How many centuries does Hodge need?

[jk20]

Seriously how many centuries does Brad Hodge have to score before he gets a look in to the ODI and 20/20 team. Seems like he is scoring centuries everytime he bats.
Would be a much better option the Voges.

[Adelaide Hawk]

About another 30 or so should do it.

[mattys123]

Oh cmon, 700 runs in ODD cricket isn't enough.

4 hundreds in ODD isn't enough.

Being the best and most consistent batsman in the world in 20/20 isnt enough.

Stupid CA, he should have been playing One Dayers and 20/20's for years for Australia.

[The Falcon Strike]

Oh cmon, 700 runs in ODD cricket isn't enough.

4 hundreds in ODD isn't enough.

Being the best and most consistent batsman in the world in 20/20 isnt enough.

Stupid CA, he should have been playing One Dayers and 20/20's for years for Australia.

So should Tim Zoehrer - but i daresay (from rumour) for similar reasons - both didn't go any further for regular selection

[Cleavy]

A century of hits upside Hilditch's head with his bat should do the trick ;)

[Kim Hagdorn]

Didn't they give him a go playing every game in a 7 match series against India?

I think he averaged about about 9...

[JUBJUB]

Would be a much better option the Voges.

Hodge or Voges would be a better option in T20 than Clarke.If Ponting bothered playing T20 Clarke would be out on his arse.

[eddiesmith]

Problem for Hodgey is he cannot make runs in India in any form, at any level, obviously Australia gave him his only full ODI series in India which didnt help him, but with the next World Cup in India there isnt much point picking him. But he should still be in the T20 side

[Kim Hagdorn]

Yeah he should've at least been in the squad for the last T20 WC.

[Tambaran]

He had a long enough run in the ODI side to prove that, aside from his bad effect on team spirit, he wasn't good enough.

[Kim Hagdorn]

His already extremely poor ODI average is also pumped up by a score of 123 against cricketing powerhouses in the Netherlands :o

But yeah it's the selectors fault for him being complete crap in almost all the ODI games he's played in..

[damochandler]

they have moved on and i don't think he will be picked ever again tbh. when they rest one of theur regulars, they will bring in a young pup in that middle order from now on.

his international career is over

[Blue Dimension]

Hodge has had his chance and blew it, similarly to David Hussey. Neither took their opportunities and they had plenty.

Hodge also struggles in the subcontinent, and as eddiesmith said, with the next world cup in the subcontinent, he won't get near the ODI side.

[Cotchin 9]

Won't get a look in for the ODI's ever again, but he is a better T20 player than Clarke & Birt.

[HSSB]

A little too old to get a look in now, but he should have been in the 20/20 team and possibly the ODI team. Although his stats aren't good at all in ODI's.

Also I don't think many of the Australian players actually get along with him all that well.

[dr nick]

Hodge is regarded by selectors and players in the aussie team as a bit of a tosser and most of all a pea heart. He's not in the ODI plans, and the fact he gets runs domestically only serves to raise false hopes and get his mum some air time.

[JUBJUB]

A little too old to get a look in now

Dirk Nannes ain't no spring chicken and he's getting games for Aus now

[eth-dog]

One more than he has currently, one more each time he scores one

[Bombers_Forever]

He blew his chance, and his attitude towards selectors sealed it.

[Ill Chicken]

He had a long enough run in the ODI side to prove that, aside from his bad effect on team spirit, he wasn't good enough.

Well considering they changed him for David Hussey, who was given pretty much given the same run, they were better off just sticking with Hodge as they have done when other players are around situation like White and Waston who both only started to pay dividends around the 30 game mark.

[Tambaran]

Hussey and Hodge were mature age players. They, like M Hussey, don't get as long to prove their worth because they're expected to adjust quicker.

Neither did, sorry, no more chances.

[mediumsizered]

Would much rather Hodge play for the Vics. He took the Qld attack by the scruff of the neck yesterday & totally dictated terms. His pull shot off McDermott, after walking down the wicket & having the ball dropped short by McDermott, was just an example of him being a class above domestic bowling attacks. When Hodge is in the mood he was in yesterday, he is a delight to watch.

[Kim Hagdorn]

Would be a much better option the Voges.

Voges record at international level is better than Hodges.

[Ill Chicken]

Voges record at international level is better than Hodges.

Give him another ten games before you use that as a measurement.

[Kim Hagdorn]

Would much rather Hodge play for the Vics.

Agree with this, state level is were he has always belonged, it's his limit. Some players sadly just don't have it mentally to succeed at the highest level.

[eth-dog]

Agree with this, state level is were he has always belonged, it's his limit. Some players sadly just don't have it mentally to succeed at the highest level.
Hodge at Test level:
6 games, 11 innings, 503 runs @ 55, with a high score of 203*. Tell me how:
a) He got dropped 1 test after making 200 and
b) why, when in the West Indies, he made in his only test, 3rd highest score in the first innings, and 2nd highest score in the second innings, got dropped?

[Tyberious Funk]

Voges record at international level is better than Hodges.

Debatable.

He may (currently) have an average of 37, but other than spanking 72 against Scottland, Voges doesn't have much to boast about on his international resume. Hodge, on the other hand has some 90's against New Zealand in addition to his century (admittedly against the Netherlands).

I think the selectors were probably correct to drop Hodge at the time, if you look at his form. But selecting Voges over him this summer is an absolute travesty.

It seems pretty clear the Hodge is an absolute plonker. But IMHO that shouldn't exclude him from the team. And it seems pretty clear the selectors put a line through his name a few years ago and vowed he would never play for australia again. Ever. I got a similar impression about Chris Rogers, too.

