View Full Version : Are we going to get any trade's done soon?
Nick Stojkovski
11 Oct 2006, 13:01
Are we going to get any trade's done soon?
I know we have a history of waiting till Friday but i'd like to see the Spider trade over and done with so we can concentrate on others.
I say accept Sydney's pick 33 and then tell Carlton Picks 24 and 33 for Thornton. If there not happy with that, then just leave them and they get nothing.
Lets stop mucking around and just get the deals done!
philhawk
11 Oct 2006, 13:07
Are we going to get any trade's done soon?
I know we have a history of waiting till Friday but i'd like to see the Spider trade over and done with so we can concentrate on others.
I say accept Sydney's pick 33 and then tell Carlton Picks 24 and 33 for Thornton. If there not happy with that, then just leave them and they get nothing.
Lets stop mucking around and just get the deals done!
For some reason, I think Pelchen is going to try and screw around with Carlton and only offer either Pick 24 or Pick 33 for Thornton.
I'd rather he just offered both and get everything out of the way. :thumbsd:
Nick Stojkovski
11 Oct 2006, 13:09
For some reason, I think Pelchen is going to try and screw around with Carlton and only offer either Pick 24 or Pick 33 for Thornton.
I'd rather he just offered both and get everything out of the way. :thumbsd:
i agree, whats holding up the Spider trade then?
just take pick 33 and move on
i agree, whats holding up the Spider trade then?
just take pick 33 and move on
Why?
We'll get better than 33 for spida and the way the blues are going they will lose Thornton for nothing (therefore we keep 24 :thumbsu: ) as I think Pelchin will be prepared for him to go into the PSD.
Herbs hawks
11 Oct 2006, 13:28
With Ross Lyon just being appointed St.Kilda coach and stating they are after a 200cm ruckman as a priorty. I would just hold off with spider for another day or two until Ross is spoken to.
Nick Stojkovski
11 Oct 2006, 13:52
With Ross Lyon just being appointed St.Kilda coach and stating they are after a 200cm ruckman as a priorty. I would just hold off with spider for another day or two until Ross is spoken to.
Fair enough, but let's hurry it up. If St Kilda can beat Sydney's deal then do it.
As for Thornton I would rather get him in the trade's and risk not getting him in the PSD. 2 2nd round picks isnt that bad and we dont need that many young kids anyway.
The TACHawks
11 Oct 2006, 13:55
With Ross Lyon just being appointed St.Kilda coach and stating they are after a 200cm ruckman as a priorty. I would just hold off with spider for another day or two until Ross is spoken to.
The guys at Carrrlton are starting to stress...
Looks like they want to throw cash at Polak via the PSD but that means they can't re-select Thornton or Russel with pick 1.
Port are confident that Russel will slip through to pick 5 as clubs before them have stated they won't touch him. If Carlton are smart they'll take whatever picks they can get from us or Port and still get Polak!
BUT, all Port and Hawks need to do is hold out till Friday lunch and wait for the bargain offer to arrive...I can't see us offering more than pick 33 (If the Everitt deal goes through) IF this is the case!! I wouldn't want to be Pagan at the moment (or ever in fact :D )
Herbs hawks
11 Oct 2006, 13:59
The guys at Carrrlton are starting to stress...
Looks like they want to throw cash at Polak via the PSD but that means they can't re-select Thornton or Russel with pick 1.
Port are confident that Russel will slip through to pick 5 as clubs before them have stated they won't touch him. If Carlton are smart they'll take whatever picks they can get from us or Port and still get Polak!
BUT, all Port and Hawks need to do is hold out till Friday lunch and wait for the bargain offer to arrive...I can't see us offering more than pick 33 (If the Everitt deal goes through) IF this is the case!! I wouldn't want to be Pagan at the moment (or ever in fact :D )
Offer pick 24 for thornton and that's it.
I am warming up to the PSD one year 500K contract. the 250k year 2 & 3. I think we would get him :D
Nick Stojkovski
11 Oct 2006, 14:01
The guys at Carrrlton are starting to stress...
Looks like they want to throw cash at Polak via the PSD but that means they can't re-select Thornton or Russel with pick 1.
Port are confident that Russel will slip through to pick 5 as clubs before them have stated they won't touch him. If Carlton are smart they'll take whatever picks they can get from us or Port and still get Polak!
BUT, all Port and Hawks need to do is hold out till Friday lunch and wait for the bargain offer to arrive...I can't see us offering more than pick 33 (If the Everitt deal goes through) IF this is the case!! I wouldn't want to be Pagan at the moment (or ever in fact :D )
If thats the case, Carlton better sit down with Hawthorn soon before Polak goes somewhere else. If they trade with us for Thornton, then they can use our picks to go after Polak. Looks ok for Calton considering they could end up with nothing.
Robber Baron
11 Oct 2006, 14:07
With Ross Lyon just being appointed St.Kilda coach and stating they are after a 200cm ruckman as a priorty. I would just hold off with spider for another day or two until Ross is spoken to.
Its all comming together now. St Kilda pays us a better draft selection that Sydney would have and that means that Sydney have to pay even better draft so maybe we end up with a bidding war. This is gunna be great for us. Pelchn and Clarkson are really the best thing that came to us, we are definetey gunna be unbeatable in the next few years. They just can do nothiing wrong. We will defenetly pick up Thornton who is gunna be a gun player and will get him for real cheap. Pelchin is a gun recruter and negotiater.
Funkalicous
11 Oct 2006, 15:32
For some reason, I think Pelchen is going to try and screw around with Carlton and only offer either Pick 24 or Pick 33 for Thornton.
I'd rather he just offered both and get everything out of the way. :thumbsd:
It's been a real rollercoaster ride over the last few days. I was hopeful that we'd get a top 10 pick given the time we put into Thornton (not to mention his importance). Unfortunately for us, both your club and Thornton have tried desperately to screw Carlton over. Personally I don't think that's the best way to get yourself to your club of choice, ie Nick Stevens. Having said that, I think Carlton should move into damage control. We should take pick 24 and 33, and move on.
The reason for my surrender is that now Jordan Russell is using the PSD threat with the knowledge that we can't redraft both he and Thornton. But unlike Thornton, Russell is in no position to demand a large salary. Considering he wants to go to Port Adelaide, it's unlikely they would propose a figure that we couldn't match.... comfortably. Therefore, so long as we've only got one fish to fry, Port Adelaide can't screw us.
If we continue to do nothing however, it could get very ugly...... and I'm talking about the supporters.
Funkalicous
11 Oct 2006, 15:34
If thats the case, Carlton better sit down with Hawthorn soon before Polak goes somewhere else. If they trade with us for Thornton, then they can use our picks to go after Polak. Looks ok for Calton considering they could end up with nothing.
Yeah that too.
Carlton need to deal with Thornton >>>> then Russell >>>>> then Polak.
And we better get cracking soon....
kolchak
11 Oct 2006, 15:36
Offer pick 24 for thornton and that's it.
I am warming up to the PSD one year 500K contract. the 250k year 2 & 3. I think we would get him :D
Fully agree with that!!! We can chuck in a player as well, Brennan or Boyle, as we are gaining a KP backman. The spida deal has little to do with it because we are trying to get the best deal for us not Carlton, only that if we can't do the deal (i think we can) we will be lacking in good draft picks, which may possibly affect if we trade for Thornton at all, but this won't happen.
Nick Stojkovski
11 Oct 2006, 15:53
It's been a real rollercoaster ride over the last few days. I was hopeful that we'd get a top 10 pick given the time we put into Thornton (not to mention his importance). Unfortunately for us, both your club and Thornton have tried desperately to screw Carlton over. Personally I don't think that's the best way to get yourself to your club of choice, ie Nick Stevens. Having said that, I think Carlton should move into damage control. We should take pick 24 and 33, and move on.
The reason for my surrender is that now Jordan Russell is using the PSD threat with the knowledge that we can't redraft both he and Thornton. But unlike Thornton, Russell is in no position to demand a large salary. Considering he wants to go to Port Adelaide, it's unlikely they would propose a figure that we couldn't match.... comfortably. Therefore, so long as we've only got one fish to fry, Port Adelaide can't screw us.
If we continue to do nothing however, it could get very ugly...... and I'm talking about the supporters.
Im glad some Carlton people have started talking some sense. Im not out to rip Carlton off, Thornton wants Hawthorn, Hawthorn wants Thornton and Hawthorn are willing to compensate Carlton.
It Sounds so easy. You would think Carlton would have to listen sooner or later. I hope for their sake it's sooner rather than later.
FriarTuck
11 Oct 2006, 16:00
Carton is really under the pump here.
Any second round for Spyda is good.
Thornton for a second rounder and Brennan/Boyle would be fantastic. Cant see it happening. Thornton appears handy but lets not go silly on him. Carton was only going to pay him marginally more than an also ran until we made an offer.
Sydney have offered their second rounder plus more I think...
Fabulous
11 Oct 2006, 16:12
Sydney have offered their second rounder plus more I think...
You'll find that Ricky Nixon has got involved and come up with a compromise deal involving a number of swaps of picks because the negotiations between Hawks and Swans broke down.
Swans are in a meeting this afternoon to decide whether to go with it.
Thornton's situation could prove interesting with the AFL possibibly getting involved if it looks like Thornton was going to the PSD.
philhawk
11 Oct 2006, 16:47
You'll find that Ricky Nixon has got involved and come up with a compromise deal involving a number of swaps of picks because the negotiations between Hawks and Swans broke down.
Swans are in a meeting this afternoon to decide whether to go with it.
Thornton's situation could prove interesting with the AFL possibibly getting involved if it looks like Thornton was going to the PSD.
Huh?! :confused:
Davo-27
11 Oct 2006, 16:52
Huh?! :confused:
i heard this elsewhere as well.............i think they have influence over carlton because of carltons financial situation...............
Fabulous
11 Oct 2006, 17:11
Huh?! :confused:
Tony Nolan has a close eye on what is going on. Not happy with Carlton, Hawthorn and Essendon at the moment.
chelsworthgale
11 Oct 2006, 17:14
Tony Nolan has a close eye on what is going on. Not happy with Carlton, Hawthorn and Essendon at the moment.
oh well how about hawthorn come to the table with a proper deal... the AFL should have no hands in this at all, it is a joke it they do... and boy if they do bring on the Decemeber board elections!
Boyler_Room
11 Oct 2006, 17:23
If they get involved it will be an absolute farce. I understand they are giving Carlton money but they should not get involved in the trades done by them. This will show just how impartial the guys that run this game are, if the trade does or doesn't go through and the AFL is involved it will taint the whole thing and they will lose any respect they have left with Victorian clubs.
philhawk
11 Oct 2006, 17:30
Tony Nolan has a close eye on what is going on. Not happy with Carlton, Hawthorn and Essendon at the moment.
If true, that's absolutely farcical. :thumbsd:
Fabulous
11 Oct 2006, 17:34
If true, that's absolutely farcical. :thumbsd:
The use of an arbitrator is a new part of the AFL trade week this year.
noosa hawk mad
11 Oct 2006, 17:59
Lets Hope the Blues come to the party on pick 24:) If not and he does go to PS draft what are our chances of getting him:thumbsu:
chelsworthgale
11 Oct 2006, 18:14
Lets Hope the Blues come to the party on pick 24:) If not and he does go to PS draft what are our chances of getting him:thumbsu:
fat chance... essendon has eyes on him, they are the silent monster in all this. Kangaroos also have some good eyes on thornton as well
philhawk
11 Oct 2006, 18:26
fat chance... essendon has eyes on him, they are the silent monster in all this. Kangaroos also have some good eyes on thornton as well
Essendon - Fair chance
Kangaroos - Dont they have too many defenders?
chelsworthgale
11 Oct 2006, 18:36
Essendon - Fair chance
Kangaroos - Dont they have too many defenders?
I can only pin watt and brown down as 190ish + defenders with around 100 games experience... at either haw ess or kang he will be a very good player
either way looking at where they finished the defenders they do have dont seem to be doing a sensational job do they? (yeh yeh i know carltons isnt that crash hot either hence why we are trying to retain him!)
