View Full Version : NAB cup game review
donsman4eva
24 Feb 2007, 18:42
Must admit, I didn't see the whole match because of work. Shame on me. I've taped it so I will watch it eventually. Anyway, I tuned in with 9 mins to go in the third quarter. From what I saw, Davey was the absolute standout player. He should get a game from round 1. Monfries was the other player I thought did very well, as did MM. Lovett and Davey running thru the midfield was exciting. I thought Laycock was good in the ruck, but maybe when he plays against a real ruckman we might get a better picture. Good to see Winderlich back, Lloyd too of course. With a few games Winderlich should get back to where he was before his injury.
Once I've seen the rest of the game, I'll make more notes, but until then, feel free to add on :)
PressureCooker
24 Feb 2007, 18:49
I know its early in the year but disposal was horrible by hand and foot. Far far too many unnecassary turnovers. Always hate losing to Carlton... ruins my night:mad:
McVeigh seriously needs anger management classes. Bradley has done himself no favours so far. Houli looks very nervous at this stage, and definitely needs a season in the VFL at this stage. We looked slow in the middle compared to them.
ManWithNoName
24 Feb 2007, 20:27
Welsh, Bradley, Peverill, Laycock and Cole should all be delisted now. They are utter, utter hacks.
Not a Wellman
24 Feb 2007, 20:32
Welsh, Bradley, Peverill, Laycock and Cole should all be delisted now. They are utter, utter hacks.
We are going no where fast with welsh pev and bradley they wouldn't get close to a game in a top 4 side. Cole though very harsh thought he was going alright and Laycock despite tonight will be a gun of the future don't worry about that.
ManWithNoName
24 Feb 2007, 20:40
We are going no where fast with welsh pev and bradley they wouldn't get close to a game in a top 4 side. Cole though very harsh thought he was going alright and Laycock despite tonight will be a gun of the future don't worry about that.
Cole showed nothing apart from stupid decision making and an unwillingness to committ.
Laycock may have a future but Ryder played better tonight and he's 2-3 years behind him in terms of years in the system.
Fair dinkum!! You were not that bad at all.
For a game with really poor skills, you should have watched last nights game with the Roos and Pies!
Now that was disgracefull!!:thumbsd:
Lots of good signs for both clubs IMO. And no chance of 16th for either of you. Both will climb the ladder.
Young Davey has the potential, if Sheedy looks after him in the next2-3 years, to be anything.:thumbsu:
Dare I say it, he could be as be as good as Farmer or his own brother.:thumbsu:
First game of the year boys. Take it easy.
Hird was good.
Lloyd looked comfortable.
Michael struggled with the new rules, but adds a lot of experience and he is smart enough to adapt.
I reckon you will go all right this year.
Barring injuries, and with the obvious potential of your experienced youngsters, you will press for the bottom half of the 8.
But one thing!!
Try and find Keppler another yard of pace, or sit him very deep in defence because, unless he quickens up, he will continue to get caught out in general play beyond the goal square.:)
Not a troll fellas.
Just an honest opinion.:thumbsu:
Good luck for the rest of the year!
Why does CJ always escape criticism?
Did he touch the ball tonight?
He has been referred to as the messiah, i have always had serious doubts about him, and suggested he should be traded while he had some currency at the end of last year.
I think by the end of this year he will have no currency and no club.
He is just an over rated player, who has fascinated everyone by his size imo.
This is not an over reaction to our and his poor game tonight, which i have just got back from, but the thoughts i have had for a very long time.
I'm not going to lose much sleep over tonight although there is still the regular turnover merchants making the same mistakes. Hopefully Nash, Dyson jetta etc get some decent gametime in the coming weeks. More guys who can use the footy need to be played.....same song, different year unfortunately.
At least the speed issue is now a myth.
Why does CJ always escape criticism?
Did he touch the ball tonight?
Once the ball hits the deck he's useless, unless we are dominating the middle our supersized forweard line will do us more harm than good.
Why does CJ always escape criticism?
Did he touch the ball tonight?
He has been referred to as the messiah, i have always had serious doubts about him, and suggested he should be traded while he had some currency at the end of last year.
I think by the end of this year he will have no currency and no club.
He is just an over rated player, who has fascinated everyone by his size imo.
This is not an over reaction to our and his poor game tonight, which i have just got back from, but the thoughts i have had for a very long time.
In all fairness to CJ, he had to find the ball up the ground as we were way too wasteful going forward, particularly in the first half. Even Lloyd didnt get into the game until half way through the 3rd term. I think Sheedy's gameplan is getting very old and fast.
We'll become Carlton's bunnies if we dish up that crap in the first half. Dont think we will get far if we're playing catch up all the time.
Once the ball hits the deck he's useless, unless we are dominating the middle our supersized forweard line will do us more harm than good.
