View Full Version : Expansion Just how viable is the Gold Coast
I mean you really shouldn't make assumptions about the place. You wouldn't know.
Well perhaps you could educate us all. If you say 80% of the people from Melbourne are actively interested in Aussie Rules, what would you suggest the level of interest is from the Gold Coast, regional Queensland, and northern NSW.
FWIW I have been to all three places, so I wasn't taking a blind stab in the dark.
Well perhaps you could educate us all. If you say 80% of the people from Melbourne are actively interested in Aussie Rules, what would you suggest the level of interest is from the Gold Coast, regional Queensland, and northern NSW.
FWIW I have been to all three places, so I wasn't taking a blind stab in the dark.
I have been to Italy, but I wouldn't presume to label them all soccer fans. Why can't the gold coast people enjoy more than one sport? Why is it one or another?
I have been to Italy, but I wouldn't presume to label them all soccer fans. Why can't the gold coast people enjoy more than one sport? Why is it one or another?
I've been to Italy and I'm prepared to say that more of them are interested in football than ice hockey.
And I didn't say all would be rugby or league supporters, I said most. And while I'm sure there will be many capable of enjoying any sport, what you are trying to attract is the people that would see Aussie Rules as their number 1 sport. Go to games, buy merchandise etc.
Are you prepared to guesstimate a percentage? Aussie Rules, Rugby, League, other sport, no sport?
I've been to Italy and I'm prepared to say that more of them are interested in football than ice hockey.
And I didn't say all would be rugby or league supporters, I said most.
Are you prepared to guesstimate a percentage? Aussie Rules, Rugby, League, other sport, no sport?
No, I am not, and if you do, you will probably be wrong. I will go with the AFL's feeling on the matter, as they have spent the money on research rather than your feeble attempt at guessing a number, as compelling and scientific as it must be.
No, I am not, and if you do, you will probably be wrong. I will go with the AFL's feeling on the matter, as they have spent the money on research rather than your feeble attempt at guessing a number, as compelling and scientific as it must be.
I thought not. Do you deny that more people in the regions mentioned are interested in rugby union or league than the numbers interested in Aussie Rules?
And I wouldn't believe the AFL for a second. There is more than enough evidence that they are prepared to distort the truth on issues when they're trying to force their will on the gullible footy follower.
And if their research was so clear cut they would have no problems publicising it. I'll give you my estimate of the chances of that happening. 0%.
I thought not. Do you deny that more people in the regions mentioned are interested in rugby union or league than the numbers interested in Aussie Rules?
And I wouldn't believe the AFL for a second. There is more than enough evidence that they are prepared to distort the truth on issues when they're trying to force their will on the gullible footy follower.
And if their research was so clear cut they would have no problems publicising it. I'll give you my estimate of the chances of that happening. 0%.
Go right ahead and stick your head in the sand. The AFL really do want to systematically destroy the league and have no interest in making money in new markets.
Now, which is more likely?
Go right ahead and stick your head in the sand. The AFL really do want to systematically destroy the league and have no interest in making money in new markets.
Now, which is more likely?
Ha ha, you're not interested in debate at all. You just want to discount everything a Roos supporters says, but you don't have the bottle to concede any negatives. Of course the rugby's are more popular on the Gold Coast than Ausie Rules. Thevery fact you can't concede that says everything about your argument for me.
FWIW, the Gold Coast isn't going to destroy the league. The AFL will make sure of that. What it will do is cost the clubs a fortune, maybe even send one or two of them into the position we're in at the moment.
But if it's so clear cut why don't they release the research and let everyone in on the secret. We aren't all like you, willing to bend over just because the AFL says so. And like I've said before, if the facts are there (not the spin), if the supporters are fully informed, and if the decision is one that our board can make without the duress they are currently being placed under then I personally will support the move.
OK moomba,
Either the league is totally irrational and bent on destroying your club, OR they have a plan for how to make a team work on the GC.
Presumably, this plan is long term, and involves the new team being AT LEAST as viable as the Kangaroos.
Tell me, why do you think they're doing it?
Either the league is totally irrational and bent on destroying your club, OR they have a plan for how to make a team work on the GC.
I've already said they'll make sure the team will be viable, but it will cost a fortune to do so. It won't cost the AFL a fortune, it will cost the clubs a fortune, maybe even sending another couple to the wall paving the way for the next phase of expansion.
Presumably, this plan is long term, and involves the new team being AT LEAST as viable as the Kangaroos.
Tell me, why do you think they're doing it?
Who knows, they haven't told anyone. Until they do I will strongly oppose.
Like I said, if they show the facts, they let us make a decision without constant spin, then I will support the move. But I wonder why they won't do that, what do they have to hide?
Not as viable as Los Angeles, 3.8 million people, huge television market and no football team.
Play 4 games home, then 4 away, to lessen the travel impact.
A definite goer. :D
Moomba, Helix has been quoted as saying that the GC is an Aussie Rules town. He hates it when I remind him.
I am not sure where some of you get the Gold Coast being RL heartland. It really isn't. Have you ever even been here? It is an AFL city, have no doubt.
http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?p=4233684#post4233684
Moomba, Helix has been quoted as saying that the GC is an Aussie Rules town. He hates it when I remind him.
http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?p=4233684#post4233684
I have no problem with it, and stand by it, in the context that it was aimed.
I have repeatedly stated, yet I will do it again here since you might be a little slow, that the Gold Coast IS an AFL town AS WELL as a rugby league town. We are quite capable of supporting more than one sport, due to the massive numbers of Victorians who saw the light (sunlight) and moved here, combined with the traditional support for Rugby League. The sports are both very well represented at all the schools in the area, Auskick is commonplace.
Since the Titans have started, we have embraced them too. See, I am a Melbourne boy, grew up in Melbourne, am (obviously) mad keen on AFL, and support rugby league as well. Isn't that amazing! This is how it works here.
I have no problem with it, and stand by it, in the context that it was aimed.
I have repeatedly stated, yet I will do it again here since you might be a little slow, that the Gold Coast IS an AFL town AS WELL as a rugby league town. We are quite capable of supporting more than one sport, due to the massive numbers of Victorians who saw the light (sunlight) and moved here, combined with the traditional support for Rugby League. The sports are both very well represented at all the schools in the area, Auskick is commonplace.
Since the Titans have started, we have embraced them too. See, I am a Melbourne boy, grew up in Melbourne, am (obviously) mad keen on AFL, and support rugby league as well. Isn't that amazing! This is how it works here.
