View Full Version : Worst test cricketer you've seen?
Dippers Donuts
12 Feb 2002, 14:52
Who's the biggest dud you have seen play test cricket?
For me - Brad Hogg from WA. One test in India, admittedly he was drafted into the side. Stodgy batsman, left arm chinaman bowler.
Least he got a baggy green cap out of it...
Who's yours?
Jars458
12 Feb 2002, 15:12
Simon O'Donnell
TESTS
(career)
M I NO Runs HS Ave SR 100 50 Ct St
Batting & Fielding 6 10 3 206 48 29.42 43.73 0 0 4 0
O M R W Ave BBI 5 10 SR
Bowling 156.4 37 504 6 84.00 3-37 0 0 156.6
The Doctor
12 Feb 2002, 15:17
Tom Hogan, Ray Bright, Simon Davis, Chris Matthews, Greg Ritchie, Sam Gannon, Micheal Hibbert, Wayne Phillips (Vic), Jo Angel, Peter McIntyre, Peter Wilson, Scott Muller, Sean Young
just to name a few
Dippers Donuts
12 Feb 2002, 15:19
Yeah SOD was a dud test cricketer wasn't he (aint much better as a commentator either imo).
Another vastly overrated player (although by no means the worst I've seen) is Carl Hooper. Captains the Windies with a batting average of about 34 and a bowling average of 70. Struggle to get a game with many of our state sides I reckon.
Dippers Donuts
12 Feb 2002, 15:22
BTW, did Greg Campbell end up playing a test for Australia?
If not, would have to qualify as one of the worst "tourist's ever.
Jars458
12 Feb 2002, 15:24
Originally posted by Dippers Donuts
BTW, did Greg Campbell end up playing a test for Australia?
If not, would have to qualify as one of the worst "tourist's ever.
He did play one test in that series - I think the first or the last as someone was injured
Campbell definitely played 1 test on that 89 ashes tour.
London Dave
12 Feb 2002, 15:30
Campbell played two, got another game in Tassie the next Aussie season I think.
Chris Matthews from WA sprayed it around a bit i his 2(?) tests.
I think you'd have to go with some of the guys who played during WSC. Just off the top of my head, Sam Gannon, David Ogilvie were two pretty ordinary cricketers who got a few games. Did David Horne (leftie from NSW) ever get a game? And Murray Bennet...dud!
Jars458
12 Feb 2002, 15:32
He actually played four matches and took 13 wickets - not too bad at all relatively
TESTS
(career)
M I NO Runs HS Ave SR 100 50 Ct St
4 4 0 10 6 2.50 15.62 0 0 1 0
O M R W Ave BBI 5 10 SR Econ
Bowling 158.3 29 503 13 38.69 3-79 0 0 73.1 3.17
ONE
WCE2000
12 Feb 2002, 16:11
I really dont like it when it people pose a question such as this. I played against plenty of players who only played one or two tests in grade cricket up in Sydney, and i can assure you, they are all brilliant cricketers.
I know people like to pose the question, but its just something i really dont like. personal choice more than anything.
Ruddeger
12 Feb 2002, 16:17
Originally posted by Dippers Donuts
Another vastly overrated player (although by no means the worst I've seen) is Carl Hooper. Captains the Windies with a batting average of about 34 and a bowling average of 70. Struggle to get a game with many of our state sides I reckon.
I feel that seeing as I am related to him (he is married to my cousin) I should stand up for him where he can't :)
Sure, his figures don't really stack up, butjust from watching him you can tell that he is going at 3/4 pace at the most. His first-class batting and bowling averages of 46.29 and 35.05 stack up more favourably. As for not being able to crack a Pura Cup side, he easily took out the Ryder medal in Melbourne District cricket when he played for Carlton a couple of seasons back, all while not training, flying over to Melbourne from Adelaide every friday afternoon, and worrying about the welfare of Carl jr., who was in poor health as a result of being born prematurely.
That said, I can understand whre your criticism is coming from, and I'm possibly a little biased in my opinion of him.
Its got to be Scott Muller.
Bomber Spirit
12 Feb 2002, 18:00
Simon Davis. 0 runs at an average of 0.00, and 0 wickets at an average of infinity.
Daren Ganga (WI) and Wayne Larkins (Eng). Absolute shockers.
Worst Aussie : Usually maligned guys like Muller and Cook actually did pretty well in their Tests, and Sean Young & Paul Wilson didn't get much of a chance in the single matches they played. Brad Hogg might have got carted a bit in India, but so did Warne and all the others. Jo Angel was pretty good, despite not taking many wickets, remember he played against a pretty formidable West Indies line up, and has been a fantastic consistent bowler for WA who deserved a chance internationally.
