View Full Version : Mark Williams signed to Essendon
Slattery_20
12 Aug 2010, 11:09
Just wanna get your thoughts on whether Mark "shotgun" Williams has been a successful signing.
Was pretty good on Scarlett, good v Carlton, didn't get a touch the other two he played and picked up an injury at some point.
Is it too early to judge the success of his signing?
What did you think this thread was?
Ludwig van Bertstare
12 Aug 2010, 11:13
Given what we gave up for him and how he has performed this season, it isn't a success. However, that could change in the next year.
DapperDon
12 Aug 2010, 11:13
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ9ch6yeJSMSB9Eqqv5nl2p0H0ntk-rxCFj4NDGuXT1WdNho6M&t=1&usg=__DSM3IYdqnNKpevhXnld1mFJ9SWQ=
centurion
12 Aug 2010, 11:15
At this point in time, it has been a massive failure by the club. But lets see what happens next year.
New Essendon mantra - this club is only big enough for one Mark Williams.
Vote one off the island and the other on.
StealthBomber
12 Aug 2010, 11:17
Too early to tell.
I will say that we offered him too much though, could we have lured him over with less? Hindsight is a wonderfull thing aint it!!??
Being injury free and a proper run next year (give him about 3-5 games) will tell the real story.
NB. Our midfielders NEED to deliver the ball better into the F50 to give all our forwards better marking opportunities.
Slattery_20
12 Aug 2010, 11:21
I'm pretty sure he's still our highest goal-kicker per game this year. Maybe Hardingham passed him.
Not a complete failure yet; if we could get 30 decent games out of him I think the downgrade of what... 8 picks... is worthwhile.
Ben the Gooner
12 Aug 2010, 11:29
Not making a judgement until at least the end of next year.
jonesy86
12 Aug 2010, 11:36
how many years did he sign for?
there was a rumour going around that he will 'retire' at the end of the season
Slattery_20
12 Aug 2010, 11:38
3.
I'd be surprised if he pulled the pin. His bad injuries in the past have been knees, he's had an ankle this year, which was operated on a few weeks back. If it were a re-occurence of the knee, it'd be worrying.
rhysman
12 Aug 2010, 12:25
Will be viewed comparably to Cole, Alvey, Zantuck, Allan, Camporeale in terms of recruiting decisions made by the EFC. An absolute disaster. We could have Bastinac playing for us!!
Eleven 38
12 Aug 2010, 12:38
too early
Slattery_20
12 Aug 2010, 12:38
I didn't rate Bastinac that highly, thought little Trav shaded him the other week.
bombermick
12 Aug 2010, 13:02
So will Shotgun turn to Choco in the Essendon box and give him the choke signal after a goal?
bombermick
12 Aug 2010, 13:05
We'll have to wait until the end of next year before making a judgement. If Willo can stay fit and kick 30-40 goals, along with a similar ouput from Hardingham then the forward line starts to look dangerous. Atm having Bastinac sounds good but you can't judge a trade after a single season. Colyer looks at least as good as Bastinac but having both would of course better.
The player himself hasn't been successful, but the switching around of draft picks makes a verdict on overall trade hard to decide.
So far it's been a mistake but that's mostly been due to injury. With Hardingham and Monfries as our leading small forwards we may not need him at all next year though.
bombermick
12 Aug 2010, 13:14
Hardingham, Monfries and Williams are all very different players. There is plenty of room for all them if they're good enough.
Hardingham, Monfries and Williams are all very different players. There is plenty of room for all them if they're good enough.
Yes that probably wasn't the best example, but there's a lot of players that can fit into small forward roles and it might come down to giving experience to the youth vs playing experienced players and we know that Knights tends to favour youth in those situations.
yodellinhank
12 Aug 2010, 14:10
We'll have to wait until the end of next year before making a judgement. If Willo can stay fit and kick 30-40 goals, along with a similar ouput from Hardingham then the forward line starts to look dangerous. Atm having Bastinac sounds good but you can't judge a trade after a single season. Colyer looks at least as good as Bastinac but having both would of course better.