Thats why we have crumbers....
I'm not going to lose much sleep over tonight although there is still the regular turnover merchants making the same mistakes. Hopefully Nash, Dyson jetta etc get some decent gametime in the coming weeks. More guys who can use the footy need to be played.....same song, different year unfortunately.
At least the speed issue is now a myth.
Well, I think its still a question mark. Their disposal was much quicker collectively than ours more often than not. Still a little way off at playing such a blinding speed of football.
Thats why we have crumbers....
Crumbers cant be everywhere, he needs to learn how to compete when the ball is on the deck.
mcphee_is_a_gun
24 Feb 2007, 21:14
We need to kick the ball forward, not over handpass or kick sideways. Some of the play tonight was terrible in those regards.
Well, I think its still a question mark. Their disposal was much quicker collectively than ours more often than not. Still a little way off at playing such a blinding speed of football.
Im talking about leg speed and the ability carry the footy and chase opponants down. Our disposal is still terrible which effects our ability to move the ball clean and quick. But we took bounces in this game than in most games last year, i like to see the boys who can run back themselves.
Crumbers cant be everywhere, he needs to learn how to compete when the ball is on the deck.
Should that be his role though? What use is he if he were to spend the majority of his game time on the deck when someone of smaller stature can go in and send it high again for him....
Im talking about leg speed and the ability carry the footy and chase opponants down. Our disposal is still terrible which effects our ability to move the ball clean and quick. But we took bounces in this game than in most games last year, i like to see the boys who can run back themselves.
I think we looked slow when the game was red hot in the first quarter also. Sure, our pace has improved, but they were faster everywhere for longer periods.
We need to kick the ball forward, not over handpass or kick sideways. Some of the play tonight was terrible in those regards.
Spot on.
We build up momentum from the backline, then it gets to the centre/wing, and all that momentum just stops and the opposition flood back as we chip it around, same players time after time
Spot on.
We build up momentum from the backline, then it gets to the centre/wing, and all that momentum just stops and the opposition flood back as we chip it around, same players time after time
We just have to accept we got killed in the middle and across our half back line. Cant keep giving teams that much of a lead early on.
Should that be his role though? What use is he if he were to spend the majority of his game time on the deck when someone of smaller stature can go in and send it high again for him....
At the very worst he needs to pressure his opponant. With 3 big guys down there most teams will find it easy to run the footy out of defense.
We just have to accept we got killed in the middle and across our half back line. Cant keep giving teams that much of a lead early on.
Exactly right. We were smashed in the middle. No matter how fast we are everyone looks slow when you don't have the footy. And you look slow when you can't hit targets. The quickest sides don't miss by foot.
I think we looked slow when the game was red hot in the first quarter also. Sure, our pace has improved, but they were faster everywhere for longer periods.
As denis pagan once said "Its amazing how slow you look when you dont have the footy"
Maybe thats been our problem all along....not so much our speed, but our disposal. Between 99-01, we still weren't terribly quick, yet with the likes of Misiti, Rama, Mercs and Long hitting their targets, we were unstoppable.
Maybe thats been our problem all along....not so much our speed, but our disposal. Between 99-01, we still weren't terribly quick, yet with the likes of Misiti, Rama, Mercs and Long hitting their targets, we were unstoppable.
Its true, poor skill and ballwinning ability has been our downfall for the last few years. Has a bit to do with our ruckmen as well, we have not had a genuine tap ruckman since Barnes to give our on ballers first use.
Its true, poor skill and ballwinning ability has been our downfall for the last few years. Has a bit to do with our ruckmen as well, we have not had a genuine tap ruckman since Barnes to give our on ballers first use.
Which leads me to think Laycock mightnt be our answer. And Ryder is still very young at this stage. So, might have to look at poaching a ruckman at year's end to supplement Hille around the ground. One with grunt would be adequate in the middle.
Longy413
24 Feb 2007, 22:02
Maybe thats been our problem all along....not so much our speed, but our disposal. Between 99-01, we still weren't terribly quick, yet with the likes of Misiti, Rama, Mercs and Long hitting their targets, we were unstoppable.
At time we actually looked too quick tonight. We had a lot of guys in tonight that can carry the ball, but they carried for no reason. Speed isn't our problem, ball use is.
Matty Lloyd proved in one contest tonight that he is still a dead set gun, people forget he can actually take contested marks.
Kick the ball to Lloyd and kick it to him quickly.
At time we actually looked too quick tonight. We had a lot of guys in tonight that can carry the ball, but they carried for no reason. Speed isn't our problem, ball use is.
Matty Lloyd proved in one contest tonight that he is still a dead set gun, people forget he can actually take contested marks.
Kick the ball to Lloyd and kick it to him quickly.
