Andrew Murray

[Captain Sensible]

Why doesnt he just join the Libs? It would save everybody a lot of angst.

[The Ewok]

Why doesnt Natasha Stop-Destroyher and Andrew Bartlett just join the Greens? It would save everybody a lot of angst.

[Captain Sensible]

Originally posted by The Ewok
Why doesnt Natasha Stop-Destroyher and Andrew Bartlett just join the Greens? It would save everybody a lot of angst.



Why would The Greens want them?

[The Ewok]

Originally posted by localyokel

Why would The Greens want them?

Because those two no longer represent the issues the Democrats were originally formed for and under NSD she has turned the Democrats into a loony left wing party more akin to the Greens and miles away from the middle ground they used to hold

That is why Lees & Murray have quit the Democrats because the party they joined no longer exists apart from the name

[Captain Sensible]

Originally posted by The Ewok


That is why Lees & Murray have quit the Democrats because the party they joined no longer exists apart from the name

I know how they feel. Same thing happened to me with the ALP.

[Bomber Spirit]

Most people vote for parties rather than the individual, especially in the Senate. So when someone quits the party they were elected on the basis of being a member of, they shouldn't be allowed to remain in the Parliament.
Howard got to sell half of Telstra because of Mal Colston, and now Lees & Murray will give Howard the numbers to sell off the other half.:( :( :(

[Briedis]

Originally posted by Bomber Spirit
Most people vote for parties rather than the individual, especially in the Senate. So when someone quits the party they were elected on the basis of being a member of, they shouldn't be allowed to remain in the Parliament.
Howard got to sell half of Telstra because of Mal Colston, and now Lees & Murray will give Howard the numbers to sell off the other half.:( :( :(

I don't understand how Lees can get into the senate on a Democrat ticket, yet stay there now she has quit the party.

I think NSD is quite within her rights to be very upset at Lees.

From an outsider, if you take away all of the media hype, it looks as though Lees and Murray want to join the Libs anyway. The Democrats should replace them with two other candidates.

This whole issue has reflected badly on NSD and the Democrats. Hopefully, they can turn it into a positive and use the media limelight to highlight some of their policies.

The rest of the party is surprisingly stable other than the two would-be Liberals. Lees seems dirty that she lost the leadership, but she only has herself to blame. Many people were upset with the GST deal-making she did and it was NSD that crossed the floor and opposed her on that issue. Lees lost her support within the Democrats after that.

[TigerCraig]

Under the Australian Constitution, it is the individual that holds the seat, not the party (except for where a senator dies, becomes incapacitated or leaves parliament, where the party can name a replacement).

However, as I understand it under the AD's constitution, candidates agree that if they leave the party they will resign their seat.

Anyway, the sooner the lefty clowns self-destruct the better. NSD can then do a Cheryl and cry about how everybody was out to get her, and was nasty, and wouldn't share their lunch, or share their toys ...

[Briedis]

So, Lees must resign.

Why would you want the Democrats to self-destruct?

Surely, they are even more important now with the ALP seemingly unable to provide any opposition voice, it needs to come from somewhere.

Would you prefer Australia to become a Howardian dictatorship? Or worse still, an Abbottonian dictatorship? Seriously, this bloke is fast becoming the Dan Quayle of Australian politics. I mean who would vote for a bloke who's solution to poverty was: "You can never solve the problem of poor people so there's no point in helping them..." Seriously this guy is a tool.

[TigerCraig]

Don't disagree Briedis (and as a Sea Eagles man you are obviously a very intelligent individual), but I would rather see the Greens continue to grow and broaden as a third force. I've never liked the AD's, and especially Cheryl & Tash's holier than thou carry on.

[Briedis]

I thought Cheryl was OK at the Democrats. It wasn't until she crossed over that her political career went bad. She did some good things at the Democrats.

I wonder how Lees career will turn when she becomes a Liberal.

Natasha has been terrific throughout the current crisis and I reckon she will emerge as a stronger leader from it.

[Hollypig]

The Australian people voted out becoming a republic for one reason. The (usually Sydney based) young left wing,caffe latte, born to rulers set, talking down to the great unwashed. Shoving their smug little views down everybodys throat. I was willing to give it a go, but when that lot took over the cause, they lost me.

Same deal the Democrats, when they shafted Lees to get their darling Tashy scott despoilt in, a hell of alot of people would have turned right off. We put up with alot of things in our pollys but smugness is`nt one of them. The GST deal, & stance on illegals
would`nt have helped, but, the way she was rushed in at the first possible opportunity looked very much like the Dems were running a campaign on looks & not issues

[Briedis]

Originally posted by Hollypig
The Australian people voted out becoming a republic for one reason. The (usually Sydney based) young left wing,caffe latte, born to rulers set, talking down to the great unwashed. Shoving their smug little views down everybodys throat. I was willing to give it a go, but when that lot took over the cause, they lost me.


I think most Australians would have voted for a republic if the question was just a simple "Should we become a republic?". Instead, Howard ensured a status quo by complicating the matter by creating the referendum based on a particular model, which was rejected by the Australian people.

The process was done the wrong way around. First there should have been a vote on whether or not Australia should become a republic with a debate between monarchists and republicans. If it was then decided that we should have become a republic, then the republican convention should have been held and a number of models for our new republic should have been voted on by plebisite by te Australian people.

But, Howard decided not to do it the logical way in order to protect the status quo (i.e. his job as PM).

