"The players must have got the wrong message" - crap!!

[Pred]

I am surprised none of you have brought this up yet.

When repeatedly grilled by the media on why the Crows were so bad on the weekend, Ayres keeps coming out with "Weeell, I thiiiink the plaaaayers must have got the wrooong meeessage".

For ****'s sake, who is it who is charged with the responsibility of getting the message through to the players. The coach. Can't blame the players for that one. And why the hell, if the game was going so badly, wouldn't you make your message C L E A R, in the changerooms at half-time??!

Everyone is accusing Ayres of being a poor tactician at the moment, but he looks to be failing on the player communication front too.

[Kane McGoodwin]

The Crows played dumb wet weather football. The players should be smart enough to work it out for themselves - ie. Don't stuff around with the ball, kick it long (unless there is a play very free for a short option), etc. Basic stuff really.

[Pred]

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
The Crows played dumb wet weather football. The players should be smart enough to work it out for themselves - ie. Don't stuff around with the ball, kick it long (unless there is a play very free for a short option), etc. Basic stuff really. That's all true, but the point is that if the players aren't getting it right, it is the coaches responsibility to make sure they do.

[Jars458]

The coach can only give the instruction

If the players don't follow taht instruction you can't blame the coach

Some footy players are just too stupid.

[Boof33]

Okay, it's up to the players to play "smart", but tell me why would you play three tall forwards on a wet day? Doesn't seem a sensible coaching decision to me. :p

[dyertribe]

Well something's gotta be done somewhere.

We've got Ayres crapping on about this, that and t'other and every Sunday I am subjected to McLeod's tripe about 'changing attitudes' and 'we all realise such and such a performance is unacceptable' etc...

Fact of the matter is, when we lose to the Power on the weekend and if other results don't go our way we can finish 6th or 7th right?

Another promising season pi$sed down the drain because no-one feels like being accountable.

You know who we've become? Norwood.

All talk, no action, bottle it when we shouldn't. Lucky we'll all have 1997 and 1998 to point to when Port Adelaide are masters of the universe in a century's time eh?

Sound familiar?

[Pred]

Maybe I didn't make myself quite clear.

The coach has two main responsibilities in the leadup to a game and during the game itself:

(1) MESSAGE - getting the players up mentally so that they are playing their best as a team and individually. Making sure they all understand the gameplan.

(2) TACTICS - Game plan, matchups, countermeasures.

Ayres is clearly struggling with (2), and if he is saying the PLAYERS aren't getting the MESSAGE, he is struggling with (1) as well.

A coach is not responsible for a player's poor disposal. But he IS responsible when a large number of players, in his own words, "aren't getting the message".

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by Pred
That's all true, but the point is that if the players aren't getting it right, it is the coaches responsibility to make sure they do.
The coach can't do it for them. However, what he can do is pull a player off when they repeatedly do something stupid or putting in a pathetic effort (no matter who the player is).

[DaveW]

Originally posted by dyertribe
Another promising season pi$sed down the drain because no-one feels like being accountable.

You know who we've become? Norwood.

All talk, no action, bottle it when we shouldn't. Lucky we'll all have 1997 and 1998 to point to when Port Adelaide are masters of the universe in a century's time eh?

Sound familiar? You sound like you want to switch sides.

[Pred]

The message on Saturday should have been "Kick long, play close, and go hard at the footy". When it was clear the players weren't doing that by half time, Ayres should have given them the spray of their lives, and made no bones about it. Ron Barassi or Leigh Matthews certainly would have been able to make them change their ways quick smart. If Ayres can't do that, bye bye.

[macca23]

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
The coach can't do it for them. However, what he can do is pull a player off when they repeatedly do something stupid


I don't know why you think the player should be rewarded for stupidity Kane. :D

[dyertribe]

DaveW: Not at all... however I am seeing an all too familiar pattern emerging at AFL level that I used to love seeing at SANFL level.

Now I know what it's like to be a non-Magpies supporter...

Lots of talk, lots of confidence, but in the end the side comes up short and leaves you looking like an idiot... meanwhile the Magpie (read Power) Machine rolls on regardless. Too arrogant to care let alone gloat.

[Pred]

Originally posted by macca23
I don't know why you think the player should be rewarded for stupidity Kane. :D Yeah, I'm against coaches pulling players off too. It's unhygienic ;)

[macca23]

Originally posted by Pred
The message on Saturday should have been "Kick long, play close, and go hard at the footy". When it was clear the players weren't doing that by half time, Ayres should have given them the spray of their lives, and made no bones about it. Ron Barassi or Leigh Matthews certainly would have been able to make them change their ways quick smart. If Ayres can't do that, bye bye.

For what it's worth, I totally agree with you Pred. We played 4 quarters of dumb footy on Saturday doing exactly the opposite of what should have been done, and at no time did the players attempt to change the game plan.

Sure they have to wear the rap as well, because blind Freddie could see that they were playing dumb footy. If the coach was preaching a different message then he certainly failed in lumps to make it happen.

[Jars458]

Lets all jump on the lets bag the coach bandwagon after two defeats

This is second best home and away season ever after last year.


The loyalty factor amongst our supporters this week is becoming really disturbing.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Jars458
This is second best home and away season ever after last year. Not unless we beat the Power on the weekend.

[Pred]

Originally posted by Jars458
Lets all jump on the lets bag the coach bandwagon after two defeatsJars, a coach's job is more than just 'giving instruction'. If that's what it was, the coach could just hand his instruction sheet to the captain to read out, and head off to the box to prepare. No, it's about getting inside the players' heads, and making them, through the skillful use of your words and personality, absolutely want to get out there and do what you say. You're starting to sound like ok.crows - refusing to face reality.

