View Full Version : The "White should be dropped" thread.
Santana
19 Oct 2008, 16:14
For the love of god.
ManWithNoName
19 Oct 2008, 16:16
Wrist spinner in his second Test and was the leading wicket taker in the first innings this Test IN INDIA.
'Nuff said.
Bennycoff
19 Oct 2008, 16:16
agreed.
not a test standard player sorry.
Wrist spinner in his second Test and was the leading wicket taker in the first innings this Test IN INDIA.
'Nuff said.
lol and do you think that the Indians are afraid of him?. Didn't you see what Dhoni did to him?. Imagine what Shewag, Tendulkar etc would do to him.
Should never have got a cap in the first place
Santana
19 Oct 2008, 16:24
Wrist spinner in his second Test and was the leading wicket taker in the first innings this Test IN INDIA.
'Nuff said.
Please dude, he is clearly not good enough for tests. Just get him back home and playing for the Rangers again.
ManWithNoName how do you compare White with India's young leggie? I mean do you think White is better than Mishra who is in his debut test match?
Bombers_Forever
19 Oct 2008, 16:32
Shouldn't have been picked - the fact Ponting thought White was good in his debut says he has the support and won't get dropped.
ManWithNoName
19 Oct 2008, 16:40
lol and do you think that the Indians are afraid of him?. Didn't you see what Dhoni did to him?. Imagine what Shewag, Tendulkar etc would do to him.
I didn't see people questioning Warneys spot when we went to India. He was always distinctly average there. White's bowling moderately well in a country where Warne struggled and he should be dropped? What crap.
Gunnar Longshanks
19 Oct 2008, 17:48
Wrist spinner in his second Test and was the leading wicket taker in the first innings this Test IN INDIA.
'Nuff said.White took two wickets.
Johnson and Siddle took three apiece.
Terrible bastmen, and an average bowler.
Not sure why we are wasting time on a player who will never be any good.
ManWithNoName
19 Oct 2008, 17:51
White took two wickets.
Johnson and Siddle took three apiece.
My bad. Misread Cricinfos bowling figures.
ahhhhhh
19 Oct 2008, 17:52
Yea lets bring in Krejza and he can go for 0/199 again, White is clearly the best option we have at the moment and he is not doing a bad job.
He isn't troubling the batsmen too much, but he is quite economical and is taking a few wickets.
NFI op.
Terrible bastmen, and an average bowler.
Not sure why we are wasting time on a player who will never be any good.
Every other player under some pressure get chance after chance after chance when they've been playing poorly (Ponting, Clarke etc). I suspect White will get a few more chances before the writing is on the wall.
King Elvis
19 Oct 2008, 18:05
I'm inclined to agree with dropping him.
He's not a Test Class bowler, but we accept that based on the strength of his batting.
His batting has been shit, so he shouldn't be there.
Put D Hussey in the side, bowl him, Clarke & Katich, and just try and draw the series.
Bennycoff
19 Oct 2008, 18:13
Why hasn't Katich had a bowl yet?
Why hasn't Katich had a bowl yet?
B/c Ponting can be tactically deficient at times.
Bennycoff
19 Oct 2008, 18:16
Sure he can go for runs but so does Clarke and White. Katich actually has some good deliverys, just needs the chance. Ponting is ignornant perhaps?
Ricketts
19 Oct 2008, 18:18
Not even i would give Katich a bowl, and i'm his biggest fan.
Playing an extra batsman and dropping White wouldn't be a bad idea, with Clarke being our "spin" bowler.
There is no spin bowler in the land worthy of playing test cricket, so selecting one is like playing with 10 men
OzBomber
19 Oct 2008, 18:20
He's a far better choice than Krejza. Imagine if we played Krejza? We'd all have cut our heads off and been running around like headless chickens for ages by now.
Bennycoff
19 Oct 2008, 18:20
Should play four quicks.
davey_magik
19 Oct 2008, 18:22
Four quicks won't happen.
I doubt they'll drop White. I think he could be a decent Test player and I think he's exceeded everyone's expectations with his bowling. His economy rate has been decent so far.
ManWithNoName
19 Oct 2008, 18:23
In this series White's only taken one wicket less than Brett Lee.
OzBomber
19 Oct 2008, 18:24
White would be far more dangerous if he could atleast spin the ball either way.
Funny thing is the Australian "spinners" took more wickets and conceded less run that India's in the first test.
White should be told you will be picked for all test this series so at least that monkey is off his back and told to go for broke in each match.
Bennycoff
19 Oct 2008, 18:37
Ponting bowls him far too late anyway so the match has drifted and Clarke even bowls before him.
Deadly Outbreak
19 Oct 2008, 18:42
He is not the only player not batting well. If he has to come in when Australia are 6 for 146 and then be expected to be great when everyone else is falling around him.
He did well in his second innings in the first test.
He should have also had Ganguly early saving 70 or so runs and possible making it a different game.
The 747
19 Oct 2008, 19:00
Dropped for who?
He has not made runs yes, a few others with far more experience have not made any runs either. Bowling has exceeded expectations which to be fair were very low.
Would like to see him bowled earlier and tell him to try and get some wickets. At the moment he only bowls when the sting is out of the game. But so far we have seen he is not getting murdered so we should see if he can be an attacking option.
Think we know the answer to that but the way this series is going we might as well try.
Bennycoff
19 Oct 2008, 19:03
Exactly. We need to use him as an attacking option.
How he goes in the second innings will give a big indication of his test future. Warne needs to be contracted to be his full time spin coach. Fact his White can bat and bat well, lets not forget last summer Hogg was the number one spinner in the test team.
Warne needs to be contracted to be his full time spin coach.
Won't do him any good, as they're different styles of bowlers. White had Terry Jenner as his coach at one point (to fix his leg break to turn more), which (in White's opinion) stuffed him up and made him lose confidence in his bowling.
Won't do him any good, as they're different styles of bowlers. White had Terry Jenner as his coach at one point (to fix his leg break to turn more), which (in White's opinion) stuffed him up and made him lose confidence in his bowling.
Good point, however still think Warne knows enough about spin to work on White learning some more tricks rather than try to change his stock bowling.
Good point, however still think Warne knows enough about spin to work on White learning some more tricks rather than try to change his stock bowling.
Very true, but in the end it all comes back to the same conclusion: White doesn't bowl enough!
Very true, but in the end it all comes back to the same conclusion: White doesn't bowl enough!
And there lies the answer, if White is not comfortable bowling himself too much at Domestic level he should in between games go back to grade level and bowl thirty plus overs.
Bennycoff
19 Oct 2008, 20:03
Did the captaincy hurt him then, in terms of his spin bowling career?
I think it has been noted in cricket circles that White became very unsure of putting himslef on for big spells and most recently for any bowling at all.
Did the captaincy hurt him then, in terms of his spin bowling career?
Definitely, imho.
Bennycoff
19 Oct 2008, 20:46
Perhaps not the best decision making him captain then? Or is that too harsh?
ManWithNoName
19 Oct 2008, 21:07
Perhaps not the best decision making him captain then? Or is that too harsh?
Hookesy made him skipper. I get the feeling if Hookesy was still coach he'd be in his ear getting him to bowl himself more. As it is Whitey's a humble bloke and would probably feel a bit egotistical bowling himself too much.
Oh well then better send Hayden and Clarke home on the plane with him then.
:rolleyes:
He isn't the only one not batting well, don't throw the whole lot of the blame to him.
Yeah confidence is for losers :thumbsu:
XFactor1979
20 Oct 2008, 09:47
if ever there was a passenger in the team at the moment, it is cameron white
bats at 8
last resort bowler
why bother?
stuart clark in for him for the next test match
also brad haddin looks a very pale imitation of adam gilchrist. hes in the side for his "batting" (not his keeping) ... averages 20 less than gilchrist
Gunnar Longshanks
20 Oct 2008, 09:55
also brad haddin looks a very pale imitation of adam gilchrist. hes in the side for his "batting" (not his keeping) ... averages 20 less than gilchristAfter the 2005 Ashes, Gilly averaged about 30.
Haddin should be able to do better than that.
Funkalicous
20 Oct 2008, 10:39
Wouldn't make a pinch of difference who we played ahead of him. Fact is we don't have a spinner anywhere near good enough to face the Indians. At least White can offer something else. Although maybe we should've considered Tait. - Why the **** not? :o
The funny thing White is most likely going to bowl more overs this series than he did for the whole 07/08 summer. I doubt they would drop him now, would be stupid to as he has actually exceeded expectations with the ball.
In regards to his batting, he has failed twice. Give the kid a break, way too early to drop him.
Can someone please tell me what is going to happen when White bowls today?. I guess he will get a few wickets because Ricky will have the boundary rider's out.
dr nick
20 Oct 2008, 10:46
pretty obvious that india will be out for quick runs and white will chip in with a few easy wickets in between getting pillaged to all corners of the ground. Thats if ricky bowls him for a lot of overs.
