View Full Version : If we draft Rioli with Pick 12 ...
philhawk
3 Nov 2007, 15:30
... I wont be happy.
Nothing against the kid or his talents, I just think it's a massive risk to draft a HFF with a high pick in the draft.
It's ironic that i'm using Tambling as an example, but he's another kid that was taken from Division 2 who hasn't gone particularly well since being drafted (with a very high pick at that).
I just think we'd be best off going either with another tall. As we saw with Alwyn Davey last year, crumbers can be picked up with late picks in the draft.
Anyone concur/disagree?
It should be noted, i've only ever seen Rioli play once (and he played very well that match).
play2win
3 Nov 2007, 15:34
100% concur. i think they should use the pick to add depth to the backline kp's
HappyHawk
3 Nov 2007, 15:39
Tend to agree Phil. Tall (But Quick) defender or a classy, quick mid.
CharlieMitchell
3 Nov 2007, 15:43
About a month ago i was about as pro Rioli as one man could get...Nightwolf aside. Having thought about it, id be happy to see us draft a tall defender ie Myers, Collier, Rance, Pears with pick 12.
Nothing against Rioli at all, infact id still be quite happy with him at pick 12, but like you said phil, it is more than likely a small quick crumber can be picked up with a 2nd or 3rd round pick.
One player i would hope we would consider with a later pick is Marlon
Motlop, i havent seen alot of him play but from all reports he is relatively similar to Rioli in skills, size and speed. Whilst i know Motlop is a natural midfielder surely it would be possible to train him as a mid/crumber for us....Roughie you hold the key to this answer.
For the record phil, its probably a bit unfair on Rioli to label him as purely a pocket/crumbing forward. The overall opinion seems to be that will be where he starts his career until his fitness levels improve enough to allow him to play a midfield role.
Brown Blood
3 Nov 2007, 16:11
Well I'll be very happy.
And at the end of the day I have faith that the club will get the most appropriate player available at pick 12.
So if rioli is available and the club picks him, great.
Legendary_No.19
3 Nov 2007, 16:22
With our pick the likely players left would be Collier, Rioli & Pears. As Rance will be gone by our pick, so out of them i hope we get Collier rather than Rioli as we can probably get a small quick crumber with our 2nd pick.
noosa hawk mad
3 Nov 2007, 16:30
Be happy if we got Rioli at pick 12 if not then i would hope we get Collier great agility & from what i have read a great kid
Lord_Espos
3 Nov 2007, 17:13
A perfect example is Essendon when they drafted Monfries with I think like pick 14. Monfries was just a bit too small and you think you should use your 1st round picks on a kep position player or a marquee midfielder.
TylerDurden
3 Nov 2007, 17:55
I'll be doing cartwheels. You have to draft for deficiencies, and right now, we are one of the slowest teams in the league. We need a pace injection, and we need it from this draft...
hawkstars
4 Nov 2007, 11:22
I think they will be better off drafting for a backman. Our forward line with Willo, Buddy, Roughie, Thorp, Boyle and one of the mids resting up forward is far too strong already. So to get another forward (crumbing) I don't think will make much of a difference. We all know. No ball going to the forward line = No goals. So backman for me.
sinepari
4 Nov 2007, 11:24
About a month ago i was about as pro Rioli as one man could get...Nightwolf aside. Having thought about it, id be happy to see us draft a tall defender ie Myers, Collier, Rance, Pears with pick 12.
Nothing against Rioli at all, infact id still be quite happy with him at pick 12, but like you said phil, it is more than likely a small quick crumber can be picked up with a 2nd or 3rd round pick.
One player i would hope we would consider with a later pick is Marlon
I'd be surprised if either become KPP's. Tall midfielders/HB's for mine.
I for one will be disappointed if Rioli lasts till our pick and we pass on him. The guy is an excitement machine and proven goal kicker.
I don't really know much about this draft, but it doesn't really concern me with whoever we pick up! I think we could miss the next 2 drafts and still be threatening on the field.. :p
Like someone said, you choose a player to fill in any deficiency the team might have. If the club chooses Rioli they obviously feel he is worth while, and given Chris Pelchin's track record how could I be disappointed? :)
I'm trying to do a Phantom draft and I gotta say, the Hawks pick is near on impossible to call.
