View Full Version : Help needed - Brent Guerra
Hi all,
I'm hearing this guy's name mentioned a hell of alot by varous reliable North sources. Laidley is quite keen on him apparently.
Your team is one i just dont get much of a chance to watch all that often unfortunately, and this guy is one i just can't seem to get much of a mental picture of.
For some reason i've got a faint vision of a David Calthorpe type receading hairline, dark features and stocky frame... and that frightens me!! :( :o
Seriously though, I'd appreciate a chop out from anyone who is keen.
Strengths? Weaknesses? Best position? Realistic trade value?
His statistics aren't flash, but that does't obviously tell a player's full story.
Any help is appreciated.
Others can provide more details, but in brief Guerra is rated much more highly by us fans then by Mark Williams. His problem is that his best position is probably a small defender. Unfortunately we have a couple of the best in Hardwick and the man of steel - Gavin Wanganeen, so he's always getting game time off the bench - and not much of it, then dropped, then recalled. When he's on the ground his attack on the ball is his greatest strength - one of the best tacklers in the side. When Hardwick or Wanganeen retires he should be a walk up to their position. However he may be frustrated waiting for the opening to occur and may want to be traded. Port fans hope not as we'd be losing a great player.
His trade value on games played is probably a third round pick, but given the players he's been in competition with for time on the ground, in the team top of H & A the last two seasons, Port wouldn't accept anything less then a second round pick for him.
He is smallish and stocky... with a receading hairline, but still only about 21 I think.
Is very hard at and only goes at 1 speed ... full bore for the ball or player.
Is a great tackler ... get a copy of the Port v WC game this year and watch the opening quarter.
Is a very big kick for his size and can easily bomb goals from 50-60 meters.
Unfortunately he is only played on/off the bench for Port but when ever he is on he makes an impact. He is pretty much the 1st player selected if 1 of our usual midsized players is out.
Best suited to defence or midfield, but is also quite handy as a small forward.
SKC
Porthos
18 Sep 2003, 10:21
Port would be stupid to take a second round pick for him, considering they used one on him and he isn't a dud. We'd be stupid to trade him right now unless the offer appeared to be above the odds to the neutral observer (but close to his real value).
Is a genuine utility, can play on any pocket or flank. Has had match-winning tackles versus the Crows and Brisbane (2002), and arguably was the match-winner against Essendon (2001). Resultantly, one could label him a big-game player, but barely gets game time in any game that he is selected in (hence the poor stats). For example, look at end of the first quarter against Sydney where he kicked a potentially game-turning, trademark left-footed boomer from beyond 50, and barely saw any time for the remained of the game.
He should be at the very least an interchange player, but the combination of depth/playing favourites by Mark Williams means that the Guru hardly sees as much time in the teal as he deserves. This off-season will tell if the likes of himself, Cassisi et al will get regular games next season. This could made more difficult by the rise of messrs Ebert and Salopek.
Kid Dynamite!
18 Sep 2003, 12:00
I'm thinking of something along the lines of Guerra for Teague, who's probably gone more backwards than forwards under JYD. Thoughts?
Porthos
18 Sep 2003, 12:02
I don't rate Teague. Certainly not ahead of Guerra.
vacekadelaide
18 Sep 2003, 12:34
As a doggies supporter in the SANFL i have seen a lot of Guerra. I cannot understand how he isnt playing consistently for the Power, even if he is used off the bench. When he does get an AFL game he rarely gets a go, and is then dropped - usually for Che-Cockatoo Collins. He has a great kick - very accurate and is a great tackler. I am always happy to see him lining up for us in the SANFL because he always gives 100%. The Power would be silly to trade him, but i could sympathize with him if he was getting frustrated with his lack of game time.
I felt the same about Michael Stevens and the Power traded him - which has worked out successfully for the Power with Stuart Cochrane. Stevo always gave 100% for the doggies, unfortunately, Port had too many players of his mould. I hope for his sake that North give him more of a go next season, as he is a real talent. I think i am right in saying most doggies supporters would love to see him come back and play for us if he wasnt playing AFL.
As for that possible trade for teague..i think its silly..but i think you underestimate how good Teague is. I still remember his state game for VIC vs SA at Adelaide Oval. He destroyed us, and i have remembered his name ever since.
He'd fit in very well at NM, very hard at it, good skills.
However, we'd be mad to trade him, i think that it will be up to him, if he wants to go, then we cant stop him and will have to take what we can get. Hopefully though he chooses to stick it out and will be in our starting 18 the moment Dimma or Gav (maybe both) retire.
