How safe is Mark Williams this year? [Archive]

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JohnK

6 Apr 2006, 04:46

Crowked

6 Apr 2006, 09:23

Looks like no ones interested John.

Personaly I think both are safe this season regardless of the win/loss ratio. The Port board know they are rebuilding and they will be for at least this and next season. Not saying they cant do well, they certainly could, but I dont think the board would be expecting too much ATM. If there isnt a significant improvement by the end of next season though, Mark could be in a spot of bother. I think Williams is a good coach though and I'm expecting him to do well enough to survive the rebuild and be around for quite a while. I think the consistent run through 2002-03 and the 2004 flag has bought him more time to complete the rebuild.

NC has more expectation on his shoulders and to miss the finals this year would put some pressure on, but even a terrible 2006 wouldnt cost him his job IMO. However, 2 consecutive poor seasons would almost certainly be all she wrote for any coach of the AFC, looking at the past anyway. The Crows are approaching cash in time or bust with this list, if he cant get the runs on the board with this squad, he's unlikely to do it when the Roo, Goody, Macca and Tyson retire. I think Neil is a very good coach, and expect us to do well this and next season. We have a great chance to secure another flag, and Neil could well be the first 10 year coach at the AFC. He has very few short comings IMO.

To set some benchmarks, I think..

PAFC would expect to win say 7-8 home games, and at least a couple away and maybe sneek into the finals. More importantly for the long term, blood some young guys and prepare for a red hot go in 2007 & 08.

AFC would expect to win most home games, and at least half the away games, make the finals, hoping for a top 4 finish again. At least make the prelims but be hoping to improve on last seasons finals and get into the GF. 2007 might be the last realistic chance for some of the aging stars, so as I eluded to, it could be the defining season for NC too. Win a flag and he's set for the long haul, fail and he could be stuggling to get a contract extension. Here's hoping he's around for a while.:thumbsu:

Macca19

6 Apr 2006, 09:44

Personally, I believe Marks job is safe no matter where we finish. It shouldnt be, but I think he could finish bottom and still finish out his contract, unless the members put the club under a lot of pressure to get rid of him.

Craigs position is also safe no matter what. Anything outside the top 8 would be a poor finish though

Porthos

6 Apr 2006, 09:54

Choco is safe.

Win-loss is a stupid measure anyway. He's more likely to lose his job if crowds keep dropping, and if we keep ********ing around, they probably will.

blackdiamond

6 Apr 2006, 10:10

What's his benchmark to be coach in 2007?

Seven wins, ten wins? A final eight finish?

How many losses in a row can Mark suffer before the Board taps him on the shoulder?

Four, seven, nine? Thirteen?

Does Mark want to coach Port next year?

What's Craig's minimal benchmark for 2006?

13 wins? Would anything under that put him in trouble?

Is it lower? If Craig had only nine wins, would that be enough to be in trouble?

Any reason why this is not posted on the Adelaide Board as well?

Surely you should be asking the Adelaide supporters about their expectations of Craig. Is this for one of your journalistic pieces or just your attempt to bring on the trolls?

In my honest opinion though they are both safe.

I won't speak for Adelaide, but history will show you that Port Adelaide don't sack coaches that often and it pretty well documented that we are going through a rebuilding phase and learning a new game plan. JohnK we aren't Richmond or the Western Bulldogs.

Your story should be more directed towards Fremantle and how many games he should need to win to keep his job.

Lastly I doubt either of the clubs would want to pay out the coaches contracts and there would probably be a fair bit of pressure from the SA Football Commission so that this didn't happen as well, remember they like a dividend at the end of the year.

wharfie_1870

6 Apr 2006, 10:46

Safe as houses. We can expect to see a lot more of the same shyte served up for the rest of the season even though it isn't "the way we want to play".

When was the last time the PAFC sacked a coach who still had a year (or more) to run on their contract?

Ford Fairlane

6 Apr 2006, 11:02

As Porthos suggested, win-loss won't count for much. Choco can trot out the 'rebuilding' youth card if wins dry up. And we're not that bad that we won't win a reasonable amount of games.

But yes, his danger is if the crowds drop off, sponsors (and no, not just Allan Scott) get nervous, the TV ratings drop, the gains in supporter base/membership stall. In short, if the market penetration drops off. And it will if, as Wharfie said, we keep serving up a shyte style of play.

And don't kid yourself, Adelaide have been pounding the drums long and hard all summer, on the back of a successful on field revival - packaging themselves as the shiny alternative to Port. You can't blame them, we would do the same. So we have to keep an eye on that situation, and keep up with their propaganda. Otherwise in the war for the young hearts and minds, we'll be like the Germans in Russia in WW2.