The one bloke who reckon never did much was Brendon Julian, who got a few Tests and way too many one-dayers. Being a left armer was an advantage, but bowled so much garbage that he probably achieved more with the bat than the ball. Rarely averaged under 30 a season bowling for WA, and his overall First Class figures only look respectable because he played so much cricket in the inferior County competition in the UK.
The Old Dark Navy's
12 Feb 2002, 20:18
Dutchie Holland was a reasonable spin bowler but all I can remember is his abysmal batting and absolutely attrocious fielding.:eek:
The Hollioke brothers from England.
Boeta Dippenear [Sth Af] may be a future candidate.
Originally posted by Darky
.
The one bloke who reckon never did much was Brendon Julian, who got a few Tests and way too many one-dayers. Being a left armer was an advantage, but bowled so much garbage that he probably achieved more with the bat than the ball. Rarely averaged under 30 a season bowling for WA, and his overall First Class figures only look respectable because he played so much cricket in the inferior County competition in the UK.
I was wondering when someone would bring up BJ. I personally am a big fan of his. He started very brightly then his bowling got weaker (opponents found him out?) His batting was very impressive by that stage & he would've batted higher for W.A. if they hadn't had blokes like Gilchrist (B.J. would've batted ahead of most state keepers), Brad Hogg (not a fan myself) & Kade Harvey (don't rate him either) he would've had more opportunities. He had A good ashes tour & a great tour of The Carribean.
He bowled quite well in his tests and had a few good innings with the bat (1 half century?) His bowling was poor in one dayers ( most left armers seem to struggle in one dayers, Akram & Reid excepted) though his batting was OK.
He made a big century (in a shield final in Perth from memory) and it was one of the best innings you'll ever see.
I have no idea what sort of picture his numbers paints but i'm sure they don't tell the full story. What can more can I say B.J. is my type of cricketer. I'm a Nicholson fan too for similar reasons, fast bowler who really has a go with the bat & they're pretty rare.
The Hippie
12 Feb 2002, 20:58
Anyone remember Sam (I think that was his first name) Trimble's ODI debut years ago, that was embarassing. The poor bloke got so nervous, he couldn't hit the pitch when he was bowling and bowled a stack of wides in his first spell. That said, he was a good state player for QLD, and a really good, hard-hitting lower order batsman.
Booze Hound
12 Feb 2002, 22:27
BT
Brendon Julian only played one season in England (for Surrey) and you'll probably find his stats were no worse than in Australia.
Dippers Donuts
12 Feb 2002, 22:54
Originally posted by Ruddeger
I feel that seeing as I am related to him (he is married to my cousin) I should stand up for him where he can't :)
Sure, his figures don't really stack up, butjust from watching him you can tell that he is going at 3/4 pace at the most. His first-class batting and bowling averages of 46.29 and 35.05 stack up more favourably. As for not being able to crack a Pura Cup side, he easily took out the Ryder medal in Melbourne District cricket when he played for Carlton a couple of seasons back, all while not training, flying over to Melbourne from Adelaide every friday afternoon, and worrying about the welfare of Carl jr., who was in poor health as a result of being born prematurely.
That said, I can understand whre your criticism is coming from, and I'm possibly a little biased in my opinion of him.
Not really criticising him Ruddeger, just a gentle dig that's all. When he's on song he is a beautiful batsman to watch, although I think it is fair to say he hasn't maximised his talent.
He seems like a good guy as well.
WCE2000
Fair enough comment. As a cricketer who struggled to get the occasional A grade game, sure, these underperforming test cricketers are still far and away better talents than I will ever be (although Brad Hogg...;))
Just a thought provoking thread that's all, no malice intended.
Bulldog1954
13 Feb 2002, 00:42
Brett Lee :)
Esperito
13 Feb 2002, 01:22
And imagine if he did NINE.
I guess they mean he'd be even more of a ****head.
How dare you say Brad Hogg is involved in this thread. I've got his autograph on my Eltham hat with Courtney Walsh. Can PLAY!
Originally posted by Hoggy
How dare you say Brad Hogg is involved in this thread. I've got his autograph on my Eltham hat with Courtney Walsh. Can PLAY!
I got Brady Rawlings's autograph at a club function last year. Doesn't mean HE can play! :D
But I do think Brad Hogg had something to offer, talentwise, a few years ago. Just seems to have stagnated a bit, maybe because he and the WA hierarchy didn't know what his role was. I mean, he started out as a batsman, bowled a few overs and took a couple of wickets, and due to the lack of spinners in WA, he seemed to be pushed to work on his bowling, which unfortunately didn't really improve. His batting suffered, and he ended up batting at 8 or 9.
