R8: Port v Brisbane Review [Archive]

Macca19

21 May 2006, 18:01

Well, that was worse than last week. Sad to say but that was horrible.

Dont know where to start really. Our complete lack of accountability for our opponents is whats really worrying. Their midfield ran all over us. Once Peter went off we barely won a clearance at all. The total lack of chasing or energy is what is really noticeable. Half hearted chases or no chases at all. Even our usual chasers didnt bother today.

The match day coaching was terrible. I dont think Wakelin and Bishop were moved off their opponents all day, and if they were it definately wasnt for any significant amount of time. They both got destroyed, but were never moved. Why? Why bother? At least try something different. Mark still stuck by his pre planned changes and that was it. At least he threw a couple of younger guys in the middle. Chaplin and Willits/Pettigrew couldnt have done any better? If they wouldnt, at least they would have learned something. The average age of our starting defence today was about 31. Great way to rebuild.

Our midfield lacks any true clearance winner. Our forward line lacks any true target. Our defence was embarrasing.

There arent any real positives to come out of the day. Ezards debut was nice. At least he gave the side a spark. Its a pity that a few times he was left to chase 3 or 4 opponents while his teammates stood back and watched.

Im unsure where we go from here. Our entire group of players look panicky, unsure and simply disinterested.

Player Reviews:

Tredrea - A few marks and touches late in the match but otherwise he couldnt win a contest all match.

Wakelin - Was left on Brown all day and was thrashed.

Salopek - Played quite well. Found a lot of the ball and used it well. One of our better players

Lade - Worst game of the year. Was destroyed in the ruck and his around the ground work was well below what its been all year. Gone was the confident long kicking Lade and in his place was a panicky player whos first, second and third thought was to handball to someone backwards. Dunno what happened here.

P Burgoyne - Great first quarter. The side went downhill when he went off

S Burgoyne - Poor. Lacked chase and effort and didnt have much of an impact.

Ezard - Pretty good debut. Laid some great tackles and fought for and won the ball a few times.

Pearce - Like Shaun, he lacked chase and effort most of the day. A couple of long chases but when we really needed him to chase, he sat back and watched. Akermanis killed him in the first half.

K Cornes - A nothing game. Disposal was better than last week but just couldnt find the ball. Black had a day out.

Bishop - If he plays next week I dont think ill bother going to another game this year. Thankyou for your years of service Bish, but the time has come to seriously bring in new blood. Realistically, he should not play again this year. Was nowhere near Bradshaw all day. However, it is not his fault that he was left on him all day. Should have been moved.

Wilson - Another who lacked effort and made some real poor decisions like handballing over his head to an opponent standing on his own.

Mahoney - Started well, was well held for a while after that.

Symes - A bit panicky but at least tried to create something. Was decent.

White - Dropped about 9 marks today and just had a day to forget.

Thurstans - Took a good strong mark and kicked a goal in the 2nd quarter. That was it. Like Bishop, he should never play again. He cost us about 4 goals in laughable turnovers.

Kingsley - Unsighted almost all day.

Ebert - His best game for some time. Kicked two, took a screamer, tried hard all day. Well done Brett.

Lonie - In and out. Kicked a good goal. That was about it.

C Cornes - Misused today. Was left on Patfull all day. Dont know why. Was average.

Deluca - Hammered in the ruck but did ok when up forward. Kicked a goal.

Surjan - Was alright early but didnt have much impact after half time.

Walsh - A couple of bad clangers again. Lost his touch at the moment.

POTY Votes:
10
9
8
7
6
5 - Ebert
4 - Salopek, Ezard, Mahoney
3 - P Burgoyne, Symes
2 - S Burgoyne, C Cornes, Deluca
1 - Tredrea, Lade, Pearce, K Cornes, Lonie, Surjan
0 - Wakelin, Bishop, Wilson, White, Kingsley, Thurstans, Walsh

Magpiespower

21 May 2006, 18:06

It's like Commetti said, we're the "Andy Warhol" of the AFL (or words to that affect).

Play fifteen minutes and then we're done.

*PAF

21 May 2006, 18:08

...
Mark still stuck by his pre planned changes and that was it. ...
I was driving in the car towards the end of the first quarter when apparently Thurstans marked and goaled. ... then went straight to the bench.
Is that correct?
If so, WTF?

Macca19

21 May 2006, 18:09

Did we even play 15 minutes today though? Even our token revival quarter didnt happen.

Magpiespower

21 May 2006, 18:10

Did we even play 15 minutes today though? Even our token revival quarter didnt happen.

Thought we were half a chance at quarter-time.

Five minutes into the second term and we were gone.

Macca19

21 May 2006, 18:10

Cant blame the coach for stuff like that though PAF. He probably got the message a minute or two earlier. Lonie did the same thing. Kicked a goal then ran to the bench.

Ford Fairlane

21 May 2006, 18:11

I was driving in the car towards the end of the first quarter when apparently Thurstans marked and goaled. ... then went straight to the bench.
Is that correct?
If so, WTF?

Yes it's true. And when Lonie did his one ueeful thing of the day and kicked a goal on the run he just kept going all the way to the bench. Choco has gone rotation mad.

Magpiespower

21 May 2006, 18:13

I was driving in the car towards the end of the first quarter when apparently Thurstans marked and goaled. ... then went straight to the bench.
Is that correct?
If so, WTF?

