Changes Vs. Hawthorn

[SaintsPremiers08]

who will come in and who will go out?

My Predictions:

In: M.Gardiner, Baker (If fit)

Out: Allen, Gwilt

If Baker not Fit then bring Geary in IMO. Had 2 BOG's in the 2's in the past 2 weeks.

Unlucky: Geary, Birss, Schneider.


Thoughts?

[makemytime]

Have X Clarke and Schneider had a run in the scorps yet?

[Look2Me4Guidance]

Have X Clarke and Schneider had a run in the scorps yet?

Schneider was named in the best yesterday.

[Persevering Saint]

who will come in and who will go out?

My Predictions:

In: M.Gardiner, Baker (If fit)

Out: Allen, Gwilt

If Baker not Fit then bring Geary in IMO. Had 2 BOG's in the 2's in the past 2 weeks.

Unlucky: Geary, Birss, Schneider.


Thoughts?
I agree, although maybe with Birss in instead of Geary. I love having him in our side.

[TassieSaint]

Apparantly Baker wasn't exactly tearing it up for Casey, but with Hawthorn's quality midfield we could probably use him.

I'd like to see
In: M. Gardiner, Baker, Birss (and maybe Geary)
Out: Allen, Gwilt and one of McQualter and Eddy

Still can't understand why Birss was dropped in the first place, and he hasn't taken a backward step since.

[Vaul Darkhour]

Definitely Birss and Gardiner in for Allen and Gwilt. Leave the others for another week and give Xavier a run also .. ;)

[mailman4]

Gwilt has to go...i think we've given him enough chances to prove himself and he just hasn't done anything, it would take a huge effort for him to not be delisted at the end of the year.

[saintsownthedome]

Still think that Sam Gilbert has been patchy at best since his return, and probably just needs some confidence.

With Baker / Geary available, you'd think that Gilbert could do the job that Gwilt has been doing (picking up the 3rd best tall), and then jobs like Eddie Betts would go to players who are more mobile and able to stick with him at stoppages, where Gilbert really got found out on Friday night.

Anyone know when X is due back ? And what is the exact injury he has got ?

[just a line monkey]

Gardiner and Birss in for me.

Gwilt and Allen out for me.

Fiora, L Fisher and Rix delist?

Robert Eddy the next Lenny?

[ChrisFooty]

Gwilt, Allen - it's simple really. Allen has potential and will be kept for next year. Gwilt on the other hand will struggle to keep his place on the Saints list.

Schendier got named in the best without kicking a goal (for Casey) Prehaps back in the team playing more in the midfield?

Baker did not look 100% for Casey (Thats the word)

[Dagz]

In general agreeance re the outs of Allen and Gwilt.

If Schneider is fit he is definately in our best 22 and that could make McQualter the unlucky one.

OUTS
Allen, Gwilt, McQualter

INS
Gardiner, Birss, Schneider

If Baker fit, Birss gets another run in the magoos.

Gilbert gets another weeks reprieve.

Bring on the Hawks!

[Disco7]

Geez tough to drop McQualter, his job on Murphy Friday night was 2nd to none, best game he's played in years. No chance on missing out and as for Eddy he's getting better with every game he plays , he's tough and fights for the footy at every contest(Leave the boys in, since we've had this injection of youth we haven't lost a game Army,Moe and Eddy).

Allen maybe the unlucky one but I think he suits the structure at the moment. With Kingy playing well in the ruck and Kosi relieving him when he's tired it enables us to give Allen some much needed time at FF when Kosi pushes up into the centre and utilise him around the ground, Kosi picked up 14 Hit outs Friday and took some valuable marks in the back half, bringing M Gardiner back in means Kosi must spend the majority of the game at FF otherwise Roo is the only one down there(And we've all seen how good he has been the last 3 weeks with the freedom to move anywhere). I just reckon if we think about it maybe Ross has got something good going at the moment and why change it. We must use Kosi as the 2nd ruckman to King or Gardiner whichever is fit because it brings him into the game. Leaving him at FF all time(Refer rds 1-11) he becomes stagnent

I think if Bakes or Schneider are fit then we must make way for them. Gwilt the obvious but the other i'm not so sure probably one of the kids but as I said it'll be a tough decision because they've injected some much needed life back into our season.

Unlucky Birss and Gears.

Go Sainters!!!!!!