So what is he - a batsman who bowls, a bowler who bats well, or is he in that limbo where his (or someone else's) approach to his career has inadvertently stuffed up both facets? :confused:
I honestly thought he had a chance for the ODI's this year because he's averaging about 50 with the bat and he's about third in the wickets tally and he's a great fielder.
Oh yeah, this is Brad Hogg I'm talking about
SeinDude
13 Feb 2002, 12:20
Mark Ramprakash would have to be my pick. How a player with a test average of only 26 can get into any team's top 6 in the batting order is beyond me!!
It's more of a case of him under-achieving, as he is a very talented county player in the English leagues, but England will never get anywhere if the likes of him play in their test side.
SeinDude
Waltzing Woof Biscuit
13 Feb 2002, 13:02
Originally posted by The Hippie
Anyone remember Sam (I think that was his first name) Trimble's ODI debut years ago, that was embarassing. The poor bloke got so nervous, he couldn't hit the pitch when he was bowling and bowled a stack of wides in his first spell. That said, he was a good state player for QLD, and a really good, hard-hitting lower order batsman.
I think it was Glenn Trimble, and yes, it wasn't pretty.
But THE worst HAS to be Chris Matthews (agree LondonDave). Played two tests, some time apart, and on both occasions was totally overawed. In the first, the batsmen almost had to shoulder arms at third slip. The selectors gave him another go, and the same thing happened.
Chris Tavare of England was AWFUL to watch. You thought Gavaskar could be slow? This guy had the shot making of a sedated tortoise.
And LondonDave, I thought Murray Bennett was kinda cool with his dark glasses. Had a decent batting average at least :)
Groucho
13 Feb 2002, 15:06
Probably a bit long ago for most of you but take it from me the worst Test cricketer ever was John Watkins. He was a leggie and plucked from nowhere (well,NSW anyway-of course!) by the selectors in 1973. He played one test against Pakistan and I remember a commentator saying that "his bowling seemed to lack all the necessary skills required to play the game of cricket", or words to that effect. He just couldn't land the ball on the pitch or even near the batsman! But he still went on the following tour of the West Indies! Thankfully he didn't play any more tests. Strangely he helped win that test by putting on about 70 with Bob Massie for the last or 9th wicket giving Australia enough runs to allow Max Walker to take 6-15 off 16 overs and win a close one. But as he was selected as a bowler he would have to be the worst! hardly heard of again even for NSW after that.
wagstaff
13 Feb 2002, 15:33
Nixon McLean of the West Indies would be up there for me. Somehow managed to play all five Tests against Australia last summer yet he failed to take 10 wickets for the whole series. It would have helped had he learnt how to actually swing or seam the ball.
Overall, his Test record isn't much better:
19 matches, 44 wickets at 42.56
Macca19
13 Feb 2002, 16:46
Chris Matthews was shocking. 3 tests, 6 wickets at 52. Couldnt ball to save his life...i remember his first test was when i was young..like 5 or 6 and all i can remember about him was the dozens of wides he balled.
Julian wasnt that bad. He had quite a good series against the West Indies, i think in 95 in the Carribean where we won our first series there for 30+ years.
other than that, there really isnt that ive seen. The Aussie team has always been very stable with no real hacks in it since ive followed cricket (since 89). The only "hacks" i can think of is Chris Matthews and the other players that played one or two tests for no real result
The majority of the New Zealand team from about:
New Zealand v England, 1991/92, 1st Test
Lancaster Park, Christchurch
18,19,20,21,22 January 1992 (5-day match)
Result: England won by an innings and 4 runs
until about:
Pakistan v New Zealand, 1996/97, 2nd Test
Rawalpindi Cricket Stadium
28,29,30 November, 1 December 1996 (5-day match)
Result: Pakistan won by an innings and 13 runs
With special honourable mentions to the teams that lost by an innings and 200+ runs
London Dave
13 Feb 2002, 22:33
Yeah, Chris Matthews was an interesting case. I remember a newspaper article about him at the time, saying that some people are totally destroyed by nerves, or because they feel they don't belong/aren't good enough, completely lose the plot and are unable to do the things that come naturally in a less stressful situation. Glen Trimble had the same problem, kind of like what happened to Ian Baker-Finch.
I recall Watkins Groucho, legendary performance that.
Possibly another name for the list is Jonathon Agnew (now the BBC cricket supremo for radio at least.) Took a big haul v the Windies at Lords, and the poms are announcing the 'great' fast bowler has arrived. Came down to Oz, and I recall Slug Jordan absolutely cacking himself on the radio when he bowled, saying "...and the Poms reckon this bloke is quick????"
