The Analysis: The England Batting Order

[LIONS then DAYLIGHT]

Strauss
Cook
Vaughan
KP
Bell
Collingwood
Ambrose
Broad

What does everone think of this batting lineup.

Strauss seems to be back in favour and Cook seems to be in decent form.

The thing i notice about this order is the fact that players like Bell and Collingwood are coming in at 5 and 6. This to me is a slight tweak in tactics which has caught my attention. These players are not going to keep captains up at night, and often a decent innings will be followed by a cluster of failures, but coming down late protects these players from the moving ball, especially Bell who is not a number 3, and never will be a number 3. Coming down this late serves to hide deficincies in their ability to play a ball that is moving off the pitch or through the air.

While there are no new players as such, this tweak makes the lineup look stronger to me. This shits me.

KP is the main man, how can we get him out. Here is how.

KP likes to play though the mid-wicket area and will often plant his front foot on middle and off as soon as he gets his eye in. Bowling short is a waste of time, the grounds are too small and edges go for six, this is often followed by Botham saying how great KP is and how good a shot it is and how Ponting is a shit captain because he didn't put a fielder in a position to save one which allowed the other batsmen to get off strike and bring KP off strike who then hit hte six, So its Pontings fault (that was Hussain's logic last ashes series :rolleyes:)

To me if you block of mid wicket and try and make KP play squarer then he is vulnerable in terms of getting bowled and LBW. You still ahve to keep the ball just outside off, but the plan could work.

[eth-dog]

Strauss
Cook
Vaughan
KP
Bell
Collingwood
Ambrose
Broad

What does everone think of this batting lineup.

Strauss seems to be back in favour and Cook seems to be in decent form.

The thing i notice about this order is the fact that players like Bell and Collingwood are coming in at 5 and 6. This to me is a slight tweak in tactics which has caught my attention. These players are not going to keep captains up at night, and often a decent innings will be followed by a cluster of failures, but coming down late protects these players from the moving ball, especially Bell who is not a number 3, and never will be a number 3. Coming down this late serves to hide deficincies in their ability to play a ball that is moving off the pitch or through the air.

While there are no new players as such, this tweak makes the lineup look stronger to me. This shits me.

KP is the main man, how can we get him out. Here is how.

KP likes to play though the mid-wicket area and will often plant his front foot on middle and off as soon as he gets his eye in. Bowling short is a waste of time, the grounds are too small and edges go for six, this is often followed by Botham saying how great KP is and how good a shot it is and how Ponting is a shit captain because he didn't put a fielder in a position to save one which allowed the other batsmen to get off strike and bring KP off strike who then hit hte six, So its Pontings fault (that was Hussain's logic last ashes series :rolleyes:)

To me if you block of mid wicket and try and make KP play squarer then he is vulnerable in terms of getting bowled and LBW. You still ahve to keep the ball just outside off, but the plan could work.
swap those two with Bopara and Joyce next Ashes, as they will not be playing. I agree- KP is the main man, but get rid of him and we'll be well set, but don't underestimate Cook. he is probably #2 Test Opener behind Haydos right now, and will continue to play well for another 5-10 years. Ambrose is also a good batsmen, and could be the X-Factor in that lineup, no-one can argue that. Bell, going to lose them that series

[Don Draper]

swap those two with Bopara and Joyce next Ashes, as they will not be playing. I agree- KP is the main man, but get rid of him and we'll be well set, but don't underestimate Cook. he is probably #2 Test Opener behind Haydos right now, and will continue to play well for another 5-10 years. Ambrose is also a good batsmen, and could be the X-Factor in that lineup, no-one can argue that. Bell, going to lose them that series


Swapping them would just make the line up even weaker. Strauss will definately be there against us. He has shown what it takes to go away from international cricket, find the form and return to the top level. He would be behind only Cook and KP in form wise. Vaughan could well be on his last legs but he did make a test century this summer so may have a little more fight in him

Collingwood and Bell worry me. It is a waste down that low but you can't reallly move them anywhere. Bell has been tried at 3 and struggled at times and Collingwood is just a middle order batsman fullstop. It is their weakest link for mine. Solution: who knows Maybe bringning in the young Bopra at 5 and put Bell at 3 and hope he fires once every couple of innings.

[Furn]

Bopara for Collingwood would be the only change i could see. If Vaughns fit he'll play and bat at 3 as Bell is much better at 5.

Im going against the grain here but i can see Bell being one of the top Batsman in the world in a few years, he has some classy shots just gets out softly too often but i think thats in his head more than his technique.

If you throw in Flintoff at 7 as a bowling all rounder it looks a pretty stronger line up.

[Grimwood]

Our opening pair are a little too similar for my liking. They both like to score off the hips and square of the wicket and neither of them has the game to really push on once they hit three figures. Alastair Cook has shown some signs of bringing a little bit of aggression into his game but he's never going to be Marcus Trescothick.


