Australian sitcoms [Archive]

GOALden Hawk

11 Aug 2003, 13:27

Why are we no good at them? The Poms are famed for their sitcoms. Many people bag the Yanks as unfunny, yet they have dozens of great sitcoms.

Australia's most successful sitcom is Hey Dad. Says it all really. Most of them turn out to be as good as the Bob Morrison Show.

I know we don't have the production budgets to buy a heap of writers like in the States, but that doesn't stop Australia producing good dramas or infotainment shows.

Anyone got a theory behind it?

Pessimistic

11 Aug 2003, 13:35

Yanks and the poms make plenty and there are some shockers.

You never see those out here byt there have been so many lame characters based in the suburbs of london you'd swaer the producers don't believe there is a UK outside london !

Flipside is Mother and son, Frontline, Kath and Kim are among the gems from down under.

Wicked Lester

11 Aug 2003, 14:59

I completely agree Goalden Hawk. In fact on reading your post I thought I'd written it myself.

It's a tough one because it sort of involves admitting that Australian humour may not be quite what we think it is. Or perhaps Aussie humour just doesn't translate well to a sitcom format.

I believe the test of a great sitcom is whether it stands the test of time - like Seinfeld and a host of other American or British shows.

Unfortunately IMHO only one australian show does - Frontline (which is more satire than sitcom anyway) - with Mother and Son there or abouts.

The brutal fact that Hey Dad is our most successful by some margin is of course alarming. I agree with Pessimistic in so far as there are clearly a large number of American and British shockers that are canecelled fairly quickly, but I still don't think it accounts for the fact that the sitcom format is not often tried in Australia.

Most of our comedy shows are either skit shows or, political or social satire - neither of which tend to date very well and don't make for good repeat viewing.

Its quite the conundrum!!

Pantsless

11 Aug 2003, 17:34

I think its got to do with budgets and the quota of Australian shows....

I agree with all posters on the various points of view, but it's cheaper for networks to buy American and Britsh rubbish, than it is to make our own.

And if they can get to the 25% quota by making Backyard Blitz 73 or some variant of cop show than they'll be happy to do that and then they can buy 2 guys a girl and a pizza place.

My other theory is that for Ch 9 /10, the AFL coverage counts in the 25%, add your infotainment and drama and we're at about 25%.

Leaping Lindner

11 Aug 2003, 19:19

Originally posted by GOALden Hawk
Why are we no good at them? The Poms are famed for their sitcoms. Many people bag the Yanks as unfunny, yet they have dozens of great sitcoms.

Australia's most successful sitcom is Hey Dad. Says it all really. Most of them turn out to be as good as the Bob Morrison Show.

I know we don't have the production budgets to buy a heap of writers like in the States, but that doesn't stop Australia producing good dramas or infotainment shows.

Anyone got a theory behind it?

Where to start?

The main reason I'd put it down (from personal experience) is Australian Televison executives are F**kwits! If you take a sitcom to the commercials they want it "dumbed down" and if you take one to the ABC (even when they had $) they constantly compare it to "Mother and Son". Not that "Mother and Son" is a bad show,far from it it's brilliant,but let's not forget the same writer wrote "Eggshells".
Another problem is that most australian comedy writers that are worth their salt are so desperate for money they do bit work(EG: write columns for newspapers,sketches for comedy shows etc..) to pay the bills rather than invest months of their time into a project that (no matter how good it is) have very little chance of seeing the light of day and delivering the writer any money.
Speaking of Australian sit coms am I the only one here that thought "Bligh" was any good? I use to enjoy that and some episodes (in particular the 'gun control' one)were very clever and well written.

Mr Eagle

11 Aug 2003, 19:59

Originally posted by Leaping Lindner
Speaking of Australian sit coms am I the only one here that thought "Bligh" was any good? I use to enjoy that and some episodes (in particular the 'gun control' one)were very clever and well written.

I enjoyed it.

I think the reality is that our best writers are more skilled in the art of satire than sitcoms. Our last genuinely good sitcom was Mother & Son. Kath and Kim is as much a ****take of "ordinary Australia" as it is a sitcom, and the successes in between were satires like Frontline, The Games, and Grass Roots (anyone else spot the ABC theme here?). I dare say Russell Coight survived solely because it had an element of urine extraction to it.

RogerC

11 Aug 2003, 22:25

It's not really a mystery. It has a lot to do with network budgets and productivity, a lot to do with the Australian sense of humour and not a little to do with our track record.

Sketch comedy (notwithstanding recent efforts) has been our forte. You could easily list a dozen of them, from Mavis Bramston through to CNNNN. Satire and a sense of irony really suit the Australian psyche.

And the best thing about sketch comedy is that, once you set up the production costs, it's all quite simple. It has to be topical, and by its very nature it has to be churned out cheaply. No lengthy character development, no searching for chemistry between lead actors, no taking a risk on a premise. Just pile on the jokes and hope more than 50% stick.

The problem with sitcoms is illustrated superbly by Seinfeld and Frasier. Both very popular, but both took quite some time to gain a foothold here. Seinfeld swapped stations (9 to 10), Frasier got lumped here there and everywhere before it gained an audience.

What Australian production company is going to spend that sort of time, effort and money on four or five sitcoms searching for a formula? What network has the patience to sit through weeks of poor ratings just to see whether a sitcom has legs? Why bother at all when we can buy the cream of British and American stuff way, way cheaper?

And seriously, who in this country beyond, say, Garry McDonald and Rob Sitch has shown any flair for carrying a sitcom through a series?

I'd say that, given a bit of faith and some financial assistance, we could develop a fair sitcom industry. Shaun Micallef, Michael Vietch, Gina Riley, Lano and Woodley and a few others have demonstrated that it is possible. But there's a lot of toes being dipped in the water at the moment, and not enough diving in. You need a good idea, and a good team of writers first - then you need time and money and more time honing the bloody thing.

It's worth noting also that two of our more popular efforts, 'Kath and Kim' and 'Kingswood Country' had their origins in sketch comedy. But it's not a great return for the amount of sketch comedy we have produced.

Then again, our film industry was crap until the mid 70s, and we still had trouble producing a quality comedy film until probably the 90s. There's hope for sitcoms in this country yet.

M29

11 Aug 2003, 22:33

Originally posted by GOALden Hawk
Many people bag the Yanks as unfunny, yet they have dozens of great sitcoms.

Name one 'great' sitcom.

Excluding the simpsons...

Yank TV is **** and the reason why our TV is so p|ss poor.

RogerC

11 Aug 2003, 23:07

I reckon I could name a dozen, but it is all a matter of taste I suppose. I'd certainly class 'Soap', 'The Larry Sanders Show' and 'Strangers With Candy' as both funny and subversive, if that's your bag. They're certainly making good stuff over there, it's just that we get overwhelmed with the likes of Friends etc. and start to think that's all they're capable of.

P76

12 Aug 2003, 08:52

Agree with you RogerC on both your posts - there have been a lot of good American sitcoms, and a lot of crap ones, and that's an indicator why it's hard to get one off the ground here. The success rate for sitcoms would have to be below 20% - that is, four crap ones for one OK one.

Australian TV just doesn't have the money to invest in that many shows - a show here has to be successful pretty much strait away or it gets the axe.

Don't forget M29 there have been a hell of a lot of crap English Sitcoms when you think about it too.

I however, am hopeful. I think the gloss is starting to come off reality TV, and sometime down the track people will want "real" TV back.

Darky

12 Aug 2003, 10:16

Australian TV is obviously the first market for Australian sitcoms. If it's crap and it fails, it's Australian viewers that see it and decide its fate.

If the same thing happens to a US or UK series, and for instance it gets canned midway through the first series, it'll probably never surface in Australia.

So in a way we might skim past the worst of the overseas lot, but still get to see the worst of our own.

Smokin

12 Aug 2003, 10:47

Aussies = sarcastic = sitire, plus satirical stuff isnt all that difficult relatively speaking.

Sitcoms are probably considered the hardest to write/produce, big or small screen. The failure rate with them is huge. Its harder, therefore takes more time, effort and of course money. Definitely an investment that often backfires.

I wouldnt say we are necessarily bad at them, I woulda thought it was a neglected area for Australians. We dont seem to try them anywhere near say the americans or brits.

Asgardian

12 Aug 2003, 11:35

Very good posts RogerC

"Mother and Son" plus "Kingswood Country" have always appealed to me as the best sitcom offerings from OZ.

IMO the problem Aussies have with sitcom production is the focus our sense of humour tends to have, self-depreciation, which does not lend itself to longevity.

The Poms and Yanks focus outwards to find a butt of up - to - date humour, Aussies will use our inwards focus to create humour usings ourselves as the fulcrum.

Therein lies our problem, we can use ourselves only so often before it becomes tired and repetitious. The yanks and Poms are not so limited, just as long as new events occur in the real world, they can maintain a fresh facade of relevance utilizing any current affair.

Uncle Steve

12 Aug 2003, 15:13

Originally posted by Asgardian
"Kingswood Country"
Bingo! I am amazed it took 13 or so posts for someone to mention Kingswood Country. It is the quintessential Aussie situation comedy.

Sadly, with the permeation of "political correctness" through today's society, I doubt we'll ever see Kingswood Country repeated on our screens :(

Uncle Steve

12 Aug 2003, 15:14

Originally posted by M29
Name one 'great' sitcom.

Excluding the simpsons...

Yank TV is **** and the reason why our TV is so p|ss poor.

M*A*S*H.

Though in general I agree with your assessment of American TV. M*A*S*H and the Simpsons are a couple of oases amid a vast desert of trite, commercial rubbish.

Darky

12 Aug 2003, 17:49

wagstaff

12 Aug 2003, 18:14

Originally posted by M29
Name one 'great' sitcom.

Excluding the simpsons...

Yank TV is **** and the reason why our TV is so p|ss poor.

Get Smart was a great show in my view, I've watched most of the 138 episodes that were made and all bar a couple are very funny and worth watching.

The two-part episode which is a parody of 'The Great Escape' is so well made it could've been made into a feature movie.

As Buck Henry, the co-creator of the 'Get Smart' said, "The reason Get Smart is a success is not because the show is so brillant, but because TV has gotten so chicken".

Apart from that, I agree with you. There are a lot of so-called classic sitcoms that are overrated or haven't aged well.

Dogwatcher

12 Aug 2003, 21:15

Originally posted by Uncle Steve
Bingo! I am amazed it took 13 or so posts for someone to mention Kingswood Country. It is the quintessential Aussie situation comedy.

Sadly, with the permeation of "political correctness" through today's society, I doubt we'll ever see Kingswood Country repeated on our screens :(

I'm surprised no one's brought up Pizza yet.
To me, that show is the modern equivalent of Kingswood Country. Taking the **** out of stereotypes and an Australia that has gotten that bit more used to multiculturalism.
There's no way that Pizza is politically correct.

By the way, how come All Together Now hasn't been mentioned?
That had great comic talent like Bruno Lucia and Gary Who. lol.

Slax

12 Aug 2003, 23:05

Originally posted by Dogwatcher

By the way, how come All Together Now hasn't been mentioned?
That had great comic talent like Bruno Lucia and Gary Who. lol.

Next you'll reminise about the Bob Morrison show.

The main problem is that making sitcoms is an expensive investment which is highly risky. Most Australian drama are presold to the US and UK markets, the main problem with this is that an Australian sitcom would fail in the US due to the differences with the humour and collequialisms.

Big stations are interested in ratings and their bottom line not entertainment. When you provide entertainment people will watch.

Weaver

13 Aug 2003, 00:02

One thing I find with a lot of Aussie sitcoms is that they are star-driven. They are often based on a stand-up comic, and most of the support stars are stand-ups as well. The casting never gets much beyond the star and their mates.

A lot of the good sitcoms feature actors playing a comic character. I don't think any of the casts of Mash or Frasier were stand-ups. Seinfeld was but the supports weren't. I think most Aussie comedies feel very 'stagey'. Most of the American sitcoms might feature one commedian and then good actors as supports.

I think Mother and Son had two good actors that captured your attention even if they weren't cracking gags. None of the other Aussie sitcom stars are interesting characters aside from the one-liners.

Harry

13 Aug 2003, 00:07

Originally posted by Uncle Steve
M*A*S*H.

Though in general I agree with your assessment of American TV. M*A*S*H and the Simpsons are a couple of oases amid a vast desert of trite, commercial rubbish.

MASH and The Simpsons are generally considered sitcoms but much of their humour is satire. MASH is based on an anti Vietnam War movie and many of the Simpsons' jokes go straight over the kiddies' heads (including the blackboard messages at the start).

They probably appeal to us in the same way Frontline and The Games did. We like a joke, especially if it's taking the p1$$ out of authority figures. Let's call it satcom (Satirical Comedy).

What we don't like is the I Love Lucy style sitcom produced for a brainless mass market who need a laugh track to tell them where the funny bits are supposed to be.

I'd rate Frontline, The Games and Mother & Son as the best Aussie sitcom/satcoms. All are ABC programs which confirms that commercial networks would rather repeat imported junk like Seinfeld and Raymond than develop quality homegrown product.
At the end of the day Copyright G.Ayres it all comes down to dollars.

Dogwatcher

13 Aug 2003, 12:29

Originally posted by Harry
. MASH is based on an anti Vietnam War movie

Actually, Korean War.

Weaver

13 Aug 2003, 14:29

Originally posted by Dogwatcher
Actually, Korean War.

It was set during the Korean War, but all the satire was driven by Vietnam.

DaveW

14 Aug 2003, 01:59

Originally posted by Slax
Next you'll reminise about the Bob Morrison show. My Two Wives, anyone? ;)

JUBJUB

14 Aug 2003, 12:08

Originally posted by DaveW
My Two Wives, anyone? ;)

I can go even worse

Flat Chat :o

Noddy Holder

16 Aug 2003, 11:11

KiNgCliVe26

18 Aug 2003, 01:44

None of the other Aussie sitcom stars are interesting characters aside from the one-liners.

Ted Bullpit= Greatest AUssie sitcom character ever.

Mr Eagle

18 Aug 2003, 13:11

Originally posted by JUBJUB
Flat Chat :o
Hampton Court.

Bingles.

JUBJUB

18 Aug 2003, 19:15

Originally posted by Mr Eagle
Hampton Court.

Bingles.

You win. :D

JUBJUB

18 Aug 2003, 19:24

Late for School .Now theres a shocker of a sitcom.

Black JuJu

19 Aug 2003, 02:25

Australian sitcom on commerical channels is an absolute black hole.
ABC has produced the goods a few times over the last 15-20 years.

I agree with what was said, its because they hire stand up comedians, they base there story around the punchlines, its lame and lacks any kind direction for the show.

Most Aussie sitcoms (like some American ones ie The Nanny), are pretty much just the same jokes over and over, thats why they don't last (except for Hey Dad, I never understood how that survived).

The range that Aussie standups have is pretty damn limited really...

But lets face it, Australian comedy hasn't really produced real talent for a long time capable of doing a good sitcom.

The Games, Frontline, Kath and Kim etc, look who did those shows, its all pretty the same group of people, maybe about 20 people who cut their teeth in Fast Forward, D-Generation or at a stretch, Comedy Company.

God knows where the talent is going to come from.....

Pessimistic

19 Aug 2003, 10:43

I actually liked theat show - what was it called - The Newlyweds ?

JUBJUB

19 Aug 2003, 15:36

Originally posted by Pessimistic
I actually liked theat show - what was it called - The Newlyweds ?

:eek:

That was the show with Annie Jones and the Doc in All Saints wasn't it ?

Black JuJu

20 Aug 2003, 00:44

I actually liked theat show - what was it called - The Newlyweds ?

May god help us all. :D

Asgardian

20 Aug 2003, 02:05

Three other Aussie shows deserve a mention, though in truth none were true "sitcoms"

"The Aunty Jack Show"
"The Mavis Brampton Show"

Both had their roots in satire

I'm damned if I can remember the title of the third show, but it had Rod Quantock and lots of Mars bars

It was more of a mini "Hey Hey It's Saturday" show full of skits

Leaping Lindner

20 Aug 2003, 10:49

Originally posted by Asgardian
Three other Aussie shows deserve a mention, though in truth none were true "sitcoms"

"The Aunty Jack Show"
"The Mavis Brampton Show"

Both had their roots in satire

I'm damned if I can remember the title of the third show, but it had Rod Quantock and lots of Mars bars

It was more of a mini "Hey Hey It's Saturday" show full of skits

Ratbags! Late night on Channel 10 in 1981 or 1982.