Yeah, that happened.

But it's not unusual.

Coach makes a change and just before it's about to happen, player bobs up for a goal.

Felt for Toby when he got booed by supporters today.

He was far from the worst out there today.

*PAF

21 May 2006, 18:13

Cant blame the coach for stuff like that though PAF. He probably got the message a minute or two earlier. Lonie did the same thing. Kicked a goal then ran to the bench.
We seem to do that sort of stuff quite a bit.
Not sure it's all for the best as once a player gets an edge over his opponent we should ride it for as long as possible.

Ford Fairlane

21 May 2006, 18:13

The whole team has descended into madness. There is no structure, no discernible system, players rotate til even the supporters are dizzy. Selections make no sense, and you get the impression the players are voting with their actions.

Groove

21 May 2006, 18:15

Yeah, that happened.

But it's not unusual.

Coach makes a change and just before it's about to happen, player bobs up for a goal.

Felt for Toby when he got booed by supporters today.

He was far from the worst out there today.
He had some atrocious clangers out there today. Very costly errors.

Magpiespower

21 May 2006, 18:20

He had some atrocious clangers out there today. Very costly errors.

Yeah, he did - notably that handball in the last quarter.

But he wasn't the only one.

Toby's confidence looks completely shot.

Ported

21 May 2006, 18:24

When 3 port players in a row went the body, only to have the ball scooped up and run off with, you could see we'd switched off.

Porthos

21 May 2006, 18:25

Bishop - Continued his 2006 season form. Possibly his most consistent season for the Power.

Wakelin - Nasty limp once we got about 40 points down.

Shaun Burgoyne - Got slower once we got about 40 points down.

Lonie - I've held off bagging him this year, because its hard to judge how soft a player is on TV. Having seen him in his natural habitat, he is the softest player to wear a Port Adelaide uniform ever, and there are no exceptions. Classic case when a Brisbane player was clearing from defence, Lonie was right in his path, so he quickly ran out of the way so as not to impede the Brisbane player's run. This led to the goal that John Brown just dinked over the line. Will add nothing to the side, ever, trade him to anyone at the end of the year in a sweetheart deal like we got Walsh for. Even offer to pay most of his salary, its not like we have anyone else to spend it on for now.

Salopek - Meh. His exceptional quality seems to be an ability to look as though he's trying to clear the ball when he's not really. Great for forcing ball ups, I suppose.

Ebert - Gun effort, he shouldn't have been dropped last week, and this result is the sort he's been building towards all year. Actually is playing like an AFL player now, not a good SANFL player.

Ezard - Is playing like a good SANFL player. Lost his opponent a lot, but a pretty decent debut.

Lade - the inevitable thing with Lade. He loves being the primary ruck, but after a few weeks it gets a bit hard and he loses a bit of form. This has happened throughout his career, so we can't be too surprised. I don't think we should rush Brogan back to compensate though.

Deluca - looked like a typical rookie AFL ruckman. I think he's learning a bit from Primus in his second effort work at ballups, which is encouraging. Needs to learn to position himself to mark better.

Damon White - was barely OK. Has anyone seen him take a chest mark?

P Burgoyne - not a great day. Seem to take the wrong option a lot when he was on, then went off early.

Wilson - yeah, he's Wilson. Brisbane spent the game dragging him out of defence.

Pearce - Shut out. Dunno what happened there, maybe he's getting more attention now.

Chad - meh. Another quarter of good footy and a bunch of times where you wonder where he's gone.

K Cornes - I didn't think it was possible to unlearn football.

Mahoney - Got a bit lucky.

Symes - Not bad. A couple of good clearances, and he handled multiple opponents better than most.

Thurstans - FFS

Kingsley - Still should be at the Magpies. If players aren't proven fit, we should not be playing them.

Surjan - For a while when he was chasing and tackling I was on the Surjan bandwagon. But in the end, he didn't really do much...even the tenacity was only for a while. I can't see him being better than third-tier at his best at the moment.

Walsh - When you talk about Choco making tough decisions, playing Walsh actually is one. Some so-called hard decisions we hear about are of course very simple (like playing Chaplin, dropping Bish, etc)...but what about Walsh?

He's serviceable without being excellent. He's an OK creator of play in a side that has a fair number of players that could do that role. He's not very accountable for his opponent at all, but he keeps getting stats. And at his age, he definitely won't be in our next finals side. Its a genuinely tough call as to whether to keep him in the side now or not.

Choco - har har its about time Bishop's poor form clearly and painfully bit you on the arse. Quit being a sap and realise that what this squad needs is real hard-arse leadership, not you being a pub mate.

Ford Fairlane

21 May 2006, 18:26

Top review again Macca. They don't deserve your time and effort. ALtho maybe you couldadd a coaching review in there too ...

A couple of questions over and above the comments already made.

Can Mahoney keep his feet in a ground level contest?

Does Walsh have to try to break a tackle every time he takes possession?

If Shaun Burgoyne wants to crunch a body, can he do it early instead of saving it til the end of the game? He does it quite well.

Macca19

21 May 2006, 18:28

Its harsh to boo any player.

