View Full Version : No lead-up player from CHF?
Allefgib
20 Apr 2008, 01:35
I think I am starting to see a trend in this years gameplay.
Has anyone else noticed that we rarely have a lead-up player from HF to the Wing/Centre?
We seem to try and run the ball to the HBF/Wing area and then centre the ball by run/hands as a first option and then come through the front of the square to hit guys leading from 20 out.
Now all of that should result in good scoring shots but.. today we were desperate at times for someone to presnt out to the wings. Some to offer us something leading out from the HF line.. and we never seemed to have it. Kenny was around the place a few times but never really presented himself in that capacity (I assume based on 'structure').
It was really starting to frustrate me (then again it was a frustrating game!). Thoughts?
PS I felt we were woeful in not trying to kick it on top of Tippet's head a little more today.. in the NAB cup we did and look what happened.. the kid only had 8 touches but half of them were very special.. gotta look for him a bit more I reckon.
fightingdreamer88
20 Apr 2008, 01:38
Our two ideal options, Gill and Hentschel, are not fit to come into the side so we are having to persist with blokes like McGregor who are just far too slow and easy to defend.
And I agree - there were many stages throughout the day where we could have kicked long to Tippett but took FAR too long to move the ball, and he was outnumbered by the time he became a realistic target. He's a big strong target who has already shown that he either takes the mark or brings the ball to the ground in front of his feet - USE HIM!! EDIT
Rollins
20 Apr 2008, 01:42
If big Tipps can stay around the forward line more the better we will be..great hands on him and ground play....going wide in the last few games really hurts us and its old bad habits that I thought we may have banished this year...well almost anyway....I think bringing back Maric will straighten us up a bit with Tipps in the forward line...he was No.1 ruck there for a bit in pre-season and has played solidly in the locals so craigy should put him in and give him a go..like he is with the younger blokes...FINALLY!!!!
Porplyzia is a better lead up CHF than Mcgregor at the moment.
Allefgib
20 Apr 2008, 02:07
Porplyzia is a better lead up CHF than Mcgregor at the moment.
Possibly.
What I was getting at in the OP though was that we DONT seem to want to lead from HF up to the wings/centre. We lead TO the half forward line, lots of shots from 45 to 50 today, but no one really leading from the half forward line to give the ball coming out of HB a target.
Anyone else notice this?
Crowman32
20 Apr 2008, 02:22
This is a really good post. I noticed the same thing today. So many times when we went to go forward there was no one to kick to across half forward therefore resulting in us going handball happy or going wide and sideways. The best illustration of this was when Symes had the ball on the half back flank and had no one to kick to across half forward so he launched a torp towards the boundary to the cheers of the crowd.
Campbell's Chunky
20 Apr 2008, 02:24
Had the current draft rules been in place in 2004, Buddy would be running around in Crows colours...
Allefgib
20 Apr 2008, 02:45
Had the current draft rules been in place in 2004, Buddy would be running around in Crows colours...
I don't think its personnell. I think its the current gameplan/style we have put on the park.
Kenny in particular was camped at the 45m mark a few times and could have offered a lead.. but seemed to have been instructed to hold his ground as he never charged off.
I was almost wishing we had a Treadrea type to win cheap kicks on the wing :P
Southerntakeover
20 Apr 2008, 02:46
Had the current draft rules been in place in 2004, Buddy would be running around in Crows colours...
:(:(:(
James_37
20 Apr 2008, 11:19
I don't think its personnell. I think its the current gameplan/style we have put on the park.
Kenny in particular was camped at the 45m mark a few times and could have offered a lead.. but seemed to have been instructed to hold his ground as he never charged off.
I was almost wishing we had a Treadrea type to win cheap kicks on the wing :P
By the sounds they went alright deeper today, but I wouldn't mind seeing Burton and Goodwin do this a bit more, both are supremely fit and could really use this to their advantage along with their strong marking, more than they can deeper..
By the sounds they went alright deeper today, but I wouldn't mind seeing Burton and Goodwin do this a bit more, both are supremely fit and could really use this to their advantage along with their strong marking, more than they can deeper..
Burton did that a couple of times yesterday, after some quick/good fast ball movement coming out of defence. When he marked the ball bang in the centre of his chest, making it all most impossible for his defender to spoil, something usually resulted from his following kick. It was good to see :thumbsu:
Kamikaze Krowz
20 Apr 2008, 12:05
This is where perrie was good and important to us, though i know so many didnt like him.. He gave that target and did lead through that area so well.. Matty robran did it well before that..
Constantly yesterday we had the ball on half back and there was space on the wing, but no one would use it to lead into.. Its open for sellar to take this role at some stage i think
Crows Feet
20 Apr 2008, 12:16
This is where perrie was good and important to us, though i know so many didnt like him.. He gave that target and did lead through that area so well.. Matty robran did it well before that..
