The Unexpected trades

[Kristof]

Okay - let's be honest. We're all holding out for those unexpected trades (well, holding out for that, and getting some of the picks back we gave away with Wayne) - so this is the official thread for proposing trades such as Ben Finnin for Ronnie Burns.

And I'll start:

Michael Doughty and Marty Mattner for Nathan Eagleton and Patrick Wiggins. Looks like the Bulldogs can't afford Nathan (he's only 24) and Wiggins is big and mobile.

Plus - what for Perrie? Geelong have either Harley (mobile, very improved) or Kingsley (can kick a bag, but complete space cadet). One of those, plus pick 22? There's also pick 7, but is that wishful thinking?

[DaveW]

Well your post certainly lived up to its title.

[lozstar]

Originally posted by Kristof
Michael Doughty and Marty Mattner for Nathan Eagleton and Patrick Wiggins. Looks like the Bulldogs can't afford Nathan (he's only 24) and Wiggins is big and mobile.
errr.. a big no-no to that one :)

Originally posted by Kristof
Plus - what for Perrie? Geelong have either Harley (mobile, very improved) or Kingsley (can kick a bag, but complete space cadet). One of those, plus pick 22? There's also pick 7, but is that wishful thinking? I wouldn't mind either Harley or Kingsley.. but wouldn't Geelong want an arm and a leg for them? (alot more than perrie anyway!)

[Kristof]

Originally posted by lozstar
errr.. a big no-no to that one :)

Cool - but why?

Doughty < Eagleton
Mattner < Wiggins (he has more value as a Tall and potential KPP)

The only reason WB would trade Eagleton would be $$$ - he had a fantastic last six months after spending a year or so all at sea after WB tried to remake him into a tagger ...

I wouldn't mind either Harley or Kingsley.. but wouldn't Geelong want an arm and a leg for them? (alot more than perrie anyway!)

Maybe. I think they'd be curious about Kingsley trade proposals, as the guy is ridiculously unreliable - but playing a very valuable positition. Perrie has more value than Harley, as he's just a flanker, though one the better ones running around in the AFL. We would possibly be the ones stepping away from this trade.

Throw more trades out there, folks! I'm sick of reading about the HMS Holland! :)

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Kristof
Mattner < Wiggins (he has more value as a Tall and potential KPP)
Wiggins is rubbish.

What an insult to Mattner.

[Kristof]

Originally posted by DaveW
Wiggins is rubbish.

What an insult to Mattner.

Maybe. But it'd be hard to insult Mattner, considering what little value he has. Nothing personal ...

Funny, I could post this same trade at the WB board, and hear all about how Wiggins is all potential, has height, you never trade big for small, etc etc. I would have thought trading our third best tagger for a potential tall who may improve in our system is a worthy risk, but fair enough if you'd rather not.

[DaveW]

Perhaps I should mention I'm not exactly Marty Mattner's biggest fan either. ;)

To be honest I haven't seen much of Wiggins. But you're the first person I've come across who has had any praise for him at all.

Just looking at the stats: 9 marks in 12 games... and this guy's supposed to be a KPP?

[Crow-mosone]

Originally posted by DaveW
Wiggins is rubbish.

What an insult to Mattner.

Not to be rude, but ol' Marty didn't do that much this year...

[Kristof]

Yeah - I may be sounding a bit desperate in my need for young and tall, because he does scream "Evan Hewitt".

I had originally looked at McMahon being the second player, but thought that was unlikely. Mostly Wiggins was a throw-in, because WB would want more than Doughty for Eagleton, and we'd want something else if we were adding a second player, and it's better to be tall and useless than short and useless.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Crow-mosone
Not to be rude, but ol' Marty didn't do that much this year... Wiggins did even less.

[Kristof]

Comparing Mattner and Wiggins is like comparing levels of suckage. It's like measuring a vacuum.

I suppose my point was Wiggins was crap and TALL. And young ...

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Kristof
I suppose my point was Wiggins was crap and TALL. And young ... Wiggins (jan 81) is a year and a half older than Mattner (aug 82).

Wiggins has played 12 games across 4 seasons.

[CrowBoi]

I'd love Tom Harley to come home and play for the Crows ;) Don't think it'd happen though...

He'd be a perfect replacement for Ben Hart eventually... IMO

[Kristof]

Originally posted by CrowBoi
I'd love Tom Harley to come home and play for the Crows ;) Don't think it'd happen though...

He'd be a perfect replacement for Ben Hart eventually... IMO

Annoyingly, I have an AFL media guide right here, so I should have just compared their ages ... But I kind of meant that Wiggins was young (fullstop), not young (compared to Mattner), especially considering that tall guys often take longer to develop.

Anyway - is Perrie for Harley/22 worth chasing? Half back flankers aren't as high value as marking forwards, and Geelong can't get ANYONE to take the trip up the highway ... so they'd probably nibble - but is it what we want?