Well put Helix, as I've posted before times are a changing fast and an AFL team up here now would succeed and grow just as fast.
IT SEEMS Moombas problem is that he is intent on telling us that an AFL team wouldn't work up here as justification for him not wanting his Roos up here.
Like the Crows, a GC team would bring people in to the game that might not have otherwise have followed a team.Especially if they get a Port vs Crows rivalry with the Lions going.( I witnessed this in Adelaide, thousands of new fans came on board to watch the worlds best spectator game whom had never followed the code before including yours truly)...yep I can just see the future.....star Gold Coast CHB Nick Rheiwoldt smashes Lion J Brown from behind play causing a 3 week injury... the people scream , the newspapers moan and bang an extra 2,000 fans he he.
..you know we're lucky that Moomba wasn't Captain Cook or he just might have said its too hard and stayed home
IT SEEMS Moombas problem is that he is intent on telling us that an AFL team wouldn't work up here as justification for him not wanting his Roos up here.
I'm waiting for someone to provide evidence to the contrary. Gold Coasts population is 1.3m less than Brisbanes. Brisbane had 15,000 local members last season, an established club on the back of three premierships in a row.
..you know we're lucky that Moomba wasn't Captain Cook or he just might have said its too hard and stayed home
I've already said that I'm prepared to follow a relocated side if it is done correctly, and if the club isn't railroaded into it. You can try and take the piss out of me all you like but what it says very clearly is that you can't attack the points that I'm making, so you need to look for some other angle.
southern star
5 Nov 2007, 18:50
Get over it north how many of you supporters see every melbourne game anyway if it wasnt for wayne carey your club would have folded 10 yearsago like fitzroy
Get over it north how many of you supporters see every melbourne game anyway if it wasnt for wayne carey your club would have folded 10 yearsago like fitzroy
Or St Kilda not that long ago if it wasn't for the generosity of footy supporters of all clubs.
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 18:57
Atleast Moomba is making sence here. What will happen to the Roos if a move fails you morons ???
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 19:00
Get over it north how many of you supporters see every melbourne game anyway if it wasnt for wayne carey your club would have folded 10 yearsago like fitzroyPlease your club isn't in great shape either. S.O.S ( save our saints ) does that wring a bell ?You really are not in a position to bag on other clubs. When was the last time the Saints won anything bar a wooden spoon ?
Atleast Moomba is making sence here. What will happen to the Roos if a move fails you morons ???
1) Its "Sense"
2) No, he is shit scared that his club is moving, and this is the reason most Roos fans object to the Gold Coast. If it was Hawthorn, we would hear nothing from them, but plenty from Hawks supporters. It is understandable, but not sensible.
3) The Roos will fail if they don't, as the last 10 years has shown.
4) I would prefer the Roos to stay in Melbourne too, and admit Southport as the 17th club.
southern star
5 Nov 2007, 19:12
Or St Kilda not that long ago if it wasn't for the generosity of footy supporters of all clubs.
HEY MOOMBA I AGREE IF IT WASNT FOR TONY LOCKETT THE SAINTS WERE GONE
2) No, he is shit scared that his club is moving, and this is the reason most Roos fans object to the Gold Coast. If it was Hawthorn, we would hear nothing from them, but plenty from Hawks supporters. It is understandable, but not sensible.
No, as I have pointed out time and time again if it's done right, I won't have a problem with relocation. I'm not sure how I would feel about a relocated team, but my fight at the moment is based on two premises. 1) I don't think the Gold Coast is a viable place to put a full time club. 2) The AFL has gone totally the wrong way about this, rather than try to force a move against the will of the club administration and members they should be trying to convince people that it will be best for the club to move. To date they've provided nothing other than lies, propaganda, threats and "we want it to happen" statements.
3) The Roos will fail if they don't, as the last 10 years has shown.
A premiership, two GF appearances, 5 finals appearances in the last 10 years does not constitute failure. Or have you forgotten that football isn't played on a balance sheet.
[QUOTE=Helix;9413123]
No, as I have pointed out time and time again if it's done right, I won't have a problem with relocation.
A premiership, two GF appearances, 5 finals appearances in the last 10 years does not constitute failure. Or have you forgotten that football isn't played on a balance sheet.
This is a financial discussion, not a football one.
southern star
5 Nov 2007, 19:17
Please your club isn't in great shape either. S.O.S ( save our saints ) does that wring a bell ?You really are not in a position to bag on other clubs. When was the last time the Saints won anything bar a wooden spoon ?
HEY ******** SOS WAS 16 YEARS AGO NOT YESTERDAY WEVE WON 2 NIGHT FLAGS IN THAT TIME AND RUNNERS UP IN A GF AND I COULDNT GIVE A SHIT IF MY TEAM WON THE 20 WOODEN SPOONS AT LEAST I COULD GET ON A TRAIN NOT A PLANE TO WATCH THEM.
This is a financial discussion, not a football one.
The thread is about whether or not the Gold Coast is viable, not about Norths finances.
The thread is about whether or not the Gold Coast is viable, not about Norths finances.
Then why did you bring up North Melbourne at all? Too late to back peddle now son.
Then why did you bring up North Melbourne at all? Too late to back peddle now son.
You made the statement that North Melbourne was not successful over the past ten years. Incorrect and ignorant statements like that need correcting dad.
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 19:28
HEY ******** SOS WAS 16 YEARS AGO NOT YESTERDAY WEVE WON 2 NIGHT FLAGS IN THAT TIME AND RUNNERS UP IN A GF AND I COULDNT GIVE A SHIT IF MY TEAM WON THE 20 WOODEN SPOONS AT LEAST I COULD GET ON A TRAIN NOT A PLANE TO WATCH THEM.
Two night flags? And even a grand final 'appearance'?
Whoa... :eek:
You made the statement that North Melbourne was not successful over the past ten years. Incorrect and ignorant statements like that need correcting dad.
Yes, but it was obviously meant as a financial one. On field the Kangaroos have been good, which simply supports the argument that in spite of on field success, not enough people follow the roos for them to be viable in Melbourne. Personally, I hope you stay in Melbourne, and the Sharks get a licence. Then, let nature take its course. Nothing ignorant or incorrect about it.
Yes, but it was obviously meant as a financial one. On field the Kangaroos have been good, which simply supports the argument that in spite of on field success, not enough people follow the roos for them to be viable in Melbourne. Personally, I hope you stay in Melbourne, and the Sharks get a licence. Then, let nature take its course. Nothing ignorant or incorrect about it.