Originally posted by Hollypig
Same deal the Democrats, when they shafted Lees to get their darling Tashy scott despoilt in, a hell of alot of people would have turned right off. We put up with alot of things in our pollys but smugness is`nt one of them. The GST deal, & stance on illegals
would`nt have helped, but, the way she was rushed in at the first possible opportunity looked very much like the Dems were running a campaign on looks & not issues

The GST deal hurt Lees within the Democrats and was the major reason behind the push for her to be ousted from the party leadership. NSD did not support Lees on this bargaining tactic and won the support of the party from that action.

Lees tried to use the "looks vs. poor-old-middle-aged-woman" tactic, but most Democrat members had their minds made up after the GST bargaining policy she had. She was far too right-wing for the Democrat members. Good riddance to her.

[Captain Sensible]

And anyway why should someones looks exclude them from the political process? Theres a lot of politicians I dont like the look of but I dont deride on the basis of their looks. That is esily done on some of their more moronic, short sighted policies.

[Hank Jones]

Originally posted by Hollypig
The Australian people voted out becoming a republic for one reason. The (usually Sydney based) young left wing,caffe latte, born to rulers set, talking down to the great unwashed. Shoving their smug little views down everybodys throat. I was willing to give it a go, but when that lot took over the cause, they lost me.

Same deal the Democrats, when they shafted Lees to get their darling Tashy scott despoilt in, a hell of alot of people would have turned right off. We put up with alot of things in our pollys but smugness is`nt one of them. The GST deal, & stance on illegals
would`nt have helped, but, the way she was rushed in at the first possible opportunity looked very much like the Dems were running a campaign on looks & not issues

One of my best friends was Meg Lees former press secretary and she quit her job for reasons which are now becoming obvious. I can't disclose the details but I can say that Meg Lees has been considered dead weight for a number of years and the Democrats have been truly rudderless through this period and while it was believed that Ms Stott-Despoja would steady the ship it has been proved otherwise due to various issues.
I'm also interested in what you mean by the 'stance on illegals'?

Originally posted by Ewok
That is why Lees & Murray have quit the Democrats because the party they joined no longer exists apart from the name.

It would now appear that Lees quit the party because it wasn't anywhere near right-wing enough. She hinted at her leanings with her GST deal and now she's showing her true hand. Apart from all this I get the feeling (in fact I've heard this for a while) that Meg 'aint' too well endowed in the brain department.

[The Ewok]

Originally posted by Hank Jones

It would now appear that Lees quit the party because it wasn't anywhere near right-wing enough. She hinted at her leanings with her GST deal and now she's showing her true hand. Apart from all this I get the feeling (in fact I've heard this for a while) that Meg 'aint' too well endowed in the brain department.

The Democrats were originally more of a "right-wing" party - Don Chipp was a former Liberal and so were most Democrat members up until the last few years

That is why the Democrats are failing in the polls and at elections since 1999, NSD has taken them from their moderate Liberal roots into loony left territory and all the Democrats with Liberal leanings have dumped them

[Hank Jones]

Originally posted by The Ewok


The Democrats were originally more of a "right-wing" party - Don Chipp was a former Liberal and so were most Democrat members up until the last few years

That is why the Democrats are failing in the polls and at elections since 1999, NSD has taken them from their moderate Liberal roots into loony left territory and all the Democrats with Liberal leanings have dumped them

As opposed to right wing lunatics? All I can say is that at least us left wingers actually give a f*** about someone apart from ourselves.

[Jars458]

Originally posted by The Ewok


The Democrats were originally more of a "right-wing" party - Don Chipp was a former Liberal and so were most Democrat members up until the last few years

That is why the Democrats are failing in the polls and at elections since 1999, NSD has taken them from their moderate Liberal roots into loony left territory and all the Democrats with Liberal leanings have dumped them

This is garabage

That change occurred far earlier than when NSD came in

I have voted Democrat for ages now as I consider them more left wing than Labor and they have been since Paul Keating's time as Prime Minister

So NSD has not taken them to the loony left at all as you put it - other than reverse Lees' stance on the GST.

[Briedis]

Originally posted by The Ewok


The Democrats were originally more of a "right-wing" party - Don Chipp was a former Liberal and so were most Democrat members up until the last few years

That is why the Democrats are failing in the polls and at elections since 1999, NSD has taken them from their moderate Liberal roots into loony left territory and all the Democrats with Liberal leanings have dumped them

Considering NSD was elected leader in 2001, how does her leadership affect the result of the 1999 poll?

[Captain Sensible]

So Senator Murray has come crawling back with his tail planted firmly between his legs.



What a farce. Why not just quit politics?

[Hollypig]

Originally posted by localyokel
So Senator Murray has come crawling back with his tail planted firmly between his legs.


Not quite yokel, get the paper this morning & read.
Seems like little Tashy`s put her foot in it again.
Might be a good idea to take off again to see her lovers brothers grocers cousins half-brother on his death bed.

[Captain Sensible]

Originally posted by Hollypig


Not quite yokel, get the paper this morning & read.
Seems like little Tashy`s put her foot in it again.
Might be a good idea to take off again to see her lovers brothers grocers cousins half-brother on his death bed.




I think you mean her fiance's father.



And the tail is firmly between Murray's legs.

[Hollypig]

Originally posted by localyokel





I think you mean her fiance's father.


Which fiance is it this week?

[Captain Sensible]

Originally posted by Hollypig


Which fiance is it this week?


Fair point.

[Hollypig]

Originally posted by localyokel



Fair point.

Beauty.;)

[Captain Sensible]

Originally posted by Hollypig


Beauty.;)


Bewdy