SavHawk
11 Oct 2006, 19:00
oh well how about hawthorn come to the table with a proper deal... the AFL should have no hands in this at all, it is a joke it they do... and boy if they do bring on the Decemeber board elections!
hawthorn have come to the table, but carlton do not want to listen...
TheGeneral
11 Oct 2006, 19:32
hawthorn have come to the table, but carlton do not want to listen...
Smart.
We're not going to be easy by giving him up cheaply when we have the first PSD pick to pressure the Hawks into giving us the best possible traded for Carlton. And it's only fair we get two picks between 20 and 30 for a tall defender you wanted badly enough to target for $1 million for three years.
Pick 24 and pick 27 would be a fair trade if the Saints get him.
philhawk
11 Oct 2006, 19:48
Smart.
We're not going to be easy by giving him up cheaply when we have the first PSD pick to pressure the Hawks into giving us the best possible traded for Carlton. And it's only fair we get two picks between 20 and 30 for a tall defender you wanted badly enough to target for $1 million for three years.
Pick 24 and pick 27 would be a fair trade if the Saints get him.
Tell me Cypher, where are you taking these figures from? If 'money value' is an indicator of what a player is worth (draft wise), why isn't Spida worth a Top 10 pick when, according to media speculation, he's set to recieve $1 mill over 2 years?
chelsworthgale
11 Oct 2006, 20:16
Tell me Cypher, where are you taking these figures from? If 'money value' is an indicator of what a player is worth (draft wise), why isn't Spida worth a Top 10 pick when, according to media speculation, he's set to recieve $1 mill over 2 years?
hold on what cypher is getting at is the fact that Hawthorn ARE desperate for Thornton and this can be measured by:
a) the fact that they are throwing large sums of money at him, larger than what Carlton are throwing.
b) are willing to front end a contract with him as to try and "outbid" carlton on his services.
In other words carlton hold the power in this battle.
kolchak
11 Oct 2006, 20:20
Carton is really under the pump here.
Any second round for Spyda is good.
Thornton for a second rounder and Brennan/Boyle would be fantastic. Cant see it happening. Thornton appears handy but lets not go silly on him. Carton was only going to pay him marginally more than an also ran until we made an offer.
It would be a good deal, but its all we can afford IMO. We would get more value with 2 2nd round picks.
philhawk
11 Oct 2006, 20:27
a) the fact that they are throwing large sums of money at him, larger than what Carlton are throwing.
Really?
Thornton wants trade solely for 'fresh start'. (http://www.theage.com.au/news/Sport/Carltons-Thornton-wants-to-be-a-Hawk/2006/10/06/1159641505879.html)
"Carlton offered a substantial contract, no different to what Hawthorn offered, but Bret wants to make a fresh start," McConville told the AFL website."
So, how are we offering more than Carlton, again?
b) are willing to front end a contract with him as to try and "outbid" carlton on his services.
Actually, that's again conjecture on the part of Thorntons management.
Thornton willing to chance PSD (http://www.theage.com.au/realfooty/news/afl/thornton-says-he-wants-to-be-a-hawk/2006/10/06/1159641532028.html)
No mention of 'Front-ended' contracts is made from any party - Thornton, his manager, nor Hawthorn.
According to McConville, though, Thornton wants to play for Hawthorn only and is prepared to go into the pre-season draft if necessary.
In other words carlton hold the power in this battle.
To be fair, that's absolute rubbish. It's reached the stage now where
Carlton wont even negotiate with Hawthorn about Thornton
Thornton has clearly outlined that his future lies elsewhere outside of Carlton
And perhaps most important, Thornton has defined his terms of Trade.
See here (http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2006/10/09/1160246070787.html)
The Dons are also interested in Thornton and have suggested using their second-round pick, No. 20, to thwart the Hawks if Carlton relents. But for this to work, Thornton would have to agree, which his manager, Anthony McConville, has said will not happen.
So by the looks of things, Thornton very much holds all the cards. The fact that he wants to come to Hawthorn ...
Who holds the cards again?