[Vaul Darkhour]

cant see Baker coming back into the side after playing just the 2 matches this year and being injured... more time in the VFL... Schneider though will prob get a call back and I cant see McQualter going anywhere soon after his performances.. :)

[SaintsSeptember]

Gwilt and Allen out. My only concern is who would play in Allens spot, because I wouldn't want to upset what has been happening with Kosi, Reiwoldt.

I think pace will be a factor against the Hawks, is Mc Qualter noteably quicker than Birss? If he is I would tend to favour keeping him in. I think Baker's tagging ability would be very useful against the Hawks. ( I agree with the comment above - Gilbert to take Gwilt's role )

[The Punter]

Gwilt and Allen are the only two players who deserve to be dropped on Friday night's performance.

I think M Gardiner will struggle to get back, as it is clear that Kosi plays his best football alternating between the ruck and the forward line.

In: Schneider, Baker
Out: Gwilt, Allen

[MIDDO]

Geez tough to drop McQualter, his job on Murphy Friday night was 2nd to none, best game he's played in years. No chance on missing out and as for Eddy he's getting better with every game he plays , he's tough and fights for the footy at every contest(Leave the boys in, since we've had this injection of youth we haven't lost a game Army,Moe and Eddy).

Allen maybe the unlucky one but I think he suits the structure at the moment. With Kingy playing well in the ruck and Kosi relieving him when he's tired it enables us to give Allen some much needed time at FF when Kosi pushes up into the centre and utilise him around the ground, Kosi picked up 14 Hit outs Friday and took some valuable marks in the back half, bringing M Gardiner back in means Kosi must spend the majority of the game at FF otherwise Roo is the only one down there(And we've all seen how good he has been the last 3 weeks with the freedom to move anywhere). I just reckon if we think about it maybe Ross has got something good going at the moment and why change it. We must use Kosi as the 2nd ruckman to King or Gardiner whichever is fit because it brings him into the game. Leaving him at FF all time(Refer rds 1-11) he becomes stagnent

I think if Bakes or Schneider are fit then we must make way for them. Gwilt the obvious but the other i'm not so sure probably one of the kids but as I said it'll be a tough decision because they've injected some much needed life back into our season.

Unlucky Birss and Gears.

Go Sainters!!!!!!

Allen unlucky ?? Hardly touched the ball and really needed to take his chance with maybe just one goal from the big fella to show us something,think M.Gardiner in Allen out.Bring on Buddy lets see how Max stiches him up !!!

[Persevering Saint]

I suspect it will end up being the obvious:

Out: Gwilt, Allen
In: Birss/Schneider, M Gardiner.

Bakes needs more time in the twos. Birss should never have been dropped. Allen will be a gun, but isn't quite ready yet (and keeping him in the side every week right now can only be hurting his confidence...).

Havind said that, I have to say Punter makes a great point about Kosi's rotating from ruck to forward. But rather than that meaning Gardiner stays out of the team, might I suggest they switch at times. What I mean is, King rucks, with Gardiner and Kosi in the forward line as twin talls (Roo is always running just outside the 50 in this scenario). When King rests on the bench or the backline, Kosi rucks, Gardiner stays in the 50. Then when Kosi needs a break, Gardiner goes in and Kosi goes back to the forward line. Thoughts?

[Sainters66]

Gwilt and Allen are the only two players who deserve to be dropped on Friday night's performance.

I think M Gardiner will struggle to get back, as it is clear that Kosi plays his best football alternating between the ruck and the forward line.

In: Schneider, Baker
Out: Gwilt, Allen

I agree Punter:thumbsu:. One of the reason we are doing better is that Kosi is playing better as he is more suited to ruck/forward than being stuck at FF. I don't think we can have both King and Gardner in the same team. It's one or the other and with King playing a really good game on Fridya night, Gardner will have to sit it out this week at least. :)

[Sainters66]

I suspect it will end up being the obvious:

Out: Gwilt, Allen
In: Birss/Schneider, M Gardiner.

Bakes needs more time in the twos. Birss should never have been dropped. Allen will be a gun, but isn't quite ready yet (and keeping him in the side every week right now can only be hurting his confidence...).

Havind said that, I have to say Punter makes a great point about Kosi's rotating from ruck to forward. But rather than that meaning Gardiner stays out of the team, might I suggest they switch at times. What I mean is, King rucks, with Gardiner and Kosi in the forward line as twin talls (Roo is always running just outside the 50 in this scenario). When King rests on the bench or the backline, Kosi rucks, Gardiner stays in the 50. Then when Kosi needs a break, Gardiner goes in and Kosi goes back to the forward line. Thoughts?