If we traded him i reckon he would be the best player we have traded to this point. If he was under contract I wouldn't trade him unless we get a great deal. It will be his call though.
Porthos
18 Sep 2003, 14:29
I'd rate keeping Brent as a higher priority than keeping Stevens at this stage.
Cheers for all that guys. Excellent responses there.
I can see why Laidley would be so keen going by all that.
The spot of a quality small defender/back pocket is one of our most glaring holes in North's structure. We have plenty of attacking half back types, but no blokes who can wear a small forward. Sounds like he could be a big part of the answer to this.
I've always thought Shannon Moltop would be the type of player to thrive at Port Adelaide. Sublimly skilled, great runner, terrific balance and wonderfully attacking. Defensively he has question marks over him though.
But he just never seemed to embrace the North way and due to a combination of limited opportunity and sometimes very questionable treatment from our coach(es), he just could never string much consistent footy together for us.
I think getting a second chance elsewhere might be the tonic he needs to really extract the digit and produce his best footy, and he just seems a good fit for your club. He could perhaps be part of a package with a David Teague and a draft pick or the like?
Anyway, thanks again for the great response. Good luck for the weekend.
Porthos
18 Sep 2003, 18:37
I really think that any package deals Port get involved with will be going the other way - for Port to improve its list, we need concentrated quality, not a spread of fringe players. We've got enough trouble picking 3 players to delist as is.
PAfolwr
18 Sep 2003, 19:17
Originally posted by Porthos
I'd rate keeping Brent as a higher priority than keeping Stevens at this stage.
I certainly do not disagree with this statement.
Against: Stevens and Guerra are different sort of players, and it can be argued that since we have more like Guerra than Stevens, and don't have a younger replacement for Stevens at this stage, we could unbalance the side.
Pro: Stevens has gone missing way way too often in big games.
Stevens trade value for a club that is keen would be a lot higher than Guerra's.
We would have a big chance (long term) of winning out by trading Stevens, whereas we would have a big chance of losing out from any Guerra trade.
Asgardian
18 Sep 2003, 22:03
Guerra would be the kind of player that Laidley would love to get at the Roos, coz he plays so much like Laidley did at his best.
Head down, bum up, 100% goer, who loves the tough stuff.
Coz of his limited game time at the Power, his trade value is miles below his true value. So if Port do entertain a trade involving Brent, we will end up on the wrong side of the equation
tashibatts
19 Sep 2003, 00:02
All sounds very good.. sounds the Perfect Shinboner IMO, Smallish, Tough.. and he is young to boot.
Would be very happy to get him going by what all of you have said.
What kinda trades would you expect for him (fair trades)
?
Thanks for your help
Go Roos
I am liking the sound of this Mr Guerra! Hopefully there is someone on North's list that some of you are interested in...
tashibatts
19 Sep 2003, 00:22
Dylan Smith anyone?
Go Roos
Porthos
19 Sep 2003, 00:25
No offense, but Brent is worth more than anyone you'll offer.
tashibatts
19 Sep 2003, 00:31
Originally posted by Porthos
No offense, but Brent is worth more than anyone you'll offer.
True.
Go Roos
Royal Blue And White
19 Sep 2003, 10:49
Originally posted by Porthos
No offense, but Brent is worth more than anyone you'll offer.
I think Guerra for Morrell would be a good trade.....Diggers is really a CHB IMO and Laidley has not realised it...Would slot in well to Ports relatively smallish backline beside Wakelin and Hardwick
Originally posted by Royal Blue And White
I think Guerra for Morrell would be a good trade.....Diggers is really a CHB IMO and Laidley has not realised it...Would slot in well to Ports relatively smallish backline beside Wakelin and Hardwick
Heard somewhere that Morrell may be a bit of a "lazy" player. Is that just something that started with a missed training or does he go missing for long periods?
hurricane
19 Sep 2003, 12:00
Originally posted by Porthos
No offense, but Brent is worth more than anyone you'll offer.
How about a draft pick plus a player? I know you don't want a spread, but take the draft pick as more or less the base payment, and add a fringe player as a speculative punt.
A player like Shannon Motlop has loads of talent, but doesn't seem to be given the chance under Laidley. Ditto Dylan Smith, who we picked up in the first round.
Digby Morrell may also be worth a punt... nobodies idea of a KPP, but could shine as a third tall. Bags of 5 goals show he can play, but it isn't quite working for him with our current structure.
A second rounder plus one of these players would seem a bit high to me, but a third round + player may be too low for you.