[Durham Hawks]

averaging 30 from 21 ODI innings...enough chances for sure

i think some fans just get shitty because they only pay attention to games during the domestic summer. at a guess i'd say the majority of hodge's 25 ODI caps have come overseas and therefore not as squarely in the public eye

[Smokey_22]

Seriously OP?

Somebody show OP Hodges innings by innings ODI record. Also his age.

Silly thread.

[HBF]

He'll never play for Australia again, he realises this, and is now going to set him and his family up by playing in the IPL.

[aussie1st]

He missed the boat with his last ODI series in India, and once you get dropped or black marked its near on impossible to get back in.

[Ricketts]

Agree with this, state level is were he has always belonged, it's his limit. Some players sadly just don't have it mentally to succeed at the highest level.

Exactly right.

Why would the selectors consider a state cricket standard player to play internationally?

Makes absolutely no sense.

[Ill Chicken]

Exactly right.

Why would the selectors consider a state cricket standard player to play internationally?

Makes absolutely no sense.

They're giving North a run aren't they?

[The Falcon Strike]

They're giving North a run aren't they?

Rightly or wrongly - my belief is that the only reason North was picked is because he could bowl "ok". We didn't have a 5th bowler - given Clarke's back and Kat's shoulder - so in the SA series we needed someone to send down a few overs.

When he took 6 wickets his selection was sealed.

North hasn't been in the best 2-3 performing batsman in the domestic scene - which is what you need to be picked as a batsman at age 30. He has 10k runs - but that is a sign of consistency - not elitism.

[Ricketts]

They're giving North a run aren't they?

Clearly better than Hodge.

[Ill Chicken]

Clearly better than Hodge.

That can't be justified, nor is it when you look at Hodge's record in all three formats in comparison to North.

[Tyberious Funk]

Clearly better than Hodge.

You be smokin' some gooood sheet, mon.

[Kim Hagdorn]

Exactly right.

Why would the selectors consider a state cricket standard player to play internationally?

Makes absolutely no sense.

They gave him a chances and he failed miserably.

[mcglede]

Hodge continually makes runs on flat decks. Just look at his knock in Brisbane - makes a hundred out of 300+ and QLD then respond with a 300 score, so not as if the deck was moving about - barely a ball moved off the straight all game, and Hodge thrives on those decks. Someone show me the Hodge century out of a 180 to 230 score. Phil Hughes did it last year, and lo and behold found himself in the Test team. Hodge can't, and isn't.

Over in India he was an epic fail - and guess where the IPL is being played this year. Not in South Africa, where decks are like Australia and he played well at last year - whole new ball game over in India.

Also remember that this joke of an international player made his 200 after being dropped before he got to 10 and that on the fifth day, an Australian attack couldn't dislodge Jacquas Rudolph and Justin Kemp - those two Bradman-like South Africans. Do they even play internationals anymore? Oh, and this was the one draw in a long line of W's for the Australians. Why? Because the deck was flat!!

Aside from his score against the Dutch, he's barely done anything in ODI's. Look at his 40+ scores - almost all at a strike rate below the team's strike rate.

And if we're wondering why he got dropped in the West Indies, go back a little earlier to a stage where he and Shane Watson recognised that there was a spot at the top of the order going. Watson had I think four fails in a row, and kept at it. Hodge had a game at the MCG where he double failed and never went back to it again. Watson (and Katich) persevered at the top and lo and behold have a look now who the Australian openers are. And then look at that same season - Peter Siddle was Hodge's personal nightwatchman in Pura Cup matches. Got to the point at one game where QLD lost two bowlers to injury that Hodge and Jewell batted an entire day, but Hodge had used a nightwatchman the night before. He was out first ball and then Hodge decided i was time to bat - boy! that ball must have been one heck of a handgrenade.

Over in the West Indies, he batted OK, but number six would have to be the easiest position to find a batsman - the shine is off the new ball mostly and you're onto the first and second change bowlers. You and I could probably average 20 so imagine what a good player can do. The selectors went for the bloke at the top of the order (Katich) who had the grapefruits to go out and face the new ball.

Oh, and a few years back when he was going to take full advantage of a 'rest' given to Ricky Ponting, here's how he did against an English attack featuring that Wisden non Cricketer of the Century Sajid Mahmood...

http://www.cricinfo.com/db/PICTURES/CMS/71200/71296.jpg

Case closed. Bloke is a flat track bully and isn't worthy of being mentioned in the same sentance of the words 'Australian cricketer'.

[Ill Chicken]

Hodge continually makes runs on flat decks. Just look at his knock in Brisbane - makes a hundred out of 300+ and QLD then respond with a 300 score, so not as if the deck was moving about - barely a ball moved off the straight all game, and Hodge thrives on those decks.

OD cricket is orientated towards the batsmen, not only in the way wickets are produced but field restrictions and so on, so how should any batsman especially in Asia, get any credit for making runs in limited overs?

Someone show me the Hodge century out of a 180 to 230 score. Phil Hughes did it last year, and lo and behold found himself in the Test team. Hodge can't, and isn't.

Show where they're going to take a 35 year old middle order batsman, over about three other openers who score close to a 1000 runs for the season?

Over in India he was an epic fail - and guess where the IPL is being played this year. Not in South Africa, where decks are like Australia and he played well at last year - whole new ball game over in India.

Decks in South Africa are the best bowling decks in world cricket or didn't you watch the Champions Trophy?

