The Biggest "Reach" In The Draft?

[Roughie]

Which player got selected higher then his actual worth?

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Depends what you are basing it on. If based on most phantom drafts Boak would be one and Grigg would be another. Hampson too but then Burgan had him at 10 and definite top 20.

[Hawthorn '06]

Boak and Everitt

[mad-saint-guy]

Brad Howard at 27 easily.

[macca69]

Boak and Everitt

Everitt possibly, but not Boak.

[tiger of old]

Would have to be out of Frawley & Everrit

[Weaver]

Brad Howard at 27 easily.

Would surely have been available much later. So has to be Howard.

[macca69]

Would surely have been available much later. So has to be Howard.

But would he have lasted to #59. St Kilda abviously thought he wouldn't. This bloke was brilliant at the screening, and has big upside.

[vinnie_vegas69]

Grigg would be another.
I had Grigg at #19 in my rankings, so it didn't surprise me at all.

189cm wingman/ball magnet with a 2.9-something 20m time - Good get.

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

I had Grigg at #19 in my rankings, so it didn't surprise me at all.

189cm wingman/ball magnet with a 2.9-something 20m time - Good get.
:D :D :D :)

[Embers]

James Thompson - If we wanted a toilet cleaner we could of just put a ad in the paper

[Roughie]

Youd have to think Davey was a bit of a reach aswell, he surely would of been there for another round or 2?

[vinnie_vegas69]

Youd have to think Davey was a bit of a reach aswell, he surely would of been there for another round or 2?
Nah - Teams would have started looking at him in the 50s.

[wizard_9]

Alwyn Davey, could have got him later. Went way to early but will be a very handy player for the Dons.

[bringbackschwarter5]

Frawley and Everitt

[mckinale]

Im a mate of Dawesey and called him like 20 mins after he got drafted
even hes surprised he got picked up so early
He knew the pies were keen because theyd been calling him all year
but the only other club to show interest was west coast and they stopped calling him when he did his knee
I had to shut down his myspace coz the club won't allow him to have one

[Weaver]

But would he have lasted to #59. St Kilda abviously thought he wouldn't. This bloke was brilliant at the screening, and has big upside.

I think St Kilda almost recruited from the bottom -> up. They knew their budget would see them pass on the last 3. They knew they were taking Ferguson. They probably had a list for a tall defender (Allan, Collier, Grose etc) and so were not too concerned about going early for that pick. Basically meant that if they were keen on Howard it was the only pick they had available to use on him.

Definately a reach - but not one the Saints could have avoided.

[vinnie_vegas69]

Yo`DooR;6285491']:D :D :D :)
Don't get too excited - His kicking makes Andrew Walker's look like Nathan Buckley's at times...

[The Royal Sampler]

I think Dawes may go down as the biggest reach of the draft. He was touted to go top 30 before injuring his knee, so we took him top 30 anyway. I hope he turns out to be a gun, rather than another Lee Walker.

[FIGJAM]

Im a mate of Dawesey and called him like 20 mins after he got drafted
even hes surprised he got picked up so early
He knew the pies were keen because theyd been calling him all year
but the only other club to show interest was west coast and they stopped calling him when he did his knee
I had to shut down his myspace coz the club won't allow him to have one
He's a bit of a stretch, but presumably we have given him the full medical.

Word is that the doctor who did the knee operation is Julian Feller who's a Collingwood man and did Didak's reco, so we must be fully confident that it will be 100% OK in time. You can correct me if that's incorrect.

Other whispers suggest WCE were still very interested in him and would have taken him later on in the draft. We wanted him more and a spend of a second round pick for a not in 2007 is reflective of this. We may have even rated him higher than the first two kids we took!

PS: Good work taking down the myspace page and keep him off the smokes and drugs! ;) :D

[The Royal Sampler]

No doubt we gave him the full medical, and he's already 3 months in to his rehab, but as a physiotherapist I can say with confidence that these things are always an unknown quantity until he gets back to at least full training.

That's not doubting Feller either, just the reality of knee reco's in elite athletes.

[mckinale]

He's a bit of a stretch, but presumably we have given him the full medical.

Word is that the doctor who did the knee operation is Julian Feller who's a Collingwood man and did Didak's reco, so we must be fully confident that it will be 100% OK in time. You can correct me if that's incorrect.

