View Full Version : UFC 75 - Rampage v Henderson
UFC 75: SEPTEMBER 8, 2007 IN LONDON, ENGLAND
Main Card Bouts:
-Quinton Jackson (#2 Light Heavyweight in the World)* vs. Dan Henderson (#4 Light Heavyweight in the World)*
-Mirko Cro Cop (#3 Heavyweight in the World)* vs. Cheick Kongo
-Michael Bisping vs. Matt Hamill
-Houston Alexander vs. Alessio Sakara
-Paul Taylor vs. Marcus Davis
Preliminary Bouts:
-Thiago Silva vs. Tomasz Drwal
-Naoyuki Kotani vs. Dennis Siver
-Anthony Torres vs. Jess Liaudin
-Gleison Tibau vs. Terry Etim
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What i'd like to know is where does main event get off on charging $39.95 for a PPV that airs at 5am in the morning!
Cro Cop fight will be very interesting, Kongo is a big guy with good reach and decent muai thai, and after CC's last effort he may have lost that aura of invincibility.
Tipping Rampage to KO Henderson in the 3rd.
Henderson via G&P with in the first round.
Presti_is_god
3 Sep 2007, 16:35
Hendo by U-Decision i think.
I'm also looking forward to Bisping V Hammill. They never got to throw down on TUF and you could see that Bisping was itching for it.
I'm thinking Henderson by decision as well. He's never been knocked out and Rampage won't catch him in an armbar like the Nogueiras did.
Yeah, Henderson for me by decision or gnp, but Rampage might also catch him early and get a knock out. If it goes longer than 2 rounds hendo should have it.
It is a tough one to pick, but my gut says hendo.
Hamill vs Bisping should also be a good one, but I reckon the count will get the win via knock out or ground and pound.
Christ - it's this weekend! SWEET :D
Cro Cop got owned, there's no way in hell he can mix it with the UFC heavyweight division he's too small he's one dimensional and he doesn't have the invincibility aura in UFC that he had in Pride. Randy would destroy him.
Doesn't bode well for Fedor i reckon. He's not overly big either. I think both of them should drop to 205 and take on Shogun and Rampage.
crowm dome
10 Sep 2007, 16:44
Cro Cop got owned, there's no way in hell he can mix it with the UFC heavyweight division he's too small he's one dimensional and he doesn't have the invincibility aura in UFC that he had in Pride. Randy would destroy him.
Doesn't bode well for Fedor i reckon. He's not overly big either. I think both of them should drop to 205 and take on Shogun and Rampage.
Cro cop looks to be only in it for the dollars now. He signed a 4 fight deal worth decent cabbage with the UFC and since then has publicly announced that he is going to stop fighting after that deal expired.....Well it appears he stopped fighting before the Eddie Sanchez fight because since then all his efforts have looked half hearted.
Can't say I agree on Fedor trying to drop a weight class. He has successfully beaten heavier opponents than himself, much like Randy who is also considered a small heavyweight.
All in all it has been a bit of a mixed bag with the Pride fighters who have competed in the UFC over the last 12 months. For every success such as A. Silva, Q. Jackson etc there has been equal dissapointment (when compared to expectation) from the likes of Cro Cop, Herring. I guess this just shows the strength of MMA at the moment, which at the end of the day makes it exciting for us...the fans!!
Apparently Cro Cop broke one of his ribs in the first round and you could argue that Kongo should have lost a point for the repeated ball shots but Mirko looked terrible in there - very tentative and too easily pushed up against the cage by the bigger opponent. It didn't help that the UFC didn't feed him an undersized Japanese can like PRIDE did after he was knocked out.
Great fight from Rampage though, looking forward to seeing if he's improved his knee defence enough to beat Shogun next.
Bisping was fortunate to get the judges' decision and then came off as a complete dick in his victory speech, so much so that even some of the hometown crowd were booing him. I'd love to see them throw him in there with Houston Alexander now.
Bisping was fortunate to get the judges' decision and then came off as a complete dick in his victory speech, so much so that even some of the hometown crowd were booing him. I'd love to see them throw him in there with Houston Alexander now.
