Mega Thread Trade and List Management discussion

[go you pups]

Who gives the slightest s**t about height?

Scarlett always gave away height to his opponents and he consistently won. Height is one of the least important attributes to a defender.

Exactly, both him and Tom Harley were only 192cm I think, but they read the ball brilliantly and were rarely beaten in 1 on 1s. Positioning and reading of the game are key as a KPD and Roughead has vast improvement to do in these areas.

 

[themightydoggies]

we have to start playing tommy c, he is prob ahead of minno for mine!

 

[TimC]

I could actually see grant being of interest to gws. Addison hasn't worked for them. They need a medium forward and a small, defensive pressure forward as well.

Yes, possibly. But not for Patton or such a high pick.

 

[timtamWB]

What do people think about kreuzer?

Not a bad idea, the only problem is that Carlton would probably want our first pick for him, or someone like Hrovat, and I wouldn't do that in a pink fit. So while he could be a good one to get in, he would cost way too much.

 

[timtamWB]

Wallis is tradeable as is Hrovat. We can't keep stockpiling all these kids and expect to keep them all. We also have Smith, Honey, Hunter, JJ, mystery man Prudden, Tutt.
We can only get quality by offering quality. GWS holds the aces. They don't have to trade, so to make it happen we have to offer big.
I'm trying to look at it totally impartially, it hurts but the future looks brighter with Patton or Boyd in fwd line

So what you're saying is that Wallis is practically untouchable? Hrovat is.

 

[TedDougChris]

What do people think about kreuzer?

Pass - while talented lacks the natural hunger and desire to really bust a gut and compete IMO. Just cruises (sorry) through games and is also starting to look a little like Tom Williams - athletically top notch, body doesn't cope with the rigours of the game...

One of those not quite a ruckman, not quite a forward types... His best is very good, but don't see it often enough..

 

[fronkalicious]

Wasn't suggesting we trade him - as I said, it was just a random example from the pile of traded that have been suggested in this thread.

Dannnnnn are we getting your KPF target list or are you going to keep being a responsible student and study all day??

 

[Dale4captain]

On the height debate, its really circumstantial. It depends massively on the opponent obviously. You don't really want a difference of more than about 6cm, past that and the taller opponent will get a massive advantage.

You've also gotta think though, a lot of defenders and forwards for that matter rely on their jump to get to the ball. So you could be 210cm and have a s**t vertical jump and be beaten by the bloke at 197cm who can leap tall buildings. People who are saying Talia (who is 194.5cm) doesn't have the height to be a key tall and should be played as the third tall are dreaming. Thats plenty big enough.

 

[TedDougChris]

Dannnnnn are we getting your KPF target list or are you going to keep being a responsible student and study all day??

Pfftttt.. I'm meant to be working......

 

[TBOW]

I’d be really interested in hearing what anyone thinks these massive trades that other clubs will cook up might be. No one was able to get a deal done involving players for the mini-draft and there aren’t clubs with high multiple picks or compo picks this time around.

Looking at the Melbourne teams -

Carlton are apparently chasing Mitchell who would require a pick 1 in return. I also don’t see who they could offer up that they would be prepared to lose, that would interest GWS, and would be prepared to move to Sydney.

St.Kilda would be reckless to offer up big on a key forward when they have so many other needs. They have also already weakened their list so much they couldn’t afford to lose any more experience.

Richmond will not offer up their young guns, and the rest of their list is made up of plodders that would not interest GWS. Maybe someone like Rance or Grimes might interest them but I can’t really see that topping what we might put up.

Melbourne I can’t see being that interested. They are still looking to buil on their midfield.

Essendon don’t have the commodities and probably need a gun mid more than a tall.

North probably won’t really have anything of interest to GWS.

Hawthorn & Geelong probably have other needs and won’t have the draft picks to compete.

Collingwood could maybe offer up someone like Sidebottom but I’m not sure that would interest GWS and I’m not sure Collingwood would be going that hard with Moore coming in and Cloke having a few years left.


Maybe GWS’ best option is to try to hold on to these guys for as long as they can and hope the AFL allows the trading of future draft picks in the next couple of years. Otherwise I can’t see them getting what they want.