Santos L Helper
14 Feb 2002, 10:08
Trevor Laughlin
Wayne Phillips (vic)
Murray Bennett
Tom Hogan
Steve Smith
Peter Toohey
Julian Weiner (hehe)
Dav Whatmore
Jeff Moss
Phil Carlson
Wayne Clark
Alan Ogilvie
Tony Mann
Ahh, the old WSC era...............glory days for the hack.
Chris Matthews test match performances were excruciating to watch. Simon Davis was cod ordinary too.
Australia have tried a few spinners of the years that weren't much chop - Murray Bennett, Brad Hogg, Tom Hogan, Peter Sleep all come to mind.
Of batsmen - Rob Kerr from Qld did nothing in a couple of games.
Mark Ramprakash is the one that astounds me - averages under 30 and he's played about 50 test matches. Just shows how low the Poms have sunk in recent years.
Bloodstained Angel
14 Feb 2002, 11:48
Dirk Welham
I'm still amazed at the hype that surrounded this guy - and yet he did diddly squat.
He did manage one ton - but I think that was about it.
To think he was touted at the time as the new Greg Chappell or something equally as ridiculous
cheers
Groucho
14 Feb 2002, 12:49
Originally posted by Santos L Helper
[
Jeff Moss
Ahh, the old WSC era...............glory days for the hack. [/B]
Jeff Moss!!! He's got a test average of 60 if you don't mind!
Briedis
14 Feb 2002, 13:59
Originally posted by The Hippie
Anyone remember Sam (I think that was his first name) Trimble's ODI debut years ago, that was embarassing. The poor bloke got so nervous, he couldn't hit the pitch when he was bowling and bowled a stack of wides in his first spell. That said, he was a good state player for QLD, and a really good, hard-hitting lower order batsman.
That's who I was trying to think of...Trimble. That has to go down as the worst debut of all time doesn't it?
How come we both remember that one? Must have been a Manly/Parra reply on beforehand! :D
Briedis
14 Feb 2002, 14:05
Originally posted by BMD
Chris Matthews test match performances were excruciating to watch. Simon Davis was cod ordinary too.
Australia have tried a few spinners of the years that weren't much chop - Murray Bennett, Brad Hogg, Tom Hogan, Peter Sleep all come to mind.
Of batsmen - Rob Kerr from Qld did nothing in a couple of games.
Mark Ramprakash is the one that astounds me - averages under 30 and he's played about 50 test matches. Just shows how low the Poms have sunk in recent years.
Ramprakash is a tough one. His stats say he is no good, but he looks like a good player when he bats, some beautiful shots when in form. He just has a habit of getting himself out too early unfortunately....
Originally posted by Briedis
Ramprakash is a tough one. His stats say he is no good, but he looks like a good player when he bats, some beautiful shots when in form. He just has a habit of getting himself out too early unfortunately....
Agree that he plays some nice shots, but eventually you just have to put the runs on the board. How many chances do you get?
Briedis
14 Feb 2002, 14:38
Originally posted by BMD
Agree that he plays some nice shots, but eventually you just have to put the runs on the board. How many chances do you get?
Well, I guess he's thanking his lucky stars he wasn't born an Australian! He would be in the top bracket of English batsmen even without any runs....true about how low they have gone, look to be on the way back though. I guess it has to be remembered that he would not have had the chance to build many big partnerships in this English side due to the lack of quality batsmen in the side, maybe that is a factor as well.
Scoring runs doesn't seem to be a criteria over here either...or maybe Steve had scored TOO many - so he gets dropped.:D
dogs105
20 Feb 2002, 04:36
I remember a certain series in ~87 vs NZ, when Sleepy was our best player by far (He was about the only one doing anything!!)
Well, he was making runs anyway
Easily the best #7 batsman in Aus. History until Gilly came along (Sorry Ian H)
:)
Worst batsman for mine has to be Steve Smith. I remember thinking at the time how out of his depth he was. Never passed 12 runs in 5 innings - even our bowlers were outscoring him! Career ended with a broken little finger from Joel Garner. Totally inglorious.
Worst bowler - Chris Matthews. Can't recall the last time I cringed so much at watching an Australian bowler. I thought that over might never end. There are guys with worse figures, but Matthews was the worst to watch.
Fat Red
21 Feb 2002, 09:42
Originally posted by The Doctor
Tom Hogan, Ray Bright, Simon Davis, Chris Matthews, Greg Ritchie, Sam Gannon, Micheal Hibbert, Wayne Phillips (Vic), Jo Angel, Peter McIntyre, Peter Wilson, Scott Muller, Sean Young
just to name a few
Ray Bright is most unfair, took 53 test wickets, not a great average but there's plenty worse, had a big hand in the tied test in India.