[topjars]

Originally posted by CrowBoi
I'd love Tom Harley to come home and play for the Crows ;) Don't think it'd happen though...

He'd be a perfect replacement for Ben Hart eventually... IMO
agreed; but with Ben Hart destined to break Michael Tucks record Tom will grow old with mould on him

[noddy]

Originally posted by Kristof



Michael Doughty and Marty Mattner for Nathan Eagleton and Patrick Wiggins. Looks like the Bulldogs can't afford Nathan (he's only 24) and Wiggins is big and mobile.

Plus - what for Perrie? Geelong have either Harley (mobile, very improved) or Kingsley (can kick a bag, but complete space cadet). One of those, plus pick 22? There's also pick 7, but is that wishful thinking?

Would not say no to the Eagleton trade,

Zilch to the next one, Mattner has a lot of improvement in him to come,

Would not trade Perrie unless for a decent kpp who could hold down chf in the likely event of us having to do without Carey & Stevens ala in 03,

At least Perrie will put in & compete plus his goal-kicking has improved heaps under the guidance of Fud,

[Stiffy_18]

I would have to say to both trades;)

The only person that would agree with you on getting Eagleton is dyertribe:)

Eagleton is not required and I would rather keep Doughty. Eagleton has done bugger all with Bulldogs. He only came good later in the year but heck anyone can get a run on late in the season.

Wiggins, is a heck. Hell we might as well keep Schell. Definetly not worth going after. In fact i think he will get delisted by the Doggies.

Harley would be handy but I would rather develop Parker who possibly has greater upside.

Kingsley - NO THANKS.

I would only trade Perrie if we got a decent KPP in return who can play at BOTH end of the ground. Eg. Ben Holland. BUT if we are offered pick 7 for Perrie and pick 29, I would take it and run.

I would rather get D. Motlop than Eagleton. At least the bloke has potential to be special and is 3-4 years younger.

[macca23]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
BUT if we are offered pick 7 for Perrie and pick 29, I would take it and run.

I would rather get D. Motlop than Eagleton. At least the bloke has potential to be special and is 3-4 years younger.

Pick 7 is my preferred option too Stiffy.

Motlop v Eagleton?? No comparison. Motlop has huge upside. Eagleton has shown he hasn't.

Unexpected was not quite the word I would have used for the trades proposed at the beginning of this thread - unacceptable is a lot closer!! ;)

[macca23]

On the topic of unexpected trades, would we get much for Ben Rutten???

A young KPP who can play back or forward and kicked 3 goals at FF in his one and only AFL game.

I can't see him becoming a gun because of his lack of pace and mobility.

But there is a real shortage of KPP's around at the moment and he just might bring something decent.

Would you trade him and what do you think he might bring??

[Kristof]

Originally posted by macca23
Pick 7 is my preferred option too Stiffy.

Motlop v Eagleton?? No comparison. Motlop has huge upside. Eagleton has shown he hasn't.

Unexpected was not quite the word I would have used for the trades proposed at the beginning of this thread - unacceptable is a lot closer!! ;)

Alright - not that I want to get precious - and it's always a risk attacking any macca(s) or stiffy, who are to this board what Hird and Lloydy are to Essendon, -- BUT --

Pick 7 and 29? They GROW vegetables in Geelong, not they ARE vegetables in Geelong. Ben Holland is a cruise ship in tight shorts. Injured, slow - and did anyone see his last half season? He made Ben Rutten look like Ben Johnson. Before or after steroids.

Motlop? Love to have him, but POTENTIAL. And I didn't think it was either/or. Eagleton has proven more. International in '99 or '00. Motlop had three good games - Eagleton had most of a good season, once WB realised how to use him. No tag! Bad! And "rather have Doughty" - please...

Anyway, it was just an attempt to throw a few vaguely realistic, out-of-the-box trades into the mix - feel free to throw others ...

[Kristof]

Originally posted by macca23
On the topic of unexpected trades, would we get much for Ben Rutten???

Maybe we'll get pick 7 and 29 for him!

[Kristof]

No, seriously - if we, as a board (resembling something close to a bunch of monkeys with a keyboard and Fox Footy) have cottoned onto the fact that he's running in a different time zone to everyone else, don't you think the recruiting officers would have?

Maybe there's some value in the KPP thang, but one good quarter isn't going to get us much. Let's keep him, and hope that he improves in ways unexpected - I can't think the value would be too high.

[noddy]

Originally posted by Kristof

Motlop? Love to have him, but POTENTIAL. And I didn't think it was either/or. Eagleton has proven more. International in '99 or '00. Motlop had three good games - Eagleton had most of a good season, once WB realised how to use him. No tag! Bad! And "rather have Doughty" - please...

Anyway, it was just an attempt to throw a few vaguely realistic, out-of-the-box trades into the mix - feel free to throw others ...

