Votes v Hawthorn [Archive]

Leaping Lindner

7 Jun 2003, 18:50

Originally posted by topjars
BOG

5 Hart
4 Massie
3 McGregor
2 Bickley
1 Edwards

TTM

3 Hart
2 Biglands
1 Begley

ROTY

3 Pass
2 Pass
1 Mattner

I hate losing:rolleyes:

Hard to tell no real standouts for me TJ. Ladhams looked set for a blinder and Welsh the same.Both then faded in and out. Your top 5 is probably as good as any on the ground. Thought Begley was pretty ordinary though (he actually looked like he has a virus or something) especially after the form he has shown lately.
If I see that clown Mattner in a Crows jumper ever again there is going to be two deaths! Mattner and the idiot that keeps picking him:mad:

dyertribe

7 Jun 2003, 19:01

How much are we missing Stevo and Bode?!! Urgh. This game was built for young Krusty - he would've been invaluable in these conditions as he's the only true in-and-under on-baller we have.

MOM:

5: Bassett - Had a stormer down back.
4: Massie - Another great game from the Swede.
3: McGregor - Yup... shoosh Stiffy ;)
2: Hart - Played well
1: Gallagher - Thought he ran and tried hard all day.

BTM:

3: Bassett - Tried his heart out and got nothing.
2: Biggles - Busted a gut with no Clarke or Marsh to help him out against one of the best ruckmen in the comp.
1: Kenny Mac - Asked to do a job at both ends of the ground and did it well.

Rookie:

Sorry Marty, but you're playing garbage. Pull your finger out or head off to Centrelink.

Stiffy_18

7 Jun 2003, 20:14

Best on Ground

5 - Sam Mitchell (What a great player. Love those types)
4 - Shane Crawford (Captains effort)
3 - Joel Smith (Ripper of a game)
2 - Spider Everitt (Dominated Ruck all day)
1 - Richard Vanderburg (Sensational Acceleration)

Nah honestly I reckon we didn't have a player in top 5 today. Good effort to guts itr our but fair dinkum Darren Goldspink has to be dropped next week. His decisions in the last 5-6 minutes cost us big time. He needs a brain transplant.

Here are my votes for this week

Best on Ground

5 - Ben Hart (I tought he played really well. Did a good job on Rawlings and provided plenty of rebound from the back lines. Where are you blighty??????:rolleyes: )
4 - Kris Massie (His last 3 weeks have been extremely good. Provided plenty of run and fought his guts out on the field)
3 - Ken McGregor (I thought he was sensational at both ends of the ground. He kept Holland quite and then when moved up forward, provided a target, tooks some good marks and kicked 3 goals)
2 - Chris Ladhams (He started really well and looked dangerous majority of the game. Kicked a couple and set a couple up. Had he kickd straighter he could have had 4 goals)
1 - James Begley (Couldn't give it to McLeod despite 25 touches as he burned the ball half of the time. Begley was solid without being spectacular)

Best Team Man
3 - Ben Hart (The number of times he saved our arses to day was unbelieveable)
2 - Ken McGregor (He was great. Worked his backside off all day long)
1 - Kris Massie (If he continues on like this I'll have to give him a nickname "Rock")

Rookie

None

I have lost patience with Mattner. His holding the ball in the centre square at crutial time was just pathetic. He has to get dropped. He is just playing dumb footy.

Credit where credit is due. Hawks played well and definetly wanted it more. Their tackling was the best I have seen from a team this year. They were great and probably deserved to win by a greater margin.