Ford Fairlane

21 May 2006, 18:29

Lonie - I've held off bagging him this year, because its hard to judge how soft a player is on TV. Having seen him in his natural habitat, he is the softest player to wear a Port Adelaide uniform ever, and there are no exceptions. Classic case when a Brisbane player was clearing from defence, Lonie was right in his path, so he quickly ran out of the way so as not to impede the Brisbane player's run. This led to the goal that John Brown just dinked over the line. Will add nothing to the side, ever, trade him to anyone at the end of the year in a sweetheart deal like we got Walsh for. Even offer to pay most of his salary, its not like we have anyone else to spend it on for now.

Thank you. Should never have been picked up, should never be picked again. Offer to Collingwood in a twins reunification attempt for the worst player on their list. I don't care who it is.

Porthos

21 May 2006, 18:33

Nonono, we don't need to take a player.

Just offer Lonie + 6th round pick for their 7th round pick.

Sheeds

21 May 2006, 18:34

Its harsh to boo any player.

Not if it is Thurstans or Bishop.

Macca19

21 May 2006, 18:38

A coaching review Ford?

I thought it was one of the most insipid coaching performances of Chocos career.

Ford Fairlane

21 May 2006, 18:44

Nonono, we don't need to take a player.

Just offer Lonie + 6th round pick for their 7th round pick.

Sounds like a plan to me.

Jumbo

21 May 2006, 18:45

K Cornes - I didn't think it was possible to unlearn football.

By hand and foot Kane has become our new 'bomb scare', every bloody possession went straight up in the bloody air

Ford Fairlane

21 May 2006, 18:47

A coaching review Ford?

I thought it was one of the most insipid coaching performances of Chocos career.

I think the debacle has crept beyond match day.

I wonder what this week's team bonding activity will be? Go Karts? Abseiling?

Porthos

21 May 2006, 18:49

In keeping with the theme of the season, I'm guessing dodgeball.

Jumbo

21 May 2006, 18:54

Nothing too physical

Ported

21 May 2006, 18:59

In keeping with the theme of the season, I'm guessing dodgeball.

I hear Rischbieth excels at it. Speaking of which, what's he up to? He's not even listed on the Port website.

Russian

21 May 2006, 19:05

Player Reviews:

Tredrea - First time this year he's played well enough to deserve a spot next week without a gold pass

Wakelin - Well beaten by Brown

Salopek - Kicking wasn't as good as usual, but one of not many good players

Lade - FFS Broges it's only pain - get out there

P Burgoyne - Tempted to give him 5 POTY votes and he went off half way through the 2nd

S Burgoyne - Thought he had more of it than the stats say, was good without being great

Ezard - First gamer's effort, didn't get much of it, would prefer him to go back to Westies if it's a choice between him and Doc in the middle

Pearce - Aker killed him, did **** all

K Cornes - Did nothing but Black didn't have any influence either

Bishop - What's he doing in a list of players?

Wilson - A bit rusty, but ran all day, far from our worst

Mahoney - Reasonable

Symes - Good

White - He tried, got kneed in the back twice which probably sums up his day

Thurstans - Looked ok in the square, elsewhere looked like Toby

Kingsley - Did a hamstring - good

Ebert - Being dropped worked, best game in ages, hopefully he'll keep playing like that up forward and won't spit the dummy about not being in the midfield this time

Lonie - First long goal he's kicked, stupid but when teammates told him what to do his execution was good

C Cornes - Couple of important marks in defence, but beaten by Patfull

Deluca - Outclassed in the taps, doesn't know what to do around the ground, at least he was a target up forward although he only had one uncontested chest mark which he followed with a kick that was never going anywhere but where it went and an overhead mark that shouldn't really have been paid. Should've stuck with Toby there (or given Willits a go)

Surjan - No impact

Walsh - Skills weren't great, brain was

Votes:
10
9
8
7
6
5 - S Burgoyne, Symes, Salopek
4 - K Cornes, P Burgoyne, Ebert, Wilson
3 - Tredrea, Mahoney
2 - C Cornes, Walsh
1 - Lade, Deluca, Ezard, Lonie, White
0 - Wakelin, Kingsley, Thurstans, Pearce, Surjan, Bishop

JuddyisGod

21 May 2006, 19:15

is Tredrea fit yet or still carrying? He looked better today but still struggled a bit.

PortProudWA

21 May 2006, 19:31

Heard the scores as they kept crossing to the game as it wasnt on the radio...didnt/dont have the heart to watch it on the tv after the final score!!

Where has my proud, strong club gone??? :(

Thank god the bombers lost, thats all I can say!! And thank god, i have someone to occupy my mind and heart now, other wise I'd be destroyed........SOME ONE COME AND GET ME WHEN THE REAL PORT ADELAIDE STANDS UP!!!

macca23

21 May 2006, 21:07

I went to the game today expecting a fiercely fought contest, which it was for nearly one quarter, the first. A disaster for Port from that point on.

Just a few observations from an outsider:-

Onground leadership - absolutely non-existent. No Primus, no Carr or even no Wangas type leadership. Someone has to adopt that role in the middle and around the ground.

Off-field match-ups - some amazing match-ups by Choco such as Chad Cornes after the first 2 minutes being moved off of Brown into the back pocket onto the 3rd tall Patfull playing his 1st game. WTF??

Tredrea - is not physically 100% right and his form is crap. The captain barely competes and definitely does not chase at present. His knee is not 100% right, and he should be rested completely for at least a couple of weeks to accelerate him getting to 100% fitness.

