View Full Version : Skills Analysis Player by Player- No AFL stats allowed
Seeing our skills are in questioned i thought it would be a good idea to do a skills analysis for our current team
The different areas assessed include field kicking-looking at ability to hit targets, kicking penetration and ability to use opposite side of body
Decision Making- The ability to work your way through traffic, choose the right option and set play up
J.Adcock- Field kicking has been disappointing this season so far, he seems to have lacked penetration in his kick and pokes at the football. Last year he proved himself to be an excellent field kick and a very penetrating kick especially when kicking for goal. I am assuming this year he has been carrying a leg injury. Poor on opposite side
Decision Making- Last year proved himself to be a good decision maker, i believe he is down on confidence when he has the ball because he knows he is unable to dispose of it by foot due to mystery injury.
S.Black- Field kicking is excellent, often his mistakes will be due to getting the ball in high pressure situations, excellent on his opposite foot.
Great decision maker and is a shining light in our team.
J.Brennan- Has a robotic-stiff ball drop and rarely straightens his body when kicking the ball, he is fifty fifty at best currently, his natural ability allows him to use his right foot quite well. Lacks good penetration with his kick, is a bit of a floater of the ball
Decision Making- Once again he is fifty fifty, i tend to think early in his career he was always willing to back himself especially in impossible positions and was often caught etc. Now i feel he is looks to give off to much in our forward fifty and should just back his natural attacking instincts.
J.Brown-Excellent penetrating field kick on both sides of his body, excellent kick for goal when he has his run up correct, terrible when he moves the ball around too much.
Decision making- Rarely makes a bad decision, fantastic football brain
J.Charman- Ugly ball drop, should be banned from kicking the ball under 50m, solid kick for goal. No left foot
Decision making- Average at best, doesn't get enough of the ball, when winning the ruck his tap work is very good.
Mitch Clark-Field kicking is quite good, isn't a penetrating kick but an okay passer of the football, the ugliest kick for goal i have ever seen with a terribly two handed ball drop- can use his left but must improve
Decision Making- Is a good decision maker around the ground, is still very young and is going to be prone to poor decisions.
Corrie- Has a very high ball drop and this leads to quite an inconsistent result when he kicks the ball. Hasn't got a penetrating kick due to this ball drop problem. No left foot
Decision Making- Tends to be a pretty good decision maker but is still learning how to crumb a contest
Josh Drummond- The most spearing and penetrating kick in the competition, can use his right when in trouble. Brilliant kick of the footy.
Decision Making- His decision making is excellent, in his position when you get the ball as much as he does then a poor decision may lead to a goal being kicked.
R.Hooper- Quite a penetrating kick of the footy, needs to steady when he kicks and still looks rushed. no right foot
Decision making- Still learning to crumb the ball, his decision making in the forward fifty is not great, often gives off when he should kick and kick when he should give off. Still young and will learn
T.Johnstone- When focussed and playing with intensity his field kicking is scarily accurate and is penetrating. When he is being lazy and trying to finesse he coughs the ball up too much. Very proficient on his left side
Decision Making-When focussed and playing with intensity his decision making is excellent. When he is being lazy and trying to finesse he makes poor decisions
J.Macdonald-An improved kick of the football, draws the leg much further back these days and no longer kicks from the knee. Often kicks off one or 2 steps would benefit from getting further back off the mark and having 5 or 6 steps into his kick. Okay on his left
Decision Making- Much improved decision maker and his now has the confidence to back himself. Will only improve
A.McGrath- He is probably second to Drummond as the most penetrating kick of the football in the team. Is a very good field kick, his penetration catches defenders out of position and we need to see him spearing the ball into our forwards 4-5 times a game. No left foot
Decision Making- Much improved and is showing a great deal of composure with the footy in the backline.
D.Merrett- Ugly ball drop, holds the ball for too long and doesn't guide it well, he is also much improved and long floating kick of the ball, gets good distance and should always look to kick long. Poor left foot but it is improving
Decision Making-Most improved decision maker in the team.