Thoughts?
hurricane
19 Sep 2003, 12:03
Originally posted by mic59
Heard somewhere that Morrell may be a bit of a "lazy" player. Is that just something that started with a missed training or does he go missing for long periods?
I wouldn't have called him a lazy player at all. His work rate is really good.
That being said, he does tend to go missing... I think that aerobic capacity (as opposed to ethic) could be an issue. Athleticism and body strength are not strong points.
On the plus side, he reads the play well and has a very good pair of hands for his size. He's also a reliable kick for goal.
He really needs to take that one more step up, but I don't know whether he is going to get the opportunity at North, where Laidley is likely to use the 3rd forward spot to blood our future KPPs next year.
Originally posted by hurricane
I wouldn't have called him a lazy player at all. His work rate is really good.
That being said, he does tend to go missing... I think that aerobic capacity (as opposed to ethic) could be an issue. Athleticism and body strength are not strong points.
On the plus side, he reads the play well and has a very good pair of hands for his size. He's also a reliable kick for goal.
He really needs to take that one more step up, but I don't know whether he is going to get the opportunity at North, where Laidley is likely to use the 3rd forward spot to blood our future KPPs next year.
Thanks. It was a remark from a commentator(I can't remember which). Aerobic capacity should be no problem, Port have a good gym and nutritional program so if he's short on these we have assistants who can help him.
Originally posted by tashibatts
All sounds very good.. sounds the Perfect Shinboner IMO, Smallish, Tough.. and he is young to boot.
Would be very happy to get him going by what all of you have said.
What kinda trades would you expect for him (fair trades)
?
Thanks for your help
Go Roos
We (the supporters) would expect a lot more than what we will actually be given. Hopefully he chosses to stay on another year or two until a permanent spot opens up for him in our starting 18.
year of the roo
21 Sep 2003, 00:23
if guerra decides he wants out of port adelaide, then port may be forced to accept just about anything for him or risk losing him for nothing. as he is out of contract, there is a slight chance this could happen and would be just about north's only hope of landing him imo.
The complete lack of drive out of defence saturday has surely bumped the retention of a young and tough player like Guerra (one of the few on our list who seems to relish the man on man style of play) high up the list of priorities. If Choco has a problem with Guerra he should put it aside, Brent should be told Port are offloading a small defender (for gods sake get rid of Kingsley he might do ok in some minor round games, but under pressure he falls apart even faster then the rest of the team) and if he does the hard work in the pre-season he'll be a starting 18 player next year.
Ford Fairlane
25 Sep 2003, 10:12
According to the news last night and today's Tiser, Guerra is on his way, most likely to the Roos. Maybe a swap of players and second or third round picks. But I haven't seen enough of the Roos to nominate a player. Obviously the names going around are S Motlop, Morrell, Smith ... any advances on those?
Ausgard
25 Sep 2003, 16:37
Originally posted by Ford Fairlane
According to the news last night and today's Tiser, Guerra is on his way, most likely to the Roos. Maybe a swap of players and second or third round picks. But I haven't seen enough of the Roos to nominate a player. Obviously the names going around are S Motlop, Morrell, Smith ... any advances on those?
How about you give him to us because you got Pickett for a steal ;)
most likely it will be draft picks and a fringe player (one of those mentioned I guess)
NorthBhoy
25 Sep 2003, 16:43
Originally posted by Ford Fairlane
Obviously the names going around are S Motlop, Morrell, Smith ... any advances on those?
We don't have much else to put on the table to be honest.
Our senior players are either heart and soul types (Stevens, Archer, King) or the blokes leading us into the next era (Simpson, Grant, Harvey, Sinclair). The rest are young and already vital ingredients, or don't have much currency due to their limited experience/exposure.
We have drafted so well that I would be upset to part with all but about two of our many players under 21years old.
On natural footy talent, Shannon Motlop is only behind a few at the club. Digby can more than match it with the best on a good day, but they don't come along enough. Dylan Smith captained Victoria in the Nationals and is a 20yo inside midfielder with an impecable attitude and leadership qualities. Neat skills, not quick, good endurance and terribly gutsy.
Originally posted by NorthBhoy
We don't have much else to put on the table to be honest.
Our senior players are either heart and soul types (Stevens, Archer, King) or the blokes leading us into the next era (Simpson, Grant, Harvey, Sinclair). The rest are young and already vital ingredients, or don't have much currency due to their limited experience/exposure.
We have drafted so well that I would be upset to part with all but about two of our many players under 21years old.