Constantly yesterday we had the ball on half back and there was space on the wing, but no one would use it to lead into.. Its open for sellar to take this role at some stage i think
I agree that this was Perrie/Robran's and even Gill's role within the team. I actually think that with the personell we 'lost' at the end of last year that Craig has tried to implement this new, attacking game plan. Part of this is the belief that should we kick to HF we may lose the contest and the ball will be down the other end before we get numbers back. However, if we carry the ball and then kick it beyond HF to the FF position it puts more pressure on the oposing defence and gives us more opportunities to reclaim the ball should we lose the contest.
macca23
20 Apr 2008, 12:59
I agree that this was Perrie/Robran's and even Gill's role within the team. I actually think that with the personell we 'lost' at the end of last year that Craig has tried to implement this new, attacking game plan. Part of this is the belief that should we kick to HF we may lose the contest and the ball will be down the other end before we get numbers back. However, if we carry the ball and then kick it beyond HF to the FF position it puts more pressure on the oposing defence and gives us more opportunities to reclaim the ball should we lose the contest.
Correct on all counts IMO.
It appears to be working too - we only had 41 entries into our forward 50 yesterday but had 28 scoring shots.
When and if Gill returns he will give us that additional option of a lead up forward.
Campbell's Chunky
20 Apr 2008, 13:44
This is where perrie was good and important to us, though i know so many didnt like him.. He gave that target and did lead through that area so well.. Matty robran did it well before that..
Constantly yesterday we had the ball on half back and there was space on the wing, but no one would use it to lead into.. Its open for sellar to take this role at some stage i think
As much as I wish it wasn't the case, I'd have Perrie in our current line up until Trent or Gill was fit, or Sellar was demanding s pot.
Chief Crow
20 Apr 2008, 14:11
I believe a ruckman is always good in that sitsuation. This is a spot on the ground where Griff, Ivan or Kurt (until hes moved deep into the forward line) can excel. All 3 have good agility and if not hit up with a lace out pass can take a over head mark while making the opposition rucks more accountable
Kane McGoodwin
20 Apr 2008, 14:24
When and if Gill returns he will give us that additional option of a lead up forward.
I would like to see Stevens play the lead-up CHF role until Gill returns. Reckon he did this well in the Bullies game, but has been in defence mostly since. Particularly if Massie returns our defence can cover Stevo moving forward.
Allefgib
20 Apr 2008, 14:35
Correct on all counts IMO.
It appears to be working too - we only had 41 entries into our forward 50 yesterday but had 28 scoring shots.
When and if Gill returns he will give us that additional option of a lead up forward.
<nods> I agree with smiley wrinkles, it seems to be a deliberate ploy. You say its working maccas.. based on those stats I'd agree.
I think there is some room for fine tuning on it though. We needed a player to present on the Wing (or in the middle but we seem to try to run it through there so its quite crowded) a number of times and there was no one doing it.
Concur with Chief Crow, potentially the ruckmen could fill that role. Ideally though would be a Gill/Stevens/Sellar type.
Carl Spackler
20 Apr 2008, 22:19
I think this is consistent across the entire competition. All teams' key forwards are now playing a lot closer to home.
Teams want to run and carry the ball through the midfield and deliver long to the hot spot. Or they use short passes to a leading small followed by a handball give to create run. They don't want to kick to a contest across the half forward line because a turnover in that area is too potentially damaging.
The only time you ever see someone kicking to a contest is deep into the forward line. I think that Ashley Hansen is the only footballer still playing the traditional CHF role.
Kamikaze Krowz
21 Apr 2008, 23:04
Correct on all counts IMO.
It appears to be working too - we only had 41 entries into our forward 50 yesterday but had 28 scoring shots.
When and if Gill returns he will give us that additional option of a lead up forward.
This is whats worrying.. At the moment it feels like he's never going to be back.. Its been massively underestimated how much we miss gill.. Not just what he can do and provide, but his unpredictability and freakish side and work ethic to chase etc
Allefgib
21 Apr 2008, 23:10
I think this is consistent across the entire competition. All teams' key forwards are now playing a lot closer to home.
Teams want to run and carry the ball through the midfield and deliver long to the hot spot. Or they use short passes to a leading small followed by a handball give to create run. They don't want to kick to a contest across the half forward line because a turnover in that area is too potentially damaging.
The only time you ever see someone kicking to a contest is deep into the forward line. I think that Ashley Hansen is the only footballer still playing the traditional CHF role.
I am still more suggesting we needed someone, at times, provide an option leading out to the wing to give the guys trying to run it out from defence an option.
THe only players I saw leading to the wing on saturday were from the centre out or from the Half Back line sprinting ahead of the ball movement.
At the very least it drags away a defender to the wing and makes more space.