Also what about the classic oz sitcom "My name's McGooley what's yours?". Don't remember it myself but I am assured it was a classic by some older friends.

Grendel

20 Aug 2003, 11:49

Anyone recall 'Birds in the Bush'? Had Hugh Taylor (I think that was his name.. was a Han(ock half hour reg) and 'the Fella's'. The Fella's being a group of lovely nubile young sheila's (getting the Aussie lingo gowin). ;)

I must have been a right devo as a 5yo when if first aired. I LOVED that show.

FuManchu

1 Sep 2003, 18:05

Its garry Shandling's show in the late eighties was a very funny "sitcom" that used the fact they were playing before a live audience, he would often go talk to the audience during the show, walk b/w sets. Very well done.

Because of the dryness of the Australian sense of humour, I feel that trying to make a "situation" comedy as such is pointless, what they should do is a reality program of BBQ's or pub nites, where the best humour is heard and all the nuances of the night can unfold. That is where our sense of humour is showcased

FuManchu

1 Sep 2003, 18:12

Another very very funny US comedy was"Its your move" from the early 1980's. It starred a teenage Jason Bateman who was such a smarta**e who would continually undermine his sister and stop his mother from getting a boyfriend. Until one day he met his match then it was to and fro between the son and the boyfriend.

Very funny, but never repeated in Australia.

the fly

2 Sep 2003, 19:32

Hmmm, taking the **** out of stereotypes, like having a Swedish character called Lars Larsson and making him a tennis player.

What ever happened to Nikki Wendt?

hale

3 Sep 2003, 01:01

Didn't anyone get into Welcher & Welcher (http://www.abc.net.au/welcher/) earlier in the year?

Now that Nine have given Micallef the arse, maybe he can get back to the ABC and give us another series.

Welcher & Welcher: the verdict

The bad news is it starts awkwardly. Mis-timed punchlines leave jokes falling flat, the wordy script makes the narrative cumbersome and cluttered, and the characters are not immediately likeable or engaging. Some scenes are too obvious, some too subtle.

Fortunately, about halfway through episode one, Welcher slips into gear. Suddenly the pace is quick and the wit is sharp. The interplay between the pompous lawyer Quentin Welcher (Micallef) and his good-samaritan wife (Robyn Butler) is engaging; Francis Greenslade's character, a low-life sleaze, is hilarious; and the machinations of the Welcher & Welcher practice - with bumbling painters, anguished articled clerks and an incompetent IT expert (Santo Cilauro) - are oddly plausible.

Episode two is even stronger, ending in a rib-splitting scene in which Quentin thinks he's about to get lucky. He isn't, but we are: only a few patchy sequences dampen a consistently strong first series.

Here's more good news: Welcher is character-driven and plot-driven, more in the mould of British classics such as Fawlty Towers (probably inevitable in a sitcom that revolves around a tall man with a penchant for pratfalls and absurdity) than US shows such as Everybody Loves Raymond. Micallef himself describes it as farce. Combining slapstick, clever one-liners and absurd situations, it is much less weird than fans of the third series of The Micallef Pogram might expect.

Eight episodes left me wanting more.

- Sacha Molitorisz
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/02/04/1044318605505.html

Woodson

6 Sep 2003, 15:17

Originally posted by FuManchu
Another very very funny US comedy was"Its your move" from the early 1980's. It starred a teenage Jason Bateman who was such a smarta**e who would continually undermine his sister and stop his mother from getting a boyfriend. Until one day he met his match then it was to and fro between the son and the boyfriend.

Very funny, but never repeated in Australia.

Reminded me of MJ Fox in Family Ties. Growing Pains was in the same vein then Home Improvement took off and bettered them all with Tim Allen's goofy ways.
I loved Not The Nine O'Clock News. The British humour seemed more spicey than the Americans. I love Seinfeld but the Simpsons has got to be worth it's weight in gold.

Kingswood Country and Home Sweet Home/ Acropolis Now would rate as my fav Aussie Sitcoms of all time but Paul Hogan put that kind of comedy on the map.
I feel sorry for the generation growing thru thier teens now, they have a very shallow crop of options. Thank god for THe Simpsons !! (and yup, Pizza & Crank Yankers deserve a mention but never in the league of Not the Nine O'Clock News IMO.)