Also remember that this joke of an international player made his 200 after being dropped before he got to 10 and that on the fifth day, an Australian attack couldn't dislodge Jacquas Rudolph and Justin Kemp - those two Bradman-like South Africans. Do they even play internationals anymore? Oh, and this was the one draw in a long line of W's for the Australians. Why? Because the deck was flat!!

Lets apply some rationalisation here, where is the Australian bowling attack from that game now? Do they even play international cricket anymore?


Aside from his score against the Dutch, he's barely done anything in ODI's. Look at his 40+ scores - almost all at a strike rate below the team's strike rate.

And if we're wondering why he got dropped in the West Indies, go back a little earlier to a stage where he and Shane Watson recognised that there was a spot at the top of the order going. Watson had I think four fails in a row, and kept at it. Hodge had a game at the MCG where he double failed and never went back to it again. Watson (and Katich) persevered at the top and lo and behold have a look now who the Australian openers are. And then look at that same season - Peter Siddle was Hodge's personal nightwatchman in Pura Cup matches. Got to the point at one game where QLD lost two bowlers to injury that Hodge and Jewell batted an entire day, but Hodge had used a nightwatchman the night before. He was out first ball and then Hodge decided i was time to bat - boy! that ball must have been one heck of a handgrenade.

No other captain, in the history of cricket, has used a nightwatchman. Besides that, it's actually hard to decipher where you are referencing to, first class, domestic one dayers or ODI's.

Over in the West Indies, he batted OK, but number six would have to be the easiest position to find a batsman - the shine is off the new ball mostly and you're onto the first and second change bowlers. You and I could probably average 20 so imagine what a good player can do. The selectors went for the bloke at the top of the order (Katich) who had the grapefruits to go out and face the new ball.

Oh, and a few years back when he was going to take full advantage of a 'rest' given to Ricky Ponting, here's how he did against an English attack featuring that Wisden non Cricketer of the Century Sajid Mahmood...

Case closed. Bloke is a flat track bully and isn't worthy of being mentioned in the same sentance of the words 'Australian cricketer'.

Brad Hodge is an Australian Cricketer.

[mcglede]

Rationalisation? You think nightwatchmen are used in One Dayers.

[Ill Chicken]

Rationalisation? You think nightwatchmen are used in One Dayers.

Where did I say that? I was referring to the rest of what you wrote, ie Watson opening up.

[mcglede]

I'd suggest then you go do a little history search on the Pura Cup instead of wanting to blow smoke up Brad's date.

Bradley would be best reminded that blokes like Jamie Siddons and Jamie Cox were exceptional talents as well but never got a look-in.

To their credit, neither have complained like Hodge ever has.

[Ill Chicken]

I'd suggest then you go do a little history search on the Pura Cup instead of wanting to blow smoke up Brad's date.

Bradley would be best reminded that blokes like Jamie Siddons and Jamie Cox were exceptional talents as well but never got a look-in.

To their credit, neither have complained like Hodge ever has.

How bout you be a bit more relevant.

Watson didn't have a choice about opening up in the Ashes. You can't use that as a comparison to Brad Hodge not even being on tour and then suggesting he wouldn't have accepted the position as well is ludicrous.

When was the last time Watson actually played in a Shield/Pura Cup match?

To their credit, neither have complained? Why is it a credit or not a credit? So basically they're soft cocks who didn't have the guts to question why they weren't selected?

[mcglede]

It's a credit because they accepted the umpires (in this case selectors) decision. Bradley hasn't. There's always been a grumble as to why he isn't in the team. Hence this thread. Maybe you should use hot spot or snicko in your referral chook as you can't accept the umpires decision either.

Furthermore, don't argue relevance and then come up with a completely irrelevant line as to regards Watson not playing Pura Cup/Sheffield Shield. Been a while since Ponting has played a Shield game, and Mitchell Johnson has been a WA contracted player for a couple of seasons now...and has never played for them.

May I ask though, did you write this line:

OD cricket is orientated towards the batsmen, not only in the way wickets are produced but field restrictions and so on, so how should any batsman especially in Asia, get any credit for making runs in limited overs?

Really? Did you write that?

[Yabba]

And if we're wondering why he got dropped in the West Indies, go back a little earlier to a stage where he and Shane Watson recognised that there was a spot at the top of the order going. Watson had I think four fails in a row, and kept at it. Hodge had a game at the MCG where he double failed and never went back to it again. Watson (and Katich) persevered at the top and lo and behold have a look now who the Australian openers are. And then look at that same season - Peter Siddle was Hodge's personal nightwatchman in Pura Cup matches. Got to the point at one game where QLD lost two bowlers to injury that Hodge and Jewell batted an entire day, but Hodge had used a nightwatchman the night before. He was out first ball and then Hodge decided i was time to bat - boy! that ball must have been one heck of a handgrenade.

Over in the West Indies, he batted OK, but number six would have to be the easiest position to find a batsman - the shine is off the new ball mostly and you're onto the first and second change bowlers. You and I could probably average 20 so imagine what a good player can do. The selectors went for the bloke at the top of the order (Katich) who had the grapefruits to go out and face the new ball.

If you recall Watson went to the top of the order and failed miserably, 3 ducks in 4 knocks and a single figure score IRRC. He the went back to batting down the order as when he played in India in 2008, and his last games for QLD.
http://www.cricinfo.com/ausdomestic/engine/match/361279.html
So its crap to call Hodge soft for not opening, If you recall Jaques got picked and made the spot his own until injured, then Katich was chosen after breaking the record for most runs in a SS season.

