View Full Version : What if our worst nightmare comes true?
The Old Dark Navy's
1 May 2002, 21:30
From Old Dark Navys.net
I don't mean to be a doomsayer here, but what if it happened? What if our 106th season of VFL/AFL football provided us with our first ever wooden spoon?
What would it mean for the club and the fans?
The obvious consequence for the club is the loss of a proud historical record in that Carlton is the only foundation club not to have received this most unwanted piece of 'woodenware'. It would also place a lot more question marks on the direction the club is taking in an ever changing football climate and whether the personnel at the club have what it takes to guide us out of the wilderness. Those questions exist now if we fail to win a flag every year such is the culture of success at the club, but add a wooden spoon and the peasants would be revolting and we have all seen exactly how revolting some of them can get.
For the fans, well I'll leave those with masochistic tendencies out of the equation and look at the normally well adjusted fans like myself who just happen to grow a beard and sprout fangs at the first bounce of the ball at each Blues game. Personally I am scared to death of the wooden spoon. Call it a fear of the unknown or call it a reluctance to receive the taunts and insults of opposition fans stored away in the memory banks for 106 years. Let's face it, they have all been there in one generation or another and they want us to get a taste of abject failure, to atone for the smugness of Blues fans, past and present. I'm not sure how well I can handle a century worth of abuse just looking for a way to escape. Ever since 2000 when Essendon tied Carlton for premierships won and threatened to then go on with it and take the outright lead, the fact that the wooden spoon had never found its way into our trophy cabinet was that little something extra to maintain some superiority over all of our traditional foes. Take that away and our armoury becomes a little thinner as we will be reduced to quoting almost meaningless head to head records and winning percentages. Let's face it, half the fun of being a fan is the bragging rights that go with it. Whether you be three parts 'tired and emotional' on your favourite CUB product and shouting it from the rooftops, or whether you are quiet and controlled, with a little smile and that glint in your eye that just smacks of success and annoys the bejesus out of all others, the bragging rights are there. They know it, we know it, they won't admit it, we won't let them forget it. This is something I don't feel I am ready to give up just yet.
Let's look at it all logically. What is the likelihood of it happening?
Compared to 1998 when we were last threatened by this unwanted title, it is fair to say that our injury toll is worse and our competition is better. At the start of the year, West Coast, Geelong, St Kilda, Melbourne and Fremantle all had stakes in a share of the spoon. After 5 rounds of the season, West Coast, Geelong and Melbourne are riding high in the top 8 while Fremantle has done enough to suggest they will be very competitive at all times and extremely difficult to beat on their own dunghill. Only St Kilda is still struggling but not struggling so much that they couldn't defeat Carlton in round 1 with more sidelined players than we had. We go into a round 6 encounter against the Bulldogs where the loser will see them themselves sitting stone motherless last and contemplating their end of season trip. The danger for us is that although they are yet to win a game, the Bulldogs have been far more consistent than us and have nowhere near the injury concerns. Koutoufides is still a couple of months away (maybe), Allan is already booking his end of season trip (no skiing Matty), Hulme and Hickmott will be praying to come back about the same time as Kouta (touch wood), Camporeale will miss three games and McKernan will not be on deck this week. We are relying on young or inexperienced players like Simon Wiggins, Trent Sporn, Lindsay Smith, Andrew Merrington, Ian Prendergast and Luke Livingston to be able to match it with players with more developed games and physiques, in the case of the latter quartet, in a key post. Obviously, we are going to need each and every player to be at the top of their game week in, week out to overcome such an obstacle.
Just in case we need to steadily condition ourselves for the day should it come, are there any positives to come out of it?
Well yes there is, such is the miracle of the modern day draft system. The pick of the best young player in the country for starters. And if we are particularly unfortunate, the prospect of a further priority pick in recognition of the truly pathetic teams of the competition. I might add that while most teams who find themselves in this situation really do need such benefits to have a hope in hell of escaping their predicament, this would not necessarily be the case if the Blues were to find themselves there. There is a lot of talent in this side and their ladder position has largely come about through incredibly bad luck with injury and a smattering of complacency. Going into a 2003 season with a clean injury sheet and having picked up the best young talent in the land after already successfully blooding a fistful of talented youngsters in 2002 could only mean good things for Carlton. We can also put paid to a time honoured tradition at Carlton to do whatever is necessary to plug the gaps and avoid the ultimate failure at all costs, often at the expense of building for a real assault at the preferred silverware in the not too distant future. Can we take solace in the saying that 'every cloud has a silver lining'?