There's that bloody word "Potential" again

Well i don't think your not that far of the mark in throwing Eagleton around as a trade for Doughty & would definitely be worth a look, can remember him playing well for the paps before he went over to the doggies where he seemed to lose his way & at age 24 he still could be a very handy on-baller/forward,

[macca23]

Originally posted by Kristof
Alright - not that I want to get precious - and it's always a risk attacking any macca(s) or stiffy, who are to this board what Hird and Lloydy are to Essendon, -- BUT --

Pick 7 and 29? They GROW vegetables in Geelong, not they ARE vegetables in Geelong. Ben Holland is a cruise ship in tight shorts. Injured, slow - and did anyone see his last half season? He made Ben Rutten look like Ben Johnson. Before or after steroids.


I think you've misread this one.

What the Stiffmeister and I were wondering is whether Geelong would part with pick 7 for Perrie and OUR pick 29. Not that we get pick 29, as you seem to be suggesting was said.

They have more young talent than most clubs and need a ready made KPP up forward more than most clubs do and just ca'nt attract one.

They're also one of the 3 Vic clubs that have shown a stong interest in Perrie.

[Kristof]

Originally posted by macca23
I think you've misread this one.

What the Stiffmeister and I were wondering is whether Geelong would part with pick 7 for Perrie and OUR pick 29. Not that we get pick 29, as you seem to be suggesting was said.

They have more young talent than most clubs and need a ready made KPP up forward more than most clubs do and just ca'nt attract one.

They're also one of the 3 Vic clubs that have shown a stong interest in Perrie.

So - I should have said that I'M the vegetable ... ;)

As some previous math teachers have said to me - PAY ATTENTION TO THE DETAILS!!! Actually, it was past girlfriends that said that, but the point remains ...

Annoyingly - I think we completely agree. They need Perrie. He has an artificially high value because of that and the current marketplace (3 teams, etc). Sure, we'd love to keep him - but I remember Collingwood offering the number three pick for Ellen and scrap after one of our GF years, and we should have taken that then, too ...

[DaveW]

Originally posted by macca23
On the topic of unexpected trades, would we get much for Ben Rutten???

A young KPP who can play back or forward and kicked 3 goals at FF in his one and only AFL game.

I can't see him becoming a gun because of his lack of pace and mobility.

But there is a real shortage of KPP's around at the moment and he just might bring something decent.

Would you trade him and what do you think he might bring?? You're kidding, aren't you?

Rutten was rookie drafted and has played two matches. He's had a decent debut and an ordinary second match.

He has no trade value.

[Mong]

Yet 12 months ago Fantasia and Reid were telling everyone that our three rookie list promotions, Rutten, Bock and Mattner would've been top 20 draft picks had they been in the draft.

With this sort of judgement it's no wonder we are so keen to trade our draft picks away.

::shakes head::


Mong

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by Kristof
Pick 7 and 29? You obviously misread what i said so i'll try and simplify it.

Ian Perrie and Pick 29 to Geelong
Pick 7 to Adelaide

I wouldn't even dream of pick 7 and 29 for Perrie.

Eagleton is a GREAT underachiever. Why the hell would we want him?????? You talk about Motlop having a POTENTIAL and Eagleton WAS international. The operative word being WAS. And how did you come to the conclusion that Bulldogs cannot afford Eagleton??????? They are losing Brown who would have been on at least $350K a year. Eagleton worth is nowehere near that value.

Eagleton is the MOST one sided player I have seen. He has absolutly NO right foot. In all seriousness I would rather keep Doughty.

EDIT: I just read that macca23 has expleined Pick 7 for Perrie and pick 29 thing;)

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by macca23
On the topic of unexpected trades, would we get much for Ben Rutten???

A young KPP who can play back or forward and kicked 3 goals at FF in his one and only AFL game.

I can't see him becoming a gun because of his lack of pace and mobility.

But there is a real shortage of KPP's around at the moment and he just might bring something decent.

Would you trade him and what do you think he might bring?? He has a bugger all trade value. The only way we can get something in return for him is if he was part of the trade package.

[macca23]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
He has a bugger all trade value. The only way we can get something in return for him is if he was part of the trade package.

Gotta be totally honest here Stiffy, it was half serious, half a stir. As mong said above, 12 months ago Fantasia and Reid were telling everyone that our three rookie list promotions, Rutten, Bock and Mattner would've been top 20 draft picks had they been in the draft.

If that were true, Then Rutten should be worth the Crown Jewels - which he ain't!!

We should be trying to use him as a filler on a trade deal though to get something for him.

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by macca23
We should be trying to use him as a filler on a trade deal though to get something for him. Give him a chance macca23. Let him work on his agility and pace over the summer and see how he goes.

McGregor was not much better than Rutten is in terms of agility when he first came to the club.

Have faith mate;)

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Eagleton WAS international. :confused:

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by DaveW
:confused: He represented Australia Vs Ireland;)

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
He represented Australia Vs Ireland;) Oh didn't realise that.