No quick midfielders to give you, some alright inside types but then you already have that role covered.
Sounds like you guys arnt keen on Rioli, who seems an ok fit but then I'm not even sure he will make it to your pick.
Most Hawks fans complain about the options available to them but dont offer any other realistic alternatives :p
FriarTuck
4 Nov 2007, 12:13
The problem we have is so many untested players. Our needs for 2008 may have already been addressed. Moss looks like the perfect fit for our forwardline.
Rioli at 12 appears to be extravagant. If he can kick and can help out in the midfield then I'd give him a run.
Why on earth would we draft another tall? We have too many of them as it is.
Delisted
4 Nov 2007, 12:26
Why on earth would we draft another tall? We have too many of them as it is.
Tall backman? We dont have to many decent types. I'd Be happy with Rioli,Coiler, Rance or Myers.
philhawk
4 Nov 2007, 13:10
Why on earth would we draft another tall? We have too many of them as it is.
Wasn't it Kennedy who said "At three quarter time, the smalls get slower but the talls dont get any smaller".
You can never have too many talls.
delirious1
4 Nov 2007, 14:10
Take Woemerrai second round. simular player, will plug that "crummer" role you all cry about.
TylerDurden
4 Nov 2007, 16:52
Rioli at 12 appears to be extravagant. If he can kick and can help out in the midfield then I'd give him a run.
His kicking is reported to be elite (another left-footer too!).
Has got pace, can play midfield and knows where the goals are. What more do we want?...
Go against Nightwolf at your peril - this is the man who predicted Buddy.
Take Woemerrai second round. simular player, will plug that "crummer" role you all cry about.
Austin Wonamerri is more likely to be undrafted. His best chance is rookie listing by the crows.
His kicking is reported to be elite (another left-footer too!).
Has got pace, can play midfield and knows where the goals are. What more do we want?...
Sounds like he could play the skilled outside midfielder we need aswell as the crumber. Could he play KPP back aswell?s
Legendary_No.19
5 Nov 2007, 00:28
Wasn't it Kennedy who said "At three quarter time, the smalls get slower but the talls dont get any smaller".
You can never have too many talls.
I absolutely love that quote its so true!!:thumbsu:
Collins-Langford-Ayres
5 Nov 2007, 04:52
Sounds like he could play the skilled outside midfielder we need aswell as the crumber. Could he play KPP back aswell?s
Does he have the requirements e.g. size, endurance, etc to be an AFL midfielder?
Rexcellent
5 Nov 2007, 13:13
... I wont be happy.
Nothing against the kid or his talents, I just think it's a massive risk to draft a HFF with a high pick in the draft.
It's ironic that i'm using Tambling as an example, but he's another kid that was taken from Division 2 who hasn't gone particularly well since being drafted (with a very high pick at that).
I just think we'd be best off going either with another tall. As we saw with Alwyn Davey last year, crumbers can be picked up with late picks in the draft.
Anyone concur/disagree?
It should be noted, i've only ever seen Rioli play once (and he played very well that match).
i dont think it is a massive risk, considerin the amount of picks we have had recently, we should draft for what we need, not just something less of a risk because its a KKP etc. plus i think he can adapt to be a midfielder
forget tambling, look at birchall, pick 14, division 2
thing with davey was his age that lead to being a late pick
regarding goin another tall - Bailey, Boyle, Campbell, Croad, Dawson, Dolwer, Franklin, Gilham, Morton, Renouf, Roughead, Taylor, Thorp, McEntee
thats just over 1/3rd of our list, not including those like Birchall, Jacobs, Murphy, Brown who are either borderline tall/can play tall
ellis tuck and muston also up there with a bit more growth from when they joined us
i personally would rather not go a tall, but however the only option would be a fullback, but i do not know enough about fullbacks at pick 12 to make a calculated decision as the cluub would, compared to a personal opinion
not matter what, i dont think i will feel disappointed considerin our recent past draft history, whateva decision pelch n co make
unless they pick thurgood:p
BUDDYHODGEBIRCH-
5 Nov 2007, 14:28
we should be trying really hard to grab collier with our 12 pick, he will be a gem!!!!!!!!!!!!