Other whispers suggest WCE were still very interested in him and would have taken him later on in the draft. We wanted him more and a spend of a second round pick for a not in 2007 is reflective of this. We may have even rated him higher than the first two kids we took!

PS: Good work taking down the myspace page and keep him off the smokes and drugs! ;) :D
lol yeh his myspace was a pisser
my body is my temple n ******** like that
and he said he was a crystal meth addict n stuff

[HBF]

I had Grigg at #19 in my rankings, so it didn't surprise me at all.

189cm wingman/ball magnet with a 2.9-something 20m time - Good get.

I haven't seen alot of Grigg to be honest. Only saw him at the Champs, but a couple of people have called him very outside and unaccountable. How would you respond to this VV?

[macca69]

I haven't seen alot of Grigg to be honest. Only saw him at the Champs, but a couple of people have called him very outside and unaccountable. How would you respond to this VV?

Those two negatives aren't to significant IMO. Many top junior players are unacountable because they have copped heavy tags since a young age, they haven't needed to be acountable, most players amend this flaw very early on in their AFL careers. Being outside isn't a huge negative these days, clubs need both inside and outside mids, it's nice to have guys that can play both inside and outside, but you shouldn't knock an outside player because he is outside. In fact Gibbs has these 2 characteristics you mentioned, but there not huge problems if your competant in other areas. My biggest concern of Grigg is his disposal, can be rather average at times.

[HBF]

Those two negatives aren't to significant IMO. Many top junior players are unacountable because they have copped heavy tags since a young age, they haven't needed to be acountable, most players amend this flaw very early on in their AFL careers. Being outside isn't a huge negative these days, clubs need both inside and outside mids, it's nice to have guys that can play both inside and outside, but you shouldn't knock an outside player because he is outside. In fact Gibbs has these 2 characteristics you mentioned, but there not huge problems if your competant in other areas. My biggest concern of Grigg is his disposal, can be rather average at times.

I'm going to have another look at my DVD's this week on Grigg, as he was a player I didn't pay alot of attention to as i really didn't think he'd be on our radar.

I'll pay particular close attention to see if there is a flaw in his technique, or he just needs to practice a lot more on his skills.

Thanks for the reply Macca, very much appreciate it! :thumbsu:

[Weaver]

I haven't seen alot of Grigg to be honest. Only saw him at the Champs, but a couple of people have called him very outside and unaccountable. How would you respond to this VV?

I'd say Grigg gets 7/10 in every department which is both his strength and weakness. Pace 7/10, Kicking 7/10, Hardness 7/10 etc.

Sometimes a guy needs that one stand-out quality and Grigg doesn't really have one. But then he doesn't have a big flaw like some do either.

Reminds me a lot of Wayne Campbell (although Campbell would get 10/10 for smarts and reading the game).

[macca69]

I'd say Grigg gets 7/10 in every department which is both his strength and weakness. Pace 7/10, Kicking 7/10, Hardness 7/10 etc.

Sometimes a guy needs that one stand-out quality and Grigg doesn't really have one. But then he doesn't have a big flaw like some do either.

Reminds me a lot of Wayne Campbell (although Campbell would get 10/10 for smarts and reading the game).

Not sure I'd rate his kicking a 7/10, he has improved in that area since last year, but he still sometimes shanks kicks with minimal pressure. He's also very tall and quick for a midfielder, so that would make him stand out a bit more. He also gets a lot of the pill, and while that may not be a stand-out quality like you're talking about, it still forces recruiters to have a look at you.

[Artful_Dodger]

David Armitage at 9 was a reach if he wasnt taken there he would of slipped all the way down to Essendon at 18. He is very slow and will be exposed at AFL level.

Shaun Grigg at 19, selfish soft outside receiver who is a poor kick is just what Carlton needs.

Chris Dawes at 28 what were Collingwood smoking! they could of got him at 63. Taking a guy with a knee injury that couldnt turn and move the best before the injury and is out for 12 months is very very risky and stupid. Collingwood needed to take a running midfield option such as a Petterd, Krakouer, Hawksley, Schmidt or Houlihan at 28.

[mckinale]

David Armitage at 9 was a reach if he wasnt taken there he would of slipped all the way down to Essendon at 18. He is very slow and will be exposed at AFL level.