[macca23]

Originally posted by Jars458
Lets all jump on the lets bag the coach bandwagon after two defeats

This is second best home and away season ever after last year.


The loyalty factor amongst our supporters this week is becoming really disturbing.

I, like the majority of others, didn't bag the coach after the Collingwood game, and if I have at any time during the year it's been on the rarest of occasions and IMO would have ben justified.

Don't confuse loyalty with blindness.

Last week we showed the Kangas no respect and paid the price. Neil Craig openly said on TV before the game that they were experimenting with a game plan against the Roos who in their opinion played a similar style to Port, Brisbane and Collingwood.

If what we saw was it, then it was the game plan of a madman.

My criticism is equally levelled at the selection committee, the coaching panel and the players for one of the dumbest most pathetic displays when we had everything to gain.

Loyalty includes honesty.

[dyertribe]

Originally posted by Jars458
This is second best home and away season ever after last year.

The loyalty factor amongst our supporters this week is becoming really disturbing.

13 wins is good is it? For a side that has traditionally been bulging with All-Australians and other star players.

This is where we fall down - we don't demand excellence.

It's about time we did. Nothing to do with loyalty, it's about an urge to propel the club to where it deserves to be - certainly not another pi$sy 5th or 6th placed 13-9 season with a host of underperforming players and staff wishing to pass the buck when a Premiership should've been afoot.

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by macca23
My criticism is equally levelled at the selection committee, the coaching panel and the players for one of the dumbest most pathetic displays when we had everything to gain.

The selection of the side has been a major concern & factor in our losses in the last 2 weeks. We have clearly picked unfit players who are of little use to the side. This is even worse when you are bringing 3 players back after a long lay-off. We must pick 22 fit players this week, otherwise we will be on the end of the mother of all thumpings. Port will take no prisoners this week, so all 22 players & coaching staff must be 100% on our game.

[Jars458]

Originally posted by macca23
I, Loyalty includes honesty.

Yes of course it does and i have been critical on many many occassions

All I am saying is don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

[Kane McGoodwin]

There have been plenty of discussions behind closed doors this week between the coaching staff & the players. They realise that the last 2 weeks performances have been insipid & an embarassment to AFC & us as supporters. I'm expecting that they will come out all guns blazing this week to show that they do have pride in the jumper & character as players. A win against Port will keep us in the hunt for a flag. Another effort like the last 2 weeks & serious questions will need to be asked as we can kiss our season goodbye.

[napsyd]

No one would say we have the best coach in the AFL. No one would say we have the best list in the AFL.

Making judgements about our season based on the last two weeks performance is crap. Yes, they have been awful, but they are just two games.

My feeling is that we are not travelling as well this year as last, but it is too soon to start condemning the coach, players, staff and the bloke who turns out the lights at footy park after each game to eternal mediocrity.

Lets dissect the season when the season is over.

[Macca19]

Originally posted by dyertribe
13 wins is good is it? For a side that has traditionally been bulging with All-Australians and other star players.

This is where we fall down - we don't demand excellence.

It's about time we did. Nothing to do with loyalty, it's about an urge to propel the club to where it deserves to be - certainly not another pi$sy 5th or 6th placed 13-9 season with a host of underperforming players and staff wishing to pass the buck when a Premiership should've been afoot.

Interesting post.

97 and 98 were a long time ago now. Are the large majority of Crows fans too concerned with those premierships still and thinking along the lines of Port hasnt won one yet so its all good...rather than being more concerned about very possible Crows premiership success in the near future?

Do the Crows supporters as a whole think that 13-9 and 5th or 6th spot and being a finals also-ran is classed as success?

[mic59]

Originally posted by Jars458
Lets all jump on the lets bag the coach bandwagon after two defeats

This is second best home and away season ever after last year.


The loyalty factor amongst our supporters this week is becoming really disturbing.

Right with that one, Jars. In 2000 when we had what would have to be described as our worst year the crowds were 2/3 what they were in 1997 and are now. Part of that was due to the run of bad weather we had which meant just about all of our night matches were wet and cold, and some was due to incessant injuries preventing us from being competitive, but most of the drop off was supporters who couldn't drag themselves to games that weren't guaranteed wins.

[noddy]

Had to double check to make sure i was on the right board & after reading some of the comments posted here i'm still not sure,

Gary Ayres is the coach of the AFC in good times & bad !! sure he's made some blunders just as any other afl coach past & present has but for the guy to drawn & quarted by an interloper from our cross town rivals is bad enough but to have some of our own in agreement & then have Dyertribe give us a bloody lesson in how we will always be a Norwood & forever wallow in the wake of the Port Adelaide Power well that just about takes the cake,

I am a Crow supporter & i do not live on past glories & i will criticize my club, coach & players when i think it's warranted not when some bloody papsie comes on my board with his bloody airs & graces,

The Adelaide Football Club is an identity in it's own right & i do not want my club to look at other AFL clubs in the hope of being a clone but rather that we build on what tradition that we have already built so far in our short history,

& maybe i am being a bit naive & looking for the improbable but i bloody well think we are not done for yet & that we can win this weeks showdown & go on to make a real run at this years flag,

[GoalsFrom50Out]

I agree with dyertribe. We're becoming the Norwood of the AFL. All talk, all hype, and produce nothing. Norwood have done absolutely **** all in the last twenty years. They've produced two premierships, when in fact they should've won '87, '93 (against the new team [Eagles]), '98, '99, '02.

Frankly, as supporters of the club, why should we be forced to up with this annoying three quarter crap football where the team goes to sleep in a quarter, and loses a massive lead they've built up, and narrowly win the game.