Shouldnt we employ some diversity to our game though? I agree in theory, but while we're trying to gel these young kids and groom them into smart midfielders for Lloyd to receive from, we 'd have to keep the opposition guessing by delivering to a different target.
McPhee wouldve been handy tonight getting it quickly to Lloyd and I dare use Campo as an example also.
donsman4eva
24 Feb 2007, 22:15
Welsh, Bradley, Peverill, Laycock and Cole should all be delisted now. They are utter, utter hacks.
I'm utterly sick of Welsh bashing. He is one of the best players in our team. There are at least 30 players that you can call a hack before welsh. He doesn't deserve the bad press he gets. He constantly beats his opponent, which BTW is a defenders job. Maybe he does kick sideways more than people would like. But if there is someone making room across the ground, why shouldn't he kick it there. He is just playing to team instructions.
Longy413
24 Feb 2007, 22:37
Shouldnt we employ some diversity to our game though? I agree in theory, but while we're trying to gel these young kids and groom them into smart midfielders for Lloyd to receive from, we 'd have to keep the opposition guessing by delivering to a different target.
McPhee wouldve been handy tonight getting it quickly to Lloyd and I dare use Campo as an example also.
McPhee wouldn't have made much of a difference, he runs forward with little thought for what is ahead.
Heff is the man, he adds composure to our midfield. We have enough pace, not enough smarts. Heff would top us off nicely.
danielcan
24 Feb 2007, 22:46
Why is this thread so negative?
What about some nice things to write about?
I thought Monfries played really well.
McPhee wouldn't have made much of a difference, he runs forward with little thought for what is ahead.
Heff is the man, he adds composure to our midfield. We have enough pace, not enough smarts. Heff would top us off nicely.
Not sure we can turn it around that swiftly though.
Jeremias
24 Feb 2007, 22:51
Cole showed nothing apart from stupid decision making and an unwillingness to committ.
Laycock may have a future but Ryder played better tonight and he's 2-3 years behind him in terms of years in the system.
Was Cole playing?
:eek:
Not a troll guys...seriously didn't see him once.
ManWithNoName
24 Feb 2007, 23:09
Was Cole playing?
:eek:
Not a troll guys...seriously didn't see him once.
He was the bloke who kept giving it back to Carlton players.
Storyboy
25 Feb 2007, 01:06
I was very encouraged by a few of our 'next generation' players. Watson is a ball magnet, Monfries is a gun, Lovett-Murray is looking composed and Lovett is looking fast once more.
I would agree that there are still a number of issues to work out, but by and large, I am encouraged by much of what I am seeing. Some of the time and development is paying off.
I can't believe we still piss fart around with it like we do, just kick it deep inside 50 for christ sake, Lloyd, Lucas and Johns can all take a contested mark, if not at least there is a possibility of a free kick or something happening when it hits the deck.
Better than waiting and waiting gor the lines to be cut off, especially when our disposal is poor.
How can Fev get those free kicks then Johns gets an elbow right in the back and nothing, very frustrating also.
The story of the game was the same complaint i have had for years. ********ing turnovers. 14 times we handballed it to the oposition. 13 times heading inside 50 be blazed it staright to a Carlton player.
You can blame whoever you want, balme the sideways kicking or stuffing around but at the end of the day if we cant hang onto the ball we wont win!!
Our inside 50's where terrible. Most of the time it gave our forwards no chance.
C4[2]Yo`DooR
25 Feb 2007, 08:26
In all honesty - the intesity of the match made it by far the best of the NAB Cup yet.
go team
25 Feb 2007, 08:40
The way our skills looked, it was like we were playing the game in February...
The way our skills looked, it was like we were playing the game in February...
Carlton's were a lot better
go team
25 Feb 2007, 08:56
Definitely - but what was our defensive pressure like? I'm talking about the pressure on the opposition midfielders. Pretty non existent. Which is another issue in its self. I'm sure Carlton's skill levels will turn to ******** when the play a midfield providing some sort of harassment.
Definitely - but what was our defensive pressure like? I'm talking about the pressure on the opposition midfielders. Pretty non existent. Which is another issue in its self. I'm sure Carlton's skill levels will turn to ******** when the play a midfield providing some sort of harassment.
It's hard when we turn it over so much and get caught out of position. We need to hit targets more and stop handballing and p|ss farting around with it so much, get it in quicker.
Little Alwyn Davey had 8 tackles, didn't do his chances any harm.
ManWithNoName
25 Feb 2007, 09:15
Carlton's were a lot better
And that is so unbelievably sad I could cry.
Watson is a ball magnet
Agreed, but there's one small problem Jobe...KICK THE GOD DAMN THING! I'm sick to death of our players handballing backwards or sideways to a player surrounded by opposition players. How god damn hard is it to kick it long to a contest. FFS.
