View Full Version : Hold on, wasn't Tait bagged for being expensive and inconsistent?
Tambaran
17 Dec 2009, 18:14
...how come we have to deal with it from Johnson?
The guy is a joke. He has played 29 Tests, is supposedly the "leader" of our attack, yet can't hold up an end, consistently leaks runs, bowls wide dross constantly and seems to get most of his wickets from bad balls.
He has had one really good series and other than that, he's been a mess. I personally think Tait (maybe not right now) would be more dangerous than Johnson.
Must be ripe for the dropping.
Because Johnson also takes wickets. As shown pretty much one minute after you made this thread.
Also he isn't as mentally weak as Tait.
Rumblah#16
17 Dec 2009, 18:21
...how come we have to deal with it from Johnson?
The guy is a joke. He has played 29 Tests, is supposedly the "leader" of our attack, yet can't hold up an end, consistently leaks runs, bowls wide dross constantly and seems to get most of his wickets from bad balls.
He has had one really good series and other than that, he's been a mess. I personally think Tait (maybe not right now) would be more dangerous than Johnson.
Must be ripe for the dropping.
Ask yourself this.
What is more benefit to a team -
Option 1 - A bloke who can consistently bowl 145km/h, and by consistent I mean all day
Option 2 - A bloke who bowls one over of 150km/h, then slows to about 125-130.
Also he isn't as mentally weak as Tait.
close to even?
Tambaran
17 Dec 2009, 18:25
Because Johnson also takes wickets. As shown pretty much one minute after you made this thread.
Not consistently. As evidenced in England, he is often the one who lets the batting side get away.
Also he isn't as mentally weak as Tait.
That's pretty arguable, given the Woman's Weekly exposé about mum after the Ashes. :rolleyes:
Yes. Johnson gets smashed. He also takes wickets. As evidenced in England where he was equal second on the wickets taken list.
Has Tait made his return to FC cricket yet?
The Reaper
17 Dec 2009, 18:51
I'm a big Tait fan but I'll say that Zimbabwe will play tests again before Tait does
crownie
17 Dec 2009, 19:00
...how come we have to deal with it from Johnson?
The guy is a joke. He has played 29 Tests, is supposedly the "leader" of our attack, yet can't hold up an end, consistently leaks runs, bowls wide dross constantly and seems to get most of his wickets from bad balls.
He has had one really good series and other than that, he's been a mess. I personally think Tait (maybe not right now) would be more dangerous than Johnson.
Must be ripe for the dropping.
hold on........Tait never took wickets.
Dixie Flatline
17 Dec 2009, 19:43
The OP has a point, though. Punter would be pulling what's left of his hair out trying to set fields to Johnson, who has absolutely no idea where he'll pitch the ball when he lets it go half the time. He ran through the Saffers last summer and there's always the potential that he'll do it again against the Windies, but at the moment, his bowling is very inconsistent.
The 747
17 Dec 2009, 19:49
...how come we have to deal with it from Johnson?
The guy is a joke. He has played 29 Tests, is supposedly the "leader" of our attack, yet can't hold up an end, consistently leaks runs, bowls wide dross constantly and seems to get most of his wickets from bad balls.
He has had one really good series and other than that, he's been a mess. I personally think Tait (maybe not right now) would be more dangerous than Johnson.
Must be ripe for the dropping.
Pretty much spoiled a reasonable argument by putting Tait in your OP.
So as you say we have an inconsistent, a bit mentally soft express quick and you suggest replacing him with an even more inconsistent, much mentally softer quick who can't even be arsed playing any form of cricket where he has to bowl more than 3 overs in a row?
They're both expensive and inconsistent.
Johnson is one of the worlds most overrated cricketers. Can't even hit the cut stuff most of the time.
bombersno1
17 Dec 2009, 20:01
At least Johnson is not a whimp and actually plays 4 day and 5 day cricket..last time I looked Tait took "stress leave" ROFL
apollo_creed
17 Dec 2009, 20:01
They're both expensive and inconsistent.
Johnson is one of the worlds most overrated cricketers. Can't even hit the cut stuff most of the time.
yep.
really there's nothing good about his bowling except for the steep bounce he extracts - which is only a luck based formula - of action + height.
wotdoiput
17 Dec 2009, 20:04
Comparing Johnson and Tait isnt really that good. Tait was expensive, bowled crap most of the time and took no wickets. Mitch is expenisve, bowls a lot of crud and some very good stuff and at least he takes wickets.
How about a comparison to Brett Lee who can be expensive but still took wickets with better deliveries than what Mitch gets them with.
As Dixie said it must be frustrating for Ponting.
Being expensive whilst getting wickets didnt save Krezja.
Homer Jnr
17 Dec 2009, 20:05
Troy Cooley has alot to answer for.
bombersno1
17 Dec 2009, 20:18
Being expensive whilst getting wickets didnt save Krezja.
Remind us what his figures were in last years Perth test..he sure as heck did not get many wickets!
wotdoiput
17 Dec 2009, 20:23
Remind us what his figures were in last years Perth test..he sure as heck did not get many wickets!
Oh noes one game where he doesnt pick up wickets on a pace bowlers pitch. One game after he gets a bag. Pretty sure other bowlers have stayed in the side after a similar situation.
bombersno1
17 Dec 2009, 20:29
Yes one pitch where Paul Harris took more wickets. I am sorry but that explains Krejza right there. He needs a doctored Indian pitch to do anything..lets not forget Sehwag too a 5 for with his gentle off spinenrs in the same test!
Krejza might have stayed if he din't go at 5 runs an over!
wotdoiput
17 Dec 2009, 20:33
Yes one pitch where Paul Harris took more wickets. I am sorry but that explains Krejza right there. He needs a doctored Indian pitch to do anything..lets not forget Sehwag too a 5 for with his gentle off spinenrs in the same test!
Krejza might have stayed if he din't go at 5 runs an over!
Doctored Indian pitch hey? Do you think Hauritz would of gotten those wickets if he was playing in Krejza's place?
Some stupid Australian batting certainly helped Paul Harris get some wickets last year. Spinners always get wickets against Australia. Just look at Benn.
But Mitch can stay doing the same? Fair enough
bombersno1
17 Dec 2009, 20:41
Yes, Hauritz would have got a similar bag of wickets. It was turning 3 feet in that game. Regardless of how we batted, Harris took more wickets than Krejza did, so saying it was a fast bowlers paradise is incorrect, a tight spinner who applies pressure got wickets on that exact surface, in WORSE bowling conditions (we batted first).
Mitch is not excused for bowling pies, but he is an all-rounder, not just a bowler. He got 35 with the bat today, and despite bowling absolute tripe got a key wicket today. He was not the worst one out there today. For all his fans Bollinger was just as bad, if not worse as he is a swing bowler that did not swing the ball once!
wotdoiput
17 Dec 2009, 20:42
Yes one pitch where Paul Harris took more wickets. I am sorry but that explains Krejza right there. He needs a doctored Indian pitch to do anything..lets not forget Sehwag too a 5 for with his gentle off spinenrs in the same test!
Krejza might have stayed if he din't go at 5 runs an over!
Lets not forget that Sehwag acctually bowled 18 overs and took 0/38 in that test.
Also while Krezja took 12 wickets, Mishra took 5 wickets and Harbi took 7.
Three Of The Best - A Quick Look At Jason Krezja and Australia
0/189 from 31 overs (http://www.cricinfo.com/indvaus2008/engine/current/match/345668.html) Tour Match
12/358 from 74.4 overs (http://www.cricinfo.com/indvaus2008/engine/current/match/345672.html)
1/204 from 49 overs. (http://www.cricinfo.com/ausvrsa2008_09/engine/match/351681.html)
Yeah don't even compare Krezja and MJ
His control tonight was laughable... actually put more balls in the slot than not. Gayle would have had more challenging throw down sessions.
Thank science Ponting took him off when Gayle really got going, his figures might have resembled Mighty Mick's ODI record.
MJ and Tait are two peas in a pod in terms of control, reliability and mental fortitude (or lack thereof).
wotdoiput
17 Dec 2009, 20:48
Yes, Hauritz would have got a similar bag of wickets. It was turning 3 feet in that game. Regardless of how we batted, Harris took more wickets than Krejza did, so saying it was a fast bowlers paradise is incorrect, a tight spinner who applies pressure got wickets on that exact surface, in WORSE bowling conditions (we batted first).
Mitch is not excused for bowling pies, but he is an all-rounder, not just a bowler. He got 35 with the bat today, and despite bowling absolute tripe got a key wicket today. He was not the worst one out there today. For all his fans Bollinger was just as bad, if not worse as he is a swing bowler that did not swing the ball once!
So even though Krezja got more wickets than both Mishra and Harbi, both far superior to Haurtiz, Hauritz would of picked up a similar bag? Yeah doubtful.. extremely doubtful. Remember when Pup got 6/9 on a sandpit? Hauritz did well to take 2/85 I guess.
Yeah that makes sense Bollinger 1 wicet going at 3 and a half runs an over was worse than Johnson taking a wicket while going at 6 runs an over.
wotdoiput
17 Dec 2009, 20:50
Three Of The Best - A Quick Look At Jason Krezja and Australia
0/189 from 31 overs (http://www.cricinfo.com/indvaus2008/engine/current/match/345668.html) Tour Match
12/358 from 74.4 overs (http://www.cricinfo.com/indvaus2008/engine/current/match/345672.html)
1/204 from 49 overs. (http://www.cricinfo.com/ausvrsa2008_09/engine/match/351681.html)
Yeah don't even compare Krezja and MJ
Why not? They have both shown they can take wickets in Tests while being expensive and bowling some crap.
Krezja hasn't really shown it. He did it on a pitch he'll probably never play on again. Why don't we judge him on his one test on home soil? Surely that has more relevance?
wotdoiput
17 Dec 2009, 20:58
Krezja hasn't really shown it. He did it on a pitch he'll probably never play on again. Why don't we judge him on his one test on home soil? Surely that has more relevance?
If he had played more than one test on home soil then I would agree with you. I would of liked more than one test in Perth to judge it on.
He still got as many wickets as Harbi and Mishra combined in that Test. Must mean something.
Freo Big Fella
17 Dec 2009, 21:07
Tait was embarrasing in his last Test Match - Johnson can be woefully inconsistent but at least he has a tendency to bounce back and take wickets.
Tait goes missing for a month, then retires.
King Elvis
17 Dec 2009, 21:12
Yes, Hauritz would have got a similar bag of wickets. It was turning 3 feet in that game. Regardless of how we batted, Harris took more wickets than Krejza did, so saying it was a fast bowlers paradise is incorrect, a tight spinner who applies pressure got wickets on that exact surface, in WORSE bowling conditions (we batted first).
Mitch is not excused for bowling pies, but he is an all-rounder, not just a bowler. He got 35 with the bat today, and despite bowling absolute tripe got a key wicket today. He was not the worst one out there today. For all his fans Bollinger was just as bad, if not worse as he is a swing bowler that did not swing the ball once!
No, he's a bowler, who can bat.
I love the bloke, and he bowled a couple of spells against the Saffers that was as brutal and awesome as you'll ever see, but **** me he's inconsistent.
juddsentant517
17 Dec 2009, 21:13
The key difference between Tait and Johnson is that Johnson can bowl over two overs at a time
Shifty1
17 Dec 2009, 22:56
Troy Cooley has alot to answer for.
This.
What has this guy actually done since joining the Australia team? Can any of our bowlers actually swing the ball on a consistent basis? I know Hilf can but he doesn't swing the ball that far (not a necessity anyway). Can any of our bowlers bowl reverse? No.
2005 Ashes and the English quicks are hooping it all over the place with new ball and reverse swing. Come 2009 Ashes and we can barely move it it the air. Forget about swinging it in Australia. I hate the fact that the commentators talk about Bollinger and Siddle being able to swing the ball when it only happens once in a blue moon. What are you doing Troy???
Tambaran
17 Dec 2009, 23:02
Comparing Johnson and Tait isnt really that good. Tait was expensive, bowled crap most of the time and took no wickets. Mitch is expenisve, bowls a lot of crud and some very good stuff and at least he takes wickets.
.
Johnson, 29 Tests. Tait, 3 Tests. Johnson was also rubbish in his first 3 Tests.
Tait's first-class record and one-day record speak more than comparing incomparable Test records.
Tait > Johnson as a bowler.
King Elvis
17 Dec 2009, 23:16
Johnson, 29 Tests. Tait, 3 Tests. Johnson was also rubbish in his first 3 Tests.
Tait's first-class record and one-day record speak more than comparing incomparable Test records.
Tait > Johnson as a bowler.
Tait as he was for the last World Cup, probably.
Tait now? No.
wotdoiput
17 Dec 2009, 23:26
Johnson, 29 Tests. Tait, 3 Tests. Johnson was also rubbish in his first 3 Tests.
Tait's first-class record and one-day record speak more than comparing incomparable Test records.
Tait > Johnson as a bowler.
Yup Johnsons 11 wickets at 26 in his first three tests is rubbish compared to Taits 5 wickets at 60.
So we cant compare their records in Test cricket but can in first class and one dya cricket. OK lets do that:
One dayers:
Tait: 38 wickets at 25.28 with an Economy rate of 5.38 and a strike rate of 28.4.
Johnson: 111 wickets at 26.19, Economy rate 4.97, strike rate 31.6.
So Tait is slightly, only slightly ahead on average and strike rate while leaking more runs and have a lower sample size.
First Class:
Tait 198 wickets at 28.59 Economy of 3.66 and strike rate of 46.7.
Johnson 212 wickets at 30.24 economy of 3.32 and strike rate of 54.5.
So again Tait has a slight edge (except for his impressive strike rate). However Taits sample is mostly against state sides while Mitch has been playing the best sides in the world.
Tait could well be more naturally talented as a bowler than Mitch. But because he is lazy, has a heart like a winter lettuce hasnt been able to fufill his talent and thats all that matters. So in the real world Johnson >>> Tait. The guy doesnt eve play 4 day cricket FFS.