Sorry mate, can't say I agree with that at all. We would be way too top heavy. look at the top four. Apart from say the hawks, its the smaller forwards who are dominating.

[Squizzy1970]

Can't see Bakes coming in yet.

Schneider, Birss and Geary all put their hands up. Fiora did too, noting he was (surprisingly) an emergency against Carlton.

[Signd Sealed Saint]

Gardiner is key coz we need a good second stringer since campell and taylor are quite strong. As for the other i'd like 2 see geary get another game since we do need some youth in the side but i cant see who will make way since Baker will need to come back. So i reckon

In: Baker, Gardiner
Out: Gwilt, Allen

@ Punter, while Kosi is playing good footy in that role, i dont think he'll match it either Hawthorn ruckmen, if we were playing another side with lesser ruck prowess maybe we'd bring the two smalls but i rkn this week go with Gardiner

[_Interpol_]

Geez tough to drop McQualter, his job on Murphy Friday night was 2nd to none, best game he's played in years. No chance on missing out and as for Eddy he's getting better with every game he plays , he's tough and fights for the footy at every contest(Leave the boys in, since we've had this injection of youth we haven't lost a game Army,Moe and Eddy).

Allen maybe the unlucky one but I think he suits the structure at the moment. With Kingy playing well in the ruck and Kosi relieving him when he's tired it enables us to give Allen some much needed time at FF when Kosi pushes up into the centre and utilise him around the ground, Kosi picked up 14 Hit outs Friday and took some valuable marks in the back half, bringing M Gardiner back in means Kosi must spend the majority of the game at FF otherwise Roo is the only one down there(And we've all seen how good he has been the last 3 weeks with the freedom to move anywhere). I just reckon if we think about it maybe Ross has got something good going at the moment and why change it. We must use Kosi as the 2nd ruckman to King or Gardiner whichever is fit because it brings him into the game. Leaving him at FF all time(Refer rds 1-11) he becomes stagnent

I think if Bakes or Schneider are fit then we must make way for them. Gwilt the obvious but the other i'm not so sure probably one of the kids but as I said it'll be a tough decision because they've injected some much needed life back into our season.

Unlucky Birss and Gears.

Go Sainters!!!!!!


Agree - if mini gets dropped ill go heave, killed murphy, got 10-15 of his own and kicked a goal. Will not get dropped

Gwilt out, Geary in. Geary with 2 BOG's in a row MUST be rewarded

While allen didnt do much with the ball, you'll find having him in the game free's up kosi and roo. Not every player hasd to have 400 possessions, his presense is useful and works well with the plan. Why change a winning formula???? 3 in a row. 1 change maximum, 2 if you absolutely need to

Wouln't bring Gardy in yet, ruck is working well ATM, kosi pinch hitting is doing awesome and he isnt being stagnant at FF

[SaintsSeptember]

How would Gardner go as a tall forward?

[makemytime]

can take a contested mark and kick goals but having 3 ruckmen? hmmmm

maybe get kosi in forward 50 but play as ruck in the attacking 50 while king/gardiner plays ruck on rest of the ground while rotating

[wheels4]

in: m.gardiner, schneider/baker
out: allen, mcq (unlucky)

need gardiner as they have taylor & campbell

gwilt i think will stay as a tall down back we need him there with their forwards of franklin, roughead, williams etc.

if baker comes in mcq will go if schneids comes back in i think it might be eddy even though he is looking good hope he doesnt get dropped

dont think x will come back probs not bakes either but never no

[ChrisFooty]

Mcqualter had 15 touches and kicked a goal. Did a solid tagging job. I do not think he will be dropped. Eddy would be dropped before him. There will only be two changes maxiumum i feel. Baker needs another VFL match most likely to get fitness and form up.

[SaintsSeptember]

in: m.gardiner, schneider/baker
out: allen, mcq (unlucky)

need gardiner as they have taylor & campbell

gwilt i think will stay as a tall down back we need him there with their forwards of franklin, roughead, williams etc.

if baker comes in mcq will go if schneids comes back in i think it might be eddy even though he is looking good hope he doesnt get dropped

dont think x will come back probs not bakes either but never no

Gwilt would not be able to stop franklin, roughead, williams etc.
Just because someone is tall does not mean that they are a good defender. ( Or a good basketballer for that matter ).

