What will happen with the two plastic franchises?

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I am well aware of the SANFL and opposition clubs stance on Port, it hasn't exactly been obvious since the late 80's.

However I suppose the real debate is about that, do they really want to get rid of Port? The amount of fans and support they would lose would be horrendous - despite being a Reserves side now as well as having to give up their zones and fold their underage teams, Port still have and draw a lot of support at SANFL level.

Bit like Glenelg - a pretty shithouse team yet still has a decent support base.
 
Heardy_101 said:
I am well aware of the SANFL and opposition clubs stance on Port, it hasn't exactly been obvious since the late 80's.

However I suppose the real debate is about that, do they really want to get rid of Port? The amount of fans and support they would lose would be horrendous - despite being a Reserves side now as well as having to give up their zones and fold their underage teams, Port still have and draw a lot of support at SANFL level.

Bit like Glenelg - a pretty shithouse team yet still has a decent support base.
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Im pretty sure that's why the SANFL directors voted in the AFL teams originally, with the fear of maybe losing support. But since the majority of SANFL fans have been so vocal about the fact they don't want AFL in the SANFL, the club directors will have no other choice than start going with the want of their members or else these club directors will no longer be directors as they will be voted out by the members.

Most fans couldn't give a toss about the numbers game they just enjoy going to the local footy. If they wanted more they would get on an AFL team and go to the that. By saying more they could spend more and get reserved seating have entertainment and a different experience to that offered by local footy.

But too think the normal true SANFL fan cares about being the 2nd best comp in the land or if they can afford to pay their players $100K, from my experience I would say no we couldn't care a less. As long as they can afford to run the league and offer what they have been offering for years that great.
 
Despite the fact my posts seem to say otherwise, I don't think the SANFL is all that irrelevant - I just don't think it's completely relevant, either, especially in this day and age where AFL is seen as the highest and most professional form of the game.

the SANFL, since the 1990's has been a Reserve-grade competition, and in comparison with the VFL-AFL, the quality of Football as well as the quality and performance of team is also Reserve grade. It's not just the SANFL, the VFA-VFL, WAFL and NEAFL are at best Reserve-grade competitions as well. Mind you having said that, the VFL and WAFL are probably in worse situations than the SANFL. However a young, talented aspiring footballer isn't going to, and nor does he want to, spend too much time dawdling in the SANFL. He wants an AFL club to take notice of him. So at best he only wants to spend at least 2-3 years at SANFL level. Or, he could bite the bullet and go play in the TAC Cup (if he can afford to move over to Vic) where the clubs, especially the bigger Vic clubs such as Hawthorn and Collingwood, tend to look first. There aren't many aspiring footballers out there who actually want to stay at State/Reserve level for more than 2-3 years. Those who do are generally draft rejects, delisted players or players who still have gas in the tank but their AFL club wanted youth.

Furthermore, and I posted this in the other thread, while it has been clear since the 1980's that the SANFL and the 8 clubs hate Port Adelaide and probably would like them gone, but can you really blame Port Adelaide for wanting to achieve bigger and better things at a National level? Remembering Norwood once had that opportunity several times but chickened out.

The question is can the 8 clubs and the SANFL afford not to have Port in the SANFL? Keeping in mind that, Reserves or no Reserves, Port still have, and still draw, a lot of support and fans to both home and away SANFL games. The SANFL isn't like the AFL where the fan base is 70%-90% home team, 10%-30% away team (not counting the big Victorian rivalries where the figure is closer to 60% home and 40% away), in the SANFL the ratio of home fans vs away fans is more even spread and generally sits at 60-40 home team-away team. Most of the SANFL teams need those 40% Port fans just to break even or turn a profit at the gate!

Do I think the SANFL should be full of AFL Reserves teams like the VFL? No. I don't think it's healthy for the AFL players to be spread around the clubs either. However the best option - at the moment - is to have the Crows and Port Reserves in the SANFL. Financially it is easier for the SA teams until the AFL funds a Reserves competition, and the SANFL and the clubs gets extra cash from Port and Crows for having their Reserves there. So at the moment it's a win-win.

Even if there is an AFL Reserves comp re-started, the SANFL will probably still allow a Port presence in the league - heck, if Port make a new reserves team, the Magpies will probably be back to stand alone. It will still all be One-Club, just the Magpies won't have any AFL players.
 

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That's where they also need to look at the bigger picture. By allowing AFL Reserves in their comp, then they get extra $$. Also by having an extra home game each (since the Crows play away bar the now-annual Clare showdown), the clubs again get extra $$. No board, president or club would really turn down some extra cash in the clubs coffers.

At the moment the Reserves teams are inconsistent and different. The Crows have one set of rules and Port have another. This is where I believe that the SANFL should run only a League and Reserves comp for the current 10 teams, then form a completely new under 18's competition - like the TAC cup in Victoria. This new comp would be both under 18 and under 16. All 10 clubs have zones or even feeder clubs, but players from those zones can only play at SANFL if they aren't drafted by an AFL club. This is where Port could been able to keep their zones. The AFL wouldn't allow zoned players to play at AFL level anyway.
 