T.Notting-Long penetrating kick of the footy, he does kick the ball very well but often has to kick at top speed and can lose accuracy, i rate him our 3rd most penetrating kick of the ball. Good on his left side
Decision Making- Much improved and normally makes good decisions with the ball, he is prone to blonde moments with the ball.
J.Patfull-Solid kick of the footy, he is a professional and makes the most of his kicking ability, i don't think he is proficient on his opposite foot.
Decision Making-Excellent and if he does make a mistake he is the first one to mop it up
Power- Very accurate kick of the footy over 30 metres, has little penetration in his kick over 35 metres. Can use his right foot in emergencies but not well enough to effectively snap a right foot goal 30m out.
Decision Making-Normally brilliant, occasionally due to his lack of distance with his kick he will go short to a 50 50 when a long kick to a contest would better
Roe-Strong penetrating kick of the footy, is a much better kick over 60 m than what he is over 30m, can use his left side quite well
Decision Making-Once again he is much improved and seems to make less errors with the ball in the limited game time this year.
T.Selwood-Kicks from the knee and has an awkward ball drop-doesn't guide the ball well hand to foot. Once again he kicks of 1-2 steps far too often and would be better off going back and running in to kick the ball, no penetration on the kick and doesn't have much of a left foot kick.
Decision Making-Poor at best when he has the ball in traffic, often looks like a dear caught in headlights with the foot. Poor foot skills cut down your options when you have the ball!
Sherman- Pokes the ball when he kicks and doesn't guide the ball from hand to foot enough, has worked really hard on his left side and now uses it. When his foot skills are on he is good but when the are off they are bad.
Decision Making-Improving all the time, just needs his skills to match it
I have tried to give credit when credit is due but it is obvious that our skills need to improve.
campbell
18 Jun 2008, 14:12
Excellent analysis there.
our skills on the weekend let us down badly.
Quigley
18 Jun 2008, 14:43
Nice job acuguy. Very interesting read.
My comments on a few points though:
Adcock - absolutely agree there must be an injury there somewhere.
Corrie - I think you underplay Corrie's decision making. He has real hurt value with his kicking and makes his kicks count more than anyone bar Brown and Black.
Drummond - needs to take a step or two to slow and collect himself when he is kicking. His kicking goes back to the field when he is at full speed or is not given that step.
Johnstone - kicking and decision making is below average when under pressure. He will take low percentage options and is very 50/50 at best at hitting the target.
Merrett - I think the most improved element of his kicking has been his medium length stab kicking. It looks not nearly as awkward as it used to and he hits his targets pretty well now.
Notting - great long kick but his short and medium length kicks are not so great.
Some of young guys coming through have above average disposal skills which is very encouraging as well. I am thinking Garner, Schmidt, Proud, Collier and Hawksley here.
Good read.
I think our skill level was well and truly on the up in our run of wins. Obviously hit a bit of a speed bump last week, but overall I think we are heading in the right direction.
That said I would not be surprised at all to see a sharp focus on skills droning the summer.
Monkey Daniel
18 Jun 2008, 21:06
Very insightful read. :thumbsu:
However you forgot one - Daniel Bradshaw. (my wife's favourite player :))
Must be one of the best kicks we have.
Decision Making - can't really fault, although there was one blunder in the Carlton game. That night he didn't seem to want to kick at goal. He did however, eventually kick a goal late in the game.
D.Bradshaw- Excellent kick of the football, Bradshaw kicks like your classical fullforward. He knows his kicking ability and natural kicking curve as if it was a lifelong friend. Bradshaw is extremely damaging on his left side especially when snapping around the corner. Both Bradshaw and Brown have the ability to got to their left or right around goal this results in confusion for the defender and allows a snap on goal.
Decision Making- Bradshaw is a good decision maker, he knows when to go for goal (knows his limitations) and knows when to dish the ball off. His ability to make space and position his body to shield the drop zone of the ball is evident. Sometimes Braddles is your typical old style full forward and will drop off attacking the ball hoping for the easy one out the back. I still think the best is yet to come!