Mate that's an understatement, i went to the UG before and they're calling out rogan for the d#ck tuck because he didn't say on air that peoples was a corrupt pos (or whatever). I didn't write it above but i too was disgusted with that decision it was blatant wrong and i think everyone knows it.
UFC 76 looks lame with Liddell headlining against Jardine, I'm much more looking forward to shogun. By the way do you guys reckon it's the steroid testing that is f#cking the ex-pride guys now?
Cro Cop got owned, there's no way in hell he can mix it with the UFC heavyweight division he's too small he's one dimensional and he doesn't have the invincibility aura in UFC that he had in Pride. Randy would destroy him.
Doesn't bode well for Fedor i reckon. He's not overly big either. I think both of them should drop to 205 and take on Shogun and Rampage.
Fedor would beat anyone in the HW division. Randy, Nog, Barnett, anyone. The only thing going against him is NSAC's restricted rules that the UFC abide by. Even then I think Fedor is a step above - and I'm Randy's #1 fan so I'm not biased. Most serious MMA fans acknowledge that Fedor's is thoughoughly deserving of the spot at the top of the sport so saying that "it doesn't bode well" for him is rubbish. He really just needs to get in there and fight. Dana needs to do whatever it takes to sign his ass :)
Cro Cop has not been the same fighter since coming to UFC. He seems way too tentative and just sloooow... very different to his pride days. Agreed that he is too one dimensional, a bit like Chuck Liddell IMO. I think he should probably compete at 205. If he even wants to fight at all. He just doesn't look like he's really trying. A real pity.
Bisping was lucky to be awarded the victory who I thought should have gone to Hamill. I actually used to like the count but he acted like a full tosser post fight and Hamill was respectful and took it like a man. He should drop to 185 where he'd have more of a chance. Hamill looked a much better fighter since appearing in TUF #3.
Henderson and Jackson was just an awesome fight. Nothing much else needs to be said, it was a very close fight that showed how damn good both are. Henderson could very well compete at 185 and rip that division up. Rampage looked very very good and impressed me with his cardio which was better than Dans.
Houston Alexander also looked very impressive.
Overall a great UFC. Cant wait to see shogun at 76!
/edit - I also thought it was cool that Big John referred to both fighters as "Champions" rather than champion and challenger :)
Fedor would beat anyone in the HW division. Randy, Nog, Barnett, anyone. The only thing going against him is NSAC's restricted rules that the UFC abide by. Even then I think Fedor is a step above - and I'm Randy's #1 fan so I'm not biased. Most serious MMA fans acknowledge that Fedor's is thoughoughly deserving of the spot at the top of the sport so saying that "it doesn't bode well" for him is rubbish. He really just needs to get in there and fight. Dana needs to do whatever it takes to sign his ass :)
I do not agree with this. :)
I suspect pride wasn't as good as people thought it was, and Fedor is a dwarf who fought against cans in pride. CC has been shown up as an inferior fighter to the UFC boys, dont tell me he's not interested he's just not good enough, not big enough not strong enough. I am also starting to strongly suspect pride was rife with steroids which i think warped the results.
I do not agree with this. :)
I suspect pride wasn't as good as people thought it was, and Fedor is a dwarf who fought against cans in pride. CC has been shown up as an inferior fighter to the UFC boys, dont tell me he's not interested he's just not good enough, not big enough not strong enough. I am also starting to strongly suspect pride was rife with steroids which i think warped the results.
Fedor > UFC.
Cameron_K
10 Sep 2007, 22:12
The decision against Hamill was disgraceful and the reaction of Bisping was just as bad. How in the hell 2 judges gave that 2nd round to Bisping I will never know. Yes you shouldn't leave it to the judges but c'mon. Decisions like that, especially hometown ones are the reason in which boxing has declined in my opinion. I'm still amazed and disgusted in the result. If I was Dana I would book Hamill v Bisping in America again straight away.
My respect for Matt increased ten fold :thumbsu:
I do not agree with this. :)
I suspect pride wasn't as good as people thought it was, and Fedor is a dwarf who fought against cans in pride. CC has been shown up as an inferior fighter to the UFC boys, dont tell me he's not interested he's just not good enough, not big enough not strong enough. I am also starting to strongly suspect pride was rife with steroids which i think warped the results.