Rioli ran 11.2 in the beep at draft camp apparently. Which is very, very ordinary if he wasn't carrying an injury or something. Does he have the work ethic to gain the fitness necessary for AFL football? No point being quick if you can still run in the second half.
Rioli is possibly the best kick in the draft, fast and CAN play midfield.
Fatrollo
5 Nov 2007, 19:05
Rioli ran 11.2 in the beep at draft camp apparently. Which is very, very ordinary if he wasn't carrying an injury or something. Does he have the work ethic to gain the fitness necessary for AFL football? No point being quick if you can still run in the second half.
He hadn't been playing for the whole season so he was unfit, and I saw him everyday after school, running with one of our trainers, trying to get up to peak fitness, which I don't think he achieved. He also wasn't in the Scotch Flyer, which is a handicap race held every year at Scotch between the fastest runners in the school, this year even though he was in it last year.
Big Ronnie
5 Nov 2007, 20:19
I'll be doing cartwheels. You have to draft for deficiencies, and right now, we are one of the slowest teams in the league. We need a pace injection, and we need it from this draft...
bingo!
cschreuder61
6 Nov 2007, 09:56
I'll be doing cartwheels. You have to draft for deficiencies, and right now, we are one of the slowest teams in the league. We need a pace injection, and we need it from this draft...
That is one of the biggest myths about the Hawthorn Football Club.
We are far from 'one of the slowest team in the league'.
How many games did we get run off our feet last year?
How many times did we run other teams off their feet last year?
I don't think I ever watched a game where I thought, 'geez we are slow'.
I've thought, geez we run hard, and, they wont be able to keep up in the second half.
I still think we lack another class player with footskill. Sewell, Mitchell, Lewis, their as a group isn't that they are slow, its that they don't have hugely pentrating kicks. All are very good over a short distance or medium distance, its that long range kick to our forward that sometimes goes a miss, and its not to with pace.
Pace doesn't win grand finals regardless of all that. I reckon Port wish they had a few more inside players on grand final day.
On the topic about pick 12. I really haven't seen much of Rioli. Pick 12 may be a bit of a risk on someone of his type/position.
Collier is my man.
TylerDurden
6 Nov 2007, 11:42
I don't think I ever watched a game where I thought, 'geez we are slow'.
.
Ah, the Port game in Tassie is one that springs to mind. A bloke called Danyle Pearce had 13 touches in the last qtr and was running rings around us.
Mitchell and Lewis are slow. Period. Hodge, Sewell and Crawf are not fast.
To be honest, Bateman is the only player who can break the lines, and even he isn't blistering. We need more players who can break the lines.
We are fit, yes, but fast, no.
We need pace. It's delusional to think otherwise...
cschreuder61
6 Nov 2007, 12:06
Ah, the Port game in Tassie is one that springs to mind. A bloke called Danyle Pearce had 13 touches in the last qtr and was running rings around us.
Mitchell and Lewis are slow. Period. Hodge, Sewell and Crawf are not fast.
To be honest, Bateman is the only player who can break the lines, and even he isn't blistering. We need more players who can break the lines.
We are fit, yes, but fast, no.
We need pace. It's delusional to think otherwise...
Which sides run us off our feet? You use Port as 'one' example, yet we ran them off their feet in the corrisponding game in Adelaide. Also you use an example of a game or period where we had a flat patch in form, and that period was widely considering as a blip in our overall successful season.
The amount of times we are level at half time but manage to burst away shows how well we ran last season.
Our last quarter performances are either the best in the comp, or top 2. I'd say that indicates that our running is in good shape at the moment.
Adding to that Muston, Tuck, Ellis, Moss and improvements from Young I think we have an ok list of running midfielders types already.
One more would be nice, as would another key defender, or another classy midfielder like Dal Santo, but I don't think we are in desperate need of pace, especially since running is one of our biggest strengths.
Having said that I would draft a midfielder/utility over a key position player this draft. I'd draft the better midfielder for our side, not just the fasted one. I'm not sure if Rioli is the best midfielder or not, but that would be my drafting philosophy. Maybe I'm just delusional though.
tomthehawk
6 Nov 2007, 12:13
Ah, the Port game in Tassie is one that springs to mind. A bloke called Danyle Pearce had 13 touches in the last qtr and was running rings around us.
Mitchell and Lewis are slow. Period. Hodge, Sewell and Crawf are not fast.
