Majestic]

If it makes Australia a disgrace, what does it make India who have been doing it for a numbers of years now. And in the past Sri Lanka have been known to over appeal.

Oh that's right, they aren't Australia.

[eddiesmith]

If it makes Australia a disgrace, what does it make India who have been doing it for a numbers of years now. And in the past Sri Lanka have been known to over appeal.

Oh that's right, they aren't Australia.
I dont remember seeing Ganguly, the bowler and the keeper all holding 5 minute arguments following every appeal that was turned down

[The Majestic]

No, they would waste time in other ways, they would spend 5 minutes discussing where a player would go, or not go. There are many games they have failed to bowl their overs on time.

[gerta]

No, they would waste time in other ways, they would spend 5 minutes discussing where a player would go, or not go. There are many games they have failed to bowl their overs on time.

I think thats the thing... cricket and some of the attitudes of certain players across the whole world need to be brought back into line... Harsher penalties need to be given rather than just slapping people on the wrist....

[Renegade]

don't try and distance yourself from Simmo (a grumpy nostalgic old fart) - you started this f***ing thread!

Umm....idiot, i was saying the thread was started over the Bob Simpson quotes, and if you call me an idiot because of them you should be calling Simpson an idiot too, for it was his quotes i was backing up....not distancing myself from you thick fool.

[The Majestic]

I think thats the thing... cricket and some of the attitudes of certain players across the whole world need to be brought back into line... Harsher penalties need to be given rather than just slapping people on the wrist....
Oh I agree, they should appeal, and when it's turned down move on, but it would seem some countries players appeal when there is no way it was out, and only do so to stop the umpire calling a wide.

Most of the appeals I've seen from Australia, they have been rather close, though, the spats after are the thing that need to stop. I think Gillys was the final straw.

[gerta]

Oh I agree, they should appeal, and when it's turned down move on, but it would seem some countries players appeal when there is no way it was out, and only do so to stop the umpire calling a wide.

Definitely... that would have to be the most annoying thing ever.... No chance of it being even remotely a wicket and they appeal for it...



[/QUOTE]
Most of the appeals I've seen from Australia, they have been rather close, though, the spats after are the thing that need to stop. I think Gillys was the final straw.[/QUOTE]

Some of the appeals from warnie in the test matches were pretty ordinary... A few the ball pitching clearly outside leg stump and he was still going nuts... But yeah what happens after the appeal is the most concerning thing... Just get on with the bloody game... Its slow enough as it is...

[The Majestic]

Very true, it's almost like AFL players bitching at the umpire after they get a free kick given against them, just get an explaination and move on.

Maybe the umpires should be allowed to add a run or 2 runs to the other team for the player arguing, much like the 50 mentre rule that is in place in the AFL.

[beatnik]

Umm....idiot, i was saying the thread was started over the Bob Simpson quotes, and if you call me an idiot because of them you should be calling Simpson an idiot too, for it was his quotes i was backing up....not distancing myself from you thick fool.

nice sidestep...now address the issue of double standards

you dense pom

the point of the story is the double standards being applied to the Australian team (and Ponting in particular) by umpires, the ICC, the cricket media and spiteful little trolls like yourself

during and after the Ashes, Ponting's captaincy and the whole team were considered 'soft' and generally too nice...

afridi was busted for ball-tampering during the drinks break...tresgothick and dravid have both been fined for putting sticky lollies all over the ball

but it's the Aussies who're supposedly a disgrace?

for what? appealling? ffs

[eddiesmith]

nice sidestep...now address the issue of double standards
The Aussies are a disgrace not only for over appealling, but when their pathetic appeals are turned down they spend 5 minutes arguing with the umpire and onn TV it looks extremely bad for the image of the game

[skipper kelly]

Just another troll thread.:thumbsd:

[Adelaide Hawk]

The Aussies are a disgrace not only for over appealling, but when their pathetic appeals are turned down they spend 5 minutes arguing with the umpire and onn TV it looks extremely bad for the image of the game

As opposed to people like you who spend all day arguing with people and trying to upset everyone. I know who the disgrace is and it isn't the Australians.

You know what really annoys me about all this Australian "bashing" at the moment? I can appreciate everyone has an ideal on how the game should be played, and I welcolme the thoughts of those who feel the Aussies go over the top at times. There have been times when I thought so as well, just as I have thought some players from other countries have also gone too far at times.

However. the person most vocal about the Australia cricketers' behaviour is none other than Tony Greig who was perhaps the most annoying antagonistic cretin ever to walk onto a cricket field. He built a career on trying to upset everyone with his mouth and antics. I would think the very last person to be criticising the way cricketers behave on the field would be Tony Greig. If he honestly feels he was a good role model for youngsters he is deluding himself. Selective memory I think.