If you want to talk about Norths finances there are plenty of threads for it, this as clearly stated is about the viability of a club on the Gold Coast.
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 19:34
1) Its "Sense"
2) No, he is shit scared that his club is moving, and this is the reason most Roos fans object to the Gold Coast. If it was Hawthorn, we would hear nothing from them, but plenty from Hawks supporters. It is understandable, but not sensible.
3) The Roos will fail if they don't, as the last 10 years has shown.
4) I would prefer the Roos to stay in Melbourne too, and admit Southport as the 17th club.So the AFL should spend money in a region that doesn't give a rats toss about the game ?
If you want to talk about Norths finances there are plenty of threads for it, this as clearly stated is about the viability of a club on the Gold Coast.
It is obviously relevant here, due to your motivation for denying the obvious viability.
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 19:38
Two night flags? And even a grand final 'appearance'?
Whoa... :eek:Who did they lose to again ???
So the AFL should spend money in a region that doesn't give a rats toss about the game ?
No, they shouldn't. But we are talking about the Gold Coast, which obviously does care very much. But feel free to make stuff up, it seems to be a theme among the detractors.
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 19:41
HEY ******** SOS WAS 16 YEARS AGO NOT YESTERDAY WEVE WON 2 NIGHT FLAGS IN THAT TIME AND RUNNERS UP IN A GF AND I COULDNT GIVE A SHIT IF MY TEAM WON THE 20 WOODEN SPOONS AT LEAST I COULD GET ON A TRAIN NOT A PLANE TO WATCH THEM.OK lets do this!!!
I don't get to see my team that often as we sell out every game in Adelaide so getting tickets is difficult we don't go arround with tin cans dangling arround our necks with SoS either.. When was the last time your pittiful team sold out a match ? I remember it was when the crows spanked you in the 97 GF right ???
GAMO OVER.
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 19:43
No, they shouldn't. But we are talking about the Gold Coast, which obviously does care very much. But feel free to make stuff up, it seems to be a theme among the detractors.What ? I'm not making it up I'm stating the facts mate. GC is rugby land not AFL spending all the recourses up there is a good idea until it fails.
What ? I'm not making it up I'm stating the facts mate. GC is rugby land not AFL spending all the recourses up there is a good idea until it fails.
1) "Resources"
2) No, you aren't. You have no clue. But thanks for coming along.
It is obviously relevant here, due to your motivation for denying the obvious viability.
For the record, and once again, this thread is about the Gold Coast. If you presume that North have to move (and that is subject to debate on other threads), is the Gold Coast the best place to move to? Is it viable?
Instead of just sitting back trying to pick holes in my arguments, why don't you put forward a few constructive ones yourself?
Cause all you're doing at the moment is trying to detract attention from the fact that Gold Coast isn't a viable place to have an AFL team unless you're going to sink tens of millions of the other clubs money into it.
southern star
5 Nov 2007, 19:49
Two night flags? And even a grand final 'appearance'?
Whoa... :eek:
ITS BETTER THAN THE GOLD COAST BUDDY
southern star
5 Nov 2007, 19:51
Who did they lose to again ???
ADELAIDE BIG DEAL SO DID NORTH WHO DID YOU LOSE AGAINST IN 05 IN ADELAIDE TO STOP YOU WINNING THE FLAG
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 19:53
North melbourneThe Crows.
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 19:55
1) "Resources"
2) No, you aren't. You have no clue. But thanks for coming along.Thanks for the correction needles.
For the record, and once again, this thread is about the Gold Coast. If you presume that North have to move (and that is subject to debate on other threads), is the Gold Coast the best place to move to? Is it viable?
Instead of just sitting back trying to pick holes in my arguments, why don't you put forward a few constructive ones yourself?
Cause all you're doing at the moment is trying to detract attention from the fact that Gold Coast isn't a viable place to have an AFL team unless you're going to sink tens of millions of the other clubs money into it.
This premise is rubbish. You have shown nothing to support this. Just passion fed bleeting. I look at this from a pure business point of view. The AFL have smart people, and they are not going to pick a place that is so obviously going to fail. You are blinded by your passion, and that is the only fact here. If the AFL think it is viable, and they are the only ones who have spent the time and money to find out, then I tend to take their word over yours. I am more aware of the awareness and support of AFL on the Gold Coast than you, do you agree? I think you have a poor understanding of the sporting dynamic here. You raised the discussion, but have shown nothing at all that is actually based in fact. Nothing. Nada. Zip. Make an argument, then I will something to respond to, but so far you have failed to raise a single valid point.
Thanks for the correction needles.
Welcome.
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 19:56
Heres my two cents:
The AFL probably could make a Gold Coast team work. Probably.
But there are two major problems with this-
1) If you are going to risk the heritage and history of a 140-year-old football club, you want better than 'probable' success- you want guaranteed- which the AFL simply cannot promise.
2) The amount of resources wasted on making a Gold Coast team (a relocated 'North' or otherwise) work would far outweigh the benefits.
By this I mean the money, time and effort the AFL would spend up there that could be better spent on so many other areas. How much money has Demetriou already committed to spending up there?
But just as important would be the rigging of the 'competition' to help the new team out (salary cap concessions, draft concessions, priority draft zones etc) which would compromise our game even further. It wouldn' be fair that an up-and-coming Bulldogs or Collingwood side (for example) finish runners up in the 2011 Grand Final because the AFL gave the Gold Coast side all manner of advantages in the interest of 'promoting the game'.
I mean, one of the great prides we take in our sport over so many others is that we believe it is an 'even playing field', where no-one can 'buy' premierships, and everybody has a 'fair' chance at the pinnacle of success. But the truth is that the AFL consider the actual competition to be ancillary to their main objective of 'expanding the game' (read- making more $$$). Just as they gave the Lions a helping hand or three (if you don't know what I'm talking about- look it up) they would surely give the Gold Coast more of the same. If you believe the papers, they've already promised it. Not only is it not fair- it just isn't right. Not in a professional sport.
What is the point in having a salary cap if one or two teams are effectively exempt? What is the point of a ladder-position based draft if one team is given priority regardless? What is the point of an open draft if one team gets its very own zones? Really- think about this. Think about what it does to the integrity of the competition and our sport.
Of course, without such 'helping hands' the Gold Coast team would surely struggle even worse. We saw what happened to Brisbane once its concessions and flags dried up- so did the supporters. Of course the AFL would ensure the club was 'successful' on-field bit really, at what cost?