Hawk0373
11 Oct 2006, 20:31
hold on what cypher is getting at is the fact that Hawthorn ARE desperate for Thornton and this can be measured by:
a) the fact that they are throwing large sums of money at him, larger than what Carlton are throwing.
b) are willing to front end a contract with him as to try and "outbid" carlton on his services.
In other words carlton hold the power in this battle.
Funny thing is it's not a massive amount for a kpp entering his 6th season with plenty of upside in a rebuilding team, its just that carlton fluffed it originally by offering him a 2nd year player's wage.
The front end contract speculation is just that, and would only be entertained if Carlton were adamant they could keep a player who doesn't want to play for them -again, not smart.
The only power Carlton hold will be the decision to trade or end up with nothing (assuming Thornton still doesn't want to play for them by Friday) - hardly a favourable position to be in.
TheGeneral
11 Oct 2006, 20:57
Tell me Cypher, where are you taking these figures from? If 'money value' is an indicator of what a player is worth (draft wise), why isn't Spida worth a Top 10 pick when, according to media speculation, he's set to recieve $1 mill over 2 years?
Sneaky leakers. :p :D
Approximately $1 million.
And I don't know if the price has changed in the past two days since I don't know who's staying or leaving anymore :mad:
Blues must retain defender: Fevola (http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2006/09/30/1159337390978.html)
Fevola has put the onus of retaining the defender squarely on the Blues' administration, rather than on his teammate, who has received an offer for a three-year contract worth around $300,000 a season from Hawthorn.
Thornton may leave Blues for Hawthornl (http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2006/09/27/1159337221831.html)
After several months of fruitless negotiating over a new contract, Thornton was left with a choice between a two-year Carlton offer comprising a guaranteed sum of $150,000 a season, and an earning capacity of up to $240,000 next year and $260,000 in 2008, or a three-year deal from the Hawks worth almost $300,000 a season.
Smart.
We're not going to be easy by giving him up cheaply when we have the first PSD pick to pressure the Hawks into giving us the best possible traded for Carlton. And it's only fair we get two picks between 20 and 30 for a tall defender you wanted badly enough to target for $1 million for three years.
Pick 24 and pick 27 would be a fair trade if the Saints get him.
I know there is recognition for top post on BF but what about the reverse?
carlton actually hold no cards
You don't seem to understand cypher, thornton has walked out on the club - he says he will go PSD rather than stay at carlton.
And do you really think you want to waste a PSD pick on someone that does not want to stay?
Oh, and when thornton puts a price of $500K on his head (which he can do) are you going to pick him up then?
No, & you know who will - the hawks - & we will then negotiate a 3 yr contract with him (which we are entitled to do)
And you know what carlton will get -
NOTHING
carlton need to wake up to the fact they need to start negotiating or they will get NOTHING.
are players able to go for a one year deal in the psd if they want? because thornton can say he want 500k for a year, and tells other clubs he will only go to hawks so do not bother picking him up. or he will leave in a year.
also dont essendon and north have less room to move under their cap?
are players able to go for a one year deal in the psd if they want? because thornton can say he want 500k for a year, and tells other clubs he will only go to hawks so do not bother picking him up. or he will leave in a year.
also dont essendon and north have less room to move under their cap?
He can nominate a contract for a year. But he can't really say he will leave after a year (not publically anyway).
No one will pick him up though for $500K for 1 year.
mulhollanddrive
12 Oct 2006, 01:47
I would rather get pick 33 for Spider than anything else. That is our first priority, because that's the only scenario in which we could lose if he goes for nothing.
From then on we have options such as Thornton or keeping picks 24/33 which would be good, potentially not as good as Thornton, but we've drafted well it seems and would back ourselves to pick up decent players.
Nick Stojkovski
12 Oct 2006, 08:28
Smart.
We're not going to be easy by giving him up cheaply when we have the first PSD pick to pressure the Hawks into giving us the best possible traded for Carlton. And it's only fair we get two picks between 20 and 30 for a tall defender you wanted badly enough to target for $1 million for three years.
Pick 24 and pick 27 would be a fair trade if the Saints get him.
If Hawks trade with Swans, we'll still give pick 24 and pick33 to Carlton for Thornton.
If Carlton ever want to start negotiating with us.