[sainter]

I´m travelling around Europe for the remainder of the year so I´ll be more reliant than ever on you all to keep me up to date.

I only read the reviews of the Carlton game but it´s such a good sign to read in this thread that we got through unscathed and have senior players fit and ready to return.

Gwilt and Allen do seem the obvious candidates to be dropped. Mini has worked so hard to get back into the team and if he had such a strong game on Murphy you´d be foolish to drop him. We want competition for places, definitely. But we can´t go around dropping players who are performing.

[Squizzy1970]

I congratulated Mini on his game (when he was down at Casey watching), even though I normally leave the players alone. He seemed pretty happy with the job he did, so I've no idea why anyone would suggest he get dropped. Murphy ended up staging for free kicks and was ineffective on the night.

[stfan]

I cannot see anyone but Allen and Gwilt being omitted.

The casey match rep[orts all had Geary, Birss. M Gardiner and Schneider playing well.

Bakes was evidently still not looking too fit...and Raph was very error prone.

Birrs has also now strung together very good games at Casey when he was dropped, and he was stiff to be dropped in the first place.

Are M Gardiner and Schneider fully fit????


So possible ins are M Gardiner, Birrs, Geary and Scneider.

I cannot imagine 4 changes though. Only 2.

[Kildonan]

Gwilt has to go. He's been doing nothing but the undiscipline stuff when playing. I would like to see both clarke brothers playing. :thumbsu:

I'm not sure that X is ready yet, and Raph - whom I'm a rap for, has just come off his worst game in some time.

Gwilt is too much of a risk though in modern football - I would prefer to see Allen moved back than get a replay of Gwilt's Carlton game.

Time to forgive Birss (he must have reversed into the selectors' ferarri or something) and let him back into the fold, and Geary has major claims as well.

[dg102]

GWILT HAS TO GO! You cannot have backmen that consistently turn over the ball and give away free kicks.
To beat Hawthorn we need to bring in as much pace as possible. They run and rebound so quick through CHB. Bringing in M. Gardiner even if he is fit is a big mistake. He's extremly slow. Bringing in Shnieder, Geary, Birss and GWILT, Allen out.

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

Dude, people forget how good MG was rucking. He wasn't having much of an impact around the ground but he's a better ruckman than King. Just wish he could fkn stay on the ground for more than a couple weeks at a time. Him and king swapping on and off would be very beneficial for us againt the Hawks.

Although I agree that Kosi has done very well around the ground in MG's absence.

[dg102]

I just think with MG coming in it takes away ruck time from King which is unnessasary and yes Kos can fill in for him while he rests. We dont need another ruckmen in the team atm. Dont forget throw ups are just a small part of the game. When MG isnt in the ruck he's very slow around the ground. Probably slowest on the team and Hawks are way quicker than us. I think saints should try balance that out.

[Sir Robert]

Dude, people forget how good MG was rucking. He wasn't having much of an impact around the ground but he's a better ruckman than King. Just with he could fkn stay on the ground for more than a couple weeks at a time. Him and king swapping on and off would be very beneficial for us againt the Hawks.

Although I agree that Kosi has done very well around the ground in MG's absence.

Agreed - even if King, Kosi and M Gardiner swap whilst one is in the forward line and the other on the bench would be fine by me, as long as all three aren't on the ground at the same time.

[Vaul Darkhour]

MG very definitely needed in the team, as is Xman.... :) it will be good to see them back in the side.. Birss deserves another crack at the moment and could be used as a shut down player or another mi forward etc... there is always the option of playing ruckman on bench, one forward and alternate Kosi in the ruck for a moment if he's not seeing the ball...

[Squizzy1970]

Agree Darky.

Gardi would have had the bulk of the reported 52 hit-outs for Casey.

Hopefully he is fit and X can play with Casey this week.

Birss has been in the best three for 3-4 weeks in a row, so can't do much more.

[Look2Me4Guidance]

I just think with MG coming in it takes away ruck time from King which is unnessasary and yes Kos can fill in for him while he rests. We dont need another ruckmen in the team atm. Dont forget throw ups are just a small part of the game. When MG isnt in the ruck he's very slow around the ground. Probably slowest on the team and Hawks are way quicker than us. I think saints should try balance that out.

I don't think this is true at all. Rioli is the only player with real pace. I think we matchup decently in the pace department.

[Signd Sealed Saint]

Anyone know where the game actually is? Said on the news it was at the G' yet on all the websites it says Telstra Dome even the Ticketmaster site. Confirmations appreciated.

