Hurleys case adjourned until march

[nickh32]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/essendons-michael-hurley-may-keep-record-clean-despite-alleged-attack-on-indian-taxi-driver/story-e6frf7jo-1225821576327

This sounds better than what i was expecting could happen. Im sure essendon will come down hard on him though. What are peoples thoughts?

[Big Blow Hard]

5 charges sounds worse than I expected. But I am glad they are considering putting his case through a diversion programme, rather than saddling him with a conviction.

What does anyone see as an appropriate course of action by the club? In the case that he is guilty obviously.

With the season kicking of from late March, do we bite the bullet and suspend him for a couple of games, and a fine. Do we preempt the case (if we know his plea) and suspend him from the preseason games?

I wish this would hurry up and be over so we can give him due sanction at the start of the year, rather than have it drag out.

[B-Bomber]

I think a hefty fine should be enough. Perhaps forcing him to do extra community work in his spare time also. Of course, if this is the case opposition supporters will make insinuations but we all know they don't truly give a crap about what's "right" rather that they simply want suspensions etc as this may have an effect on-field. Couldn't care less what opposition supporters think.

[Redb#]

5 charges sounds worse than I expected. But I am glad they are considering putting his case through a diversion programme, rather than saddling him with a conviction.

What does anyone see as an appropriate course of action by the club? In the case that he is guilty obviously.

With the season kicking of from late March, do we bite the bullet and suspend him for a couple of games, and a fine. Do we preempt the case (if we know his plea) and suspend him from the preseason games?

I wish this would hurry up and be over so we can give him due sanction at the start of the year, rather than have it drag out.

yes would have preferred a quick resolution one way or the other for a first offence.

[Ben the Gooner]

Unless he is found not guilty, we simply have to suspend him for at least 2-3 regular season games. Otherwise, we make a mockery of our discipline standards as laid out to McVeigh and Lovett.

[7zark7]

Great result!! Diversion order means he won't actually face court and it will be more like a hearing!!

[Call Me Cake]

Unless he is found not guilty, we simply have to suspend him for at least 2-3 regular season games. Otherwise, we make a mockery of our discipline standards as laid out to McVeigh and Lovett.

Were McVeigh and Lovett first offenders?

[Ben the Gooner]

Were McVeigh and Lovett first offenders?

No, but neither were charged with assault. Lovett's criminal case was minor (driving without a license) - the cases are hardly comparable.

[Godzke]

Expect him to get a soft sanction from Essendon ... purely for the fact the GC are knocking on everyone's door right now.

[Skeeta Olly]

I don't think suspending players for a match only really works ot an extend. It hasn't stopped Lovett or McVeigh from re offending. Though, it does please the AFL community and make it look like the club is doing the right thing.

I think suspend him from the preseason games if any at all.

I think community service in the Indian community for once or twice a fortnight for a year, a nice big fine and letter of a apology to the victim. *


* This all of course if he is found guilty.

[The Great Barry Besanko]

First offence deserves just a fine, no way game suspension.

[Lance Uppercut]

I think community service in the Indian community for once or twice a fortnight for a year, a nice big fine and letter of a apology to the victim. *


* This all of course if he is found guilty.

mmm I strongly disagree. If he is to give service to a community, surely it should be the taxi driving community?

There is absolutely no indication that it was racially motivated in any way. He just happened to be Indian

[DapperDon]

mmm I strongly disagree. If he is to give service to a community, surely it should be the taxi driving community?

There is absolutely no indication that it was racially motivated in any way. He just happened to be Indian

Agree, can't play the race card. Get him to clean the vomit out of cabs for a few months or such.

Club wise, a fine and miss NAB Cup games. If found guilty, miss out on season games, say around 4.

[Kong]

mmm I strongly disagree. If he is to give service to a community, surely it should be the taxi driving community?

There is absolutely no indication that it was racially motivated in any way. He just happened to be IndianDefinitely.

I understand where Olly's coming from, and agree with the penalties except for the place of his community service. The media helps fuel the assumption that these assaults on Indian people are racially driven; nowhere has it been proven to be so. However that's probably for another board entirely.

[TeamHurley]

No regular season games. Suspend him from all of the NAB cup. Give his wrist a chance to heal up. And LMAO at the thread on the main board. Seriously worse than the indian media.

[NateDogg33]

This is where football supporters need to separate football from acceptable social behaviour. If I go out and bash an Indian man whilst he goes about trying to earn a living – I go to jail, I lose my job. Yet, a young football player does it and we have a board full of supporters saying suspend him for the fcking NAB Cup or just 2-3 ‘real’ games!

This is a disgrace. Racially motivated assault (or assault in general) cannot be condoned and swept under the carpet because the Gold Coast are circling. Some of us need to remove our rose coloured glasses on this one.

