match ups for saturday night [Archive]

saints

18 Jul 2007, 16:28

Franklin could be trouble. Goose is well underdone still. Gilbert might be an option, I believe. I would love to see Gilbo on Franklin and Goose on Roughead.

Start Goose on him and tell him to rough him up a bit. Test the young fella out. I really think this is a chance to go head to head with there midfield and see where we are at. Of course Dal will get tagged but the rest wont.

I would expect matchups to be

Roo v Brown
G-Train v Croad
Kosi/Rix v Taylor/Campbell
Goose v Franklin
Maxxy v Roughhead
Dal v Sewell
Baker v Mitchell

I think everyone else may be left to run with who they line up on.

Oh When the Saints

18 Jul 2007, 16:33

I think:

S. Fisher vs. Franklin
L. Fisher vs. Dixon
M. Maguire vs. Roughead
Ball vs. Mitchell
Attard vs. Hodge
Baker vs. Crawford

Emmo

18 Jul 2007, 16:34

Start Goose on him and tell him to rough him up a bit. Test the young fella out. I really think this is a chance to go head to head with there midfield and see where we are at. Of course Dal will get tagged but the rest wont.

I would expect matchups to be

Roo v Brown
G-Train v Croad
Kosi/Rix v Taylor/Campbell
Goose v Franklin
Maxxy v Roughhead
Dal v Sewell
Baker v Mitchell

I think everyone else may be left to run with who they line up on.

yeah i reccon your right here some pretty even match ups though i wouldn't be supprised if sewell holds dal pretty well. very under rated player.

Harvey's Crew

18 Jul 2007, 17:59

POSSIBLE MATCHUPS:

Riewoldt vs Brown but Birchall/loose defender to cut his leads off

Gehrig vs Gilham or Croad

Dal Santo vs Sewell

Harvey vs Crawford (Shane said he wants to play on him)

Ball or Attard vs Hodge

Baker vs Mitchell

S.Fisher vs Franklin but L.Fisher/Gram to cut his leads off

Maguire vs Roughead

Roughie

18 Jul 2007, 21:34

Are you guys going to mark up our forward flanks who play up field? Or do you think Lyon will try play again with two loose in defence?

mulhollanddrive

18 Jul 2007, 23:19

Essendon tried to rough up Franklin, Fletcher/McPhee/Michael. Kept him goaless in the first quarter doing this, kicked 9 in 3 quarters later.

Also Collingwood tried this, he kicked 4.

Just because he's young and isnt considered a body player, doesnt mean any physical stuff is going to bother him.

That's deliberate

18 Jul 2007, 23:43

hawthorn by 54 points ....and then some

Kildonan

19 Jul 2007, 02:04

The Saints were seriously undermanned last time we played Hawthorn.
Despite this, the Hawks played an ultradefensive style of play which forced the Saints to do likewise or be left with an overcrowded forward line.

ST KILDA
B: Gwilt, S.Fisher, L.Fisher
HB: Attard, Blake, Gilbert
C: Milne, Ball, Birss
HF: Harvey, Riewoldt, Fiora
F: Voss, Gehrig, Koschitzke
FOLL: Rix, Montagna, Dal Santo
I/C: B Brooks, D Armitage, J Sweeney, B Howard
EM: Howard, Hudghton, Sweeney
IN: B Brooks, D Armitage, J Sweeney, B Howard
OUT: Goddard (knee), Jones (collar bone), X Clarke (virus), J Gram (virus)

With a better list available, the Saints will be able to play this match much more to their own liking. This is a match where Ross Lyon will be critically evaluated on. He has seen the Hawks game in action. He has been doing plenty of work regarding tactical assessment and devising a gameplan to counter the Hawks new game. If the Saints are unable to counter the Hawks and beat them, it will bode poorly on Lyon - in my and other's assessment of him.

To try and simplify this game into starting matchups would be like placing a great importance on which pawn is moved first in a championship chess match. Sometimes the "development" of the pieces is relational to the ultimate goal without necessarily depending on specific pieces.

So far it is one - love to Clarkson. I expect the slate will be evened out Saturday night, but there may well be many great tussles between our two clubs in the near future.

Roughie

19 Jul 2007, 03:34

The Saints were seriously undermanned last time we played Hawthorn.
Despite this, the Hawks played an ultradefensive style of play which forced the Saints to do likewise or be left with an overcrowded forward line.
.