[Squizzy1970]

Definitely at the Dome.

I got thrown out with the Carlton game, as the draw I printed pre-season had it at the Dome (but I think it got over-run by the other religious event - the Y-Generation rally).

[Buddy the Brave]

Any WA Saints know where we can watch this game, not on FTA or Fox in Perth.

[Kildonan]

GWILT HAS TO GO! You cannot have backmen that consistently turn over the ball and give away free kicks.
To beat Hawthorn we need to bring in as much pace as possible. They run and rebound so quick through CHB. Bringing in M. Gardiner even if he is fit is a big mistake. He's extremly slow. Bringing in Shnieder, Geary, Birss and GWILT, Allen out.

I don't think this is true at all. Rioli is the only player with real pace. I think we matchup decently in the pace department.

The Hawks do have a few pacey players, but the secret to their defensive pressure and attacking speed is their well-drilled zone defence.

The Saints played them on their own terms early in 2007 and it was a shocker of a match - low scoring and full on defensive battle. The brilliance of Buddy and a radical approach to their forward structure led to their last quarter superiority.

We got to play them again, this time after we had schooled on their style of play. Ross Lyon got together with the boys and devised a way of toppling the Hawks. They weren't happy either - the Hawks - they didn't like being shown up - and they displayed it with a physical reaction - like children collectively spitting the dummy.

[beejay]

Any WA Saints know where we can watch this game, not on FTA or Fox in Perth.

good question mate - to tell u the truth i have absolultey no idea and i doubt any pubs would be showing it cos their precious eagles will be the preferred match shown so they can all get their hopes up and think they will win and get crushed again haha (this is what my dad is always like:p)

[dg102]

I don't think this is true at all. Rioli is the only player with real pace. I think we matchup decently in the pace department.

You should watch a few Hawks games. If you think their only player with pace is Rioli. They run off the back line and through the middle with serious pace.

[HoldenMCaulfield]

I would expect (in the order of likelihood - I would not mind an unchanged side either, though) :

In : M Gardiner / Out : J Allen

Allen did not play well at all on Friday and Gardiner was even better then King before his injury - Koschitzke should not be a pure full forward, resulting in him being bored and out of the game, but Hawthorn's ruckmen are a very different category than Carlton's. Gardiner is rather slow, yes, but will also provide an additional option in the forward line.

In : A Schneider / Out : D Armitage

I know, I'm not sure myself that I'd really like this, but I can't think of anyone else to make room for Schneider who apparently had a phantastic game with Casey and can play a 'playmaker' role in the midfield and score goals. Armitage is tough, something we will need against Hawthorn, but I believe that the only other candidate, Eddy, is contributing more to the team, as much as I like Armitage and would feel bad for his omission. Gwilt - see below - would be, apart from Allen, the only 'obvious' candidate to be dropped, but that would probably require Gram to move back again - unlikely after his excellent performance on Friday.

In : J Geary (or S Birss) / Out : J Gwilt

Gwilt improved towards the end of the game, but he was a real concern being slow and indecisive and giving away frees (his performance on Friday will not have cemented the spot Lyon was talking about...). Geary apparently played very well for Casey for two weeks running and deserves another go. Birss most definitely deserves another go and was unlucky to have been dropped in the first place, but appears to not be on Lyon's list for whatever reason. Baker has missed a real lot of footy and should get a few more games with Casey (also, there is no immediate need to bring him in with McQualter playing very well).

[Look2Me4Guidance]

You should watch a few Hawks games. If you think their only player with pace is Rioli. They run off the back line and through the middle with serious pace.

They are no faster than when Montagna and Gram do it mate. Birchall and Ladson are no faster than our boys in the same position.

[Squizzy1970]

Not sure how much this gives away, but note Schneider not mentioned and Fiora maybe ahead of Gears & Birss?

