View Full Version : Lasting images baffle: "Hawthorn ignores this at it's peril"
philhawk
9 Oct 2007, 03:39
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,22553886%255E19742,00.html
Lasting image baffles
09 October 2007 Herald Sun
Trevor Grant
AS HE does when he tucks a football under his arm and spears through a pack, Chris Judd has left behind a trail of frustration, bewilderment and ruined dreams on his way to his next club.
...
ndeed, the hit Hawthorn has taken in all of this is a serious one, even if it has barely been acknowledged.
Colleague Mike Sheahan wrote recently his sources were telling him Judd refused even to talk to Hawthorn because he had concerns about the culture of the club.
Hawthorn has a young, strong list, new facilities, one of the best coaching panels and genuine premiership prospects. So much about it fitted Judd's stated criteria before he chose the Blues.
Yet, we are told, there is a culture there that the best player is very keen to avoid.
Culture problem these days is code for drug problem. Whether Hawthorn has a problem in this area no one can say with any surety, not least because everything about substance abuse in the AFL is cloaked in secrecy.
However, perception is as damning as reality in 21st century elite sport.
Whatever the truth, this is a stunning declaration of no confidence from the game's most respected player.
Hawthorn ignores it at its peril.
We dont, actually.
I'm personally hoping that Judd sticks his $5 million contract right up where the sun doesn't shine.
Hawks1523
9 Oct 2007, 03:42
Exactly. We don't, and if Judd thinks we're the only Victorian club who may have culture problems, he's one ver naieve person.
Adelaide Hawk
9 Oct 2007, 07:39
The more I understand about Judd, the more I know I'm correct in thinking he's a sanctimonious moron. Who the hell does this guy think he is? I have never wanted him within 500 miles of our club and I was very pleased to hear he didn't wish to talk with us. He is much better suited to Carlton where dishonesty, deceit, and the pursuit of the almighty dollar is more their style.
I still think the Hawthorn Football Club need to seriously explore it's options in taking legal action. If the club is being hampered in bringing players to the club because they were singled out when other clubs are in the same situation, then we would be entitled to clear our name, not to mention compensation.
And I am so tired of potato head Judd being referred to as the best player in the competition. He's nowhere near that.
Fabulous
9 Oct 2007, 07:52
Trevor Grant may have stepped over the line in this article. The club and the AFL may be looking at demanding a retraction or apology at the very least. The injunction would appear to have been breached.
Pessimistic
9 Oct 2007, 08:31
Do Grant or Shehan ever feel the need to back this stuff up with facts ?
Hawthorn will manage its house as it always had. But thats got nothing to do
with Judd.
Appointing Mitch may be a start - I'm not accusing Hodge - Just Mitch would be less of a party animal.
PS Grant and shehan we werent exactly squeaky clean in th 80s but we know the results don't we ?
Mitchell Madness
9 Oct 2007, 08:31
Trevor Grant may have stepped over the line in this article. The club and the AFL may be looking at demanding a retraction or apology at the very least. The injunction would appear to have been breached.
I dont think it has been breached, but he was very rude. He quoted, then rephrased what judd had said, so really, he is in a decent position, judd is the one who may need to issue an appology
CyberKev
9 Oct 2007, 09:05
Deadset.
My care factor is too low for zero about anything Juddrick says, does, thinks, or may even vaguely allude to!
Lets leave the media and his ever undiscerning great unwashed minions to waste away their while away lives with their wanton Judd lust.
We've got plenty to occupy ourselves with given the burgeoning young list that we currently have to get distracted by such a trifling sideshow.
Dudes let it go , it's an opinion piece , respond and it's tomorrows news , let it go and it's yesterdays news and forgotten within the week.Let it go
Judd dissed us because he's a dirty eye gouger and was exposed for it when Browny drank the truth serum on pay tv to the bloke who vilified him for Judd the Gouger having to face the tribunal in the first place. Sanctimonious git
Concrete boots
9 Oct 2007, 09:35
Judd's reason for not speaking to Hawthorn is obvious to those who socialise with the Hawks' players.
I have no doubt we are not alone in this regard BUT Hawks need to focus on minimising this culture before we reach the awful level of the WCE.
Be alert, not alarmed.
1) Judd didn't want to be the 3rd or 4th best player at the club
2) Judd was only after money - definately not what he was spouting out as his criteria. How else could he have chosen Carlton
3) 2008 is going to be Judd's worst year to date. Starting late into pre-season training and on-going groin problems
All this adds up to me being a Happy Hawker that we didn't end up with him - however it occured
QUOTE
[Lasting image baffles
09 October 2007 Herald Sun
Trevor Grant
AS HE does when he tucks a football under his arm and spears through a pack, Chris Judd has left behind a trail of frustration, bewilderment and ruined dreams on his way to his next club.
