The Problem with people and music is.. [Archive]

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 10:28

That some people will automatically hate something coz it is old!

That some people will automatically hate something coz of who it is by!

That some people will automatically hate something coz it is popular! And assume that the band is just selling out because a lot of people like them!

That some people will automatically hate something coz it is not popular! And think that because it's not in the top 50, they will think it is no good!

That some people will only listen to what they hear on the radio and only ever here the pop music when there is planty more wonderful and insteresting music out there!

Macca19

31 Oct 2002, 10:44

Originally posted by PrideofSA
That some ppl think that a DJ is a musician, when in actual fact they are not! I've seen some DJ's they play a CD and talk a bit and then do there crappy scratching (which is cool when done at the right time but not cool when it goes on for ages). A live band playing ****s all over a DJ or any nightclub playing recorded songs! Although a nightclub can be fun for a good night out!

Nightclub DJ's are not musicians. I could become a nightclub DJ if i wanted to, and i am not a musician.

However, if you think all DJ's never write their own music then you are just a moron.

The thing you dont get about this is that most of the big name 'DJs' in the world are DJs second. First of they write their own music, or are producers. They just happen to also DJ and are bloody good at it. DJing properly is quite difficult. It does take time to learn how to beat mix to a high standard.

The thing you dont understand about the big DJ's of the world (not the local nightclub type DJs) is that they are also Producers. They produce records, they do plenty of remixes - proper remixes and they write their own stuff. Paul van Dyk and BT are two huge DJ/Producers.

Big name DJ's like Sasha, Digweed, Paul van Dyk, Adam Freeland, Andy C, DJ Hype, LTJ Bukem, Roni Size - they all write their own stuff and have released cd's of their own stuff. And thats just off the top of my head.

As for live bands crapping over DJ's - thats your opinion.

A live band is usually more respected as they are putting in the hard work to playing live and learning/writing songs, instruments and everything else!

Maybe you should try and make an electronic song one day. Hell, ill even give you a copy of Fruityloops and see how you go. I'll put $1000 that after a month you still have no idea what youre doing.

Anyone can play a CD in big speakers, but can anyone actually appreciate a live band (a good one)?

You know what s**ts me about music and people these days. People like yourself who constantly bag other peoples tastes in music when youve got no clue at all.

hourn

31 Oct 2002, 10:45

THe problem with music starting about 1995/96. Dont know what happened but from then, and i think it started a few years before then, but i think at that point music really hit a downer. well for me anyway.

There is no longer any bands that give out nice good hard rock tunes which dont just sound like somone is strumming every string on the guitar.

There are rock bands out there but they just hit every string at once and it just sounds like a big fuzz. It just plain sucks.

Macca19

31 Oct 2002, 10:54

Oh and i forgot another one!

People that hate music just because its from a certain genre

Dogwatcher

31 Oct 2002, 11:03

It's funny that this thread started as a comment against the staid ways and ignorant of certain music listeners and the way certain people react to different music and then the poster showed their own ignorant staid way. Not quite sure what was being achieved.
No as for the comment about DJS. Dance/techno/ break beat etc is fast becoming the new classical music.
These guys are composers of the first order - they just use technology.
Take a listen to an Underworld cd and you will understand what I mean.
While lots of dance music is crap, capitalising on an underground movement by making it popular - if the thread starter stepped outside the confines of the Heaven or Planet nightclub and saw a real dj at work, he might have some real understanding.
I like all types of music - take a look at my personal hottest 100 and you'll see what I mean. It's only the uptight people trying to make an impression or assert their demands on the music world that makes comments such as those at the commencement of this thread.
Open your ears some and there's a whole world of music out there most of usx haven't even touched.

coxon

31 Oct 2002, 11:07

Originally posted by Macca19
Oh and i forgot another one!

People that hate music just because its from a certain genre

hahaha... !

:D :D :D

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 11:09

Originally posted by Macca19

Nightclub DJ's are not musicians. I could become a nightclub DJ if i wanted to, and i am not a musician.

However, if you think all DJ's never write their own music then you are just a moron.

The thing you dont get about this is that most of the big name 'DJs' in the world are DJs second. First of they write their own music, or are producers. They just happen to also DJ and are bloody good at it. DJing properly is quite difficult. It does take time to learn how to beat mix to a high standard.

The thing you dont understand about the big DJ's of the world (not the local nightclub type DJs) is that they are also Producers. They produce records, they do plenty of remixes - proper remixes and they write their own stuff. Paul van Dyk and BT are two huge DJ/Producers.