Then again, even hacks like Chris Heffernan have represented Australia.

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by DaveW
Oh didn't realise that.

Then again, even hacks like Chris Heffernan have represented Australia. Exactly;)

[macca23]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Give him a chance macca23. Let him work on his agility and pace over the summer and see how he goes.

McGregor was not much better than Rutten is in terms of agility when he first came to the club.

Have faith mate;)

McGregor was only 18 when he started playing AFL and even back then he was far more mobile and had much more pace than Rutten will ever have. Mc Gregor is in the top bracket of sprinters over short distances in the squad. Rutten is 20 and lumbers, not runs.

I'm finding it hard to have faith, Stiffy. :(

[Crow-mosone]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Eagleton is a GREAT underachiever. Why the hell would we want him?????? You talk about Motlop having a POTENTIAL and Eagleton WAS international. The operative word being WAS. And how did you come to the conclusion that Bulldogs cannot afford Eagleton??????? They are losing Brown who would have been on at least $350K a year. Eagleton worth is nowehere near that value.

Eagleton is the MOST one sided player I have seen. He has absolutly NO right foot. In all seriousness I would rather keep Doughty.



Dude,
a little lateral thinking here, we need an outside ball carrier with pace, someone who can link with Tyson sweeping from a back pocket and move the ball. Someone who can break lines and kick goals, and frankly they cost a lot of cash. Look at Nick Stevens, just think what he would be worth if played a decent finals match.

We don't have anyone like that, and eagleton can do it. He'd be cheap, he's south australian - so he'd be more settled, and he showed a bit this year. When WB moved him on the ball, and off the on baller, he showed he still knew how to find the pill.

We were too slow and predictable at times, and Eagleton is someone who can carry and break lines. For the price he would cost, he's worth the risk imo. I'd bet our footy department has considered it as well - given his local pedigree.

[CrowBoi]

I reckon McMahon would be a better investment than Eagleton... All he needs is a little gym work, and that speed is up there with the best of them...

[Crow-mosone]

Originally posted by CrowBoi
I reckon McMahon would be a better investment than Eagleton... All he needs is a little gym work, and that speed is up there with the best of them...

it's all about the price, I would rather Akermanis, but it doesn't work like that.

eagleton, should be tradeable for supermarket coupons.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Crow-mosone
we need an outside ball carrier with pace I don't know if you've heard of him, but there's a bloke in our squad by the name of Andrew McLeod...

[Crow-mosone]

Originally posted by DaveW
I don't know if you've heard of him, but there's a bloke in our squad by the name of Andrew McLeod...

gee dave,
thanks. you're a pretty smart guy.
besides he does his best work inside.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Crow-mosone
besides he does his best work inside. Since when?

[Crow-mosone]

Dave,

gee you got me there - too clever.

[Kristof]

Originally posted by Crow-mosone
Dave,

gee you got me there - too clever.

Don't get stroppy C-mosone, you can argue your case better than this ... ;)

[Crow-mosone]

Originally posted by Kristof
Don't get stroppy C-mosone, you can argue your case better than this ... ;)

C-Mo could be my tag down in da hood!
mind you closest I get to the hood is at the wheel of the bavarian.


can't be arsed at times. Look as you well know mcleod does his best work at stoppages, in traffic, and link up play moving forward. he plays in the middle, or on the ball. At no point does he function in the true sense of outside player, he may not be in and under, but he is always right in the thick of it.

As opposed to a true ouside players like Craig Bradley, or even more recently Nick Stevens and Aussie Jones (cast your minds back sports fans, it was true once). Loitering wide of the pack, ready to RECEIVE the clearance, not make it, tuck the ball under his arm and go. Player must be able to work backwards of the centre square, and link up as the ball is being moved from half back. If Mcleod is linking here, he is too far behind play, and the coach should be shot. It's a luxury we can't afford.

Eagleton was once great at this, and when he pushed forward, he would use his pace to burst through the wing and roost over half forward.

For a dollar fifty, it's worth considering.

[noddy]

Originally posted by Crow-mosone
C-Mo could be my tag down in da hood!
mind you closest I get to the hood is at the wheel of the bavarian.


can't be arsed at times. Look as you well know mcleod does his best work at stoppages, in traffic, and link up play moving forward. he plays in the middle, or on the ball. At no point does he function in the true sense of outside player, he may not be in and under, but he is always right in the thick of it.

As opposed to a true ouside players like Craig Bradley, or even more recently Nick Stevens and Aussie Jones (cast your minds back sports fans, it was true once). Loitering wide of the pack, ready to RECEIVE the clearance, not make it, tuck the ball under his arm and go. Player must be able to work backwards of the centre square, and link up as the ball is being moved from half back. If Mcleod is linking here, he is too far behind play, and the coach should be shot. It's a luxury we can't afford.