...
ndeed, the hit Hawthorn has taken in all of this is a serious one, even if it has barely been acknowledged.
Colleague Mike Sheahan wrote recently his sources were telling him Judd refused even to talk to Hawthorn because he had concerns about the culture of the club.
Hawthorn has a young, strong list, new facilities, one of the best coaching panels and genuine premiership prospects. So much about it fitted Judd's stated criteria before he chose the Blues.
Yet, we are told, there is a culture there that the best player is very keen to avoid.
Culture problem these days is code for drug problem. Whether Hawthorn has a problem in this area no one can say with any surety, not least because everything about substance abuse in the AFL is cloaked in secrecy.
However, perception is as damning as reality in 21st century elite sport.
Whatever the truth, this is a stunning declaration of no confidence from the game's most respected player.
Hawthorn ignores it at its peril. ]
:mad:
- Is this the games most respected player who eye gauges, who thinks he is bigger than the game by choosing a suiter with whom to play with and the same 'games most respected player' who can shove his contract up his bald a#se because the game doesn't need him. The game has been strong before him and will go on long after him.
Sadly perception in this day and age is more important than reality.
lickmerocks
9 Oct 2007, 10:14
Judd's reason for not speaking to Hawthorn is obvious to those who socialise with the Hawks' players.
I have no doubt we are not alone in this regard BUT Hawks need to focus on minimising this culture before we reach the awful level of the WCE.
Be alert, not alarmed.
Spot on.
Judd is the best player in the competition and had we been able to get him we would be sitting here saying we are a chance to snare a Flag.
It is a very disturbing piece and not good for our club.
IMO Buddy's a better long term prospect.
Judd's reason for not speaking to Hawthorn is obvious to those who socialise with the Hawks' players.
I have no doubt we are not alone in this regard BUT Hawks need to focus on minimising this culture before we reach the awful level of the WCE.
Be alert, not alarmed.
Well said. I certainly hope there are processes at work internally to redress the issue. Blaming Judd for what may be a problem of the club's making will not fix it.
Gary Shadforth
9 Oct 2007, 11:07
Hawthorn has a young, strong list, new facilities, one of the best coaching panels and genuine premiership prospects. So much about it fitted Judd's stated criteria before he chose the Blues.
Mr Judd's real problem is there are too many now established and upcoming stars in the Hawthorn team which will outshine him as wear and tear on his shoulder and the rest of his body inevitably slows him down.
At Carlton a slower Judd, as the years roll by, will stand out to a degree. It is not only dollars on his mind but Brownlow votes.
The more I hear and see of this sly looking smug individual the more disgusted I become.
Collins-Langford-Ayres
9 Oct 2007, 12:06
Or just maybe, he knew he had no chance of getting the captaincy. Pretty out of order for a bloke that was captain of a club with the worst culture in the league. What role did you play in stopping it Chris?
Pessimistic
9 Oct 2007, 12:12
I discounted the steven greene delisting thing as minor then found out he is Judd's business partner.
if we need to look at any club issues perhaps that is the first place
Juddy still has nightmares from when he was 5 watching the 1988 GF:D
I don't care to be honest. If Judd is that narrow minded let him be, tell Judd never to go in to a club because he will see drug taking there, if he wants to do something on the weekend he can go and play lawn bowls at least the majority of the players arent on anything illegal..........yet.
If that was Judd's soul reason not to even consider hawthorn,
1) He is a gutless shit who was to scared to answer the phone and be a man and tell the Hawthorn officials why he wouldnt consider us.
and
2) He is a narrow minded knob head who by the sounds of it cries if anything illegal goes on but in reality so many people in his age group does try or per take weekly in recreational drugs....including athletes.
Seriously, I couldn't care less what Judd thinks.
I don't see why his opinion is held in higher regard than that of any other footballer running around. Just because he has exceptional football skills doesn't automatically make him an ethical genius.
I guess nobody will ever know if he tried to help Cousins, Kerr or any of the other players suspected but the one thing we know he did do was to pack his bags and run like hell. Should journalists be using somebody like that as a moral measuring stick? I think not.
Saying that, I'm happy that this keeps getting bandied about because one thing I have noticed about AC's Hawks is that the play better when their backs are against the wall and with that in mind; if Judd goes to Carlton we wont loose to them for the next ten years:D
nikolasgabriel
9 Oct 2007, 13:08
the fact of the matter is
If Chris Judd has chosen the hawks, you would all be very excited indeed, the fact that he hasnt, and then has thrown mud at you, well thats very unfortunate, very unfortunate.