Problem number one is enough for me to say 'No thanks', but I am a North supporter so perhaps I won't gain much support here.
But surely anyone who cares about our game and about fairness and equality in general must disapprove of what the AFL has become all about. This is the Australian Football League, not the Australian Financial League.
ArachniX
5 Nov 2007, 19:59
No, they shouldn't. But we are talking about the Gold Coast, which obviously does care very much. But feel free to make stuff up, it seems to be a theme among the detractors.
So there are thousands of AFL followers on the Gold Coast that follow the game but fortunately don't actually barrack for a side? The good old Southport side that gets mentioned, that only got 2500 to its Grand Final this year (so my research tells me), is more valuable than the 22k members in Melbourne.
Where I am from in Country Victoria (North East) a Grand Final there will get near 5000 people not to mention the Ovens & Murray which got over 15000 this year. Call us detractors but feel free to make stuff up....
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 19:59
ITS BETTER THAN THE GOLD COAST BUDDY
Mate, the Gold Coast club (whether a relocated 'North' or otherwise) will have more flags in its first ten years than your club has to show for its entire history in the sport. I would be wiling to put a lot of dollars on it.
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 20:05
This premise is rubbish. You have shown nothing to support this. Just passion fed bleeting. I look at this from a pure business point of view. The AFL have smart people, and they are not going to pick a place that is so obviously going to fail. You are blinded by your passion, and that is the only fact here. If the AFL think it is viable, and they are the only ones who have spent the time and money to find out, then I tend to take their word over yours. I am more aware of the awareness and support of AFL on the Gold Coast than you, do you agree? I think you have a poor understanding of the sporting dynamic here. You raised the discussion, but have shown nothing at all that is actually based in fact. Nothing. Nada. Zip. Make an argument, then I will something to respond to, but so far you have failed to raise a single valid point.Bla bla bla!!! You can't come up with anything original can you ? Lets hope our clubs don't ever sink to the level that you find exceptable.
I hate resorting to insults but you are vey annoying.
Rex - Crow
5 Nov 2007, 20:08
Mate, the Gold Coast club (whether a relocated 'North' or otherwise) will have more flags in its first ten years than your club has to show for its entire history in the sport. I would be wiling to put a lot of dollars on it.Hey they have won 2 night flags since 1963 and made a GF what a great trophy display they have.
St Kilda are a JOKE!!!!!
This premise is rubbish. You have shown nothing to support this. Just passion fed bleeting.
I've said why I believe my premise to be the case, all you've done is stamp you feet and say "you're wrong, you're wrong", correct peoples spelling, and change the topic onto something you're more comfortable discussing. You've yet to show anything to support any point of view, but I guess it's always easier to knock someones elses argument than actually make one of your own.
I look at this from a pure business point of view. The AFL have smart people, and they are not going to pick a place that is so obviously going to fail.
Ah, the old "AFL told me it was a good idea, so it must be" argument. Oh well, at least you've made one.
You are blinded by your passion, and that is the only fact here. If the AFL think it is viable, and they are the only ones who have spent the time and money to find out, then I tend to take their word over yours. I am more aware of the awareness and support of AFL on the Gold Coast than you, do you agree? I think you have a poor understanding of the sporting dynamic here. You raised the discussion, but have shown nothing at all that is actually based in fact. Nothing. Nada. Zip. Make an argument, then I will something to respond to, but so far you have failed to raise a single valid point.
I've made the argument time and time again. I don't see how a population 27% of the size Brisbane can expect a whole lot more than 27% of of Brisbanes local membership. Thats between 4-5k local supporters, which is not sustainable without significant input from the AFL. I haven't even gone on (too much) about the fact that a significant percentage of people on the Gold Coast who are interested in football would already be Lions supporters and will remain so. I haven't even gone on (too much) about the fact that Brisbane have just come off one of the most successful eras any club has had for decades. I haven't even gone on about the fact that it has taken the Lions decades to reach the level they are currently at, and I haven't even gone on about the level of support the Gold Coast community gave the Bears when they played at Carrara. I've made the arguments, you just continue to ignore them.
Still, I guess when you are busy correcting spelling mistakes on an internet forum for kicks it must be hard to come up with the time to do anything else.
ArachniX
5 Nov 2007, 20:11
Heres my two cents:
The AFL probably could make a Gold Coast team work. Probably.
But there are two major problems with this-
1) If you are going to risk the heritage and history of a 140-year-old football club, you want better than 'probable' success- you want guaranteed- which the AFL simply cannot promise.
2) The amount of resources wasted on making a Gold Coast team (a relocated 'North' or otherwise) work would far outweigh the benefits.
By this I mean the money, time and effort the AFL would spend up there that could be better spent on so many other areas. How much money has Demetriou already committed to spending up there?
But just as important would be the rigging of the 'competition' to help the new team out (salary cap concessions, draft concessions, priority draft zones etc) which would compromise our game even further. It wouldn' be fair that an up-and-coming Bulldogs or Collingwood side (for example) finish runners up in the 2011 Grand Final because the AFL gave the Gold Coast side all manner of advantages in the interest of 'promoting the game'.
I mean, one of the great prides we take in our sport over so many others is that we believe it is an 'even playing field', where no-one can 'buy' premierships, and everybody has a 'fair' chance at the pinnacle of success. But the truth is that the AFL consider the actual competition to be ancillary to their main objective of 'expanding the game' (read- making more $$$). Just as they gave the Lions a helping hand or three (if you don't know what I'm talking about- look it up) they would surely give the Gold Coast more of the same. If you believe the papers, they've already promised it. Not only is it not fair- it just isn't right. Not in a professional sport.
What is the point in having a salary cap if one or two teams are effectively exempt? What is the point of a ladder-position based draft if one team is given priority regardless? What is the point of an open draft if one team gets its very own zones? Really- think about this. Think about what it does to the integrity of the competition and our sport.
Of course, without such 'helping hands' the Gold Coast team would surely struggle even worse. We saw what happened to Brisbane once its concessions and flags dried up- so did the supporters. Of course the AFL would ensure the club was 'successful' on-field bit really, at what cost?
Problem number one is enough for me to say 'No thanks', but I am a North supporter so perhaps I won't gain much support here.
But surely anyone who cares about our game and about fairness and equality in general must disapprove of what the AFL has become all about. This is the Australian Football League, not the Australian Financial League.