Bishop - is only a shadow of the player he once was, and belongs to the past not the present. Chaplin should take his place and be played every week for the rest of the year to build up confidence and form.

Thurstans - an embarrassment to your guernsey. Cannot play - must go.

Lade - poor bastard. Looked like he's been worked into the ground carrying the team for the previous few weeks.

Symes - the brightest light of the day for the Power. He is a genuine first class AFL player and would have been in Port's best 3 IMO. Has a great future.

Ebert - great come-back by the lad after copping heaps from the knockers (me included) a couple of weeks ago. Well done Brett.

Salopek - found a fair bit of the footy today but has to learn to get the hard footy. Still somewhat of a free-wheeler IMO - a talented one though.

The future - time for the powers to be at Port to openly declare that this is the start of a long term re-building program, so the supporters can expect and accept the fact that it can't be achieved without quite a bit of pain. The words have to be matched with actions and that means drawing a line through the names of certain players eg Thurstans and Bishop and transferring them to the "not to be selected list' with young players taking their place.

The goal has to be to win flags and that can't be done without re-building a squad that's capable of doing that - and that takes time and pain.

Ford Fairlane

21 May 2006, 21:25

Fair call Macca. You're right about Chad. Choco's managed to take Port's best player this year behind Lade and somehow destroy his confidence by hawking him all over the ground, apparently randomly. At least Pettigrew won't feel victimised.

GO 161

21 May 2006, 22:07

Power21

21 May 2006, 22:10

Yes it's true. And when Lonie did his one ueeful thing of the day and kicked a goal on the run he just kept going all the way to the bench. Choco has gone rotation mad.

You're kidding aren't you? You are saying this never happens, or it's weird? It happens all the time, and really isn't unusual for any team, you often see a midfielder or small forward kick a goal then havea spell, happens all the time.

PJ Power

21 May 2006, 22:13

Most of what I have to say has been said, but these are things that stand out.

1. Our players refuse to pick up an opponent - without exception. The lack of contest we provide through our HF through to FB line is incredible. Tredrea explained it post-match on 5AA by talking about zoning off to help in defence. Ebert retorted later mind you, that we would be better to help the defenders by applying pressure up the ground and possibly stopping the ball getting down there. Sounds like Herb is one bloke whose coaching might be improving.

2. Peter Burgoyne was the only player who kept us in it in the first quarter and when he went off we were left with nothing. I couldn't understand the use of many payers, but Pearce should have been injected into the middle. He was overawed by Ackermanis and then was too dumb as a defender for McGrath who embarrassed virtually all of our players at one stage or another.
Likewise the use of Chad is abominable. If he is not going to be played as a midfielder, surely he should be at CHB and against the Lions that means on Brown - at least he might have been competitive. Wakelin would have been a more realistic option on Bradshaw, and Bishop well he might have been able to restrict Patful to 3-4 goals.

3. Porthos has described Salopek beautifully. Looks like he is trying to create a clearance but only succeeds in getting held up by three opponents and forcing a ball-up. BUT, at least he actually tries to get to the ball. I thought he did ok today. After half-time he worked hard and along with Symes found himself all over the ground trying to get into the play. He played with alot more heart than many others out there, and is improving. He didn't disappoint me for a 30 game player.

4. Ebert - take a bow. That is how you can play HF. Just work hard. You are better than you realise. Be confident. Some beautiful things today.

5. Symes - the shining light. Tackles well, runs to create, actually shepherds quite effectively, chases, not afraid to stand up and play like a man.

6. Tredrea - maybe I am reading too much into it, but I thought there were some signs late in the game that he is coming around (slowly, but surely). He didn't play well and he got outmarked too easily at times. He still looks too sulky for a captain atm, but he moved around a bit more than in previous weeks.

7. White - just seems to be up and then down. Does not do well against the medium-tall mobile defender (in this case Notting). Under those circumstances should be moved to the goal-square. Happy to see him trialled in defence but Patful got the better of him. I can't understand why given his propensity to drop marks, Williams doesn't give clear instructions to one of the smaller players to always be around his feet. Ackermanis cleared from him on several occasions today.

8. Ezard - did ok. Work off the ball was encouraging. Is a good tackler, which he has over numerous teammates. Made some skill errors but looks a handy rather than brilliant longterm player.

9. DeLuca - showed some signs. I don't mind if he keeps playing. Every experience will help him in the longterm. I don't think he is going to be a dud.

10. Bishop, Thurstans and Lonie - duds, duds, duds. We are insulted by having to watch them play. At last several callers to radio stations singled these guys out. What could we ever have gained by playing Bishop ahead of Chaplin? What is Williams thinking?

11. Walsh and Kingsley - I don't know that they are of any value anymore. Kingers talked up the Port Magpies courage and tradition, but displayed none of it. His tackles didn't even look like sticking. Woeful.

We are by far the worst side in the competition now. There are no signs of improvement. We have to play as many kids as possible and be patient as they develop.

With Burgoyne and Kingsley out, it should mean that Thomson and possibly Ware get opportunities.
Chaplin and Willits should replace Thurstans and Bishop.
I'm not fussed if Brogan returns as DeLuca might as well continue his apprenticeship at AFL this year.