St Kilda returns to basics

By Pat Devery 12:14 PM Wed 16 July, 2008
ST KILDA assistant coach Anthony Rock says the club will continue to focus on the basics as it attempts to upset third-placed Hawthorn at Telstra Dome on Saturday night.
Speaking to saints.com.au Rock noted that the team's effort over the past three games - each of which has ended in a Saints victory - had improved, and the coaching staff would be concentrating on replicating that against the in-form Hawks.
"Over the last three or so weeks, we've really got an effort", said Rock. "Our ball use has been a lot better, and the way we've ran and carried the ball and shared it around.
"Our tackling efforts have been really good as well - really all the basics you hear time and time again: you tackle well, you win the ball and really focus on the contested ball."
Rock also highlighted the selection pressure being exerted by several players in the VFL who were pressing for inclusion against Hawthorn.
"We're in a really good spot at the moment. Michael Gardiner returned from injury and was pretty solid in the ruck. I'm sure he will be in contention this week, along with Aaron Fiora who has been pushing his name back up. His performances have been pretty good over the last three or four weeks.
"Jarryn Geary had 40 possessions in the VFL and that's pleasing from a coaching perspective because he's a young, developing player."
Leigh Fisher and Shane Birss were other players Rock said had been consistently good and were close to senior selection.
As for the challenge presented by Hawthorn on the weekend, Rock said several Saints were capable of curbing the influence of the Hawk big guns, including Luke Hodge, Sam Mitchell and Lance 'Buddy' Franklin.
"We've done reasonably well in the past particularly on Hodge," he said.
"Sean Dempster really did a good job last week on (Nick) Stevens; Andrew McQualter was good on (Marc) Murphy.
"I'm not too sure [who will pick up Hodge or Mitchell] but ... they're dangerous players and I'm sure they'll be a focus in our preparation.”
Rock said creating pressure in the midfield and in the forward 50 was vital if the Saints were to limit the scoring chances of Franklin, a player he described as "pretty hard to stop".

[Signd Sealed Saint]

Hope Fiora doesn't come back into the side, a 26 year old failure is the last thing we need to be honest. Trade him and hopefully we get something decent (e.g young player or 3rd round pick). Anyway hopefully we can play Schneids tho, he brings pace and that X factor. Handy.

[makemytime]

I thought Fiora was pretty decent last year, or am I wrong? His last game was shocking though, playing on the wing and only getting 4 touches

[TassieSaint]

Surely they wouldn't pick Fiora ahead of Geary or Schneider. Surely.

[HoldenMCaulfield]

An in form Aaron Fiora is not only a very handy contribution to the team with a lot of pace, but also great to watch with some spectacular marks and good long kicks for goal.

He did play really well last year and if he does get another chance, confidence will be a major factor - I just hope that he will be treated with the same respect and admiration as every other player wearing the St Kilda jumper.

Generally, I really like the fact that he has not given up. He will know that his last performances for the Saints were below average and that he will need to really prove himself again. Birss, Rix, L Fisher and Geary could also be excused for showing a certain frustration for not being given another chance at the moment - yet they continue to be named amongst the best and thus, even if not selected for the Saints, remind those in the actual 22 not to be too confident of their position.

[Signd Sealed Saint]

Holden your forgetting that Fiora is 26, his time is past.

[HoldenMCaulfield]

Holden your forgetting that Fiora is 26, his time is past.

You may have misunderstood what I was trying to say. I am not necessarily asking for Fiora's inclusion. But if he does come in, I hope that people will cheer for him like all other St Kilda players.

He can be great, we've seen that just last year.

And I suppose you are not trying to say that 26 is too old for being a good AFL footballer, are you (by the way, Fiora is 27) ?

If you are, please don't tell Robert Harvey (36), Max Hudghton (32), Steven King (29), Michael Gardiner (29), Lenny Hayes (28), Stephen Milne (28), Steven Baker (28), Jason Blake (27) or Brownlow Medal co-favourites Brett Kirk (31), Brent Harvey (30), Simon Black (29), Jason Akermanis (32) and Matthew Richardson (33)...

You are not (like) Nexus who wants to trade Hayes and other experienced players for a wagon full of unproven youngsters, are you ?

[ChrisFooty]

Gwilt improved towards the end of the game, but he was a real concern being slow and indecisive and giving away frees (his performance on Friday will not have cemented the spot Lyon was talking about...).).

Gwilt improved towards the end of the Carlton match? How?

[Rough_Edges]

Gwilt won't be dropped i don't think, Lyon will persist.

Schneids and Gardiner to come in i'd say.

[Rough_Edges]

You may have misunderstood what I was trying to say. I am not necessarily asking for Fiora's inclusion. But if he does come in, I hope that people will cheer for him like all other St Kilda players.

He can be great, we've seen that just last year.

And I suppose you are not trying to say that 26 is too old for being a good AFL footballer, are you (by the way, Fiora is 27) ?

If you are, please don't tell Robert Harvey (36), Max Hudghton (32), Steven King (29), Michael Gardiner (29), Lenny Hayes (28), Stephen Milne (28), Steven Baker (28), Jason Blake (27) or Brownlow Medal co-favourites Brett Kirk (31), Brent Harvey (30), Simon Black (29), Jason Akermanis (32) and Matthew Richardson (33)...

You are not (like) Nexus who wants to trade Hayes and other experienced players for a wagon full of unproven youngsters, are you ?
How do you know he can be greaT?

Whats this - his 9th season in the system?

For not one good season.

An average one last year but not great, and i am by no means a Fiora bagger, he's just not up to it.

[Vaul Darkhour]

I think what Holden may be alluding to, is that Fiora is the type of player that blitzes when the the team is on song... our team hasn't this year so far but is heading that way.. he's not the kind of player that goes in for the hard ball but Lyon may realise this and be aware that he can potentially be a game breaker against the better sides with his pace, goal kicking and marking ability..

I'm not saying that we should include him in either but you never know.. if the team gets on a role, then anything could happen...

[_Interpol_]

Gwilt won't be dropped i don't think, Lyon will persist.

Schneids and Gardiner to come in i'd say.

Hmm, he should be... Had 4-5 weeks, really hasn'y imptaced 1 game, and you can't keep him in after giving away 4-5 direct goals, he will be found out by a good unit like the Hawks

Which 2 do you drop to bring in Schneids and Gardy then??? If you're not dropping Gwilt?

LESS CHANGES IS BETTER - why are we always looking to make changes?? Yes, Schneids, Birss, Fish, Fiora been doing well, but it's not the point AFL level an VFL level are miles apart, only be incluned to bring in 1 player at most. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

1 change, any more and we will be going backwards. For too long we brought in old tried players who were ineffective, just based on rep. Those times must go

Out: Gwilt

In: Baker/Birss/Geary - Take your pick - i'd say a fit bake could be handy against the Hawks

[dg102]

Didnt Geary get 40 posessions and BOG on the weekend? HELLO 40 POSSESIONS! and hes just a kid. How can you not reward a performance like that. He has to be called up.

[SaintsSeptember]

I think what Holden may be alluding to, is that Fiora is the type of player that blitzes when the the team is on song... our team hasn't this year so far but is heading that way.. he's not the kind of player that goes in for the hard ball but Lyon may realise this and be aware that he can potentially be a game breaker against the better sides with his pace, goal kicking and marking ability..

I'm not saying that we should include him in either but you never know.. if the team gets on a role, then anything could happen...

I would rather a player who fights as hard as he can when the chips are down, than someone who looks good in a game we would have won anyway!

[tim_saints]

I have to agree, Fiora shoodnt be brought back into the side reason being i think we would get more value out of either Schneider or Geary becasue they win more of the ball and schneider can kick a few goals when on song aswell.

[stfan]

Team should be out soon...

[CHBench]

In: Fiora Schneider
Out: Gwilt Allen

[makemytime]

can understand schneider but i hope fiora puts in a damn good performance

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

No MG, ****k. Get back in son.

[Signd Sealed Saint]

You may have misunderstood what I was trying to say. I am not necessarily asking for Fiora's inclusion. But if he does come in, I hope that people will cheer for him like all other St Kilda players.

He can be great, we've seen that just last year.

And I suppose you are not trying to say that 26 is too old for being a good AFL footballer, are you (by the way, Fiora is 27) ?

If you are, please don't tell Robert Harvey (36), Max Hudghton (32), Steven King (29), Michael Gardiner (29), Lenny Hayes (28), Stephen Milne (28), Steven Baker (28), Jason Blake (27) or Brownlow Medal co-favourites Brett Kirk (31), Brent Harvey (30), Simon Black (29), Jason Akermanis (32) and Matthew Richardson (33)...

You are not (like) Nexus who wants to trade Hayes and other experienced players for a wagon full of unproven youngsters, are you ?

Not at all, except right now it should be near the peak of Fiora's career and if what we've seen of him is the best he could produce i think time is better spent on the likes of Geary and Eddy etc. And no I would never ever considering trading the likes of Hudgeton and Hayes, I have Hudgeton's number on my guernsey and Hayes is one of my favourite at the club. Never EVER will i want the heart and soul of the club put to the trading table.

[_Interpol_]

No MG, ****k. Get back in son.

Disagree - ruck structure working well without him.. Kosi seems to have found his spot in the team..

Now, they have raped him well and truly by removing Allan and leaving us 1 KPP forward short.. All for resting Jaz, but ya gotta bring in another KPP: Fergo, or even let Macca play fwd...

This is my beef with st kilda, we do well, and then change a winning team to bring in old heads who have always let us down.. Why will Fiona be any different this time?

[Juggalo Balla]

How does fiora deserve a spot in the team :(

Had better be 100% fit with rock solid hammies ready to run with Bateman all day long.

[makemytime]

hes on bateman? oh crap but nahhh hes in and we can't change, cheer him on and he'll batter bateman

[ChrisFooty]

Willing to give Fiora another shot. Hopefully he can capture his second half of 2007 form. Would not be a game breaker, but would be a contributor.

Has not played one good game yet this season at AFL level. Maybe this weekend will be his first.

[SaintsSeptember]

The inclusions are a bit strange, not just whether Fiora should have been selected but also the role he and Schneider will play.
We have taken out two who played key positions forward and back last week, and included two who normally play midfield or forward wing.
We seem to be lacking a full forward and a defender.

[kirbatron]

Perhaps Fiora will go with Young?

[Kildonan]

Now there is a match up :D

Both only have vague recolections about this thing called defence

[SaintsSeptember]

Not sure how much this gives away, but note Schneider not mentioned and Fiora maybe ahead of Gears & Birss?

St Kilda returns to basics

By Pat Devery 12:14 PM Wed 16 July, 2008
ST KILDA assistant coach Anthony Rock says the club will continue to focus on the basics as it attempts to upset third-placed Hawthorn at Telstra Dome on Saturday night.
Speaking to saints.com.au Rock noted that the team's effort over the past three games - each of which has ended in a Saints victory - had improved, and the coaching staff would be concentrating on replicating that against the in-form Hawks.
"Over the last three or so weeks, we've really got an effort", said Rock. "Our ball use has been a lot better, and the way we've ran and carried the ball and shared it around.
"Our tackling efforts have been really good as well - really all the basics you hear time and time again: you tackle well, you win the ball and really focus on the contested ball."
Rock also highlighted the selection pressure being exerted by several players in the VFL who were pressing for inclusion against Hawthorn.
"We're in a really good spot at the moment. Michael Gardiner returned from injury and was pretty solid in the ruck. I'm sure he will be in contention this week, along with Aaron Fiora who has been pushing his name back up. His performances have been pretty good over the last three or four weeks.
"Jarryn Geary had 40 possessions in the VFL and that's pleasing from a coaching perspective because he's a young, developing player."
Leigh Fisher and Shane Birss were other players Rock said had been consistently good and were close to senior selection.
As for the challenge presented by Hawthorn on the weekend, Rock said several Saints were capable of curbing the influence of the Hawk big guns, including Luke Hodge, Sam Mitchell and Lance 'Buddy' Franklin.
"We've done reasonably well in the past particularly on Hodge," he said.
"Sean Dempster really did a good job last week on (Nick) Stevens; Andrew McQualter was good on (Marc) Murphy.
"I'm not too sure [who will pick up Hodge or Mitchell] but ... they're dangerous players and I'm sure they'll be a focus in our preparation.”
Rock said creating pressure in the midfield and in the forward 50 was vital if the Saints were to limit the scoring chances of Franklin, a player he described as "pretty hard to stop".

So should we blame Anthony Rock for the bizzare selections. After being ho-hum for weeks, Fiora plays a half decent game ( but still not as good as Geary or Birss ) and gets selected. Will our team get critisized for being too soft after this weekend? Ironically we ended up with Fiora at the Saints because we didn't want to give Troy Simmonds a 5 year contract, Fiora is currently under contract for his 5th year. ( We must be the AFL equivalent of the public service ).

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

Man we got fked over in that trade.

[Squizzy1970]

Well if you guys can work out what's going on with our emergencies you're better informed than me:

Round 15 v Carl :
EMG: Charlie Gardiner, Aaron Fiora, Adam Schneider

Round 14 v North :
EMG: Jarryn Geary, Aaron Fiora, Ben McEvoy

Round 13 v Freo :
EMG: Nick Dal Santo, Shane Birss, Brad Howard

Round 12 v Sydney :
EMG: Shane Birss, Andrew McQualter, Aaron Fiora

Round 11 v WB :
EMG: Leigh Fisher, James Gwilt, Aaron Fiora