Thanks for the responses as well. Quigs i do agree with you about Corrie and i do feel i have underrated his ability to penetrate. I think i was swayed by some poor ball drops over the last couple of weeks when kicking for goal. The great thing is he looked annoyed as well and i am sure he is working on becoming more efficient around goal.
Does it surprise anyone that we seem to have so many one side players, but on the flip side is we also have so many tenacious and willing footballers. I guess you can't have everything.
He needs to put a copyright on that snap across the body. He does it so often and is textbook perfect.
He needs to put a copyright on that snap across the body. He does it so often and is textbook perfect.
I suggest it was perfected as a kid at his local footy ground. God to be a kid kicking the footy around again!
beatnik
21 Jun 2008, 14:19
an interesting read acuguy :thumbsu:
Roe-Strong penetrating kick of the footy, is a much better kick over 60 m than what he is over 30m, can use his left side quite well
has anyone noticed that he swings the ball across his left hip and back again before kicking on the right boot?
it's a lot to cram in and he seems to kick much better when he's full tilt - perhaps that accounts for why he's better over longer distances as acuguy noted?
Once again i don't have official stats but some glaring skill errors today involved
Corrie- absolutely no left side of his body, easily coralled along the boundary line and when streaming forward if he cannot get onto his right side he has to stop.
Our field kicking is attrocious due to several poor kicking techniques.
If you get the chance to have a look at Gavin Urqhuart from the Kangaroos, there is a young footballer with an excellent ball drop and strong kicking style.
campbell
29 Jun 2008, 21:15
Once again i don't have official stats but some glaring skill errors today involved
Corrie- absolutely no left side of his body, easily coralled along the boundary line and when streaming forward if he cannot get onto his right side he has to stop.
Our field kicking is attrocious due to several poor kicking techniques.
If you get the chance to have a look at Gavin Urqhuart from the Kangaroos, there is a young footballer with an excellent ball drop and strong kicking style.
So, Acuguy how do you think we can change that with the poor kicking style of some of the players?
In the past, I have thought a biomechanist is the answer.I am a bit biased there.It worked a treat for the Storm with Cam Smith.
They can teach the players the physics of acuracy.
This is not meant as a negative post, its an observation.
blynd_freddie
29 Jun 2008, 21:56
As our previous poster has suggested, I too am of a similar thought, “This is not meant as a negative post, its (sic) an observation.”
After today, nothing also makes sense to me any more, including a biomechanist (sic) and the physics of acuracy(sic). But I concur... Acuguy, how do you suggest we change this?
LIONS then DAYLIGHT
30 Jun 2008, 00:10
This skill analysis is pointless. Not every player can kick 50 metres off their left or right and hit a 10 cent piece. No point in trying to get players to do this.
The key point is players KNOWING what they can and cannot do on a consistent basis.
For example, you wouldn't want Merret trying to hit 30 m short passes coming out of the defensive 50. So he either kicks it long or lays off a hand ball.
The main priority should be picking players who can get the ball. Either in and under players who can get there own ball, or designated kickers who can use the ball efficiently. A good team has a combination of these players.
Field kicking comes into focus when you have players trying to perform skilled kicks when they do not have the ability to do.
This skill analysis is pointless. Not every player can kick 50 metres off their left or right and hit a 10 cent piece. No point in trying to get players to do this.
The key point is players KNOWING what they can and cannot do on a consistent basis.
For example, you wouldn't want Merret trying to hit 30 m short passes coming out of the defensive 50. So he either kicks it long or lays off a hand ball.
The main priority should be picking players who can get the ball. Either in and under players who can get there own ball, or designated kickers who can use the ball efficiently. A good team has a combination of these players.
Field kicking comes into focus when you have players trying to perform skilled kicks when they do not have the ability to do.
My pointless exercise was for my own purpose and then i decided to post it on bigfooty, all year we have spoken about the skill level of our players and after a brief analysis i am confident in saying that we have many poor kicking styles and skill deficiencies. Not everyone will be an extremely skilled footballer. Improving skills are an essential at any level. I agree you must know your limitations and what you can achieve with the footy. But if you have over 50 percent of footballers in your team that are struggling by foot then it will hurt you.