C'Mon, you're just biased against any Pride fighters and PrideFC in general. I don't know how you got such a chip on your shoulder.
What did you think when Rampage KO'd Liddell? Did it shock you? It certainly didn't me... why the dislike for any ex. Pride fighters? this is MMA not UFC vs Pride... those days are long gone. The UFC's 185 and 205 titles are both held by ex Pride guys. They are now UFC guys... are you secretly hoping Shogun loses just so you can go on thinking UFC > Pride? I think its time you got over the Pride vs UFC thing.
The only Pride guy that hasn't succeeded in the UFC is CC. Others such as Rampage, Henderson and Silva have all shown they are top tier. Nogeira should also do pretty darn well in HW.
Saying stuff like "Fedor is a dwarf that only fought cans" is just ludicrous. Thats MMA noob stuff... I'll forgive you for just being totally UFC one eyed though.
Why do you suspect Pride was rife with roids? And how would this "warp" the results if everyone was on them?
Anyway, seeing I have no allegiance to either organisation at least I can see things with an unbiased eye.
C'Mon, you're just biased against any Pride fighters and PrideFC in general. I don't know how you got such a chip on your shoulder.
What did you think when Rampage KO'd Liddell? Did it shock you? It certainly didn't me... why the dislike for any ex. Pride fighters? this is MMA not UFC vs Pride... those days are long gone. The UFC's 185 and 205 titles are both held by ex Pride guys. They are now UFC guys... are you secretly hoping Shogun loses just so you can go on thinking UFC > Pride? I think its time you got over the Pride vs UFC thing.
The only Pride guy that hasn't succeeded in the UFC is CC. Others such as Rampage, Henderson and Silva have all shown they are top tier. Nogeira should also do pretty darn well in HW.
Saying stuff like "Fedor is a dwarf that only fought cans" is just ludicrous. Thats MMA noob stuff... I'll forgive you for just being totally UFC one eyed though.
Why do you suspect Pride was rife with roids? And how would this "warp" the results if everyone was on them?
Anyway, seeing I have no allegiance to either organisation at least I can see things with an unbiased eye.I suspect pride was rife with roids because they never tested for them, but not sure if everyone was on them. And it's not that I think all of pride was shit it's more like I don't blindly think fedor nog cc and barnett were 1234 in the world, like the pro-pride guys do. i'm mainly directing my comments that way.
also it wasn't long ago the pride people thought gomi was unbeatable and would wipe the floor with any ufc guy, then he got beat by diaz.
I hate that blind pride is best on every level attitude. and re fedor the dwarf bit was just me being stupid but seriously he's only 6ft for example how's he going to handle the much bigger gonzaga on the ground? randy aint that big but he's got a couple of inches on fedor I just can't see fedor dominating at all. as long as people aren't overawed by his rep I think he's definitely beatable.
and no cans? mate the guy has fought 1 top level hw in 3yrs I don't get it, if it aint bullsh*t aura then what in heavens name has him ranked #1 fighter in the world?
re shogun rampage henderson they are all great fighters and have shown that the ufc lhw div used to be comparitively weak. seems to be not the case with the other divisions though.
What did you think when Rampage KO'd Liddell? Did it shock you?
Shocked me that it happened so quickly, but he'd beaten Chuck before so not entirely surprised. I admit i'm a bit of a chuck fan though. That chuck Wandy fight is one i really want to see.
I suspect pride was rife with roids because they never tested for them, but not sure if everyone was on them. And it's not that I think all of pride was shit it's more like I don't blindly think fedor nog cc and barnett were 1234 in the world, like the pro-pride guys do. i'm mainly directing my comments that way.
also it wasn't long ago the pride people thought gomi was unbeatable and would wipe the floor with any ufc guy, then he got beat by diaz.