As wooden spoon virgins we may well be terrified of it but once it has happened, it will never hurt as much as the first time again. With every fibre of my being I don't want it to happen, but if it does I'm determined to be ready for it, accept it as part and parcel of the game, pick up the pieces and set about supporting the club as it starts on the next phase of its existence.
The Spornstar
1 May 2002, 23:55
That was a brilliant read, Rick.
errrrr, it means you will finish last and get a top four draft pick
one season
nothing more
You will then get on with life.
ps - bragging about no wooden spoons is pointless
1st and nowhere
No offence Jars,but you don't know what it means not to win a wooden spoon.It would be devastating if we finished bottom.More devastating then having to have a holiday in Adelaide.;)
The Old Dark Navy's
2 May 2002, 21:10
Originally posted by Jars458
errrrr, it means you will finish last and get a top four draft pick
one season
nothing more
You will then get on with life.
ps - bragging about no wooden spoons is pointless
1st and nowhere That's what it means to you Jars. That's not what it means to Blues fans. It is something we are very proud of and something long time supporters of the VFL/AFL are well aware of and if you don't think they'll be lining up to have a shot should it happen, you really have no idea. You stick to understanding your club's culture, we'll stick to ours!
TheSheik
2 May 2002, 21:58
THE RULES
1. We are to never win a wooden spoon.
2. Refer to Rule 1.
It is completely unacceptable to finish last and under no circumstances is it going to be tolerated.
END OF STORY !!!!!!!!!!!!!
It just wont happen.
There is an unwritten rule somewhere, that Carlton do not "win" wooden spoons.
Too much pride at stake to let it happen.
As for finishing last to get top draft picks that is a level Collingwood sinks to, Carlton don't!
Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
That's what it means to you Jars. That's not what it means to Blues fans. It is something we are very proud of and something long time supporters of the VFL/AFL are well aware of and if you don't think they'll be lining up to have a shot should it happen, you really have no idea. You stick to understanding your club's culture, we'll stick to ours!
Its not my fault if you guys think pointless statistics and false pride mean anything
We have not won a wooden spoon either but I would take 3 wooden spoons and one flag over four second places any day.
Good luck for having that record, but really it means nothing.
If you finish 15th, only ahead of 16ht by percentage - what does that mean in real terms - bugger all.
I admit nobody wants to finish last - but it won't be the end of the world.
Just you wait and see;)
FootyBabe
3 May 2002, 11:40
We just can't win a wooden spoon!
Originally posted by Jars458
If you finish 15th, only ahead of 16ht by percentage - what does that mean in real terms - bugger all.
I admit nobody wants to finish last - but it won't be the end of the world.
Just you wait and see;)
You don't understand the "Carlton culture," Jars. Finishing last would be the worst humiliation ever.
The difference between finishing 14th or 15th compared to last is nobody will ever remember if you finish in those two positions, but finish last and everyone will remember it forever and never let you forget it either!
Originally posted by Bee
You don't understand the "Carlton culture," Jars. Finishing last would be the worst humiliation ever.
The difference between finishing 14th or 15th compared to last is nobody will ever remember if you finish in those two positions, but finish last and everyone will remember it forever and never let you forget it either!
Well Bee
its been nice knowing you
When you slit your wrists when you win the wooden spoon you shall be a huge loss.
Rest in peace;)
McAlmanac
3 May 2002, 16:50
Carlton have enough quality to avoid finishing bottom.
blues^rock
3 May 2002, 17:24
i just can't see us getting the wooden spoon... i mean, yeah we're down on luck and not looking too good at the moment... but it's not as though we're playing all that bad!
it's jsut not RIGHT for us to win the spoon... and besides, i swore i wouldn't live to see it ;)
The Old Dark Navy's
4 May 2002, 12:12
Originally posted by Jars458
Its not my fault if you guys think pointless statistics and false pride mean anything
We have not won a wooden spoon either but I would take 3 wooden spoons and one flag over four second places any day.
Good luck for having that record, but really it means nothing.