On natural footy talent, Shannon Motlop is only behind a few at the club. Digby can more than match it with the best on a good day, but they don't come along enough. Dylan Smith captained Victoria in the Nationals and is a 20yo inside midfielder with an impecable attitude and leadership qualities. Neat skills, not quick, good endurance and terribly gutsy.
Not having seen many of your games this doesn't jump out at me. Is he #4? He sounds like the sort of player we would be looking for midfield wise.
Ausgard
25 Sep 2003, 16:52
Originally posted by sog35
Not having seen many of your games this doesn't jump out at me. Is he #4? He sounds like the sort of player we would be looking for midfield wise.
#4 is Harris - we will be keeping him :)
#13 is Smith - played about 10 games - and none this year - the North board goes on about how he never gets a call up despite getting BoG for Port Melbourne AGAIN.
I think he had 4 in a row at one point.
Basically he was never given a go
Porthos
25 Sep 2003, 16:57
I wouldn't say no to Morrell as part of a trade, especially post Morgan/Paxman departures.
Smith...great junior rep, but as we're not VFL watchers, who can say if he's good enough? By all accounts Aaron Davey rips it up over there.
Originally posted by Ausgard
#4 is Harris - we will be keeping him :)
#13 is Smith - played about 10 games - and none this year - the North board goes on about how he never gets a call up despite getting BoG for Port Melbourne AGAIN.
I think he had 4 in a row at one point.
Basically he was never given a go
Well if he's got a good attitude and isn't prone to homesickness then we'll have him, Smith and a 4th rounder for Guerra, given that Guerra is more of a proven quality at AFL level.
Originally posted by Porthos
I wouldn't say no to Morrell as part of a trade, especially post Morgan/Paxman departures.
Smith...great junior rep, but as we're not VFL watchers, who can say if he's good enough? By all accounts Aaron Davey rips it up over there.
Both very valid points. SA is only next door to WA.
Originally posted by Porthos
I don't rate Teague. Certainly not ahead of Guerra.
Trust me from a neutral point of view, they're closer than you think.
Teague is a little tougher & Guerra gets more of it. Would love either of them at Melbourne.
Originally posted by BT
Trust me from a neutral point of view, they're closer than you think.
Teague is a little tougher & Guerra gets more of it. Would love either of them at Melbourne.
Guerra has won us two matches with tackles in the last few minutes of the game. Guerra and Teague would be on a similar level you are right but from what I have seen of Teague I'd take Guerra.
Hmmm... BT, Guerra is probably as tough as they come. Pint-sized powerhouse, if you will.
Porthos
25 Sep 2003, 17:36
At 5 to 1 odds, I would happily place $10 on Brent Guerra earning an All-Australian nomination in his career.
tashibatts
25 Sep 2003, 17:42
Originally posted by sog35
Smith and a 4th rounder for Guerra
I would do that:D
Go Roos
NorthBhoy
25 Sep 2003, 17:43
Smith is a hard one to explain.
He is not quick. Over short distances and in traffic he is ok. Strong body, good hands and a great work ethic. Pagan saw him as a replacement for Bell (was in the Bell trade FWIW, pick 6). Physically, the two are nearly identical (apart from the Korean bit) with Bell having better endurance.
He is not a deep kick, but an accurate one.
His brain and approach to the game is his strength. He was kocking up BOG's in the VFL, and despite his lack of opportunities, continued to bust his arse. Great kid. He was told by Laidley that he was playing great footy but he simply didn't have a spot for him. He was tagged by Brodie Holland in the VFL prelim final and struggled.
Port would be silly to do a straight swap.
POrthos, Aaron Davey has indeed played some breathtaking footy over here, and is certain to be drafted.
Originally posted by Porthos
At 5 to 1 odds, I would happily place $10 on Brent Guerra earning an All-Australian nomination in his career.
I'll have a bit of that.
Originally posted by NorthBhoy
Smith is a hard one to explain.
He is not quick. Over short distances and in traffic he is ok. Strong body, good hands and a great work ethic. Pagan saw him as a replacement for Bell (was in the Bell trade FWIW, pick 6). Physically, the two are nearly identical (apart from the Korean bit) with Bell having better endurance.
He is not a deep kick, but an accurate one.
His brain and approach to the game is his strength. He was kocking up BOG's in the VFL, and despite his lack of opportunities, continued to bust his arse. Great kid. He was told by Laidley that he was playing great footy but he simply didn't have a spot for him. He was tagged by Brodie Holland in the VFL prelim final and struggled.
Port would be silly to do a straight swap.
POrthos, Aaron Davey has indeed played some breathtaking footy over here, and is certain to be drafted.
One point and one question.