It is very difficult to change a kicking style etc, most of these blokes have been kicking like this since they started playing footy. As said above-accepting limitations is one, so for alot of our blokes trying to kick the laceout worm burner is a no no. 2nd is not kicking short to 50 50 contests, these 2 points alone will lessen the impact of poor skills.
As for kicking the footy it is about aligning the body correctly, not kicking across the body and controlling the footy from hand to foot and kick through the football. Very simplistic but alot of our boys don't do it. This sounds silly but there aren't many footballers on our list that kick the ball better than state league players.
The left foot issue really annoys me- it is time to shame these blokes that cannot use their opposite side- get these blokes in for an hour a day kicking on their left foot untill they are able to use it effectively to pass 30 metres or get out of trouble. Our first goal was set up because Bradshaw's opponent had no idea which way he would turn because he can use both sides of his body.
This skill analysis is pointless. Not every player can kick 50 metres off their left or right and hit a 10 cent piece. No point in trying to get players to do this.
The key point is players KNOWING what they can and cannot do on a consistent basis.
For example, you wouldn't want Merret trying to hit 30 m short passes coming out of the defensive 50. So he either kicks it long or lays off a hand ball.The main priority should be picking players who can get the ball. Either in and under players who can get there own ball, or designated kickers who can use the ball efficiently. A good team has a combination of these players.
Field kicking comes into focus when you have players trying to perform skilled kicks when they do not have the ability to do.
D.Merrett - Ugly ball drop, holds the ball for too long and doesn't guide it well, he is also much improved and long floating kick of the ball, gets good distance and should always look to kick long. Poor left foot but it is improving
Did you copy this off my pointless post?
Tassie4ever
30 Jun 2008, 12:55
If you need an example of a bloke who knows his limitations, go no further than Luke Power- he knows he hasn't got an opposite foot to save himself, but that hasn't stopped him and right now in fact he's in career best form.
If you need an example of a bloke who knows his limitations, go no further than Luke Power- he knows he hasn't got an opposite foot to save himself, but that hasn't stopped him and right now in fact he's in career best form.
A fantastic footballer, he has always been able to to kick on the outside of his foot to be able to offset his non dominant side issue. In saying that there have been plenty of times in his career when his lack of a right foot has limited his effectiveness.
LIONS then DAYLIGHT
2 Jul 2008, 01:06
Sorry about labelling your skill analysis a 'pointless exercise', i didn't mean it like that.
What i was trying to say is that every player will have skills and weaknesses and that this was nothing new.
Most of our turnovers happen when short kicks are performed often to a man leading up from space with a defender close checking. Obviosuly in this situation a kick only needs to be slightly off and the defender will get a fist on it, often propelling the ball towards their goals. Which then makes the original kick pointless, as no territory has been gained.
Now, why kick the ball 25 metres to a 50 - 50 when you can kick it 50 or 60 to a contest.
We have enough skilled kickers in our team to launch attacks that can win us games against anyside. Drummond is a great user of the ball and sets up attacks from defense, the key is players have to find space and crumbers have to know where to go.
This is a situation we have yet to master, watch any game and see Bradshaw or Brown lead out to the wings with a defender and loose man in the vicinity, the kick will be reasonable but the leading player will shell the mark due to pressure from the defender and the opposing team runs the ball out often through the loose defender.
This is why it is essential that a loose defender has to be made accountable, in some cases it is essential that a damagin loose defender is tagged to prevent them running the ball out.
Bradshaw and Brown aren't going to mark everything, it is frustating to see reasonable kicks that give these forwards a chance rebounded because there are no crumbers preventing the ball from being rebounded.
carnaroys08
2 Jul 2008, 09:32
I disagree strongly with your opinion of Shermans decision making skills acuguy. How can you say that Shermans decision making is improving ? As was pointed out by the astounded commentator on the weekend, Shermans leap in the air to avoid a tackle was the type of poor decision making you would see in u/14 footy. Get real man.