If you finish 15th, only ahead of 16ht by percentage - what does that mean in real terms - bugger all.
I admit nobody wants to finish last - but it won't be the end of the world.
Just you wait and see;) Might have some merit Jars if you guys had been in the comp for a bit longer than 12 seasons! Might also have a point if we had 0 wooden spoons and just 1 or 2 flags. But when you have a share of the flag record and bitter long term rivalries, something like never being the worst team in a given year is something that frustrates the hell out of these rivals whose team has experienced it. As you have read from almost all Blues supporters around the trap, it is not meaningless to them and that is what counts.
Funny thing, when this question was raised a while back when it wasn't a possibility, a lot of Blues fans were more set on winning flags than saving wooden spoons. As soon as the flag is out of the question, they have started worrying about the very real possibility of finishing last. Sometimes you never realise how you feel until confronted with the situation.
Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
Might have some merit Jars if you guys had been in the comp for a bit longer than 12 seasons! Might also have a point if we had 0 wooden spoons and just 1 or 2 flags. But when you have a share of the flag record and bitter long term rivalries, something like never being the worst team in a given year is something that frustrates the hell out of these rivals whose team has experienced it. As you have read from almost all Blues supporters around the trap, it is not meaningless to them and that is what counts.
Funny thing, when this question was raised a while back when it wasn't a possibility, a lot of Blues fans were more set on winning flags than saving wooden spoons. As soon as the flag is out of the question, they have started worrying about the very real possibility of finishing last. Sometimes you never realise how you feel until confronted with the situation.
Too true
Wold you believe this is the first time in four years a certain Carlton supporter known to us both has not had a carton of beer with me on who would finish higher, Carlton or Adelaide.
For what its worth - Carlton won't win the spoon. Has to be the Saints...................surely
Originally posted by Jars458
Well Bee
its been nice knowing you
When you slit your wrists when you win the wooden spoon you shall be a huge loss.
Rest in peace;)
Nah, I wouldn't go that far Jars. Nice to know you'll miss me though. :D
At least if it does happen, it will forever wipe away the humiliation of the 1993 GF loss to Essendon.
westbrom
9 May 2002, 04:54
I can only hope and pray, that somewhere in the inner sanctum at Optus Oval, there is still some of that old fashioned grit and determination. Hopefully Laps, will settle down on the grog, and Fevola will realise he needs to do a little more than kick 12 on New Years Eve. May Braddles, will prove us all wrong, and start kicking to a man, (no offense brads, you have been a champion, I just hope you do not retire too late), Maybe Hotts will grow another couple of inches, and take the ruck duties, or maybe McKernan, can learn to raise his arms at centre clearances (this is not meant as a joke), What has happened to McKernan, he used to tear us apart.
Maybe Houla can slot through a few extra, or we can CLONE MAKKA. Whatever happens, Carlton needs to find some resolve, or a miracle. Because unfortunately for all our whistle blowing, there is no doubt that the side we put out to play Essendon this weekend will be the worst side in the Competition. If you take that many starters out of any side, they would be sitting last. So either we pray for a miracle, or we pack the stadium to the rafters, and show some of the young fellas that will be out in the next few weeks, that even when faced with adversity... There will ALWAYS be blues fans lifting them. I pray for no wodden spoon as well, but this week I am going to be suppoting the fellas as they try and crush the bombers.
blues^rock
9 May 2002, 10:43
Originally posted by westbrom
or we can CLONE MAKKA.
lol... that'd be good, also we might wanna clone a few Whitnalls... one for the forward line, one for the backline... and hey! why not one in the centre ;) jsut make one that can run!!!
The Hitman
13 May 2002, 11:40
Originally posted by Jars458
Wold you believe this is the first time in four years a certain Carlton supporter known to us both has not had a carton of beer with me on who would finish higher, Carlton or Adelaide.
I'm very happy with an 'investment' I made at the end of last season. Had a bet with Meg that Hawthorn would finish above Carlton this season, and if I win she has to pay for dinner and a movie at Crown for us, and vice versa if Carlton finish above us.
Looks like Pizzahead at Crown and a movie on a Friday night, Meggles. :p ;)
The Hitman
The Hitman
13 May 2002, 11:44
Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
As wooden spoon virgins we may well be terrified of it but once it has happened, it will never hurt as much as the first time again.