Bell... has some classy shots just gets out softly too often but i think thats in his head more than his technique.

Yep. He's definitely one of the most talented batsmen in the country along with Pietersen and Bopara, but he just can't seem to make the breakthrough. You could see how hard he was trying yesterday, he waltzed to 40 and then spent the rest of the innings trying to make sure he didn't throw it all away with a soft shot.

[DaRick]

Our opening pair are a little too similar for my liking. They both like to score off the hips and square of the wicket and neither of them has the game to really push on once they hit three figures. Alastair Cook has shown some signs of bringing a little bit of aggression into his game but he's never going to be Marcus Trescothick.

I've always felt that Trescothick was overrated, TBH. Although I'm being somewhat general, anyone who could bowl accurate swing and seam would probably have a field day against him, as he has no footwork to speak of. That's probably why his record against Australia is (still) mediocre.

[usalion]

What happens when (if) Freddie makes a full recovery and is back firing, which the pom press are thinking for the second test? Slopster to go? Or a bowler? Does freddie come in as one of the four bowlers, or do they play him as an all rounder?

This order is far from set

[Grimwood]

What happens when (if) Freddie makes a full recovery and is back firing, which the pom press are thinking for the second test? Slopster to go? Or a bowler? Does freddie come in as one of the four bowlers, or do they play him as an all rounder?

This order is far from set

Flintoff's also going to impact on the wicket keeping selection. If we want him as one of five bowlers then we really need a keeper who can bat at six. Do we really want to change keepers again?

[Bond,ShaneBond]

Bell is a seriously good player, as he is showing right now! In numbers 4,5 and 6 he averages 50+ compared to 45 at 3. So you can infer that he is more suited to bat lower down, and there is no shame in that. He will be a key player in 09 because he will have more experience, and no Warne who terrorised him in the past. I think that Colly is their weak link, I still am not convinced over him at all.

They have a solid batting order, with their players being 40-45 batsmen, aside from KP. If Bell and Cook can push up to being 50 run players by 09 then they will have a seriously intimidating order.

However, I think that bowling will once again prove decisive, as it was in 05. There are lots of big ifs about their options, eg Freddie and Jones on fitness and if Broad can reach his potential in the next year. If they have Fred and Broad that will strengthen their batting even more.

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Going to be interesting to see how Flintoff slots back in.

Is it a straight swap for Anderson?

Or will they drop Collingwood and bat Freddie at six?

If it's the latter, Prior may be preferred to Ambrose on the strength of his batting.

[eth-dog]

Going to be interesting to see how Flintoff slots back in.

Is it a straight swap for Anderson?

Or will they drop Collingwood and bat Freddie at six?

If it's the latter, Prior may be preferred to Ambrose on the strength of his batting.
they won't drop Collingwood, as he is they're only fielder and next captain

[davey_magik]

Collingwood should be dropped for Flintoff, his form has been abysmal of late.

[Ysaye]

Collingwood should be dropped for Flintoff, his form has been abysmal of late.

Need to keep Collingwood because of fielding and aggression that he adds to the team.

Flintoff's bowling is what is needed, the batting ability is just an extra: drop the worst bowler.

[Blue Dimension]

Freddie and Hoggard need to come back into that team at the expense of Collingwood and Anderson if they are to have any hope at challenging Australia in the next Ashes series.

Despite Bell's 199 against SA, imho, he struggles when the heat is on.

Ambrose is yet to convince me. I think Prior was the better option. But i guess it's still only early days for Ambrose.


Positives for England include

* Sidebottom - is just pure class and will trouble Australia. Very good bowler and doesn't take a step back. Love his aggression
* Broad - adds that batting ability to their lower order that they lacked in the 2006 Ashes. Also a very talented young bowler.

[DaRick]

Ambrose is yet to convince me. I think Prior was the better option. But i guess it's still only early days for Ambrose.

I don't know. Matthew Prior was a pretty poor wicketkeeper, whereas Ambrose is not. You probably shouldn't select wicketkeepers on the strength of their batting, unless we're talking Gilchrist's or Sangakkara's (although he no longer keeps).

[i_hate_scams]

since we are on the topic, who are the bowlers you think will front up for the ashes?

and how are these guys tracking?


Simon Jones
Harmison
Hoggard
Flintoff

[Grimwood]

since we are on the topic, who are the bowlers you think will front up for the ashes?

and how are these guys tracking?


Simon Jones
Harmison
Hoggard
Flintoff


The only issue with Jones and Flintoff is one of stamina. Neither have lost any pace but whether they are ready to bowl more than 15 overs a day is unknown. We should get a good look at Flintoff later this week but you probably won't see Jones until the ODIs.

Harmison and Hoggard are a more than handy pair to have around but neither are likely to be in England's first choice attack. Especially if Jimmy Anderson can replicate his performance of the last few days on a consistent basis.