If number 6 is so easy to bat then why is the incumbent in the side so much weaker than every other batsmen in the side?

Personally I am not sure that Hodge has been treated harshly (apart from stiff original dropping) in regards to the test side, but he should have been given an opportunity in the 20/20 side.

[mcglede]

THANK YOU!

I was wondering when someone was going to mention Phil Jacques.

Bloke was dropped from the team and a tour to South Africa and told to work on his fielding!! Never mentioned anything about his batting.

Complaints from Phil Jacques...0

Not too many complaints from Phil Hughes either - the kid was dropped well before he deserved to be, but perhaps the selectors got that decision right in the long run. Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing him slip in at six.

As for Marcus North - had an awful summer, but did well in South Africa and England so they've giving him time to hit form. Perhaps too long, but perhaps he's more of a team player than Bradley is!!

I won't say that Hodge isn't a very good player - he is. Just that he was never someone who was going to win us Test and ODI matches on a regular basis. To the selectors credit, they realised occasionally there would be a dodgy deck or two along the way and that he would go missing.

[Ill Chicken]

It's a credit because they accepted the umpires (in this case selectors) decision. Bradley hasn't. There's always been a grumble as to why he isn't in the team. Hence this thread. Maybe you should use hot spot or snicko in your referral chook as you can't accept the umpires decision either.

The umpires have someone to answer to, who do the selectors answer to? They're appointed and usually resign when they feel like it. They're not held accountable for their actions in the same way an umpire is, so your point is irrelevant.

Along with, I've never seen the selectors come out and say, Brad Hodge will not be picked in the sides for these reasons ie lets say your points. How hard is that? At least then everyone can say, bad luck Brad, there's nothing you can do.

You know why they don't? Because hypocrites, they'll say a player is too old then pick Bryce McGain, they'll say OD form counts to test selection and ignore Bracken.

Hodge deserves credit if anything even if it did contribute to his none selection.

Furthermore, don't argue relevance and then come up with a completely irrelevant line as to regards Watson not playing Pura Cup/Sheffield Shield. Been a while since Ponting has played a Shield game, and Mitchell Johnson has been a WA contracted player for a couple of seasons now...and has never played for them.

How is it not relevant? I don't know when the last time Watson opened in a Pura Cup match, hence as Yabba pointed out in the previous post, your point is defunct.

May I ask though, did you write this line:

OD cricket is orientated towards the batsmen, not only in the way wickets are produced but field restrictions and so on, so how should any batsman especially in Asia, get any credit for making runs in limited overs?

Really? Did you write that?

Yes, really, I wrote that. It's a question, haven't you seen one of them before? You are calling Brad Hodge a flat track bully in Limited Overs Cricket. All One Day cricket is played on roads, that's the whole point, to see the batsmen make massive runs. You're blaming Hodge for making runs on such tracks when it is the sticking point of the game.

Really, can you understand that?

[mcglede]

Hang on, Hodge deserves credit because he goes missing when the deck does a bit but brings his bat and ball when the wicket resembles Eastlink, and consistently whinged when things do not go his way.

Needs credit for that?

Really?

Sure?

I will cut him some slack and suggest the Victorian media is partly to blame. They look for any anti-Australian selector comment, and even ran a long campaign to get McGain into the team, then said little as his second ball in Test cricket went sailing into the grandstand en route to a 0-149. I also recall several years ago, we had to remember I-N-N-E-S-S? Where is he now?

Bracken? Well Chook, when Rudolph (28) and Kemp (32 - both far too old for cricket now I take it?), managed to hold out Australia on the last day in the afore mentioned Perth Test, they did it against an attack of McGrath (had an ok career), Brett Lee (300+ Test scalps - ordinary) Warne (perhaps you've heard of him) and...Bracken.

Perhaps Bracken got put into the same boat as Krezja - someone who was dropped for not bowling a team out in Perth. I'm not sure - I'm not a selector, but given Australia's success over the past decade or two, they haven't done too badly. A few World Cups, long time Test number one - yeah - they've been asleep at the wheel haven't they!

By the way, the selectors are employed by Cricket Australia, therefore they answer to CA. Perhaps you should talk to them.

And in response, they will tell you that the selectors just managed to pick squads that ended the summer undefeated - first time since 1948 when we beat a nation still on war rations.

Think they'll sign off by telling you to learn a little about the game before passing comment.

—

Had Mark Waugh or Gilchrist done much ODD opening before they went up top? Haven't looked, but I doubt there was too much.

—

And yes, I can blame Brad for that, as I highlight his last ODI Tour, which was in India (part of Asia - where batsmen shouldn't get credit for making runs)

Australia batting averagesPlayerMatInnsNORunsHSAveBFSR1005004s6sA Symonds (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/7702.html)761365107*73.00330110.601312712BJ Haddin (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5560.html)44120087*66.6624382.30020185ML Hayden (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5616.html)5502909258.0032988.14030356RT Ponting (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/7133.html)5511995749.7523783.96010291MJ Clarke (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4578.html)76022213037.0025886.04112183AC Gilchrist (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5390.html)77120879*34.6621497.19021255JR Hopes (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5702.html)7611363927.20113120.35000130MG Johnson (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/6033.html)7212524*25.003278.1200021B Lee (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/6278.html)764241712.0021114.2800111BJ Hodge (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5674.html)76059209.8310854.6200170NW Bracken (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4185.html)410333.001816.6600000GB Hogg (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5681.html)720000.0040.0000200SR Clark (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4582.html)3------------Australia bowling averagesPlayerMatInnsOversMdnsRunsWktsBBIAveEconSR45CtStSR Clark (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4582.html)3214.415832/1419.333.9529.30000MG Johnson (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/6033.html)7757.02260145/2618.574.5624.40110GB Hogg (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5681.html)7654.31249114/4922.634.5629.71010A Symonds (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/7702.html)7217.00780--4.58-0010JR Hopes (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5702.html)7638.0017562/4329.164.6038.00010B Lee (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/6278.html)7749.4424063/3740.004.8349.60010NW Bracken (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4185.html)4436.4319142/3047.755.2055.00010MJ Clarke (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4578.html)7314.017432/3524.665.2828.00020BJ Hodge (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5674.html)712.00180--9.00-0040AC Gilchrist (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5390.html)7-----------122BJ Haddin (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5560.html)4-----------00ML Hayden (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5616.html)5-----------20RT Ponting (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/7133.html)5-----------30