To be honest, Bateman is the only player who can break the lines, and even he isn't blistering. We need more players who can break the lines.
We are fit, yes, but fast, no.
We need pace. It's delusional to think otherwise...
I agree with this, we just need one or two more players in the team that can break lines. You can see how much we struggle when Changa or even Crawf aren't having a good day, we just struggle to get moving and we become stagnant and the other team just floods back. I'm hoping Muston can become one of these players but we probably need to draft one more.
tomthehawk
6 Nov 2007, 12:30
Which sides run us off our feet? You use Port as 'one' example, yet we ran them off their feet in the corrisponding game in Adelaide. Also you use an example of a game or period where we had a flat patch in form, and that period was widely considering as a blip in our overall successful season.
The amount of times we are level at half time but manage to burst away shows how well we ran last season.
Our last quarter performances are either the best in the comp, or top 2. I'd say that indicates that our running is in good shape at the moment.
Adding to that Muston, Tuck, Ellis, Moss and improvements from Young I think we have an ok list of running midfielders types already.
One more would be nice, as would another key defender, or another classy midfielder like Dal Santo, but I don't think we are in desperate need of pace, especially since running is one of our biggest strengths.
Having said that I would draft a midfielder/utility over a key position player this draft. I'd draft the better midfielder for our side, not just the fasted one. I'm not sure if Rioli is the best midfielder or not, but that would be my drafting philosophy. Maybe I'm just delusional though.
Yeah we are if not the fittest team, one of the fittest in the comp. But we just need that extra burst of pace so when we become stagnant like we sometimes do, we can burst out of it by having someone provide that spark. I also believe the need for a key defender is very overated and that we manage just fine without a massive body down there. You're right with the midfielder/utility, i think we have enough talls and should just add another gun into our midfield, hopefully Patrick Veszpremi
TylerDurden
6 Nov 2007, 12:33
Which sides run us off our feet? You use Port as 'one' example, yet we ran them off their feet in the corrisponding game in Adelaide. Also you use an example of a game or period where we had a flat patch in form, and that period was widely considering as a blip in our overall successful season.
The amount of times we are level at half time but manage to burst away shows how well we ran last season.
Our last quarter performances are either the best in the comp, or top 2. I'd say that indicates that our running is in good shape at the moment.
Adding to that Muston, Tuck, Ellis, Moss and improvements from Young I think we have an ok list of running midfielders types already.
One more would be nice, as would another key defender, or another classy midfielder like Dal Santo, but I don't think we are in desperate need of pace, especially since running is one of our biggest strengths.
Having said that I would draft a midfielder/utility over a key position player this draft. I'd draft the better midfielder for our side, not just the fasted one. I'm not sure if Rioli is the best midfielder or not, but that would be my drafting philosophy. Maybe I'm just delusional though.
Read my post again. I said fit - yes, fast - no. There's a big difference...
Hawkamania!
6 Nov 2007, 12:50
I wouldn't mind having Junior Boy in our squad. He has the talent necessary, has a brain and has good common sense.
Rioli will be a good pick for any team. He could be the Aaron Davey type we need in the forward line and has the ability to play mid.
With our pick (12), I feel that we will be looking at either Collier or Rioli.
mulhollanddrive
6 Nov 2007, 18:31
Just playing devil's advocate.
Rioli won't be playing midfield full time for at least 3-4 years imo, has below average fitness for all the tests - Beep, 3km etc...
I think its a mistake to think he's going to be our quick midfielder that we need. He's going to be more of a Davey type, with quick speed and good tackling across half forward, won't be a line breaker through midfielder that we need imo.
HawkXNtric
6 Nov 2007, 20:53
I don't know a thing about any of the potential draftees, other than what I've read on BigFooty (so it all must be true!)
All along, Chris Pelchen has said that we need three more 'player-types' to complete our 3-year drafting model. The general consensus on this forum is that those three 'player-types' are (in no particular order) - a KPP defender, a small crumbing forward, and a fast outside mid.
It will be interesting to see who we actually do draft on draft day, as I suspect that the players drafted will be nothing like what we expect! I would be quite happy with a Rioli, a Collier, or a Selwood, just so long as whoever we draft turns out to be a gun. Looking forward to it....:)