But if he does get wickets does that mean we have found our long term spinner?. I guess against crappy teams who can't play spin he would be a gun.
Funkalicous
20 Oct 2008, 10:53
Can someone please tell me what is going to happen when White bowls today?. I guess he will get a few wickets because Ricky will have the boundary rider's out.
God yes!
The Aussies will be setting a 20/20 field today. Everyone will be moved to the boundaries and our spinners will be asked to flight the buggery out of the ball. If we keep them to 4 an over or less it'll be a smashing success.
MC_Bomba
20 Oct 2008, 12:02
Why is he in the test team i dont know.
Average batsman.
Not a test spinner.
Watsons the all rounder.
This team is a joke at the moment.
Who ever wants white dropped is on drugs. Shutup loosers
Funkalicous
20 Oct 2008, 13:00
Who ever wants white dropped is on drugs. Shutup loosers
Mrs White?
Would of been good to see him make some more runs. His bowling has not been that bad but hasn't look dangerous enough, he had Ganguly out (around 50 at the time) in the first innings and Rudi did not evern refer it.
He isn't our best spinner as he IMO is behind McGain, Casson, Cullen, Hauritz in that order. But has been chosen infront of these guys minaly due to his batting, and partly due to: being a leg spinner and a good fieldsman.
He has hardly being disgraced with his bowling efforts and the blame should be pointed fair and squarely on Cricket Australia for failing to produce quality spinners.
The Boy From Brasil
20 Oct 2008, 15:43
He has hardly being disgraced with his bowling efforts and the blame should be pointed fair and squarely on Cricket Australia for failing to produce quality spinners.
Thats the issue. Its not White's fault. He is trying his best. He will never be a star spin bowler, but we don't have a heap of alternatives. There is no spinner out there putting their hand up to be picked. The fact that the main two guys, are one in his mid 30's and one who is chosen mainly for his lower order batting says more about Australia's spin development policy than it does about White.
It could be said that the ACB sat on its backside when looking for young spinners while it revelled in the performances of Warne.
Cooldude
20 Oct 2008, 15:45
He adds nothing to the side
Better off playing four genuine quicks than a so called allrounder who's not good enough to warrant a spot at either discipline
ManWithNoName
20 Oct 2008, 15:59
On debut in a notoriously hard country for spinners:
B Lee: 67 overs, 3 @ 66
C White: 55 overs, 4 @ 47
Yeah, let's drop him. :rolleyes:
Ricketts
20 Oct 2008, 16:24
Yeah but it's usually a case of the batsman getting themself out to him
White wont be dropped he just got a wicket of the centurion lol. So that now means he has both centurions from the the 2 innings, no way will he be dropped. Australia here is your future spinner hahahah
Adelaide Hawk
20 Oct 2008, 16:45
White wont be dropped he just got a wicket of the centurion lol. So that now means he has both centurions from the the 2 innings, no way will he be dropped. Australia here is your future spinner hahahah
I think you need to turn the ball in order to be called a spinner.
But he has got the two centurions out, that must count for something surely?
Cooldude
20 Oct 2008, 16:48
No it doesn't, coz you kinda wanna get them out before they got a century
dr nick
20 Oct 2008, 17:34
That is the worst ball i have ever seen by a test standard bowler.
Cooldude
20 Oct 2008, 17:35
That is the worst ball i have ever seen by a test standard bowler.
Stephen Harmison
Although Cam White just did a Harmi, it wasn't the first ball of an Ashes Test or anything
dr nick
20 Oct 2008, 17:35
his confidence is absolutely shot.
He'd stand out in a 5th grade side and quickly be pulled out of the attack.
ManWithNoName
20 Oct 2008, 17:39
his confidence is absolutely shot.
He'd stand out in a 5th grade side and quickly be pulled out of the attack.
Because Ponting shows absolutely no confidence in him.
Give the f-ing kid a shot. Jesus christ some of you wouldn't be happy if he took 10 wickets in each Test Match. He's a young spinner on debut in India. WTF were you expecting to happen?
Cooldude
20 Oct 2008, 17:42
Correction: He's technically not a spinner, he really isn't
He's an allrounder who cannot contribute with the bat so far, and being asked to do a holding role with the ball that many other bowlers can do a far better job at. Australia's better off playing a front line bowler, even if it's a quick, to strengthen the depleted bowling attack so far. There's no point playing a spinner for the sake of playing one if they aren't good enough, and White isn't even a real spinner
dr nick
20 Oct 2008, 17:43
id say that was his last over in test cricket.