Big name DJ's like Sasha, Digweed, Paul van Dyk, Adam Freeland, Andy C, DJ Hype, LTJ Bukem, Roni Size - they all write their own stuff and have released cd's of their own stuff. And thats just off the top of my head.

As for live bands crapping over DJ's - thats your opinion.

[b]

Maybe you should try and make an electronic song one day. Hell, ill even give you a copy of Fruityloops and see how you go. I'll put $1000 that after a month you still have no idea what youre doing.

[b]

You know what s**ts me about music and people these days. People like yourself who constantly bag other peoples tastes in music when youve got no clue at all.

Yeah dude, I wasn't talking about those types of Dj's, I realise they write their own music and do a lot of producing!

Also with electronic music. It is very easy coz everything is done on a loop, creating a few bars of a new idea and adding to it....quite simple and fun to do as I have done it before, but Listen to it can be quite boring as it becomes very competitive!

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 11:11

Originally posted by Macca19
Oh and i forgot another one!

People that hate music just because its from a certain genre

Yeah I was gonna add that one in, but some genre's can be hard to listen to and some ppl just won't like it because of that genre which is fine.....some ppl can't listen to dance music for instance!

FIGJAM

31 Oct 2002, 11:14

PrideofSA, your post started off alright, with the general consensus that people should appreciate good music for what it is...to which I wholeheartedly agree!

~~then the ironic twist~~

You have demonstrated your complete ignorance to electronic music and completely dumped on a genre, because they do not get up on stage with guitars and drums to perform.

Between you and me PoSA, I can actually appreciate a good live band...it's impossible not to if they are good enough. Same goes for a quality electronic set...they too put plenty of grit and sweat behind their work!

You should edit yur post and stop it at: That some people will only listen to what they hear on the radio and only ever here the pop music when there is plenty more wonderful and insteresting music out there!

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 11:24

Originally posted by FIGJAM
PrideofSA, your post started off alright, with the general consensus that people should appreciate good music for what it is...to which I wholeheartedly agree!

~~then the ironic twist~~

You have demonstrated your complete ignorance to electronic music and completely dumped on a genre, because they do not get up on stage with guitars and drums to perform.

Between you and me PoSA, I can actually appreciate a good live band...it's impossible not to if they are good enough. Same goes for a quality electronic set...they too put plenty of grit and sweat behind their work!

You should edit yur post and stop it at:

Done and Done!

fair enough point expect that those Dj's that play Cd;s and talk a little is what i was actually talking about! And Dj's that just scratch and scratch till the cows come home!

Good electronic music is good unless it is repetitve dance beats!

hourn

31 Oct 2002, 11:29

I just dont like dance or electronic music fullstop

call me what you will i dont care, i go to clubs occasinally, not often, but sometimes, and here the music there and i'll dance to it because i'd look like a bit of fag if i didn't, but i dont enjoy the music at all.

I'm very happy to stick with my genre of old school rock and a bit of the modern stuff.

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 11:33

Originally posted by hourn
I just dont like dance or electronic music fullstop

call me what you will i dont care, i go to clubs occasinally, not often, but sometimes, and here the music there and i'll dance to it because i'd look like a bit of fag if i didn't, but i dont enjoy the music at all.

I'm very happy to stick with my genre of old school rock and a bit of the modern stuff.

Yeah the problem wih me is that if I don't dance I look like a tool and If I do dance I look like a tool......catch 22!

So I usually hang around near the bar and always have a drink in my hand!

Macca19

31 Oct 2002, 11:38

Originally posted by PrideofSA

fair enough point expect that those Dj's that play Cd;s and talk a little is what i was actually talking about! And Dj's that just scratch and scratch till the cows come home!

So in other words you have a problem with nightclub DJ's??

Good electronic music is good unless it is repetitve dance beats!

Good electronic music is good hehe. Its the same with any genre mate. Good metal is good. Good rock is good. Thats why it is...good!!!

Repetitive. Most dance music is repetitive - thats the whole point of it so you can dance to it for extended periods of time. A good DJ will beatmix so well and choose his records so well that each song flows into each other perfectly so you cant tell when one song finishes and another song starts.

Macca19

31 Oct 2002, 11:40

Originally posted by PrideofSA

Yeah the problem wih me is that if I don't dance I look like a tool and If I do dance I look like a tool......catch 22!

plenty of people dont dance at clubs. Sit down and talk to your mates!

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 11:40

Originally posted by Macca19

So in other words you have a problem with nightclub DJ's??

[b]

Good electronic music is good hehe. Its the same with any genre mate. Good metal is good. Good rock is good. Thats why it is...good!!!

Repetitive. Most dance music is repetitive - thats the whole point of it so you can dance to it for extended periods of time. A good DJ will beatmix so well and choose his records so well that each song flows into each other perfectly so you cant tell when one song finishes and another song starts.

Yeah thats my point, I lsten to music for the musicality and lyrics etc etc, I dont' listen to music so I can dance and dance to the same beat nonstop!

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 11:42

Originally posted by Macca19

plenty of people dont dance at clubs. Sit down and talk to your mates!

Yeah that's why u watch bands play when u do that, so that while ur not dancing to dance music, u don't have to listen to it aswell!

The_Flying_Egg

31 Oct 2002, 11:49

Originally posted by PrideofSA

That some people will automatically hate something coz it is popular! And assume that the band is just selling out because a lot of people like them!

Spot on

Some people on here seem to think that you're only good if you don't sell records and if you're a rock band that do sell you're a sell out or too commercial

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 11:51

Originally posted by The_Flying_Egg

Spot on

Some people on here seem to think that you're only good if you don't sell records and if you're a rock band that do sell you're a sell out or too commercial

my point exactly!

Most of the most talented musicians are ppl I know personally and yet they aren't huge and popular or signed with a record contract!

Dogwatcher

31 Oct 2002, 12:54

Originally posted by PrideofSA

my point exactly!

Most of the most talented musicians are ppl I know personally and yet they are huge and popular or signed with a record contract!

Could you please explain this quote, I'm sorry but I don't quite understand it.

Macca19

31 Oct 2002, 12:59

Originally posted by Dogwatcher

Could you please explain this quote, I'm sorry but I don't quite understand it.

Nor do i!

gPhonque

31 Oct 2002, 13:06

PrideofSA,

You are not a musician.

In fact, you don't even know what music is.

cheers
gPhonque

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 13:07

Originally posted by Dogwatcher

Could you please explain this quote, I'm sorry but I don't quite understand it.

sorry I'll just change 1 letter and maybe u will understand it!

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 13:09

Originally posted by gPhonque
PrideofSA,

You are not a musician.

In fact, you don't even know what music is.

cheers
gPhonque

Yeah that's right, I'm not coz u say so!

Moron!

gPhonque

31 Oct 2002, 13:13

Originally posted by PrideofSA

Yeah that's right, I'm not coz u say so!

Moron!

A true musician would listen to all kinds of music, and would never ignore any style.

Dogwatcher

31 Oct 2002, 13:16

Originally posted by PrideofSA

sorry I'll just change 1 letter and maybe u will understand it!

Waiting.

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 13:30

Originally posted by Dogwatcher

Waiting.

It's changed, go back and read the inital post!

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 13:32

Originally posted by gPhonque

A true musician would listen to all kinds of music, and would never ignore any style.

oh no no no, quite far from the case!

Many classical musican can simply not listen to jazz and vice verser! There are always wars going on between genre's

I like all types of music, expect I don't really like dance/techno etc and full on death metal is a bit much too!

Apart from that most stuf I will like!

hourn

31 Oct 2002, 13:45

Originally posted by gPhonque

A true musician would listen to all kinds of music, and would never ignore any style.

if you mean by that, that are person to be classed as a musician must like all style's of music to be classed as a true musician, than that is absolute utter crap IMO.

if however, you mean that to be a true musician you have to listen to all music before deciding on your opinion of it, then i agree there.

Dogwatcher

31 Oct 2002, 13:45

Thanks Pride, now I understand what thou art trying to say. BTW you don't need to use exclamation marks so much, unless you really are as excited by your comments as the exclamation marks would suggest.

Also, Pride could you tell me what your favourite bands/musicians are please, for curiosity's sake.

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 13:54

Originally posted by Dogwatcher
Thanks Pride, now I understand what thou art trying to say. BTW you don't need to use exclamation marks so much, unless you really are as excited by your comments as the exclamation marks would suggest.

Also, Pride could you tell me what your favourite bands/musicians are please, for curiosity's sake.

Sure, I think the exclamation marks thing is just a force of habit!

See!

um my fav's are

Red Hot Chili Peppers, Incubus, Lenny Kravitz, Foo Fighters, Hoobastank, Green Day, Goo Goo Dolls, Ben Folds Five, Bink182, Beatles, Eagles, Living End, Motorace, Silverchair, Sum41, Unwritten Law,Oasis, Pearl Jam, Limp Biskit, The Cruel Sea, Good Charlotte and more!

Guitarists
Jimi Hendrix, Stevie Ray Vaughn, Eric Clapton, Jimy Page, John Frusciante, John Scofield! and more!