2006 is a lost cause. Even achieving honour in defeat is beyond our players.

Macca19

21 May 2006, 22:26

1. Our players refuse to pick up an opponent - without exception. The lack of contest we provide through our HF through to FB line is incredible. Tredrea explained it post-match on 5AA by talking about zoning off to help in defence. Ebert retorted later mind you, that we would be better to help the defenders by applying pressure up the ground and possibly stopping the ball getting down there. Sounds like Herb is one bloke whose coaching might be improving.

This is the one thing that gets me. Our complete lack of defensive skills all over the park. As soon as the opposition gets the ball its too much work. THe last two weeks the opposition has led us a merry dance all the way up the field. They have loose players all over the place. If a player fumbles it doesnt matter because they have as much time as they want to recover. If there is a loose ball contest, it doesnt matter because most of the time its 3 or 4 to 1 against us. I had a close look today especially at what was happening off the ball and where our loose players were when Brisbane were streaming down the ground. They were basically all on the opposite side of the ground. Surely players should not lose their opponent by up to 50 metres.

Is it the players mindset or is it coaching?

6. Tredrea - maybe I am reading too much into it, but I thought there were some signs late in the game that he is coming around

Cheap marks and kicks on a half back flank at the 23 minute mark of the last quarter isnt a sign.

PJ Power

21 May 2006, 22:30

Cheap marks and kicks on a half back flank at the 23 minute mark of the last quarter isnt a sign.

Don't get me wrong, he did not play at all well and leadership was still absent. Very poor from a man who was desperate to lead us.

But he did take 3-4 marks/half-volleys that I can recall moving a little more freely up the ground. He set Salopek up for his last quarter goal, and........ well I dunno Macca, I'm just hoping we get something out of him this year.

Our talls were absolutely flogged today. We keep talking about the problems with our midfielders, but between Wakelin and Bishop in defence and the three blind mice in our forward line, we don't look like taking a contested mark.

It is really depressing at the moment.

GO 161

21 May 2006, 22:49

Ho hum.
Another week, another thrashing on our home ground from a joke club - in fact, a combination of two joke clubs - another insipid , gutless performance.
And I'm pretty sure nothing's going to change anytime soon, at least until two things happen:

* Tough decisions are made regarding the playing list
* That brainless imbecile is removed from the coaches box.

Time to grow some cohones, Mr Boulton, Mr James, Mr Abernathy et al, and act.

Player reviews:

Tredrea -Pathetic performance. Thrashed by Michael. Didn't give a yelp. Needs to have a damn good look at himself. He is, after all, supposed to be the leader.

Wakelin - Unfortunately set up for failure by foolish coaching. First bad game for Dags in ages..

Salopek - Had a crack. Some disposals let him down.

Lade - Maybe the weight of carrying the side week in week out is starting to tell.

P Burgoyne - Looked OK till felled by that hammy again.

S Burgoyne - See Lade.

Ezard - Serviceable debut although bewildered why he spent so much time on the bench. We know what happens now though. Welcome to the Williams Revolving Door, Jimmy.

Pearce - Well down on efforts so far.

K Cornes - Hardly sighted. Assume he was used as a stopper on Black as per usual Brisbane match plans. Not too effective if that was the case.

Bishop - I'll wave as you pass by me on your way to Noarlunga. No, wait - that gold pass will be good for a while yet, unless the board comes to it's senses and acts immediately.
Should be the first bit of dead wood thrown out after Williams. Absolutely f***ing hopeless, and has been for years.

Wilson - No longer up to AFL standard. Must go. Injuries have caught up with him. A loyal warrior but his time has come. Retire with grace, Wilbur, and be remembered for the great Port man you have been, rather than a liability.

Mahoney - As per usual, tried his guts out.

Symes - Quality. Good value. Perhaps the one shining light on an otherwise very bleak day..

White - At one stage I looked up and saw him in the back pocket. God only knows what Scott Hodges or Tim Evans must be thinking.
No doubt both would be thanking their lucky stars they were never part of a side coached by Williams. Has this moron got some sort of personal issue with full forwards?.

Thurstans - Copping a lot of flack on here and at the ground, unjustifiably. Direct your anger at the idiot who has ruined his career, and turned a promising young player into a broken man with absolutely no confidence. It's not Toby's fault his coach doesn't have a clue. If that trade had gone through, you'd be seeing a very different player.

Kingsley - Hopefully, his latest injury means we have seen the last of this Gold Pass holder.

Ebert - Used as a small forward again. Performed admirably, but when we are screaming out for a midfielder, one has to ask......ah forget it.
What's the f***ing point.

Lonie - Kick long. Every time you get it. And guess what??

C Cornes - More effective coaching.

Deluca - Will get a lot out of this game. Kids learn from hard knocks. Shows some good signs, but will be back on the revolving door this week, no doubt.

Surjan - I'm getting very concerned this bloke is going to be Thurstans Mark 2. Was very impressive in his debut in early 04 - now looks to be devoid of confidence..

Walsh - Nothing game. Hard to offer any comment.

Ford Fairlane

21 May 2006, 22:56

You're kidding aren't you? You are saying this never happens, or it's weird? It happens all the time, and really isn't unusual for any team, you often see a midfielder or small forward kick a goal then havea spell, happens all the time.