I hate ****ing Collingwood but the example they set by suspending didak & shaw for a finals series shows the way IMO (and neither of those 2 bashed anyone)…

[Lance Uppercut]

This is where football supporters need to separate football from acceptable social behaviour. If I go out and bash an Indian man whilst he goes about trying to earn a living – I go to jail, I lose my job. Yet, a young football player does it and we have a board full of supporters saying suspend him for the fcking NAB Cup or just 2-3 ‘real’ games!

This is a disgrace. Racially motivated assault (or assault in general) cannot be condoned and swept under the carpet because the Gold Coast are circling. Some of us need to remove our rose coloured glasses on this one.

I hate ****ing Collingwood but the example they set by suspending didak & shaw for a finals series shows the way IMO (and neither of those 2 bashed anyone)…

if you went out and bashed anyone, Indian or not, and it was your first offence, you wouldn't go to jail, and you wouldn't lose your job. WTF are you talking about?

There is no indication this assault was race related. None.

Further, there is no reason to think it's being "swept under the carpet". The fact of the matter is it's before the courts, and Essendon cannot prejudice the case.

Capiche?

[yaco55]

Unless he is found not guilty, we simply have to suspend him for at least 2-3 regular season games. Otherwise, we make a mockery of our discipline standards as laid out to McVeigh and Lovett.

Ben

The standard position has been a one week penalty.

Then again opposition supporters will bag us because we play Geelong in Round 1 - A game we are not expected to win.

[DapperDon]

This is where football supporters need to separate football from acceptable social behaviour. If I go out and bash an Indian man whilst he goes about trying to earn a living – I go to jail, I lose my job. Yet, a young football player does it and we have a board full of supporters saying suspend him for the fcking NAB Cup or just 2-3 ‘real’ games!

This is a disgrace. Racially motivated assault (or assault in general) cannot be condoned and swept under the carpet because the Gold Coast are circling. Some of us need to remove our rose coloured glasses on this one.

I hate ****ing Collingwood but the example they set by suspending didak & shaw for a finals series shows the way IMO (and neither of those 2 bashed anyone)…

What has his nationality got to do with anything? would it be a less crime if the cabbie was Anglo Saxon?

Also, if you committed the crime, and it was your first incident you would not go to jail. You would most likely receive, what 1000's of others have received. The same deal Hurley looks like getting.

[centrelink1]

mmm I strongly disagree. If he is to give service to a community, surely it should be the taxi driving community?

There is absolutely no indication that it was racially motivated in any way. He just happened to be Indian

100% spot on.

[Ben the Gooner]

Ben

The standard position has been a one week penalty.

Then again opposition supporters will bag us because we play Geelong in Round 1 - A game we are not expected to win.

If Hurley had missed training, then I'd agree with you. This is a couple of levels up from that.

I'd love him to play against Carlton in Rd 3, but the principle of the matter is more important. We have to lay down the law, whether it's a member of the leadership group (McVeigh), a senior player (Lovett) or a future superstar (Hurley).

[yaco55]

It seems that Hurley was so drunk he wouldn't have known, whether the taxi Driver was Indian or Caucasian:)

[Skeeta Olly]

100% spot on.

I agree as well.

India doesn't and unfortunately I can see part of the sentence being racial orientated.

Look at it this way. Imagine instead of seeing the bullshit India promote about Australia, they see a famous person serving out his punishment in the Indian community in Melbourne, all the smiling faces and good comments on how helpful he is and so on. It's a chance to restore Victoria's image (not that I believe this is the way). People need to understand about how people are made an example of. I know it's bullshit, I think it's bulllshit but the media control is amazing in these situations. (I don't believe this is the right thing to do).

Also, take off your Essendon biased glasses and look at it this way, not many people know what actually happened that morning, but things could have been said, or things could have been done that could possibly be called racist (be it in India or Australia) or nothing at all happened that could be called racist yet it would look better if he did something Indian orientated (not that I believe it's right). The attack wasn't a racist one, but few know what went on after that.

Ideally I hope if he is to do any community service it involves donating a nice sum of money to a Taxi Union (or what ever) and in some way helping out.

[Skeeta Olly]

Further, there is no reason to think it's being "swept under the carpet". The fact of the matter is it's before the courts, and Essendon cannot prejudice the case.


+1.

Although me must have friends at the Herald Sun, normally they'd be all over this shit.

[Ben the Gooner]

+1.

Although me must have friends at the Herald Sun, normally they'd be all over this shit.

Now that it's before the courts, there's not a lot they can do.

[Skeeta Olly]

Now that it's before the courts, there's not a lot they can do.

Mick in the Shits

By Hearld Moon Journalist

Michael Burley appears in the Broadmeadows Federal Court on assault charges where he could find himself with a one way myki ticket to Pentridge prison.

Budda to his team mates, Liz is looking for the silver lining, "I've never been there before".

?

[Ben the Gooner]

one way myki ticket to Pentridge prison.


Good to see he avoided the slammer.:thumbsu:

[TimeReaper]

I do not want him jailed or anything like that since the victim was not badly beaten and it is his first offence. But......
Even if he goes through the program or found guilty he should be suspended and for atleast 4 weeks by the club. The only other alternative I would like to see is that if he plays he gives his match fee or apportioned amount of his contract $$ to the victim for 4 weeks or alike, Assault is a terrible act even if it is provoked.

[M29]

The feedback on the main forum is hilarious. Not as funny as the herald sun comments section, but some of the stuff is pure comedy.

Personally, I think he should get the chair and be deported. AT THE SAME TIME.

[bipolarbeaR]

Fine him 10% of his wages, No NAB cup and disallow him to play the first two regular season matches, I think this is pretty fair.

Assault is assault, first time offense but still a very stupid thing to do, we all know he is a decent kid and I would put my life on it that no more off field stuff will happen from Hurley, a real kick in the butt and will help him mature.

[DaSawx]

And LMAO at the thread on the main board. Seriously worse than the indian media.

This is the part I like.

[Pevers-Legend]

The wowsers clearly have won.

I hate violence - can't stand it unless it is on computer screen or a movie.

People let's get some perspective. Lovett and McVeigh screwed up footy related issues i.e. training.

Hurley's was in the off-season and I think this is critical. He had his first season, got too drunk and acted like a tool.

He has copped plenty of media and race related crap - that is a punishment in itself.

For me though - suspending him from games helps no one for a once off, off season event.

Plenty of community service, fine hime $2K - seems to be the going rate for these offences by footy clubs - see Masten and David Johnson.

What does suspending him from home games prove? How would you feel if your work suspended you just to look good in the media?

Of course if he did this during the season it is a totally different matter, because then he is actually breaking team rules i.e. he is on Essendon FC time, not the off season i.e. his personal time.

[Bomberattack]

The wowsers clearly have won.

I hate violence - can't stand it unless it is on computer screen or a movie.

People let's get some perspective. Lovett and McVeigh screwed up footy related issues i.e. training.

Hurley's was in the off-season and I think this is critical. He had his first season, got too drunk and acted like a tool.

He has copped plenty of media and race related crap - that is a punishment in itself.

For me though - suspending him from games helps no one for a once off, off season event.

Plenty of community service, fine hime $2K - seems to be the going rate for these offences by footy clubs - see Masten and David Johnson.

What does suspending him from home games prove? How would you feel if your work suspended you just to look good in the media?

Of course if he did this during the season it is a totally different matter, because then he is actually breaking team rules i.e. he is on Essendon FC time, not the off season i.e. his personal time.
I heard the cabbie didn't trust him to go inside to put some food in his stomach which sounds like something you would encourage considering how much hurley drunk. I'm not saying hurley was innocent, but i do know from working in hospitality for years that drinking does exaggerate how you feel, so if someone is provoked their reaction would be alot worse than if they were sober. Did the cabbie take this into account or maybe the cabbie provoked him? We all know what cabbies can be like, is this cabbie claiming innocence and racism because of his skin colour, like the cabbies that claim they can't speak english and take us the longest way home?

[morebeer]

First offence & minor injury = Token fine / suspension from the NAB club.

I dont really get the racial thing. As much as the BF crew (and internet forums in general) think of themselves as being a class above, they really are just a reflection of the average Today Tonight audience. Just so dramatic.

How funny is it that people are saying we should go the same road as Collingwood with Dids and Shaw. They only did this because they lied to the club and made Ed look like a flog. Remember the 'scaley mates' comments and the JFK analogy.

[nickh32]

I would really like to know why they didnt go in the drive thru?

[yaco55]

If Hurley had missed training, then I'd agree with you. This is a couple of levels up from that.

I'd love him to play against Carlton in Rd 3, but the principle of the matter is more important. We have to lay down the law, whether it's a member of the leadership group (McVeigh), a senior player (Lovett) or a future superstar (Hurley).

Ben

You are making a supposition that Hurley's case is more serious than MvVeigh's or Lovett's case. All we know in the latter cases are that they missed training because they were drunk - There could have been more to their cases.

[yaco55]

A bit of a lighter side to this discussion.

I took my wife ( Indonesian ) to Melbourne in 2007 and 2008.

We caught lots of taxis and she was surprised to have an Indian or Sri Lankan driver every time.

She said ' Do any Aussies drive taxis '.

And a further aside

English mate took his wife ( Thai ) to England for the first time and by the time she had got through Heathrow she was still waiting to see her first English man.

[yaco55]

It appears as though Hurley will plead guilty and go through a Diversion Program.