Greg Ritchie was also average but not terrible in a weak time in Australian cricket.
And Wayne Phillips is hard done by, one test match for an opening batsman is not enough of an opportunity.
Have to agree about John Watkins' ineptitude. Several of his deliveries in that match against Pakistan endangered the square leg umpire.
Apparently he was the classic country bumpkin. On the trip to the West Indies, so the story goes, he asked one of his Australian team mates whereabouts he could go on the aircraft to change into his pyjamas.
Mr. Blonde
21 Feb 2002, 19:17
One player that used to annoy me was Graeme Wood. I'm not sure of his avarages, but he was the classic player from the 80's who only got picked because we had no one else.
The Hippie
21 Feb 2002, 20:47
Originally posted by skilts
Have to agree about John Watkins' ineptitude. Several of his deliveries in that match against Pakistan endangered the square leg umpire.
I remember reading a story by Doug Walters I think, asking him if he was checking to see if the next weeks pitch was going to take any spin. :D
Dippers Donuts
21 Feb 2002, 22:07
Originally posted by Mr. Blonde
One player that used to annoy me was Graeme Wood. I'm not sure of his avarages, but he was the classic player from the 80's who only got picked because we had no one else.
what a shocker Graeme wood was. Averaged about 32 in test cricket but somehow managed to play over 50 tests.
Had a liking for the hook shot IIRC...as for his running between wickets...didn't they call him the kamikaze kid!! His running between the wickets with Rick Darling was almost comical.
Rick Darling...there's another dud.
Originally posted by Dippers Donuts
what a shocker Graeme wood was. Averaged about 32 in test cricket but somehow managed to play over 50 tests.
Had a liking for the hook shot IIRC...as for his running between wickets...didn't they call him the kamikaze kid!! His running between the wickets with Rick Darling was almost comical.
If Graeme Wood was a shocker, what does that make Geoff Marsh!!!
Compare :
Graeme Wood 60 Tests, 113 Inn, 6 NO, 3374 runs @ 31.53, HS 172, 9 centuries, 13 fifties
Geoff Marsh 50 Tests, 93 Inn, 7 NO, 2854 runs @ 33.19, HS 138, 4 centuries, 15 fifties.
So in a nutshell, a bloke with a highest score of 138, and averaging a piss poor 1 century per 18.25 innings (4 centuries in about 7 years) was Australia's VICE BLOODY CAPTAIN for about half of those Tests!!!
Dippers Donuts
22 Feb 2002, 12:20
Originally posted by Darky
If Graeme Wood was a shocker, what does that make Geoff Marsh!!!
Compare :
Graeme Wood 60 Tests, 113 Inn, 6 NO, 3374 runs @ 31.53, HS 172, 9 centuries, 13 fifties
Geoff Marsh 50 Tests, 93 Inn, 7 NO, 2854 runs @ 33.19, HS 138, 4 centuries, 15 fifties.
So in a nutshell, a bloke with a highest score of 138, and averaging a piss poor 1 century per 18.25 innings (4 centuries in about 7 years) was Australia's VICE BLOODY CAPTAIN for about half of those Tests!!!
Gee, I'm surprised Swampy Marsh's average was that low. I always thought it was around the 37/38 mark. He did taper off quite a bit towards the end of his career, obviously more than I realised.
He was a master tactician though...:p
Originally posted by Dippers Donuts
Gee, I'm surprised Swampy Marsh's average was that low. I always thought it was around the 37/38 mark. He did taper off quite a bit towards the end of his career, obviously more than I realised.
He was a master tactician though...:p
Could never stand watching Swampy bat. More boring than Steve Waugh, and you KNOW how I feel about him!
Your query of sorts did lead me to do some investigating and I found that after his 25th Test, he never averaged higher than 36.
After his first century (in his 10th Innings), he reached his career-high average of 42.22
His centuries came in his 10th, 15th, 18th and 59th Innings. Two very long droughts of 41 Innings (2 years, 9 months) and 34 Innings (2 years, 7 months), the second drought ending his career.
So, afgter a promising start of 3 centuries in his first 18 innings, he followed it up with 1 century in 75 innings!