Shaun Grigg at 19, selfish soft outside receiver who is a poor kick is just what Carlton needs.

Chris Dawes at 28 what were Collingwood smoking! they could of got him at 63. Taking a guy with a knee injury that couldnt turn and move the best before the injury and is out for 12 months is very very risky and stupid. Collingwood needed to take a running midfield option such as a Petterd, Krakouer, Hawksley, Schmidt or Houlihan at 28.
I agree that colloingwood took him unecessarily high but he is actually an elite athlete
he has serious pace and agility for a bloke his size

[footyman]

I agree that colloingwood took him unecessarily high but he is actually an elite athlete
he has serious pace and agility for a bloke his size
I'd have thought a players agility deteriorates once they have a knee reconstruction?

[S.Patrol.G]

Youd have to think Davey was a bit of a reach aswell, he surely would of been there for another round or 2?

I reckon you may have missed him if he had been passed up then. Port were keen on him- so I've heard.

[Artful_Dodger]

I agree that colloingwood took him unecessarily high but he is actually an elite athlete
he has serious pace and agility for a bloke his size

I agree his straight line pace is good but get him off the train tracks and he struggles and if the ball goes over his head in a contest he has a slow turning circle which can only be made worse with knee instability as a result of the injury.

[Weaver]

I agree his straight line pace is good but get him off the train tracks and he struggles and if the ball goes over his head in a contest he has a slow turning circle which can only be made worse with knee instability as a result of the injury.

Also a very very solid bloke. Still listed as being quite heavy but actually had to lose weight at one stage. Early in the season he would have been 105kg+ and played more like a battering ram than an elite junior. Was suprised how well he played by the Championships after deciding to get serious. I think I am a little biased by that early season showing - and don't rate him nearly as highly as others - even pre-injury.

[Brian has spoken]

David Armitage at 9 was a reach if he wasnt taken there he would of slipped all the way down to Essendon at 18. He is very slow and will be exposed at AFL level.

Shaun Grigg at 19, selfish soft outside receiver who is a poor kick is just what Carlton needs.

Chris Dawes at 28 what were Collingwood smoking! they could of got him at 63. Taking a guy with a knee injury that couldnt turn and move the best before the injury and is out for 12 months is very very risky and stupid. Collingwood needed to take a running midfield option such as a Petterd, Krakouer, Hawksley, Schmidt or Houlihan at 28.

You tosser. Blokes like you are the reason this site gets canned all the time. You are uninformed. Dont make ridiculous statements.

DAVID ARMITAGE

http://www.thedrafter.net/images/df_spacer.gif31.10.2006

Position : Midfielder/Defender
D.O.B.: 16/6/88
Club : Morningside Queensland
Height: 183cm
Weight: 79kg
The long list of impressive Queensland prospects at this year's draft continues to grow with the emergence of midfielder/defender David Armitage. While maintaining consistently impressive performances for his state, Armitage was never expected to challenge the blue-bloods from the southern states for a place in the first round. However, with an impressive performance in the National Championships, capped off with an All-Australian selection on the half back flank, his prospects quickly soared.
A feature of David's play is his strong attack on the ball and quick hands in traffic. Profiled as a neat left-footer, he averaged 20 possessions and provided Queensland with consistent drive throughout the under 18 championships. If selectors were still searching for a missing ingredient to separate the young champ from the rest they certainly would have found it at this year's Draft Camp where he smashed his competition in the agility test. Armitage stopped the clock at 7.88 seconds and if that wasn't enough, he went on to finish in the top ten for both the shuttle run (beep test) and the three-kilometre time-trial. In a competition where athletic ability is becoming a key differentiator in the top end group of talented players, AFL recruiters are certain to be monitoring young Armitage closely.