[skipper kelly]

As opposed to people like you who spend all day arguing with people and trying to upset everyone. I know who the disgrace is and it isn't the Australians.

You know what really annoys me about all this Australian "bashing" at the moment? I can appreciate everyone has an ideal on how the game should be played, and I welcolme the thoughts of those who feel the Aussies go over the top at times. There have been times when I thought so as well, just as I have thought some players from other countries have also gone too far at times.

However. the person most vocal about the Australia cricketers' behaviour is none other than Tony Greig who was perhaps the most annoying antagonistic cretin ever to walk onto a cricket field. He built a career on trying to upset everyone with his mouth and antics. I would think the very last person to be criticising the way cricketers behave on the field would be Tony Greig. If he honestly feels he was a good role model for youngsters he is deluding himself. Selective memory I think.

ah. Tony Greig worried about the image of the game. He obviously forgets his role in WSC. :thumbsd:

[Renegade]

nice sidestep...now address the issue of double standards
Double standards nothing.
How often to you see any other captain sprint to the umpires at the end of every over whinging about an appeal that was turned down?
The you have your vice captain start following the umpire at the end of overs mouthing off. Your leading bowler throws hissy fits everytime he thinks he should have a wicket.....let's just push aside the fact he openly cheats on his wife, takes banned drugs and gets involved with bookies over pitch conditions. Your captain has a gambling problem and Symonds enjoys turning up to training drunk....and judging by the black eye he was sporting last night it wouldnt surprise me if it was because of a drunken bar room brawl the night before.....but gee you're right....they're just so tough on Australian players. So harshly treated!

[Kane McGoodwin]

The Aussies are a disgrace not only for over appealling, but when their pathetic appeals are turned down they spend 5 minutes arguing with the umpire and onn TV it looks extremely bad for the image of the game
I can't say I like the over-questioning of the decisions after an appeals are turned down ... but you are wrong to suggest the over-appealing in unique to just the Australian cricketers. All nations do it!

[bmwofoz]

Interesting...........................

I see nothing new in the Australian Cricket Teams behaviour, I think its very rich for the likes of Simpson and Taylor complaining about this lots behaviour, for while Australian Cricket has had a great 15 Years or so, I think its fair to say, that whenever they have been put under pressure, they have in the past been quite sooky, o and who was the Captain and Coach of this time, also its this time that the likes of Ponting co.

Clearly they learnt their Behaviour from someone.

[LIONS then DAYLIGHT]

Double standards nothing.
How often to you see any other captain sprint to the umpires at the end of every over whinging about an appeal that was turned down?
The you have your vice captain start following the umpire at the end of overs mouthing off. Your leading bowler throws hissy fits everytime he thinks he should have a wicket.....let's just push aside the fact he openly cheats on his wife, takes banned drugs and gets involved with bookies over pitch conditions. Your captain has a gambling problem and Symonds enjoys turning up to training drunk....and judging by the black eye he was sporting last night it wouldnt surprise me if it was because of a drunken bar room brawl the night before.....but gee you're right....they're just so tough on Australian players. So harshly treated! Idiot!

Looking forward to the soccer world cup renegade?

May i suggest you get "Stop Crying Your Heart Out - Oasis" loaded in your CD player for after your team gets smashed 8-0 and your mob go home with your tail between your legs.

:D :D :D

[Renegade]

Looking forward to the soccer world cup renegade?

May i suggest you get "Stop Crying Your Heart Out - Oasis" loaded in your CD player for after your team gets smashed 8-0 and your mob go home with your tail between your legs.

:D :D :D
Thanks for the completely relevant response :rolleyes: Confirms that everything i've said in this thread is right on the money....as usual.

[LIONS then DAYLIGHT]

Thanks for the completely relevant response :rolleyes: Confirms that everything i've said in this thread is right on the money....as usual.

No Problem

Thank You Very Much Indeed.

[Manunz]

http://content-aus.cricinfo.com/vbseries/content/story/233599.html

Bob Simpson has joined a chorus of former Test captains to condemn Australia's behaviour and believes the players are acting like "small children". Simpson, one of the country's most decorated figures as a former captain, coach and selector, is concerned the on-field acts are being replicated in junior matches and finds the pre-series wars of words "distasteful".

Writing in his Indian Sports Star column, Simpson said the most upsetting aspect was Ricky Ponting did not see anything wrong with his side's sledging and Steve Waugh felt it attracted more spectators to the game. "I have been very disappointed with these comments," he said, "for they seem to show a lack of leadership and concern for the game."