The analysis can be found here :
http://statserver.cricket.org/perl/sdb/sdb_player.pl/NATIONAL/AUS/?playerid=1793&class=testplayer&filter=basic&team=0&opposition=0¬opposition=0&season=0&homeaway=0&continent=0&country=0¬country=0&groundid=0&startdefault=1985-12-13&start=1985-12-13&enddefault=1992-01-29&end=1992-01-29&tourneyid=0&finals=0&daynight=0&toss=0&scheduledovers=0&scheduleddays=0&innings=0&result=0&followon=0&seriesresult=0&captain=0&keeper=0&dnp=0&recent=&viewtype=bat_cumulative&runslow=&runshigh=&batposition=0&dismissal=0&bowposition=0&ballslow=&ballshigh=&bpof=0&overslow=&overshigh=&conclow=&conchigh=&wicketslow=&wicketshigh=&dismissalslow=&dismissalshigh=&caughtlow=&caughthigh=&caughttype=0&stumpedlow=&stumpedhigh=&csearch=&submit=1
I'm going to lie down now (and don't call me Hansie!) :o
Fat Red
22 Feb 2002, 14:05
Swampy was both boring and not especially good, but I think you have to take it in context.
He joined the team when it was at rock bottom and together with Border, Boon, McDermott and S. Waugh was part of a determined group of strong characters who dragged it back to competitiveness. He didn't make a lot of runs but he took on the hard job of opening and worked hard to protect the middle order from the new ball.
Stats don't tell the whole story.
When he was finally dropped AB was so angry he refused to play before backing down. Clearly Swampy had something to offer the team over and above runs.
Fair enough Fat Red, but geez he was crap to watch!
London Dave
22 Feb 2002, 23:12
It was better watching Marsh show a bit of ticker than the lot who came before him get cleaned up by the likes of Graeme Dilley and the rest of those piss porr poms.
Foxtrot
28 Feb 2002, 14:10
Not many representatives here from the subcontinent.
How about Ajit Agurkhar the Indian "all rounder"
Not sure what his averages are but I can only remember him getting carted and scoring a comically long series of ducks vs the aussies.
Dave Gilbert was another Aussie struggler.
Originally posted by Dippers Donuts
Rick Darling...there's another dud.
I played against him in Limited Overs grade C in Adelaide Turf
That is teh second lowest grade but often gets good players who can't be bothered playing two day cricket
I bowled to him and he only hit singles
He didn't get out and they won the match easy
God knows how old he was two years ago
Dippers Donuts
1 Mar 2002, 21:52
Originally posted by Jars458
I played against him in Limited Overs grade C in Adelaide Turf
That is teh second lowest grade but often gets good players who can't be bothered playing two day cricket
I bowled to him and he only hit singles
He didn't get out and they won the match easy
God knows how old he was two years ago
Jars, according to cricinfo Darling was born in 1957, so two years ago he would have been 43. That's not too bad I guess, I have played against older guys.
FYI, his career test stats are 14 tests, 691 runs at an average of 26.81, six half centuries, no centuries, top score of 91.
BTW: anybody remember Rod McCurdy? I used to think when he was bowling that he was always about to blow a gasket!!
Hehe I remember Graeme Wood & Andrew Hilditch opening for Oz in the '85 series.Neither of them could resist the hook-Beefy in the last year that he was anywhere near approaching being a decent bowler (even though he was pretty fat at this point) just loved it, he let em have a few short ones & they couldn't help themselves getting caught at fine leg numerous (or so it seemed:D ) times between them.
It's pretty funny reading about some of these suppoesed shocking Australian cricketers, they'd be legends of the english game!:D
Here's afew real shcokers for you
bowlers(fastish or meant to be):Mark Illot,Martin Bicknell,Steve Watkin,Greg Thomas,Jonathan Agnew,Les Taylor,ArnieSidebottom,Allan Igglesdon
spinners(or perhaps that should read slow bowlers),Ian Salisbury,Richard Illingworth,Shane Udal,Mike Watkinson,Peter Such,Nick Cook
batsmen:Matthew Maynard,Steven James,Mark Benson,Chris Cowdrey,Mark Lathwell
allrounders (in that they couldn't bat or bowl):Chris Lewis,David Capel,Derek Pringle,Mark Ealham
You won't have seen a lot of these as they never lasted long enough to make an Ashes series but it's enough to know that they make Ramprakash, Hick & Tufnell look like world beaters.
These are just bloke from when I satrted following Test cricket in the early/mid 80s so there's a few more out there plus i must have missed a few.
Booze Hound
2 Mar 2002, 00:37
Dipper
You forget Min Patel (awful Kent spinner) and Neal Radford (a medium pacer who really believed he was very fast - the sight of him bowling 'bouncers' at Javed Miandad was hilarious). You were hard on Martin Bicknell though.
A list of New Zealand's worst would be worth seeing. The rouble is, some of them would also be amongst New Zealand's best.
Dippers Donuts
2 Mar 2002, 01:36
What about that eejit Martin McCague?