Eagleton was once great at this, and when he pushed forward, he would use his pace to burst through the wing and roost over half forward.

For a dollar fifty, it's worth considering.

I can see where your coming from

but don't expect a rush of approval, ;)

[nananana catman]

I honestly think there is no way in hell geelong would trade Tom Harley. I dont know if you can remember back to the start of the season but he was injured and it cost us big time. i know im a little bit behind the topic but.... meh Kinglsey possibly but not Harley.

As for Ian Perrie, I dont think wed give up pick 7 for an erratic kick who doesnt kick goals consistently. we have enough of them already :D .

[Bockchoy67]

I think that we've underated Ian Perrie a bit. I mean, he can kick goals, and although he's not consistent, he can kicks lots of goals whne he's really up to it.

Round 12 this year against Melbourne, Perrie kicked 6 or 7 goals.

Sure, he wasn't against the best of opposition at the time but he kicked four of those goals in fifteen minutes.

And he's only about 23. He's got plenty of time in front of him if he strives to do better.

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by Crow-mosone
we need an outside ball carrier with pace In 2002, Doughty was this man and in 2003 it was Burton. If we are to add to our midfield then it would have to be the in and under type not another outside player. We have Burton, Doughty, Begley and Reilly coming through (just to name a few).

I just don't see the point in trading for a 24 year old that will not make your best 22 no matter how much he costs. I would rather take a punt at youngster even if we pay a bit more. As CrowBoi said, McMahon would be a better option but as you pointed out he would cost more. BUT in the long run you will get better value out of McMahon than you would out of Eagleton.

The player I would really like for this role would be Daniel Motlop but he might be a bit out of our reach

[Russian]

Perrie for Harley and an exchange of 1st round picks. Chances improve if Geelong can secure Bradshaw from Brisbane.

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by nananana catman
I honestly think there is no way in hell geelong would trade Tom Harley. I dont know if you can remember back to the start of the season but he was injured and it cost us big time. i know im a little bit behind the topic but.... meh Kinglsey possibly but not Harley.

As for Ian Perrie, I dont think wed give up pick 7 for an erratic kick who doesnt kick goals consistently. we have enough of them already :D .
Geelong would do well to trade Harley for Perrie IMO, because it would mean Graham would move back to defence where he plays his best footy with Scarlett in the key back roles. Also, end up with a solid target up forward to take the pressure of the kids (Playfair, McCarthy, etc).

[Crow-mosone]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
In 2002, Doughty was this man and in 2003 it was Burton. If we are to add to our midfield then it would have to be the in and under type not another outside player. We have Burton, Doughty, Begley and Reilly coming through (just to name a few).

I just don't see the point in trading for a 24 year old that will not make your best 22 no matter how much he costs. I would rather take a punt at youngster even if we pay a bit more. As CrowBoi said, McMahon would be a better option but as you pointed out he would cost more. BUT in the long run you will get better value out of McMahon than you would out of Eagleton.

The player I would really like for this role would be Daniel Motlop but he might be a bit out of our reach

Now Stiffy, I am not trying to pick on you here. But the guys you listed don't have much pace, or have not established themselves yet. Burton is an endurance athlete, begley is a tall running defender, doughty isn't in the team and reilly is an unknown at this stage - though he looks promising. These guys do not perform this role, if they did we wouldn't look so slow and predictable moving the ball from down back.

a 24 year old has another 8 years at least, and if in form Eagleton certainly makes our team. without a doubt. If he's not, we haven't lost much. that's all.

I'm talking about a low risk gamble with a potential high return.

[macca23]

Originally posted by Crow-mosone
Now Stiffy, I am not trying to pick on you here. But the guys you listed don't have much pace, or have not established themselves yet. Burton is an endurance athlete, begley is a tall running defender, doughty isn't in the team and reilly is an unknown at this stage - though he looks promising. These guys do not perform this role, if they did we wouldn't look so slow and predictable moving the ball from down back.

a 24 year old has another 8 years at least, and if in form Eagleton certainly makes our team. without a doubt. If he's not, we haven't lost much. that's all.

I'm talking about a low risk gamble with a potential high return.

It is a gamble, because a regular player in the bottom side is no certainty to get a game in a side like Adelaide's.

On the other hand Doughty would be a regular with the Bullies.

Eagleton did play okay though in the last 11 games for the Doggies - averaged 19 disposals for those 11 games.

I'd do the trade with the following adjustment

Eagleton and Bullies' 3rd round pick

for

Doughty and Crows' 3rd round pick.

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by macca23
Eagleton and Bullies' 3rd round pick

for

Doughty and Crows' 3rd round pick. I could live with that. We improve our standing in the 3rd round by 10 or 11 places which would give us a crack at a decent prospect.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by macca23
Eagleton and Bullies' 3rd round pick

for

Doughty and Crows' 3rd round pick. The Bulldogs are as likely to agree to that as they are to agree to swapping Daniel Schell for Robert Murphy.