Could have been both but no Carlisle. So we wait and see, if Carlisle makes something of himself, could be a clear win.
The other thing is, lets give our forward line a bit of time as a group, as I've said before: if Gumby can start getting more of the ball, it may open a spot for a 10-15 possession a game goal kicker in Williams.
****ing arsehole had me with the title
It has been a massive failure
He has suffered injury riddled seasons 3 years in the last 4.
I want to trade him out but I doubt there will be any takers.
Donakebab
12 Aug 2010, 21:26
****ing arsehole had me with the title
Glad I'm not the only one.
Storyboy
12 Aug 2010, 21:44
In all seriousness I think this has been a disapointment so far, but by no means a failure yet. A stellar year next year still makes it a win, with something less a break even.
If we are somparing to the other trades last year you would have to say that it has been less successful than Ball, Hall, Burgoyne or even Fev, but a tremendous leap forward over the catasrophic failure that was Lovett (regardless of the court case).
So all things considered, it could have been worse. And he at least has next year and the year after to deliver on his undoubted promise.
Obviously the thinking was - get a agile forward line to suit our fast paced game style in the absence of Lloyd and Lucas.
What wasn;t taken into account was that Neagle and Gumbelton could both play and slow our forward line down and that without Lovett our midfield lacked line breakers and the pace to get the ball moving quickly.
In hindsight it's a huge concern that our list mangement failed to see this.
I'm a fan of Williams and thought in the GF he was one of Hawthorns best but it's a question of what was going to be the benfit of recruiting him for three years.
Slattery_20
13 Aug 2010, 08:20
Obviously the thinking was - get a agile forward line to suit our fast paced game style in the absence of Lloyd and Lucas.
What wasn;t taken into account was that Neagle and Gumbelton could both play and slow our forward line down and that without Lovett our midfield lacked line breakers and the pace to get the ball moving quickly.
In hindsight it's a huge concern that our list mangement failed to see this.
I'm a fan of Williams and thought in the GF he was one of Hawthorns best but it's a question of what was going to be the benfit of recruiting him for three years.
At the time Williams signed, those two had played a total of about 20 games over 3 years, they were hardly set in stone.
I think what Williams may add, which we still apparently have no clue about, is that if he's on a good lead he'll want it honoured. Whereas a Gumby or Neagle are still feeling their ways through league football & may not make much of a noise about it. Even tho he wasn't a huge goalkicker for the Hawks in 08, his leads often took a good mid-sized defender out of the path of Buddy or Roughie.
We saw that agaisnt Geelong, he was dragging Scarlett way up the wing, he wouldn't pay Monfries or Hardingham that much respect. In turn that created a bit of space for Gumby (who was, unfortunately, rusty as a farm gate) & Neagle... don't play on.
I think there's a spot for him, if he can still demand that kind of respect. He can still carve up spud defences, even if he won't kick huge bags on a great full-back.
The House
13 Aug 2010, 13:27
Essentially we traded pick 16, that was used on McMillan-Pittard, for Mark Williams and Jake Carlisle (correct me if i'm wrong by all means).
Despite Williams having a bad year with injuries, i'm constantly puzzled by the claim that it was a bad trade.
Carlisle looks pretty darn good at this early stage from what i've seen, and i wouldn't be unhappy getting him at 16 without Mark Williams.
Obviously time will tell how good he and McMillan-Pittard turn out, but even if Carlisle turns out to be even with M-Pittard then the only thing we've lost out of it is the coin that we paid Willo.
If however Williams can be handy, or even good over the next few years, it's a clear win.
In a nut shell it's too early to tell if it's a win or not, but it certainly hasn't been a loss as yet either. Well worth the risk imo.
knightsgone
13 Aug 2010, 13:30
get him ffs
Ben the Gooner
13 Aug 2010, 13:39
get him ffs
Hi cawshezy:)
Essentially we traded pick 16, that was used on McMillan-Pittard, for Mark Williams and Jake Carlisle (correct me if i'm wrong by all means).
We basically downgraded pick 16 to 24, PLUS upgraded 42 odd and Nash to 33odd and also recieved Williams.
If you look at it that the draft picks we lose from #16 was cancelled out by the upgrading of the 2nd part, we effectively traded Nash for M. Williams.
is the best summary of it I've seen so far.
Call Me Cake
19 Feb 2011, 13:16
Set it up too.
Dfw7aETwB4g
Lance Uppercut
19 Feb 2011, 13:26
**** me Milne is such a tip rat
Call Me Cake
19 Feb 2011, 13:34
**** me Milne is such a tip rat
There's always "that guy"...
Willo should have brought back the shotgun imo. :p
He comes across as the kind of guy that has no respect for women.
Oh, wait.
The player himself hasn't been successful, but the switching around of draft picks makes a verdict on overall trade hard to decide.
pretty stunning fence sitting post by me
Colin D'Cops
19 Feb 2011, 13:41
He comes across as the kind of guy that has no respect for women.
Haha, lovely work. :D
Call Me Cake
19 Feb 2011, 13:45
http://i52.tinypic.com/2zgvg8x.jpg
EVERLAST
23 Feb 2011, 12:37
I hope Knights was taking notes on how to actually coach a football team.
Aside from this, Willo doesn't fit into this young side and snatching a goal after the siren will hardly cement his position in the side.
Would rather have Mercuri in his final season than a fit Willo in the Essendon jumper. Hope he proves me wrong this year, however, wouldn't be betting on that.
I think you're being fairly harsh on Willo there. This preseason he has tried really hard to get his body right, shed the kilos and looks to have got over his injury problems. I think the Melbourne game coming up will give us a better indication of where he is at because he should play most of the game and will have time to settle in.
He should now know once within kicking range have the shot. He is deadly in front of goals.
Call Me Cake
23 Feb 2011, 13:26
He should now know once within kicking range have the shot. He is deadly in front of goals.
Exactly!
I got so mad when he passed off an earlier opportunity before. :eek:
If there was anyone you'd want to be selfish, it's Williams!
There's a reason why everyone always says "Once Willo gets a couple touches, you've got a couple goals" - Never misses.
You just need to feed it to him.
I hope Knights was taking notes on how to actually coach a football team.
Aside from this, Willo doesn't fit into this young side and snatching a goal after the siren will hardly cement his position in the side.
Would rather have Mercuri in his final season than a fit Willo in the Essendon jumper. Hope he proves me wrong this year, however, wouldn't be betting on that.
Very harsh. It was a great performance by Willo in the last 30 seconds. He won the ball, passed to Stanton, then followed up with a great mark and goal.
He looks fit and enthusiastic this year.
As for the Mercuri comment. Mercuri is one of my all time favourite players at his best he was unbelievable but we carried him in his last year. I don;t think we'll be doing the same with Williams.
Ben the Gooner
23 Feb 2011, 15:11
Such an incorrect post from Everlast.
HyperAgressiveDonk
23 Feb 2011, 19:47
If he remains fit and motivated, you can probably get three or four seasons of really good football from him. He's a beautiful kick, very quick on the lead, very good at ground level and a proven big game player ( prelim in 08 and GF in 08 ).
When he's on, he's a super player and I hope he finishes his career with a flourish.
Slattery_20
24 Feb 2011, 06:09
Mercuri's biggest weakness is Willo's strength.
The House
24 Feb 2011, 10:29
that celebration for a practice match makes me cringe....love the rest of it though.
that celebration for a practice match makes me cringe....love the rest of it though.
The celebration was great, maybe those sitting around watching on the box where not excited but those at the ground where, i know it was a draw but it was the come back from a shit position and the fact that the draw gave us the win for the round.
Call Me Cake
24 Feb 2011, 10:34
that celebration for a practice match makes me cringe....love the rest of it though.
I think it was more-so a celebration for himself, than for the game imo. Just being able to put in some effort and get "back on the park" after a shitty run with injuries, per-say.
I think if I was out for a long time and came back to good form, I'd celebrate and be happy too.
Agree with Ant; the noise at the ground was quite awesome for a 25,000 sized crowd.
We were dead and buried, suddenly we were back with a sniff, Williams needs to kick the goal after the siren, HE DOES!!
It wasn't even that over the top, either.
Once he ran and hugged a few of his team mates, he calmed right down again.
I think if I was out for a long time and came back to good form, I'd celebrate and be happy too.I tore my meniscus in my final year of footy, in what was promising to be a premiership year, alongside most of my mates.
When I returned 6 or 7 weeks later, and kicked the winning goal (which incidentally was from the "Hird" pocket, after practising it so often at training), I ran and hugged my mate's Mum at the fence, just like the great man did.
stay true
24 Feb 2011, 13:53
I think the crowd had a lot to do with the celebrations of the players. There was an almighty roar (for 25k people) before it went over the goal umpires head and I think the players just reacted to that instinctively.
Considering we were down by almost 5 goals and really dead and buried with about 10-12 minutes to go it was a pretty awesome comeback considering we had a weaker team in than the first game.
The tiprat can ggf. Bloody muppet.
Noddy Holder
24 Feb 2011, 13:58
At this stage signing Williams was a failure. It's up to him to turn it around this year.
Call Me Cake
24 Feb 2011, 20:09
I tore my meniscus in my final year of footy.
Ouch.
Good to see you came back, and of course, common sense says anyone would be happy in that occasion. :thumbsu:
Also, thought Willo did alright tonight. Set up a few goals, got some touches, kicked the goal to settle Melbourne's momentum down a bit. Overall, he showed up. :)
Can't wait to see him in Round 1 onwards. Never misses.
Skeeta Olly
24 Feb 2011, 20:15
Haters gonna hate.
Soild performance tonight.
GoldenboyHird_5
24 Feb 2011, 20:38
Defensive pressure was brilliant from Willo.
That combined with his straight kicking earns him a ticket to Round One.
stay true
25 Feb 2011, 00:17
Concur with all 3 previous posts.:thumbsu:
Slattery_20
25 Feb 2011, 06:07
So good at bobbing straight up off the ground after he's slid into a pack or a tackle. Hard to explain but he can be cat-like.
Ben the Gooner
25 Feb 2011, 06:09
Attacked the footy like an inside mid.
Really impressive.
Noddy Holder
25 Feb 2011, 06:50
Haters gonna hate.
If that was in reference to me then I am not a hater. I would love to see Williams do well this year. However, the fact is that up to this point in time based on last year his signing has not been a success. As I said, it is up to him to turn it around this year.
Quality game, might have to consider him for my Supercoach team if he keeps displaying that. Clean hands, great defensive pressure, great kick for goal or to a team mate.
Although only preseason, you get the feeliing he wants to repay the faith the Dons showed in him when offering 3 years.
I think one factor is contributable to all of the above:
He's visibly enjoying himself, and looks very interested.
Quality game, might have to consider him for my Supercoach team if he keeps displaying that. Clean hands, great defensive pressure, great kick for goal or to a team mate.
Although only preseason, you get the feeliing he wants to repay the faith the Dons showed in him when offering 3 years.
He's never really been a good SC scorer, even at Hawthorn.
Slattery_20
25 Feb 2011, 08:31
I think one factor is contributable to all of the above:
He's visibly enjoying himself, and looks very interested.
The whole side are. Really throwing themselves at everything, defensively, marks, hardballs etc
It's fun to watch.
Skeeta Olly
25 Feb 2011, 09:00
If that was in reference to me then I am not a hater. I would love to see Williams do well this year. However, the fact is that up to this point in time based on last year his signing has not been a success. As I said, it is up to him to turn it around this year.
No reference to you at all.
Started the year well. We need more options in our forward line so hopefully he can stay fit.
Mrs Mercuri
26 Feb 2011, 10:32
A fit and firing Mark Williams will be a very handy addition to the forward line this year after his 2010 was ruined by injury. Another player that will have a new lease on life under Hirdy.
Potential match winner.