All season we have played 4 men in our forward 50 in a box set up, with our flankers coming off the wing or behind the square, ussually found in McGlynn, Young, Crawford or Ladson. And every game bar the Saints game they have been manned up. When we have the two flankers up field they dont sit in the defensive 50, they help carry the ball on the rebound. You were the ones who left your men sitting in your defensive 50 not us.

We some times play with one man loose in either Guerra, Ladson or DJ. You saw what happened last time the gates were opened, you were trying to stop it from happening. I hope this game can be free flowing as I think your team has played well over the last few weeks and are really fighting for a finals spot.

ShadowFax

19 Jul 2007, 10:45

I believe the most important match-up for saturday night is who plays on Buddy. Sam Fisher is the best man for the saints to line-up up on him (he did a very good job on him last time). However, the saints will be keen to keep him as a loose and/or running HB. Interesting to see how that one plays out.

Having said that this game, like about 75% of all games, will be won in the midfield. Both sides have formidable forward lines.

hitdatarget

19 Jul 2007, 11:00

Let's all hope supercoach Rocket Ross can have us playing an attacking brand of footy rather than the Sydney rugby style that he has unsuccessfully tried to instal for much of this season.
Yes, be accountable for your opponent, but our strength is there for all to see. Tall strong forward set up. The quivker and delivery the better.

The Punter

19 Jul 2007, 11:43

Goose ain't going near Franklin. It'll be Sam Fisher. That means Gram has to step up his run from half-back. Goose will take Roughead, with Thorp to be the wildcard for the Hawks, as he may get a smaller opponent in Gram or Leigh Fisher, or perhaps Sam Gilbert.

In the midfield Sewell will tag Dal Santo, and Baker should go to Mitchell. Ball may go to Hodge, leaving Montagna on Lewis and Harvey on Crawford.

Hedgehodgy

19 Jul 2007, 13:09

Do you guys think Lyon will play that extremely ugly game he employed last time because you were undermanned and wanted an honourable loss?

Persevering Saint

19 Jul 2007, 13:30

Do you guys think Lyon will play that extremely ugly game he employed last time because you were undermanned and wanted an honourable loss?

Never going to happen, for at least three reasons. One, because he did it amid major injury problems, and we're not nearly as bad-off there now; Two, because an honorable loss won't get us into the finals - we need to, and indeed OUGHT to, win it; Three, because that gameplan was an embarrassment to our club, to the players, and above all to him as coach. Lyon is too good a coach to let that game stick in people's minds for long, and a thumping, high-scoring 40 point win against the same side will go a long way to erasing it from people's memory.

Get ready for a blitz from the boys this week. They're gonna be on. Really on.

Coathanger

19 Jul 2007, 14:33

I really hope for both sets of supporters this is a high scoring belter
of a game. With 117% it will hardly be the Hawks who drag this game down again. I really do think you guys will choke this game again,as it's your only hope of a win. Look what Adelaide & Sydney did to us with success,the two ugliest brand of footballing teams this season.

Win ugly or don't win at all,will be your only chance this week.

Rowie09

19 Jul 2007, 16:29

I have a distinct feeling this match is going to a belter from the first bounce a-la Hawthorn V Collingwood a few weeks ago.

Expect some serious gut running and tag shaking, as well as some terriffic skills.

Both sides are going to come out blazing, contrary to the mess that was served up earlier in the year.

Really hope Crawford and Harvey go head to head.

Falchoon

19 Jul 2007, 16:39

any chance Blake on Franklin?

Maguire seems ideally suited to Roughead

JezzHawk

19 Jul 2007, 18:39

any chance Blake on Franklin?

Maguire seems ideally suited to Roughead

I think your right here. Maguire to Roughead. As for Franklin, you will need a run with player. Sam Fisher IMO.

This will be a great game of 2 modern day coaches. There will be bluffs, tempo, kick it long, hard running, etc....

I think the fitest team will win.

Hawks by 1pt.

mulhollanddrive

19 Jul 2007, 21:14

Hughston is back in for you guys. Thats a huge in if he's fit.

Hughston, Fisher, Mcguire, Blake have our talls covered for match ups, and could even allow Fisher to play loose or 4th tall.

Thats dangerous for us.

ChrisL#12

19 Jul 2007, 21:59

any chance Blake on Franklin?

Maguire seems ideally suited to Roughead

Blake on Franklin! Surely not. We would like to win the game.

saints_rule23

19 Jul 2007, 22:06

I reckon Gilbert on Franklin saw him play on him last year in the
VFL an reckon Gilbert beat him on that day
So give him another shot i reckon...