I just get so frustrated with our tendancy to underestimate our opposition. I never thought I would say this but loosing Marsh before half time was a big loss:(

Stiffy_18

7 Jun 2003, 20:16

Originally posted by dyertribe
3: McGregor - Yup... shoosh Stiffy ;) My lips are sealed;)

macca23

7 Jun 2003, 20:19

Best on Ground

5 - Kris Massie (Gave his all, and hardly put a foot wrong. Excellent game)
4 - Ken McGregor (Performed well at CHB and then kicked 3 up at CHF)
3 - Ben Hart (Excellent game in defense in getting the ball but burnt it at times. )
2 - Nathan Bassett (not pretty to watch but worked his arse off)
1 - Andrew McLeod (played in fits and starts but was easily the best of the mid-fielders.)

Best Team Man

3 - Ken McGregor (see above)
2 - Kris Massie (see above)
1 - Nathan Bassett(see above)

Rookie

None.

Normally our best 5 are dominated by on-ballers but not today. Macca was the best of these although I think he ultimately cost us the game by his indecisiveness at the 7 minute to go mark when trying to be clever inside their forward 50, lost the ball and Hawthorn got the goal which gave them momentum.

Goody's injury hurt us badly. Marsh was doing fairly in ruck but was hopeless around the ground until injured and got far too much game time before injured.

If Mattner can't kick a goal from15 metres out, then he can't be taken seriously as an AFL player

And the umpires - enough said. CHEATS!!

iceman21

8 Jun 2003, 01:01

Best On Ground

5 ... Massie - Just kept on trying , never say die attitude
4 ... McGregor - Has really stepped up this year, has rarely been beaten down back and today was no exeption then shifted up forward and also did well
3 ... Benny Hart - started to get a bit of run back into his game
2 ... Bassett - solid game
1 ... Ladhams - looked dangerous all game

Best Team Man

3 ... Kenny McGregor - see above
2 ... Rhett Biglands - tried hard all day
1 ... Kris Massie - see above

Rookie

No Vote this week, but Mattner was stiff to get that holding the ball against him........what happened to prior oppourtunity?

DaveW

8 Jun 2003, 01:54

I agree with LL. We really didn't have any stand-outs. Hart was good all day. I thought Biglands was very good considering he was required to do so much - in the ruck and up forward.

So here goes...

BOG
5. Hart (superb in his rebound out of defence and also did some good things moving up the ground)
4. Biglands (as above, a lot was asked of him and did well)
3. Massie (like Hart did a good job cleaning up down back)
2. McGregor (was our best forward, also good in defence)
1. Ricciuto (our best midfielder)

BTM
3. Biglands
2. Bassett (did well considering how much Hawthorn delivery there was to the forward line)
1. Perrie (wasn't so good up forward but he tried, I thought he did well in defence later in the game)

That second quarter was atrocious. Everytime we kicked out from full back we kept breaking down at half-back or the centre of the ground allowing Hawthorn to pump the ball back forward again. :mad:

RaDaR ReiLLy

8 Jun 2003, 13:30

Here are my votes this week. Very dissapointing.

BOG
5- K. McGregor
4- K.Massie
3- B.Hart
2-N.Basset
1-C.Ladhams

BTM
3-K.McGregor
2- K.Massie
1- B.Hart

ROTY
Abstain. Mattner didnt do enough to warrant a vote from me this week. He missed a crucial goal in the last quarter that he should've got. I think its time he went back to Sturt to get some confidence- but dont bag the poor bloke yet, and dont say you wanna kill him either!!!! :(

bluecrow

8 Jun 2003, 14:01

BOG
5- Kenny!!
4- Massie
3- B.Hart
2- Edwards
1- Begley :D

BTM
3- Kenny
2- Massie
1- Begley

ROTY
2 - Mattner. - I thought Marty tried really hard all day, more so than others. That holding the ball in the last quarter was a complete crock. Would have given him 3, but for the goal he missed.

sapaul

8 Jun 2003, 16:52

POTY

5-Massie
4-McGregor
3-Ladhams
2-Hart
1-Bassett

TTM

3-Massie
2-Bassett
1-Hart

Rookie

-

topjars

8 Jun 2003, 18:17

I know McLeod is a champion player but how he got amongst the best players ( in the print media ) in the last two weeks escapes me.:rolleyes:

Stiffy_18

8 Jun 2003, 18:32

Originally posted by topjars
I know McLeod is a champion player but how he got amongst the best players ( in the print media ) in the last two weeks escapes me.:rolleyes: How he got in this week is beyond me. He got 25 touvhes but half of those were turnovers and 5-6 were costly ones. He burned the ball like Gags on a very bad day.:(

DaveW

8 Jun 2003, 18:43

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
How he got in this week is beyond me. He got 25 touvhes but half of those were turnovers and 5-6 were costly ones. He burned the ball like Gags on a very bad day.:( Agreed. In terms of mistakes McLeod had one of his worst days for a long time. It really wasn't the McLeod we know - i.e. even if he has 20 touches, they're 20 quality touches. Not yesterday. I recall some errant kicks and handballs. And that grubber kick under pressure in defensive fifty that allowed Hawthorn to kick their last goal (? or one of the late goals anyway) killed us.

dyertribe

8 Jun 2003, 20:18

Originally posted by DaveW
Agreed. In terms of mistakes McLeod had one of his worst days for a long time. It really wasn't the McLeod we know - i.e. even if he has 20 touches, they're 20 quality touches. Not yesterday. I recall some errant kicks and handballs. And that grubber kick under pressure in defensive fifty that allowed Hawthorn to kick their last goal (? or one of the late goals anyway) killed us.

Do you reckon it was the conditions or simply Hawthorn pressure - or a bit of both?

DaveW

8 Jun 2003, 20:21

Originally posted by dyertribe
Do you reckon it was the conditions or simply Hawthorn pressure - or a bit of both? I don't know about the conditions - it was pretty slipperly last week and McLeod used the ball well when he got it. Maybe it was Hawthorn's pressue, maybe it was just a rare off day.

macca23

8 Jun 2003, 21:26

I put Macca as my 5th best even though he did make mistakes.

Our mid-fielders disposals were

McLeod 25

Bickley 15

Doughty 11

Gallagher 12

Ladhams 15

Riciutto 19

Do you honestly think that the other mid-fielders who had a lot less of the ball than Macca didn't burn the ball either. Well, IMO if you really think that you had better watch the replay gain, because they did.

He might not be playing at his very best, but when you work out a player's value to the team on a day it should be compared with the performance of others, not what they could have theoretically done.

Harsh call on Macca guys, harsh call. :(

Nige_Bix

9 Jun 2003, 00:49

BoG
5. Hart
4. Massie
3. McGregor
2. Bassett
1. Ladhams

TM
3. Hart
2. Massie
1. McGregor

R
0. Mattner

DaveW

9 Jun 2003, 00:54

Originally posted by macca23
Do you honestly think that the other mid-fielders who had a lot less of the ball than Macca didn't burn the ball either. Well, IMO if you really think that you had better watch the replay gain, because they did. McLeod got plenty of the ball but he just didn't use it as well as he normally does. Perhaps I'm judging him by his own high standards. I thought Ricciuto was our best midfielder, I felt he was more damaging. But neither were standouts. McLeod just made too many mistakes for my liking, from the player I least expect to make them.

Sezza_20

9 Jun 2003, 14:27

A frustrating game that we were close to winning despite the fact hawthorn had the better players on the ground. No crows players really dominated.

POTY:
5 - Ken McGregor
4 - Ben Hart
3 - Kris Massie
2 - Chris Ladhams
1 - Nathan Bassett

mcLeod played well but I refuse to give him votes for the costly things he did in the last quater.

BTM:
3 - Kris Massie
2 - Rhett Biglands
1 - Ian Perrie for playing in defence

ROOKIE:
0 - Sorry Marty, you disappointed again this week. Crawf was just about BOG where were you??? And that shot at goal.....hmmm.

AngelEyes

9 Jun 2003, 14:42

Originally posted by topjars
I know McLeod is a champion player but how he got amongst the best players ( in the print media ) in the last two weeks escapes me.:rolleyes:

SIMPLE: reputation.

Kane McGoodwin

9 Jun 2003, 18:36

Will tally the final results Wednesday night, given today is a public holiday.

11 Voters

Best on Ground
45 Massie (5)
41 McGregor (4)
40 Hart (3)
15 Bassett (2)
10 Ladhams (1)
4 Biglands
3 Edwards
2 Begley
2 Bickley
1 Gallagher
1 Ricciuto
1 McLeod
165 Total

Best Team Man
16 Massie (3)
16 McGregor (3)
11 Hart (1)
11 Biglands (1)
8 Bassett
2 Begley
2 Perrie
66 Total

Best Rookie
2 Mattner
9 Abstained (1)
11 Total

DaveW

9 Jun 2003, 18:39

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
Best on Ground
45 Massie (5)
41 McGregor (4)
40 Hart (3)

Best Team Man
16 Massie (3)
16 McGregor (2)
11 Hart (1)
11 Biglands
Mmm... it's tight at the top. The remaining votes will make a big difference.

Surely the BTM is 3, 3, 1, 1 as opposed to 3, 2, 1, 0?

Kane McGoodwin

9 Jun 2003, 18:41

Well I have pondered over my votes after spending a few days relaxing at the Coorong...

BOG
5. McGregor
4. Massie
3. Hart
2. Bassett
1. Ladhams

BTM
3. Massie
2. McGregor
1. Hart

BR
As I have been saying for weeks, we are doing Marty no favours playing him at AFC whilst he is in this form. Time to return to Sturt.

Kane McGoodwin

9 Jun 2003, 18:44

Originally posted by DaveW
Mmm... it's tight at the top. The remaining votes will make a big difference.

Surely the BTM is 3, 3, 1, 1 as opposed to 3, 2, 1, 0? Yeah Dave, picked it up just as I was posting my votes. All fixed now.

DaveW

9 Jun 2003, 18:51

It's ironic that McGregor is polling so well, he arguably lost us the game. He missed a vital set shot in the last quarter which would've put us two and a half goals ahead. That would've been a most handy lead at that stage.

And he definately should've gone the torp with seconds to go (nah, just kidding he did the right thing by kicking it to the goal square ;)).

Anyway, I'm not bagging him - he kicked two important goals in the last term and provided a target. I'm just mulling over missed opportunities. :(

ant

9 Jun 2003, 18:52

BOG

5 McGregor
4 Massie
3 Hart
2 Bassett
1 McLeod

TTM

3 Hart
2 Massie
1 Biglands

Rookie

-

Agree totally with macca23, some guys are very harsh on macca, I thought he really lifted, especially in that last quarter. He worked very hard to get us over the line and despite a couple of errors, was a key factor in us staying in it up until the last few seconds. Continually gets closely tagged and scragged so to get 25 possies and be our best midfielder (which admittedly wasn't that hard) is worthy of getting listed in our best. If only some others could take his lead.

Of course, our whole midfield group deserves a massive kick up the backside for its performance for about 3 and a half quarters on Saturday, no surprise it's the backmen and a couple of forwards that have been getting the plaudits.

Easily our worst performance of the season.

And in further news, next week we again play a team on the ropes, down on confidence, that will be hammered in the press. Just our luck.

Any danger we could play a side in good form for once? ;)

Kane McGoodwin

9 Jun 2003, 18:56

Originally posted by DaveW
It's ironic that McGregor is polling so well, he arguably lost us the game. He missed a vital set shot in the last quarter which would've put us two and a half goals ahead. That would've been a most handy lead at that stage.

And he definately should've gone the torp with seconds to go (nah, just kidding he did the right thing by kicking it to the goal square ;)).

Anyway, I'm not bagging him - he kicked two important goals in the last term and provided a target. I'm just mulling over missed opportunities. :( Geez, your harsh Dave. McGregor got us back in the game (for all of those of you who bagged him as a key forward ;) ). Who would we give our votes to, if you couldn't give it to someone who stuffed up at some stage? Better to give the votes to someonw who had a crack (& made a few mistakes) than someone who didn't appear to give 100% (or faded in & out of the game)!

DaveW

9 Jun 2003, 18:58

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
Geez, your harsh Dave. McGregor got us back in the game (for all of those of you who bagged him as a key forward ;) ). Who would we give our votes to, if you couldn't give it to someone who stuffed up at some stage? Better to give the votes to someonw who had a crack (& made a few mistakes) than someone who didn't appear to give 100% (or faded in & out of the game)! Yeah like I said I wasn't actually bagging him, he was one of our best. But geeeeeez, it would've been handy if he'd nailed that shot to give us a two and a half goal lead.

footychick

9 Jun 2003, 19:07

BOG
5- Hart
4- Massie
3- McGregor
2- Edwards
1- Biglands

TTM
3- Biglands
2- McGregor
1- Basset

ROOKIE
none again this week from me.... wasn't impressed with Mattners game... :mad: :(

Blues_Girl

9 Jun 2003, 20:38

Originally posted by bluecrow
2 - Mattner. - I thought Marty tried really hard all day, more so than others. That holding the ball in the last quarter was a complete crock. Would have given him 3, but for the goal he missed.

*YAY* At last someone agrees with me! I didn't think Marty played any worse than some of the other players. If nothing else he's consitantly trying (although it doesnt come off), it's more than some are doing.

When's Gary gonna learn that he is NOT a tagger and shouldn't be played in that role. He's going to continue to get beaten until Gary moves him back to where he belongs.

Blues_Girl

9 Jun 2003, 20:47

Best on Ground

5. Ben Hart
4. Kris Massie
3. Ken McGregor
2. Chris Ladhams
1. James Begley

Best Team Man
3. Ben Hart
2. Ken McGregor
1. Kris Massie

Rookie
1. Marty Mattner

noddy

9 Jun 2003, 20:52

Bit late with my votes but just got back from Melbourne,

my once a year pilgrimage to the gee has not been very enjoyable these last 3 years think i might change it to the dome next year & se if that works,:(

BoG

5 = K Massie
4 = B Hart
3 = N Bassett
2 = K McGregor
1 = C Ladhams

BTM

3 = B Hart
2 = M Bickley
1 = A McLeod

Rookie
zilch

Jars458

10 Jun 2003, 11:28

5 - McGregor
4 - Massie
3 - Hart
2- Ladhams
1- Gallagher

BTM

3 Massie
2 Bassett
1 Welsh

Rookie

ROFLMAO. As if we have one.

Kane McGoodwin

11 Jun 2003, 19:28

17 Voters

Best on Ground
70 Massie (5)
64 McGregor (4)
63 Hart (3)
22 Bassett (2)
16 Ladhams (1)
5 Biglands
5 Edwards
3 Begley
2 Bickley
2 Gallagher
2 McLeod
1 Ricciuto
255 Total

Best Team Man
25 Massie (3)
22 McGregor (2)
21 Hart (1)
15 Biglands
11 Bassett
2 Bickley
2 Begley
2 Perrie
1 Welsh
1 McLeod
102 Total

Best Rookie
3 Mattner
14 Abstained (1)
17 Total

DaveW

11 Jun 2003, 19:29

Hmmm, so Biglands didn't get a vote for either category. Rough. :(

Kane McGoodwin

11 Jun 2003, 19:33

Originally posted by DaveW
Hmmm, so Biglands didn't get a vote for either category. Rough. :(
Sure he tried hard, but Everitt had more influence IMO.

Jars458

11 Jun 2003, 19:34

Originally posted by DaveW
Hmmm, so Biglands didn't get a vote for either category. Rough. :(

Why?

He took two marks in the first two mintues, finished with two marks.

Hardly touched the ball after the that.

We were well beaten in the clearances.

What did he actually do to deserve votes?

DaveW

11 Jun 2003, 19:43

Biglands was required to do most of the ruckwork with Clarke out and Marsh injured during the game. He was also required to play a role in the forward line when not rucking. He had a lot more gametime than usual and I thought he did reasonably well.

bfg

11 Jun 2003, 20:06

"If I see that clown Mattner in a Crows jumper ever again there is going to be two deaths! Mattner and the idiot that keeps picking him"

I couldn't agree more with this comment. The guy is crap, the only thing he can do is tackle, it takes a lot more to be able to play football. If he was in front of me when he missed that goal on saturday i serioulsy would have strangled him. He needs at least another 2 years in sanfl.

Unfortunately we have to put these crap guys on the field with our injury list, but I dont understand why Gallagher was taken off the field? Was he injured? He was an absolute ball magnet in the first half, and it beats me why a guy like doughty always gets chosen ahead of gags. Gags is underrated.

I think the guy we were missing the most on saturday was Clarke. I cant beleive how many injuries we have at the moment, it's ludicrous.

Stiffy_18

11 Jun 2003, 20:41

Originally posted by bfg
...it beats me why a guy like doughty always gets chosen ahead of gags. Because he is a better footballer at this stage where he uses the ball a lot better than Gags, is a better mark and as a result a better linkman and is not only a receiver like Gags. Gags is a good prospect but he has a long way to go to get Doughty's spot.;)

dyertribe

11 Jun 2003, 20:50

I'm rapt that Fred Bassett is amongst the votes...

Wasn't flashy (what's new) but he had both hands, feet and every other appendage to the pump for 120 minutes on Saturday.

ant

11 Jun 2003, 21:00

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Because he is a better footballer at this stage where he uses the ball a lot better than Gags, is a better mark and as a result a better linkman and is not only a receiver like Gags. Gags is a good prospect but he has a long way to go to get Doughty's spot.;)

I don't know.....IMO the only reason Doughty is a better player is because of his body. He's bigger, doesn't get pushed off the ball so much, can take a mark. Gags is more of a footy player to me, smarter, better pace, generally skillful (hasn't shown it much recently mind you) and with a footy brain.

Doughty has a slow footy brain IMO, doesn't make a quick decision well, his skills leave a lot to be desired when under pressure (very similar to Gags, but even more so IMO) and while Gags is a receiver because of his size, Doughty is a receiver with a body that should be getting more hard ball, again IMO.

Not many will agree with me, but I don't see much difference between the two, except for their physical build. And that's why Doughty will get a game ahead, and maybe rightly so, because he has size, can take a grab, mind a small to medium sized player and put pressure and tackle with greater efficiency than Gags.

Kane McGoodwin

11 Jun 2003, 21:06

Dogga & Gags are different types of players in that they both have different attributes, as already discussed. I reckon both have played OK lately & should both start on the ground this week.

macca23

11 Jun 2003, 23:25

Originally posted by ant

Not many will agree with me, but I don't see much difference between the two, except for their physical build. And that's why Doughty will get a game ahead, and maybe rightly so, because he has size, can take a grab, mind a small to medium sized player and put pressure and tackle with greater efficiency than Gags.

I think you half destroyed your own argument ant, as I think you've described perfectly why Doughty should be chosen ahead of Gallagher. ;)

ant

11 Jun 2003, 23:34

Originally posted by macca23
I think you half destroyed your own argument ant, as I think you've described perfectly why Doughty should be chosen ahead of Gallagher. ;)

No, well, I agreed with Stiffy, I just don't think he's miles ahead, or a much better player. He's simply got a better body, (sadly for Gags, as I'd rather him in) and I'm sure the girls on this site will agree ;)

Jars458

12 Jun 2003, 16:25