That has got to be one of the funniest things I've read. Made my day Rick.
By the way, you won't get the spoon, St. Kilda will get spanked by the wood again.
The Hitman
The Spornstar
13 May 2002, 11:48
Yep that call was a pearler Rick - top stuff mate.
Originally posted by The Hitman
I'm very happy with an 'investment' I made at the end of last season. Had a bet with Meg that Hawthorn would finish above Carlton this season, and if I win she has to pay for dinner and a movie at Crown for us, and vice versa if Carlton finish above us.
Looks like Pizzahead at Crown and a movie on a Friday night, Meggles. :p ;)
The Hitman
Don't be silly Hitter, haven't you been told that Carlton supporters never pay up on their bets. Or at least take ages to do it.:rolleyes: :D
Originally posted by Bee
Don't be silly Hitter, haven't you been told that Carlton supporters never pay up on their bets. Or at least take ages to do it.:rolleyes: :D
Exaaaactly ;) :D We are so on the same wave length Bee ;)
Originally posted by meg
Exaaaactly ;) :D We are so on the same wave length Bee ;)
And anyone who has Pup in their avatar is on the same wave length as me!
Ummm, even if you have distorted him a bit.:D
The Hitman
13 May 2002, 23:12
Originally posted by meg
Exaaaactly ;) :D We are so on the same wave length Bee ;)
Now now, missy. At least when I win we'll be going somewhere classy and beautifyul. Pizzahead by the Yarra at night, sensational. You would have chosen a place on Chapel Street. Blah! :p
Anyway, you've mutilated Hulme, as if he wasn't ugly enough. :D
The Hitman
Originally posted by Bee
And anyone who has Pup in their avatar is on the same wave length as me!
Ummm, even if you have distorted him a bit.:D
;) Don't blame me... it was PiesPremiers who did it... he distorted him!
Well that's what I get for trusting a Pies supporter, even if he is a closet Carlton fan, hey PP? ;)
Wheels for P.M
15 May 2002, 05:52
I Would like Carlton to get the Spoon for a couple of reasons
1,It might stop some of your supporters being Arrogant Gits.
2,Carlton can afford to get the spoon unlike the Roos or Doggies
3,It will actually help you in the long run & I want all Victorian clubs to prosper (except the Bummers ...Death to the EFC)
The reasons Carlton deserves to get the spoon
1,Braddles was a champ but he is hindering the long term prospects by pretending to be a long term prospect.
2, YOU TRADED PORTER FOR COREY...THE WORST TRADE IN HISTORY.
3,Carlton has not studied and nurtured youngsters
The reasons Carlton won't get the Spoon
1,St Kilda
2,St Kilda
3,Grant Thomas
4,Did I say Saints?
5,Chris Grants Goal kicking
6,Kouta will come back sometime this year
7,St Kilda
The Old Dark Navy's
15 May 2002, 21:54
Originally posted by Wheels for P.M
The reasons Carlton deserves to get the spoon
1,Braddles was a champ but he is hindering the long term prospects by pretending to be a long term prospect.
How is he pretending to be a long term prospect? He is still worthy of his spot and knows his career is at the end. He doesn't claim anything else.
2, YOU TRADED PORTER FOR COREY...THE WORST TRADE IN HISTORY.We did it for a decent reason and let's face it, Ports has not done any better with the Roos. Still not decided.
3,Carlton has not studied and nurtured youngsters
We have, we just don't blood them soon enough and often they are cut without ever being given a proper chance IMO. The fact that other clubs don't recruit our outcasts would suggest that we made the right decisions.
No, I highly doubt we'd get the spoon this year, but at this rate we might be a chance! Seriously, the players themselves should know what situation they are in at this moment, and try to dig out if it and maybe salvage what's left of this season. Pride would be on the line - and I'm sure the boys have plenty of that, but pride alone cannot assure us wins week in, week out. I guess that with some of our key players returning back this year, we'll finish off strongly... but not make the finals. I'd prefer Carlton to finsih second last than 9th. Why you ask? Because we won't reach the finals anyway, and we'll get higher draft picks, avoid a wooden spoon, and start afresh for 2002, with Kouta firing. ;)
That way, the players would understand why finishing poorly in a season is not in Carlton's agenda.