ManWithNoName
20 Oct 2008, 17:44
id say that was his last over in test cricket.
You would've dropped Shane Warne after his debut and stamped him as "Never Play Again".
ahhhhhh
20 Oct 2008, 17:46
You would've dropped Shane Warne after his debut and stamped him as "Never Play Again".
Mate I like your relentless defence of White, none of these other idiots have any idea.
Cooldude
20 Oct 2008, 17:46
You would've dropped Shane Warne after his debut and stamped him as "Never Play Again".
Totally different scenarios. Warnie always showed promise even in that first Test where he got hammered, he threw it up, tried different things and gave it a good rip (And it did turn loads for him), and he was just a rookie being outclassed by two fantastic players of spin
White just looks completely out of his depth
dr nick
20 Oct 2008, 17:47
Shane Warne could turn the ball. He was landing them but shastri was using his feet beautifully. This bloke promises nothing and cant land it on the pitch.
ManWithNoName
20 Oct 2008, 17:48
Totally different scenarios. Warnie always showed promise even in that first Test where he got hammered, he threw it up, tried different things and gave it a good rip (And it did turn loads for him), and he was just a rookie being outclassed by two fantastic players of spin
White just looks completely out of his depth
So a debutant all round spinner should look completely comfortable bowling in India?
Cooldude
20 Oct 2008, 17:51
So a debutant all round spinner should look completely comfortable bowling in India?
When have I mentioned anything about comfortable? I mentioned about being "out of his depth". The bloke has shown no real skills with the art of leg spin that suggests he would ever do anything at the top level as a "spinner". He has one of the worst wrist spinners' action you'd ever see. It's completely front on, his alignment's totally screwed and he can do nothing but push the ball out the front of his hand which is why he never ever turns it bar maybe drifting it back in a little
Mishra showed skill, regardless of his 5fer or not, he showed that he could throw them up, he has control over his flight, he can turn it, he has a good wrong'un and can vary his angles. White has shown nothing at all
That is what I call out of his depth.
Don't use the Warne in India or Warne on debut thing again. Warnie always showed promise, even when he got hammered. White has shown nothing
We need White who else have we got, at least he has experience now.
walkers a legend
20 Oct 2008, 20:03
I would like to see one of Hilfenhaus, McGoffin or Geeves getting a game but thats just my opinion.
Cameron White couldnt spin the ball if he put it in a washing machine... ;)
You don't need to spin the ball, look at the great Kumble.
Cooldude
20 Oct 2008, 20:15
You don't need to spin the ball, look at the great Kumble.
Different bowlers, Kumble is one of the best accurate leggies to have played the game, had a great flipper, a great straight one and a fantastic wrong'un. Gave away nothing in his prime and worked out batsman either with variation with bounce or in deliveries
White isn't accurate enough, has a wrong'un but it isn't reliable or threatening enough. Doesn't have a great flipper, so what does he have? Well he does bowl the straight one and the one that goes straight on, that's about it
White has bowled very well in both test matches apart from 2 overs. You can't drop a player for 2 bad overs.
Cam White is having a good series
Different bowlers, Kumble is one of the best accurate leggies to have played the game, had a great flipper, a great straight one and a fantastic wrong'un. Gave away nothing in his prime and worked out batsman either with variation with bounce or in deliveries
White isn't accurate enough, has a wrong'un but it isn't reliable or threatening enough. Doesn't have a great flipper, so what does he have? Well he does bowl the straight one and the one that goes straight on, that's about it
Yes but don't you think he can learn? Man Kumble had to learn, he talked to so many people and learnt from them. Why can't White do that? We have better facilities here in Australia. **** look at India they have 3 or 4 young spinners who are pretty good ready to replace Kumble. Why wasn't Australia preparing for the day that Warne retired.
Cooldude
20 Oct 2008, 20:21
He can learn in domestic cricket, and he's had the opportunity to learn from the likes of Terry Jenner and Shane Warne. If even TJ tried to fix him and couldn't, there's nothing else that can really be done
White's bowling is as it is at the moment, he has a horrible action and unless he fixes it, nothing will change. I don't see anything in his bowling for thep ast 5 years that has warranted him being persisted with.
crowsarethebest
20 Oct 2008, 20:23
Yes but don't you think he can learn? Man Kumble had to learn, he talked to so many people and learnt from them. Why can't White do that? We have better facilities here in Australia. **** look at India they have 3 or 4 young spinners who are pretty good ready to replace Kumble. Why wasn't Australia preparing for the day that Warne retired.
Cause you've got to have the talent in the first place. We're 21 million- India is 1.1 Billion.