Ah yes, and Collingwood and Melbourne also have been damned as well.
Firstly, any club that thinks they do not have at least one player who has taken recreational drugs is in noddy land.
Secondly anything Judd says I take with a grain of salt. Ultimately he has selected a club that does not meet the criteria he set. so why did he reject Collingwood - do they have a culture problem to?
Thirdly, Carlton really have a great culture, their president's company has been fined $40m for price fixing and given the systemic abuse of the system carlton undertook in the past I would have thought their culture left alot to be desired.
Far from being one of the most highly respected people, I think Judd has really done some damage to his sterling reputation with his actions over the past few weeks.
At the end of the day, Journos live of making a huge deal about somehting relatively minor.
I initially has some leaning towards trading Williams and a draft pick for Judd. However the more I think about it, the more I'm gald it never happened. We have a class midfield that operates quite well and really a fit and firing Williams is of more value to us as a club than Judd is. That is Williams will add more to our forward line than Judd would to our midfield.
the fact of the matter is
If Chris Judd has chosen the hawks, you would all be very excited indeed, the fact that he hasnt, and then has thrown mud at you, well thats very unfortunate, very unfortunate.
Ah, Carlton supporters taking the high ground. Naturally, getting Chris Judd to any club can only add value, however I am of the opinion that trading Williams would be a bigger loss to the club, than recruiting Judd.
It is going to be very interesting to see where Carlton ends up next year and whether one player makes such a huge difference.
play2win
9 Oct 2007, 13:17
this is just media hype and is plain simple crapola
when has judd ever said why he did not pick hawks, saints, roos, pies, dees, bombers etc.
the media are reading a story into why he is leaving (contrary to what judd has said, ie. family - but we all figure it's money) and why he chose the blues over other clubs (contrary to what judd has said).
there is no story if judd chooses the blues because
1. he is close to his family
2. they can pay him more than anyone else
3. offer a career beyond football more to his liking than anyone else
BORING!!!!
the hawks just happen to be the easy target with what has occurred recently. the club needs to work on this perception and not be an easy target in future.
Gilbert_Hodge
9 Oct 2007, 13:18
Money money money money...... MONEY!
Londoner86
9 Oct 2007, 13:39
The whole article is based on this:
Colleague Mike Sheahan wrote recently his sources were telling him Judd refused even to talk to Hawthorn because he had concerns about the culture of the club
So, some type of source or sources have told Mike this?
What is the source: Mike's own voice?
The whole story is ABSOLUTE NONSENSE.
There is no direct quote from Judd, and I fear he is being unfairly blamed for a beat-up by the Herald Sun: the old story without any facts: they do it very well at the Herald Sun.
LH86
Matt Murder
9 Oct 2007, 14:10
Sir Chris Judd is setting himself for some physical batterings next season. I think the Steven Greene business partnership is an interesting one. I'm sure Steve would have no hesitation digging the boots in.
What is his perception of the Carlton "culture"? Everything is squeaky clean now that Laurie Angwin and Karl Norman aren't there anymore.
nikolasgabriel
9 Oct 2007, 14:57
Ah, Carlton supporters taking the high ground. Naturally, getting Chris Judd to any club can only add value, however I am of the opinion that trading Williams would be a bigger loss to the club, than recruiting Judd.
It is going to be very interesting to see where Carlton ends up next year and whether one player makes such a huge difference.
thats just crazy
so not losing williams, is more important than getting Judd
:confused:
thats just crazy
so not losing williams, is more important than getting Judd
:confused:
Just because Carlton are going to get him there is no need to try defend this big headed idiot. IF you havent noticed midfielders grow on trees, hell West Coast still have 4 great mids. Williams is one of the hardest players to match up onto in the league and Ebert is the closest thing to a player of Williams calibure (as a small leading forward). Where as Judd is great but hell there a gun mids all through out the AFL, you name another small leading forward with the calibure of Willow.
The whole article is based on this:
Colleague Mike Sheahan wrote recently his sources were telling him Judd refused even to talk to Hawthorn because he had concerns about the culture of the club
So, some type of source or sources have told Mike this?
What is the source: Mike's own voice?
The whole story is ABSOLUTE NONSENSE.
There is no direct quote from Judd, and I fear he is being unfairly blamed for a beat-up by the Herald Sun: the old story without any facts: they do it very well at the Herald Sun.
LH86
This is starting to annoy me as well.
We're lynching a bloke on the basis of a rumour and yet we've seen how badly a players name can be tarnished by rumours first hand.
This is starting to annoy me as well.