Brett Lee, Adam Gilchrist and Glenn McGrath have been reported for poor behaviour in the past month and the former Test captains Mark Taylor and Tony Greig have also complained about the antics of the Australians. "While present-day cricketers promote the need for the spirit of cricket to be adhered to," Simpson said, "many of them do not follow in action this norm, which they publicly endorse in words.

"This not only includes sledging but excessive appealing, disrespecting the umpiring decisions and using their well-paid, generally ghost-written columns to bait opposition teams and players. Public criticism of the opposition now seems to be part of the team tactics. All this reminds me of the behaviour of small children and the bravado they use to disguise their own fallibilities."

Spot on there Bobby. Aussies are the worst sportmen in the world when something doesn't go their way. And they call Poms whingers :D Couldn't find a more pathetic bunch of role models for kids getting into the game, umpire abuse, crowd abuse, opposition abuse, excess appealing, you name it. Then off the field their cheating on their wife, taking banned drugs, talking to bookies about pitch conditions, have gambling problems, turn up to training sessions drunk.... PATHETIC!
And you claim you're not a troll. What a nice piece of work you are.

[Manunz]

hahahaha excellent article there.
It's only the arrogant Aussie fans that don't see what a disgrace they are to the game.
They are the game. They get the people watching. You have a problem. You want to be an Australian supporter, but you are not good enough, so you resort to slanging them off about nothing.
You need to give it all a rest.

[Renegade]

They are the game. They get the people watching. You have a problem. You want to be an Australian supporter, but you are not good enough, so you resort to slanging them off about nothing.
You need to give it all a rest.
Hahahaha why are you bringing up a month old thread? Is it to try and validate the garbage you're speaking on the other thread and getting burnt over? Not by just me but Aussie fans as well?
Kane has already spoken to me about the things i've said on this thread and we had a discussion over it and put it to rest. Then you come along and try and have a go at me a month later and only succeed in embarrassing yourself further.
Time to quit whining isn't it?

[Manunz]

Hahahaha why are you bringing up a month old thread? Is it to try and validate the garbage you're speaking on the other thread and getting burnt over? Not by just me but Aussie fans as well?
Kane has already spoken to me about the things i've said on this thread and we had a discussion over it and put it to rest. Then you come along and try and have a go at me a month later and only succeed in embarrassing yourself further.
Time to quit whining isn't it?
No, I'm just pointing out that you are unfairly biased against Australia and that you should post more reasonably. Not be a troll, in other words.
You, my friend, have lost your arguments. Go home before you make a bigger fool of yourself.

[bombersno1]

I do not see one single problem with it. Every team is guilty of over-appealing at stages. Australia is, england is, lankan's, india, etc. That does not mean that one team is worse than another!

[Manunz]

I do not see one single problem with it. Every team is guilty of over-appealing at stages. Australia is, england is, lankan's, india, etc. That does not mean that one team is worse than another!
Exactly right. The first quality post I have seen for a while after having to cop crap after crap from renegade.

[Renegade]

Exactly right. The first quality post I have seen for a while after having to cop crap after crap from renegade.
You wont have to cop crap for much longer, i've been told from a mod that the admin are going to be banning you :D

[Manunz]

You wont have to cop crap for much longer, i've been told from a mod that the admin are going to be banning you :D
I have done nothing wrong so I will not be banned.
You on the other hand have been reported for the last message you sent to me.

[Manunz]

Apparently you cannot argue a point now, so I am being banned.

[Renegade]

I have done nothing wrong so I will not be banned.
You on the other hand have been reported for the last message you sent to me.
I don't think you understand, i'm not the only one who's reported you, others have too. The day you joined you were warned for abuse and you kept going, so playing dumb and saying you've done nothing is pretty pointless. Besides they've already sent a request to have your account banned.

[Renegade]

Apparently you cannot argue a point now, so I am being banned.
Well you have to admit, you joined up and began running your mouth abusing people the same day you joined. I've been warned and followed Kane's advice and the Aussie fans havent had a problem because i started to watch what i said about certain players. You just keep going.

[crownie]

umpire abuse, crowd abuse, opposition abuse, excess appealing, you name it. Then off the field their cheating on their wife, taking banned drugs, talking to bookies about pitch conditions, have gambling problems, turn up to training sessions drunk.... PATHETIC!

bowling with illegal.....oh wait :D

[Manunz]

Well you have to admit, you joined up and began running your mouth abusing people the same day you joined. I've been warned and followed Kane's advice and the Aussie fans havent had a problem because i started to watch what i said about certain players. You just keep going.
I actually have not been warned for my posts. So I see the situation as rather unfair.

[beatnik]

I actually have not been warned for my posts. So I see the situation as rather unfair.

why are you banned?