It's frustrating >_<

[Macca19]

Originally posted by GoalsFrom50Out
Norwood have done absolutely **** all in the last twenty years.

Last Twenty years? And the rest. Try the last 50.

[GoalsFrom50Out]

Well. That's true.

[DaveW]

This is only the third year since 1971 that Norwood haven't contested the finals.

Five premierships in that time too. Which isn't as bad as everyone is making out.

Perhaps the number of premierships is still disproportionately low compared to the number of finals appearances. But if that's analagous to any AFL club, it's Port Power, not us. ;)

[kirky]

I for one believe that this side is fully aware that the last two weeks have been their worst performances for the year. Not the time to do it but then again what a way to pull it off, false sense of security for the others.

This side will account for itself this week then will start the fours weeks to glory. You don't lose talent and skill overnight (perhaps passion but that is easily returned) and this side has what it takes and contary to what the Rucci says - for $uck sake until two weeks ago our largest defeat (and in Brisbane for that matter) was 18 points - we must have been doing someting right.

Oh ye of little faith - the grail is still there. Now go and get it boys.

[noddy]

Originally posted by Macca19
Interesting post.

97 and 98 were a long time ago now. Are the large majority of Crows fans too concerned with those premierships still and thinking along the lines of Port hasnt won one yet so its all good...rather than being more concerned about very possible Crows premiership success in the near future?

Do the Crows supporters as a whole think that 13-9 and 5th or 6th spot and being a finals also-ran is classed as success?

Macca if you think the majority of Crow fans are living on past glories get out of Adelaide & talk to the reginal Crow fans who would soon put you on the right track,

I have said this before & i'll say it again, a great year for me would be a Crows premiership & to top it off the wooden spoon for Port Adelaide & i'm bloody sure most if not all pap supporters would love the reverse to happen,

& as for for your last paragraph well i find that rather insulting & not what i would expect from you, Pred maybe but not you,

[noddy]

Originally posted by macca23
I, like the majority of others, didn't bag the coach after the Collingwood game, and if I have at any time during the year it's been on the rarest of occasions and IMO would have ben justified.

Don't confuse loyalty with blindness.

Last week we showed the Kangas no respect and paid the price. Neil Craig openly said on TV before the game that they were experimenting with a game plan against the Roos who in their opinion played a similar style to Port, Brisbane and Collingwood.

If what we saw was it, then it was the game plan of a madman.

My criticism is equally levelled at the selection committee, the coaching panel and the players for one of the dumbest most pathetic displays when we had everything to gain.

Loyalty includes honesty.

All of us could see that the coaches, players & selectors stuffed up badly for what surely was the biggest stuff-up our club has done for a few years & i was in the quew with my ranting & raving but life goes on there is this week & the week after & then if we bomb out the hard questions will be asked,

I consider myself a loyal AFC supporter who at the same time can keep his feet on the ground & critizize when necessary but bloody hell the seasons not over yet,

[SAbella]

Originally posted by Jars458
Lets all jump on the lets bag the coach bandwagon after two defeats

This is second best home and away season ever after last year.


The loyalty factor amongst our supporters this week is becoming really disturbing.

I don't think what is going on this week is a loyality issue but rather a great feeling of disappointment and maybe a sense of dread. I think Crows supporters at the moment are feeling shocked, angry and need to vent. It is so frustrating to think that because of one game the Crows whole season can be basically destroyed and they'll lose their Top 4 position which they have held for the majority of the year-it is just such a waste, I think the feelings are all quite valid and it makes it worse when you know where the team could be and that they are not going to maximise their potential, it is only natural that people are going to look at where the problem is, so really its not a loyalty issue at all.

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by napsyd
No one would say we have the best coach in the AFL. No one would say we have the best list in the AFL.

Making judgements about our season based on the last two weeks performance is crap. Yes, they have been awful, but they are just two games.

My feeling is that we are not travelling as well this year as last, but it is too soon to start condemning the coach, players, staff and the bloke who turns out the lights at footy park after each game to eternal mediocrity.

Lets dissect the season when the season is over. No we don't have the best coach in the AFL and no we don't have the best list.

I can honestly say that overall this year has been disappoining up to this point. We dropped some games that we never should have dropped (St. Kilda, Collingwood, Hawthorn, Fremantle and Kangaroos), we didn't capitalise on our opportunities during the season. How many times during this year did we have a chance to go 1st or 2nd and failed to make the most of it. Yes we did have a rotten run with injuries but it is no excuse for some of these games where we should have well and truely won.

I agree that we are not travelling as well as we did last year and that can be partly associated with the injuries that we had and not having a settled line up. Personally I was feeling a lot more confident going into the finals last year than I am this year unless we somehow turn around our form and play at our peak for the entire game and not have any brain fade outs.

[Macca19]

Originally posted by noddy
Macca if you think the majority of Crow fans are living on past glories get out of Adelaide & talk to the reginal Crow fans who would soon put you on the right track,

Heres a challenge for you. Go to this showdown in Port Power gear and count the amount of times a Crows supporter will say to you 'How many flags you got?' or 'Weve got two premierships you know'. I guarantee you at least 30 times it will be said to you.

I have said this before & i'll say it again, a great year for me would be a Crows premiership & to top it off the wooden spoon for Port Adelaide & i'm bloody sure most if not all pap supporters would love the reverse to happen,

Your probably right.

& as for for your last paragraph well i find that rather insulting & not what i would expect from you, Pred maybe but not you,

What is so insulting about it? I reckon its a fair point. Im not talking about Crows fans on this board. Im talking about as a whole - the whole lot. A fair few clubs out there class other things as a success. I bet St Kilda would be classing this year as a success. I bet Fremantle would be at this point as well.