Yeah you keep telling yourself it happens all the time and maybe you'll begin to believe it. Me, I'm a little more sceptical that it happens "all the time". Who's kidding whom? A nice touch was the small running midfielder Thurstans being taken off by rotato-man after mark, kick, goal.

I note on another thread you want to lay it all at the players feet for half arsed efforts. Well, if Choco's not telling them to play like that, and I'm sure he isn't, but they are doing it week in, week out ... well what do you suggest needs to happen? You've already said 10 changes won't make any difference.

deeps

21 May 2006, 23:21

I wonder if we're playing for picks?

I said it last week, and this week it was even more obvious. We apply absolutely no pressure on their ball carriers. We give them SOO much space and time, they can amble their way through the middle, and take their time, size up an option, and drill it to him, or go long for goal themselves.

Up till last week, Pearce, S.Burgoyne, even Lade, Surjan etc. were chasing hard, whilst the rest stopped and watched on. This week, it seems like even the above have given up (and i don't blame them...if nobody else is gonna put in, then why would they?)

I don't know what the game plan is, but how fkin hard is it to man up?! I mean ffs, once or twice in a game, if your opponent gets away from you, thats excusable, but for a whole freaking game, luke power ran up and down the ground with no opponent.

It's ridicilous. I've been saying that we can't make too many changes in one go, as it will affect stability, but enough is enough. Big changes are necessary.

OUT:
Bishop, Kingsley, Wilson, Lonie, Thurstans

IN:
Pettigrew, Chaplin, Thomson, Shattock (yes, shattock), Thomas

Shattock in, because he is willing to chase hard, puts in 100% all the time, and isn't afraid to put his body on the line. Looked ok in his last game for port.

edit: Tredrea is beginning to look ok, now needs the ball to be kicked to him more often

Porthos

21 May 2006, 23:25

I wonder if we're playing for picks?Lets not start this rumour. I'm sure Michelangelo is champing at the bit to use this as another excuse for why Choco is really a mastermind rather than a coach thats lost control of his team and club.

PJ Power

21 May 2006, 23:47

Lets not start this rumour. I'm sure Michelangelo is champing at the bit to use this as another excuse for why Choco is really a mastermind rather than a coach thats lost control of his team and club.

He definitely tried to give him that escape option during the press conference and Choco (God bless his funny little soul) replied by pointing out that there were 13-14 games left and if you won all of them that would leave you pretty high on the ladder.
Ahhh, fairy land, where all of your dreams come true and where you get to pick your own fairies like Bishop, Lonie and co. and play them wherever your dainty little heart wants to.

Ford Fairlane

21 May 2006, 23:52

Somewhere, over the rainbow, way up high.
There's a land that I heard of Once in a lullaby.
Somewhere, over the rainbow, skies are blue.
And the dreams that you dare to dream
Really do come true.

Toots Hibbert

21 May 2006, 23:56

THe first quarter effort was fine. We kicked into a two to three goal wind and were down only a few points at quarter time.

Both sides came out prepared at the start of the second quarter. Brisbane were prepared to chip the ball around, and we were prepared to let them. As everyone has said the lack of effort and accountability is the outstanding feature of our poor play.

Players who appeared to give a damn and were prepared to run and chase:-

Wilson,
Pearce,
Ebert,
Mahoney,
Symes,
Ezard,
White (dropped two or three marks - not nine, but worked bloody hard and presented well taking some good marks in the process)
Shaun Burgoyne (and I'm a bit surprised he hasn't received higher marks from some here because he was one of the players prepared to chase down one opponent after another while his mates stood by and were not even in place to pick up the turnover created by his efforts. In addition he won some good clearances out of the middle).

Was Adam Thomson injured during the game? Seemed to have very little time on the ground. Why wasn't he brought into the middle instead of putting Wilbur there in the last quarter after he had worked his arse off?

Why did it take till half way through the last quarter before Ebert got a run in the middle?

Matthew Bishop should never play for us again. He simply takes up space on the team sheet. It's sad to see him now and remember him when he was playing well for us up to and including 2004. Choco,wake up and realise he's history. Put Chaplin in place of him. At least he's part of our future.

I've finally made up my mind about Thurstans. He's one of these players that looks like he can play but is basically not up to standard. Dump him and bring him back only in an emergency. Bring in Willits in place of him. Let's see whether he shows any promise.

Nathan Lonie does a few useful things but physical presence is minimal. That's a major failing in a footballer and I'm almost sorry he kicked a good running goal because it no doubt has ensured him a game next week.

To me the key feature was the lack of accountability and effort by the majority of our side. It was maddening to see a minority of our players prepared to chase hard and being forced to follow the ball from one opponent to the next when, if their team mates had been prepared to work even half as hard, a turnover would have been forced.

As the game went on the inevitable result of the lack of commitment was a drop in confidence and then the descent into laughable turnovers and the gift wrapping of goals to the opposition.

Why have the players turned into a rabble? It has to get back to the coach. There's no escaping this. The exact cause of the players' lack of motivation is not clear. Is it disillusionment with the continued selection of players like Bishop and Thurstans? Is it disillusionment with a game plan that just does not work against decent sides? Or something else? :confused:

(PS by not mentioning Lade and Chad Cornes I'm not implying they played without heart, just that they had below par games - which they are entitled to, considering they have been part of the core of the side that has continued to fight in the last six weeks.)