I hate that blind pride is best on every level attitude. and re fedor the dwarf bit was just me being stupid but seriously he's only 6ft for example how's he going to handle the much bigger gonzaga on the ground? randy aint that big but he's got a couple of inches on fedor I just can't see fedor dominating at all. as long as people aren't overawed by his rep I think he's definitely beatable.
and no cans? mate the guy has fought 1 top level hw in 3yrs I don't get it, if it aint bullsh*t aura then what in heavens name has him ranked #1 fighter in the world?
re shogun rampage henderson they are all great fighters and have shown that the ufc lhw div used to be comparitively weak. seems to be not the case with the other divisions though.
yeah, fair enough. The blind pro-any organisation allegiance piss me off aswell, ufc or pride. I've always been pretty even minded with what I thought was better. I just love MMA no matter where its at. At the peak of the 'argument' say a year back, I think Pride was better at the HW, LHW and LW divisons whereas the UFC's MW and WW div's were probably stronger, definately the 170's. Times change though and now the UFC are totally dominant so who really cares.
I think Fedor's #1 call is basically because at his peak there was noone that could stop him so he claimed #1. I think if you watched his fights circa 05/06 you'd also likely agree that he'd chew up and spit out any of the other HW guys at the time... And I dont think the size would matter.. Guys like Big Nog are as big as Gonzaga and Randy isn't a giant so I don't know why you'd think Fedor is too small. He's only an inch shorter than Couture and he'd be as strong.
HOWEVER, perhaps a rethink of the #1 spot should happen if he hasn't fought in a while he should start to drop in rank.
What I'm saying though is that *IF* he can still fight at the level he did in 05/06, I reckon the number #1 spot is still deserved.
And personally, I think he can so therefore I reckon he'd still be number one. Certainly number 1 if they fought under Pride rules, but in the UFC, he might need to adjust to elbows, the cage and so on. I'm not sure. In any case Randy didn't lose anything in his time off, so perhaps the lack of fights wont affect Fedor either.
But the main thing is that I have not seen a more rounded and devestating HW fighter than Fedor Emelianenko at his prime.
I definately agree that he needs to step into the ring/cage and prove it though. And FWIW I think a UFC Randy/Fedor match would be very close, especially because Randy is a master of the cage and would have a 'home ground' advantage. Yes Fedor is beatable, but I could count on 1 hand the number of people in the world that could do it.
and no cans? mate the guy has fought 1 top level hw in 3yrs I don't get it, if it aint bullsh*t aura then what in heavens name has him ranked #1 fighter in the world?
I can understand where you're coming from, but if Fedor isn't on top anymore then who is? All of the other top heavyweights have been beaten at some stage in their past five fights.
I think if Nogueira beats Randy for the UFC title and Fedor still hasn't fought anyone of note then he should be ranked number one.
I suspect pride was rife with roids because they never tested for them, but not sure if everyone was on them. And it's not that I think all of pride was shit it's more like I don't blindly think fedor nog cc and barnett were 1234 in the world, like the pro-pride guys do. i'm mainly directing my comments that way.
also it wasn't long ago the pride people thought gomi was unbeatable and would wipe the floor with any ufc guy, then he got beat by diaz.
I hate that blind pride is best on every level attitude. and re fedor the dwarf bit was just me being stupid but seriously he's only 6ft for example how's he going to handle the much bigger gonzaga on the ground? randy aint that big but he's got a couple of inches on fedor I just can't see fedor dominating at all. as long as people aren't overawed by his rep I think he's definitely beatable.
and no cans? mate the guy has fought 1 top level hw in 3yrs I don't get it, if it aint bullsh*t aura then what in heavens name has him ranked #1 fighter in the world?
re shogun rampage henderson they are all great fighters and have shown that the ufc lhw div used to be comparitively weak. seems to be not the case with the other divisions though.
This argument has not taken into account the improvement in the UFC since TUF and Dana White took over. Stronger organisation helps develop stronger fighters.
All the talk of Fedor fighting cans is moot. The UFC dished up Tim Sylvia for years, and no sane person could say he was better then Fedor. He's also fought some bloody good HW's with that bunch of Jap can fighters.
