English CRicket Resurgence?

[Briedis]

What does everyone think of Englands progress?

With the Ashes series looming at the end of the year, i reckon that England will give us a good shake this time around. They have improved all facets of their game.

Batting - Trescothick would have to be in the top 5 batsmen in the world at the moment. A real find. Thorpe and Hussain seem to have found some form and Butcher has finally found his feet on the international stage. Vaughan has also performed very well.

Bowling - With the core attack of Caddick and Gough ageing England have found a few guns to step up. Hoggard and Tudor have really taken the next step - put these four together and you have a very potent attack, especially for Aussie conditions. Giles is going very well and provided that variation that is required.

I reckon this will be a great series this year, I am REALLY looking forward to it already.... it's been ages since we had a really good competitive series out here, BRING ON THE POMS!!

[SeinDude]

Originally posted by Briedis
What does everyone think of Englands progress?


There's no doubt England look to have improved their game. Marcus Trescothick is a quality batsman, and if he can make some runs at the top of the order, it will make it easier for the likes of Hussain and Thorpe in the middle order to play their natural games.

England's bowling still looks a little suspect to me, and looking at the likely English attack, it's hard to see how they'll be able to bowl us out twice in most games. Ashley Giles, the left-arm spinner is likely to be targetted by Hayden, Langer and Gilchrist as someone they can attack and score quickly off, and while England's medium pace attack is able to get movement off the seam on English wickets, the flatter Australian wickets are less likely to offer them assistance which will make it harder for the likes of Flintoff to do much.

The other factor in all of this is still Shane Warne. England's batsman have been unable to find effective ways to score off him with little risk, and he could once again be the key to the series.

Cheers!! :cool:
SeinDude

[Briedis]

Agree with you there mate. I think we will still win, but I reckon that the English attack with the inclusion of Tudor and Hoggard will be much more potent. Plus, these guys will benefit from a tour out here and come back the next time primed.

Both of these guys are much quicker than medium pace too.

Giles, I agree, is a worry for them. Perhaps they could bring out the other spinner they took to India, can't remember his name, but he looked pretty good.

The other thing I like about England is that they have a thinking captain who is not afraid to try new ideas to get a batsman out, ala Steve Waugh.

It should make for a great contest this summer...

[London Dave]

I tend to agree with you guys...Trescothick and Vaughn had to (and still need to) make the step up from 35 average to 40 plus...i.e. not turning into a "Gatting" type dud who averages 35 for a career, but become a good test bat (40+) at least.
The rest of the batting is solid enough...Flintoff, as I said during the England-India tour, has turned the corner, is now a test cricketer...big ticker, and big hitter....Tudor and Hoggard are both good bowlers, Hoggard in particular has a big ticker too boot. Not taking Caddick and Gough on tour may make the difference (no loser mentality)...dunno about Giles, the bowling is OK, bu still needs the batting to make runs and put the aussies under the cosh to some extent. There are concerns with Tudors' ability to stick at it on a long day...first spell is good, but can be cannon fodder afterwards, though he displayed a disturbing Botham like tendency to take wickets with crap balls.


and if they dont take Stewart as keeper/bat, they dont want to win it.

[Brett Li]

I can't wait as I'll be flying over for the Sydney test. Come on you England!!!!!

[NYPomme]

Originally posted by Brett Li
I can't wait as I'll be flying over for the Sydney test. Come on you England!!!!!

Spawny Get! :D

With Sri Lanka relative disappointment - and South Africa's recent disasters - would we hazard a guess at World Ranking?

Loooking forward to the Ashes Series - I think that England have, at last, a team that COULD compete. I also think it will be a good stimulus for the series if England continue there good run of form.

I particularly like the fact that England have a few batsmen looking like international players. For so long there have only been a couple of guys at any time who 'fire' - which, over a series, spells 'collapse' in two or three innings.

In the Bowling - I like Hoggard and Tudor - and think that Caddick and 'Hovis' (can't believe someone accuses Goughie of a loser mentality) will be ready for the Aussies. 2002/3 has to be Stewart's swansong. I'm relishing the prospect.

1-1 Series - with England playing much the better stuff ;)

[Briedis]

Originally posted by London Dave
I tend to agree with you guys...Trescothick and Vaughn had to (and still need to) make the step up from 35 average to 40 plus...i.e. not turning into a "Gatting" type dud who averages 35 for a career, but become a good test bat (40+) at least.
The rest of the batting is solid enough...Flintoff, as I said during the England-India tour, has turned the corner, is now a test cricketer...big ticker, and big hitter....Tudor and Hoggard are both good bowlers, Hoggard in particular has a big ticker too boot. Not taking Caddick and Gough on tour may make the difference (no loser mentality)...dunno about Giles, the bowling is OK, bu still needs the batting to make runs and put the aussies under the cosh to some extent. There are concerns with Tudors' ability to stick at it on a long day...first spell is good, but can be cannon fodder afterwards, though he displayed a disturbing Botham like tendency to take wickets with crap balls.


and if they dont take Stewart as keeper/bat, they dont want to win it.