So true, so true. It'll show in the future when the money is needed elsewhere and the Victorian Clubs realise the drain the Northern clubs put on the competition. Not to mention telling a young supporter of the game why all the supporters of his team are angry about losing another Grand Final to a QLD side that is propped up by Victorian/SA/WA money. "Its not fair" No its AFL.
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 20:11
Hey they have won 2 night flags since 1963 and made a GF what a great trophy display they have.
St Kilda are a JOKE!!!!!
Oh, two night premierships? Really? Well pardon me. :D
southern star
5 Nov 2007, 20:14
OK lets do this!!!
I don't get to see my team that often as we sell out every game in Adelaide so getting tickets is difficult we don't go arround with tin cans dangling arround our necks with SoS either.. When was the last time your pittiful team sold out a match ? I remember it was when the crows spanked you in the 97 GF right ???
GAMO OVER.
we dont play in a shoe box buddy
southern star
5 Nov 2007, 20:17
Heres my two cents:
The AFL probably could make a Gold Coast team work. Probably.
But there are two major problems with this-
1) If you are going to risk the heritage and history of a 140-year-old football club, you want better than 'probable' success- you want guaranteed- which the AFL simply cannot promise.
2) The amount of resources wasted on making a Gold Coast team (a relocated 'North' or otherwise) work would far outweigh the benefits.
By this I mean the money, time and effort the AFL would spend up there that could be better spent on so many other areas. How much money has Demetriou already committed to spending up there?
But just as important would be the rigging of the 'competition' to help the new team out (salary cap concessions, draft concessions, priority draft zones etc) which would compromise our game even further. It wouldn' be fair that an up-and-coming Bulldogs or Collingwood side (for example) finish runners up in the 2011 Grand Final because the AFL gave the Gold Coast side all manner of advantages in the interest of 'promoting the game'.
I mean, one of the great prides we take in our sport over so many others is that we believe it is an 'even playing field', where no-one can 'buy' premierships, and everybody has a 'fair' chance at the pinnacle of success. But the truth is that the AFL consider the actual competition to be ancillary to their main objective of 'expanding the game' (read- making more $$$). Just as they gave the Lions a helping hand or three (if you don't know what I'm talking about- look it up) they would surely give the Gold Coast more of the same. If you believe the papers, they've already promised it. Not only is it not fair- it just isn't right. Not in a professional sport.
What is the point in having a salary cap if one or two teams are effectively exempt? What is the point of a ladder-position based draft if one team is given priority regardless? What is the point of an open draft if one team gets its very own zones? Really- think about this. Think about what it does to the integrity of the competition and our sport.
Of course, without such 'helping hands' the Gold Coast team would surely struggle even worse. We saw what happened to Brisbane once its concessions and flags dried up- so did the supporters. Of course the AFL would ensure the club was 'successful' on-field bit really, at what cost?
Problem number one is enough for me to say 'No thanks', but I am a North supporter so perhaps I won't gain much support here.
But surely anyone who cares about our game and about fairness and equality in general must disapprove of what the AFL has become all about. This is the Australian Football League, not the Australian Financial League.
WHY DONT YOU GIVE YOUR TWO CENTS TOO YOUR CLUB THEY NEED IT
So there are thousands of AFL followers on the Gold Coast that follow the game but fortunately don't actually barrack for a side? The good old Southport side that gets mentioned, that only got 2500 to its Grand Final this year (so my research tells me), is more valuable than the 22k members in Melbourne.
Where I am from in Country Victoria (North East) a Grand Final there will get near 5000 people not to mention the Ovens & Murray which got over 15000 this year. Call us detractors but feel free to make stuff up....
At last, a fair point. However. Mt Gravatt was the other side in the grand final, does this mean football in Brisbane is not viable either?
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 20:21
we dont play in a shoe box buddy
Let me make one thing clear here, southern star:
Nobody here is your buddy. Not even your fellow Saint supporters. They must cringe when they read dribble like your posts. It gives their entire fanbase a bad image which they don't deserve. If a fellow roofan was making a spectacle of himself like you are now, I would PM him quicksmart and ask him politely to shutup. Fortunately this has never happened as North fans seem to have a little more common sense than others.
I've said why I believe my premise to be the case, all you've done is stamp you feet and say "you're wrong, you're wrong", correct peoples spelling, and change the topic onto something you're more comfortable discussing. You've yet to show anything to support any point of view, but I guess it's always easier to knock someones elses argument than actually make one of your own.
Ah, the old "AFL told me it was a good idea, so it must be" argument. Oh well, at least you've made one.
I've made the argument time and time again. I don't see how a population 27% of the size Brisbane can expect a whole lot more than 27% of of Brisbanes local membership. Thats between 4-5k local supporters, which is not sustainable without significant input from the AFL. I haven't even gone on (too much) about the fact that a significant percentage of people on the Gold Coast who are interested in football would already be Lions supporters and will remain so. I haven't even gone on (too much) about the fact that Brisbane have just come off one of the most successful eras any club has had for decades. I haven't even gone on about the fact that it has taken the Lions decades to reach the level they are currently at, and I haven't even gone on about the level of support the Gold Coast community gave the Bears when they played at Carrara. I've made the arguments, you just continue to ignore them.
Still, I guess when you are busy correcting spelling mistakes on an internet forum for kicks it must be hard to come up with the time to do anything else.
You just killed your own argument.
When the Bears played on the Gold Coast 20 years ago they had more members than your 27% estimate. See anything wrong with your figures? They are just crap mate. That isn't an argument, it is a rant. More people than that went along to see the kangaroos play, hell, more than that went to see Melbourne play Adelaide at Cararra. Imagine, just for a minute, a team with a local identity, promotion, sponsorship, and thus, support.
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 20:26
At last, a fair point. However. Mt Gravatt was the other side in the grand final, does this mean football in Brisbane is not viable either?
In case you weren't aware, Brisbane actually already have an AFL side to follow, so they don't have to settle for QAFL. Their side is called 'Brisbane'.
The reason why Southport's dismal GF turnout is brought up is because it illustrates quite clearly that the much-touted 'Southport Sharks' and their supposed ready-made fanbase are little more than a country football team.
It also serves as an indication of the true Aussie Rules support in the region. If i was 'begging' for an AFL team but didn't have one, you know who I'd follow instead? The local QAFL team. Guess who Gold Coasters by-and-large don't support? I'll let the 2.5 - 3k answer that question.
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 20:28
You just killed your own argument.
When the Bears played on the Gold Coast 20 years ago they had more members than your 27% estimate. See anything wrong with your figures? They are just crap mate. That isn't an argument, it is a rant. More people than that went along to see the kangaroos play, hell, more than that went to see Melbourne play Adelaide at Cararra. Imagine, just for a minute, a team with a local identity, promotion, sponsorship, and thus, support.
Alright matey- you are the expert, you tell us.
How many members can Gold Coast expect in 2010 (supposing, for argument's sake, they have a team then)?
And with what relevant facts, figures, statistics, anecdotal evidence etc. do you back up your claim?
ArachniX
5 Nov 2007, 20:31
At last, a fair point. However. Mt Gravatt was the other side in the grand final, does this mean football in Brisbane is not viable either?
Of course it's viable but only with handouts. Brisbane technically would have died every year from its inception in 1987 without constant handouts from the AFL. I did mention in another post about the East Coast Bears. Have you heard of them? The money spent on Brisbane as well as zones and priority picks over uncontracted players has made Brisbane viable, not to mention the free Grand Finals they got. The Western Bulldogs haven't been in a Grand Final for years let alone won 3 in a row but they still survive. Where would Brisbane really be if they could compete on a level playing field? If that same money was put into the Victorian clubs they wouldn't be struggling these days. They are only struggling "relative" to the big clubs but exist in a much stronger way than either Sydney or Brisbane.
southern star
5 Nov 2007, 20:33
Let me make one thing clear here, southern star:
Nobody here is your buddy. Not even your fellow Saint supporters. They must cringe when they read dribble like your posts. It gives their entire fanbase a bad image which they don't deserve. If a fellow roofan was making a spectacle of himself like you are now, I would PM him quicksmart and ask him politely to shutup. Fortunately this has never happened as North fans seem to have a little more common sense than others.
OH MY GOD I WANT BE ABLE TO SLEEP 2NIGHT
In case you weren't aware, Brisbane actually already have an AFL side to follow, so they don't have to settle for QAFL. Their side is called 'Brisbane'.
The reason why Southport's dismal GF turnout is brought up is because it illustrates quite clearly that the much-touted 'Southport Sharks' and their supposed ready-made fanbase are little more than a country football team.
It also serves as an indication of the true Aussie Rules support in the region. If i was 'begging' for an AFL team but didn't have one, you know who I'd follow instead? The local QAFL team. Guess who Gold Coasters by-and-large don't support? I'll let the 2.5 - 3k answer that question.
I never said they are ready made at all. I have said, however, that they have cash. As for the crowd figures, we can directly correlate these to the same situation with the Titans. The QRL Wizard cup between Tweed Heads (Gold Coast based) and Redcliffe drew a small crowd (i do not have exact numbers, but low) at Suncorp stadium, yet the Titans had a very good year in their first year. Maybe the numbers dont flow like that.
Alright matey- you are the expert, you tell us.
How many members can Gold Coast expect in 2010 (supposing, for argument's sake, they have a team then)?
And with what relevant facts, figures, statistics, anecdotal evidence etc. do you back up your claim?
I don't think memberships is an issue with the new Gold Coast team or the relocated Roos. Its all about exposing more people to AFL. Giving QLD 2 teams to ensure that they have 2 games of AFL on TV every week that the public would be interrested in and 2 local derbies that would generate great interest.
We all know that Brisbane, Sydney and 2 other teams aren't going to have massive memberships. But they will have good if not great TV audiences. That is where the money is. Not memberships. Its the TV dollars.
Of course it's viable but only with handouts. Brisbane technically would have died every year from its inception in 1987 without constant handouts from the AFL. I did mention in another post about the East Coast Bears. Have you heard of them? The money spent on Brisbane as well as zones and priority picks over uncontracted players has made Brisbane viable, not to mention the free Grand Finals they got. The Western Bulldogs haven't been in a Grand Final for years let alone won 3 in a row but they still survive. Where would Brisbane really be if they could compete on a level playing field? If that same money was put into the Victorian clubs they wouldn't be struggling these days. They are only struggling "relative" to the big clubs but exist in a much stronger way than either Sydney or Brisbane.
The problem is if it wasn't for Sydney and Brisbane the AFL would not have the massive money from the TV deal they did. So basicly the 2 teams are paying for themselves and all others
Of course it's viable but only with handouts. Brisbane technically would have died every year from its inception in 1987 without constant handouts from the AFL. I did mention in another post about the East Coast Bears. Have you heard of them? The money spent on Brisbane as well as zones and priority picks over uncontracted players has made Brisbane viable, not to mention the free Grand Finals they got. The Western Bulldogs haven't been in a Grand Final for years let alone won 3 in a row but they still survive. Where would Brisbane really be if they could compete on a level playing field? If that same money was put into the Victorian clubs they wouldn't be struggling these days. They are only struggling "relative" to the big clubs but exist in a much stronger way than either Sydney or Brisbane.
That old chestnut. If the salary cap allowance was so important in out triple premiership years, surely Sydney would have had 4 in a row by now. Level playing field? You are naive. Melbourne based club players get more than Brisbane players when you take all their income into account. Those who claim Brisbane is the AFL's love child are right. We are money. The AFL loves money.
You just killed your own argument.
When the Bears played on the Gold Coast 20 years ago they had more members than your 27% estimate. See anything wrong with your figures? They are just crap mate. That isn't an argument, it is a rant. More people than that went along to see the kangaroos play, hell, more than that went to see Melbourne play Adelaide at Cararra. Imagine, just for a minute, a team with a local identity, promotion, sponsorship, and thus, support.
Average attendances - Carrara Stadium (1987-1992)
http://stats.rleague.com/afl/crowds/vn_carrara.html
1987 - 8,965
1988 - 12,425
1989 - 10,944
1990 - 8,997
1991 - 7,399
1992 - 6,499
Remember, thats attendances not memberships. It includes Bears supporting non-members, opposition supporters, media, administrators and freebies given to kids to make the crowds less embarassing. And they weren't competing against a very successful AFL team located just up the road.
What source do you have for Bears memberships during the Carrara years, I'd be very interested to see the facts if you have any.
Average attendances - Carrara Stadium (1987-1992)
http://stats.rleague.com/afl/crowds/vn_carrara.html
1987 - 8,965
1988 - 12,425
1989 - 10,944
1990 - 8,997
1991 - 7,399
1992 - 6,499
Remember, thats attendances not memberships. It includes Bears supporting non-members, opposition supporters, media, administrators and freebies given to kids to make the crowds less embarassing.