Raods? He averages 9.83 and six blokes average more than 30 but he should be in the team more?

Really? He should be in the team?

You sure?

Pretty clear he isn't in for his bowling either!

[Hoggy]

Oh, and a few years back when he was going to take full advantage of a 'rest' given to Ricky Ponting, here's how he did against an English attack featuring that Wisden non Cricketer of the Century Sajid Mahmood...

http://www.cricinfo.com/db/PICTURES/CMS/71200/71296.jpg

Case closed. Bloke is a flat track bully and isn't worthy of being mentioned in the same sentance of the words 'Australian cricketer'.

I only read that part of your rant because I wanted to see the justification for inserting one picture of Hodge being bowled.

Anyway...I looked at who else Mahmood has bowled in ODI's...

Adam Gilchrist
Sanath Jayasuriya
Mohammed Hafeez
Brian Lara


For shame Brad Hodge.

Sangakkara, Hayden, Gilchrist and Afridi have all been dismissed multiple times by Mahmood.

So my conclusion is, your placing of one instance of being outclassed by a bowler is pointless. Chris Martin could hit Dale Steyn for a 6 one day. It doesn't mean overall he is a better batsman than Steyn is a bowler. It just means in individual moments, one person can defeat another person. It's why Federer doesn't win every point in a match of tennis.

Now you say Hodge is a flat track bully as well...I believe the last three seasons is enough to judge how he has gone in the best domestic competition in the world...

Ford Ranger Cup
27 matches, 1271 runs @ 55.26, 1 50, 8 100s, HS: 139

KFC Big Bash
19 matches, 614 runs @ 36.12, 4 50s, HS: 90

I would have thought they were worthy stats.

[Ill Chicken]

Hang on, Hodge deserves credit because he goes missing when the deck does a bit but brings his bat and ball when the wicket resembles Eastlink, and consistently whinged when things do not go his way.

Needs credit for that?

Really?

Sure?

Positive.

I will cut him some slack and suggest the Victorian media is partly to blame. They look for any anti-Australian selector comment, and even ran a long campaign to get McGain into the team, then said little as his second ball in Test cricket went sailing into the grandstand en route to a 0-149. I also recall several years ago, we had to remember I-N-N-E-S-S? Where is he now?

Bracken? Well Chook, when Rudolph (28) and Kemp (32 - both far too old for cricket now I take it?), managed to hold out Australia on the last day in the afore mentioned Perth Test, they did it against an attack of McGrath (had an ok career), Brett Lee (300+ Test scalps - ordinary) Warne (perhaps you've heard of him) and...Bracken.

Perhaps Bracken got put into the same boat as Krezja - someone who was dropped for not bowling a team out in Perth. I'm not sure - I'm not a selector, but given Australia's success over the past decade or two, they haven't done too badly. A few World Cups, long time Test number one - yeah - they've been asleep at the wheel haven't they!

I'm sure what this spiel is about. Are you agreeing with the selectors being ordinary or not?

By the way, the selectors are employed by Cricket Australia, therefore they answer to CA. Perhaps you should talk to them.

They're not held accountable for their actions in the same way an umpire is, so your point is irrelevant.

And in response, they will tell you that the selectors just managed to pick squads that ended the summer undefeated - first time since 1948 when we beat a nation still on war rations.

Yes, what a marvellous effort, only took them a couple of years to realise that Doug Bollinger is key to our test success or that if you given Nathan Hauritz a run he will pay dividends instead of treating him like second rate sub-district cricketer dropping him at will. You know that thing, confidence, when you get given a few games in a row, rather than thinking every game is your last?

Think they'll sign off by telling you to learn a little about the game before passing comment.

What in the same way you know about the game by belittling players who have played two of the three highest forms of the game. Yeah nice work champ.

Had Mark Waugh or Gilchrist done much ODD opening before they went up top? Haven't looked, but I doubt there was too much.

What does this have to do with anything?


And yes, I can blame Brad for that, as I highlight his last ODI Tour, which was in India (part of Asia - where batsmen shouldn't get credit for making runs)

Australia batting averagesPlayerMatInnsNORunsHSAveBFSR1005004s6sA Symonds (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/7702.html)761365107*73.00330110.601312712BJ Haddin (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5560.html)44120087*66.6624382.30020185ML Hayden (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5616.html)5502909258.0032988.14030356RT Ponting (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/7133.html)5511995749.7523783.96010291MJ Clarke (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4578.html)76022213037.0025886.04112183AC Gilchrist (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5390.html)77120879*34.6621497.19021255JR Hopes (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5702.html)7611363927.20113120.35000130MG Johnson (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/6033.html)7212524*25.003278.1200021B Lee (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/6278.html)764241712.0021114.2800111BJ Hodge (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5674.html)76059209.8310854.6200170NW Bracken (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4185.html)410333.001816.6600000GB Hogg (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5681.html)720000.0040.0000200SR Clark (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4582.html)3------------Australia bowling averagesPlayerMatInnsOversMdnsRunsWktsBBIAveEconSR45CtStSR Clark (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4582.html)3214.415832/1419.333.9529.30000MG Johnson (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/6033.html)7757.02260145/2618.574.5624.40110GB Hogg (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5681.html)7654.31249114/4922.634.5629.71010A Symonds (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/7702.html)7217.00780--4.58-0010JR Hopes (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5702.html)7638.0017562/4329.164.6038.00010B Lee (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/6278.html)7749.4424063/3740.004.8349.60010NW Bracken (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4185.html)4436.4319142/3047.755.2055.00010MJ Clarke (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/4578.html)7314.017432/3524.665.2828.00020BJ Hodge (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5674.html)712.00180--9.00-0040AC Gilchrist (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5390.html)7-----------122BJ Haddin (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5560.html)4-----------00ML Hayden (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/5616.html)5-----------20RT Ponting (http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/content/player/7133.html)5-----------30

Raods? He averages 9.83 and six blokes average more than 30 but he should be in the team more?

Really? He should be in the team?

You sure?

Pretty clear he isn't in for his bowling either!

Quite obviously, yes, the ODI wickets in India are roads.

Where am I saying that he should be in the team now?

I saying blokes like you shouldn't be saying Brad Hodge doesn't deserve to be mentioned as an Australian Cricketer because quite rightly he does.

[Ricketts]

Ford Ranger Cup
27 matches, 1271 runs @ 55.26, 1 50, 8 100s, HS: 139

KFC Big Bash
19 matches, 614 runs @ 36.12, 4 50s, HS: 90

I would have thought they were worthy stats.

Worthy of being labeled a good Domestic cricketer, yes.

[mcglede]

Well said Ricketts.

By the way Hoggy, I would imagine most of those blokes you mentioned actually played a shot!

Here's a hint - when you're given a lifeline in the team, you do not surrender it like Hodge did that time, and with a poor series in India.

[Ill Chicken]

Get off it mcglede I've seen basically everyone in the Australian team get out not offering a shot.

[Hoggy]

Worthy of being labeled a good Domestic cricketer, yes.

That if you include a test average of over 50, proves he should have been given more opportunities at the highest level.

[Tambaran]

That if you include a test average of over 50, proves he should have been given more opportunities at the highest level.

That's what is called a statistical aberration from a small sample size.

[Ill Chicken]

That's what is called a statistical aberration from a small sample size.

And how does that indicate he shouldn't have had further opportunity?

[Ricketts]

Because he was only in the team as a short term replacement.

[Ill Chicken]

Because he was only in the team as a short term replacement.

Which he was relatively successful at, so again, the statistical abherration doesn't indicate that he shouldn't have received the opportunities considering there were several changes over the next two series Australia played in, while an older player in Martyn being re-instated, along with Jaques and Clarke not forgetting that Symonds was also a part of the side with no significant performances.

[Kim Hagdorn]

Hodge was disappointing in the Test team usually hanging his bat out to provide easy catching practice for the opposition. The guy was good at bullying state/county players but was quite poor at international levels when the heat was on and people/crowds were actually watching. He was given chances and blew it.

The Victorians need to get over their love/conspiracy theories for players from their own state.

[Ill Chicken]

Hodge was disappointing in the Test team usually hanging his bat out to provide easy catching practice for the opposition. The guy was good at bullying state/county players but was quite poor at international levels when the heat was on and people/crowds were actually watching. He was given chances and blew it.

The Victorians need to get over their love/conspiracy theories for players from their own state.

Thanks Kim, two 50's and a double ton in six test appearances, what a disgrace. Next time I need confirmation of a players worth, I'll make sure to run it past you.

[caboose]

Hodge was disappointing in the Test team usually hanging his bat out to provide easy catching practice for the opposition. The guy was good at bullying state/county players but was quite poor at international levels when the heat was on and people/crowds were actually watching. He was given chances and blew it.

The Victorians need to get over their love/conspiracy theories for players from their own state.

This is really the key point, and you're exactly right.

It's all well and good to make runs when the going is easy. But, for someone with such a vaunted reputation, Hodge simply fails way too many times on the big stage and when the going is genuinely tough.

I have honestly lost count now of how many times he has gone missing for the Vics in big games. He is worse than Collingwood in finals matches.

Another abysmal performance with both bat and ball today when the Vics were crying out for something of substance from him.

[eddiesmith]

Whilst of course we ignore all his runs in preliminary finals or basically elimination matches such as the QLD game last week...

No one since Bradman makes centuries every week, thats why no one averages near 100, you cant blame the highest scorer in the competition for not making a century in the final, put the blame on the rest of the team who continued to fail

[mcglede]

That's because runs against Gary Putland and teenage Ranga's aren't the equivalent of big game runs Eddie.

By the way - another flat deck last night at the 'G...well, it seemed to be for Tasmania. Perhaps they used another deck in the second innings or Hodgey's hamstring, which went on him last time he failed at the 'G, must have flared up again.