Russian

22 May 2006, 00:07

Was Adam Thomson injured during the game? Seemed to have very little time on the ground. Why wasn't he brought into the middle instead of putting Wilbur there in the last quarter after he had worked his arse off? Could be because he wasn't in the 22 ;)

Toots Hibbert

22 May 2006, 00:11

Could be because he wasn't in the 22 ;)
Oh. I thought I saw him out there in the second quarter. That's a symptom of me being too busy to pay attention to footy during the week.

crazy_big_al

22 May 2006, 12:35

a joke of a game

Powerstufff

22 May 2006, 13:23

We are a dispirited, rudderless, poorly coached rabble. The coaching box seems incapable of learning. The players produce more turnovers than Balfours.
It is actually easier to score a goal against Port after we've score a point than from a centre bounce. Oppositions start off in possession (of course), we zone off on kick-outs, let them play overlap football down to the forward pocket, then leave them a loose forward inside the 50m.
Team after team are able to beat us at the clearances always having one opponent for each of our guys plus one loose man to run off.

Player Reviews:

Tredrea - Sparked up a bit late in the game but it's embarrassing when the crowd give their captain a sarcastic cheer for taking a mark. Not leading as he used to. Not taking the marks he used to. Dishing off shots he should take.

Wakelin - I thought he did pretty well though it's clear most here didn't. One glaringly mistimed leap saw the ball fall into Brown's hands.

Salopek - Really good. Still only 80% reliable in his disposals though.

Lade - Started well but became less effective as the game went on, especially the second half. Still it must be pretty demotivating to be a tap ruck-man whose taps are consistently intercepted by Brisbane players.

P Burgoyne - The footy gods are such :D :D :D :D s. Peter was giving us one of our best games for ages so of course he'd pull a hammy. After that centre clearances were the Luke Power show.

S Burgoyne - I found it hard to judge at the match. Intermittent bursts of speed and skill but not noticed for great slabs of time otherwise.

Ezard - A really good first game and an automatic selection for next week IMO. I was surprised to hear Chocco sounding less impressed post-match.

Pearce - He was due for a bad one someday and this was it. Missed a snap early. Little effect from then on.

K Cornes - Worked hard but disposals were really poor, in fact damaging to us more than helpful.

Bishop - Truly atrocious. Absolutely no contest provided. Really what goes through this guy's head? "..Ball coming down...hello, there's my wife in the crowd...opponent leading out...We need to get milk on the way home...better get after him...hmmm, that putting your hands in the air and catching it works well, I might try that sometime....

Wilson - Played surprisingly well for someone who couldn't play out last week's game. However this is not to say he was anything special. The general decay in the squad's attitude and skills seems to have affected even him.

Mahoney - Worked well early but pretty well roughed up, with no protection from the umpires. Fatigue, soreness, and poor delivery to him saw his output drop off. A few time threw himself over the half-volley balls in front of him which is a bad habit as it invited the pursuing player to land on him in a bone crunching tackle.

Symes - Adequate, with a bit more confidence might have tried to show some flair.

White - Did some good stuff but the dropping of crucial marks and the half-volley passes (see 'Mahoney') saw him take a step backwards.

Thurstans - Laughable. Selection stinker of the round. That pass from Tredders that Catdog sprayed when he could have walked into an open goal........could you have a more defining moment on our season than that? It was the 'Wooden Spoon Event'.

Kingsley - Gave some confidence and skill when on, so of course was injured.

Ebert - Courage, excitement, skill. One magic long distance goal in the second quarter just before we gave up totally. Another that was close and hit the post. PLEASE keep playing like that.

Lonie - In front of us on the eastern side he stood and watched as a ball rolled out, except it didn't. A Brisbane player scooped it up fired it down the wing and BANG, they goaled. However he also excitingly took the ball through the midfield, weaved through traffic, and kicked a long distance goal. Between those two point I thought him adequate.

C Cornes - Adequate. Apart from a few good marks I don't know what else to say.

Deluca - Just a development game and I hope we persist. Terribly underweight at present but with a bit of beef in a year or two will be imposing, physically at least. Thrashed in ruck. Kicked one 'gimme' goal. Missed a relatively easy one by a mile.

Surjan - Tried his heart out, maybe less obvious on TV. Not able to affect the game much.

Walsh - Gives the team a lot but like nearly all of them is making errors he shouldn't.

Papa G

22 May 2006, 14:21

I thought Wakelin was okay, some of J Brown's goals were lucky and not entirely Wake's fault. Lost it a bit at the end when we were getting pumped.

Bishop on the other hand was flattered by Bradshaw only kicking 6. Could have had 10. I have not been as hard on Bish as many others, but after that game, it's over.

We are officially the worst side in the AFL and will be bottom after next week's "marquee matchup"

GO 161

22 May 2006, 22:31

Ezard - A really good first game and an automatic selection for next week IMO. I was surprised to hear Chocco sounding less impressed post-match.
.

Pwerstufff....

7 years of Choco Gump and the Revolving Door Policy, and you still haven't got it worked out??

Ford Fairlane

23 May 2006, 01:30

Pwerstufff....

7 years of Choco Gump and the Revolving Door Policy, and you still haven't got it worked out??