[macca23]

Originally posted by DaveW
The Bulldogs are as likely to agree to that as they are to agree to swapping Daniel Schell for Robert Murphy.

I have the same thoughts about a straight swap of Eagleton for Doughty.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by macca23
I have the same thoughts about a straight swap of Eagleton for Doughty. Exactly. Eagleton's value is long way above Doughty's.

[Crow-mosone]

Bullies will want to sell eagleton while his value is slightly high again, rather than be stuck with him. he is now tradeable, when 6 months ago he wasn't.
They would want much more than Doughty right now, but come the end of the week, the price might be a lot lower.

might, being the operative.

[DaveW]

Eagleton will stay at the Doggies.

They paid a fortune - trade wise - to get him. They'll hang onto now that he's come good.

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by DaveW
Eagleton will stay at the Doggies.

They paid a fortune - trade wise - to get him. They'll hang onto now that he's come good.
Cool, because I would prefer to keep Dogga than trade for Eagleton.

[DaveW]

I can't believe how highly some people rate Doughty. He was clearly a surplus player in 2003.

Although if he stays, it's a boost for South Adelaide at least. :cool:

[macca23]

Originally posted by DaveW
I can't believe how highly some people rate Doughty. He was clearly a surplus player in 2003.

Although if he stays, it's a boost for South Adelaide at least. :cool:

Surplus doesn't mean that you can't play.

In 2002 when we finished 4th, Doughty played everyone of the 25 games, and held his position with good footy.

In 2003 he got squeezed out with the transfer of Burton from playing as a forward to a wingman, plus the emergence of Reilly and the use of Hart, Begley and at times Torneyand Massie on the other wing.

Equally I can't believe how highly you rate Eagleton who averages less than 14 disposals per game over 72 games as an on-baller for the Bullies.

The facts barely justify your statement that "Eagleton's value is long way above Doughty's."

Doughty is good enough to play AFL consistently. A lack of opportunity might just mean that his career will be elsewhere other than at the Crows.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by macca23
Surplus doesn't mean that you can't play It means you're not good enough.

Doughty has minimal trade value.

I'm not a big fan of Eagleton. But the Bulldogs would value him highly.

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by DaveW
It means you're not good enough.

Doughty has minimal trade value.

I'm not a big fan of Eagleton. But the Bulldogs would value him highly.
Dogga was a victim of a lack of opportunities in 2003 & wasn't given a fair run given the poor form at times from Bode, Ladhams, etc.

Sure he won't get us anywhere near a 1st round pick, but he is a better player than Eagleton who has been given too many chances to prove himself. Dogga would only dream of the opportunities that Eagleton has been given. Hence why I believe it is in his best interests to trade him, as he would confortably make the starting line-up for at least half the AFL teams.

[macca23]

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
Dogga was a victim of a lack of opportunities in 2003 & wasn't given a fair run given the poor form at times from Bode, Ladhams, etc.

Sure he won't get us anywhere near a 1st round pick, but he is a better player than Eagleton who has been given too many chances to prove himself. Dogga would only dream of the opportunities that Eagleton has been given. Hence why I believe it is in his best interests to trade him, as he would confortably make the starting line-up for at least half the AFL teams.

I couldn't have put it better.

Spot on.

[DaveW]

Doughty was a victim of lack of opportunities because he wasn't good enough.

He sometimes couldn't get a game ahead of the likes of Gallagher, Mattner and Begley.

His last game against Collingwood was rather ordinary.

Doughty doesn't fit the Dogs' needs anyway. So I don't know why everyone thinks we can ship him off to Footscray.

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by DaveW
Doughty was a victim of lack of opportunities because he wasn't good enough.

He sometimes couldn't get a game ahead of the likes of Gallagher, Mattner and Begley.

His last game against Collingwood was rather ordinary.

Doughty doesn't fit the Dogs' needs anyway. So I don't know why everyone thinks we can ship him off to Footscray.
IMO, Dogga is a better player than Gags, Mattner & Begley. These guys were all given more games than him not because of football ability! Dogga has played more good games in 2002, than the 3 of these combined in 2003.

Playing Doughty at CHB on Burns was a stupid matchup, as he is on-baller. Ayres should take the blame for that one. Also, I hate rating or playing guys for only 1 game, as it doen't give a fair reflection of their ability.

[naughty monkey]

Doughty started like a house on fire in 2002 and got worse the longer the season went. He was very lucky not to get dropped from just after the halfway mark of the season.