What source do you have for Bears memberships during the Carrara years, I'd be very interested to see the facts if you have any.
Free tickets? Prove it. Look up the Bears memberships yourself. You have nothing. Your math is flawed. Too simplistic, and tainted by your desire to keep a failing side.
Free tickets? Prove it. Look up the Bears memberships yourself. You have nothing. Your math is flawed. Too simplistic, and tainted by your desire to keep a failing side.
I've provided facts, all you've done is stamp your feet.
FACT: Brisbanes average attedance for home games at Carrara was 9,251.
Were they all members? :D:D
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 20:51
If you gain 3 people and lose 1 person, then you are 2 people up. :)
So if North losses half their members, you think that will be outdone by 3 GC members joining up for every i current North member and paying more than their $5 gaming machine/cheap meals membership?
ArachniX
5 Nov 2007, 20:52
That old chestnut. If the salary cap allowance was so important in out triple premiership years, surely Sydney would have had 4 in a row by now. Level playing field? You are naive. Melbourne based club players get more than Brisbane players when you take all their income into account. Those who claim Brisbane is the AFL's love child are right. We are money. The AFL loves money.
Well if the salary cap wasn't a problem Essendon would have been a lot more successful than "one in a row" in 2000. Their problems are well documented after the 2000 season. And what I mean by a level playing field is that if the Victorian clubs could use the money they generate themselves they would be so much more powerful than a Brisbane side with money it generates itself. And the money from TV rights i think you will find will even itself out. As you mentioned earlier about the AFL "knowing" about the Gold Coast I can guarantee you they know where their game is watched by most fans as well.
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 20:54
I don't think memberships is an issue with the new Gold Coast team or the relocated Roos. Its all about exposing more people to AFL. Giving QLD 2 teams to ensure that they have 2 games of AFL on TV every week that the public would be interrested in and 2 local derbies that would generate great interest.
We all know that Brisbane, Sydney and 2 other teams aren't going to have massive memberships. But they will have good if not great TV audiences. That is where the money is. Not memberships. Its the TV dollars.
So this thread is about how viable the Gold Coast is.
And you concede that Gold Coast won't get many members.
So therefore they must be reliant on AFL handouts.
Huh?
I've provided facts, all you've done is stamp your feet.
FACT: Brisbanes average attedance for home games at Carrara was 9,251.
Were they all members? :D:D
Lol. You haven't done anything. If attendance figures from 15 years ago is the cornerstone of your argument, you are an idiot. The Gold Coast clearly has far more, i'll say it again for effect, FAR MORE potential than the Kangaroos. Everyone knows it except desperate fans wishing it isnt so. Your own figures prove it.
What is the growth in attendance and membership from Brisbane in 86 to 2006? Now lets do North Melbourne. The AFL sees this in the Gold Coast too. potential in 20 years. That is a fact.
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 20:57
Basically it is this simple.
The Gold Coast will rate on TV. The rivalry between the 2 QLD teams will attract large crowds and hopefully more viewers on the idiot box. Its all about ratings not about crowds, memberships or anything else. The money is in TV deals. The Gold Coast will add more bargaining power to the AFL for future TV deals
How will a game on the GC rate- to whom will it rate and who is going to suddenly want to watch the game?
Well if the salary cap wasn't a problem Essendon would have been a lot more successful than "one in a row" in 2000. Their problems are well documented after the 2000 season. And what I mean by a level playing field is that if the Victorian clubs could use the money they generate themselves they would be so much more powerful than a Brisbane side with money it generates itself. And the money from TV rights i think you will find will even itself out. As you mentioned earlier about the AFL "knowing" about the Gold Coast I can guarantee you they know where their game is watched by most fans as well.
Essendon's problems would have existed with our salary cap too. Especially if you removed all the extras that being in Melbourne provided. Just accept that Brisbane was an awesome side, and stop whining about it.
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 21:00
Lol. You haven't done anything. If attendance figures from 15 years ago is the cornerstone of your argument, you are an idiot. The Gold Coast clearly has far more, i'll say it again for effect, FAR MORE potential than the Kangaroos. Everyone knows it except desperate fans wishing it isnt so. Your own figures prove it.
What is the growth in attendance and membership from Brisbane in 86 to 2006? Now lets do North Melbourne. The AFL sees this in the Gold Coast too. potential in 20 years. That is a fact.
Interesting the AFL hasn't produced any figures supporting their views now have they- beyond the gee its growing fast so lets send a team there!
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 21:00
Essendon's problems would have existed with our salary cap too. Especially if you removed all the extras that being in Melbourne provided. Just accept that Brisbane was an awesome side, and stop whining about it.
Like what?
Like what?
Like Lloyd's Foxtel salary, Hirds 9 salary, etc, etc, etc. Seriously. Don't play dumb.
ArachniX
5 Nov 2007, 21:02
Lol. You haven't done anything. If attendance figures from 15 years ago is the cornerstone of your argument, you are an idiot. The Gold Coast clearly has far more, i'll say it again for effect, FAR MORE potential than the Kangaroos. Everyone knows it except desperate fans wishing it isnt so. Your own figures prove it.
What is the growth in attendance and membership from Brisbane in 86 to 2006? Now lets do North Melbourne. The AFL sees this in the Gold Coast too. potential in 20 years. That is a fact.
20 years? Who is going to fund that for 20 years? The people on the Gold Coast? Ha. Come on, wanting it to happen doesn't make it true.
ArachniX
5 Nov 2007, 21:05
Essendon's problems would have existed with our salary cap too. Especially if you removed all the extras that being in Melbourne provided. Just accept that Brisbane was an awesome side, and stop whining about it.
Being in Melbourne provided? So you have just admitted that the money is in Melbourne and not Brisbane. Surely a side that won 3 premierships in a region crying out for another side could earn huge amounts of money from endorsements? Ah, welcome to the big league. Shows exactly where you guys sit in the scheme of things.
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 21:05
Like Lloyd's Foxtel salary, Hirds 9 salary, etc, etc, etc. Seriously. Don't play dumb.
Playing dumb?
Are you stating that what the AFL includes as income for the salary cap is somehow different in regards to Melbourne based clubs and the Lions?
20 years? Who is going to fund that for 20 years? The people on the Gold Coast? Ha. Come on, wanting it to happen doesn't make it true.
No one will need to. They will be profitable straight away.
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 21:06
No one will need to. They will be profitable straight away.
How- on what basis have you said that?
Playing dumb?