Bass Players (i'm not one but bass rocks)
Flea, Jaco Pastorius

I also am keen to hear new stuff as I want to broaden my listening variety!

I also listen to some jazz, funk, hiphop, folk, etc etc!

Lockyer24

31 Oct 2002, 14:34

Some things that pee me off about people and music...

1. The lack of respect people have for other genres of music, just because they don't like it. Some genres are an acquired taste or simply require a little more sophistication to like :)

2. Bandwagon Rock/Punk band kids who suddenly have been 'lifelong' fans of the freshest new undiscovered bands yet jump off the wagon as soon as they get any commercial airplay or a new Linkin Park or the Vines comes along. (i.e its no longer cool to like em anymore)

3. Kids who like bands for novelty value (i.e Death metal or whatever the **** that **** is) totally ignoring the lack of quality musical element because the group can add a few 'hardcore' swear words in their lyrics.

4. Moshing! The most expressionless and disgusting form of 'dancing' there ever was and has been.

5. Anyone who needs drugs to like a form of music. Including the pothead rap kids and the eccie munching 'its all about the music man, thats why we're dressed up like clowns' kandy raver kids.
Special note to shirtless Muzza cokeheads.

Thats about it
:cool:

Dogwatcher

31 Oct 2002, 14:42

Originally posted by Lockyer24
Some things that pee me off about people and music...

4. Moshing! The most expressionless and disgusting form of 'dancing' there ever was and has been.

Hey, you forgot line dancing and the macarena, a latin form of the same ****e!

BomberGal

31 Oct 2002, 15:22

Originally posted by PrideofSA

That some people will automatically hate something coz it is popular! And assume that the band is just selling out because a lot of people like them!

Exactly. This one ****s me up the wall. Not all so called 'popular' music is bad. I get "Lifehouse are just pop" all the freaking time...yeah, get a life. Listen to their stuff, get a clue!

Originally posted by Lockyer24

1. The lack of respect people have for other genres of music, just because they don't like it. Some genres are an acquired taste or simply require a little more sophistication to like

This annoys me too. If you don't like a particular genre then don't listen to it. Easy! Have a little respect that everyone is different and not like your Godly self if you want to act that way.

gPhonque

31 Oct 2002, 15:23

Surprisingly (or not...), nobody has actually mentioned the biggest problem when it comes to people and music.

That is, major labels.

It is the major labels who decide what most of you people listen to. (as is apparent by PrideofSA's list of favourite artists)

It is the major labels who control what the mainstream radio stations play.

It is the major labels who take an artist and turn them into something devoid of all creativity in the name of $$$. (that is, assuming that the artist had a clue in the first place....)

It is the major labels who generally refuse to take risks when it comes to what they release, unless it is a controversial risk that will generate publicity, and in turn, more $$$. (isn't true art always supposed to be a risk...?)

It is the major labels who decide what is "cool."

PrideofSA is just a product of the major labels dominance over mainstream music.

Sadly, PrideofSA, who might actually have some talent as a musician for all we know, will instead grow up thinking that "music" is MTV, when in fact, there couldn't be anything further from the truth.

Music is supposed to be art.

That is what the major labels, and in turn, mainstream music fans, have forgotten.

If it weren't for some of the producers/engineers on these records, then mainstream music would truly be a bigger mess than it already is.

BomberGal

31 Oct 2002, 15:33

Originally posted by gPhonque

You are not a musician.

In fact, you don't even know what music is.

So, genius - what is a musician? What is music?

PrideofSA

31 Oct 2002, 16:38

Originally posted by gPhonque
Surprisingly (or not...), nobody has actually mentioned the biggest problem when it comes to people and music.

That is, major labels.

It is the major labels who decide what most of you people listen to. (as is apparent by PrideofSA's list of favourite artists)

It is the major labels who control what the mainstream radio stations play.

It is the major labels who take an artist and turn them into something devoid of all creativity in the name of $$$. (that is, assuming that the artist had a clue in the first place....)

It is the major labels who generally refuse to take risks when it comes to what they release, unless it is a controversial risk that will generate publicity, and in turn, more $$$. (isn't true art always supposed to be a risk...?)

It is the major labels who decide what is "cool."

PrideofSA is just a product of the major labels dominance over mainstream music.

Sadly, PrideofSA, who might actually have some talent as a musician for all we know, will instead grow up thinking that "music" is MTV, when in fact, there couldn't be anything further from the truth.

Music is supposed to be art.

That is what the major labels, and in turn, mainstream music fans, have forgotten.

If it weren't for some of the producers/engineers on these records, then mainstream music would truly be a bigger mess than it already is.