9.5 there it is, the big wicket the Tigers were looking for. Full outside off, drives in the air straight to cover where Cowan takes an easy catch 35/3

[Rabid Mongrel]

I very much doubt Brad Hodge will be remembered outside Victoria after he quits. Even if he is remembered, he will be remembered as nothing more than a good average player who is hopeless when it really matters. :spade:

[sammy 2]

i thought all aussie batsman were flat track bullies.the only ones lately who loved the challenge of a tough deck would be langer and steve waugh and before them border.

[Gazza_11]

I very much doubt Brad Hodge will be remembered outside Victoria after he quits. Even if he is remembered, he will be remembered as nothing more than a good average player who is hopeless when it really matters. :spade:

Good average player my ass! He's got a great reputation, and since when was he hopeless? He's played a number of crucial knocks for the Vics, and for Australia.

[Scotland]

Hodge is a fine batsman, and better than many of his generation who have played test cricket for other nations.

He's still a plonker though, and that is the reason he got less of a chance than others at international level.

[mcglede]

Good average player my ass! He's got a great reputation, and since when was he hopeless? He's played a number of crucial knocks for the Vics, and for Australia.

A number of crucial knocks for Australia? Well, if there is in fact a number it's far out and away less than his failures.

[Gazza_11]

I fail to recall his failures?

[mcglede]

Here's a hint of a failure.

Second ball against England at SCG...

http://www.cricinfo.com/db/PICTURES/CMS/71200/71296.jpg

If that is not a failure, you're either his mum or know nothing about cricket.

[Gazza_11]

6th ball actually :p

http://www.cricinfo.com/db/PICTURES/CMS/71400/71400.jpg

How about that? Came in at 3/112 and needing 179 more. The run rate was around 8at one stage, and he was there till the end, when we won with 10 balls left.

The he made 97* in New Zealand, 123* off 90 against the Dutch and was dropped. That's not fail, that's just bad luck.

No mistakes at test level either. A very good ODI strike rate, and has done well in T20Is.

Could have done better, but nothing to suggest failure.

[Selective Retention]

Brad Hodge in finals for Victoria.

Sheffield Shield

99/00 v. Queensland – 0 & DNB
00/01 v. Queensland – 47 & 3
03/04 v. Queensland – 89 & 5*
05/06 v. Queensland – 108 & 28
07/08 v. New South Wales – 84 & 0
08/09 v. Queensland – 17 & 90

Total: 471 runs @ 47.1

Ford Ranger

94/95 v. South Australia – 4 (13)
98/99 v. New South Wales – 42 (72)
07/08 v. Tasmania – 9 (17)
08/09 v. Queensland – 22 (35)
09/10 v. Tasmania – 14 (23)

Total: 91 runs @ 18.2

Twenty 20

05/06 v. New South Wales – 106 (54)
06/07 v. Tasmania – 13 (8)
07/08 v. Western Australia – 23 (17)
09/10 v. South Australia – 9 (16)

Total: 151 runs @ 37.75

Match winning knock in the 05/06 T20 final but aside from that hardly earth shattering stuff, especially as the only ton in the shield came on a pitch where Queensland racked up 900.

[mcglede]

Hence why I suggest he only makes runs on a flat deck Selective Retention.

Gazza's right though, it was sixth ball in Sydney. Of course, I'm sure Gazza will turn around and admit his error as Hodge was bowled by Peter Borren in his 123...where Australia racked up 358 on what I'm guessing was hardly a dodgy deck.

His 97 in New Zealand was out of 336, so hardly a dodgy deck there (New Zealand got 340 to win in reply) and his 99 in Melbourne was made coming in when the RRReq was around 6.62 instead of 8 (that's just overinflation). He came in at 5 with the field out and Vettori and Styris on. Ponting (who made a hundred in the innings) came out with the field up and the quicks on.

In all, he made 9 scores of less than 5 in 21 ODI innings. In a full series in India, he averaged less than 10. And thanks for coming...don't shut the door on your way out!

T20 wise he made a couple of 30s early (one a 35 not out where he in turn gave 20 of them back in two overs of bowling (and we wonder why we lost to Zimbabwe), but didn't set the world on fire in his last three knocks.

Why are we talking about a crybaby in his mid-30s though? Let's try someone like George Bailey, who made 500+ FRC runs, is 27 and is a bloke who doesn't whinge.

[Ill Chicken]

Basically the barometer is that if Hodge doesn't make any runs, it is an unplayable pitch. So who ever makes runs on these wickets should be held in super high regard.

[Gazza_11]

Damn, I had a feeling you were gonna exploit all the weaknesses in my arguments :p

Especially the flat track ones :S

And what I said was, at one stage the run rate got up to about 7.8-8. IIRC.

But yeah, I'm not endorsing Brad Hodge for the national team at this age,was just trying to point out he's not too hopeless.

[dr nick]

Thanks Kim, two 50's and a double ton in six test appearances, what a disgrace. Next time I need confirmation of a players worth, I'll make sure to run it past you.

and this is the dreamland most Victorians live in.

A real Jacques Kallis innings. He got that helping South Africa secure the draw on a very placid Perth deck, when Ricky Ponting batted far too long in the 3rd innings with the only purpose of helping Hodge over the line. Never played a match winning innings and wilted when any bowling was directed at the body and stumps was approaching.

Also got his only ODI 100 vs the Netherlands, which was subsequently followed with 0, 3, 3, 17, 20, 16 before he was given the long overdue arse and cue his jilted mother.

As someone said, will be remembered as a solid state player and nothing more, and gets far more bigfooty threads than his career performances would warrant.

[Gazza_11]

Us Vics will be Vics.

[eddiesmith]

Has anyone ever considered that if Hodge didnt make 200* that Australia might have actually lost that test?