Sherman is a victim of being used beyond his football talents; which could have serious negative effects on the poor lad.He is sensational as a pacy crumber/receiver in the forward line snapping goals.Thats where it starts and ends for the kidd.To be fair to Sherman he should only be used in that capacity.
Except we played him in the forward line last year, and he was worse...
I disagree strongly with your opinion of Shermans decision making skills acuguy. How can you say that Shermans decision making is improving ? As was pointed out by the astounded commentator on the weekend, Shermans leap in the air to avoid a tackle was the type of poor decision making you would see in u/14 footy. Get real man.
Sherman is a victim of being used beyond his football talents; which could have serious negative effects on the poor lad.He is sensational as a pacy crumber/receiver in the forward line snapping goals.Thats where it starts and ends for the kidd.To be fair to Sherman he should only be used in that capacity.
Lay off mate. Acuguy wrote that over 2 weeks ago when, to be fair, Sherman did look like an improving player. That he had somewhat of a shocker, decision making wise, on the weekend is hardly something that acuguy would have been able to predict.
As dlanod alluded to, some people think that some of Sherman's poor form was due to the fact that Lethal tried to turn him into a dangerous small forward when really he was most comfortable on the half back line or on-ball. It is not something that I subscribe to but he was less than impressive in the times that I saw him stationed inside 50. The goals that we all remember were generally kicked when he played in the midfield, IIRC.
I personally don't think that's the reason for his bad form, but I think he's not suited to life stationed in the forward line. He was at his best when he used to be able to charge through the middle of the ground and bomb a goal from about 30-40m out, not crumbing or taking marks on the lead.
If I had to take a stab at it, I'd say that his loss of form was due to a loss of speed while injured. Get chased down a few times and you lose the confidence to attempt those blazing runs that were his hallmark and instead you just become an averagely skilled midfielder.
i didn't mind the jump into the tackle, the idea was to get the arms above the the tackle so he could use it effectively, it didn't work so we slam him, if it works he is a genius,
i didn't mind the jump into the tackle, the idea was to get the arms above the the tackle so he could use it effectively, it didn't work so we slam him, if it works he is a genius,
I thought the same about the decision to take on the ruckman. If he didn't try and outsprint Johnson, he would have copped a spray for not backing himself.
I htink he's changed his running style and is taking some time to adjust. Hopefully the new technique prevents injuries longterm. And hopefully his judgement calls improve in the meantime.
You don't play as well as he did in his first 2 years and not have talent, Sherman is working on his game and that is easy to see, he is using his opposite side, looking to link up and is more defensive, what isn't working now for him is his offensive play, when it clicks we are going to see him at his best.
I know it says no stats allowed but I'm a mod now so no punk is gonna tell me what to do! :p
This is actually in support of the notion that stats can mislead.
I compared the disposal efficiency of our typical back 6 with our typical forward 6:
Patfull - 83%
Selwood - 82%
JMac - 80%
Merrett - 75%
Drummond - 72%
McGrath - 68%
Clark - 79%
Corrie - 73%
Hooper - 68%
Bradshaw - 64%
Brown - 62%
Johnstone - 62%
I think most people would agree that, out of that list, TJ and Drummo have the rep as being highly skilled while Merrett and Selwood are considered to have less than elite skills. But that's not reflected in the stats and I don't think that it is our perception that is wrong.
There are a number of factors which I think are at play here:
1. Due to flooding, it is easier hitting a target when you play down back than when the opposition has congested the forward 50.
2. Conservative disposal options (and therefore, higher likelihood of being "effective") are more encouraged in the back half than the forward line where "risky" disposal is more acceptable.
3. The term "effective" is probably misused. I think most of us agree that a sideways or backwards chip in the back half is not really effective, in the context of most games. But it will be counted as effective for the purposes of the stats.
4. The reputation of being an elite kick is almost like a score in diving - execution x degree of difficulty. Without the latter, you aren't likely to have a good reputation as far as using the ball goes.
5. As acuguy alluded to, skill is about decision making as much as technique.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts - for support rather than for illumination." Pretty good quote, I reckon.