It was clearly the influence of their 158 man leadership group that pulled them over the line. Tim Pagan you genius. Bet thornton is glad he stayed on now.
It's going to be another season we're we'll drag ourselves down to other teams levels of ineptness.
That should be our excuse. But our disposal is rubbish.
ManWithNoName
25 Feb 2007, 09:18
It was clearly the influence of their 158 man leadership group that pulled them over the line. Tim Pagan you genius. Bet thornton is glad he stayed on now.
It's going to be another season we're we'll drag ourselves down to other teams levels of ineptness.
That should be our excuse. But our disposal is rubbish.
Careful. You'll be accused of simply being a young fan who hasn't seen the hard times if you dare utter a syllable not in favour of Essendon.
Geez, a little too negative here I think.
I think half the problem was expectations - on paper they were spooners last season, but that has nothing to do with the way our games go. Our games generally go down to the wire. Just probably our major arch rival which both teams love to hate, and results in a good game. Over the past decade so many times the result hasnt reflected the general position of both teams. Just a great rivalry we have going.
Yes, we had a good team on paper, but in reality we were carrying Lloyd, Lovett, Widerlich, Laycock & Cole who were clearly underdone and need as much game time as possible before the season proper. Add to that the frustration and perhaps unprepardness of MM and Fletcher with the new rule and there we have a batch of over half a dozen we can get plenty more out of.
The game was lost in the last 5 minutes of the first term, and first 15 or so of the 2nd. The quarter time scoreboard was not reflective of the game - I watched the tape this morning which confirmed to me that we actually outplayed them in the first quarter, yet kicked too many behinds, and gave away 3 extremely soft goals, one of which being a super goal, and all of a sudden we were over 3 goals down. They got the rub of every green in that period.
We got much better as the game went on, but the usual skill errors are very worrying. Sure, some of it can be put down to the first game with real pressure, however they seemed a lot cleaner around the stoppages, the ball and by hand and foot. We over-used the ball, a huge sin when you have a look at our forward line. It was given no chance at all for much of the game.
The only real worry I have is Kepler. He really needs to improve this season. Again, it just looks the pace of the game is too much for him at the highest level.
Cole and Winders, just looked more underdone than bad to me. Cole actually hit a few targets in that first half - more than I can say for most of the team. Winders got near it enough, but the touch really wasnt there. All these guys who missed most of last season, Lloyd and laycock included, are going to take time, probably 3-5 rounds of the real stuff before they can really be judged.
At the end of the day, we probably only had 5 or so "winners" on the ground, where has they got plenty from every line. We only lost by a few points after hitting the post at least 5 times.
Sure, we have improvment to do, but I think some here are going a bit overboard.
And that is so unbelievably sad I could cry.
Agreed, but there's one small problem Jobe...KICK THE GOD DAMN THING! I'm sick to death of our players handballing backwards or sideways to a player surrounded by opposition players. How god damn hard is it to kick it long to a contest. FFS.
Yea, but it looked like a directive, rather than impulse.
We looked for the handball at EVERY opportunity, even when it wasnt there. Some times it made the whole flow look really unnatural.
ManWithNoName
25 Feb 2007, 10:02
Yea, but it looked like a directive, rather than impulse.
We looked for the handball at EVERY opportunity, even when it wasnt there. Some times it made the whole flow look really unnatural.
I agree. It's what we did last year and why the hell we're doing it again I'm not sure. FFS we have Lloyd, Lucas and Johns up forward. Just kick it long to them when they're not surrounded by 7 defenders and more often than not they'll take the mark and kick the goal. Why bother with this handball bull********?
I cant understand this Welsh bagging either if u watch the game a little more closely last night he was easily in our best 7 or 8 players. He's so underrated by our supporters and by the comp in general. He's super gutsy, quick and effective in his disposal.
On the positives first, We were clearly the better team in the first quarter but as usual our kicking for goal was woeful and our lack of composure in that area was disappointing. I think Hirdy passed one where he should hav had a shot, maybe Houli as well and possibly Lovett too. Just kick the goals.
Licha looked very good for his preparation and i think could be a good link player through the middle, Lovett was fantastic wen he ran and carried the footy from half back- this is wat we hav been craving from him and we can afford to hav him up the ground more with Davey slotting into his forward role.
Enter Davey he was spectacular and is ready made for round one. We have needed someone with this forward line pressure and hes got it in spades.
Ryder for the first time in his short career actually did some things that showed me that he has the potential to develop into a good player. This is wat i have been waiting for and although it probably isnt enough to be a regular 22 it gives me greater confidence in his selection.
Hirdy was every bit as good as ive seen him in a pre-season game which is fantastic news. Lloydy needs to realise that we dont need him chasing kicks up the wing wen hes struggling, just stay at home and wait for the opportunities. With more game time will be ready. Fletch was good at setting up play across half back and i was licking my lips early but still needs to focus on beating his man in the contested situation.