Are you stating that what the AFL includes as income for the salary cap is somehow different in regards to Melbourne based clubs and the Lions?
Not at all, i am suggesting that players can earn more in Melbourne due to external sources, and they do. Hence the need for retention allowances.
How- on what basis have you said that?
That is my opinion. Obviously the only ones with the figures are the AFL, and they support the idea.
greennick
5 Nov 2007, 21:10
Being in Melbourne provided? So you have just admitted that the money is in Melbourne and not Brisbane. Surely a side that won 3 premierships in a region crying out for another side could earn huge amounts of money from endorsements? Ah, welcome to the big league. Shows exactly where you guys sit in the scheme of things.
Are you sure you are not a North supporter? You seem to care almost entirely only about them.
A Living God
5 Nov 2007, 21:15
Growth in attedences since 1994.
Melbourne: 14%
Brisbane: 125%
Sydney: 275%
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 21:18
That is my opinion. Obviously the only ones with the figures are the AFL, and they support the idea.
That is my opinion.
Yes there seems to be allot of uneducated opinions on here.
Obviously the only ones with the figures are the AFL, and they support the idea.
Interesting enough they haven't been able to provide the figures supporting your idea that a GC team will be profitable straight away- or will somehow have QLD people wanting to knock the door down to become members of this new club either!
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 21:20
Growth in attedences since 1994.
Melbourne: 14%
Brisbane: 125%
Sydney: 275%
Ive also heard that 98% of all figures put on an internet forum without links to support them are fictional.
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 21:20
Essendon's problems would have existed with our salary cap too. Especially if you removed all the extras that being in Melbourne provided. Just accept that Brisbane was an awesome side, and stop whining about it.
Brisbane's side was an awesome side.
But anyone who doesn't acknowledge that that side was given a massive advantage by way of the salary cap is fooling themselves.
I mean, if the concessions had no effect, why is it that Brisbane made 4 successive grand finals with the concessions, and haven't made the finals since they were taken away the year after?
Please...
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 21:21
Ive also heard that 98% of all figures put on an internet forum without links to support them are fictional.
LOL. Prove it!
Gold :thumbsu:
All my figures are backed up by (see below).
A Living God
5 Nov 2007, 21:21
Ive also heard that 98% of all figures put on an internet forum without links to support them are fictional.
http://stats.afl.com.au/public/home.shtml
Sydney 9,800 -> 36,900
Brisbane 12,500 -> 28,000
Melbourne 37,000 -> 42,000
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 21:23
No one will need to. They will be profitable straight away.
Just when I thought you were mounting a half-decent challenge you go and say that. Ridiculous.
'Then I had to spoil it all by doing something stupid like explode you'- Sideshow Bob
ArachniX
5 Nov 2007, 21:24
Are you sure you are not a North supporter? You seem to care almost entirely only about them.
Nah, Geelong well and truly. But a true lover of the game. Something I care about. This means more to the game than anyone realises. I'll tell you one thing though. If you ever come to Melbourne or Victoria (unless you are from here) I'll show you around and give you a history of the game. Old clubs, old places, I'll take you to country football where at 5 degrees people sit in their car with the engine running to keep themselves warm (not sure that happens over there). I guarantee though that after that you will understand just how much this game means to Victorians and why despite everyones assurances people aren't just saying "oh yeah North to Gold Coast, thanks"
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 21:26
Not at all, i am suggesting that players can earn more in Melbourne due to external sources, and they do. Hence the need for retention allowances.
Do you see a small problem with your arguments here?
One minute you say that there is so much more money in SEQLD than Vic, the next minute you claim that Lions' players can't make as much from endorsements- despite being the only AFL club in the entire state! A state that supposedly is 'begging' for AFL.
Please...
http://stats.afl.com.au/public/home.shtml
Sydney 9,800 -> 36,900
Brisbane 12,500 -> 28,000
Melbourne 37,000 -> 42,000
Certainly good figures there. LOL at the others ignoring the truth
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 21:27
http://stats.afl.com.au/public/home.shtml
And?
Were does it state that QLD memberships increased by the amount amount you said?
Also what has the increase been since they their last flag; whats their membership increase since their last flag verses the melbourne average?
Were is the supporting data that their is a latent group of AFL supporters who will suddenly spring alive and join up and follow a GC club?
A Living God
5 Nov 2007, 21:30
And?
Were does it state that QLD memberships increased by the amount amount you said?
Also what has the increase been since they their last flag; whats their membership increase since their last flag verses the melbourne average?
Were is the supporting data that their is a latent group of AFL supporters who will suddenly spring alive and join up and follow a GC club?
I said attendance not membership.
And?
Were does it state that QLD memberships increased by the amount amount you said?
Also what has the increase been since they their last flag; whats their membership increase since their last flag verses the melbourne average?
Were is the supporting data that their is a latent group of AFL supporters who will suddenly spring alive and join up and follow a GC club?
It shows massive growth in crowd number in the areas outside of Melbourne. Why is everyone so wrapped up with memberships? How many times do I need to say its about TV ratings not memberships. This just shows the healthy growth in both NSW and QLD:rolleyes:
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 21:37
It shows massive growth in crowd number in the areas outside of Melbourne. Why is everyone so wrapped up with memberships? How many times do I need to say its about TV ratings not memberships. This just shows the healthy growth in both NSW and QLD:rolleyes:
1/ The AFL except for the NMFC club is based upon membership based clubs;
2/ Do you have any idea of the collective per annum income from all club memberships Verse TV ratings by any chance?
3/ You think you repeat something enough it must be true- leave that to your school classed and actually format and syntacticly structure an argument based upon factual data and information and not your opinion suffering from you personal biases.
1jasonoz
5 Nov 2007, 21:38
I said attendance not membership.
I'ii take that as a "no" you don't no were this latent group of AFL supporters who will suddenly spring alive and join up and follow a GC club; or whats their membership increase since their last flag verses the melbourne average?
yioughtta
5 Nov 2007, 21:52
http://stats.afl.com.au/public/home.shtml
Sydney 9,800 -> 36,900
Brisbane 12,500 -> 28,000
Melbourne 37,000 -> 42,000
Very selective figures, but let's run with them for argument's sakes.
Melbourne has nine teams, right? So an increase of 5,ooo per team means an overall increase of 45,000 through the gates.
45,000 -> 25,000 -> 15,000
Melb Syd Bris
Even by your very selective figures, Melbourne's attendance is growing faster than Brisbane's or Sydney's.
Ha!