Agree with you there LD. I think Trescothick does average over 40 at the moment (41 I think) Vaughan needs to pick up his game, but I think he will.

Definately agree about Tudor to some degree. He looked stuffed yesterday ... but then again he had been bowling for 3 days and most of it without Caddick. Hoggard was still going strong though. He is a future champ for England IMO.

[Dipper]

There's been a definite overall improvement since Hussain/Fletcher took charge it hasn't all been an upward curve though a few ups & downs.This series against Sri Lanka seems impressive as they came into after winning 9 Tests on the trot so to batter them in the last 2 tests is pretty satisfying BUT I'm not getting too carried away their 'pace' attack is the worst I've seen over here for a Test series since I started seriously following cricket in 1985.It's good to see our batsmen filling their boots & I can't remember seeing so many 100's from our batsman in any series let alone a 3 match one.

Funnily enough though come the Ashes I reckon it will be our bowlers that perform better & that we'll still struggle to regularly post competitive totals.Seindude is right to point out the Warne factor & even last summer when our hopes were high Gillespie & McGrath sorted out Trescothick's technique to some degree & destroyed lesser batsmen like Ward whilst the tail struggled to punch their weight as per usual.

For me the fast bowling resources are our greatest strength-we bowled Sri Lank out twice here on a good pitch without Gough & Caddick.Hoggard is pretty lethal if there's a bit of swing (although he struggles a bit without it) & Flintoff will bowl all day up hill into the wind etc & give the otheres a break.Tudor has a Test strike rate of a wicket every 42 balls & he can also bat whilst I reckon we'll take Simon Jones on the ashes trip-for those that don't know he'd be the quickest English bowler out there & probably as quick as nearly any one out there in world cricket.We still lack a spinner of real class but we've proved we can bowl people out on flat tracks & that's a big strength to have.

It's good to see you hoping for a competitive series Briedis I'm sure most of us would be happy with that even if we lose, if the situation was reversed & England had won every series since 89 I don't reckon to many England supporters would be saying the same as you though I reckon most would happily sit through one sided series winning about 3-1 every time for the next 50years:D

[Briedis]

Originally posted by DIPPER
There's been a definite overall improvement since Hussain/Fletcher took charge it hasn't all been an upward curve though a few ups & downs.This series against Sri Lanka seems impressive as they came into after winning 9 Tests on the trot so to batter them in the last 2 tests is pretty satisfying BUT I'm not getting too carried away their 'pace' attack is the worst I've seen over here for a Test series since I started seriously following cricket in 1985.It's good to see our batsmen filling their boots & I can't remember seeing so many 100's from our batsman in any series let alone a 3 match one.

Funnily enough though come the Ashes I reckon it will be our bowlers that perform better & that we'll still struggle to regularly post competitive totals.Seindude is right to point out the Warne factor & even last summer when our hopes were high Gillespie & McGrath sorted out Trescothick's technique to some degree & destroyed lesser batsmen like Ward whilst the tail struggled to punch their weight as per usual.

For me the fast bowling resources are our greatest strength-we bowled Sri Lank out twice here on a good pitch without Gough & Caddick.Hoggard is pretty lethal if there's a bit of swing (although he struggles a bit without it) & Flintoff will bowl all day up hill into the wind etc & give the otheres a break.Tudor has a Test strike rate of a wicket every 42 balls & he can also bat whilst I reckon we'll take Simon Jones on the ashes trip-for those that don't know he'd be the quickest English bowler out there & probably as quick as nearly any one out there in world cricket.We still lack a spinner of real class but we've proved we can bowl people out on flat tracks & that's a big strength to have.

It's good to see you hoping for a competitive series Briedis I'm sure most of us would be happy with that even if we lose, if the situation was reversed & England had won every series since 89 I don't reckon to many England supporters would be saying the same as you though I reckon most would happily sit through one sided series winning about 3-1 every time for the next 50years:D

Hey, look don't get me wrong. I'll be at the Adelaide and Sydney tests this year and I will be hoping that the Aussies wipe the floor with you Pommy bastards! ;)

Where is the next Jim Laker for England? What about the guy you took to India ... can't remember his name. He looked alright...

The Aussie grip on cricket is a little less tight without the Waughs IMO. A bit early to tell, but I reckon this new side will be prone to "reckless" cricket. Some of the batting against the Pakis in this ODI series has been cowboy stuff. Great to watch if your a novice in the crowd, but to see quality players just swiping at the ball, slogging, just doesn't do it for me. They will lose more games than they will win against serious opposition if they continue to do that. I miss the class of Mark Waugh I guess, he was sweet to watch when in touch....

[Slax]

They still have another test series this summer so we'll wait and see what has happened. But all I know is that 1 series win is not a revival.

[Booze Hound]

Briedis. The offie on the India tour was Richard Dawson of Yorkshire. I agree, he looked quite useful.

England's team at the moment is looking reasonably strong.

Trescothick settled into Test cricket superbly well, Vaughan suffered with bad luck and injuries for a while but I always thought he looked the part, Butcher has worked hard at his game and his life and is going like a train, I've never been too keen on Hussain but he is doing well at the moment, Thorpe is just class without being spectacular, Stewart will bat well at 6 while some young keepers need to work at their game to oust him (the other week I heard someone complain about picking this 'old man' as keeper ahead of youngsters like Warren Hegg -Hegg is 34), Flintoff looks comfortable now as a bowler and his batting will come (I'd love to see him blast Warne and McGrath for a couple of hours:)), Tudor is very talented and given a good run will prove his worth, Giles can contain well and if he gets any help from the pitch his height makes him a problem and the Caddick, Gough, Hoggard front line seam attack is very varied and will challenge any batsman. I give a lot of credit to Duncan Fletcher who treats every player as an invidual (unlike some in the past like Graham Gooch who thought what was right for him was right for everyone) and his analysis of the game is excellent.

At youth level the set up in England is strong. The problem still exists with the County game due to too many short sighted Chief Executive's who should realise where their real money comes from and aim at that.

As Rod Marsh found out, I think slightly to his surprise, there is a great amount of talent there. If it is given the right conditions to flourish the future is promising but it won't happen overnight.

[Dipper]

Originally posted by Slax
They still have another test series this summer so we'll wait and see what has happened. But all I know is that 1 series win is not a revival.

For sure but we're looking at the general improvement since 2000 when Fletcher & Hussain really got things moving.We beat Zim & Windies & then went out to Pakistan & Sri Lanka & won both series.We followed that with a 1-1 draw with Pakistan when we gave the second Test away & then got trounced by the Aussies(although we were hit terribly by injuries-I still think we would have lost but we might have made a fight of it) & then we went to India without Gough or Caddick & a really inexperinced attack where we were wiped out in the 1st Test & where in the 2nd/3rd Tests we dominated & could have won both without the intervention of the weather.We drew 1-1 in NZ where we bottled it in the last Test but let's face it the Kiwis had just held your blokes in Aussie so they're no easy beats.

I'm the last person to get too carried away & I judge them a good deal harsher than I reckon the rest of the English contingent on here does-Booze Hound,NY Pomme & Brett Li but credit where it's due there has been a definite improvement in our play in the last 2 years-we're improving in every facet of the game & there's some hope with a few of the younger blokes coming through.So really any optimism isn't just based on this series.

As for Dawson Briedis yeh he looked ok in India but Yorkshire are really struggling this season & as you'd know Headingley is a bit of a spinner's graveyard so it's a bit hard for him to show his stuff.
On the subject of Mark Waugh (who used to be one of my favourites when he played for my county Essex) being good to watch don't you reckon that Martyn is as pleasing on the eye when he gets going?Last summer if there was one aussie batsman I enjoyed watching it was him, his stroke play on the offside especially was somehting else.

Booze Hound, I agree with a lot of what you said especially regarding the counties holding back the national team (one of the reason's we're doing better is that the England players hardly get an outing for the counties now) the only thing I'm not convinced about is Flintoff giving McGrath & Warne a bit of stick for a couple of hours.I reckon he'd struggle to get McGrath away & that Warnie would bamboozle him & make him look silly:(

[Briedis]

Originally posted by Slax
They still have another test series this summer so we'll wait and see what has happened. But all I know is that 1 series win is not a revival.

I thought England battled really well in India and in New Zealand as well with a weak squad.

I agree that the series against India in England will be a good test for the Poms.

[Briedis]

Originally posted by DIPPER


For sure but we're looking at the general improvement since 2000 when Fletcher & Hussain really got things moving.We beat Zim & Windies & then went out to Pakistan & Sri Lanka & won both series.We followed that with a 1-1 draw with Pakistan when we gave the second Test away & then got trounced by the Aussies(although we were hit terribly by injuries-I still think we would have lost but we might have made a fight of it) & then we went to India without Gough or Caddick & a really inexperinced attack where we were wiped out in the 1st Test & where in the 2nd/3rd Tests we dominated & could have won both without the intervention of the weather.We drew 1-1 in NZ where we bottled it in the last Test but let's face it the Kiwis had just held your blokes in Aussie so they're no easy beats.

I'm the last person to get too carried away & I judge them a good deal harsher than I reckon the rest of the English contingent on here does-Booze Hound,NY Pomme & Brett Li but credit where it's due there has been a definite improvement in our play in the last 2 years-we're improving in every facet of the game & there's some hope with a few of the younger blokes coming through.So really any optimism isn't just based on this series.

As for Dawson Briedis yeh he looked ok in India but Yorkshire are really struggling this season & as you'd know Headingley is a bit of a spinner's graveyard so it's a bit hard for him to show his stuff.
On the subject of Mark Waugh (who used to be one of my favourites when he played for my county Essex) being good to watch don't you reckon that Martyn is as pleasing on the eye when he gets going?Last summer if there was one aussie batsman I enjoyed watching it was him, his stroke play on the offside especially was somehting else.

Booze Hound, I agree with a lot of what you said especially regarding the counties holding back the national team (one of the reason's we're doing better is that the England players hardly get an outing for the counties now) the only thing I'm not convinced about is Flintoff giving McGrath & Warne a bit of stick for a couple of hours.I reckon he'd struggle to get McGrath away & that Warnie would bamboozle him & make him look silly:(

Yeah, Dawson, that's the guy. I likes the look of him for a young bloke. He is definately one worth investing in. If his home ground is a spinners graveyard then perhaps the powers that be should encourage him to move to a county side that will be of more benefit to him. England have definately improved all facets of the game except their spin department. It's important to have a decent spinner in your side to provide flexibility.

On Martyn, he is the best bat we have at the moment as far as grace goes, but he still isn't a patch on Mark Waugh IMO. And after this ODI series the Aussie batsmen need to have a good, hard look at themselves. It's been a long time since I have seen an Aussie batting line-up bat like a bunch of cowboys. Ricky Ponting needs to remember that you can play defensive shots when you first come in and you can't hit boundaries every ball. Very immature performance from the Aussies. Hayden should not play one day cricket.

I can't wait for the Ashes to start. Do any of you Aussies here know if the England/India tests will be on FOX? I have enjoyed watching the non_aussie tests they have put on in the last year. I'm glad that they have finally put on Sri Lanka so I can have a look at them. Very impressed with Arnold and Attapatu. Very dissapointed with Vass. Sri Lanka will struggle against any decent batsmen. They will struggle to win tests against decent sides as they only have one bowler who is test standard IMO. Bowlers win tests not batsmen.

This year on FOX I have watched:

West Indies vs Sth Africa
India vs Australia
England vs Australia
South Africa vs India
India vs England
England vs Sri Lanka

I would never had had that chance without FOX, I love it!

I would love to see more of the West Indies, they are my second favourite side after the Aussies. I loved the WI when they had that super side in the 80's, VIV you legend. Hopefully, they can rebuild too.

I wish the ACB would pull their fingers out and play some winter tests over here in the more tropical areas like Darwin, Nth QLD etc. to expand the game here in Oz.

[Youngster]

Originally posted by Briedis


I wish the ACB would pull their fingers out and play some winter tests over here in the more tropical areas like Darwin, Nth QLD etc. to expand the game here in Oz.

You'll get your wish next winter - there is going to be an upgrade of Mararra Stadium in Darwin to make it suitable for international cricket...I think it will be either Bangladesh or Zimbabwe. Cairns has also been talked about as a venue. Will be huge - I'll make the trek from Alice up the track...

I think it would have made more sense to have held the Aus Pak Super Challenge up there, in their cricket season rather than indoors in Melbourne and Brisbane in the heart of footy season...that was ludicrously lacking in logic...

[Briedis]

Originally posted by Youngster

You'll get your wish next winter - there is going to be an upgrade of Mararra Stadium in Darwin to make it suitable for international cricket...I think it will be either Bangladesh or Zimbabwe. Cairns has also been talked about as a venue. Will be huge - I'll make the trek from Alice up the track...


That's great news! About time, I reckon.

Originally posted by Youngster

I think it would have made more sense to have held the Aus Pak Super Challenge up there, in their cricket season rather than indoors in Melbourne and Brisbane in the heart of footy season...that was ludicrously lacking in logic...

I don't think they had many other choices.... What about a match in the Alice one day?!? I reckon the Alice pitch would have to be a spinners track wouldn't it? ;)