Yeh on Johns, he showed nothing last nite and i would hav liked Sheeds to hav given Kep a chance in that third forward role if CJ isnt performing. ON Kep he looked ok and would hav looked better if he realises he his own limitations. Hes not the fastest going around and if hed release it earlier it'd be so much better for the team. Sheeds wen McPhee gets back get Kep away from the backline and free him up on a wing or HFF.
Overall the team needs serious decision making drills at training this week. Idunno how many times we directly handballed it to the opposition but it must hav been upwards of 10. Ryder did it twice to Lance and its just a blight on our game that probably cost us 7 or 8 forward 50 entries. If we can fix our decision making and hav more composure with our skills then i see alot of improvement from us this year. I still dont see us as a top 8 side but not through lack of talent but its just where we are on the development cycle and there is alot to like about the team going forward.
cherryripe
25 Feb 2007, 10:33
As obvious as this sounds but if you can keep your spine relatively intact and injury free you will win more games than Carlton this year. Even though you lost the game I saw more to work with in the Bombers than the Blues.
I cant understand this Welsh bagging either if u watch the game a little more closely last night he was easily in our best 7 or 8 players. He's so underrated by our supporters and by the comp in general. He's super gutsy, quick and effective in his disposal.
On the positives first, We were clearly the better team in the first quarter but as usual our kicking for goal was woeful and our lack of composure in that area was disappointing. I think Hirdy passed one where he should hav had a shot, maybe Houli as well and possibly Lovett too. Just kick the goals.
Licha looked very good for his preparation and i think could be a good link player through the middle, Lovett was fantastic wen he ran and carried the footy from half back- this is wat we hav been craving from him and we can afford to hav him up the ground more with Davey slotting into his forward role.
Enter Davey he was spectacular and is ready made for round one. We have needed someone with this forward line pressure and hes got it in spades.
Ryder for the first time in his short career actually did some things that showed me that he has the potential to develop into a good player. This is wat i have been waiting for and although it probably isnt enough to be a regular 22 it gives me greater confidence in his selection.
Hirdy was every bit as good as ive seen him in a pre-season game which is fantastic news. Lloydy needs to realise that we dont need him chasing kicks up the wing wen hes struggling, just stay at home and wait for the opportunities. With more game time will be ready. Fletch was good at setting up play across half back and i was licking my lips early but still needs to focus on beating his man in the contested situation.
Yeh on Johns, he showed nothing last nite and i would hav liked Sheeds to hav given Kep a chance in that third forward role if CJ isnt performing. ON Kep he looked ok and would hav looked better if he realises he his own limitations. Hes not the fastest going around and if hed release it earlier it'd be so much better for the team. Sheeds wen McPhee gets back get Kep away from the backline and free him up on a wing or HFF.
Overall the team needs serious decision making drills at training this week. Idunno how many times we directly handballed it to the opposition but it must hav been upwards of 10. Ryder did it twice to Lance and its just a blight on our game that probably cost us 7 or 8 forward 50 entries. If we can fix our decision making and hav more composure with our skills then i see alot of improvement from us this year. I still dont see us as a top 8 side but not through lack of talent but its just where we are on the development cycle and there is alot to like about the team going forward.
I cant understand this Welsh bagging either if u watch the game a little more closely last night he was easily in our best 7 or 8 players. He's so underrated by our supporters and by the comp in general. He's super gutsy, quick and effective in his disposal.I couldn't disagree more.
He is not quick by any means,he is beaten by his opponant many times, yes he does have some guts i will give him that, but when he gets the ball he either stuffs around with it, chips it sideways or backwards or lets the team down with poor disposal.
A very very average footballer imo.
On the positives first, We were clearly the better team in the first quarter Disagree again, and i thought Carlton really wanted the ball more than we did.
Licha looked very good for his preparation and i think could be a good link player through the middle, Lovett was fantastic wen he ran and carried the footy from half back- this is wat we hav been craving from him and we can afford to hav him up the ground more with Davey slotting into his forward role.
Enter Davey he was spectacular and is ready made for round one. We have needed someone with this forward line pressure and hes got it in spades.I thought Winderlich was very average and had little effect on the game, other than his goal.
One thing i will give him is he really does try hard, but is another with quite limited ability imo.
Lovett got the ball and ran breaking lines, but on many occasions, just gave the ball straight back to the opponant.
I have always said he "appears" to have an extremely casual arrogant approach to his football.
This may just be the way it looks rather than the reality, i don't know, but untill i see him breaking lines and hitting targets/kicking goals, all that work is wasted.
I thought Davey was very good, although he needs to improve his disposal also.Having said that he should improve as the year goes on and appears to have been a good pick up, so far.