CC hasn't adjusted to the fence. PRIDE did every thing to get fighters off the ropes and in the middle. UFC is a whole different ball game and his take down d has been found out. The UFC rules has always been biased towards ground players with elbows, no stomps and the fence. Guy's like CC and Mark hunt are going to find it very hard in the UFC, though I didn't expect it this hard. Fedor doesn't have this spraw and brawl problem as much, and his clinch takedown is up there with the likes of Couture.
This argument has not taken into account the improvement in the UFC since TUF and Dana White took over. Stronger organisation helps develop stronger fighters.
All the talk of Fedor fighting cans is moot. The UFC dished up Tim Sylvia for years, and no sane person could say he was better then Fedor. He's also fought some bloody good HW's with that bunch of Jap can fighters.
CC hasn't adjusted to the fence. PRIDE did every thing to get fighters off the ropes and in the middle. UFC is a whole different ball game and his take down d has been found out. The UFC rules has always been biased towards ground players with elbows, no stomps and the fence. Guy's like CC and Mark hunt are going to find it very hard in the UFC, though I didn't expect it this hard. Fedor doesn't have this spraw and brawl problem as much, and his clinch takedown is up there with the likes of Couture.
Who has Fedor beaten that is better than Kongo or Gonzaga? Where is any proof to say the same wouldn't have happened to Fedor against those two that happened to CC? Would your opinion change if it was Fedor who got his head caved in by high kick, or dominated in the clinch?
All I'm saying is I believe what i see and I haven't seen Fedor do anything really significant in years now. I can definitely see the sceptical point of view that says Fedor is holding off signing with UFC to protect his aura of invincibility, that he'll never fight there because of that fact, and that he senses himself that he'd be in a whole different situation in the UFC taking on Couture Gonzaga Kongo Vera Arlovski & Silvia, as opposed to cans/middleweights/or washed up old fellas like Zulu Coleman Hunt Kohsaka or Lindland.
there is no 'proof' that Fedor wont get dominated. We can only use our judgement. And as both drew_j and I are seasoned MMA fans (from UFC #1) and also train in grappling and striking our judgement is generally sound. In other words we have a pretty damn good idea what makes a good MMA fighter.
Rather than us try and 'prove' to you Fedor is the real deal, maybe at least tell us why you think Fedor would get dominated? What parts of his game do you think are suspect?
I dont think Fedor gives a sh*t about his 'aura'. He didn't create it nor perpetuate it. He just turns up, non-nonsense and fights. He doesn't care for bullsh*t.
Nogueria is as good if not better than gonzaga and although Cro Cop has looked pretty darn average in his UFC appearances he was still an absolute machine in his Pride heyday. Cro Cop has destroyed guys like Wanderlei Silva, Josh Barnett, Vovchancyn, etc. These guys aren't run-of-the-mill fighters either.
If Fedor got his head caved in and beaten soundly by Gonzaga or Randy or whoever I would have no problem in putting them above him as better fighters. :)
Anyway, it's all good, but how would you rate the top say 5 Heavyweights in order?
Who has Fedor beaten that is better than Kongo or Gonzaga? .
Randelman,
Nogueria,
Lindland,
Sobral,
Goodridge,
Coleman and
Arona.
Have you actually seen the guy fight? He's a machine. Sure, he's done nothing for a while. PRIDE has been in recivership.
Proof? Where's the proof Fedor wouldn't just kill any of these UFC boys? It's hypothetical. You may talk about hating the whole UFC vs PRIDE thing but it pretty obvious to everyone here you have a complex over it.
Randelman,
Nogueria,
Lindland,
Sobral,
Goodridge,
Coleman and
Arona.
Have you actually seen the guy fight? He's a machine. Sure, he's done nothing for a while. PRIDE has been in recivership.
Proof? Where's the proof Fedor wouldn't just kill any of these UFC boys? It's hypothetical. You may talk about hating the whole UFC vs PRIDE thing but it pretty obvious to everyone here you have a complex over it.
Gary Goodridge are you serious? Babalu? Matt friggin Lindland? Mate the only one in that list that could go with Kongo and Gonzaga is Big Nog. The others are well past it or undersized. If babalu couldn't beat the dean of mean then how in fu-ks name could he beat a monster like Gonzaga? Jeez he'd get destroyed!