 

[TedDougChris]

I’d be really interested in hearing what anyone thinks these massive trades that other clubs will cook up might be. No one was able to get a deal done involving players for the mini-draft and there aren’t clubs with high multiple picks or compo picks this time around.

Looking at the Melbourne teams -

Carlton are apparently chasing Mitchell who would require a pick 1 in return. I also don’t see who they could offer up that they would be prepared to lose, that would interest GWS, and would be prepared to move to Sydney.

Sorry to be pedantic, but I think any Carlton player would be a good deal for GWS in return for a Sydney player. They'd be thrilled. Player for nothing, their cross town rivals lose a good player in the bargain.....

I will answer seriously a little later.....

 

[fronkalicious]

Mohr gone for much of 2015. Talia chip gets more valuable if we were willing to deal.

 

[TedDougChris]

Mohr gone for much of 2015. Talia chip gets more valuable if we were willing to deal.

I agree with the assessment that we are paying too much if we give up both pick 6 AND Talia.

Sure, we solve our KPF woes in a few years (it won't be overnight), but our defensive stocks would be: Roughie, Morris, Roberts, Austin and..... ?? Heaven help us if we had the deadly double - Morris' form goes off a cliff, or his body starts to fail him week to week and Roughies shoulders don't hold up.

If it were a straight swap (which is not likely - slight understatement here), you could use pick #6 on Goddard (for example) and play him if needed in case of emergencies. But we need that early pick to fill existing holes in our list. The model we have used to date in our rebuild is late round picks for trades, early picks to the draft. Giving away a talented, but erratic kid AND a good pick is too much at this stage in our rebuild. I'm still firmly in the camp of the hardworking, quick, skillful midfielder will add more to us next year than anything else...

How we plug the gap in our forward line is one that I cannot figure out. Pity the AFL had no brains or balls when establishing the expansion clubs and took the easy option....

 

[doggies ftw]

Roberts and Talia are 196, and 195cm respectively. Not exactly small.

 

[Igloo]

I probably agree, I think Stringer is a real Point Of Difference player. He and Bonts have been inspired picks. I just am desperate to get a gun young kpf prospect. It's kind of like Robert Johnson making the deal with the devil at the Crossroads.

Not the best example, considering he only lived to 27

 

[Cudi]

As much as I'd love a Jon Patton I just don't think we would be able to work out a deal without losing someone young with quality. If we where able to get a deal offloading our first pick and Higgins then I do it in a second, but I can't see GWS doing that deal. They'd want one of our gun young mids and I'm just not prepared to give any away. So an alternative that I think is realistic plus not losing any young quality is this:

Trade our second pick for Kristian Jacksh and keeping our first pick and drafting either Goddard or Marchbank with the idea of them playing as a back and KJ as a forward. I think that GWS would do that deal or maybe a swap of later picks as well, if Higgins leaves his pick could come into it. This would then gain us a KPF and KFD and then Z.Cordy with 3rd or 4th. If Higgins does leave and we get KJ for a straight swap of our 2nd rounder then draft a skillful mid with the compo pick, hopefully L.Duggan.

So this would be the side in about 3 years time. I haven't included anyone over or nearing 30 years of age even though they'd still be playing good enough footy and would be around the mark. I gone with a 25 year old and under just for the sake of the exercise. So that means no Griff, Higgins, Picken, Dickson etc. Its more of a team to showcase just how much young talent we have and what might a potential premiership side could look like.

B: Wood Roughead Talia
CHB: Darley Goddard/Marchbank JJ
C: Macrae Wallis Hrovat
CHF: Dahlhaus Jones Crameri
F: Hunter Jacksh Stringer
Foll: Cambpell Liberatore Bontempelli
Int: Smith Roberts Stevens Sub:Honeychurch
Others: Z.Cordy Tutt Grant A.Cordy Redpath Jong

I think that a pretty dam good side and could do the business without having to sell the farm to get a FF. What do others think?? Am I overrating Jacksh or is he good enough to be a target.