Each supporter has a different ideal on what success is. I bet there are Crows supporters out there who would be happy just to finish above Port each year. Some would view a year to year improvement in wins/ladder position as success. Some supporters view making the finals each year as success. Then there are supporters who only view the ultimate as a succesful year.

There was no malice intended in the question.

[ant]

Originally posted by SAbella
I don't think what is going on this week is a loyality issue but rather a great feeling of disappointment and maybe a sense of dread. I think Crows supporters at the moment are feeling shocked, angry and need to vent. It is so frustrating to think that because of one game the Crows whole season can be basically destroyed and they'll lose their Top 4 position which they have held for the majority of the year-it is just such a waste, I think the feelings are all quite valid and it makes it worse when you know where the team could be and that they are not going to maximise their potential, it is only natural that people are going to look at where the problem is, so really its not a loyalty issue at all.

Good post, but for me, I'm neither angry, nor shocked anymore. I've simply come to the realisation we're just not plain good enough.

When push comes to shove, when it really comes down to it, when the important games come, we're just not on the same level as some other teams.

The whole year I thought differently, but it's crystal clear to me now.

[SAbella]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ant
[B]Good post, but for me, I'm neither angry, nor shocked anymore. I've simply come to the realisation we're just not plain good enough.

Thanks :) It sounds to me as though you are feeling really disillusiioned with the Crows at the moment and honestly I can't say I blame you, it really is hard to keep the hope alive for this year but the season isn't over yet, you never know saturday may have been a really good wake up call for the team. Let's hope they remember all their hardwork and start to REALLY realise whats at stake.

When push comes to shove, when it really comes down to it, when the important games come, we're just not on the same level as some other teams.

I dont know what happens to them when their backs are against the wall, maybe they need to learn how to cope with pressure better. Whats so frustrating is that they are fundamentally a VERY good sign and when they want to be they are up there with the other top 4 sides :(

[ant]

Originally posted by SAbella


Thanks :) It sounds to me as though you are feeling really disillusiioned with the Crows at the moment and honestly I can't say I blame you, it really is hard to keep the hope alive for this year but the season isn't over yet, you never know saturday may have been a really good wake up call for the team. Let's hope they remember all their hardwork and start to REALLY realise whats at stake.



I thought rounds 2, 5, 7, 8, 11, 16 and 20 were going to be good wake up calls too. The Crows have their phones off the hook.

Virtually every key, crucial, season defining moment this year, we have folded like a pack of cards. Nearly every opportunity we have had to show how far we've come, to make a statement, to move forward, particularly against good teams, we've crumbled.

Maybe the boys know what's at stake. Maybe they try hard, give their all. But they're just not good enough. It's obvious to me, the season is as good as over. We are making up the numbers.

[dyertribe]

Originally posted by Macca19
Heres a challenge for you. Go to this showdown in Port Power gear and count the amount of times a Crows supporter will say to you 'How many flags you got?' or 'Weve got two premierships you know'. I guarantee you at least 30 times it will be said to you.

That's exactly right - and I cringe when I hear my fellow Crows supporters say it. It makes me sick to be honest.

I couldn't give a flying **** what Port are doing except when they sit three games clear of the league and have proceeded to make us their b1tch for the past 6 Showdowns - regardless of the fact they've had key personnel down all year... meanwhile at West Lakes we've conceded an entire season as soon as a ruckman goes down three separate times in the past.

Yes we won flags in 1997 and 1998 - in 1999 I was ropable at the way the club imploded and turned in the worst performance by a reigning premier in league history... and you know what I was told by some fellow season ticket holders and mates of mine when I vented this anger?:

"You can't win it every year"... "We've already seen two"...

I am disgusted by this resting on our laurels crap and a lot of supporters still practice it. I grew up supporting and loving a powerhouse that stepped up to the line and gave its all every single time it was asked regardless of injuries and suspensions - and even if defeated the club never let its members, supporters and bandwagoners down.

These days I am deadly passionate about the Adelaide Football Club... I saw the pioneering days in 1991... the excitement of 1993... the sub-mediocrity of 1994-1996 through to the glory days of the two flags... followed by the 1999 and 2000 slide and the recent rebirth.

Like many of you here, I've seen it all. I am a fully paid up member and have a right to call it as I see it, and what I see now disgusts me. For this reason I'm sticking by my Norwood comparison because that's what we're getting. A lot of theory, no practice.

This season has rapidly turned from one of imminent success to one of imminent disaster - yes we're still in it, but barring a miracle we won't get close to a repeat of last year's Preliminary Final let alone a Premiership this season - and this is heartbreaking considering we'd all agree that at the dawn of this year, season 2003 was arguably the greatest chance we've had in our 13 season history of winning one.

Now what do I hear following this recent meldown? The same old chickens of 1994... 1996... 1999... coming home to roost: "oh ye of little faith"... "let's look at things after the season". Why? I have faith. I do dissect things post-season - and it seems to me that the same old lessons of past failures and underachievement have not been learnt by our coaching staff and players alike.

I go to every game expecting to see Adelaide win... and if we don't, I expect a competent effort to take heart from. Too many times this year we've blown games because - according to Ayres and McLeod - 'we weren't mentally prepared' or 'we didn't give the Saints/Hawks/Kangaroos et al enough credit'.

It's not good enough for you and it's not good enough for me. Just look at the mood and responses on this board... some are angry... some are livid... others are still showing somewhat of a blind faith... others seem apathetic and resigned to our fate.

Either way, it's unacceptable. And when Primus, Voss or Buckley holds up that cup and we're all sitting in our homes or in a pub somewhere watching the joy of those we ourselves sneered at before this season went to ****, all we can do is shut our mouth and put the kettle on/order another round.

[Pred]

There you go Noddy, you mental giant you. Before you go running off at the mouth about Power interlopers desecrating your board, perhaps ask yourself if he is just voicing what many are thinking.

[Jars458]

Originally posted by SAbella
I it is only natural that people are going to look at where the problem is, so really its not a loyalty issue at all.

There was no problem for 19 weeks

Now after an expected loss to Collingwood and one poor home performance everyone is blaming the coach

Yes - it is a loyalty issue

People ahve to calm down and be a bit more rational about it

We will know mor about the fabric of our team after Sunday.

I say again - don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

[noddy]

Originally posted by Pred
There you go Noddy, you mental giant you. Before you go running off at the mouth about Power interlopers desecrating your board, perhaps ask yourself if he is just voicing what many are thinking.

There you go yourself pred (where did i mention the word desecrating),

what you say is to me irrelevant as your purpose is to stir & frankly i can handle that because if your club repeats it's last 2 years finals efforts this year i shall take the time out to return the favour,

[Jars458]

Originally posted by Macca19
Heres a challenge for you. Go to this showdown in Port Power gear and count the amount of times a Crows supporter will say to you 'How many flags you got?' or 'Weve got two premierships you know'. I guarantee you at least 30 times it will be said to you.
.

It will be about the same number of times I called a fat girls rudy bits just for barracking for my side

About the same number of times Port fans say at least we are a real club with traditions and not a corporate monolith.

About the smae nubmer of times both sets of fans will blame the umpries for what happens

About the same number of times KG stutters on the Friday night football show

About the same number of times Johnny Howard will play the race card.


Its all cliches, and they belong to every club.

It proves nothing.

[noddy]

Originally posted by Macca19
Heres a challenge for you. Go to this showdown in Port Power gear and count the amount of times a Crows supporter will say to you 'How many flags you got?' or 'Weve got two premierships you know'. I guarantee you at least 30 times it will be said to you.

[b]
[b]

Macca i was at the last showdown in 02 stuck in the middle of the n/e pocket with my Crows scarf wrapped around my neck & i wont even bother to start repeating all the advice & lessons from history i had to liston to,

[Pred]

Originally posted by noddy
your purpose is to stirOh your Holiness has managed somehow to divine my purpose has he? You imbecile. Wrong. Bzzzzzzzzzzt. Noddy, You are the weakest link. Goodbye.

[_espoir]

Originally posted by Jars458


Its all cliches, and they belong to every club.

It proves nothing.

i agree, we give it to others that dont support our club, and people give it back. just gotta learn not to take it to heart. Everyone believe's their club is better than another, everyone believes their club is right, *shrugs* happens all the time... we get the flag thing, we get the chokers, we get this or that... and i'm sure we give it back just as bad to other supporters.

[noddy]

Originally posted by Pred
Oh your Holiness has managed somehow to divine my purpose has he? You imbecile. Wrong. Bzzzzzzzzzzt. Noddy, You are the weakest link. Goodbye.

Holiness, i can live with that,:)

Imbecile, been called worse, ;)

Goodbye, is that a promise ? ( but not before we meet on the field of no-return) :cool:

[Pred]

Originally posted by noddy
Goodbye, is that a promise ? Only if you promise to have your hands amputated and mouth filled with quick-dry cement.

[Kane McGoodwin]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by noddy
Goodbye, is that a promise ?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by Pred
Only if you promise to have your hands amputated and mouth filled with quick-dry cement.
Hmmmm, we would have to consider this proposal, although I'm not so sure we can afford to sacrifice noddy. ;)

[Nige_Bix]

Originally posted by macca23
Neil Craig openly said on TV before the game that they were experimenting with a game plan against the Roos who in their opinion played a similar style to Port, Brisbane and Collingwood.

Why the hell would you experiment at this time of the year! - just get the ball first, and more often than the oppostion, and do with it what comes naturally - which is using the game plan that was set up yonks ago - and basically seems to be ok most of the time.

[macca23]

Had the good fortune of attending a 3 and a half hour luncheon at the Italian Club in carrington Street today. CMI Toyota were the hosts and Nigel Smart was the guest speaker.

He was excellent.

Firstly bad news. He doesn't think there's any chance of Edwards or Hart playing on sunday.

As far as last week's debacle was concerned he did say that they did change the gameplan for the game and had practised going shorter all week. He said that unfortunately it didn't work, particularly on a wet day, and they were told to abandon it at half time. Unfortunately he said that the players mind sets were too far into it at that stage, and they just couldn't get back to their normal game.

HHH I asked him about the effects of the flu lingering on, and causing the lack of run, he said that somewhere between 12 and 20 players had the flu, and it may well have been a factor, but he couldn't comment as he didn't have it. He did admit that the worst players were those that had the flu.

He said that at training this week it was back to what is regarded as their predictable and normal gameplan - going long to a target in their forward line. He said that Port would try to counter this as they normally do, but he was confident that Adelaide will come out with steam from their ears and win.

He said that he thought Bickley was starting to swing more towards playing again next year, and he said that he was thinking about going again but it would be up to the club whether he did or not, as maybe it was time for younger players to step up.

He said that our two brightest up and coming stars are Hentschel and Reilly. He said that Hentschel had magical talents which we hadn't seen yet, but undoubtedly will next year. As for Reilly he said that he will blossom and come on nicely next year.

I had the good fortune of winning in a lucky draw a large signed framed testimonial print of Nigel, and it's going up on the rumpus room wall tonight. :D

All in all a great day.

[DaveW]

One wonders if the short style of football would've worked in the dry. We probably tried it one week too late.

Good to see we're going back to what suits us best. Hopefully it works against Port this time.

I do like what I'm hearing about Hentschel, but gosh I'd love to see it on the field.

As for the door prize... you lucky bastard. :p

[ant]

Anything about going straighter into the forward line? It's all well and good going long, but it's useless if it's wide to a flank.

Thanks for the report anyway and well done on winning the raffle. I must have bought a million of those tickets and never won one :o

[noddy]

Originally posted by macca23

I had the good fortune of winning in a lucky draw a large signed framed testimonial print of Nigel, and it's going up on the rumpus room wall tonight. :D

All in all a great day.

You lucky so & so, that would be something to cherish,

I would have had the same ? as ant = why do we persist in going out wide ? still thanks for the update & that must have been some lunch that went for 3 1/2 hrs:)

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by macca23
Had the good fortune of attending a 3 and a half hour luncheon at the Italian Club in carrington Street today. CMI Toyota were the hosts and Nigel Smart was the guest speaker. So is that what you executives get up to when you have those very important?!?!?! :eek: :p :p


Firstly bad news. He doesn't think there's any chance of Edwards or Hart playing on sunday. Not surprising really. Quads take a while to get over.


He said that at training this week it was back to what is regarded as their predictable and normal gameplan - going long to a target in their forward line. He said that Port would try to counter this as they normally do, but he was confident that Adelaide will come out with steam from their ears and win.That is great to hear. i just hope we stick to the corridor and none of this kicking to the flanks and delivering wide to the forward line.

He said that he thought Bickley was starting to swing more towards playing again next year, and he said that he was thinking about going again but it would be up to the club whether he did or not, as maybe it was time for younger players to step up. I am really not sure how to take this. If they continue on they will just take a spot away from someone like Hentschel, Reilly, Schuback or Parker. :(

He said that our two brightest up and coming stars are Hentschel and Reilly. He said that Hentschel had magical talents which we hadn't seen yet, but undoubtedly will next year. As for Reilly he said that he will blossom and come on nicely next year.No surprise really. However, I would have Schuback on that category as well. But overall I would agree that those are the best up and comers. If Rutten gains a yard or two of pace, he would join them.

I had the good fortune of winning in a lucky draw a large signed framed testimonial print of Nigel, and it's going up on the rumpus room wall tonight. :D

All in all a great day. You lucky so and so!!!!!!:p

[macca23]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
So is that what you executives get up to when you have those very important?!?!?! :eek: :p :p



Of course Stiffy!! A 3 course meal, free wine, a Nigel Smart Testimonial print and good company - it's a hard life mate, but someone has to do it!! :D

Forgot to mention Nathan Bassett. When Smarty was asked why he was dropped his reply was "shall I give you reason #1 or reason #2 - I think we'll just stick with reason #1" and went on to explain that Bass is an excitable character and mouthed off at the coach after being dragged for about the 4th time. We never got to hear reason #2, which probably explains why bass hasn't been picked again this week. (Sort of shooting ourselves in the foot though)

I did ask Nige about the going down the flanks all the time and he agreed and said that's why they had the match practice this week to get some run back, kick long and go straight.

Also on on Wayne Carey, Nige said that Carey isn't happy with his year because his body has had to adjust after missing a year of footy, and he hasn't produced at the level he wants to. Nigel said that Wayne is gradually working to the standard he wants and next year he expects Carey to dominate once again.

The Smart print is huge - 80 cms X 65 cms , beautifully framed and glassed and looks a treat on my rumpus room wall!! ;)

[noddy]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by macca23

The Smart print is huge - 80 cms X 65 cms , beautifully framed and glassed and looks a treat on my rumpus room wall!! ;) [/QUOTE

Will there be an open house for us mortals to have a bo-peep ??

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by macca23
Of course Stiffy!! A 3 course meal, free wine, a Nigel Smart Testimonial print and good company - it's a hard life mate, but someone has to do it!! :D Man I chose the wrong career path!!!!!!:(

So Bassett had a go at Ayersy?!?!?! This might come as a bit of a surprise but I reckon good on Ayersy for letting him know who is the boss. On the other hand Bassett is our best key defender who would have stood Cornes (If he plays and I am yet to be convinced that he will)

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by macca23
Forgot to mention Nathan Bassett. When Smarty was asked why he was dropped his reply was "shall I give you reason #1 or reason #2 - I think we'll just stick with reason #1" and went on to explain that Bass is an excitable character and mouthed off at the coach after being dragged for about the 4th time. We never got to hear reason #2, which probably explains why bass hasn't been picked again this week. (Sort of shooting ourselves in the foot though)
Does the coach & the Hound have irreconcilable differences?? I hope not.

Originally posted by macca23
Also on on Wayne Carey, Nige said that Carey isn't happy with his year because his body has had to adjust after missing a year of footy, and he hasn't produced at the level he wants to. Nigel said that Wayne is gradually working to the standard he wants and next year he expects Carey to dominate once again.
I stick to what I said at the beginning of the season - we will see Carey have a better year in 2004 than 2003, because he will have a year under his belt (after being out for 2002).

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
So Bassett had a go at Ayersy?!?!?! This might come as a bit of a surprise but I reckon good on Ayersy for letting him know who is the boss. Disagree. It sounds to me like Ayres his putting his ego ahead of whats good for the team.

Just slap him with a fine or make him wash a car... err, on second thought scrap that last one... pick him for the side and get on with things.