And pride got bought only a few months ago, up until then they were trading as per normal and it remains fact that it has been a loooooong time since Fedor fought anyone of note.
I am about fighters not orgs but i have a set against the whole pride-is-the-greatest attitude that some people have had. It isn't anti-pride it is anti the pro-pride attitude.
I'd back Nog to beat Kongo and Gonzaga. Kongo's ground game is too weak to cause him any problems and Gonzaga's not quite at the top level yet.
In fact, Nogueira's beaten everybody he's fought except for Fedor, who dominated him twice. I don't believe in X beats Y, Y beats Z so X soundly beats Z, but that's probably where Fedor's 'aura' began. Nog's victory list includes Cro Cop, Barnett, Kharitonov, Werdum, Henderson, Herring (three times), Coleman, Rodriguez, Schilt and Bob Sapp back when he was still feared.
At least CC and Nog have come and fought in the cage and given us something to kindof compare formlines. I dont see why Fedor doesn't jump at the chance to do the same. I dont think wanting to compete in sambo, or making it a condition of contract that the take on all of Fedor's teammates and let Fedor's management run UFC branded events in Russia, is good enough reason to turn the UFC down and still maintain your integrity as a fighter. It's perfectly logical and reasonable for the UFC to demand exclusivity when signing on a fighter, especially one with the standing that Fedor has.
Gary Goodridge are you serious? Babalu? Matt friggin Lindland? Mate the only one in that list that could go with Kongo and Gonzaga is Big Nog. The others are well past it or undersized. If babalu couldn't beat the dean of mean then how in fu-ks name could he beat a monster like Gonzaga? Jeez he'd get destroyed!
And pride got bought only a few months ago, up until then they were trading as per normal and it remains fact that it has been a loooooong time since Fedor fought anyone of note.
I am about fighters not orgs but i have a set against the whole pride-is-the-greatest attitude that some people have had. It isn't anti-pride it is anti the pro-pride attitude.
The only people Gonzaga and Kongo have beaten is Crocop and according to you, he's an over rated can. PRIDE was brought out recently but it's been in financial trouble all 2007 was it 1 or 2 shows they canned? How do you except a fighter to fight if his contract is with an organisation that can't afford to put on an card? I don't know what Fedor is like now he's only had one fight this year, but from what I've seen of him fight at his best he would eat anyone in MMA. If Couture can beat Gonzaga, Fedor would mail his wife the carcass in pieces.
Don't hate Fedor cos the pride fan boys love him because he is to good for that.
When you consider that people were thinking he'd just walk through the UFC HW division then in that context CC was surely overrated. But I dont think he's a can. He's one dimensional and he's more suited to pride rules and the ring is what i think about him. Otherwise awesome fighter.
Have you seen Ernesto Hoost standing next to Fedor? Mate it's like inches and inches difference, god knows what sort of weight Fedor would be giving away to that sort of fighter. Remember before Mirko went to pride, he had already fought Hoost 3 times for 3 losses.
See i dont hate on Fedor, I just dont think he's the greatest until he starts proving it a bit more.
Hoost is a kickboxer.
Fedor's last 5 fights have been against 84kg, 113, 111, 177 and 100. Hoost is 108kg's Fedor is 106, Kongo is 104 and Gonzaga is 114, Arlovski is 109 and Sylvia is shit. Bloody hell, Coture is 102! I don't even know what your argument is Fedor is bigger than or fought bigger guys then most of these UFC boys!
I can see where Deej is coming from and agree with him with some aspects, but I just think watching Fedor fight is enough to see that he is something special. And I think as well as probably most MMA pundits, that he is the greatest. Deej just happens not to 'see' it in Fedor.
It's the same when I first saw GSP or when seeing Randy and Vitor first fight in the UFC. You just know they are awesome even though they may have only fought someone half their skill.
Yes, they are defeatable (see matt serra), but it would take someone lucky or equally awesome to do it.
I can see where Deej is coming from and agree with him with some aspects, but I just think watching Fedor fight is enough to see that he is something special. And I think as well as probably most MMA pundits, that he is the greatest. Deej just happens not to 'see' it in Fedor.