 

[Dogs Rule]

I’d be really interested in hearing what anyone thinks these massive trades that other clubs will cook up might be. No one was able to get a deal done involving players for the mini-draft and there aren’t clubs with high multiple picks or compo picks this time around.

Looking at the Melbourne teams -

Carlton are apparently chasing Mitchell who would require a pick 1 in return. I also don’t see who they could offer up that they would be prepared to lose, that would interest GWS, and would be prepared to move to Sydney.

St.Kilda would be reckless to offer up big on a key forward when they have so many other needs. They have also already weakened their list so much they couldn’t afford to lose any more experience.

Richmond will not offer up their young guns, and the rest of their list is made up of plodders that would not interest GWS. Maybe someone like Rance or Grimes might interest them but I can’t really see that topping what we might put up.

Melbourne I can’t see being that interested. They are still looking to buil on their midfield.

Essendon don’t have the commodities and probably need a gun mid more than a tall.

North probably won’t really have anything of interest to GWS.

Hawthorn & Geelong probably have other needs and won’t have the draft picks to compete.

Collingwood could maybe offer up someone like Sidebottom but I’m not sure that would interest GWS and I’m not sure Collingwood would be going that hard with Moore coming in and Cloke having a few years left.


Maybe GWS’ best option is to try to hold on to these guys for as long as they can and hope the AFL allows the trading of future draft picks in the next couple of years. Otherwise I can’t see them getting what they want.

I did chuckle at Robbo's article in the Hun today when he mentioned the Bombers among the potential suitors for Waite.

Apparently Carlisle and Daniher need support.

Give me a spell. How many freakin' tall forwards do you need?

 

[TedDougChris]

I did chuckle at Robbo's article in the Hun today when he mentioned the Bombers among the potential suitors for Waite.

Apparently Carlisle and Daniher need support.

Give me a spell. How many freakin' tall forwards do you need?

According to GWS and GCS list managers - all of them......

 

[boydsno1]

Minson on the big breakfast this morning let Darcy know he and i assumed those at the club were not very happy with his suggestion of trading Griffen. Darcy may need to make a few phone calls.

 

[ThirdLegUp]

Minson on the big breakfast this morning let Darcy know he and i assumed those at the club were not very happy with his suggestion of trading Griffen. Darcy may need to make a few phone calls.

Yep you can hear it over at the bulldog site, http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/ .
right hand panel. lol Darcy was treading water for a bit there, Big Min staring him down hehe

 

[King Harold]

What do people think about kreuzer?

Definite NO for me Fronk.
We have to many holes already , don't need to add an injury prone ruckman.

 

[Dogs Rule]

Yep you can hear it over at the bulldog site, http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/ .
right hand panel. lol Darcy was treading water for a bit there, Big Min staring him down hehe

Great work Minno. Standing up for his captain and his club - love it.

 

[Snake Livermore]

I have a question and a fact.

Question: what would it take to upgrade pick 6 to pick 1 in a trade? Grant? Higgins? I feel that could be attractive to the Saints/lions with their Swiss cheese lists. They get a good playerAND a high pick, we get the pick that could help swing a Patton/Carlisle trade. Or if not used in a trade, it gets us McCartin.

Fact: a super awesome kpd is only required if your game plan is to leave your back 6 isolated 1 on 1, eg the rocket years. With Lake, Morris etc it worked. I don't think this is McCartney's plan, we're supposed to be using 'team defence' However we are clearly not executing well right now. But long term mediocre kpds (eg Dawson) should do. I wouldn't be trading or using a first rounder on one.

 

[immortalmike]

I have a question and a fact.

Question: what would it take to upgrade pick 6 to pick 1 in a trade? Grant? Higgins? I feel that could be attractive to the Saints/lions with their Swiss cheese lists. They get a good playerAND a high pick, we get the pick that could help swing a Patton/Carlisle trade. Or if not used in a trade, it gets us McCartin...

Would you have taken pick 9 and Colin Sylvia last year for pick 4?

 

[Snake Livermore]

Would you have taken pick 9 and Colin Sylvia last year for pick 4?

No he was too old for our needs. Higgins and Grant are perfect age for the Saints though.

Anyway, what would it take?