This step has advantages for Hurley and the Legal System

- Hurley if he behaves in the next 12 months will have no conviction
- Frees up resources in the legal system
- Stops a trial that the Prosecution could lose
- Gives first offenders a taste ( albeit briefly) of the legal system

[Ben the Gooner]

Ben

You are making a supposition that Hurley's case is more serious than MvVeigh's or Lovett's case. All we know in the latter cases are that they missed training because they were drunk - There could have been more to their cases.

Neither of them were charged with an offence, let alone assault, so my point stands.

[Pevers-Legend]

Neither of them were charged with an offence, let alone assault, so my point stands.

But how is it football related?

People are blurring the lines here.

McVeigh and Lovett stuffed up relating to footy matters i.e. missed training. This is the difference between them and Hurley.

If Hurley had missed training - I would agree with the sentiment.

Hurleys case is worse, but if it was in his own time after the season, why does a football club have a mandate to punish their player?

Would anyone here expect their employer to suspend them or dock pay for an incident on your holidays?

[ant555]

I agree as well.

India doesn't and unfortunately I can see part of the sentence being racial orientated.

Look at it this way. Imagine instead of seeing the bullshit India promote about Australia, they see a famous person serving out his punishment in the Indian community in Melbourne, all the smiling faces and good comments on how helpful he is and so on. It's a chance to restore Victoria's image (not that I believe this is the way). People need to understand about how people are made an example of. I know it's bullshit, I think it's bulllshit but the media control is amazing in these situations. (I don't believe this is the right thing to do).

Also, take off your Essendon biased glasses and look at it this way, not many people know what actually happened that morning, but things could have been said, or things could have been done that could possibly be called racist (be it in India or Australia) or nothing at all happened that could be called racist yet it would look better if he did something Indian orientated (not that I believe it's right). The attack wasn't a racist one, but few know what went on after that.

Ideally I hope if he is to do any community service it involves donating a nice sum of money to a Taxi Union (or what ever) and in some way helping out.

One problem Skeet and that is the court has to prove it was racially driven otherwise it has to be treated like every other assault charge.

There is a whole discussion we can have about India and the certain percentage of racist morons that have seen this issue be blown up big time but you still have to prosecute crimes based on what they are and what can be proven.
You can not force or change the law to suite the needs of a certain problem.
It would be like someone going to jail for doing 65 in a 60 zone simply because the community wants to crack down on people doing 100km plus and wiping themselves out.

If it can be proven the assault was racially driven then sure it is a different matter but you can not stuff around with the law so we can change perceptions.

If the bloody media reported every cabbie assault evenly and not just single out the Indian ones then it may be a different story. Our media here is adding to the current problems because they have turned into a bunch of tabloid wankers who don't have to bother with reporting all the facts anymore !

[ant555]

But how is it football related?

People are blurring the lines here.

McVeigh and Lovett stuffed up relating to footy matters i.e. missed training. This is the difference between them and Hurley.

If Hurley had missed training - I would agree with the sentiment.

Hurleys case is worse, but if it was in his own time after the season, why does a football club have a mandate to punish their player?

Would anyone here expect their employer to suspend them or dock pay for an incident on your holidays?


Yes but you do not sign a contract that says you will behave and uphold the values of your employer do you ?

All they players are given specific education in this area and they are expected to not cross the line.
I will give you an example , Tommy Hislop ! Received several 1 or 2 game suspensions (from Bendigo) for drinking related incidents but he was not a high profile player and not in the seniors so it all passed by without comment. Now he did not miss training nor where his issues football related but they still suspended him.

I'm with Ben on this. If found guilty he has to get a game or 2 suspension from the club. Otherwise you end up with a situation like Carlton had to face where it gets a bit out of control with continual drinking issues.

[Ben the Gooner]

But how is it football related?

People are blurring the lines here.

McVeigh and Lovett stuffed up relating to footy matters i.e. missed training. This is the difference between them and Hurley.

If Hurley had missed training - I would agree with the sentiment.

Hurleys case is worse, but if it was in his own time after the season, why does a football club have a mandate to punish their player?

Would anyone here expect their employer to suspend them or dock pay for an incident on your holidays?

The problem with these analogies is that you can't draw a straight parallel between an average workplace and a football club. Like it or not, if footballers stuff up, they have to be punished. At the very least, the sponsors demand it.

[BringBackCransberg]

I remember back when all this started, some people claiming to have inside info said that Hurley was adamant he'd done nothing wrong (besides maybe "putting himself in a position where an incident could occur", to quote Jackson). Does anyone know if there's any truth to this, and if so, if it's still the case?

[Giggidy Giggidy]

I remember back when all this started, some people claiming to have inside info said that Hurley was adamant he'd done nothing wrong (besides maybe "putting himself in a position where an incident could occur", to quote Jackson). Does anyone know if there's any truth to this, and if so, if it's still the case?

Pure speculation of my behalf, but he probably does still feel that way, and has possibly convinced the EFC that he'd done nothing wrong. However as is so often the case in the judicial system, he would have been advised to take a path in which he admits guilt in order to diffuse the matter with a lesser penalty rather than fight it and risk copping a greater penalty (and dragging his name further through the mud in the process).

IIRC, this was also the suggestion to NLM, however he decided to fight, and fortunately (and justifiably) the charges were thrown out.

[Pevers-Legend]

The problem with these analogies is that you can't draw a straight parallel between an average workplace and a football club. Like it or not, if footballers stuff up, they have to be punished. At the very least, the sponsors demand it.

Have never siad he shouldn't be punished. Just reckon it should be non football related since it was a non football related incident i.e. outside of the season.

Smack him with so much community service he won't be able to go out at night. Put severe restrictions on his nightlife etc.
I'm sure his moaning throught the season would be more of a deterent than a one of game ban.

Missing games of footy seems like a pointless exercise for an off-season incident.

[BringBackCransberg]

I hear what you're saying P-L.

Everyone bemoans the apparent special treatment that footballers/sportspeople get when it comes to crime/punishment. But by suspending him for a completely non-football related incident is to use the same logic as reverse discrimination.

[Slattery_20]

I think the club probably will suspend him if/when he's found guilty and of what.
The fact that it took over a month to lay charges, and now it's been adjourned, suggests that there's some doubt over the facts of the case.

If he just walked up and assaulted him unprovoked it'd be open and shut.

[Slattery_20]

Pure speculation of my behalf, but he probably does still feel that way, and has possibly convinced the EFC that he'd done nothing wrong. However as is so often the case in the judicial system, he would have been advised to take a path in which he admits guilt in order to diffuse the matter with a lesser penalty rather than fight it and risk copping a greater penalty (and dragging his name further through the mud in the process).

IIRC, this was also the suggestion to NLM, however he decided to fight, and fortunately (and justifiably) the charges were thrown out.
That wasn't my recollection, I think the club believed him & stood by him all the way.

[Giggidy Giggidy]

That wasn't my recollection, I think the club believed him & stood by him all the way.

The club believed him, but I think the legal advice was still to plead guilty to the lesser offence.

[Slattery_20]

Well, in that case neither he (nor the club) took it.

[Big Blow Hard]

The club believed him, but I think the legal advice was still to plead guilty to the lesser offence.

Pretty sure noone knows what his legal advice was, cept for him and maybe the club. I would think his representation would have not tried to steer him to a guilty plea, when the case against him seemed so obviously flawed. Right from the outset, I beleive his lawyers would have been confident of getting this charge quashed. There was not many people in the community that believed the charge against him, bar for the usual flogs on BF and idiots who automatically jump to the wrong conclusion.

[yaco55]

Neither of them were charged with an offence, let alone assault, so my point stands.
Ben

I am making 2 points

1) We dont know the full story with all these events.
2) The club has been very consistent in their sanctions against player misbehaviour

I expect Hurley to get one week, Ant suggested one or two and you suggested 3.

We are disagreeing at the margins but agree their should be a suspension.

I daresay that the AFL will oversee any penalty given to Hurley.

[yaco55]

Point of clarification.

Are posters in this thread referring to NAB CUP or H and A games as a possible suspension for Hurley.

I am referring to H and A games.

[Woosh24]

Should Hurley be suspended for bringing the game into disrepute?

[Big Blow Hard]

Should Hurley be suspended for bringing the game into disrepute?

All part of whatever punishment he gets. But don't go down the line of trying to make some B Cousins comparison.

[Lance Uppercut]

Should Hurley be suspended for bringing the game into disrepute?

um, no? :rolleyes:

[Giggidy Giggidy]

Pretty sure noone knows what his legal advice was, cept for him and maybe the club. I would think his representation would have not tried to steer him to a guilty plea, when the case against him seemed so obviously flawed. Right from the outset, I beleive his lawyers would have been confident of getting this charge quashed. There was not many people in the community that believed the charge against him, bar for the usual flogs on BF and idiots who automatically jump to the wrong conclusion.

Was just using NLM as an example, obviously unable to provide references for legally privileged information. Regardless, back on topic, my point was that legal advice is often to take the plea agreement, or plead guilty to the lesser offence to avoid court or avoid the potentially larger sanction, which can be a very dificult decision for someone who is adamant that they are innocent. So Hurley may feel that he is 100% innocent, but also may have been advised to take the diversion rather than fight it and risk much worse.

[yaco55]

Was just using NLM as an example, obviously unable to provide references for legally privileged information. Regardless, back on topic, my point was that legal advice is often to take the plea agreement, or plead guilty to the lesser offence to avoid court or avoid the potentially larger sanction, which can be a very dificult decision for someone who is adamant that they are innocent. So Hurley may feel that he is 100% innocent, but also may have been advised to take the diversion rather than fight it and risk much worse.

Your summary is pretty much 100% spot on.

These kind of events happen every day in the legal system.

[Ben the Gooner]

Ben

I am making 2 points

1) We dont know the full story with all these events.
2) The club has been very consistent in their sanctions against player misbehaviour

I expect Hurley to get one week, Ant suggested one or two and you suggested 3.

We are disagreeing at the margins but agree their should be a suspension.

I daresay that the AFL will oversee any penalty given to Hurley.

We know that they weren't charged with an offence. Hurley was. Ergo, Hurley transgressed more than the others did. QED. I can't believe you're even arguing that.

[Woosh24]

All part of whatever punishment he gets. But don't go down the line of trying to make some B Cousins comparison.

Ben never hurt anyone.

Hurley hurt a poor indian taxi driver.

Ben just got mixed up with the wrong people.

[Skeeta Olly]

Ben just got mixed up with the wrong people.

Naw.

[Kong]

Ben never hurt anyone.Probably damaged a few careers with his avoidance of drug testing, as well as the police on his infamous run that night.

Hurley hurt a poor indian taxi driver.Who says he was poor, or innocent?

What's his race got to do with it?

Ben just got mixed up with the wrong people.You're probably right, but he still had the freedom of choice to make his own decisions.

The blame lies solely on him, I'm afraid.

[yaco55]

We know that they weren't charged with an offence. Hurley was. Ergo, Hurley transgressed more than the others did. QED. I can't believe you're even arguing that.

Ben

Dont forget that Lovett was charged for indiscretions with his previous gitlfriend before being suspended twice for missing training.

I basing my opinion on the club's recent stance in dealing with misdemeanourse.

We may all be wrong - The club may only fine Hurley.

I am certain that any punishment for Hurley will be ticked off first by the AFL.

[Big Blow Hard]

Ben

Dont forget that Lovett was charged for indiscretions with his previous gitlfriend before being suspended twice for missing training.

I basing my opinion on the club's recent stance in dealing with misdemeanourse.

We may all be wrong - The club may only fine Hurley.

I am certain that any punishment for Hurley will be ticked off first by the AFL.

Out of interest, was Nathan Bock charged for assaulting his GF last year? I can't remember the full fallout of that one. One game suspension at the time seemed a little light on. Not that we should really base our decision on another incident. The AFL must have been satisfied wit the punishment Adelaide dished out.Was there any other things Bock was ordered to do? eg counselling, anger mangement etc.

[kelvin_sheedy]

If he's guilty of assaulting a cabbie then he should get 6 weeks minimum by the club.

We need to send a message to the community that violence will not be tolerated on any level.

[ant555]

If he's guilty of assaulting a cabbie then he should get 6 weeks minimum by the club.

We need to send a message to the community that violence will not be tolerated on any level.

Tough penalty but you are right in saying a message needs to be sent to the community about violence. At the moment some parts of the community just seem to think it is ok , a bit like speeding but that is an issue for another thread.

[kelvin_sheedy]

Tough penalty but you are right in saying a message needs to be sent to the community about violence. At the moment some parts of the community just seem to think it is ok , a bit like speeding but that is an issue for another thread.

Exactly........ I'm sick and tired of picking up the newspapers and reading about bashings, stabbings, drunkeness, etc, etc.

There seems to be an increasing lack of respect for others and the police in the community and Melbourne imo has become a shit hole.

We are getting overrun by morons who have destroyed the fabric of the city, chapel st and various other players. It has made this once great city into a cultural wasteland.

I'm willing to cop tough penalties to try and start getting us back on track.

[Mad Bomber Sean]

If found guilty I will support what ever penalty the club deems appropriate.
A long off field suspension would be reasonable given the nature of the apparent crime.
Hurley should be made to work very very hard to win back the love & respect of the club and the fans if found guilty.

Even if he is not found guilty, I feel that he should be punished to a lesser extent for tarnishing the clubs name. The kid needs to feel what he has done is wrong

I used to live in the city of Melbourne and noticed an explosion of sensless violence late night in the last 5 years, it has become dangerous in certain districts - King, Chapel, Burke round South Melb.

The cowards are simply not real men.

[B-Bomber]

Agree that violence is an increasing problem in Australia and something needs to be done to really send a message. However, is it the responsibility of a professional sporting club to make such a stand? At the expense of what the supporting clubs main aim is (onfield success)? Despite the fact that the supporters and members may not agree (to such a hefty suspension)?

(This is in regards mostly to Kelvin's 6 H&A game suspension idea but to a lesser extent for any punishment that results in Hurley missing H&A games)

[_Brainiac_]

This is where football supporters need to separate football from acceptable social behaviour. If I go out and bash an Indian man whilst he goes about trying to earn a living – I go to jail, I lose my job. Yet, a young football player does it and we have a board full of supporters saying suspend him for the fcking NAB Cup or just 2-3 ‘real’ games!

This is a disgrace. Racially motivated assault (or assault in general) cannot be condoned and swept under the carpet because the Gold Coast are circling. Some of us need to remove our rose coloured glasses on this one.

I hate ****ing Collingwood but the example they set by suspending didak & shaw for a finals series shows the way IMO (and neither of those 2 bashed anyone)…

Hear ye hear ye :thumbsu:

[Ben the Gooner]

Ben

Dont forget that Lovett was charged for indiscretions with his previous gitlfriend before being suspended twice for missing training.

I basing my opinion on the club's recent stance in dealing with misdemeanourse.

We may all be wrong - The club may only fine Hurley.

I am certain that any punishment for Hurley will be ticked off first by the AFL.

Lovett was never charged with a criminal offence any worse than breaching an intervention order. His (ex) girlfriend didn't press charges. His guilt is irrelevant - he was never charged with assault.

Hurley's offence is (if found guilty) worse than anything we've seen from an Essendon player for a while, especially under Knights' stricter regime. I'd be astounded if the suspension was less than 2-3 games.

Another option I thought of, which might be overanalysis, is that Hurley will go through the intervention, accept his guilt as part of that, and avoid a criminal trial, even though he and the club don't see that he's guilty of assault. If this happens, would the club punish him for any more than putting himself in a compromising situation?

[yaco55]

Ben

I believe that Hurley should be punished whether he is found guilty or not. You could tell by the tone of Peter Jackson's press release at that time, that the club was distinctly unimpressesed with Hurley's behaviour on the night.

A diversion means that Hurley accept's guilt but the advantage is that no conviction is recorded unless he reoffends within a prescribed time limit.

[Ben the Gooner]

A diversion means that Hurley accept's guilt but the advantage is that no conviction is recorded unless he reoffends within a prescribed time limit.

Yes, but if the club, Hurley and his lawyers all believe he can get off, he is innocent, but also that there's a realistic chance he could be found guilty, then the diversion program becomes an option. In other words he'll plead guilty for the diversion program, even though if there was a criminal trial he'd plead not guilty.

In that case, what does the club do punishment wise? Do they act on public opinion (i.e. that Hurley confesses his guilt, therefore he is guilty) or on what they know to be true (that he only confessed to avoid a trial)?

This is hypothetical, but possible.

[yaco55]

Yes, but if the club, Hurley and his lawyers all believe he can get off, he is innocent, but also that there's a realistic chance he could be found guilty, then the diversion program becomes an option. In other words he'll plead guilty for the diversion program, even though if there was a criminal trial he'd plead not guilty.

In that case, what does the club do punishment wise? Do they act on public opinion (i.e. that Hurley confesses his guilt, therefore he is guilty) or on what they know to be true (that he only confessed to avoid a trial)?

This is hypothetical, but possible.

You can be certain that any punishment handed down by Essendon will be checked off with the AFL.

[Ben the Gooner]

You can be certain that any punishment handed down by Essendon will be checked off with the AFL.

You've said that about 5 times, and not once has it had anything to do with my posts.:rolleyes:

[yaco55]

Yes, but if the club, Hurley and his lawyers all believe he can get off, he is innocent, but also that there's a realistic chance he could be found guilty, then the diversion program becomes an option. In other words he'll plead guilty for the diversion program, even though if there was a criminal trial he'd plead not guilty.

In that case, what does the club do punishment wise? Do they act on public opinion (i.e. that Hurley confesses his guilt, therefore he is guilty) or on what they know to be true (that he only confessed to avoid a trial)?

This is hypothetical, but possible.

Ben

I cant add much more.

I have explained how the diversion program works,and in my opinion Hurley will be suspended for one AFL match. I doubt that EFC will be swayed by public opinion ,but will liase with the AFL. EFC has a good reputation with the AFL, who appear satisfied with previous punishments given to misbehaving players.

Finally, I would suspend Hurley whether he is found guilty or not.

[Trav0]

hopefully he gets suspended for games which are either winnable or un-winnable, and not 50-50games, so round 7-10 would be fine for me

Port @ Etithad
Saints @ Etihad
Tigers @ MCG
Bulldogs @ Etihad

[Big Blow Hard]

hopefully he gets suspended for games which are either winnable or un-winnable, and not 50-50games, so round 7-10 would be fine for me

Port @ Etithad
Saints @ Etihad
Tigers @ MCG
Bulldogs @ Etihad

In an ideal world you could dish out punishn\ment in this manner, but what is that going to teach Hurley. It's like saying "You can muck up, but don't worry, we aren't going to suspend you from important games". Na, that is a cop out approach.

If he is suspended, it should be hard and fast, with the who we play not coming into the equation. It is very early in his career, what sort of contribution he makes would be hard to predict anyway. Just get it over with.

[Trav0]

In an ideal world you could dish out punishn\ment in this manner, but what is that going to teach Hurley. It's like saying "You can muck up, but don't worry, we aren't going to suspend you from important games". Na, that is a cop out approach.

If he is suspended, it should be hard and fast, with the who we play not coming into the equation. It is very early in his career, what sort of contribution he makes would be hard to predict anyway. Just get it over with.

it should be upto the courts to teach him a lesson not the club in my personal opinion, but that's just me, while a club suspension may teach him a lesson, what lesson does it teach other kids his age that aren't footballers, basically that they can punch someone and get off with a slap on the wrist, and thats where the real problem is!! anyway thats not really about the footy!!

Having said that its going to happen, so i agree with you get it over with! hopefully it brings the best out in the player that will replace him, Hooker most likely and the fight for spots will begin(and if hes back for round 7-10 maybe it will bring the best out of him and we can win them all)!!!! GO DONS!! and hopefully 2010 can be indiscretion free after a bad 2009!

[stander]

Ben
Finally, I would suspend Hurley whether he is found guilty or not.

Tokenism at its best. One or six weeks has no bearing on the lesson he's already learned. He's level headed and young enough to have responded to the slaps already dished out by family, friends and EFC.

[Big Blow Hard]

it should be upto the courts to teach him a lesson not the club in my personal opinion, but that's just me, while a club suspension may teach him a lesson, what lesson does it teach other kids his age that aren't footballers, basically that they can punch someone and get off with a slap on the wrist, and thats where the real problem is!! anyway thats not really about the footy!!

Having said that its going to happen, so i agree with you get it over with! hopefully it brings the best out in the player that will replace him, Hooker most likely and the fight for spots will begin(and if hes back for round 7-10 maybe it will bring the best out of him and we can win them all)!!!! GO DONS!! and hopefully 2010 can be indiscretion free after a bad 2009!

Hooker should be in regardless. I stand by my statement that he will be the absolute steal of that particular draft.

[Trav0]

Hooker should be in regardless. I stand by my statement that he will be the absolute steal of that particular draft.

Yeah, i like hooker, i just think it will be tough to fit him in there with fletch and pears, and hurley down back, hes definately the one to come in when a KPP is injured, i really want to see hurley play the McPhee role (only 100times better) and let hooker play CHB

[mustafish]

from what i hear the taxi driver refused to do a u turn to go to hungry jacks so hurley just jumped out and the taxi driver ran at him and in reaction to him coming at him hurls gave him a boot to the groin. punish him anyway you like but mark my word his a wonderfull kid and wont be a re offender..

[Slattery_20]

I cant add much more.

You can say that again.

[Beerfish]

I can't be bothered reading the whole thread so I dunno if somebody has already said this but....

Crime, punishment and justice is why we have police, law talkin dudes and judges. It isn't the football club's job to usurp their authority nor back up any decision they do or do not make with their own half arsed punishment that really punishes the rest of the players and the supporters.

It's not a football matter and it's before the courts. Let the courts decide and leave it at that.

[Trav0]

I can't be bothered reading the whole thread so I dunno if somebody has already said this but....

Crime, punishment and justice is why we have police, law talkin dudes and judges. It isn't the football club's job to usurp their authority nor back up any decision they do or do not make with their own half arsed punishment that really punishes the rest of the players and the supporters.

It's not a football matter and it's before the courts. Let the courts decide and leave it at that.

i agree, im hopeful the club will too, but im not going to hold my breath, media and public will want the club to act aswell!!!

[fogdog]

So despite Hurley recovering from his wrist injury, he may miss the NAB cup if the leadership group impose a suspension on him over the cab driver incident..

[Knight Ryders]

Why now - I have thought all along that they were waiting for the verdict and now before the first NAB match they are talking about suspensions?

I feel a dose of social consciousness coming on

[Ben the Gooner]

Why now - I have thought all along that they were waiting for the verdict and now before the first NAB match they are talking about suspensions?

I feel a dose of social consciousness coming on

It's a good question. Still, the next 2 days should be interesting as they decide.

[Big Blow Hard]

Why now - I have thought all along that they were waiting for the verdict and now before the first NAB match they are talking about suspensions?

I feel a dose of social consciousness coming on

Maybe there has been a development in the court process. Perhaps an agreement has been made about this diversion program. "In which case, it's time to punish.

[bombre-boy]

Why now - I have thought all along that they were waiting for the verdict and now before the first NAB match they are talking about suspensions?

I feel a dose of social consciousness coming on

Hmmm, odd.
The cynic in me says it is being done due to the Geelong response to Stokes.

[yaco55]

Has the AFL leaned on the Bombers ?

[jonesy86]

IMO I think the decision is being made now so you can take the lead from Carlton and 'suspend' him from the NAB Cup as you will need him in the season proper.