Keeping him out of the side only increases the bitterness and tension between the two.

[macca23]

Originally posted by DaveW
Disagree. It sounds to me like Ayres his putting his ego ahead of whats good for the team.

Just slap him with a fine or make him wash a car... err, on second thought scrap that last one... pick him for the side and get on with things.

Keeping him out of the side only increases the bitterness and tension between the two.

That was the impression I got from Smarty that there is a fair bit of tension between the two.

Rumour has it that Bass actually shoved Ayres in the chest in a later argument about Bass abusing Ayres when he was dragged. Don't know whether it's true or not but 2 weeks for disciplinary reasons is pretty high given the importance of the games.

[lozstar]

Ayres has made players wash cars before and certain other things for discipliniary reasons.. I can't see why he won't do something like that this time..
It's time to think about the side!!

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by lozstar
Ayres has made players wash cars before and certain other things for discipliniary reasons.. I can't see why he won't do something like that this time..
It's time to think about the side!!
I'm pretty sure it was Blight who was into having players wash cars.

[lozstar]

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
I'm pretty sure it was Blight who was into having players wash cars. Nah it was Ayres too! He got Rehn to do it a couple of times.

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by DaveW
Disagree. It sounds to me like Ayres his putting his ego ahead of whats good for the team.

Just slap him with a fine or make him wash a car... err, on second thought scrap that last one... pick him for the side and get on with things.

Keeping him out of the side only increases the bitterness and tension between the two. Possibly but the coach has to make sure who is the boss. Discipline is extremely important thing in any spot and if it means suspending a bloke then so be it. Only with tough discipline can a team be successful. If Bassett actually did push Ayersy in the chest during one of the arguments then I am behind AFC on this 100% percent.

[Macca19]

Originally posted by macca23

Rumour has it that Bass actually shoved Ayres in the chest in a later argument about Bass abusing Ayres when he was dragged. Don't know whether it's true or not but 2 weeks for disciplinary reasons is pretty high given the importance of the games.

Well given the way that Bassett usually flys off the handle and has a tantrum whenever his opponent takes a mark it wouldnt surprise me if he pushed or shoved Ayres when Ayres was letting him know whos boss.

Still tho...im quite shocked that he isnt playing on the weekend. Bit of a plus for the Power.

[DaveW]

Bassett flies off the handle when his opponent marks the ball because he's a perfectionist. What defender wouldn't want his opponent to get a kick? Is he supposed to be ambivalent about what his opponent does?

If Ayres can't deal with Bassett's personality then he's failed as far as man management goes.

[SAbella]

Ayres is disciplining Bassett at the expense of the whole team and important games?!?! :confused:

I'm pretty sure Ayres could find other ways to discipline a player especially considering it seems to be more of a personal thing. Don't think he's being very considerate to the rest of the team by suspending Bassett. :mad:

[Macca19]

Originally posted by DaveW
Bassett flies off the handle when his opponent marks the ball because he's a perfectionist. What defender wouldn't want his opponent to get a kick? Is he supposed to be ambivalent about what his opponent does?

If Ayres can't deal with Bassett's personality then he's failed as far as man management goes.

I think your wrong there. Sure most defenders dont like their oppoenent getting a mark or goal. Most defenders also arent as...visual...in their disgust at letting their opponenet get a mark or goal.

What i think your wrong about tho is that its Ayres fault. If Bassett is playing like crap or doesnt do what hes told and is dragged a couple of times and then he goes and abuses the crap out of Ayres...how is that Ayres fault?

If they then got into another argument about whatever and Bassett pushes Ayres, How is that Ayres fault? Why would a coach reward a player for pushing him by selecting him in the team?

It is a team game and Bassett not being in the side is penalising the team a bit but if Bassett cant keep his emotions in check then why should he not be punished? If Bassett did push Ayres...then its not Ayres penalising the team...its Bassett penalising his teammates for being stupid enough to push the coach.

I mean really. Put yourself in Ayres situation and what would you do? Would you reward Bassett even if you had allegedly got into an argument with him which resulted in him shoving you only a week after him showing a distinct lack of discipline and respect?

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by Macca19
I think your wrong there. Sure most defenders dont like their oppoenent getting a mark or goal. Most defenders also arent as...visual...in their disgust at letting their opponenet get a mark or goal.

What i think your wrong about tho is that its Ayres fault. If Bassett is playing like crap or doesnt do what hes told and is dragged a couple of times and then he goes and abuses the crap out of Ayres...how is that Ayres fault?

If they then got into another argument about whatever and Bassett pushes Ayres, How is that Ayres fault? Why would a coach reward a player for pushing him by selecting him in the team?

It is a team game and Bassett not being in the side is penalising the team a bit but if Bassett cant keep his emotions in check then why should he not be punished? If Bassett did push Ayres...then its not Ayres penalising the team...its Bassett penalising his teammates for being stupid enough to push the coach.

I mean really. Put yourself in Ayres situation and what would you do? Would you reward Bassett even if you had allegedly got into an argument with him which resulted in him shoving you only a week after him showing a distinct lack of discipline and respect? Spot on. I agree 100%. Coach is the one that is there to run the show and tell his players what to do. If they don't do what he tells them then that guarantees a disciplinary action. In any sport coach is always right. And history will show that in any sport if a player can have it with his ciach the way he likes it then that club is as good as gone.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Macca19
I think your wrong there. Sure most defenders dont like their oppoenent getting a mark or goal. Most defenders also arent as...visual...in their disgust at letting their opponenet get a mark or goal. So what? Bassett wears his heart on his sleeve. He's plays passionately and he generally plays well.