The Old Dark Navy's
15 May 2002, 23:44
Originally posted by Thrawn
we'll get higher draft picks, avoid a wooden spoon, and start afresh for 2002, with Kouta firing. ;)When you are through with your time machine Thrawn, can I borrow it?;D
Wheels for P.M
16 May 2002, 03:29
Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
[B]You dont need Braddles ,Yes hes good enough to be out there on the field ,BUT that doesnt mean he should be
How is he pretending to be a long term prospect? He is still worthy of his spot and knows his career is at the end. He doesn't claim anything else.
champions should retire on top. Bradley has achieved everything he was ever going to at Carlton(and thats a hell of a lot)last year, Carlton needs to rebuilt and hes taking up a spot a Kid could be learning in.
Now didnt you say you didnt blood enough kids
We have, we just don't blood them soon enough and often they are cut without ever being given a proper chance IMO. The fact that other clubs don't recruit our outcasts would suggest that we made the right decisions.
WHY dont you blood them soon enough? Because of Room.
I said previously Carlton didnt study and nurture kids
If others clubs dont want your outcasts you shouldnt have gotten them in the first place.Whats wrong with your recruiters?
Wheels for P.M
16 May 2002, 03:34
Porter will come good at the Roos ,
Corey wont come good anywhere hes a hack.
For christsakes Dennis Pagan gave up on the guy ,that is a very damning indictment indeed.
Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
When you are through with your time machine Thrawn, can I borrow it?;D
Alright. ;) Darn time machine calculated 2002 instead of 2003. Oh well, nothing's perfect.
The Old Dark Navy's
16 May 2002, 20:48
Originally posted by Wheels for P.M
Porter will come good at the Roos ,
Corey wont come good anywhere hes a hack.
How can I forget something that hasn't happened yet?:confused:
Wheels for P.M
17 May 2002, 03:25
Sorry mate I forgot the corey bit & some punctuation.
Anyway good luck on the W/E
Collingwood were once the proudest club, and entering the 1976 season had also never won a wooden spoon.
After "winning" the spoon in 1976, the Pies finished on top of the ladder in 1977, and played in the '79, '80, and '81 Grand Finals.
Sure, they havn't done much since '81, but overall, I don't think their first wooden spoon in 1976 ruined their culture. Their intial response, five years after 1976 was fantastic. Collingwood's culture was ruined in the yars after 1981, when the club began a slow slide into mediocrity.
You've got to rememebr Blues fans, that, presuming the AFL never dies, and the competiton continues forever, it is inevitable you will win the spoon at some point. Maybe not this year, maybe not in 50 years time, but at some point it will happen.
sainter
17 May 2002, 04:28
Wooden spoons? :eek:
My specialty! ;)
I do take exception to Dan seemingly measuring how proud a team is by virtue of how many (or lack of) wooden spoons they have won.
I admire the way my club has been to hell and back and had to fight through adversity many times. In 1897 we entered the competition behind the eight-ball and won 6 consecutive wooden spoons, not even winning our first game until 1900.
At the end of the day it is about winning and losing. I realise that. I also understand that the rivalry that Carlton have with Collingwood and Essendon goes very deep.
Just remember that winning a wooden spoon doesn't make your club any less proud. It's the way your club (and the supporters) deal with it that defines how proud (and great) a club is.
I have no doubt Carlton will improve as you get your key players back into the side. We are in a similar situation where if we have a bit of luck injury wise over the next month could be close to full strength by round 12 or 13. There are quite a few teams on the ladder that could easily be sucked back into a battle to avoid the wooden spoon. If we can avoid it, that will be great. If not, life goes on.
PS - Very good post ODN. It's interesting to read the thoughts of yourself and fellow blues supporters on what winning a wooden spoon would mean to both yourselves and your club. I think it's a misnomer that Saints fans simply accept mediocrity but the differences between our clubs are massive.
The Old Dark Navy's
21 May 2002, 21:32
Originally posted by sainter
PS - Very good post ODN. It's interesting to read the thoughts of yourself and fellow blues supporters on what winning a wooden spoon would mean to both yourselves and your club. I think it's a misnomer that Saints fans simply accept mediocrity but the differences between our clubs are massive. I wouldn't imagine you would ever accept it Sainter but you must surely become a bit more blase about it the more it happens? Once we get our first spoon out of the way, I'm sure my whole mindset will change.