Wasn't he the greatest fast bowler to come out of WA (via Northen Ireland) since Dennis Lillee?
Remember the kerfuffle about his origins? Allan Border said he was one of us.
Ha Ha! How many tests did he play?
Dippers Donuts
2 Mar 2002, 01:41
Can someone settle this dispute for me.
Azim Hafeez (I think), the paki bowler who was missing a few fingers from his hand. Was it his bowling hand? I'm sure it was, which meant he could have bowled a ripper off cutter but to satisfy a mate could someone please confirm.
Ta.
Dippers Donuts
2 Mar 2002, 01:51
Originally posted by DIPPER
Hehe I remember Graeme Wood & Andrew Hilditch opening for Oz in the '85 series.Neither of them could resist the hook-Beefy in the last year that he was anywhere near approaching being a decent bowler (even though he was pretty fat at this point) just loved it, he let em have a few short ones & they couldn't help themselves getting caught at fine leg numerous (or so it seemed:D ) times between them.
It's pretty funny reading about some of these suppoesed shocking Australian cricketers, they'd be legends of the english game!:D
Here's afew real shcokers for you
bowlers(fastish or meant to be):Mark Illot,Martin Bicknell,Steve Watkin,Greg Thomas,Jonathan Agnew,Les Taylor,ArnieSidebottom,Allan Igglesdon
spinners(or perhaps that should read slow bowlers),Ian Salisbury,Richard Illingworth,Shane Udal,Mike Watkinson,Peter Such,Nick Cook
batsmen:Matthew Maynard,Steven James,Mark Benson,Chris Cowdrey,Mark Lathwell
allrounders (in that they couldn't bat or bowl):Chris Lewis,David Capel,Derek Pringle,Mark Ealham
You won't have seen a lot of these as they never lasted long enough to make an Ashes series but it's enough to know that they make Ramprakash, Hick & Tufnell look like world beaters.
These are just bloke from when I satrted following Test cricket in the early/mid 80s so there's a few more out there plus i must have missed a few.
whilst I'm on a roll...
Dipper (sounds like I'm talking to myself) I am reminded of a banner I saw during a long ago test campaign...
"All out for Allott"
What the hell did that mean!!:D
wagstaff
2 Mar 2002, 12:07
Originally posted by Fat Red
When he was finally dropped AB was so angry he refused to play before backing down. Clearly Swampy had something to offer the team over and above runs.
Maybe so, but that oft-told story of Border's reaction to Marsh's dumping was petulant to say the least - and certainly far worse then any of the so-called controversies that Steve Waugh was involved in this summer.
The news of Marsh's (and Mark Waugh's) dumping was announced before the final day's play of a Test match against India, and Border and others didn't take it too well. Border was so incensed that he didn't take the field for the first 15 minutes of the days play - of a match that was in the balance - to barate the Australian chairman of selectors for his decision.
Then after the match, Border didn't even travel with the team down to Perth for the next Test and there were even some doubts as to whether he was going to play in the match at all.
In my opinion, it was pretty obnoxious behaviour and hardly the perfect build-up for Marsh's replacement, Victorian Wayne Phillips, who was to have a unsuccessful debut. While it's OK for Border to be disappointed that a long-time member of the side had been demoted, as others have pointed out, his overall Test record and especially his later Test record suggested that Marsh's time was well and truly up.
I wonder what Border, now himself a selector, would think of a player who reacted today like he did in 1992?
Kane McGoodwin
2 Mar 2002, 14:05
Dipper - The Paki bowler (not sure whether that was his name) came out around the mid-80's when they toured here & Imran Khan was injured for all the tests & our openers made stacks of runs. I believe Zaheer Abbas was the captain at the time. His missing fingers were not in his bowling hand. But he still had problems handling the bat (he made Glenn McGrath look good) & I also recalling him trying to catch a skied ball at deep fine-leg (I think the result was him bunting the ball over the fence for 6 runs). Hope this helps.
RoosLuver
2 Mar 2002, 17:11
The guy from WA who played the boxing day test a couple of years ago, Alistar something??......gee he was awful that day
Originally posted by RoosLuver
The guy from WA who played the boxing day test a couple of years ago, Alistar something??......gee he was awful that day
Nicholson, he had a bad match but he's a good player, I'm hoping it won't be his last one. He's just recovered from Chronic Fatigue & going along nicely.
Originally posted by BT
Nicholson, he had a bad match but he's a good player, I'm hoping it won't be his last one. He's just recovered from Chronic Fatigue & going along nicely.
A bad match? He had match figures of 4 for 115 ( a three-fer and a one-fer). Pretty solid debut, I reckon.
Wayne Phillips (the batter not the keeper) was lucky to get the one test cap he did a decade ago.