[mckinale]

I agree his straight line pace is good but get him off the train tracks and he struggles and if the ball goes over his head in a contest he has a slow turning circle which can only be made worse with knee instability as a result of the injury.
how closely have u seen toppy play?
coz i played with him a few times this year n i play in the middle
he can out-run me. there was a contest i can rememeber and the ball was kicked out from full back. And i was waitin for the crumbs on the left side
chris had the ball knocked loose to the right
i sprinted across to get it and he'd already recovered and taken off with the ball
believe me he doesnt have a big circle

[LukeHodge15]

James Thompson - If we wanted a toilet cleaner we could of just put a ad in the paper

Care to enlighten me with that comment Embers :confused:

[lee31]

ah certainly Peter Faulks, how did he even manage to get drafted. yeah and some may retort he recorded the best standing jump overall and a respectful 20 m sprint time but i hope thats not all sydney bases their selection on (statistics) this guys skills are quite poor :S oh well time will soon tell his capability

[juddy_Like]

Im a mate of Dawesey and called him like 20 mins after he got drafted
even hes surprised he got picked up so early
He knew the pies were keen because theyd been calling him all year
but the only other club to show interest was west coast and they stopped calling him when he did his knee
I had to shut down his myspace coz the club won't allow him to have one

Would you like to do the Honours for Shutting down Gibbs, Sellars, Gumby, hansen, Mossy and even Paul Bowers from last years draft. And theres are the only ones iv seen.

Myspace is the supposely 'cool' thing of this decade and it wont be long before a new one pops up.

[juddy_Like]

Care to enlighten me with that comment Embers :confused:

Embers and Thompson have a Past History or something. Well so it seems. (Read page 4 or so) on the Eagles Draft Board. According to Embers, this Thomson kid is a very pleasant man. :rolleyes:

[juddy_Like]

David Armitage at 9 was a reach if he wasnt taken there he would of slipped all the way down to Essendon at 18. He is very slow and will be exposed at AFL level.

MAte you wouldnt be Invited to the Draft itself, if you were gonna slip to 18. Ok.

Shaun Grigg at 19, selfish soft outside receiver who is a poor kick is just what Carlton needs.

Slow in What ways?? Like slow in capacity to read and react to the game or slow as in pace slow. I tend to believe hes rather quick.

Chris Dawes at 28 what were Collingwood smoking! they could of got him at 63. Taking a guy with a knee injury that couldnt turn and move the best before the injury and is out for 12 months is very very risky and stupid. Collingwood needed to take a running midfield option such as a Petterd, Krakouer, Hawksley, Schmidt or Houlihan at 28.

Havnt seen much of Dawes, so wont comment. But Wooble fans dont seem too disapointed.

[PLSC]

probably highest reach was everitt at 11 but dogs didnt have another pick until 40 odd so had to take the punt, will suit them very well though

but the joke of the day is rodan getting redrafted, nice guy works hard and all that but just isnt a good footballer

no smarts whatsoever and his body just doesnt suit his game

good luck to him anyway

[Rooboy 96]

but the joke of the day is rodan getting redrafted, nice guy works hard and all that but just isnt a good footballer

no smarts whatsoever and his body just doesnt suit his game

good luck to him anyway

none of this would have changed since Richmond drafted him a few years back I take it??? :D

[macca69]

Slow in What ways?? Like slow in capacity to read and react to the game or slow as in pace slow. I tend to believe hes rather quick.


Grigg is quick and Artful Dodger hasn't said anything to suggest otherwise :confused:

[Artful_Dodger]

You tosser. Blokes like you are the reason this site gets canned all the time. You are uninformed. Dont make ridiculous statements.

DAVID ARMITAGE

http://www.thedrafter.net/images/df_spacer.gif31.10.2006

Position : Midfielder/Defender
D.O.B.: 16/6/88
Club : Morningside Queensland
Height: 183cm
Weight: 79kg
The long list of impressive Queensland prospects at this year's draft continues to grow with the emergence of midfielder/defender David Armitage. While maintaining consistently impressive performances for his state, Armitage was never expected to challenge the blue-bloods from the southern states for a place in the first round. However, with an impressive performance in the National Championships, capped off with an All-Australian selection on the half back flank, his prospects quickly soared.
A feature of David's play is his strong attack on the ball and quick hands in traffic. Profiled as a neat left-footer, he averaged 20 possessions and provided Queensland with consistent drive throughout the under 18 championships. If selectors were still searching for a missing ingredient to separate the young champ from the rest they certainly would have found it at this year's Draft Camp where he smashed his competition in the agility test. Armitage stopped the clock at 7.88 seconds and if that wasn't enough, he went on to finish in the top ten for both the shuttle run (beep test) and the three-kilometre time-trial. In a competition where athletic ability is becoming a key differentiator in the top end group of talented players, AFL recruiters are certain to be monitoring young Armitage closely.