Choco did a sweep of all the juniors under the "inconsistent" heading. He may have even singled out poor Surjan again. That way he has all his bases covered whichever ones he chooses to drop.

PJ Power

23 May 2006, 01:40

Choco did a sweep of all the juniors under the "inconsistent" heading. He may have even singled out poor Surjan again. That way he has all his bases covered whichever ones he chooses to drop.

If ever there was a game to single out the youngsters for positive acknowledgement, surely it was yesterday. Not that they were that great, but it seems widely agreed that 3 of the 8 were in our best 5 contributors (Ebert, Symes and Salopek). That says an enormous amount about how insipid everyone else is atm.

Ford Fairlane

23 May 2006, 01:45

Here are a couple of Choco's comments, from the press conference (http://portadelaidefc.com.au/default.asp?pg=news&spg=display&articleid=267412). I wonder if it occurs to him you tend to go out of games while you're sitting on the bench ...

Explaining the inconsistency of some youngsters, Williams said: "You get teased a little by a quarter or a contest, and then, gee, they go out of the games sometimes for a fair time.

"Last week (Jacob) Surjan played particularly well, today you didn't see that much from him. Jimmy Ezard did a little bit today, (Brad) Symes did a little bit and he's missed a couple of weeks with appendicitis, so that was okay.

deeps

23 May 2006, 01:46

PJ Power

23 May 2006, 01:51

shaz63

23 May 2006, 10:30

Deeps, this is what upsets me quite a bit.

Yesterday he mentioned Surjan as not doing as much as the previous week. That comment was certainly in the context of being asked about the young players, but I haven't heard him once say:

"Bishop isn't giving us anywhere near the effort or performance of 2 years ago"

"Dew is really struggling at the moment"

"Toby had a shocker today"

Even Sheedy who has often been described as a protector of his own players in public fora, singled out Jason Johnson's poor form and talked openly about dropping him.

I don't care if Choco doesn't single out anybody, but don't mention a kid who at least did some chasing and effected a smother. That was a helluvalot more than others provided yesterday.

Really is poor form on Choco for singling out the young guys that actually try to prove themselves.
Surj may have not of been as good as the week before but there were a lot of other players that have not been pulling their weight for awhile now.
Yes, Dew was sent back to the Bulldogs and Motlop was given a run with the Roosters but its about time players like Bishop were hoistered back there as well.
Why does he continually get a game after a rather poor performance week after week.

Time to take away the gold card and give them a spot in the 22 based on performance.

Toots Hibbert

23 May 2006, 10:37

Yeh i don't quiet see how he is blaming this on the youngsters

This season, the players that have shown something at some stages:

Lade
S.Burgoyne
CCornes
Salopek - young
White - young
Pearce - young
Surjan - young
B.Symes - young
Shattock - i thought he showed quiet a bit in his only outing for us

The ones that have shown nothing

Bishop
Thurstans
Kane cornes
Dom Cassisi
Daniel motlop
Stewart Dew
Peter Walsh
Warren Tredrea - excused
Lonie

Nothings:

All the rest

Most positives have come from the youngsters, and the poor ones, from the seniors... This is why we are struggling. And i can't understand why williams is blaming it on the youngies
Can't agree with you on Walshy, deeps. He's one of the guys that's been in good form until lately and has never stopped trying. I'm a bit twitchy about this because Rucci is ready to call time on his career and that of Wakelin who was in top form until suspended. I hope both these guys are still playing next year.

Powerstufff

23 May 2006, 10:43

If ever there was a game to single out the youngsters for positive acknowledgement, surely it was yesterday. Not that they were that great, but it seems widely agreed that 3 of the 8 were in our best 5 contributors (Ebert, Symes and Salopek). That says an enormous amount about how insipid everyone else is atm.And Ezard busted his guts around the clearances. I haven't sat and worked out my best players, too dispirited to do so, but he'd certainly have been in the best 10.
I acknowledge Chocco's view is coloured by how well a player achieves his set task, not how many touches he gets. Therefore if you are set to tag a player but run off racking up possessions and your man runs free Chocco will be vexed where the fans may be happy. But I still think Ezard did very well.

Bresh

23 May 2006, 10:44

Exactly, Toots. I can't see any reason why Wakes can't go around again. One of the few senior players that both earns his spot and can teach our brigade of young defenders a thing or two.

Powerstufff

23 May 2006, 11:01

...I can't see any reason why Wakes can't go around again.....Agreed. Plus agree with Toots on Walsh. IMO neither of these players have anything to be ashamed of nor, vitally, are they keeping anyone more deserving out.

deeps

23 May 2006, 15:28

Can't agree with you on Walshy, deeps. He's one of the guys that's been in good form until lately and has never stopped trying. I'm a bit twitchy about this because Rucci is ready to call time on his career and that of Wakelin who was in top form until suspended. I hope both these guys are still playing next year.

Agree that he never stops trying. However, he isn't getting any younger, and his last few games have been poor. He's probably the best on the 'bad' list though, i wouldn't at all be bothered if he stayed, but the reason i suggested we get rid of him, was that he takes up a youngsters position, and someone like thomas can come in and get some experience.

Wakes, definately one of our better players, i've got no qualms with him staying, i'd be happy. I even think he MIGHT have one more year left in him, depending on how the rest of the season goes for him. Or he might be useful as a backup backman at the very least