I've heard this year that season ticket sales are down a few thousand on this time last year (obviously the feelgood factor of the premiership didn't last) and that's probably more a concern to the Board than W-L.

But I can't see him being sacked. Even without his champion - Bucky - there, Choco should be safe. I haven't seen a PAFC coach not see out a contract.

Andre

6 Apr 2006, 11:39

Choco's most likely safe. The only way I can see him going is if we are bottom 4 AND he stops playing youngsters. If he reverts to a side containing all of Francou, Bishop, Kingsley and one of Shattock/Lonie and we still are losing more then winning, then even the board will start to realise his talk and walk on youngsters are different things.

The flag in 2004 gives him the 'luxury' of being able to do a real rebuild without it being a sackable offense. Only a half-arsed one would cost.

Though if we keep getting flogged, regardless of players, I can see the board tapping him on the shoulder and telling him to stop stuffing around with the handball and remember it's FOOTball.

portentous

6 Apr 2006, 12:28

Choco's protected himself by publicly stating that we have pretty low expectations this year. A finish outside the 8 is therefore "justifiable" and anything higher will probably mean he's safe for another 2 years!!

Pinepower

6 Apr 2006, 14:28

Can anybody see who would replace him?

I cannot think of any other coaches out of a job at the moment.

Porthos

6 Apr 2006, 14:39

I'm still on the John Longmire bandwagon.

relapse

6 Apr 2006, 14:54

I think Williams will be safe this season, past that point it will depend how quick and successful the rebuild will be as to whether Williams remains the coach. I think much of it will depend on the year Port have next year more than it will on this year. I think going by what Montgomery said was that inside the club there is a belief that they may not make the finals so i think the PAFC Board are not expecting a hugely successful year so i wouldnt expect any change with Williams' role this season.

As for Craig alot will depend on this season, he has done very well so far and there are many with egg on their face (including myself) as to what he has done with the playing group thus far. I think that even if we have a bad year the AFC would honour his final year on the strength of what he acheived in 05.

So to sum up, both coaches are safe for 06.

Porthos

6 Apr 2006, 15:04

Oh, and if we sign Choco to a new contract extension this year, I will be ********ed.

Ford Fairlane

6 Apr 2006, 15:09

Can anybody see who would replace him?

I cannot think of any other coaches out of a job at the moment.

Tim Ginever, with Jack Cahill as Director of Coaching ... oh hang on, that's already happening somewhere ... ;)

Mind u, Timmy certainly talks like a Port coach (http://www.theadvertiser.news.com.au/footy/story_page/0,8747,18630853%255E21546,00.html)...

Tim ready for ride of lifetime
By DOUG ROBERTSON
29mar06
PORT Adelaide Magpies fans are in for an exciting ride with upbeat novice coach Tim Ginever.

The Magpies' multi-premiership skipper with a flair for the fantastic, is in a hurry to get Port back in the grand final.
"I love the expectation, that's why I love Port Adelaide – the expectation is always upon you," said Ginever, 40 next month. "Embrace it, it makes you a better person, it makes you lift. I found that as a player and I'm certainly finding that as a coach and I want it that way."

The master's apprentice last year, Ginever is out of the considerable shadow cast by close friend John Cahill, who ended the club's three-year finals drought.

Ginever says he is doing it his way but with respect for Cahill and the past.

"Port Adelaide people love the way we play football when we play properly, the way we like to play," Ginever said. "In our heyday, we weren't a team that kicked nine or 10 goals and won a game, we kicked 15 to 20 (goals) and we were entertaining.

"I showed our lads some games (on video) all the way from the 1960s right through to today and the same things apply. They are the things that win footy games and it's our culture, our ethos."

Uncomplicated, tough football underpinned by skill is what Ginever was talking about. He says he won't accept less.

He said: "We won't change much, why would we? We've always had skilful sides, you have to, how else do you win games, premierships?

"But today's coach is a completely different bloke to the dictator of the '60 or '70s where they could just roar the orders out. You've got to be collaborative with players ... not a dictator."

Cahill left a strong foundation and key recruits, midfielder Marc Bullen (Essendon), forward Shane Morrison (Richmond), defender John Baird (Kangaroos) plus the return of utility Matt Lokan (Collingwood) and forward Paul Evans (knee), expected by May, add a stronger goal-to-goal line. Troy Butcher's arrival from Glenelg adds running depth.