Cause you've got to have the talent in the first place. We're 21 million- India is 1.1 Billion.
Yes but I doubt India has the same facilities as us do they? White burst onto the scene people were saying future captain etc and saying he was going to be the next big thing. He couldn't have slipped so badly geez.
aussie1st
20 Oct 2008, 20:36
The sooner White is gone the better. Yes hes bowled above expectations but lets be honnest he isn't a bowler and thats the position hes playing in. Bring in a 4th paceman that clearly is the best option.
i can spin the ball more than cameron white.
i do think he has some potential...im not sure he belongs in the aussie team at the moment though.
i'd rather he would have a great first class season with the ball then come back to us. with mcgain out for the season then im sure he'd get a fair go with vic.
I know people have harped on this but the major concern is the lack of quality spinners at state level, theres no signs of youg quality spinners pushing for state selection or showig signs at state level. I live in Victoria and comment only them.
Vic -John Holland has played 2 games for Vic 1 4day game and 1 ODD game and has looked ok.
NSW - seem to have a host of fring spinners but none our taking their chance. Hauritz, Casson, O'Keefe?
QLD - have a lot of all rounders who bowl some mediums and rely on Symonds and Simpson as off spinners.
SA- Had two young guys ready to go 3 years ago, probably suffered with the poor standard of SA cricket over the last 2 years. Team balance was affected by poor performances. Cullen and Bailey. Cullen i think could be the one to come on he had a pretty good ODD season last year.
WA - produce few spinners in traditional pacey wicket, Heal has been a pretty solid contributor in ODD for of the game doesn't seem to push for 4 day cricket selection and WA seem to get by on North's offies.
Tas - Have Doherty who conrtibutes alot in One dayers i dnt he pays to many 4 day games keeps a tight line but will hardly run thru line ups.
I think the real worry is a lakc of over the wrist spinners we have a lot of offies or left arm othrodox.
aussie1st
21 Oct 2008, 08:59
http://www.smh.com.au/news/sport/cricket/smith-can-give-australia-leggie-to-stand-on-but-not-before-2012jenner/2008/10/20/1224351155945.html
Thats an article on Steven Smith, quite the praise from both the spin legend and his mentor. He'll take a while according to them though so hopefully NSW develop him as a spinner.
Cooldude
21 Oct 2008, 11:50
Is he the one who played a few One Dayers for NSW and got a bowl?
If so, I didn't remember being overly wowed by his leggies, they were useful. He had a reasonable action but a few flaws here and there, although if some coaching from TJ and Warne's in order, then he can always improve
dr nick
21 Oct 2008, 14:13
Absolutely hopeless.
Out for 1 in his last test.
TimeIsRunningOut
21 Oct 2008, 14:15
Just get rid of him please. Nothing against the guy but he is just no where near test standard.
Cousin Jed
21 Oct 2008, 14:18
Nothing like picking a guy who can't bowl to bat at 8 and he makes no runs
bombersno1
21 Oct 2008, 14:23
Has got to be the WORST 2 test person for Australia..what does he offer..he can't bat, he can't bowl and to make things worse he is a Victorian!
Belnakor
21 Oct 2008, 14:31
its a bit like when England picked Giles for his batting. Didn't work. Even Ponting wouldn't make that many runs batting at number 8.
Totally out of his depth.
bombersno1
21 Oct 2008, 14:35
Giles at least spun a ball or two..gosh this is sounding BAD for dud White!
TassieSaint
21 Oct 2008, 14:50
Well I think we've given him enough of a chance. I'm officially on the wagon, White: gtfo.
enough chances? His only played 2 tests and has done well with the bowl which is why his in the team for.
I say, play him all series.
TimeIsRunningOut
21 Oct 2008, 14:58
enough chances? His only played 2 tests and has done well with the bowl which is why his in the team for.
I say, play him all series.
He's in the team because of his imaginary batting ability otherwise they would have chosen any one of the other Z-grade spinners we have back home.
bombersno1
21 Oct 2008, 14:59
enough chances? His only played 2 tests and has done well with the bowl which is why his in the team for.
I say, play him all series.
He has been hopeless with the bat though, decent with the ball is being nice..
TassieSaint
21 Oct 2008, 15:05
He's in the team because of his imaginary batting ability otherwise they would have chosen any one of the other Z-grade spinners we have back home.
Exactly, any number of spinners back home could have done as well as White with the ball. He got a gig because he could supposedly bat, which he's failed to do.
Wrong, His in the side as a Spinner. Batsman don't bat at 8