Chris Matthews played one or two tests and did nothing, but that has been discussed on this thread in detail.
Greg Matthews was an interesting case. Picked primarily as a bowler, he had the excruciating bowling average of 48. :o He scored a couple of centuries which maintained his place in the team. And I agree with Darky, I don't know how Geof Marsh survived for so long considering he scored 4 centuries in nearly 100 tests.
Ironically, Geoff was a pretty handy one day player, scoring seven one-day centuries from memory.
Dippers Donuts
2 Mar 2002, 23:26
Originally posted by Dan26
Wayne Phillips (the batter not the keeper) was lucky to get the one test cap he did a decade ago.
Chris Matthews played one or two tests and did nothing, but that has been discussed on this thread in detail.
Greg Matthews was an interesting case. Picked primarily as a bowler, he had the excruciating bowling average of 48. :o He scored a couple of centuries which maintained his place in the team. And I agree with Darky, I don't know how Geof Marsh survived for so long considering he scored 4 centuries in nearly 100 tests.
Ironically, Geoff was a pretty handy one day player, scoring seven one-day centuries from memory.
Dan, Swampy Marsh only only played 50 tests...
Agree with your comments regarding his abilities as a one day player. Quite bizarre really, given his reputation as a dowdy batsman. In one day cricket he was the 'anchor' of the innings.
Dippers Donuts
2 Mar 2002, 23:28
Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
Dipper - The Paki bowler (not sure whether that was his name) came out around the mid-80's when they toured here & Imran Khan was injured for all the tests & our openers made stacks of runs. I believe Zaheer Abbas was the captain at the time. His missing fingers were not in his bowling hand. But he still had problems handling the bat (he made Glenn McGrath look good) & I also recalling him trying to catch a skied ball at deep fine-leg (I think the result was him bunting the ball over the fence for 6 runs). Hope this helps.
Thanks Kane, you have just cost me a slab of Heineken!!!
You goofy basstard!
Originally posted by Dan26
Greg Matthews was an interesting case. Picked primarily as a bowler, he had the excruciating bowling average of 48. :o He scored a couple of centuries which maintained his place in the team.
Greg was originally (and often through his career) picked as an all-rounder. I remember him making 75 on debut v Pakistan.
He ended up playing 31 tests, making 4 centuries and 12 fifties, with a batting average of 41.08. I remember in the mid-late 80s that he was chosen for several games to bat at #5 or #6.
There weren't many others in in the late 80s averaging over 35!
Although he did bowl some rubbish at times. (ie v WI 1989)
The Hippie
2 Mar 2002, 23:41
Originally posted by Dan26
And I agree with Darky, I don't know how Geof Marsh survived for so long considering he scored 4 centuries in nearly 100 tests.
Ironically, Geoff was a pretty handy one day player, scoring seven one-day centuries from memory.
I'd say half of Marsh's Tests would have been against the Windies at their peak, and the Poms when they had the wood on us in the mid/late 80's. Opening against the Windies especially in those days wasn't good for your average. :D
He averaged 28.84 in 10 Tests against the WI, and 38.36 in 17 Tests against the Poms between 85/86 and 91/92. His career was 33.18 in 50 Tests. I reckon he's done OK as an opener playing against those 2 so often.
Originally posted by Dippers Donuts
Dan, Swampy Marsh only only played 50 tests...
Agree with your comments regarding his abilities as a one day player. Quite bizarre really, given his reputation as a dowdy batsman. In one day cricket he was the 'anchor' of the innings.
With a strike rate of about 55, I reckon the longer he stayed, the worse it was for the team, taking up valuable overs and making not that many runs.
Dan, it was 50 Tests, 93 Innings. Still a very dodgy record.
Dippers Donuts
3 Mar 2002, 00:17
Originally posted by Darky
With a strike rate of about 55, I reckon the longer he stayed, the worse it was for the team, taking up valuable overs and making not that many runs.
Dan, it was 50 Tests, 93 Innings. Still a very dodgy record.
Hehe fair enough darky. Gees I'd hate to see his test strike rate!!
Originally posted by Dippers Donuts
whilst I'm on a roll...
Dipper (sounds like I'm talking to myself) I am reminded of a banner I saw during a long ago test campaign...
"All out for Allott"
What the hell did that mean!!:D
Mmmmm not really sure about that one.Paul Allott was a typical English fast medium bowler who perhaps should have made my list but for the fact I don't remember seeing him play too often.
I'd like to think it was a refernece to him running through another sides batting order & getting them all out but I very much doubt it.
As for Martin McCague didn't the Aussie press label him the rat that deserted to the sinking ship?LOL.