Nah actually, I've seen quite a few local Adelaide bands and even bought a few of there stuff. But as there is a lot of talent there and is often more than some top acts, I still see why they are often local as the standard isn't quite up to the stuff I like which seems to be more widespread. But who knows with a lot a dollars spent on them they probably will and could be just as good!

Dogwatcher

1 Nov 2002, 09:12

Originally posted by PrideofSA

Nah actually, I've seen quite a few local Adelaide bands and even bought a few of there stuff. But as there is a lot of talent there and is often more than some top acts, I still see why they are often local as the standard isn't quite up to the stuff I like which seems to be more widespread. But who knows with a lot a dollars spent on them they probably will and could be just as good!

You talk about originality and how important it is in other posts and then you say you have problems with local bands not being up to standard. Funny that - it's called money, which you alluded to later in your post.
I think when watching these bands you need to look past the fact they aren't slickily produced like the Smoo Smoo dolls and Incubus, cough cough. A band doens't have to be perfect to be good. Then you might appreciate their music.
You also keep talking about talented msuicans and singers that you know - who are these people? Name them, give yourself some credibility and them some free publicity.

PrideofSA

1 Nov 2002, 10:36

Originally posted by Dogwatcher

You talk about originality and how important it is in other posts and then you say you have problems with local bands not being up to standard. Funny that - it's called money, which you alluded to later in your post.
I think when watching these bands you need to look past the fact they aren't slickily produced like the Smoo Smoo dolls and Incubus, cough cough. A band doens't have to be perfect to be good. Then you might appreciate their music.
You also keep talking about talented msuicans and singers that you know - who are these people? Name them, give yourself some credibility and them some free publicity.

Hey, I'm not having a go at local bands at all. I think it is fantastic that they are all out there and having a go. In fact I just started up my band again, with a few rehearsals. And The efforts of most of the bands here in Adelaide aren't rewarded too well by the hotels with many getting say just $40 to $50 between them for a gig.....absolutely pathetic.

And as I said I have bought a few Cd's from local bands which I thought were pretty good, but I still like most of the stuff I listed early just better, and it may well be because of the money that u mentioned.

I've also seen some bands develop from thinking, yeah they are ok to not hearing for a year or so and thinking "Gee, they're defintely getting quite good"

And the musicians I speak of are ones that are usually playing jazz, funk, blues etc and Are a lot more skilled at what they do and wouldn't make it into the mainstream playing what they do. But are very professional and usually are happy with playing clubs and lounges at night and teaching their rwespected instruments in the day. My point is that These musicans are usually a lot more talented than the stuff most of us hear on the radio, but those people could either right a great songs, or have the look or have a chemistry in a band that is right.

That is what the record labels look for. And like it or not, we just have to expect it!

McAlmanac

1 Nov 2002, 11:10

Originally posted by Lockyer24
1. The lack of respect people have for other genres of music, just because they don't like it. Some genres are an acquired taste or simply require a little more sophistication to like :)

This is oh so true. I am guilty of this from time to time, but as I get older I'm learning to respect why people like what they do. BomberGal loves her Lifehouse - not my cup of tea, but they obviously have something which reaches out to her.

I've never been one for schmaltzy ballads. But if you are falling in love or are experiencing some sort of heartache, these songs can hit you in the left chest region (Shirley Bassey does it for me). Other times you might be on a real high and want to rock out - a thumping guitar tune is just the go (say, You Am I or Supergrass). Or you just want to read the paper with a coffee - that anonymous cafe music is perfect. There are times that you may feel downright depressed and morbid and want to wallow in self pity - The Triffids or Nick Cave, perhaps. Not a big country fan, but I have a strange liking for Glen Campbell (especially those Jimmy Webb style tunes). And if people want to take drugs and dance non-stop for hours on end, that's none of my business (just don't hurt anyone).

Respect.

Santos L Helper

2 Nov 2002, 07:16

Originally posted by PrideofSA

Yeah that's right, I'm not coz u say so!

Moron!

after this quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by gPhonque
PrideofSA,

You are not a musician.

In fact, you don't even know what music is.

cheers
gPhonque
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I know you are crap. I've spoken to people who saw your band. Remember matey, I'm friends with some high profile promoters in Adelaide and we can tell who's crap and who is decent. Your old band fell into the former category, and it shows up in your whole attitude towards music genres.
I'm also betting that your band will alter it's style in any attempt to get noticed by playing whatever you think is popular and won't play what is truly in your heart. That's the secret behind being a GOOD musician........playing what you believe in not what you want to sell, and you seem to place too much emphasis on commercial success.