What will you think if Fedor comes to the UFC and loses, ala CC?
It'll make an absolute mockery of all those long held beliefs about Pride being so much better, wouldn't you agree?
And by the way I think Fedor is a smart guy and knows what he's doing in holding out and creating the smokescreens re sambo and the other stuff. Randy can't stay at this level forever, you'd think he'd be extremely close to being finished even despite his recent efforts. I dont think Fedor would need to hang out too much longer before accepting the Randy fight and getting him at a stage where he's gone over the edge.
Guys i say again i'm not anti-pride, i just cant stand it that this legendary fighter hardly ever fights and when he does he picks fat cans or middleweights or dudes that are 4 years past it. He really needs to step up and fight Randy, Gonzaga, Arlovski, Vera, Kongo, bloody any genuine contender HW from 2007 would be nice. He's a paper mache #1 right now if you ask me.
What will you think if Fedor comes to the UFC and loses, ala CC?
It'll make an absolute mockery of all those long held beliefs about Pride being so much better, wouldn't you agree?
Was the UFC made 'mockery' when Chuck got dismantled by Rampage in Pride?
Anyway to answer your question, yes I guess if Fedor loses in the same way as CC has I'd definately say he's not number one. As I said I'm unbiased and don't hold an allegience (unlike yourself it seems). But even then it wouldn't make a mockery of PrideFC being better. It wouldn't certainly make a dent though.
You should also remember that the reputation of Pride didn't go just on the back of Fedor, there are plenty of other fighters that contributed to its talent pool and why (back then) most pundits agreed it was better than UFC in terms of fighters talent.
guys like Barnett, Nog, Arona, Rampage, Anderson Silva, Sakuraba, Shogun, Sokodjou, Alexander E, Henderson, Wanderlei, etc, etc were/are all teir 1 fighters. Why do you think many of them are being snapped up by the UFC and are going straight up into title contention? Not only that Pride had less restrictions so fighters could use more weapons, it was a truer test of MMA in my opinion. But that is moot now.
On the other hand, if Fedor *did* come in an beat Randy and co in the UFC, in the cage, under UFC rules, would finally then he be the best in your mind? Is the Pride name being carried on the back of Fedor?
And by the way I think Fedor is a smart guy and knows what he's doing in holding out and creating the smokescreens re sambo and the other stuff. Randy can't stay at this level forever, you'd think he'd be extremely close to being finished even despite his recent efforts. I dont think Fedor would need to hang out too much longer before accepting the Randy fight and getting him at a stage where he's gone over the edge.
Guys i say again i'm not anti-pride, i just cant stand it that this legendary fighter hardly ever fights and when he does he picks fat cans or middleweights or dudes that are 4 years past it. He really needs to step up and fight Randy, Gonzaga, Arlovski, Vera, Kongo, bloody any genuine contender HW from 2007 would be nice. He's a paper mache #1 right now if you ask me.
Fair enough :p I definately agree that he needs to damn well fight. I disagree that he's holding out because he's worried he'll lose or he want to fight Randy who's "past it".
He (or his management) will be holding out becuase of either:
- $$$
- Because he doesn't really like the Americans or the UFC
- Because he doesn't like how Dana White operates.
- Because he's over fighting and wants to retire and spend more time with family.
All these are possible, but its highly unlikely that he's holding out because he's 'scared'.
He either needs to fight or tell everyone he's not interested in the UFC and get it over with. I think everyone is hoping it's the former.
Is the Pride name being carried on the back of Fedor?
No Fedor's rep is being carried on the back of Fedor. Actually maybe a tiny bit of Pride's name too.
Henderson is an original UFC fighter but nobody said UFC fighters are better because Henderson cleaned up in Pride. And people say oh i liked pride rules better i like the 10min first round.....originally it was the UFC who had the long first round, then the bonuis round or whatever it was called. Yet nobody says they liked the original UFC rules they say they like the Pride rules. See it's this sort of Pride v UFC mentality that irks me and it comes from the pro-pride people not the UFC people. UFC started it all, they had a lean patch, but now they rule again and are expanding the sport in a way nobody else could. Why pride people dislike Dana and the UFC i will never know.
Who are these pride people? I love the UFC and what they have done recently, love the way Dana goes about his buissness in TUF. Wish there was stomps but such is life. Pride's inability to keep it together is a real shame, and hte reason Fedor isn't fighting.
Who are these pride people? I love the UFC and what they have done recently, love the way Dana goes about his buissness in TUF. Wish there was stomps but such is life. Pride's inability to keep it together is a real shame, and hte reason Fedor isn't fighting.
It's not you guys. In fact i dont know why i'm banging on about it cause the people i've read with this attitude are from sherdog not here.
It's not you guys. In fact i dont know why i'm banging on about it cause the people i've read with this attitude are from sherdog not here.
Yeah, I struggle to read a lot of pure MMA forums for the net warrior attitude that hangs about. Probably why I'm off the pulse a bit now days.
thehoff
13 Sep 2007, 21:33
This needs to be sorted out in the cage.
Prepare for BIGFOOTY 01 - Battle of the keyboard Warriors.
I'll be the President "The question is, do you wanna be a f$%king keyboard warrior?"
This needs to be sorted out in the cage.
Prepare for BIGFOOTY 01 - Battle of the keyboard Warriors.
I'll be the President "The question is, do you wanna be a f$%king keyboard warrior?"
I've trained all my life for this hoff
thehoff
13 Sep 2007, 21:44
I've trained all my life for this hoff
I can't wait until the weigh-ins. I'll have to separate you guys from stealing each others USB sticks.
I can't wait until the weigh-ins. I'll have to separate you guys from stealing each others USB sticks.
I'm gonna work the RAM first. To open him up for some solid CPU stikes with the ctrl-alt-del. I have no doubt I'll finish this fight with a HDD erasure probably from a high left format.
thehoff
13 Sep 2007, 22:19
I'm gonna work the RAM first. To open him up for some solid CPU stikes with the ctrl-alt-del. I have no doubt I'll finish this fight with a HDD erasure probably from a high left format.
BAHAHAHAHA
THe pre-fight interviews are going to be gold!
Here is the last fight i promoted:
http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=8kbdhXmJtjQ
No Fedor's rep is being carried on the back of Fedor. Actually maybe a tiny bit of Pride's name too.
Henderson is an original UFC fighter but nobody said UFC fighters are better because Henderson cleaned up in Pride. And people say oh i liked pride rules better i like the 10min first round.....originally it was the UFC who had the long first round, then the bonuis round or whatever it was called. Yet nobody says they liked the original UFC rules they say they like the Pride rules. See it's this sort of Pride v UFC mentality that irks me and it comes from the pro-pride people not the UFC people. UFC started it all, they had a lean patch, but now they rule again and are expanding the sport in a way nobody else could. Why pride people dislike Dana and the UFC i will never know.
Actually if you go by that Wanderlei, Belfort, Sakuraba, etc are also UFC fighters :)
But since Zuffa bought the UFC and it was governed by the NSAC (Ufc 29 or 30 I think ) the current rules have stayed. These are the "unified rules".
Prior to that the UFC changed the rules regularly, early on there were no stand ups because of lack of action, no time limits, you could headbutt, groin strikes and so on.
Pride actually had restricted rules up until Pride 13 when the 'full' Pride rules were established which allowed stomps and soccer kicks and knees to the head. These were my preferred rules. I wish the UFC went to those rules, it would be so awesome. I like the UFC's elbows and 5 min time limits though..
As it stands, my preference for MMA over the years is:
UFC 1-20 - UFC kicked arse (there was no pride anyway)
Pride Started - UFC was still better
around Pride 7, Pride started getting better fights and had more exciting fighters, Pride was my favourite
UFC 25-probably 40ish - UFC's 'dark ages' ... Ken vs Tito was a big one, but Pride was in it's "golden era" - Still Pride was THE SHIT.
UFC 60+ - TUF revived a lot of interest. Hughes vs Gracie, GSP, return of Randy. UFC was gaining on Pride a LOT.
Now: UFC Rules all.
(but I would love the UFC to add stomps and knees on the ground) :(
then it would RULE!