View Full Version : Warnock for .....?
theGav56
31 May 2008, 14:47
IF the man decides to go home (which by the way is exactly how we got MacPharlin, Headland, J Carr, Bell etc) then Essendon have a few WA players who may be attractive in a trade. I especially refer to Jetta, Gumbleton and Ryder. Ryder for me would be the standout as we are talking about someone who can take up the 2nd ruck duties as well as contribute in other ways. Jetta is yet to set the comp alight, but is still young and developing, and Gumbleton has had injuries but undoubted class. Plus he plays in exactly the position we need; CHF!!!
I have no idea what the contract situation is with these fellas.
If we get shafted by Warnock and Melbourne via the PSD, the possibility of any of these guys coming to us via the PSD opens up a bit, assuming that we remain in as bad a way as we currently are. I imagine that there are other WA players who also may look to come home in similar fashion from other clubs. Ideally though, equal trades from clubs in Melbourne would be a better situation.
Any thoughts on these three players, or other Melbourne based WA players, and their trade value in a deal involving Warnock?
If we are set to pick Hurley in the draft then I'd go Jetta, but if we are going Yarran, then I'd go Ryder.
Ryder is exactly what we need. Key defense, but versatile enough to go forward and also pinch hit in the ruck. with Bradley in the team then Ryder would be exclusively in defense IMO. I've got a feeling that Ryder is yet to reach his potential too.
IF the man decides to go home (which by the way is exactly how we got MacPharlin, Headland, J Carr, Bell etc) then Essendon have a few WA players who may be attractive in a trade. I especially refer to Jetta, Gumbleton and Ryder. Ryder for me would be the standout as we are talking about someone who can take up the 2nd ruck duties as well as contribute in other ways. Jetta is yet to set the comp alight, but is still young and developing, and Gumbleton has had injuries but undoubted class. Plus he plays in exactly the position we need; CHF!!!
I have no idea what the contract situation is with these fellas.
If we get shafted by Warnock and Melbourne via the PSD, the possibility of any of these guys coming to us via the PSD opens up a bit, assuming that we remain in as bad a way as we currently are. I imagine that there are other WA players who also may look to come home in similar fashion from other clubs. Ideally though, equal trades from clubs in Melbourne would be a better situation.
Any thoughts on these three players, or other Melbourne based WA players, and their trade value in a deal involving Warnock?
Gumbleton has just re-signed.
The Dons rate Ryder and Gumbleton very highly and our chances of securing them unfortunately is very poor indeed.
bomba4eva
31 May 2008, 15:07
If we are set to pick Hurley in the draft then I'd go Jetta, but if we are going Yarran, then I'd go Ryder.
Ryder is exactly what we need. Key defense, but versatile enough to go forward and also pinch hit in the ruck. with Bradley in the team then Ryder would be exclusively in defense IMO. I've got a feeling that Ryder is yet to reach his potential too.
Considering he is 20, I think it is safe to ascertain that Ryder has not reached his peak. Do not think for a moment that Essendon would be willing to depart with Ryder, especially for Warnock who cannot even get a game for Fremantle. Apparently he hasnt been overly impressive for the reserves also. Gumbleton recently re-signed for 2 years so he is off limits. Jetta also signed a new contract. Warnock has plenty of potential but his attitude has come into question. Perhaps he is just frustrated that he isnt getting a game with the seniors. Think Melbourne are in the box seat to grab his services if indeed he does want to leave WA. This bodes well for Freo IMO because presuming Melbourne win a PP, I can see them giving it up or even their 2nd round which will be around pick 20. Works well for both clubs.
Warnock isnt in the same league as Gumbleton, Jetta or Ryder.
If Warnock goes to Melbourne, we will be forced to take we are given (most likely a third pick). If we wants to go to another club, then I think Warnock + fourth round = second round, is about fair.
I really thought that Warnock had the ability to be something special, but isnt dominating The WAFL and complaining about the lack of opportunity. Maybe he should pull his finger out and get some BOG's. Even if he wants to came back to Victoria he would ask a few $.
chook2734
31 May 2008, 15:35
Warnock isnt in the same league as Gumbleton, Jetta or Ryder.
If Warnock goes to Melbourne, we will be forced to take we are given (most likely a third pick). If we wants to go to another club, then I think Warnock + fourth round = second round, is about fair.
I really thought that Warnock had the ability to be something special, but isnt dominating The WAFL and complaining about the lack of opportunity. Maybe he should pull his finger out and get some BOG's. Even if he wants to came back to Victoria he would ask a few $.
IF the rumours are true, then he seems to be a bit like Jeff White all over again. Not willing to bide his time in the WAFL or work hard to get some good form. Maybe when he's 30+ and still playing he might look back and realise it was all for his own good. If his attitude is that he wants out and he wants big $$ then he won't be missed - that's not the kind of player we should be wasting our time with going forward.
Tundrawolf
31 May 2008, 16:27
Warnock isnt in the same league as Gumbleton, Jetta or Ryder.
.
Agree completely with this. And as Moo mentioned Gumbleton and Ryder are OFF LIMITS completely as far as Essendon is concerned. Jetta maybe a chance even though he is contracted. Would certainly suit us with his pace.
dominguez
31 May 2008, 16:42
Winona Ryder is just what we need but the bombers won't want to lose him. The Demons are in pole position, hopefully they'll be willing to part with their 2nd round pick.
Belnakor
31 May 2008, 17:50
IF the rumours are true, then he seems to be a bit like Jeff White all over again. Not willing to bide his time in the WAFL or work hard to get some good form. Maybe when he's 30+ and still playing he might look back and realise it was all for his own good. If his attitude is that he wants out and he wants big $$ then he won't be missed - that's not the kind of player we should be wasting our time with going forward.
Sounds even lazier than White, but yeah, sounds pretty similiar to the white case. IF that is his attitude he can piss off and i hope he doesn't get a game for the sake of it.
Yello Mit
31 May 2008, 17:55
Jetta maybe a chance even though he is contracted. Would certainly suit us with his pace.Agreed. Just imagine seeing Jetta, Palmer, Mayne, and Ibbotson all in the midfield....
My god, I almost creamed my pants.
SupersonicDocker
31 May 2008, 18:19
Essendon wil never let Jetta go...
Trading with Melbourne would be Lunacy because they will definitely try and shaft us.
At the end of the day, if his reason to leave is he wants to go then i would be highly suprised if every other melbourne based club doesnt show interest.
I really dont want to see Robbie go... if the coaching staff think he has got the goods, if they think he will keep getting better, then keep him and move th earth too keep him. Just means one less problem to worry about with our drafting over the next couple of years... allows us to concentrate of getting a good fullback and two good mids...
Smallish quick mid,
Tall solid mid ala Daniel Harris type
KPP Backmen... (hurley i guess)
Essendon wil never let Jetta go...
Trading with Melbourne would be Lunacy because they will definitely try and shaft us.
At the end of the day, if his reason to leave is he wants to go then i would be highly suprised if every other melbourne based club doesnt show interest.
I really dont want to see Robbie go... if the coaching staff think he has got the goods, if they think he will keep getting better, then keep him and move th earth too keep him. Just means one less problem to worry about with our drafting over the next couple of years... allows us to concentrate of getting a good fullback and two good mids...
Smallish quick mid,
Tall solid mid ala Daniel Harris type
KPP Backmen... (hurley i guess)
I reckon we will have to trade with Melbourne, especially if that is where Warnock wants to go. Say they have pick 1 and we have pick 2; They probably could use either the talents Naitanui or Rich equally, whereas we probably need Rich a lot more than Natanui, so I reckon a swap of first picks for Warnock would be a very good trade for us.
Reveler
31 May 2008, 18:57
all I know is that the teams that want him will say he is worth nothing. then when the trade is done they will say they got a bargain and he is a superstar.
Brumbies
31 May 2008, 20:16
Plus he plays in exactly the position we need; CHF!!!
Oh so what crab do we have playing at CHF?
dominguez
31 May 2008, 20:49
Trading with Melbourne would be Lunacy because they will definitely try and shaft us.
At the end of the day, if his reason to leave is he wants to go then i would be highly suprised if every other melbourne based club doesnt show interest.
It doesn't matter how many clubs are keen on him if he nominates Melbourne as his club of choice. Just like Judd last year if Warnock picks a club that finishes below us on the ladder then they hold all the aces.
dominguez
31 May 2008, 20:54
I reckon we will have to trade with Melbourne, especially if that is where Warnock wants to go. Say they have pick 1 and we have pick 2; They probably could use either the talents Naitanui or Rich equally, whereas we probably need Rich a lot more than Natanui, so I reckon a swap of first picks for Warnock would be a very good trade for us.
Why would they trade pick one in the national draft when they can select Warnock with pick 1 in the PSD? Melbourne's offer wil be their 3rd round pick, probably around pick 35. Hopefully we can talk them into giving us their second round pick instead (probably pick 19).
It doesn't matter how many clubs are keen on him if he nominates Melbourne as his club of choice. Just like Judd last year if Warnock picks a club that finishes below us on the ladder then they hold all the aces.
I'm not sure, Dom. If he wants to bugger off, then I reckon we should do the deal that suits us best - whether that's with Essendon, Melb, Pies or whoever.
Last year the slime could have got pick 2 from Richmond, but chose to deal with Carlton because they saw pick 3 plus Kennedy as better value.
We have no obligation whatsoever to deal with a player's "club of choice."
That being said, I'd like to think that the 2 clubs could come to some sort of amicable arrangement.
chook2734
31 May 2008, 21:06
I'm not sure, Dom. If he wants to bugger off, then I reckon we should do the deal that suits us best - whether that's with Essendon, Melb, Pies or whoever.
Last year the slime could have got pick 2 from Richmond, but chose to deal with Carlton because they saw pick 3 plus Kennedy as better value.
We have no obligation whatsoever to deal with a player's "club of choice."
That being said, I'd like to think that the 2 clubs could come to some sort of amicable arrangement.
The problem is though, Melbourne at this stage look likely to finish last, so will simply take him with the first pick in the PSD. They won't care what we want.
Chops_a_must
31 May 2008, 21:06
I'm not sure, Dom. If he wants to bugger off, then I reckon we should do the deal that suits us best - whether that's with Essendon, Melb, Pies or whoever.
Last year the slime could have got pick 2 from Richmond, but chose to deal with Carlton because they saw pick 3 plus Kennedy as better value.
We have no obligation whatsoever to deal with a player's "club of choice."
That being said, I'd like to think that the 2 clubs could come to some sort of amicable arrangement.
Ummm....
If the club they want to go to has the number 1 PSD pick, bad luck.
And because the player has to sign off on the trade, there are problems. People may remember the Heath Black fiasco many years back when he didn't sign off on a deal...
The problem is though, Melbourne at this stage look likely to finish last, so will simply take him with the first pick in the PSD. They won't care what we want.
Ummm....
If the club they want to go to has the number 1 PSD pick, bad luck.
And because the player has to sign off on the trade, there are problems. People may remember the Heath Black fiasco many years back when he didn't sign off on a deal...