BigAl3001

19 Jul 2007, 23:38

I reckon Gilbert on Franklin saw him play on him last year in the
VFL an reckon Gilbert beat him on that day
So give him another shot i reckon...

Yes Please!

BudddddyLove

20 Jul 2007, 01:26

St DAC

20 Jul 2007, 08:38

On paper you would say hawthorn by about 7 or 8 goals and if both teams play to their potential then this should be the result. However if Lyon brings out his Plan A of flood at all costs and choke the game up it could come down to the wire and then could go either way.

Only if that paper is the one you're using to roll a doobie. :rolleyes:

Should be a close game. Hawks a bit quicker, Saints a bit bigger. Midfield will decide it.

Persevering Saint

20 Jul 2007, 14:35

Strangely, 67% Age experts are picking Saints - I reckon we'll win, but I still think that we're the underdogs, so that surprised me.

My hunch is that Maxy won't play, and that it's Lyon blowing smoke. I think Max is another week away. That means that he'll be replaced with the emergency defender - either Raph Clarke or Ferguson. If so, which one's your bet? I think Raph, because he's been picked ahead of Ferguson all year, and Lyon's trying to build more stability... although from all reports Ferguson's been playing some terrific backline footy recently for the Scorps.

The other million dollar question I think is Birss: was last week just a flash in the pan, or can he carry it into the next week. If he plays like last week, that's gonna go some way to winning it for us, but if he plays like he CAN play... ugghhhh....:(

Go The Hawks

20 Jul 2007, 14:49

Just wondering what sort of DUDS the Saints are going to pull out to play on the Roughie, Buddy Love, Crawf, Mitchell, Lewis, Hodgy, Sewell etc.

The only certainly is that Croady will towel up the Roo and Buddy love will kick St Kilda's season into next year!!!!!!!

BigAl3001

20 Jul 2007, 16:24

All season we have played 4 men in our forward 50 in a box set up, with our flankers coming off the wing or behind the square, ussually found in McGlynn, Young, Crawford or Ladson. And every game bar the Saints game they have been manned up. When we have the two flankers up field they dont sit in the defensive 50, they help carry the ball on the rebound. You were the ones who left your men sitting in your defensive 50 not us.

We some times play with one man loose in either Guerra, Ladson or DJ. You saw what happened last time the gates were opened, you were trying to stop it from happening. I hope this game can be free flowing as I think your team has played well over the last few weeks and are really fighting for a finals spot.

Absolutely spot on. I cannot believe they're still trying to pin it onto us.

sainter_girl

20 Jul 2007, 17:00

rumblah

20 Jul 2007, 19:43

I think:

S. Fisher vs. Franklin
L. Fisher vs. Dixon
M. Maguire vs. Roughead
Ball vs. Mitchell
Attard vs. Hodge
Baker vs. Crawford

would love to see that. Love them both

Attard on Hodge could work for us.

Bourky23

20 Jul 2007, 20:12

would love to see that. Love them both

Attard on Hodge could work for us.

your not giving attard enough respect.. hodgey is a star don't get me wrong... but a lot of players have struggled to shake jaydn all year he has been great

Hawkk

20 Jul 2007, 20:28

whilst we won't deny that we played defensive in that game, you can not claim hawks didn't reciprocrate. Both teams flooded.

Hope Max plays, really hope we win - the cockiness of the hawks supporters is quite amusing. Was at the Richmond vs Hawks game last week .... their skills weren't THAT great & I think our defence / midfield is a little stronger than the Tigers at the minute ....

Perhaps, but they are still the most efficient side in the league by foot.

Personally I think this is the game we will drop, with a reasonable run home the St Kilda and Sydney bookend games stand out like a beacon. This is a crucial game for our top 2 chances, win one of the bookend games and we are in an extremely strong position to secure a top 2 finish…lose both and we are well and truly in the scrap to make the top 4.

Don't underestimate that performance against the Tigers either - the Tigers 2nd heaviest defeat for the season. From memory, St Kilda too found it very difficult to shake off the Tigers. Richmond’s position doesn’t do their general play justice.

Vaul Darkhour

20 Jul 2007, 23:12

seriously I think some Hawks supporters are acting just a little ****y..

St Kilda is a much better version then the earlier matchup... 8pt game this one is and I see us trying to blow the hell out of the hawks... expect our forward line to go ballistic...