Hirdy was every bit as good as ive seen him in a pre-season game which is fantastic news. Lloydy needs to realise that we dont need him chasing kicks up the wing wen hes struggling, just stay at home and wait for the opportunities. With more game time will be ready. Fletch was good at setting up play across half back and i was licking my lips early but still needs to focus on beating his man in the contested situation.Hirdy was great, but Essendons future is not with him, unfortunately.
Everytime we are in trouble, we put him in the middle and sure enough he wins clearance after clearance.Yet while he is not there, we get smashed more often than not.This is not a good sign for when he is gone.
I thought Fletch was quite good and will be very dangerous in that position.
A couple of things to consider when alalysing this game.
We were playing the wooden spooners of last year.
We were widely thought to be ahead of them in our preperation prior to the game.
We were soundly beaten early, yet fought back....was this possibly related to fitness?....let's hope not.
jules101
25 Feb 2007, 12:10
Cole reminds me so much of Soloman
jules101
25 Feb 2007, 12:12
Anywhere got the stats from the game? essendon site, the age and herald sun dont. I'll try the AFL site
mcphee_is_a_gun
25 Feb 2007, 12:16
Why did Dempsey get so little game time? I thought he was very impressive when he was on.
donsman4eva
25 Feb 2007, 12:26
Anywhere got the stats from the game? essendon site, the age and herald sun dont. I'll try the AFL site
AFL site has them
He was the bloke who kept giving it back to Carlton players.
Two turnover from hanballs, i will give you a tip there where a few others with a lot more.
Jeremias
25 Feb 2007, 12:36
Guys, don't be so negative.
It was the first game, a practise game at that, so it means very little in the end.
Sure, we came away with the win, but that's not to say that there weren't positives for you as well, because there definitely were.
I think your forward line will cause a few headaches this year. Lloyd was a bit quiet last night, he was well held. But he still managed to kick some goals, even though he didn't have much of an influence. He will only get better. Lucas was average, didn't have much of an impact considering he usually kills us! :p
I am very impressed with your recruits, in particular Davey and Houli. Both caused headaches for us the whole night, and almost won the game for you. Both are very good finds IMO, and if they are given plenty of opportunities they will do well.
Johns was quiet, I don't think he got that much game time though.
Paddy Ryder showed signs of improvement. He did a few very stupid things, but there's no doubt he is improving. Be patient with him and he will be a very good player. His mark was excellent.
Sure, skills were down-but that wasn't just your team. I'm sure they will improve as they get kore practise.
Don't be so negative about it all, though-the signs are definitely there. You won't make the finals, but you won't be as bad as last year.
Cheers. :thumbsu:
We were playing the wooden spooners of last year.
Yes we where but we only finished in front of them on percentage and actually didnt beat them last year either.People may be over rating us and underating Carlton. While the Blues have a way to go yet they have picked up some good young players over the last few seasons and where bound to improve.
We were widely thought to be ahead of them in our preperation prior to the game.
Says who? Both sides where primed for the game. Where was there any reports that the Blues where behind in preperation? They had played a number of intra club games as well.
We were soundly beaten early, yet fought back....was this possibly related to fitness?....let's hope not.
Not sure how you have managed to get fitness into this. Bith sides pretty much ran all night.
Don't be so negative about it all, though-the signs are definitely there. You won't make the finals, but you won't be as bad as last year.
Cheers. :thumbsu:
Part of the problem is the fact that people seem to have the wide view that Carlton cant improve so any loss to them is an negative. ;)
Splendini
25 Feb 2007, 12:44
McVeigh seriously needs anger management classes. Bradley has done himself no favours so far. Houli looks very nervous at this stage, and definitely needs a season in the VFL at this stage. We looked slow in the middle compared to them.
I actually thought you looked a yard or two quicker than us to be honest, just didn't finish your forward thrusts and poor dispoasl by hand and foot as somebody else pointed out. I think you are still one class midfielder short and one Gumby should go to helping out the future KPP stocks. Your young indigenous kids are v. exciting though, just need to finish better.
bhorjus
25 Feb 2007, 12:48
- Monfries by far the best on ground. The start of a big year.
- Lovett provided good run through the midfield.
- Impressed with Davey. Great forward line pressure, could of had 2 or 3
- Watson got us back in the game in the last qua rter.
- Good to see Lloyd back. Did OK.
- Hird looked preaty good. If he can do that every game I'll be happy.
- I liked Paddy Ryder on the half back line.
Thought i was on the Port Adelaide board for a while there, reading some of these posts...
Anyways, on to my thoughts....
Not a welsh basher, but i really don't like him in the middle, i think it was a bad move. I also hopes he eithers improves significantly, or isn't in the team...
Hille was very poor tonight i felt, just didn't use his frame enough, and didn't do well in the ruck. Ackland and Cloke are both average ruckmen, and yet they seemed to be doing winning the ball ups.
Johnson in should help in the middle, because he knows when he has the ball to look for a kick.
Kepler is still a wild card.. i think he should be rotated into the forward line to replace CJ; but off the backline he is too slow.
Midfield pressure wasn't good enough, not enough tackling, and too many of their players were left loose. I think Heff should be played round 1, as a replacement for Pev. Heff at least is always tackling and putting pressure on players, and when he gets the ball, he usually uses it well.
Lastly, the "hands in the back" rule is ********HOUSE... the free kicks were just far too soft in some cases.
Jeremias
25 Feb 2007, 13:23
Part of the problem is the fact that people seem to have the wide view that Carlton cant improve so any loss to them is an negative. ;)
We have definitely improved, even though we were a but rusty last night.
It's not a bad thing you lost to us, sure you would have preferred to win, but don't get too hung up about it.
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Yes we where but we only finished in front of them on percentage and actually didnt beat them last year either.People may be over rating us and underating Carlton. While the Blues have a way to go yet they have picked up some good young players over the last few seasons and where bound to improve.
Says who? Both sides where primed for the game. Where was there any reports that the Blues where behind in preperation? They had played a number of intra club games as well.
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Yes we where but we only finished in front of them on percentage and actually didnt beat them last year either.People may be over rating us and underating Carlton. While the Blues have a way to go yet they have picked up some good young players over the last few seasons and where bound to improve.
The point i was trying to make was that we were poor and it was against the wooden spooners from last year.What would a proven performer have done to us
Says who? Both sides where primed for the game. Where was there any reports that the Blues where behind in preperation? They had played a number of intra club games as well.
You obviously don't read or hear as many reports as i do.It was a common belief that Essendon were ahead of Carlton in preperation, rightly or wrongly.
You know who have the best handle on that stuff, the bookies. and they ALL had Essendon as being better prepared.
Not sure how you have managed to get fitness into this. Bith sides pretty much ran all night
I didn't say it was fitness, i raised the possibility that it MAY have been related to it.
And i based that possibility on the fact that it was wideley belived, again rightly or wrongly, that we were further advanced than Carlton in preperation
meh, we struggle with Carlton. We have to accept that.
If anyone thought we were going to cakewalk this one they were dreaming. I said this during the week on the main forum in a thread totally talking up Essendon - this one had two primed teams who 90% of the time give each other a ripper of a contest.
They were better prepared match-fitness wise than us; they had a full list to chose from of fit players ready for combat.
We nearly did, on PAPER, however in reality Lloyd, Lovett, Laycock, MM and Wilderlich amoung were all carried to various extents, all had missed different chunks of last season and desparately need games under their belt.
Take Winda for example, it was his first real hitout since breaking his leg, and everyone is on his case. To me, he looked good phsically, but his touch isnt there. Clearly underdone, which is to be expected.
Give Lovett 2 or 3 more games and he wont miss targets like he was doing.
We are as "fit" as most (I dont think we were as physically fit this time last year, which is a real positive), however many of our guys really need match fitness. Big difference.
I really wonder if most would be this negative had we snuck over the line. We lost by a few points to an arch rival, and only got outplayed for a 20 minute or so stretch. It wasnt THAT bad.
Anyone watch Footscray v Sydney? Aker struggled. He missed the 2nd half of last year and it takes time, even for him.
The point i was trying to make was that we were poor and it was against the wooden spooners from last year.What would a proven performer have done to us
You obviously don't read or hear as many reports as i do.It was a common belief that Essendon were ahead of Carlton in preperation, rightly or wrongly.
You know who have the best handle on that stuff, the bookies. and they ALL had Essendon as being better prepared.
I didn't say it was fitness, i raised the possibility that it MAY have been related to it.
And i based that possibility on the fact that it was wideley belived, again rightly or wrongly, that we were further advanced than Carlton in preperation
Well given i have seen a lot of us train, i have had a look at Carlton train and had reports from a few people who have seen Carlton train i based my views on that. For whatever reason people have equated our good showing in the All Stars game as being further advanced than other clubs.
To be honest i would back what i have seen and the reports from people i know against anything.
As for being poor against a wooden spooner, well it is last years form and thats where it should be left. Carlton will not continue to be the punching bag they have been. With all that has happened there in the last few weeks i am not surprised they came out playing confident footy.
Our problem was poor skills which will be a problem against any level of opposition.
THE SKY IS FALLING.
Careful. You'll be accused of simply being a young fan who hasn't seen the hard times if you dare utter a syllable not in favour of Essendon.
Ha. 1 loss in a pre season game means nothing. Hard times this aint, over the last two years a rough patch maybe. I got a good chuckle from the morons on the main board saying that Lloyd is finished.