Let's keep this in perspective, fellas.
He's a 24 year old that's has one handy season

[maccas_no1]

Dogga is a good player and should be retained on the AFC list in 2004 and beyond, he got lost a little in Ayres's stupid idea's of try a different player in a position they dont play for a week they play bad and get dropped it happened to Gallagher and mattner also:rolleyes:

I would rate Dogga a better player than Bode..................Dogga is more consistant;)

I'd trade Bode before Dogga;)

[lozstar]

Originally posted by maccas_no1
'd trade Bode before Dogga;) Bet that Ayres will do it the other way around, or give Dogga no chances at all next year :rolleyes:

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by maccas_no1
I would rate Dogga a better player than Bode..................Dogga is more consistant;)

I'd trade Bode before Dogga;) You're kidding?????:confused:

Bode is twice the player that Doughty is. Doughty with his buildshould go in and get the hard ball not skirt around the packs like a girl. Bode with his frame is always at the bottom of the pack doing the hard yards. Doughty might have a better build than Bode and is a better kick and marks but apart from those 3 attributes, Bode sh|ts all over him.

Just because Bode had a poor year in 2003 (Thanks to Ayers) he is being bagged.

Bode is a better player than Doughty. If I had to trade one of those it definetly wouldn't be Bode.

[maccas_no1]

You just said it Stiffy..........Better kick and Better Mark more solidly built;)

Sorry I rate Dogga higher than Bode;)

If Bode plays well he is great but he isnt on song he is useless, Dogga isnt that type of player he gets in and has a go every week;)

[maccas_no1]

So in what areas does Bode **** all over Dogga?????

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by maccas_no1
You just said it Stiffy..........Better kick and Better Mark more solidly built;) So by your reasoning Ben Rutten is a better player than Mark Stevens??????

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by maccas_no1
So in what areas does Bode **** all over Dogga????? Reading of the play
Handballing
Endurance
Clearences
Goalkicking

If the in and under types struggle Doughty chases easy ball or will have a quiet game.

Lets face it we have a surplus of players of Doughty's type while we are thin on Bode types.

Trading Bode before Doughty would be a very dumb move by the AFC.

[maccas_no1]

No Rutten isnt a better player than Stevo as he hasnt proven himself yet but over his career I'd say he will be;)

It's just my opinion on what I have witnessed with my own eyes at the footy, Bode and Dogga both had good 2002, in 2003 both have gone down hill, yes I agree Ayres ****ed Bode up but he is just too inconstant for my liking, Dogga if given the RIGHT opportunities will be a better player in the long term than Bode:)

[maccas_no1]

But Dogga nor Bode should be relied on to kick goals thats why we have six forwards......................what cost Adelaide this year was poor forwardline delivery, that is the area we have to improve on, even the likes of Mcleod were delivering the ball poorly, there were countless occassions this season that MCleod should have gone for goal himself but he has tried to pass it off and the ball has been turned over:rolleyes: AFC have got to improve in this area, we could have the best forwardline in the business but if we dont deliver it correctly it's a waste, this is where is comes back to the coach to get it right lets face it the AFC have two good ruckmen, we have a good backline and good forwardline , but if we have a **** game plan and the coach playing players where they dont usually play them it's a waste, thats why Ayres will NEVER take us to the flag:(

[Mong]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Bode is a better player than Doughty. If I had to trade one of those it definetly wouldn't be Bode.


Bode is clearly a better player than Doughty in my opinion. But that doesn't mean Doughty is more likely to be traded. To the contrary, Bode would have more trade value and interest from other clubs and would present a more worth while trade option, if we actually aree interested in gaining anything significant in return.

Having said that I hope we keep Bode. I think even though his value would be higher than Doughty, he probably isn't at the peak of his trade value and I would be surprised if we could get his true worth. I put Ladhams in the same boat. Very good players coming off inconsistent seasons.


Mong

[maccas_no1]

The AFC seem to have an overload of these types of players we really need to sort out who is required and who isnt over the next couple of years or otherwise our midfeild will suffer:rolleyes:

[Crow-mosone]

Originally posted by maccas_no1
[B
I would rate Dogga a better player than Bode..................Dogga is more consistant;)

I'd trade Bode before Dogga;) [/B]

perhaps that says more about you, than either player?

[Crow-mosone]

Originally posted by maccas_no1
You just said it Stiffy..........Better kick and Better Mark more solidly built;)

Sorry I rate Dogga higher than Bode;)

If Bode plays well he is great but he isnt on song he is useless, Dogga isnt that type of player he gets in and has a go every week;)

for chrissakes, you're talking about a player who can'tt get a game.

Bode was recruited because he has an ability to read the fall of the ball, and we have precious few players who can read the play upfield like he can. He's kicking needs work, but it's his instincts that are his strength.

Geez I worry about a couple of you.

[acg_204*]

Originally posted by Crow-mosone
perhaps that says more about you, than either player?

Ouch.

[Kane McGoodwin]

Bode is currently a better player than Dogga (& worth more trade wise). I would not have a problem with trading both of them, as it will free up some room to play our next generation (ie. Reilly, Schuback & Co).