Now for another ridiculous statement!
Interesting the profile above never mentions his speed! he has a 2 second difference from 5m to 20m he is slow, his skills are also dodgy. Even though he is tough and can win a bit of the ball will not have the leg speed or foot skills to be damaging at AFL level. Clubs like Richmond, Melbourne, Bulldogs, Sydney, West Coast, Adelaide would of over looked him due to these reasons. Mate if you cant handle an opinon of supposedly a 'uninformed tosser' than what does that make you.

[macca69]

West Coast would have looked long and hard at Armitage if he was available, and I think we would have taken him. No doubt we were keen on him.

[Bollox]

Armitage was always gonna go in the top 10-12...he would have stood out like dogs balls if not taken before 10-12.

If u look hard enough u can always find something to criticise in a youngster....plenty of athletes going around with no footy smarts...this guy will be the genuine article. Got ticker too. You dont need to be Aaron Davey to get a kick.

[LukeHodge15]

Now for another ridiculous statement!
Interesting the profile above never mentions his speed! he has a 2 second difference from 5m to 20m he is slow, his skills are also dodgy. Even though he is tough and can win a bit of the ball will not have the leg speed or foot skills to be damaging at AFL level. Clubs like Richmond, Melbourne, Bulldogs, Sydney, West Coast, Adelaide would of over looked him due to these reasons. Mate if you cant handle an opinon of supposedly a 'uninformed tosser' than what does that make you.

I agree with u. Never joined the Armitage Bandwagon. Just dont see what he brings to the table that is so special for a supposed top 20 Pick let alone a Top 10.

[HBF]

I agree with u. Never joined the Armitage Bandwagon. Just dont see what he brings to the table that is so special for a supposed top 20 Pick let alone a Top 10.

You have been saying that for some time now LH15.
I really think him going to St.Kilda at #9 shows how highly he is regarded.

[LukeHodge15]

You have been saying that for some time now LH15.
I really think him going to St.Kilda at #9 shows how highly he is regarded.

Mate, the joys of having an opinion i suppose. :p

[navier-stokes equation]

LH,

Did you see any of his games after the championships?

[Brian has spoken]

Mate, the joys of having an opinion i suppose. :p

You obviously never heard Adrian Dodoro on SEN. He rated Armitage up there with Gibbs in the draft, but they did the smart thing in drafting tall. Look at the 2000 draft when Didak was coming off All Oz captaincy, the Saints went tall with picks 1 and 2 and left Dids at 3.
JB is one of the best recruiters of all time, what are your credentials???

[vinnie_vegas69]

You obviously never heard Adrian Dodoro on SEN. He rated Armitage up there with Gibbs in the draft, but they did the smart thing in drafting tall. Look at the 2000 draft when Didak was coming off All Oz captaincy, the Saints went tall with picks 1 and 2 and left Dids at 3.
JB is one of the best recruiters of all time, what are your credentials???
It's pretty clear that was a mistake on their part...

[LukeHodge15]

You obviously never heard Adrian Dodoro on SEN. He rated Armitage up there with Gibbs in the draft, but they did the smart thing in drafting tall. Look at the 2000 draft when Didak was coming off All Oz captaincy, the Saints went tall with picks 1 and 2 and left Dids at 3.
JB is one of the best recruiters of all time, what are your credentials???

Settle, its funny how people can't have opinions on certain players.

Would it be better if we all agreed that because a player went in the top 10, then that makes him an automatic star.

Never claimed to have credentials, just claimed to have an opinion after watching him play multiple times.

See this is what people don't understand, u think that every AFL club had the same 50 players in the same order when the draft commenced. I dont think so. Some clubs would have had players ranked inside their top 10 that other clubs wouldnt have had inisde their top 50. Its all about recruiters opinions-projections and scope for improvement. And with so many variables involved, thus the differences of opinion.