Hawkk

21 Jul 2007, 00:00

]
St Kilda is a much better version then the earlier matchup... 8pt game this one is and I see us trying to blow the hell out of the hawks... expect our forward line to go ballistic...

You don't think Hawthorn have improved either?

I think the Saints are a very, very good value bet, but if you win you won't 'blow us out of the water.' As has been mentioned both sides will probably struggle with the rivals forward line, the game will be won in the midfield.

Some Hawk fans may not be giving the Saints credit, but on the flipside alot of Saints aren't giving the 2nd placed Hawthorn alot of respect either - a position earnt having played every side once...respect works both ways.

Vaul Darkhour

21 Jul 2007, 00:06

You don't think Hawthorn have improved either?

I think the Saints are a very, very good value bet, but if you win you won't 'blow us out of the water.' As has been mentioned both sides will probably struggle with the rivals forward line, the game will be won in the midfield.

Some Hawk fans may not be giving the Saints credit, but on the flipside alot of Saints aren't giving the 2nd placed Hawthorn alot of respect either - a position earnt having played every side once...respect works both ways.

I dont see a lot of St Kilda supporters giving disrespect...

Kildonan

21 Jul 2007, 01:10

I dont see a lot of St Kilda supporters giving disrespect...

No - and I have been forced to delete one or two Hawthorn supporter's posts - whilst I note that the Saints posting on the Hawks board have been quite respectful there.

We are not going to kowtow to the Hawks after a single victory against an injury depleted Saints. We hold the wood on you over the recent past. The fact is that the Hawks have improved, we really don't know how much yet until they play a decent St Kilda line up.

I believe that our line up is a much improved one. We still will miss Goddard - his foot skills were a significant driving force for us, and we have almost given up on Hamill. Also we are still shy a genuine ruckman. But no team is perfect - and injuries are part of the reality of any sport. I'm sure there are one or two players you feel it would be nice to have available too.

The way many of you young Hawk upstarts are going on, you'd swear that you had twenty wins over us on the trot coming into this match. If the players feel even remotely that cocky then they are in for a very rude shock.

philhawk

21 Jul 2007, 01:34

No - and I have been forced to delete one or two Hawthorn supporter's posts - whilst I note that the Saints posting on the Hawks board have been quite respectful there.

Unfortunately, we've also had to delete some 'enthusiastic' posts from Saints fans, StKildonan - it just comes down to fans being passionate for this weekends match.

Whilst you'll find most Hawthorn fans aknowledge that the Saints have the wood over us in recent memory, our decent year this year has excited alot of Hawk fans (including myself), after so many years down in the doldrums.

I think that at the end of the day, Saints fans shouldn't see over-confidence on the part of Hawk fans as cocky, but rather a belief in their teams ability.

As you touched upon in another thread, it should be a great match and hopefully the beginning of a good rivalry.

Delisted

21 Jul 2007, 01:59

Saints will field one of there better teams for a couple of seasons. Weather or not they can gel and play to that potential will be the biggest factor. I'm not confident, its going to be a battle of the midfield.

brookers#5

21 Jul 2007, 02:53

your not giving attard enough respect.. hodgey is a star don't get me wrong... but a lot of players have struggled to shake jaydn all year he has been great
Attard is a very good tagger but will he be able to go with hodge in the air down forward?

Hawkk

21 Jul 2007, 03:13

No - and I have been forced to delete one or two Hawthorn supporter's posts - whilst I note that the Saints posting on the Hawks board have been quite respectful there.

We are not going to kowtow to the Hawks after a single victory against an injury depleted Saints. We hold the wood on you over the recent past. The fact is that the Hawks have improved, we really don't know how much yet until they play a decent St Kilda line up.

What made round 8 such a poor spectacle was the fact that both clubs played well below their best. If Hawthorn turned up to play - ala. West Coast and Port in rounds 9 and 10, it would have been a much higher standard game...ditto St Kilda, it was a game that neither side truely deserved to win.

Win or loss, I don't think we really have much to prove today. Sure a win would be terrific - and would all but cement a top 4 (perhaps top 2?) spot, but our consistency thus far justifies our improvement. Win or loss, we’ve improved a hell of a lot.

The only true reflection of where every side sits in the competition is after 15 rounds.

I believe that our line up is a much improved one. We still will miss Goddard - his foot skills were a significant driving force for us, and we have almost given up on Hamill. Also we are still shy a genuine ruckman. But no team is perfect - and injuries are part of the reality of any sport. I'm sure there are one or two players you feel it would be nice to have available too.