[macca23]

Originally posted by maccas_no1
No Rutten isnt a better player than Stevo as he hasnt proven himself yet but over his career I'd say he will be;)

It's just my opinion on what I have witnessed with my own eyes at the footy, Bode and Dogga both had good 2002, in 2003 both have gone down hill, yes I agree Ayres ****ed Bode up but he is just too inconstant for my liking, Dogga if given the RIGHT opportunities will be a better player in the long term than Bode:)

Can't agree with either of these comparisons.

IMO Rutten will never be half the player of Mark Stevens. Rutten moves with the speed of a ruptured duck.

Bode is twice the player that Doughty is, because he gets balls that Doughty never would - hard almost unwinnable hurting balls (footballs - not his ;) )

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by macca23
Can't agree with either of these comparisons.

IMO Rutten will never be half the player of Mark Stevens. Rutten moves with the speed of a ruptured duck.

Bode is twice the player that Doughty is, because he gets balls that Doughty never would - hard almost unwinnable hurting balls (footballs - not his ;) ) If we could somehow take Nathan Bock's agility and pace and install in in Rutten we would have one very good player.

I am glad someone agrees with me regarding Doughty/Bode debate. Doughty would dream of getting the number of hard ball gets in a career that Bode would get in a season.

I never really have much time for soft outside receivers.

Reilly is an outside player but he puts his body on the line and he goes in hard for the ball. Doughty on the other hand runs a mile:(

[macca23]

I still think there is a place for Doughty in AFL footy though Stiffy.

He has pace, good ball handling skills and is a good deliverer of the ball. A classic outside type wingman.

There's room for one of these in every team, but no more than that IMO. Reilly will be ours, as he has all the skills that Doughty has and more, and is a lot harder than Doughty.

That's why i think we should trade Doughty for everybody's benefit, as we would get something we could use, and he could be of value to the right team.

But Bode is by far the greater value to a team for the reasons I stated previously.

[noddy]

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
Bode is currently a better player than Dogga (& worth more trade wise). I would not have a problem with trading both of them, as it will free up some room to play our next generation (ie. Reilly, Schuback & Co).

Matty Bode didn't have the best of years in 03 but no way would i put Doughty above him in the "hold onto stakes"

Bodey lost a bit of self belief & the confidence of our coach for a good part of last year but with no Bicks for 04 we will need his in/under style of play more than ever,

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by noddy
Matty Bode didn't have the best of years in 03 but no way would i put Doughty above him in the "hold onto stakes"

Neither did I :confused:

I said Bodey would be more valuable than Dogga, but I would consider trading both if we got something decent for them.

[noddy]

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
Neither did I :confused:

I said Bodey would be more valuable than Dogga, but I would consider trading both if we got something decent for them.

oops, sorry about that Kane i got the wrong quote mentioned,

[maccas_no1]

So what are you suggesting with your comment crow-mosone????? You suggesting I dont watch footy enough????? You suggesting I cant have an opinion?????

All I stated was that I think Dogga is a better for the AFC than Bode;) Not to have my name shot down in flames:rolleyes:

[Crow-mosone]

Originally posted by maccas_no1
So what are you suggesting with your comment crow-mosone????? You suggesting I dont watch footy enough????? You suggesting I cant have an opinion?????

All I stated was that I think Dogga is a better for the AFC than Bode;) Not to have my name shot down in flames:rolleyes:

well which is it? is Bode twice the player that Dogga is, as you stated above, or is doughty rated higher in your estimation as you stated earlier still?

how can one be a better fit than another, they don't play the same position.

[kyza47]

as a bulldogs supporter - trust me u dont want the Eagle. he cost us an arm and a leg and what has he done? he played a few excellent games for us in the middle of the season but tappered off again. Adelaide has a great midfield and doesn't need an inconsistant player like him. What r the chances of Perrie or Bassett playing at the Dogs? Rumor has it Bassett wants to come over here... but i dunno wat we'd give 4 him.

[Jars458]

Originally posted by kyza47
as a bulldogs supporter - trust me u dont want the Eagle. he cost us an arm and a leg and what has he done? he played a few excellent games for us in the middle of the season but tappered off again. Adelaide has a great midfield and doesn't need an inconsistant player like him. What r the chances of Perrie or Bassett playing at the Dogs? Rumor has it Bassett wants to come over here... but i dunno wat we'd give 4 him.

Eagleton got 3 Brownlow votes against Port adelaide if I rememer correctly which was about Round 21

I would be happy with Eagleton for Doughty.

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by Jars458
Eagleton got 3 Brownlow votes against Port adelaide if I rememer correctly which was about Round 21

I would be happy with Eagleton for Doughty.
I wouldn't.

Happy to trade Dogga (& I think it it is best for his development that goes elsewhere), but I don't want the under-performing, inconsistent Eagleton.

[Thunderstruck]

How about......Ian Perrie for Tom Harley from Geelong. Im a fan of Perrie but im an even bigger fan of Harley. Very strong bloke who gives his all and will still improve. Geelong need a key forward we need a key defender. I doubt the cats would give him up tho.