We're lynching a bloke on the basis of a rumour and yet we've seen how badly a players name can be tarnished by rumours first hand.
Spot on - where oh where has Judd ever been quoted?
fishbowl
9 Oct 2007, 15:32
The words are in the wrong order. Ignore Hawthorn at your peril.
Brown Blood
9 Oct 2007, 15:45
The whole article is based on this:
Colleague Mike Sheahan wrote recently his sources were telling him Judd refused even to talk to Hawthorn because he had concerns about the culture of the club
So, some type of source or sources have told Mike this?
What is the source: Mike's own voice?
The whole story is ABSOLUTE NONSENSE.
There is no direct quote from Judd, and I fear he is being unfairly blamed for a beat-up by the Herald Sun: the old story without any facts: they do it very well at the Herald Sun.
LH86
Agree 100% LH86.
This is really gutless journalism - they say they have sources to make an accusation then won't name them and keep repeating in various articles the same accusation as if it is fact.
And they do it to suit another accusation that they make based on ''sources".
I have never seen a quote by judd why he won't talk to us along with a number of other clubs. Perhaps it is culture though I think it is more likely to be:
-difference in money
-lack of possibility of trade being completed
-doesn't like the way green left
-he lost face from the fact he eye gouged brown
-doesn't like the continuing comparison to hodge
-we won't make him captain
-doesn't want to travel so much
-doesn't like our song
-doesn't like our colours
-doesn't like waverly park
Chrissie90
9 Oct 2007, 15:47
Judd is bad news...
He is a traitor and left the club that made him rich
He was captain and he cant even control his players like Kerr and Braun and Cuz
He is just after pratts money and is cheating behind the salary cap
He bagged other clubs just to hide the fact that he wanted carltons money anyway
He is a liar and an eye gouger
He holds a grudge coz we told him he would be drafted #1 and we changed our minds
He gives the ball away with bad disposal too often.I dunno why anyone would want him. I think he is poison and hes gotta take some blame for the stuff that went down over there.
Pessimistic
9 Oct 2007, 15:50
For god sake we cant even be sure he said that !!!
Chrissie90
9 Oct 2007, 15:50
Agree 100% LH86.
This is really gutless journalism - they say they have sources to make an accusation then won't name them and keep repeating in various articles the same accusation as if it is fact.
And they do it to suit another accusation that they make based on ''sources".
I have never seen a quote by judd why he won't talk to us along with a number of other clubs. Perhaps it is culture though I think it is more likely to be:
-difference in money
-lack of possibility of trade being completed
-doesn't like the way green left
-he lost face from the fact he eye gouged brown
-doesn't like the continuing comparison to hodge
-we won't make him captain
-doesn't want to travel so much
-doesn't like our song
-doesn't like our colours
-doesn't like waverly park
Judd is shifty. He gets other people to leak out what he thinks without saying it.
He has a whole PR team behind him - thats why he was pictured in the HUN last week signing over his organs to hid the fact that he is a greedy dog. Dont go easy on him and just blame sheahan...
Judd is bad news...
He is a traitor and left the club that made him rich
He was captain and he cant even control his players like Kerr and Braun and Cuz
He is just after pratts money and is cheating behind the salary cap
He bagged other clubs just to hide the fact that he wanted carltons money anyway
He is a liar and an eye gouger
He holds a grudge coz we told him he would be drafted #1 and we changed our minds
He gives the ball away with bad disposal too often.I dunno why anyone would want him. I think he is poison and hes gotta take some blame for the stuff that went down over there.
1. He left to come back home. Definitely some sort of anti-Saint.
2. He is the Captain of a football team not a baby sitter.
3. He could have went to Collingwood for more money and even if he did you wouldn't work at the firm that offered you the best compensation?
4. Prove it.
5. Accepted
6. An assumption.
7. As opposed to Hodge?
soupofficial
9 Oct 2007, 16:12
Mr Judd's real problem is there are too many now established and upcoming stars in the Hawthorn team which will outshine him as wear and tear on his shoulder and the rest of his body inevitably slows him down.
At Carlton a slower Judd, as the years roll by, will stand out to a degree. It is not only dollars on his mind but Brownlow votes.
The more I hear and see of this sly looking smug individual the more disgusted I become.
gary you don't have a clue about the facts on this topic, and like so many of the other posters on this thread, you're diverting attention onto any excuse you can think of that involves hawthorn taking no responsibility. yours is quite imaginative and obscure, and i'm unsure whether it makes it better or worse.
they say "hell hath no fury like a woman scorned", and in this case it's a throng of furious supporters who are looking for something satisfying to blame after our club was criticised and disregarded by an excellent player who was looking for a new team in melbourne. so of course it's time to do some character assassination on chris judd, probably the bloke in the league that would know more than anyone else how difficult it is to steer a ship with certain types of rat abundant on it.
