View Full Version : Over-hyped posers in embarassing mass audience exit
Go South
23 Jan 2003, 18:06
The Vines' moment of truth
By Andrew Hunter of NEWS.com.au
January 22, 2003
ARE The Vines losing it? Did they ever have it?
These were the questions being asked after they finished playing at the Gold Coast Big Day Out on Sunday.
Hailed as the saviours of rock 'n roll by Britain's New Musical Express last year, the Sydney foursome have failed to cement their reputation in Australia as a great live act.
The main stage at Parklands was the venue to make their stand. 3.35pm: Enter The Vines.
Festival organisers had enforced a safety interval at 4.30pm to clear out the mosh pit between the stage and the new "D-barrier".
According to witnesses, they needn't have bothered as The Vines did it for them.
"They evacuated the D-barrier after The Vines, but they didn't even need to ask – barely anyone was left," one concert-goer told NEWS.com.au.
"The place was packed before they started and within two songs people started streaming out.
"Afterwards I saw one girl ripping off a Vines patch from her shirt. Later I saw punters with their Vines t-shirts turned inside-out."
Singer Craig Nicholls was "out of control", barely hitting a note, dropping his guitar several times, smashing a microphone and was generally "disengaged from his band mates".
"Their roadie was almost the fifth member of the band, spending most of the set on stage fixing up microphones, guitars and cymbal stands that Craig had dropped or run into," another witness said.
The performance drew "bemused looks" from Nicholls' band mates and fellow musicians watching from the wings.
So what became of the band described in NME as "one of the best live acts of the past decade"?
Just a few months ago The Vines played a handful of acclaimed shows in the Australian capitals. They then travelled to the States where their tour was disrupted after Nicholls had an on-stage punch-up with bassist Patrick Matthews.
As a result, 2003 started with the cancellation of shows in the UK, Japan and America and a return to Australia to work on a new album, play the Big Day Out and escape the hype.
But the hype hasn't been easy to avoid and the pressure cannot be easy to live with. The knives are being sharpened. The stakes are high.
After an incredible 2002 that saw their debut album Highly Evolved go gold in the US, Britain and Australia, 2003 will be the year of truth for The Vines. Their impending sophomore release ensures that.
It's up to them – or perhaps just the enigmatic Nicholls – whether they ripen or wither in the glare.
Apparently they were pretty good at the Arena in Brisbane on Tuesday night with Nicholls "toning down" his performance and the band gelling better.
But it's their stadium shows on which many will judge The Vines – particularly given their expected high billing on this year's European summer festival circuit.
The Gold Coast was, at best, a wasted opportunity. In the meantime, their BDO appearances in Sydney, Melbourne, Perth and Adelaide will be closely observed.
PrideofSA
23 Jan 2003, 18:32
Typical crap behaviour from a crap band that can't even now play live or write good songs.
Probably one of the most overrated bands going around.
Originally posted by PrideofSA
Typical crap behaviour from a crap band that can't even now play live or write good songs.
Probably one of the most overrated bands going around.
Never EVER thought i'd say this, but i couldnt agree more with ya Molly.
Lockyer24
23 Jan 2003, 19:48
HAHA.
Time now to put another second rate poser rock band on a pedastal for all the kiddies to go along to BDO and see and claim they are lifelong fans since their limited release debut album back in 92.
Rock = 99% hype 1% substance
Mosh on!
PrideofSA
23 Jan 2003, 21:12
Originally posted by Carlos
Never EVER thought i'd say this, but i couldnt agree more with ya Molly.
Surely Carlos Santana you could have agreed with me atleast once b4. Perhaps back in 1989.:D
GhostofJimJess
23 Jan 2003, 21:38
I only caught part of their set on Channel V on Sunday arvo ... it was dreadful. Laughable, in fact.
Stealth bomber
23 Jan 2003, 21:49
Agreed with Locks - let's put all of the flavour of the month bands on the same pedestal and see how many of them can really cut it live. My guess is a lot of them can't.
Originally posted by Stealth bomber
Agreed with Locks - let's put all of the flavour of the month bands on the same pedestal and see how many of them can really cut it live. My guess is a lot of them can't.
Pacifier, who are one of the best live acts this side of the equator, would wipe the stage with these imposters, yet they are on a good 2 or so hours beforehand, and would be lucky to have sold 1/8th of their record sales.
Go figure.
PrideofSA
23 Jan 2003, 22:18
Originally posted by Carlos
Pacifier, who are one of the best live acts this side of the equator, would wipe the stage with these imposters, yet they are on a good 2 or so hours beforehand, and would be lucky to have sold 1/8th of their record sales.
Go figure.
yeh remember it's quality not quantity.
****house band, shown up for what they are. Good to see their "fans" aren't fickle. Ahem.......
Mobbenfuhrer
24 Jan 2003, 05:26
Originally posted by Carlos
Pacifier, who are one of the best live acts this side of the equator, would wipe the stage with these imposters, yet they are on a good 2 or so hours beforehand, and would be lucky to have sold 1/8th of their record sales.
Go figure.
They used to be called something else, right?
Dogwatcher
24 Jan 2003, 07:39
Ddidn't the Sex Pistols do this deliberately ,like a generation ago?
Rusty Brookes
24 Jan 2003, 08:04
Originally posted by Dogwatcher
Ddidn't the Sex Pistols do this deliberately ,like a generation ago?
Yep, but it was for their last gig when they knew they were going to split up. By this stage, various members hated each other. The Pistols' last show was in the States and consisted of one song: A cover of the Stooges song 'No Fun". Johnny Rotten then uttered the immortal line "Ha, Ha, ever feel like you've been cheated" and that was it. However before they fell apart, the Sex Pistols were a very competent live act, whereas from from all reports I've heard, the Vines are terrible live.
SydneyBomber
24 Jan 2003, 08:06
Originally posted by Mobbenfuhrer
They used to be called something else, right? Shihad.
Not my cuppa o joe, but I played a few gigs with them years ago, and they certainly were tight.
Used to be a lot heavier - with leanings towards industrial stuff.
SydneyBomber
24 Jan 2003, 08:09
Originally posted by Rusty Brookes
However before they fell apart, the Sex Pistols were a very competent live act
Umm, I don't think so.
Don't get me wrong, I grew up listening to them (albeit 10 years too late!), so I'm a big fan, but I hardly think they looked/sonded particularly competent live.
Not that there's anything wrong with that!
:D
Leaping Lindner
24 Jan 2003, 08:19
Originally posted by SydneyBomber
Umm, I don't think so.
Don't get me wrong, I grew up listening to them (albeit 10 years too late!), so I'm a big fan, but I hardly think they looked/sonded particularly competent live.
Not that there's anything wrong with that!
:D
Compared to the Vines they were the best band in the world live!:D
Admittedly it's some twenty years later and Glen Matlock is on bass but listen to the "Filthy Lucre Live" CD ( I have been (again)for the last 1/2 hour or so) it is a really good live CD!
I've got the clip from the letterman show. I can't remember where I downloaded it from, it's funny but at the same time shows how crap they really are.
go team
24 Jan 2003, 09:51
Originally posted by Carlos
Pacifier,
*cough*sellouts*cough*
re: the vines - well, they're aren't a live band... but i still think they made a hell of a debut album, and i'd be interested to see if they can follow it up in the studio.
Originally posted by go team
*cough*sellouts*cough*
* cough * bullsh*t * cough *
I dunno how you come up with that assertion when they really havent shifted that many units!
Been a big fan of Shihad/Pacifier for years, and while they aren't trying to be Helmet anymore, i wouldnt really call their music commercial or soft compared to some acts going around.
They have matured and evolved and i reckon their music is still full of integrity.
And the whole point of mentioning them in this thread was in terms of live performance. These guys blow just about any Australasian band off the stage. IMO, they represent everything good about rock music in this country (and yes, i realise they aren't actually Australian, but i hope you still get my point): Great musos writing good, uncomplicated rock songs and playing them with passion, heart and soul live.... and ****en loud!!
go team
24 Jan 2003, 11:18
Originally posted by Carlos
* cough * bullsh*t * cough *
I dunno how you come up with that assertion when they really havent shifted that many units!
And i'm sure they are well aware of that fact... Getting an album recorded in LA, using people behind Limp Bizkit / Korn's recordings doesn't come cheap. The people down at "the label" must be questioning the dollars they spent on them...
i really dont want to bag out Pacifier, i loved all the albums they brought out as Shihad and they are fantastic live.. i'm not doubting that, but after listening to Pacifier.. i dunno i get the feeling they were chasing the American audience a little too hard
dreamkillers
24 Jan 2003, 11:20
Originally posted by Leaping Lindner
Compared to the Vines they were the best band in the world live!:D
Admittedly it's some twenty years later and Glen Matlock is on bass but listen to the "Filthy Lucre Live" CD ( I have been (again)for the last 1/2 hour or so) it is a really good live CD!
Compared to a lot of modern bands they were pretty good live until the wheels started to fall off.
Actually was a good doco on SBS last week about them and there is another coming up in a few weeks on the Classic Albums series that is currently showing on Thirsday nights..........
Episode Six: NEVER MIND THE BOLLOCKS: SEX PISTOLS (rpt)
Thursday, 13th of February at 8.30pm
Britain in 1976 was a country divided by class and deeply wounded by industrial unrest and unemployment. The music industry was almost comatose with the effect of overblown supergroups producing self-indulgent ‘progressive rock’. Consequently, the stage was set for four working-class, individualistic and dispossessed teenagers to create chaos and mayhem among the established order of the music business. In 1977 The Sex Pistols produced one of the most influential albums in rock music. This documentary tells the story of the making of “Never Mind the Bollocks” – the album that was, and remains today, a key inspiration worldwide for the alternative music scene.
This incredible story is told with exclusive interviews with John Lydon, Steve Jones, Paul Cook and Glen Matlock, as we take a track-by-track look at the making of the album. Malcolm McLaren, their manager, tells his side of the story. Chris Thomas, producer, and Bill Price, producer/engineer, set the record straight about the recording sessions and return to the original multitrack tapes for evidence of the band’s dynamic musicianship. Steve and Glen demonstrate riffs and licks from the songs and explain the development of the song writing.
The featured songs include “Anarchy in the UK”, “Pretty Vacant”, “God Save the Queen”, “Holidays in the Sun”, “EMI”, “Bodies” and “Problems”.
Rare footage, television performances, home movies, promotional videos and early demo recordings gives this program a rare insight into the making of a record which still remains a milestone in rock history.
I also recommend the video/dvd Filth and the Fury - Sex Pistols
A film by Julien Temple, tells the story of the most notorious band of all time - from the litter-stacked back streets of 70's London to incredible world-wide success and their ultimate self-destruction. Featuring never-before-seen performances and shockingly candid interviews, the film settles old scores and relives former triumphs in a true celebration of the Sex Pistols phenomenon.
SydneyBomber
24 Jan 2003, 11:25
Originally posted by dreamkillers
Compared to a lot of modern bands they were pretty good live until the wheels started to fall off.
Actually was a good doco on SBS last week about them and there is another coming up in a few weeks on the Classic Albums series that is currently showing on Thirsday nights..........
Episode Six: NEVER MIND THE BOLLOCKS: SEX PISTOLS (rpt)
Thursday, 13th of February at 8.30pm
Britain in 1976 was a country divided by class and deeply wounded by industrial unrest and unemployment.
...
{CLIP}
...
I also recommend the video/dvd Filth and the Fury - Sex Pistols
A film by Julien Temple, tells the story of the most notorious band of all time - from the litter-stacked back streets of 70's London to incredible world-wide success and their ultimate self-destruction. Featuring never-before-seen performances and shockingly candid interviews, the film settles old scores and relives former triumphs in a true celebration of the Sex Pistols phenomenon.
Filth & Fury is great IMO.
Will definitely watch the 'Great Albums' show - saw 'Transformer' last (?) week, and couldn't stop laughing at Lou Reed.
How pretentious?!
PrideofSA
24 Jan 2003, 12:22
How can the Vines be considered professional when they put on a disgusting performance like that. I've seen many more professional bands down the road at the pub than them. shameful display.
As For Pacifier, I think they have just matured their sound, they certainly haven't sold out, as they aren't commercial enough for that. I was never a huge fan of Shihad, but as Pacifier I don't mind them. Better than that terrible terrible band Magic Dirt, they are really bad.
Originally posted by go team
...but after listening to Pacifier.. i dunno i get the feeling they were chasing the American audience a little too hard
Yeah fair enough. I can see where you're coming from there actually. There are a couple of (i ****en hate this term) "Nu" moments on there which i guess made me dip my eyebrow a bit. But all in all, i dont begrudge them their wish for a bit of success, and i still think its a quality recording and kicks arse on most of the schlock that passes it up the charts.
I dunno. It just frustrates the buggery out of me that there are so many crap Aussie bands (Motorace, Grinspoon, The Vines, Frenzal fricken Rhomb) who are successful (in relative terms) yet quality bands like Shihad/Pacifier and Front End Loader, who write intelligent and clever lyrics and are far superior musos to the aforementioned, just never seem to crack it.
It all depends on what Triple ****ing "we're the youth network but actually just very ****ing commercial" J decide to push. Most of the good stuff barely gets a look-in.
Magic Dirt used to be good, but then I haven't seen or heard them for a while.
Originally posted by Carlos
I dunno. It just frustrates the buggery out of me that there are so many crap Aussie bands (Motorace, Grinspoon, The Vines, Frenzal fricken Rhomb) who are successful (in relative terms) yet quality bands like Shihad/Pacifier and Front End Loader, who write intelligent and clever lyrics and are far superior musos to the aforementioned, just never seem to crack it.
Yes it is frustrating. Jebediah is another band that is superior to those you listed above which never get the success of attention they deserve. Go the Jebs.
Originally posted by Carlos
I dunno. It just frustrates the buggery out of me that there are so many crap Aussie bands (Motorace, Grinspoon, The Vines, Frenzal fricken Rhomb) who are successful (in relative terms) yet quality bands like Shihad/Pacifier and Front End Loader, who write intelligent and clever lyrics and are far superior musos to the aforementioned, just never seem to crack it.
What's wrong with Grinspoon? Powderfinger are worse than them.
Originally posted by M29
What's wrong with Grinspoon? Powderfinger are worse than them.
Grinspoon? IMO they write boring, brainless unoriginal crap and are very ordinary musos. "Dead Cat" What the **** is that all about?!?!
I like Helmet as much as the next bloke, but it doesnt mean i wanna here band after band rip them off, and very poorly might i had. Music for the kids mate, and dont they just lap it up? Turn your amps right up, distort your sound and say f*ck a few times and hey presto! You're on the BDO line-up every second year and the radio loves ya!
Oh but i suppose now they have chucked in the tocken orcestra and written a radio friendly ballad that they are maturing and evolving in their sound?
I'll pass thanks.
And dont get me started on their "singer".
Powderfinger? In what way are they worse than Grinspoon?
I wouldnt call myself the biggest fan of that band, but i can respect a band who out time and effort into their musicianship and song wiriting. Pretty hard to compare the 2 nowadays i owuld have thought anyway. Powderfinger seem hell bent on writing movie soundtracks, while Grinspoon search for that 4th cord.
Carlos, what's your take on Jebediah or havent you heard much of their stuff?
Originally posted by Carlos
Powderfinger? In what way are they worse than Grinspoon?
Powderfinger seem hell bent on writing movie soundtracks,
Kinda answered it. I'm no big fan of grinspoon though.
St. Tuttler
26 Jan 2003, 19:21
Originally posted by Carlos
I dunno. It just frustrates the buggery out of me that there are so many crap Aussie bands (Motorace, Grinspoon, The Vines, Frenzal fricken Rhomb) who are successful (in relative terms) yet quality bands like Shihad/Pacifier and Front End Loader, who write intelligent and clever lyrics and are far superior musos to the aforementioned, just never seem to crack it.
I can understand what you say about The Vines, Frenzal Rhomb and to an extent Grinspoon, but are you suggesting that Motor Ace dont write clever and intelligent lyrics? Pat Robertson has got to be up with the best regarding song writing ability. I'm not saying Pacifier/Shihad dont write clever lyrics, in fact I like both bands and I disagree, Pacifier probably have as much a profile as Motor Ace does.
"Caught between the letters
And words you never feel
Run to get a better look
The distance kills
Where you go by the road
I'll be standing here all alone
But it feels much better
When the highs you stayed for are gone" -When the feelings gone, Motor Ace.
Lockyer24
27 Jan 2003, 10:50
I have a lot of respect for Motorace. Jod IMO I wouldnt rate Jebediah amongst those bands...but thats just me
Originally posted by Carlos
[BGreat musos writing good, uncomplicated rock songs and playing them with passion, heart and soul live.... and ****en loud!! [/B]
They certainly rock alright......just like bands used to in my day :)
I first saw them on the 2000 Big Day In......easily the best band.
As for the Vines......well after seeing them on Letterman....crap!
Mind you if they got the singer from the Hives then they could be ok in that genre of band.