The way many of you young Hawk upstarts are going on, you'd swear that you had twenty wins over us on the trot coming into this match. If the players feel even remotely that cocky then they are in for a very rude shock.

In fairness, wouldn't you be ecstatic if you had the youngest list in the game, sat second - after beating 6/7 of the current top 8, with room for improvement...whether or not its over the top is debatable, but given the last decade, its a pretty exciting time for supporters.

To be honest I think this game – along with the Sydney game in round 22, are the two games we are most likely going to drop in the run home. Fortunately due to percentage and a few upsets over the last few weeks, we should still hold onto 2nd/3rd regardless of the result, limiting the damage of a potential loss. But its a game I'm not very confident of winning at all to be honest.

Kildonan

21 Jul 2007, 04:12

In fairness, wouldn't you be ecstatic if you had the youngest list in the game, sat second - after beating 6/7 of the current top 8, with room for improvement...whether or not its over the top is debatable, but given the last decade, its a pretty exciting time for supporters.

2004 - Saints won the preseason cup then remained undefeated for the first 10 matches of the season. I know where you are coming from as far as "enthusiasm" is concerned. What happened to us that season is we fell 6 points shy of a grand final berth - with a team full of kids and an exciting entertaining style of play.

Other clubs found us out though. Our game-plan was targetted and once one team was successful in negating it, all the league teams copied the successful gambit. This is the nature of the league - you will find this applies to you too. It is like evolution. Tactics evolve to counter successful gameplans.

Beautiful free flowing gameplans are countered by boring possession style "tempo football". Port found you out not long ago - but their approach doesn't suit us - so we'll find a different way to negate your game. Meanwhile we'll play our own style (no-one knows what that is yet - not even us) to suit our personnel - and force you to be reactive.

Swings and roundabouts.

SA HAWK

21 Jul 2007, 12:45

2004 - Saints won the preseason cup then remained undefeated for the first 10 matches of the season. I know where you are coming from as far as "enthusiasm" is concerned. What happened to us that season is we fell 6 points shy of a grand final berth - with a team full of kids and an exciting entertaining style of play.

Other clubs found us out though. Our game-plan was targetted and once one team was successful in negating it, all the league teams copied the successful gambit. This is the nature of the league - you will find applies to you too. It is like evolution. Tactics evolve to counter successful gameplans.

Beautiful free flowing gameplans are countered by boring possession style "tempo football". Port found you out not long ago - but their approach doesn't suit us - so we'll find a different way to negate your game. Meanwhile we'll play our own style (no-one knows what that is yet - not even us) to suit our personnel - and force you to be reactive.

Swings and roundabouts.Even if you win you will not play finals this year.

You blew your chance to win a flag in 04-05 and now your premiership window is slammed shut where ours is just about to open and should remain open for 3 or 4 years if we can keep the team together.

Still a bit of improvement left in us yet still a fair few of our players are inexperienced or still young.

Should be a close game tonight but i think we will outrun you and win by a few goals. May the best team on the night win.

Hawkk

21 Jul 2007, 12:55

2004 - Saints won the preseason cup then remained undefeated for the first 10 matches of the season. I know where you are coming from as far as "enthusiasm" is concerned. What happened to us that season is we fell 6 points shy of a grand final berth - with a team full of kids and an exciting entertaining style of play.

Other clubs found us out though. Our game-plan was targetted and once one team was successful in negating it, all the league teams copied the successful gambit. This is the nature of the league - you will find applies to you too. It is like evolution. Tactics evolve to counter successful gameplans.

Beautiful free flowing gameplans are countered by boring possession style "tempo football". Port found you out not long ago - but their approach doesn't suit us - so we'll find a different way to negate your game. Meanwhile we'll play our own style (no-one knows what that is yet - not even us) to suit our personnel - and force you to be reactive.

Swings and roundabouts.

I agree, but after several years of disappointment you can understand why some fans may go over the top with their confidence.

Anyway, here is to a competitive, exciting match tonight.

Bourky23

21 Jul 2007, 12:58

Attard is a very good tagger but will he be able to go with hodge in the air down forward?

if he does play on him i have every confidence in him doing the job well. i personally don't rekon that many small players will be taking marks in the foward 50's tonight it'll be the big men taking the grabs down there. but if hodge gets the better of him then i wouldn't be suprised, hodge is a very good player and a lot stronger over head (and it'll help my dreamteam if he plays well:p). i could pose a similar question to yourself... do u rekon ur backmen will be able to compete with kozi and roo in the air in our foward line?