AFL players are on personal terms with players from other clubs - be it from clubs they used to play for, junior teammates, or random connections. they're likely to have a much better idea of what's happening at other clubs than you'd think, and it's almost certain that judd didn't solely base his view on a now-mythical news report on channel 7. also, player managers commonly have clients at multiple clubs, and are well placed to advise off the record on the experiences of other clients around the league.
fortunately the supporters aren't the ones that have to come up with a plan to improve the club's image amongst the rest of the league so that this doesn't happen again, but i certainly hope HFC's board and football department aren't in such an hysterical state of denial about an issue that is demonstrably affecting our ability to secure recruits.
thats just crazy
so not losing williams, is more important than getting Judd
:confused:
Yes it is. Our midfield strength is more than adequate and Williams is a real compliment to our forward line. Having Williams, Franklin, Roughead etc in our forward line is brilliant, all different players who can kick goals. Nothing needs to be said about Frankling, Roughhead, should have kicked five or six against Adelaide and I was relaly impressed with his marking and Williams has the runs on the board.
While Judd would no doubt add to any team, the fact that he didn;t want to come to our club saved us from making a difficult, and possible incorrect, decision.
Pessimistic
9 Oct 2007, 17:24
Judd is shifty. He gets other people to leak out what he thinks without saying it.
He has a whole PR team behind him - thats why he was pictured in the HUN last week signing over his organs to hid the fact that he is a greedy dog. Dont go easy on him and just blame sheahan...
If he has - they are failing badly - his percieved character is not so good now.
B&YBlood
9 Oct 2007, 18:36
pretty sure laurence angwin and carl norman got the sack by the blues for "cultural problems"??? :confused:
greennick
9 Oct 2007, 19:07
cries if anything illegal goes on but in reality so many people in his age group does try or per take weekly in recreational drugs....including athletes.
Including Mrs Judd, she used to be known around the traps as a bit of a regular ho in a particular Perth nightclub scene. Always there with a different guy, never paying for anything and always ****ed. She was called drum club **** number 7.
ojeriojo
9 Oct 2007, 19:14
they say "hell hath no fury like a woman scorned", and in this case it's a throng of furious supporters who are looking for something satisfying to blame after our club was criticised and disregarded by an excellent player who was looking for a new team in melbourne. so of course it's time to do some character assassination on chris judd, probably the bloke in the league that would know more than anyone else how difficult it is to steer a ship with certain types of rat abundant on it.
AFL players are on personal terms with players from other clubs - be it from clubs they used to play for, junior teammates, or random connections. they're likely to have a much better idea of what's happening at other clubs than you'd think, and it's almost certain that judd didn't solely base his view on a now-mythical news report on channel 7. also, player managers commonly have clients at multiple clubs, and are well placed to advise off the record on the experiences of other clients around the league.
fortunately the supporters aren't the ones that have to come up with a plan to improve the club's image amongst the rest of the league so that this doesn't happen again, but i certainly hope HFC's board and football department aren't in such an hysterical state of denial about an issue that is demonstrably affecting our ability to secure recruits.
Great call, which articulated a lot of what I have been thinking.
Regardless of whether or not the report is accurate, if there is a problem with the club's culture or image, then I hope that it is being dealt with.
Linda Crescent
9 Oct 2007, 22:42
Well said 'frankc', "At the end of the day, Journos live of making a huge deal about somehting relatively minor."
The article is rubbish, simply put, Trevor Grant doing Mike Sheahans dirty work. I reckon Sheahan has really got it in for us. He makes noises, subtle digs and gives hints and has been doing so for close to a year now... I have no time for him, an old school journalist with little integrity these days.
Adelaide Hawk
9 Oct 2007, 22:48
Well said 'frankc', "At the end of the day, Journos live of making a huge deal about somehting relatively minor."
The article is rubbish, simply put, Trevor Grant doing Mike Sheahans dirty work. I reckon Sheahan has really got it in for us. He makes noises, subtle digs and gives hints and has been doing so for close to a year now... I have no time for him, an old school journalist with little integrity these days.
More like 20 years.
At the end of the day, I have no respect for people who by their half truths and inneundo attempt to turn fiction into fact. Grant confirms his total disregard for what the truth is by reaffirming his opinion 'Whatever the truth is...'
Journos don't care what the truth is, they are simply out their to sell newspapers by whatever means necessary. I can't believe people even bother reading the crap in the Herald-Sun.
The stuff you read in New Idea has more credibility than the HS.