Point one is that because he is such a great kid with a good attitude does this mean he would be able to adapt to Adelaide and the homesickness that seems to strike.
And a question - Why would we be silly to do a straight swap? The one I suggested had a draft pick attached. Preferebly 3rd round but I suggested 4th.
Originally posted by NorthBhoy
...Port would be silly to do a straight swap....
No they wouldn't ;).
Porthos
25 Sep 2003, 17:55
Sog, I think that Dylan Smith is North Melbourne's version of our Michael Stevens dilemma.
Porthos
25 Sep 2003, 17:56
Originally posted by sog35
I'll have a bit of that. You're on.
tashibatts
25 Sep 2003, 17:57
Originally posted by NorthBhoy
Port would be silly to do a straight swap.
You aren't meant to tell them that.
:p
Go Roos
Originally posted by Porthos
Sog, I think that Dylan Smith is North Melbourne's version of our Michael Stevens dilemma.
Yeah fair enough and with a last name like Smith he could be anyone's bloody brother.
That said was Michael Stevens ever that consistent in the SANFL. not 4 BOG's in a row consistent.
NorthBhoy
25 Sep 2003, 18:06
Originally posted by sog35
One point and one question.
Point one is that because he is such a great kid with a good attitude does this mean he would be able to adapt to Adelaide and the homesickness that seems to strike.
And a question - Why would we be silly to do a straight swap? The one I suggested had a draft pick attached. Preferebly 3rd round but I suggested 4th.
Out of any kid I have seen play footy and spoken to (I played cricket with him for a few years) I can honestly say Dylan would be the least prone to "homesickness". He would eat up playing for Port. Footy mad city, proud footy club etc. In his element. Not an issue.
Silly only in the sense that lining up the career's of the two, regardless of possible improvement etc, Guera has it all over him. Smith and a 2nd rounder sounds about right to me. Not a reflection on his ability as a footballer, because I think he will make it, but on what both have put forward so far.
NorthBhoy
25 Sep 2003, 18:08
Originally posted by Porthos
Sog, I think that Dylan Smith is North Melbourne's version of our Michael Stevens dilemma.
In a footballing sense, they are poles apart.
Smith is a hard working "footballer" with brains and a excellent work ethic.
Stevens is a running machine who might make it with very little going on upstairs.
Originally posted by NorthBhoy
Out of any kid I have seen play footy and spoken to (I played cricket with him for a few years) I can honestly say Dylan would be the least prone to "homesickness". He would eat up playing for Port. Footy mad city, proud footy club etc. In his element. Not an issue.
Silly only in the sense that lining up the career's of the two, regardless of possible improvement etc, Guera has it all over him. Smith and a 2nd rounder sounds about right to me. Not a reflection on his ability as a footballer, because I think he will make it, but on what both have put forward so far.
Sounds too good to be true. Would you say he didn't get a chance due to the hard nuts you have round the ball at the moment or just poor selection?
I agree with you on the trade front. But 2nd round draft picks are quite valuable whereas third rounders have more risk attached. I would be quite happy with a 2nd rounder and Smith.
Originally posted by NorthBhoy
In a footballing sense, they are poles apart.
Smith is a hard working "footballer" with brains and a excellent work ethic.
Stevens is a running machine who might make it with very little going on upstairs.
Michael Stevens - Endurance and Speed, what a combo :D.
I think I'm still coming to terms to life without Murray, M Stevens and Kingsley. It all happened so quickly!
NorthBhoy
25 Sep 2003, 18:44
Originally posted by sog35
Sounds too good to be true. Would you say he didn't get a chance due to the hard nuts you have round the ball at the moment or just poor selection?
Bit of both.
He was competing with Simpson, Stevens, Robbins and Harris and to a lesser extent Jones for that type of role. Dyan's problem is his lack of flexibility. He is an inside midfielder. He can't play in a pocket or on a flank.
Poor selection in the sense that he didn't get a chance this year after a string of excellent games in the VFL.
Originally posted by NorthBhoy
Out of any kid I have seen play footy and spoken to (I played cricket with him for a few years) I can honestly say Dylan would be the least prone to "homesickness". He would eat up playing for Port. Footy mad city, proud footy club etc. In his element. Not an issue.
Silly only in the sense that lining up the career's of the two, regardless of possible improvement etc, Guera has it all over him. Smith and a 2nd rounder sounds about right to me. Not a reflection on his ability as a footballer, because I think he will make it, but on what both have put forward so far.
We'd probably have to take that, it's fair, but in saying that i wish we could hold onto the Guru:(