Great post POBT, being a mod is definitely agreeing with you, we all know Ponting's form flourished with captaincy, maybe the responsibility agrees with you!:D
Effective disposals are a joke. I would think 70 percent is a very good disposal rate for most footballers that try to attack most of the time with the footy.
The 2 things i would take from those stats is some our backs don't attack enough with the ball although in some of those back six cases it is good that they go sideways.
The other point is Drummond and Johnstone on a few too many occasions look to hit the absolute worm burner pass. I just bought the dvd of the 89 Hawks vs Geelong grand final (if anyone thinks footy is better today they just need to watch the skills, tackling and contested situations in that game) but Darren Pritchard and Gary Buckenara were two of the best kicks you will ever see. They kicked the ball up and used space and weighting on their kicks to perfection.
Where do i start and where do i end after tonight's loss!
Memo to recruiters- we need highly skilled young players drafted into our club!
Tim the Toolman
13 Jul 2008, 00:45
We picked up the runt of the Selwoods didn't we?
I just cannot fathom the kicking skills of our players, i have played with 50 blokes that are better kicks of the footy than Selwood!
Homer Jnr
13 Jul 2008, 01:12
I just cannot fathom the kicking skills of our players, i have played with 50 blokes that are better kicks of the footy than Selwood!
You and me both.
Sometimes it is about knowing your limitations. He surely must realise that he isn't a great user of the ball by foot, so you would surely think that when in doubt, head long down the line.
Maybe it is a simple question of mental application with some players?
I've seen alot of dumb football at all levels, and tonight I was just numb and speechless at some of the 'skills' on show. Then I sat back and reviewed what the circumstances were and what options were available, and generally speaking, the concept of going long to a contest is sadly dead.
We have lost some of the trust in our teammates. We have stopped backing them to beat their opponent. Get that back, and things look up.
After Patfull made the error in the first quarter and Lucas tackled him and goaled, the tv show Lethal screaming "Kick it down the line" i think we should blame coaches for this cancer that has taken over our game where players are more worried about turning the ball over then just getting it moving forward in their direction. The overuse of handpass blows me away, a clearing hand pass followed by a short carry normally allows for the leading player further up the field to get a good break, but now days you handball once, then twice, then three times, then four times, it must be hell for the leading forward. Not like the good old days when forwards knew to either lead to down the line or double back to the fat side depending on who was kicking the ball.
And when a defender wasn't crucified for thumping the ball 60m down the line or a mid being crucified for putting on his boot and tumbling the ball into the forward line. Any old forward knows that is the easiest mark of them all!
LIONS then DAYLIGHT
13 Jul 2008, 03:49
Frustating to see 30 metre passes to a 50/50 contest can cut off when players can go 60 metres down the line to contested situation with crumbers (hopefully) front and square.
triplemac
13 Jul 2008, 10:36
Frustating to see 30 metre passes to a 50/50 contest can cut off when players can go 60 metres down the line to contested situation with crumbers (hopefully) front and square.
This is the one area we seem to fall down every game this year. No crumbers.
thought Blacky looked alright as a crumbing forward, at least he got the ball. Sad state when our top inside mid is also the only crumber...
Hopper's at no stage stopped trying, he's just not getting near it. We're working so hard to isolate the two big guys it means Rhan is nowhere near it when it hits the ground.
LIONS then DAYLIGHT
13 Jul 2008, 19:32
I still would like to see a change in tactics. Huddle Brown and Bradshaw in the Goalsquare and have crumbers such as Corrie, Hooper running towards goal from Centre Half forward to crumb. Hopefully this setup would allow players to know where the ball is going and it would create space in the centre half forward area for mid-fielders to run into to kick running goals as the opposition defensive players run back to flood Browns space.
We used this huddling tactic last year against Collingwood, but we never saw it again, we used to run hard through the middle and the forward flanks were wide open. Crumbers are useless when the ball is being passed to forwards leading out to the flanks, no crumber can get there, we need the ball in the middle for crumbers to have a chance, at this stage we can't get the ball, so we really are struggling.