You are both correct in theory, but I'm not sure about the practice. I still believe that clubs and players do their best to work out "reasonable" trades.
I can't be arsed doing the research to be honest :o but as I recall it, when Simmonds left he made sure we got something for him. Likewise when Gehrig left the slime, when Aker left Brisbane.
I know it can happen, but I'd like to think the clubs would come to an arrangement. Even if it was a late 2nd round pick or exchange.
But if the relations between Freo and player are icy, then I'd bugger him off for nought if we don't get what we want. Port never looked back after Nick Stevens left.
Of course, this is all hypothetical on Melb winning the spoon...
Well lets hope we finish below Melbourne so come PSD we will have 1st pick. I would trade Warnock along with Mundy Murphyor Campbell or the four of them to Melbourne for their first pick and 3rd and prob a Davey. One they need a ruckmen, two they need someone with good football skills and three they need a foward and a centre half foward.
dominguez
31 May 2008, 21:52
I'm not sure, Dom. If he wants to bugger off, then I reckon we should do the deal that suits us best - whether that's with Essendon, Melb, Pies or whoever.
Last year the slime could have got pick 2 from Richmond, but chose to deal with Carlton because they saw pick 3 plus Kennedy as better value.
We have no obligation whatsoever to deal with a player's "club of choice."
That being said, I'd like to think that the 2 clubs could come to some sort of amicable arrangement.
No one is going to trade early draft picks for a player who doesn't want to play for them.
Also, let's say hypothetically that Hawthorn offer pick 13 for Warnock and Melbourne offer pick 22. Warnock would turn around and say he wants $500,000 a year, Melbourne re-structure some existing contracts for 2009, and Warnock gets to Melbourne through the PSD or for whatever they decide to give us because Hawthorn don't have the cap space.
Richmond got Simmonds and Polak for bugger all because they finished near the bottom of the ladder in 2004 and 2006. We had to accept their deal or lose the player for nothing.
Billy Hunt
31 May 2008, 22:00
2004: Heath Black from St Kilda, three way deal with Troy Simmonds and Aaron Fiora.
2006: Chris Tarrant from Collingwood for Paul Medhurst and draft selection #8
Dean Solomon plus draft selection #52 for draft selections #42 and #47
Graham Polak plus draft selections #13 and #63 for draft selections #8 and #42 from Richmond
Why would they trade pick one in the national draft when they can select Warnock with pick 1 in the PSD? Melbourne's offer wil be their 3rd round pick, probably around pick 35. Hopefully we can talk them into giving us their second round pick instead (probably pick 19).
Because depending on what uncontracted players there are out there PSD pick 1 could be worth more than a 2nd round pick in the draft, and they might not want to tie up Warnock to it.
IMO given Freo's list and problems, the ability to have first dip (IE. pick the quality fit for the club) is of more value than a 3rd round pick. We really want Daniel Rich over Naitanui and Hurley, because he is quality AND he fits the gaps so much more that the other two.
But this is not the case for Melbourne - they are deficient accross the whole ground and if I was in their position I probably don't care whether they they get Rich, Naitanui or Hurley (Though I probably would want a Kp if I was them), so long as the overall quality is up there. Assuming we have the 2nd/3rd pick, and we we give them that pick, they still end up with one of those players. I guess is what I am saying is that swap might not be worth much to them, but it is pretty valuable to us.
Bender571
1 Jun 2008, 13:28
Because depending on what uncontracted players there are out there PSD pick 1 could be worth more than a 2nd round pick in the draft, and they might not want to tie up Warnock to it.
Thats exactly it. Melbourne might decide they want to pick up Cousins. It would actually be a good pick up for Melbourne as you'd assume with Cousins comes a lot of publicity, as well as a quality player. Or there could be another Nick Steven situation.
dominguez
1 Jun 2008, 15:07
There's no chance of them trading pick one. The first pick was off the table last year and Judd was involved so why trade pick one for a ruckman who has played a handful of games and pick three.
Assuming the top 3 players are hard to split the Demons will still want to make that decision rather than let 2 other clubs make the choice for them.
Rich's form hasn't been outstanding so far this year. Depending on how he goes at the champs there's a chance that he could slide to pick 4 or 5 anyway.
Windas_Magic
1 Jun 2008, 21:02
The only WA 'talent' you could possibly take from Essendon is Johns..The likes of Jetta, Gumby, Ryder etc aren't going anywhere and it looks like you could potentially lose Warnock in the PSD to Melbourne. He isn't worth a hell of a lot anyway, was a pick in the forties and has only shown potential and apparently his attitude hasn't been to flash either
theGav56
1 Jun 2008, 21:16
The only WA 'talent' you could possibly take from Essendon is Johns..The likes of Jetta, Gumby, Ryder etc aren't going anywhere and it looks like you could potentially lose Warnock in the PSD to Melbourne. He isn't worth a hell of a lot anyway, was a pick in the forties and has only shown potential and apparently his attitude hasn't been to flash either
It looks like they are contracted into the future, so the PSD does not come into play for us, but if Melbourne were suing the PSD for Warnock, then, assuming we may be looking at pick 2, we could and will do exactly the same thing if a player wants to come West.
dominguez
1 Jun 2008, 21:20
It looks like they are contracted into the future, so the PSD does not come into play for us, but if Melbourne were using the PSD for Warnock, then, assuming we may be looking at pick 2, we could and will do exactly the same thing if a player wants to come West.
Good point Gav. Assuming that the club have planned for Warnock and Mundy to stay and they both go we should have some cap space to play with. Would love to lure a good player from Richmond since they used the PSD as leverage when trading for Polak and Simmonds.
Langdon was saying he's gone...has been speaking to him at footy on the road and he's dirty and is basicallly gone...
dominguez
1 Jun 2008, 22:02
Langdon was saying he's gone...has been speaking to him at footy on the road and he's dirty and is basicallly gone...
Lets just hope Richmond or Carlton offer him a lot more $$$$ than Melbourne.
GentlemanJeff
1 Jun 2008, 22:12
Warnock is a dog and he has known that he is leaving the club for ages.
I broke the story 18 months ago that Warnock had decided to head back to Victoria.
Hopefully we can get some sort of trade value out of him, however, I have no doubt that he will slip into the PSD and leave us with nothing if he can. The word around the club is that he is not well liked by the coaching staff. He has effectively tried to blackmail Harvey by saying "unless you play me I am going home". But I think that Harvey knows that Warnock has already made up his mind.
As I said 18 months ago: Robbie Warnock is the new Jeff White.
Chops_a_must
1 Jun 2008, 22:12
Would love to lure a good player from Richmond
You gotta laugh when sentences like these come out. :eek::D
I'd rather he walk than stay uncommitted.
I'd rather he go via the PSD than accept a pick in the 4th round.
To be honest from here on in - if you are not committed _____ off
Does anybody else think there is a big chance of Nathan Carroll returning home for Warnock?
Personally i would be happy with Carroll and a late second or early to mid third pick.
Carroll may be past it at Melbourne? im not sure
Thoughts
Does anybody else think there is a big chance of Nathan Carroll returning home for Warnock?
Personally i would be happy with Carroll and a late second or early to mid third pick.
Carroll may be past it at Melbourne? im not sure
Thoughts
No thanks. No thanks at all. Carroll is preseason draft material at best and we want younger fellas these days.
I'd like us to target Swallow and that would be an ok trade imo.
Does anybody else think there is a big chance of Nathan Carroll returning home for Warnock?
Personally i would be happy with Carroll and a late second or early to mid third pick.
Carroll may be past it at Melbourne? im not sure
Thoughts
If the answer is Carroll ...I don't think I like the question.
A 28 year old player who is past his best (or past his average) is certainly not what our club requires.
theGav56
1 Jun 2008, 23:20
Good point Gav. Assuming that the club have planned for Warnock and Mundy to stay and they both go we should have some cap space to play with. Would love to lure a good player from Richmond since they used the PSD as leverage when trading for Polak and Simmonds.
Hopefully it's not the salary that ends up getting them here. At this stage it is looking very realistic that we will be absolute cellar dwellars, and while I would love to get a good deal for any player who wants to leave the club, I am also very keen that the club uses the psd in the other direction as they did with MacPharlin.
We will get NOTHING for Warnock.
He will be out of contract & will flip thru to #1 pick in December draft to Melbourne.
Unless anotehr Victorian Club pitches something good to him - he will go to Melbourne for nothing. To be traded - HE - has to agree to the trade.
Freo knew he wasn't going to sign after this year - earlier this year & have handled the whole situation very very badly ( AS USUAL )
We will get NOTHING for Warnock.
He will be out of contract & will flip thru to #1 pick in December draft to Melbourne.
Unless anotehr Victorian Club pitches something good to him - he will go to Melbourne for nothing. To be traded - HE - has to agree to the trade.
Freo knew he wasn't going to sign after this year - earlier this year & have handled the whole situation very very badly ( AS USUAL )
Depends...if Warnock says "Play me or I'll leave" then he should get pushed...
chook2734
1 Jun 2008, 23:27
We will get NOTHING for Warnock.
He will be out of contract & will flip thru to #1 pick in December draft to Melbourne.
Unless anotehr Victorian Club pitches something good to him - he will go to Melbourne for nothing. To be traded - HE - has to agree to the trade.
Freo knew he wasn't going to sign after this year - earlier this year & have handled the whole situation very very badly ( AS USUAL )
So what should they have done? Played him so he's ready to go for Melbourne round 1 next year? I'd send him back now if he wants to go. He certainly doesn't seem to be giving it 100% and I can imagine West Perth aren't exactly thrilled at having to carry him week in week out.
We will get NOTHING for Warnock.
He will be out of contract & will flip thru to #1 pick in December draft to Melbourne.
Unless anotehr Victorian Club pitches something good to him - he will go to Melbourne for nothing. To be traded - HE - has to agree to the trade.
Freo knew he wasn't going to sign after this year - earlier this year & have handled the whole situation very very badly ( AS USUAL )
As opposed to what Superstar?
So what should they have done? Played him so he's ready to go for Melbourne round 1 next year? I'd send him back now if he wants to go. He certainly doesn't seem to be giving it 100% and I can imagine West Perth aren't exactly thrilled at having to carry him week in week out.
Play him and get his trade value up. Be totally ruthless in our favour about it.
If he stays then we spent time developing him otherwise use him and turf him.
Mattlowry
1 Jun 2008, 23:46
Gumbleton, Jetta and to an extent Ryder may haven't shown they will be superstars but there are very promising signs for all three.
I would imagine it would take a top 2-3 pick for Essendon to consider getting rid of Gumbeton or Ryder and a top 10 pick to get rid of Jetta. The are the future of the club and won't be going anywhere.
I'd like Warnock at Essendon. Not the best player but could definately replace Laycock in the side as numbe 2 ruckman so we could leave Ryder down back. I don't think you'll get more than a third round pick for him however.
To think how useful Bradley could be to us right now haha...
bomber c
1 Jun 2008, 23:57
essendon will never trade with fremantle after what they did with keplar bradley...full stop..
essendon will never trade with fremantle after what they did with keplar bradley...full stop..
Can't believe that Essendon did that to Kepler.
Thats what you mean isn't it?
dominguez
2 Jun 2008, 00:04
Hopefully it's not the salary that ends up getting them here. At this stage it is looking very realistic that we will be absolute cellar dwellars, and while I would love to get a good deal for any player who wants to leave the club, I am also very keen that the club uses the psd in the other direction as they did with MacPharlin.
Yeah fair enough. We're going to have to trade out one or possibly two players to have the cap space to lure a player of any ability to the club though.
Chops_a_must
2 Jun 2008, 00:07
If Warnock does want to go to Melbourne, just play him as our number 1 ruck, spare Sandi.
Just get the ____er injured. :D
If we aren't gonna get anything for him, at least expose the twig to some breeze.
bomber c
2 Jun 2008, 00:09
Can't believe that Essendon did that to Kepler.
Thats what you mean isn't it?
no harvey and shaw promised 3rd round pick then reneged on the last minute deal at the trade table...
you got him for nothing...
taught us a lesson we never will forget...
good luck to keps ,i am glad he is doing the job...
dominguez
2 Jun 2008, 00:11
We will get NOTHING for Warnock.
He will be out of contract & will flip thru to #1 pick in December draft to Melbourne.
Unless anotehr Victorian Club pitches something good to him - he will go to Melbourne for nothing. To be traded - HE - has to agree to the trade.
Freo knew he wasn't going to sign after this year - earlier this year & have handled the whole situation very very badly ( AS USUAL )
It sounds like the obvious option for Melbourne but how often does it happen? I can't think of any talented players who got to their club of choice through the PSD after their new club refused to discuss a trade with their old club.
The PSD isn't until December. Melbourne can either trade something for Warnock in the 2nd week of October or leave him in limbo for two months.
Melbourne will offer their 3rd round pick (probably pick 35).
dominguez
2 Jun 2008, 00:13
Does anybody else think there is a big chance of Nathan Carroll returning home for Warnock?
Personally i would be happy with Carroll and a late second or early to mid third pick.
Carroll may be past it at Melbourne? im not sure
Thoughts
:mad:
essendon will never trade with fremantle after what they did with keplar bradley...full stop..
What refused your great offer? :cool:
What part of this didn't you understand ...
You made an offer
We rejected the offer and countered
You said no we will let delist him first
You delisted him and we took him
I hope every club in the AFL says they don't want to trade with us as we are too hard.
Bring it on.
Richmond and Melb loom as the 2 most in need - though St Kilda and even to a lesser extent a Geelong/Carlton could be in the mix.
Essendon probably think of Ryder as being the one but I think they need him in def and in the ruck.
Who knows and at the moment who cares.
no harvey and shaw promised 3rd round pick then reneged on the last minute deal at the trade table...
you got him for nothing...
taught us a lesson we never will forget...
good luck to keps ,i am glad he is doing the job...
God it is hard.
Learn the facts mate ...the 3rd round offer was for Dyson & Bradley - Knights & Co said no just Bradley ...we said no we will take him in the draft. You were never, ever offered 40 for Bradley.
The rumour got started because with 2 minutes to go ...Freo came in with a take it or leave it pick 55 offer ....Essendon said 40 or nothing. I think Essendons and Essendon's fans shittiness comes from assuming we would crack. Bad move.
So guess what you called our bluff and we had a pair. It is no biggie to Essendon - I think a mistake in delisting Kepler but pick 55 is hardly going to mean you never trade with us again.
Seems the Dons were just shitty we wouldn't bend over and give them pick 40 which has turned out to be a very handy pick indeed.
Some posts from the Essendon Board at the time of the deal -
Hey we offered to buy you dinner first but you said no .....once the lights go on at the night club - well you know.
It was reported ...we offered 40 for Dyson and Bradley ...with Dyson off the table it was 56 or nothing.
Doesnt change the fact that we didnt roll over. Obviously Knights rated Dyson (given he signed for two years) so the third rounder for Dyson and Bradley was never going to happen. I would have taken pick 40 for both of them but that is another story.
and with that we got Mayne and Bradley.
Another year of playing hard ball please.
ryder hmm another tall lightly built loping defender who is at his best as a spare man an can occasionally go up forward.
Nope we dont need another player like that.
MiJohnson,Mundy,Thornton, could even include Gilmore in that list but he actually has pace.
Even though i think 2 of them could be gone at end of this year he still isnt the type of player we need.
Only really need 2 of that type
bomber c
3 Jun 2008, 01:07
God it is hard.
Learn the facts mate ...the 3rd round offer was for Dyson & Bradley - Knights & Co said no just Bradley ...we said no we will take him in the draft. You were never, ever offered 40 for Bradley.
The rumour got started because with 2 minutes to go ...Freo came in with a take it or leave it pick 55 offer ....Essendon said 40 or nothing. I think Essendons and Essendon's fans shittiness comes from assuming we would crack. Bad move.
So guess what you called our bluff and we had a pair. It is no biggie to Essendon - I think a mistake in delisting Kepler but pick 55 is hardly going to mean you never trade with us again.
Seems the Dons were just shitty we wouldn't bend over and give them pick 40 which has turned out to be a very handy pick indeed.
Some posts from the Essendon Board at the time of the deal -
and with that we got Mayne and Bradley.
Another year of playing hard ball please.
once bitten twice shy....no deals....as i said you taught us a lesson....
SupersonicDocker
3 Jun 2008, 02:56
once bitten twice shy....no deals....as i said you taught us a lesson....
What? to use your brain when making deals?
ha you guys are just dark you took myers over Palmer.... haha
What? to use your brain when making deals?
ha you guys are just dark you took myers over Palmer.... haha
Perhaps it is the fact that Kepler Bradley is averaging career highs in handpasses, kicks, marks, goals, hitouts and free kicks for & recording career average lows in frees against and behinds.
Not only that if Kep was back in red and black for them he would be 3rd in average disposals, 2nd in marks, top 10 for inside 50's and 2nd in free kicks earnt.
The funny thing is over in bomberville they are still calling him the dud ...seriously Kep would be very close to top 10 for us currently.
Palmer, Mayne Hinkley and Bradley ....seriously this is potentially the best draft we have ever had.
Chops_a_must
3 Jun 2008, 05:18
The funny thing is over in bomberville they are still calling him the dud ...seriously Kep would be very close to top 10 for us currently.
Palmer, Mayne Hinkley and Bradley ....seriously this is potentially the best draft we have ever had.
Indeed.
I bow to your wisdom in these matters draft, and I'm wondering if you would have a thought on us using later picks to look at players aged between the 20-22 region. Given the later picks are a lottery, do you think that is a viable strategy?
Indeed.
I bow to your wisdom in these matters draft, and I'm wondering if you would have a thought on us using later picks to look at players aged between the 20-22 region. Given the later picks are a lottery, do you think that is a viable strategy?
Absolutely ...as long as we use the later rounds.
The mistake I think we sometimes make is not being speculative enough on our rookie list. If we kept Dunn to save cash - it is a wasted opportunity.
NiGHTFuRY
3 Jun 2008, 06:49
Palmer, Mayne Hinkley and Bradley ....seriously this is potentially the best draft we have ever had.
You could very well be right their Moo
dominguez
3 Jun 2008, 08:05
The mistake I think we sometimes make is not being speculative enough on our rookie list. If we kept Dunn to save cash - it is a wasted opportunity.
Dunn was contracted for 2008, and has been injured off and on since drafted. Could you imagine the outcry if we had de-listed him then he got fit and dominated the WAFL/VFL in 2008 while we were still paying him?
It was a low risk move to re-draft him, we might aswell have access to a player if we are paying his wages and if he doesn't show anything in the next 3 months we can de-list him.
bomber c
3 Jun 2008, 11:08
You could very well be right their Moo
yeah solly mark johnson have been good gets...
courtney johns must think hes already a docker next year...
you can have him for free...
wizard_9
3 Jun 2008, 12:34
Keep him at all costs IMO. I watched our only win of the season last night and althogh he didnt get much game time and didnt have the ball much he looked so good.
Moves very very well, kicks well and is a nice tap ruckman. We must try and keep this kid.
And FFS Harvey play him you wanker.
Freo Shark
3 Jun 2008, 13:06
Keep him at all costs IMO. I watched our only win of the season last night and althogh he didnt get much game time and didnt have the ball much he looked so good.
Moves very very well, kicks well and is a nice tap ruckman. We must try and keep this kid.
And FFS Harvey play him you wanker.
We want to keep him but you aint going to keep him unless you throw the cheque book at him. Hows that a change of culture at Freo and more importantly a reward for his teammates?
How would Palmer and Ibbo appreciate a lazy, momma's boy, tanty thrower and out of form player getting a fat paycheck after their efforts this year.
Real smart move mate.
Cameron_K
3 Jun 2008, 13:19
At this stage I would take a carton of gravy chips for him.
sabre_ac
4 Jun 2008, 01:01
We want to keep him but you aint going to keep him unless you throw the cheque book at him. Hows that a change of culture at Freo and more importantly a reward for his teammates?
How would Palmer and Ibbo appreciate a lazy, momma's boy, tanty thrower and out of form player getting a fat paycheck after their efforts this year.
Real smart move mate.
I agree with most of this.
Ibbotson especially...He was in and out of the side, bagged and had to work bloody hard in the WAFL to get a place.
If Warnock isn't performing and is showing attitude problems, I would prefer to have Kepler in the side.
A source within a WAFL club informs me that Warnock had let West Perth know some months ago that he would not be playing for them next year...
If and this is a big if, if we finish 2nd bottom to Melbourne, we might actually be better off forcing Mebourne to pick him up in the PSD with pick 1. That would in effect give us leverage over other clubs with number 2 PSD draft pick, knowing Melbourne will use theirs for Warnock.
If we don't finish 2nd bottom we have to take what we can get, a fair trade would be 3rd round pick maybe.
estibador
4 Jun 2008, 03:16
If and this is a big if, if we finish 2nd bottom to Melbourne, we might actually be better off forcing Mebourne to pick him up in the PSD with pick 1. That would in effect give us leverage over other clubs with number 2 PSD draft pick, knowing Melbourne will use theirs for Warnock.
I never thought about it like that. Depending on who's available that could actually be far more valuable than an average draft pick that Melbourne offers. Effectively trading Warnock for whoever we can screw another club out of.
And to anyone saying we should play him to bump up his value... aren't we desperate to develop a culture where players bleed for the jumper? How are we going to do that when we're giving games to lazy half hearted players who don't want to be here just to make them more attractive to other clubs?
NiGHTFuRY
4 Jun 2008, 03:59
A source within a WAFL club informs me that Warnock had let West Perth know some months ago that he would not be playing for them next year...
If and this is a big if, if we finish 2nd bottom to Melbourne, we might actually be better off forcing Mebourne to pick him up in the PSD with pick 1. That would in effect give us leverage over other clubs with number 2 PSD draft pick, knowing Melbourne will use theirs for Warnock.
If we don't finish 2nd bottom we have to take what we can get, a fair trade would be 3rd round pick maybe.
I never thought about it like that. Depending on who's available that could actually be far more valuable than an average draft pick that Melbourne offers. Effectively trading Warnock for whoever we can screw another club out of.
And to anyone saying we should play him to bump up his value... aren't we desperate to develop a culture where players bleed for the jumper? How are we going to do that when we're giving games to lazy half hearted players who don't want to be here just to make them more attractive to other clubs?
very interesting points made there lads
bigkev bleeds purple
4 Jun 2008, 04:43
What we need even more is for a very high profile player to nominate in the PSD and get Melbourne to commit their pick to that player.
I've always thought that Booze Bus Benny is an oxygen thief, but he could yet do one useful thing with his life.
theGav56
4 Jun 2008, 11:36
If and this is a big if, if we finish 2nd bottom to Melbourne, we might actually be better off forcing Mebourne to pick him up in the PSD with pick 1. That would in effect give us leverage over other clubs with number 2 PSD draft pick, knowing Melbourne will use theirs for Warnock.
Yep, top idea. And also the point of this thread, made in the opening post. Sheeesh! ;)
If we get shafted by Warnock and Melbourne via the PSD, the possibility of any of these guys coming to us via the PSD opens up a bit, assuming that we remain in as bad a way as we currently are.
If and this is a big if, if we finish 2nd bottom to Melbourne, we might actually be better off forcing Mebourne to pick him up in the PSD with pick 1. That would in effect give us leverage over other clubs with number 2 PSD draft pick, knowing Melbourne will use theirs for Warnock.
Fair point, although it presupposes that Warnock will be the best uncontracted player in the preseason draft, which may not be the case. But it still puts pressure on Melbourne, as other clubs may offer a viable deal for Warnock and he may not be totally wedded to the bottom team even if his Brother happens to play there.
Fair point, although it presupposes that Warnock will be the best uncontracted player in the preseason draft, which may not be the case. But it still puts pressure on Melbourne, as other clubs may offer a viable deal for Warnock and he may not be totally wedded to the bottom team even if his Brother happens to play there.
But if we come 2nd last, we can take him back if no-one better is available. Should be enough leverage to get Melbourne's 2nd round pick.
If it is true what a few people are saying and Warnock was always leaving at the end of this season, then I'm glad Harvey had the balls to not play him.
Warnock has basically done nothing at WAFL level to warrant a game, Bradley has been a revelation this year, I certainly did not pick him to be playing this good.
Belnakor
4 Jun 2008, 13:31
I think you mean revelation :) but yes. Kepler has had a good start to the season, playing in the role that everyone at Essendon was saying he should have played.
Harvey is showing other people that if you pull this shit like Warnock has then the club will be absolutely mercenary and not put any effort into your development at all. Good times.
I've got a relative who plays for West Perth, who reckons Warnock's attitude stinks. though i hadn't heard that he informed the club he wasn't going to be playing next year.
Look at which Melbourne clubs need a ruckman.
Melbourne - they need just about everything
Carlton - Kruezer may not be a true ruckman, have Hampson as well
Collingwood - Traded for Cameron Wood, won't be involved
Essendon - Ruck stocks aren't that deep
Bulldogs - Traded for Hudson, may look for his replacement. Maybe for Farren Ray.
Richmond - Don't have much behind Simmonds
Hawthorn - can't see how they could afford him unless they offload a player to create room in Salsry cap. Jordan Lewis or Chance Bateman ... Not likely
Geelong - Do need ruck depth in their team. Fringe mid plus draft pick
Kangaroos - quite strong in ruck with a bit of depth
Most likely teams that could or would chase him would be Melbourne, Carlton, Bulldogs, Richmond or Geelong.
Best bet would be Bulldogs if they could get Farren Ray.
Belnakor
4 Jun 2008, 16:24
Hawthorn have plenty of room in the cap, they have the lowest player payments of anyone iirc.
Scribble Monkey
4 Jun 2008, 16:40
Warnock may be good but he's not showing it in the WAFL. This may be because he's got a Richo lip out at not being picked and his attitude sucks, or he's tanking for an out. I don't know if he's doing this, but it's happened before - some blokes believe all their own press , and others, like Croad, never wanted to be here in the first place.
I think I saw German on TV a while back being quizzed why Warnock wasn't being selected, and he said he's not good enough in the WAFL, until he is, he won't be. Whichever scenario is true, I can't see why some people are screaming for him to get a game.
I cannot see the point of picking him because he might be tanking to leave and go elsewhere. A club that panders to that sort of petulant blackmail is pissweak, and that is the last thing Freo can afford to be doing, or seen to be doing. We want to create a team, not pander to players who think we need them more than they need freo.
Of course, if he goes to Melbourne next year and gets regular games, this won't stop the press bagging our arse for not playing him and letting him go.
Bender571
4 Jun 2008, 16:59
Hawthorn have plenty of room in the cap, they have the lowest player payments of anyone iirc.
Thats what this says
http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=446480
I'd expect Hawthorn to have pick some where between 15-19 which I'd be happy to get for Warnock.
pinkus maximus
4 Jun 2008, 18:36
i reckon he'll go to richmond,they will offer something ridiculous like 500k a year
hopefully there are a few clubs interested, if we let him go for a 3rd rounder i will spew
Thats what this says
http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=446480
I'd expect Hawthorn to have pick some where between 15-19 which I'd be happy to get for Warnock.
Would have thought Hawthorn would be happy with Taylor & Campbell plus Bailey & Renouf for the future.
At this point in time I can not see any club giving anything above a late 2nd rounder - we really are not in the drivers seat unless we finish last (unlikley) otherwise who ever finishes last it is likely to be a big V team.
Collingwood getting belted in the ruck without Fraser prompted their get a ruckman at all costs trade week ...perhaps if Geelong or Doggies falter in the final due to depleted ruck stocks we may get an upgraded price.
Warnock could also pull the finger out - earn a place in the team and push his value up (or my preferred option - he may stay).
Our only hope is that a few clubs think he is all right and that his attitude isn't I only want to go play with club X (especially if club X is the spooner).
Lots of things can happen in the upcoming rounds ...we are in a tight spot at the moment.
I honestly hope Freo let him walk for nothing ala Nick Stevens than accept a low ball offer of something like a 4th rounder.
Also - Farren Ray ..I don't think the Bullies would do it.
Brettox, I agree with most of your post. I can only see Melbourne or Richmond wanting Warnock. If go for Superman than it most likely be only Richmond wanting him.
The more and more of hear of Warnock attitude, the more and more I think that I was wrong about. I think that Warnock + four round pick = richmond two round pick if about fair.
SupersonicDocker
4 Jun 2008, 20:57
Hes a young ruckman with a couple years development in him. As far as im concerned we have done the hardwork for a club already so a second round pick should be the go.
If i was freo i would start proceedings now with a different club to melbourne if warnock has decided to go
Would have thought Hawthorn would be happy with Taylor & Campbell plus Bailey & Renouf for the future.
Bailey may want to come home? That'd be a fair swap I would've thought.
Bender571
4 Jun 2008, 22:07
I honestly hope Freo let him walk for nothing ala Nick Stevens than accept a low ball offer of something like a 4th rounder.
The difference though is that when Collingwood played hard ball they didn't have the PSD bargaining chip. So both Port and Collingwood lost out. Where as in this situation if we play hard ball Melbourne still end up with Warnock, it just depends whether it costs them a national draft pick or a PSD pick.
The only way we can have a win is if another good player goes into the PSD (assuming we have the second pick), and even then we run the risk of Melbourne valuing the other player above Warnock and picking them instead, leaving us with nothing to pick
carn tigez
4 Jun 2008, 22:17
I'm not sure, Dom. If he wants to bugger off, then I reckon we should do the deal that suits us best - whether that's with Essendon, Melb, Pies or whoever.
Last year the slime could have got pick 2 from Richmond, but chose to deal with Carlton because they saw pick 3 plus Kennedy as better value.
We have no obligation whatsoever to deal with a player's "club of choice."
That being said, I'd like to think that the 2 clubs could come to some sort of amicable arrangement.
I'm glad that didn't happen, cotchin or judd i know who i'd prefer :thumbsu:
FREO 4 08 FLAG
5 Jun 2008, 00:15
Gumbelton,Ryder and Jetta are all better and have all shown that they are better than Warnock anyway what has he done to prove he has tallent
dominguez
5 Jun 2008, 00:22
But if we come 2nd last, we can take him back if no-one better is available.
What if he puts a $450,000 price on his head? I wouldn't be too keen to pay that much money to a guy that doesn't want to play for us.
dominguez
5 Jun 2008, 00:24
What we need even more is for a very high profile player to nominate in the PSD and get Melbourne to commit their pick to that player.
I've always thought that Booze Bus Benny is an oxygen thief, but he could yet do one useful thing with his life.
There won't be a lot of interest in Cousins. Clubs can also use more than one pick in the PSD, so Melbourne could select Warnock and Cousins in the PSD aslong as they have two free spots on the list and enough cap space.
bigkev bleeds purple
5 Jun 2008, 06:11
There won't be a lot of interest in Cousins. Clubs can also use more than one pick in the PSD, so Melbourne could select Warnock and Cousins in the PSD aslong as they have two free spots on the list and enough cap space.
Ah, but in that scenario, Melbourne would have to gamble that no one else wants whoever they pick second. I'm guessing that neither Knockers or Booze Bus Benny will last until the second round of the PSD (if they even nominate).
Belnakor
9 Jun 2008, 14:22
for a guy who has so many tickets on himself Warnock was pretty ____ing useless on the weekend.
theGav56
9 Jun 2008, 16:14
Warnock would be making Melbourne rethink how it may use the PSD.
He'll proabably go back to West Perth again.
Sack him.
Belnakor
9 Jun 2008, 17:27
He'll proabably go back and sulk at West Perth again.
Its a difficult thing to decide - he probably does have potential, but with the kind of attitude he has been displaying he just can't get any more games. his kind of selfish attitude is poisonous to a club.
dominguez
9 Jun 2008, 17:34
I was surprised to see that he had 14 possessions and 6 marks. Considering that he spent less than half the game on the ground those are pretty good numbers.
pinkus maximus
9 Jun 2008, 17:37
I was surprised to see that he had 14 possessions and 6 marks. Considering that he spent less than half the game on the ground those are pretty good numbers.
i didn't see much of the game, but whenever i saw warnock he seemed to be on his hands and knees shovelling out handpasses
Chops_a_must
9 Jun 2008, 17:49
i didn't see much of the game, but whenever i saw warnock he seemed to be on his hands and knees shovelling out handpasses
He looked pretty good to me in the 2 and a half quarters I saw of him around the ground...
Benny Boy says he has it all lined up with a Melbourne club for next year so you have to assume he will nominate. Been training as usual apparently.
Losing Warnock though will hurt because of the lack of depth we have behind him in ruckmen. Bradley would need to come on in Leaps and Bounds to be the permanent #2 Ruckman.
Freo Shark
14 Jun 2008, 13:44
Well he's demanding to be picked in todays Worst or else he go crying home to his mummy.
He needs to pull his finger out and demand to be picked by his form for WP.
The guy should be given an airfare and told to hike it.