What i think your wrong about tho is that its Ayres fault. If Bassett is playing like crap or doesnt do what hes told and is dragged a couple of times and then he goes and abuses the crap out of Ayres...how is that Ayres fault? Coaches have to deal with all sorts of player personalities. They have to adjust how they deal with different players. Its up to Ayres maintain healthy working relationships with his best players. Otherwise, how does he expect to be a successful coach?

If they then got into another argument about whatever and Bassett pushes Ayres, How is that Ayres fault? Why would a coach reward a player for pushing him by selecting him in the team? I'm not saying the player should be rewarded but why can't he be forgiven?

It is a team game and Bassett not being in the side is penalising the team a bit but if Bassett cant keep his emotions in check then why should he not be punished? If Bassett did push Ayres...then its not Ayres penalising the team...its Bassett penalising his teammates for being stupid enough to push the coach. Ayres drops the players, the players don't drop themselves. Ayres punishes himself as a coach by not putting his best players on the park.

I mean really. Put yourself in Ayres situation and what would you do? Would you reward Bassett even if you had allegedly got into an argument with him which resulted in him shoving you only a week after him showing a distinct lack of discipline and respect? Fine the player or find some more imaginative form of punishment. Dropping the player just upsets the whole side and that can't be good for the relationship between the players and the coach.

[noddy]

Sorry Dave but i'm with Stiffy & Macca19 on this one,

As much as i believe Basset to be one of our most reliable defenders & in the first 10 picked if he has done what has been suggested Gary Ayres had no other option than to discipline him as he see's fit,

If Nathan had have performed to his normal standard last week for the redlegs instead of (as i've been told) showing no interest at all would he be in the side for this sundays showdown ???

[marvin]

Originally posted by Macca19
Do the Crows supporters as a whole think that 13-9 and 5th or 6th spot and being a finals also-ran is classed as success?

In short - no, that's not a successful season.

IMHO, the last two Crows coaches have had to work hard to undo the damage the first two coaches did to the club.

Cornes, with his public statements about winning all the home games and pinching a few on the road set the implicit standard that 13-9 is a successful year.

Shaw - well, I won't go there.

Blight and Ayres have had to work hard to instil a win anywhere, anytime attitude. Making the finals should be the expectation, rather than cause for satisfaction.

Slowly, the attitude change is coming. Making the finals saw no great celebrations amongst the Crows faithful - at least the ones I know. We expect the Crows to make the finals; if they put themselves in a position to go deep into the finals and win, or at least challenge for, some premierships, that's a successful year in my book.

[marvin]

On Bassett - sorry Dave, but here's another vote in favour of the coach and the club and against the player.

Firstly, my observation is that whenever Bassett goes all John Drummond, he plays the rest of the game as a beaten man. I don't think I've ever seen him lose it early and come back stronger for it. I reckon it gives the opposition forwards great confidence to see the full back spitting the dummy as they go back to line up for goal.

Secondly, If he lost it with the coach in the way that's been suggested, he should be polishing up the CV. I know that players have different needs - some need more encouragement, some need more prodding. In return, the players need to respect the coach. A player can disagree with the coach, can even make his point forcefully, but if the relationship between the coach and the other players is in danger of being undermined by a player's dissent, something has to give.

[Cyclops]

May I comment in your forum?

1:"The players must have got the wrong message"

The coach knows what is wrong, and he isn't telling the press. If you can generate a large thread from a throw-away post-match cliche, it suggests there are deeper issues.

2: I guess the deeper issues include being in a two team town, so every win and loss gets loaded with significance it doesn't deserve.

3: Another issue is player discipline. Blight had to crack the whip (and three "untouchable" heads rolled) when he arrived to bring Adelaide their glorious flags. Ayres chances of success are reduced if he cannot maintain 100% discipline. This is a no-brainer. If you side with the player on this you are betraying the team.

4: 13-9 is a fair record so far, you're in the 8, and everyone knows its harder for non-Vics to reach the very top: 11 home games help you stay middle table but 11 aways make top spot harder to reach (well done Port). You'd prefer to be top, but you still have the bodies to win it from 5th.

5: Port will belt you most likely, but should you meet in the finals I'd have the house on Adelaide.

6: Ayres is now a decent coach, I was not a fan when he started but FWIW I reckon he's got better. I still don't think he's good enough to win you a flag with this list. Sack him when his contract ends, strip out the list, and start again.

[napsyd]

FWIW the "official" line from the tiser.

Bassett's indifferent form in the SANFL last weekend was not encouraging and Adelaide believes the threat of Port's three tall forwards – Warren Tredrea, Chad Cornes and Brendon Lade – can be covered by Nigel Smart, Ken McGregor and Mark Stevens

[dyertribe]

Originally posted by napsyd
Warren Tredrea, Chad Cornes and Brendon Lade – can be covered by Nigel Smart, Ken McGregor and Mark Stevens

Yeah and Marty Mattner will win the Brownlow this year.

[napsyd]

Originally posted by dyertribe
Yeah and Marty Mattner will win the Brownlow this year.

:D :p Yes!

:( Tis indeed a worry.

[topjars]

Ive been indisposed for a day or two and have just read the thread with interest.

The title of the thread says it all.
I heard Ayresy trot that line out as I was driving home from Footy Park (on 5aa) and thought then that its the Coaches responsibility to ENSURE they are getting the message and nothings changed.

I just wonder whether hes not getting thru to individuals either; not to mention the team.

The answer will be revealed this "wet" windy weekend.

[Kane McGoodwin]

Well the coach & players had a special long session behind closed doors earlier in the week, so there should be no excuse for the players getting the wrong message this week!