[Gazza_11]

Taking out about 100 runs, the Saffers would still need 390 odd, in not too much more time.

And credit to Hodge, it only took him 35 odd overs to make his second lot of 100 runs, which is pretty quick time.

[dr nick]

Has anyone ever considered that if Hodge didnt make 200* that Australia might have actually lost that test?

yes, and I think his attidude is summed up when he says that match was his 'coup de gras'

None of this... "that match where the boys got over the line in Sydney to secure the world #1 ranking and win the series"

His Australian teammates would remember him as a selfish player, and the Matthew Elliott syndrome / persecution complex didnt do him any good.

[Kim Hagdorn]

Next time I need confirmation of a players worth, I'll make sure to run it past you.

No worries, always happy to help people learn about the game.

[eddiesmith]

Taking out about 100 runs, the Saffers would still need 390 odd, in not too much more time.

And credit to Hodge, it only took him 35 odd overs to make his second lot of 100 runs, which is pretty quick time.

Which is what most people seem to forget, there is one argument around he was very slow and batted for himself to get to the 200

yes, and I think his attidude is summed up when he says that match was his 'coup de gras'

None of this... "that match where the boys got over the line in Sydney to secure the world #1 ranking and win the series"

His Australian teammates would remember him as a selfish player, and the Matthew Elliott syndrome / persecution complex didnt do him any good.

Elliott did the worst thing a player could do, upset the captain off the field, but thats alright, in the end it allowed one of the greatest opening duos to be put together

As for Hodgey, how many players are going to nominate a match that basically ended their career as 1 dismissal gave the selectors the excuse they were looking for

Anyway the Hodge saga has atleast added some entertainment to the often predictable Aussie selection, hopefully when everyone retires and books are written the full truth about some of these will finally come out

[Ill Chicken]

and this is the dreamland most Victorians live in.


I'm not Victorian nor do I support them.

A real Jacques Kallis innings.

He batted at a strike-rate of 61. How many other players batted at over sixty for the test in the top six?

He got that helping South Africa secure the draw on a very placid Perth deck, when Ricky Ponting batted far too long in the 3rd innings with the only purpose of helping Hodge over the line.

Punters fault entirely. They faced 129 overs for a draw, chasing 491 for victory, which is less than 4 an over. Declaring twenty or 30 overs earlier would have meant a score of 430 at most being chased with 150 overs to get them at less than 3 an over.

Never played a match winning innings and wilted when any bowling was directed at the body and stumps was approaching.

I'm surprised he had the career he did. Usually if you've got a problem with people bowling at the stumps, well, you don't make it past juniors unless you can bowl.

Also got his only ODI 100 vs the Netherlands, which was subsequently followed with 0, 3, 3, 17, 20, 16 before he was given the long overdue arse and cue his jilted mother.

It would be impossible for me to find a succession of failures from a player in the current ODI side.

As someone said, will be remembered as a solid state player and nothing more, and gets far more bigfooty threads than his career performances would warrant.

Has had a great sustained first class career, regardless of whether international expectations were met.

[eddiesmith]

This argument will go nowhere, after all these years no one will change their mind, so lets play some trivia, who can recognise these numbers?

14, 13, 18, 2, 60, 9, 16
0, 6, 0, 0, 11
11, 12

[usalion]

This argument will go nowhere, after all these years no one will change their mind, so lets play some trivia, who can recognise these numbers?

14, 13, 18, 2, 60, 9, 16
0, 6, 0, 0, 11
11, 12

Well, I was betting it was your hero Roy's innings in Tests at some point, or maybe in ODIs....but a check of HowStat put paid to that....

I'll still put money on it being the stats for one of the Retirement Home XI that did your mob so much in the late 90s and early 2000s....

Good to have you back, mate!

[eddiesmith]

Not a QLDer

Each line is a different series but all played in the same country

[Cousin Jed]

R.T.Ponting in India...

[Gazza_11]

Nah, Punter ended up with a ton.

ODIs or Tests?

[eddiesmith]

It is Ponting, his first 14 Test innings in India, it goes to show anyone can have a bad record in a country, doesnt mean they are no good. Obviously his 15th was a century so he eventually improved it, but you cant really point to 1 series and say the player is no good

[Gazza_11]

Yeah, you're right. I thought it would be all the knocks of one player.

0, 6, 0, 0, 11
11, 12

I should have got it from these two lines. The first line is the 17 runs he made in 2001, and the second line are the two innings he played in the last game of the 2004 series, after missing the first three tests where Gilly led us to victory.

[mcglede]

Comparing Hodge to Ponting?

That's a reach.

[Gazza_11]

Similar players, such different stories.

[mcglede]

Well they are right handers and male and play cricket. That's about where the similarities end.

Keep in mind those scores of Ponting were made when he was 27. Hodge was mid-30s and his series was make or break.

He broke.

In finals he often choke.

I'm glad I bought shares in Kleenex recently - the amount of tears being shed by Hodge fans is putting my kids through university!!

[Gazza_11]

Similar playing styles? Attacking number three batsmen, best ones in their team?

[Ricketts]

best ones in their team?

Difference is Hodge's team is Domestic.

[Ill Chicken]

Difference is Hodge's team is Domestic.

Is that same teams where they performed badly?

[Kim Hagdorn]

Is that same teams where they performed badly?

And for the English speakers among us?

[Ill Chicken]

I got no idea, I was blind.

[mcglede]

Of course you were - that's why you think the sun shines out of Hodge's rear.

Lo and behold, George Bailey gets a call-up. Selectors = :thumbsu: