View Full Version : Possibly despondent talented youngsters ......
Gary Shadforth
12 Jul 2007, 14:06
What concerns me is our young players yet to debut in the seniors getting mentioned in despatches at Box Hill as being in AFL-call-up-form but find the under-achieving Josh Thurgood getting a game before them.
Now don't get me wrong. I'm not putting JT down, just stating the fact of the situation.
I realize there is such an aspect of 'horses for courses' and 'suitable to a position'. But I would, from now on, rather see some of the in-form newcomers debuting.
Your thoughts on whether or not the youngsters being praised by the Box Hill coach for their efforts but finding an unachiever getting the nod before them maybe becoming despondent, unhappy and discouraged?
Just my thoughts, guys and gals, girls and boys.
Thaihawk
12 Jul 2007, 14:27
I was very disappointed to see Josh named in the side ahead of Muston and Tuck. I'm praying he will not be names again this week. We need to give some of these kids a run BEFORE finals time.
If we get injuries leading into a final the kids will be far better aquited if they have had some game time.
Let's see two debut this week.
kirbatron
12 Jul 2007, 15:02
Starting to frustrate supporters too it seems incl me...
PADJUAN
12 Jul 2007, 15:02
What concerns me is our young players yet to debut in the seniors getting mentioned in despatches at Box Hill as being in AFL-call-up-form but find the under-achieving Josh Thurgood getting a game before them.
Now don't get me wrong. I'm not putting JT down, just stating the fact of the situation.
I realize there is such an aspect of 'horses for courses' and 'suitable to a position'. But I would, from now on, rather see some of the in-form newcomers debuting.
Your thoughts on whether or not the youngsters being praised by the Box Hill coach for their efforts but finding an unachiever getting the nod before them maybe becoming despondent, unhappy and discouraged?
Just my thoughts, guys and gals, girls and boys.
Horses for courses and position suitable are fair enough reasons, but where is it implemented when playing Thurgood? does he have a specific role, even at BH, or just a here and there role? surely blokes like tuck, muston, moss, little, while all showing form at BH, are showing more suitability to a position then Thurgood. All 4 play different roles, so one of them shouldve been able to fill the role that Thurgood was chosen for.
Gary Shadforth
12 Jul 2007, 15:19
According to Rusty's report this morning, Musto and Mitch have been training the house down to impress to gain debut selection.
Surely the 'in' word must apply to them this week and I mean in the starting 22.
marto9000
12 Jul 2007, 15:23
how many have we had debut this year, we should take a leaf out of collingwoods book, theyve had at least 7 debut this season and they are top 4 at the present time, time for a change
JezzHawk
12 Jul 2007, 15:28
Perhaps Clarkson wants improvement to come in a waves.
Seriously, Thurgood has been lucky to date with the amount of games he has played.
Killeroj
12 Jul 2007, 16:45
How must Matty Little feel? Seeing williams (fwd), Dixon (fwd), Osborne (fwd), Roughead (fwd), Franklin (fwd) all out of the team at some stage and not to get a single chance over 3 years? Thurgood who doesnt actually have a position somehow gets multiple chances...
You cant tell me his Box hill form isnt deserving of at least 1 game to show his talents? Whats the point of selecting him... I sometimes wonder how these guys feel not to be given a chance...
Dr_Mutley
12 Jul 2007, 16:53
How must Matty Little feel? Seeing williams (fwd), Dixon (fwd), Osborne (fwd), Roughead (fwd), Franklin (fwd) all out of the team at some stage and not to get a single chance over 3 years? Thurgood who doesnt actually have a position somehow gets multiple chances...
You cant tell me his Box hill form isnt deserving of at least 1 game to show his talents? Whats the point of selecting him... I sometimes wonder how these guys feel not to be given a chance...
I would have thought u need to get more than 4 or 5 kicks in the VFL to make the AFL... maybe its time for Little to stand up in the VFL to deserve a chance in the AFL?
The Cryptkeeper
12 Jul 2007, 17:13
Sorry, I just can't see it with Little and I have been to plenty of Box Hill games. As stated above, he is good for about half a dozen kicks and two goals a game at Box Hill. He is also a lead out forward with no real strings to his bow. He's a nice kick and a solid mark on the lead but wins no contested football and has nothing to his game that set's him apart form dozens of his type that play VFL and country football. He wont get a game at Hawthorn (or any other AFL club IMO) and will be delisted at the end of the season.
Thorp looks the goods and will surely debut in the next couple of weeks. Muston is a little way off but has something about him and Tuck would also be close. Kennedy is a monster unit and will be an intimidator in years to come and Renouf is worth persevering with. Matt Little is at the end of a very long queue.
Killeroj
12 Jul 2007, 17:47
That is correct that Little probably does need a standout game where he kicks something like 6 goals and creates some good forward pressure but from what I have seen he has had games like that and was BH leading goal kicker last year and prob close this year in a at best ordinary side... Supply is also a concern in the VFL which is attrocious at points and as a forward your only as good as your midfielders disposals... With better skills in the AFL and his lead up pace i would think that would make him more effective... He was in the best in the praccy game against Freo this year after 2 ordinary performances to get his eye in...
My point was that surely just 1 game to check him out would be wise? If thurgood gets chances what sort of a message does it send to other youngsters who are playing better such as muston?
HawksRadar
12 Jul 2007, 18:26
Thorp if fit will play before Little.
Rudi Gilham
12 Jul 2007, 19:29
I would have thought u need to get more than 4 or 5 kicks in the VFL to make the AFL... maybe its time for Little to stand up in the VFL to deserve a chance in the AFL?
Couldn't have said it better myself. What is this obsession with Matthew Little? I've seen him a couple of times this year and he's struggled at VFL level.:confused:
I'm concerned about Tom Murphy, does his job every time in the 1's. Hate to lose him but he may want a trade at season end for more oppertunity?
Thoughts
macdaddio
12 Jul 2007, 21:42
I'm concerned about Tom Murphy, does his job every time in the 1's. Hate to lose him but he may want a trade at season end for more oppertunity?
Thoughts
i was just thinking this ....
my main concern is that guys like murphy who are very good players who never get picked and then you have guys like thurgood getting a shot ....
i hope our good top talent doesnt get too dishearted and want to be traded in order to get more game time..............
good thread gary...........
HawkXNtric
12 Jul 2007, 21:50
I don't think that any first year player (ie: Thorp, Renouf, Kennedy Moss, Morton) should expect to automatically get a game in their first season. Having said that, Moss has already made his debut and showed a bit the first time around.
Even second year players such as Bailey, Tuck, Dowler & Muston have had their injury concerns and are therefore only slightly ahead of the first year players. Birchall, of course, is the exception here, while Ellis is now getting games and starting to show something.
I believe that it is the third year players we should be looking at here, with the three obvious names being Thurgood, Little and Murphy. I think that Thurgood will get his chance this next week or so to add to his senior games tally (just hope he can finally get to play in a winning team...) Little doesn't seem to be any closer to getting a game, while Murphy seems the goods but just can't break in to the team.
Murphy is the only player who I could justifiably see becoming despondent and asking to be traded.
The better the senior team, the greater the competition for spots.
This for me is one of the key ingredients of a winning culture. So if young men are given a harder path to the big show, then you would hope and to a certain degree, expect them to sacrifice everything in their power to make an impression on their teammates and the coaching staff. To actually get established in this enviroment, a player will be required to show more than talent.
The added benefit to all of this struggle is a more desperate footballer. A player who will not give up his spot without a fight. 22 of those every week and you are on the way.
Players will always get their noses outta joint. At AFL level right down to suburban level. Blokes believe they deserve a show. Sure know I did! But that is what the leadership group is there for.
You'd hope that Changa, or Luke, or our often forgotten Captain, would pull aside a Beau Dowler (for want of an example) and say "Hey mate, I know it's tough, but keep putting in. Show em on the track, earn it. I think you're close. This will all be worth it come that special day"
Talent is great. But they gotta do it the HARD WAY.
BTW, great thread. Really got me thinking.
hawkslore
13 Jul 2007, 01:36
[quote=Killeroj;
My point was that surely just 1 game to check him out would be wise? If thurgood gets chances what sort of a message does it send to other youngsters who are playing better such as muston?[/quote]
Youd think that after 3 seasons that little being a top 25 draft pick, would ave been given a game just at some point!a chance to show something!i believe the greater concern will be next year,when players like bailey,renouf,tuck,kennedy,muston,murphy,thorpe and possibly dowler,,(not sure about whether he will be a player??) are seriously ready and knocking on the door for senior selection!!if we have a good run with injuries and form next year then its going to be hard to break so many players into the side especially if they are all deserving!!so we could potentially ave a situation where there would be up to 4 or 5 players wanting to be traded due to lack of opportunity!!not really a good problem to have,or is it????:confused::confused::thumbsu: