Colbert

[Cup_Half_Full]

Where should Colbert play?
Key position is not his thing.
I think he should play half-back-flank or midfield.

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Cup_Half_Full

[Carey_is_King]

CHF,
Why do you think key position is not his thing ?
I think he has the pace to play midfield, and that may be where he ends up, but I don't think we have seen all he has to offer yet.

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Trample the Weak,
Hurdle the Dead.



[This message has been edited by Carey_is_King (edited 24 December 2000).]

[warrior]

If he is free of injury he should play chb.
He is 192 cm tall.
He was playing on Carey in the 1994 prelim final but did not have the strength to hold the King.He was only 21 then.
I am certain chb is the position we had earmarked for him when recruited!!

warrior

[Darky]

Get him to go sick at the gym and build up to 98-102 kilos, and get the strength to play CHB and handle guys like Whitnall, Holland, Schwarz. He could make a star of himself rather than being what he was at Geelong - arguably the league's most versatile player, but essentially a player without a position.

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Other bands play, Manowar KILL !!!!!!!!!

[Shinboners]

We already have a centre half back in the form of Jason McCartney. In regards to Colbert, I like to see him on the wing or on the flanks. I remember one game that he played for Geelong vs Adelaide and he was in the centre, going for the ball whilst surrounded by Crows players. He picked up the ball with one hand, spun around a few Crows, dodged two more and then sent a pass forward into the chest of a Cat forward. If he bulks up, he'll lose that sort of pace and skill, and I reckon a tall, running player is invaluable to us.

[warrior]

Pagan admitted on Footy Feedback that our Defence has been,and is,the weakest part of the team.

We have not introduced another player into the team that would correct that.

While Jason McCarthy has turned out to be a good honest player he is not the answer at chb.He is shorter than Colbert.

We have drafted running type players recently.

Colbert at 25 years of age (turning 26 in 2001) will have gained the necessary body strength to handle most chf`s while having an edge in pace!

A back line with McCartney at chb and Martyn at fb is simply not good enough in todays football!!!


warrior

[Aussie_Roo]

I think Pagan will use him as a spare parts player. Really don't mind where he plays as long as he has a bumper season..

[andrewsharrock]

Hopefully he will have a good pre-season and then play on the ball. Should provide alot of poise and experience in what will be one of the youngest mid fields in the comp.

May also spend a bit of time as a leading forward ala C Sholl.

[Shinboners]

Originally posted by warrior:
While Jason McCarthy has turned out to be a good honest player he is not the answer at chb.He is shorter than Colbert.


I think you're under-estimating McCartney there. He'll never be an attacking CHB like Jakovich or Wellman, but he does his job quietly and effectively. He doesn't get pushed out of the marking contest that easily, he nearly always makes the right choice between going for the mark and going for the punch, and I don't recall any match where the CHF has truly thrashed him. In that final vs Essendon, all our defenders were well beaten except for McCartney. The only game I remember where McCartney was well beaten was in that final vs Hawthorn when Holland cut loose, but even then, Holland had to play further up the ground to get away from McCartney (who did the right thing by zoning off back into defence to plug any holes).

I do remember that Barry Stoneham once said that Colbert would make a great centre-half-back, but I reckon his height and pace will be of better value to us on the wings and flanks.

[Carey_is_King]

I have to agree with Warrior here. Martyn & McCartney in the two key backline roles leaves us exposed. Colbert is a class player, and would be excellent at CHB.

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Trample the Weak,
Hurdle the Dead.

[Rooboy 96]

Originally posted by warrior:
While Jason McCarthy has turned out to be a good honest player he is not the answer at chb.He is shorter than Colbert.

Have to agree with Shinners here... Jason was one of our best performers last year... very couragous and dependable all season...

I would play Colbert off a wing... floating between half back and half forward... or as a replacement for Craig Sholl...

[Carey_is_King]

Couldn't argue with that either. I guess it means that Colbert could play in any number of positions, so where do we play him ? That brings us back to the original post doesn't it ?


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Trample the Weak,
Hurdle the Dead.

[Shinboners]

Well, with everyone having different ideas, each of which is quite plausible, it'll be interesting to see what option Pagan and the match committee takes. During 2000, we did see Colbert play a variety of roles, so the question is, does he become a jack of all trades or a specialist in one?

[warrior]

Do you realise that the list only has 11 players over 187cm tall? That is John Blakey size.
4 Ruckmen (McKernan,Burton,L.Smith,Petrie)

2 key position forwards(Rocca,Carey)

2 key position backs(McCartney,Martyn)

3 others(Colbert,Watt,Cochrane)

That means there are 27 players on the list,187 cm tall or less ,loosely called midfielders,flankers,onballers etc.

Rocca is a cast off and untried at the Roos.
Martyn turns 34 in 2001 and is starting to struggle.

I think it is a matter of necessity Colbert play in a key position!!!!

warrior

[Kaz]

Interesting point about the lack of height.....could this be the push towards a more running style of game for the Roos?
If this is so, I'd like to see Colby used in the centre or on the wing.
With regard to the defence, shouldn't we be grooming someone (ie. Shannon Watt) to be fullback.
And stop picking on McCartney, he basically held together that end of the team all last season. With a fit Archer, and the ever reliable Blakey we should do alright down back in 2001.
What I really want to see is Pickett in the centre.....now that would make things interesting!

[Cup_Half_Full]

Colbert, Pace?...not!
Colbert, Bulk up at the gym? With a mature 25yr old body...not!
Colbert, CHB?...being 192cm tall doesn't make him key position player, eg Mark Roberts. Having said that CHB is within the capabilities of Leigh, but he is better suited elsewhere.
Martyn, McCartney, backline exposed?...not!
Don't take any notice of the scores kicked against this backline. It has been the foundation of the teams success.
The roos long kicking game is like an up tempo basketball game. The team has more chances to score, but so does the opposition.
The long kick to CHF leaves the roos vulnerable to the opposition rebounding off half-back.
i.e.
The roos forward line efficiency and defensive pressure is critical to both offence and defence.

b. Blakey, Martyn, Archer
hb. Pickett, McCartney, Colbert

It seems like a solid back 6 to me. Try selecting 6 consistent forwards?

Put Fletcher, Wellman, Wallis in instead of Martyn, McCartney, Archer and the roos would have been humiliated every week. Its easy playing down back when your midfield / forwardline dominates.

Just my opinion!

CHF



[This message has been edited by Cup_Half_Full (edited 30 December 2000).]

[Carey_is_King]

CHF,
Do you really think Colbert has no pace ? You might find he is among the quickest players at the club.

As for Mick & Mack in the backline, well I will wait and see. For my money, Mick is getting too old and too slow, and before this year, I would have ranked Mack as one of the worst backmen in the competition. He seems to have worked out what he can do and what he can't, and now plays within his capabilities, taking the safe option most of the time. There is no doubt he was one of our best this year - let's hope it continues.
I hear what you say about the way our backline plays, and it sounds good in theory, but a team really does take fate into its hands when it concedes over 100 points most weeks. Against a free scoring team like Essendon, it was our undoing, and they will flog us again this year unless we take a different approach.
Perhaps this style of play came about because our midfield was pretty ordinary, but maybe now is the time to let some of the new guys do their thing in the midfield, and tighten up in the backline; Archer & Pickett particularly.


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Trample the Weak,
Hurdle the Dead.

[Cup_Half_Full]

CIK,
Yes, I really do think Colbert has no pace.
I'm going by what I saw in 2000, so maybe he is still recovering from his knee op.
I wonder what other forum readers think?

As for Martyn, I agree he is getting old.
But his form when fit is still good. The question is whether his body will stay fit for a whole season.

[The invisible mullet]

I think the Warrior makes a pretty good point abouut the state of our backline which is slow and getting long in the tooth - whether Colbert should play in a key position or play off a half back flank is an issue (would that leave Kingy playing out of the centre?) We appear to have a range of options on the ball but few in defence.

Hopefully Shannon Watt gets a go in the Ansett Cup - he is the sort of player that North needs to take a big step up next year and should be in a better position to take his opportunities.

[Cup_Half_Full]

Originally posted by warrior:
Do you realise that the list only has 11 players over 187cm tall? That is John Blakey size.
4 Ruckmen (McKernan,Burton,L.Smith,Petrie)

2 key position forwards(Rocca,Carey)

2 key position backs(McCartney,Martyn)

3 others(Colbert,Watt,Cochrane)



That is why Rocca was such an excellent choice. The 'talls' would have looked very thin if Rocca wasn't in the line-up.

It is also easy to see why they got rid of Capuano.
McKernan- his best spot is ruck.(CIK, no comments please.)
Burton- could be a big influence with a more dominant midfield that covers for his lack of mobilty (as per Harry Madden and the Blues).
Smith- was close to playing before his injury.
Petrie- another possibility.

Mix in a heap of new midfield options and I think the recruting staff has laid the foundation for an improved line-up in 2001.

Cause for great optimism.

Roos premiers 2001!

[Shinboners]

CHF

Yep, I'm definitely more optimistic now than what I was back in August. A couple of points:

Capuano or Burton. Either one, but not both. Both are limited by their lack of mobility around the ground, so while it was sad to see Capuano go, we won't have the tactical limitations that come with having two slow talls in the one team. However, one thing about Burton....will he please play a full 4 quarters, not just the first half? Oh, this reminds me, thank you to the salary cap Gods that made sure that we didn't pick up Ryan O'Conner.

Smith and Petrie. While we don't want to see our players injured, perhaps if one of our ruckmen did miss a game, for whatever reason, it would give a window of opportunity to one of these young ruckmen. McDonald did well at the Lions while Keating was injured, same with Nicolson at Melbourne whehn White was out. Allan became the competition's best ruckman when Madden finally hung up the boots. Not that any of this is guaranteed, but sometimes all a young ruckman needs is just a chance with the senior team.

Rocca. This will only work as long as the ball can be delivered onto his chest while he's on the lead. Unlike Carey, he cannot take the contested or pack mark. So, hello Sinclair and McLaren, goodbye to Clayton and Cochrane, and if you don't get your act together (or get that Blakey-esque tagging role), Simpson too.

[Carey_is_King]

Originally posted by Cup_Half_Full:
..........McKernan- his best spot is ruck.(CIK, no comments please.)....


MMMMmmmmmmm (The gag is starting to slip)



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Trample the Weak,
Hurdle the Dead.

[Carey_is_King]

Originally posted by Cup_Half_Full:
CIK,
Yes, I really do think Colbert has no pace.
I'm going by what I saw in 2000, so maybe he is still recovering from his knee op.
I wonder what other forum readers think?



I spoke to a couple of Geelong supporters at work and their quote was "he runs like the wind". I think it was the knee reco and subsequent hamstring problems which prevented him from showing us how quick he really is.


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Trample the Weak,
Hurdle the Dead.

[Aussie_Roo]

I too, know many Geelong supporters, and they have said similiar things about Colbert's speed and ability (after slagging him for 12 months of course).

[The invisible mullet]

If Colbert has no pace why has he regularly competed in professional sprints (other than to keep Tamsyn company)? Maybe he gets a good handicap.

[Cup_Half_Full]

Invisible mullet,
Running fast on a sprint track over 100/200m is completely different to having pace on a football field. Pace over the first 5,10 and sometimes 20m is what counts.
But as eveyone else seems to think Colbert is quick I will have to concede...for now.

[kymhodgemansmo]

CIK

If he is as god as everyone claims he is, play him in the centre.

His match against WCE in which he touched the ball only a handful of times, but what he did with some handballs proved the vision is there.

He can deliver as well, and if he is as good as you say he is, why not stick with the concept of playing him in the pivot.

Forget about the holes in the defence, in coming years we need our best talent in the midfield - eg Essendon with Hird, Carlton with Kouta, so if that is the case throw him in there and be done with it.

Regards to Full Back, I reckon the bid Mac could play there and in fact would be better suited there than CHB.

He will prove an able replacement for Martyn as I believe they are similar players, but there is a hole at CHB.

But do you patch up holes or do we go out there to win.

Give him a crack in the pivot and I have to say:

DONT USE HIM AS A STOP GAP PLAYER.

Do that and he is shot because he won't get a chance to settle.

All players need to establish themselves at a new club and he has not been given an opportunity.

Play him somewhere and leave him there for the first half of the season at least.