Will never be an exact science "Drafting" because there is so many things that recruiters cant factor in when trying to get a line through the player. ie./
Will they settle, adapt to new friends - community etc
Will they adapt to an AFL envoriment
Will they enjoy the free drink cards at night clubs more than there footy
Will they dedicate themselves 100% to footy because that is whats needed
Will they want to go home
ETC ETC ETC

U look at the American franchise sports and they draft the majority of their players 20-21 +. If the AFL recruiters got to wait until then, the draft order would probably be a lot similair seeing as though most players would have reached the majority of their potential. But seeing as though that is never going to happen, we are stuck with a very inexact science of recruiting 17-18 year olds.

[LukeHodge15]

LH,

Did you see any of his games after the championships?

None on Armitage, but from reports he improved and improved since the champs.

Just my opinion, but feel he lacks that special quality for a top 20 pick as an onballer in this years draft. Time will tell if im wrong i suppose. But thats the enjoyment of having an opinion.

[macca69]

You obviously never heard Adrian Dodoro on SEN. He rated Armitage up there with Gibbs in the draft, but they did the smart thing in drafting tall. Look at the 2000 draft when Didak was coming off All Oz captaincy, the Saints went tall with picks 1 and 2 and left Dids at 3.
JB is one of the best recruiters of all time, what are your credentials???

Who do you think was the biggest reach?

[LukeHodge15]

You obviously never heard Adrian Dodoro on SEN. He rated Armitage up there with Gibbs in the draft, but they did the smart thing in drafting tall. Look at the 2000 draft when Didak was coming off All Oz captaincy, the Saints went tall with picks 1 and 2 and left Dids at 3.
JB is one of the best recruiters of all time, what are your credentials???

Just a question for u ?

How has Adrain Dodoro gone with his draft picks in the last few years ?

Like i said be4, its not an exact science.......no recruiter is 100% perfect, probably 50% would be closer to the mark if u look at the stats. And %50 is a good record.

The recruitment is getting better and better each year but if anybody gets close to 100% (which will never happen) they will be able to name their price to AFL clubs.

[blaisee]

It's pretty clear that was a mistake on their part...

you have to be joking:thumbsd:

I can guarantee you the saints do not regret taking kosi and roo ahead of didak.

[ant555]

Just a question for u ?

How has Adrain Dodoro gone with his draft picks in the last few years ?

Like i said be4, its not an exact science.......no recruiter is 100% perfect, probably 50% would be closer to the mark if u look at the stats. And %50 is a good record.

The recruitment is getting better and better each year but if anybody gets close to 100% (which will never happen) they will be able to name their price to AFL clubs.

The last three have been ok.

[Jeremias]

you have to be joking:thumbsd:

I can guarantee you the saints do not regret taking kosi and roo ahead of didak.

Yeah, I hope he was joking as well.

I would take Kosi and Riewoldt over Didak any day of the week.

[Kildonan]

I agree with u. Never joined the Armitage Bandwagon. Just dont see what he brings to the table that is so special for a supposed top 20 Pick let alone a Top 10.

Being a Saint, and living in Mackay Qld (Armitage's home town), I am rapt at his selection. (The other Mackay kid selected was Urquhart who will also be a star).

Armitage is naturally gifted, there is no doubt. His assets include great agility (as proven by being clearly best at DC), but he is not blessed with the blistering speed of an Aaron Davey. That said , he would be likely to nip past 90% of the current AFL footballers - so I don't hold that as a failing of his. His work ethic and enormous tank more than compensates for those 10% that can beat him over 20 -30 m. Look at those who did really well at the 20m and you will see that nearly all were seriously underweight for their height.

What he brings to the table is that he is good at everything required of a midfielder - in fact he probably is the safest pick in the draft in this regard (except maybe Gibbs). He is ready made and will play in 2007 without a doubt. He will give a solid performance as a youngster and will improve with experience. I don't think he will be a superstar but he is (in my mind) one of the most likely types to succeed. I think he has less up-side than some on offer, but he is ready to play in 2007 and as such held more appeal than similar types that the Saints would have had to develop.

I don't think he was a reach at all.

Those who might be considered "reaches" include:
Griggs @ 19 (would've still been there @ 35 IMO)
Stewart @ 23 (but Adelaide may have snaffled him @ 32)
Howard @ 27 (but Saints next pick was @59 and JB didn't want to risk missing out on him)
Dawes @ 28 (Collingwood could have safely picked him up @ 44 and maybe even later)
Davey @ 36 (I just think that this was a mistake - I will be surprised if he makes it at AFL)