On our pre season training, all teams 'train the house down' over summer. Every pre season media outlets, most notably the Herald Scum, prints useless articles on players being in 'the best shape ever'. Get a load of this rubbish (http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,21217108-23211,00.html).
Of course we also had Sheedy telling us about how fit everyone is and how the players all trained 22 hours a day whilst working on a cure for cancer.
If it weren't for cuntons hilarious pre season board fights etc, we'd have heard more about how ********nall has lost more weight than ever and is ready to rip a season apart like a pack of 4 and 20s.
ManWithNoName
25 Feb 2007, 16:04
Hope you don't think I'm saying this is hard times, we've had a bad trot that's all.
go team
25 Feb 2007, 17:59
relax guys.. we still have Bolton to come in!
SydneyDon
26 Feb 2007, 08:51
When McVeigh gives away a 50m penalty for his lack of disipline is really sh*ts me.
I said at the time if I was Sheeds I would bench him for the WHOLE game.
My question is what happened? It was on very late in Sydney and I couldn't see past the second qtr and already knew the result. I haven't seen a replay yet. When did the little pr*ck get back on, if at all?
With Solly gone i was hoping for a new atitude change but mouthing off after a free has always been a problem for some of our blokes and as porfessionals it is inexcusable.
Darealrath
26 Feb 2007, 09:05
2 things i was concerned about:
1 was the automatic handball after taking a mark even if it put the receiver under immense pressure. We did that a lot last year and i was hoping we'd be more circumspect with it but it appears not and if we keep that up we'll be turnover merchants all year. I do like the idea of moving it quickly but have a look first.
2 was the midfield, especially the defensive pressure. Still needs work and a lot of experience playing together.
Individual players i wasn't too bothered with. Expect to be rusty at this stage of the year.
Conceded a few to Fev but i thought Michael and Fletcher worked well and that looks very promising.
Cole looks in shape and did a few nice things.
Davey did some great work though whoever it was that said he almost goes a bit fast for his own good might be right. He really is the type we need up forward though.
Houli got involved and looked very smooth at times.
2 of those goals by Monfries were awesome. Liked how he still wants to kick check sides too.
When McVeigh gives away a 50m penalty for his lack of disipline is really sh*ts me.
I said at the time if I was Sheeds I would bench him for the WHOLE game.
My question is what happened? It was on very late in Sydney and I couldn't see past the second qtr and already knew the result. I haven't seen a replay yet. When did the little pr*ck get back on, if at all?
With Solly gone i was hoping for a new atitude change but mouthing off after a free has always been a problem for some of our blokes and as porfessionals it is inexcusable.
Yeah, that was annoying, was a soft 50m mind you, because i carlton bloke did the same thing later and wasn't called on it. I think if should be all or nothing....
When he went back on he played okay, so i didn't mind he being back on, but i reckon had he made any more mistakes, he would have been sitting the rest out.
1 was the automatic handball after taking a mark even if it put the receiver under immense pressure. We did that a lot last year and i was hoping we'd be more circumspect with it but it appears not and if we keep that up we'll be turnover merchants all year. I do like the idea of moving it quickly but have a look first.
I can't stand it when they do it just outside the F50, especially when there is a lot of ooposition players around. A quick look and they'd see a Lloyd or Johns 1 on 1, stuff around too much and they get cut off. At worst it hits the deck but they can out mark 1 on 1 if not a free kick, you never know. Beats anything else we do.
2 was the midfield, especially the defensive pressure. Still needs work and a lot of experience playing together.
Our turnovers didn't help here, too often we're caught out of position after a poor kick inside 50.
Darealrath
26 Feb 2007, 09:15
Our turnovers didn't help here, too often we're caught out of position after a poor kick inside 50.
Yeah they made it looks worse but still, something just doesn't look right about it. A lot of other teams seem to have better organisation.
Yeah they made it looks worse but still, something just doesn't look right about it. A lot of other teams seem to have better organisation.
They are still quite young, JJ and Heff will stabalize a little. They probably do run a little too hard forward sometimes when a teammate has the ball, even more of a reason to kick it quicker and deeper inside 50.
2 of those goals by Monfries were awesome. Liked how he still wants to kick check sides too.
Something he has worked on after pretty much every training run this year ;)
The Grover
26 Feb 2007, 14:58
Both teams need work on disposal into forward 50, Bombers hit the post a few times & Blues missed some easy shots for goal.
I thought Monfries & Ryder both showed how good they'll be in the future.
AFL site has them
Where? The AFL site just gives me 3 or 4 players for each team. AFL website is stil crap.
donsman4eva
26 Feb 2007, 17:26
Where? The AFL site just gives me 3 or 4 players for each team. AFL website is stil crap.
Go to match review and the live stats come up. Click on the team list tab and they should come up.
I checked just after the game and it was there, so maybe it has been removed since to make way for other games.