"It gives us the flexibility we didn't have," Ginever said. "Julian Wait and Mark Clayton fought their hearts out but at centre half-forward and centre half-back they're not tall enough to build a team around."

So, is Ginever brave enough for predictions?

"To us the expectation is always to win a premiership," he said. "Why would you do pre-season unless you were going to do that?

"Last year they started to click on to that idea through the way Jack (Cahill) is and the expectations we put on them. They're starting to believe it and that's what we have to continue. Otherwise we've wasted Jack's time, we've wasted a lot of good people's time in 2005.

"All I can say is come and see us, we'll be entertaining."

Arsene Wenger

6 Apr 2006, 15:24

Andre

6 Apr 2006, 16:08

You gotta love Timmy G - Doesnt hide behind the truth or blabber out the old cliches. He says he wants a premiership and that is what supporters love

As for Chocco hes safe but Im also keen to hear who others hypothetically think wed look at to lead the side next season for example. Who are the next in line per se?
I certainly wouldn't want anyone who's currently at the club in a coaching capacity. And I'd want a new coach to take a broom to all assistant positions except ruck coach.

gytre

6 Apr 2006, 17:03

You gotta love Timmy G - Doesnt hide behind the truth or blabber out the old cliches. He says he wants a premiership and that is what supporters love
I'd love to have Ginever coach the Power one day. But first things first...

*PAF

6 Apr 2006, 19:11

I wouldn't like to see us getting rid of coaches before their contract is up full stop.
He has this year and next at the very least.

Santos L Helper

8 Apr 2006, 00:44

Oh, and if we sign Choco to a new contract extension this year, I will be ********ed.

Won't happen. Choco still wants to coach Collingwood, and is being courted as we type.

Trust me on this......I have VERY good contacts.

RogerRabbit69

8 Apr 2006, 10:49

Won't happen. Choco still wants to coach Collingwood, and is being courted as we type.

Trust me on this......I have VERY good contacts.
When's Malthouse contracted until?

Doesn't seem much point in courting Choco at this stage. It's not as though someone's going to snatch him from under their noses.

birdmanptr

8 Apr 2006, 12:21

maccas_no1

8 Apr 2006, 16:20

Both are safe especially Craig.

As others have said, Williams has said before the season of the club rebuilding, by 2010 with good recruiting Port will be back as a serious threat once again, no doubt Williams knows how to win flags.

captain ebert

9 Apr 2006, 11:32

Larry the Liquidator

11 Apr 2006, 09:51

Makes me wonder how Danniher keeps getting re-appointed at Melbourne.

I don't wanna sound like a Macallister, but Williams is a proven Premiership coach, and a teacher to boot so he knows how to teach, and he had a big part to play back in 1996/97, in getting alot of the players who eventually featured in the 2004 flag. He deserves to at least see out his current contract. And if Port find their way back up as a contender say next year or the year after that, why on earth would you wanna get rid of him?

gbear

11 Apr 2006, 13:17

I certainly wouldn't want anyone who's currently at the club in a coaching capacity. And I'd want a new coach to take a broom to all assistant positions except ruck coach.

I concur. The only assitants that should remain are Primus and perhaps Sanderson, all the others lack ambition and IMO ambition for the head coaches job provides pressure, which drives success.

Crow-mo

11 Apr 2006, 23:52

Won't happen. Choco still wants to coach Collingwood, and is being courted as we type.

Trust me on this......I have VERY good contacts.

collingwood certainly deserve choco :p

Toots Hibbert

12 Apr 2006, 01:02

collingwood certainly deserve choco :p
Collingwood could do a lot worse than get Choco. He'd make a welcome change from the whining sook that Mick Malthouse has turned into. Choco can be feisty and stubborn but during the years that Port suffered a horendous injury toll he never turned to the absence of many key players as an excuse for poor performance. His line was always that other players would step up and the team continue to perform.

You'd never get Choco taking cheap shots at opposition fans like Eddie McGuire has done about SA fans. He's a straight shooter, and by the way a pretty good coach with a fine record. He's a guy that stood up under enormous pressure and came out on top. So no, Collingwood don't deserve him.

portentous

12 Apr 2006, 09:28

Collingwood don't deserve him as he doesn't accept coming second, something they are experts at....

crazy_big_al

12 Apr 2006, 09:44

Won't happen. Choco still wants to coach Collingwood, and is being courted as we type.

Trust me on this......I have VERY good contacts.

Are you serious? Well that would be crap IMO

Santos L Helper

14 Apr 2006, 09:40

Are you serious? Well that would be crap IMO

Very serious mate. I hear this every time I talk to this bloke. Text me, and you'll see just how close this info is.