SANFL Grand Finals have had healthy crowds without Port playing in them for well over a decade now, it will survive perfectly well without Port. It's a shame that there's not a stand alone Port team but that's their choice.
I understand and accept both Port and Adelaide wanting and needing all their players playing together all the time, I begrudgingly accept that the SANFL is the best place for them but there's no way known they should be allowed to play finals of any of their players be able to win a Magarey. The comp has a salary cap and if a team wants to compete for a flag or individual honours those rules should apply. What is happening now is a disgrace and something that neither AFL club would accept if the same advantages were given to competing clubs in the AFL.
 
I don't think anyone in their right mind would argue the SANFL is all but a local comp offering a $340K salary cap to that of a $9 million one. But everyone who follows and supports the SANFL seem very happy with that.

AS for needing the Magpies there is no question they would add to the comp in other words it would be better them there than not. But needing the Magpies I think not. If the magpies weren't in the comp there would be the same amount of games just playing the other 7 clubs more often. Sometimes you would generate more income sometimes less. The average crowd number over the same amount of games may be down slightly but nothing significant.

By what has occurred the SANFL clubs are feeling their member backlash and really now have no alternative than to address it so lets wait and see the outcome.
 
Heardy_101 said:
That's where they also need to look at the bigger picture. By allowing AFL Reserves in their comp, then they get extra $$. Also by having an extra home game each (since the Crows play away bar the now-annual Clare showdown), the clubs again get extra $$. No board, president or club would really turn down some extra cash in the clubs coffers.

At the moment the Reserves teams are inconsistent and different. The Crows have one set of rules and Port have another. This is where I believe that the SANFL should run only a League and Reserves comp for the current 10 teams, then form a completely new under 18's competition - like the TAC cup in Victoria. This new comp would be both under 18 and under 16. All 10 clubs have zones or even feeder clubs, but players from those zones can only play at SANFL if they aren't drafted by an AFL club. This is where Port could been able to keep their zones. The AFL wouldn't allow zoned players to play at AFL level anyway.
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sS I stated on the other thread the total games will remain the same average numbers maybe down by 300-500 per game but nothing significant easily achieved with a reduction in Salary Cap. If you haven't worked out no one cares of the media sprouting that the league wants to be the second best comp in the land, the supporters don't care, they just wont to go to their local footy

I believe the SANFL club directors have learnt this year not to ignore the views of their members, those 8 Clubs will now decide how they are going to handle the situation they have but I think their members views will be taken into consideration this time.

On what has been discussed it appears both clubs will operate under identical guidelines, with no Home games and a reduced age restriction and contracted players. Personally its just a way to make a high number of members happy but doesn't fix the problem, but thats only my opinion and as I said they need to keep their members happy or they wont be Club directors for very long
 
Having Port have the same conditions as the Crows is only a quick fix, and will solve nothing. If anything it creates more problems. Reduction in SANFL salary cap is probably a better solution. Also, making Port play away will again cause more issues.

Do the clubs want to create more problems? No, but they also need to fix the current ones.
 
Heardy_101 said:
Having Port have the same conditions as the Crows is only a quick fix, and will solve nothing. If anything it creates more problems. Reduction in SANFL salary cap is probably a better solution. Also, making Port play away will again cause more issues.

Do the clubs want to create more problems? No, but they also need to fix the current ones.
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lubs will


The clubs will now try and keep its members happy or should I say the board members or else they will not be elected again. I have said previously the more SANFL fans that get on the bandwagon in complaining and whinging the more likely the clubs will go into self preservation mode and do what makes their members happy.

So no they don't care about problems they care about keeping their members happy, the board that is or else they will not be re elected.
 
If that is their only priority (being re-elected) then SA Football is screwed. Sounds like Politics, "Yeah sure We'll do this, this and this, as well as fund that. We'll also do blah blah blah" then they do the opposite.

Football and Politics are chalk and cheese however. In the real world, I think you'll find that the clubs, directors and SANFL will do what is realistically best for SA Football. I think they do care about fixing problems, they may not show or say it but I think we both know they're not going to turn around and start reversing everything. Yes it's their League but that doesn't mean they'll start doing as they please. They will do what is best for SA Football, which is right now keeping the League, current 8 clubs and any future clubs afloat. They can't keep rallying against Port (or Crows) all the time, they know they must move on from the 1980's. Short term, allow AFL Reserves but make things more even. Don't make Port a leper. Long term, Port Magpies return to stand-alone status as within 5-10 years there will be AFL Reserves comp. Heck, have both Port and Crows SANFL teams as stand alones - still aligned as one club, but stand alone.

From what I'm reading the Crows are currently looking at having Adelaide Uni as their only feeder club, and ditching the current arrangement of borrowing players from other teams. Their current model is too basic. Port is obviously a different scenario in the sense they are an already established team.
 
Heardy_101 said:
If that is their only priority (being re-elected) then SA Football is screwed. Sounds like Politics, "Yeah sure We'll do this, this and this, as well as fund that. We'll also do blah blah blah" then they do the opposite.

Football and Politics are chalk and cheese however. In the real world, I think you'll find that the clubs, directors and SANFL will do what is realistically best for SA Football. I think they do care about fixing problems, they may not show or say it but I think we both know they're not going to turn around and start reversing everything. Yes it's their League but that doesn't mean they'll start doing as they please. They will do what is best for SA Football, which is right now keeping the League, current 8 clubs and any future clubs afloat. They can't keep rallying against Port (or Crows) all the time, they know they must move on from the 1980's. Short term, allow AFL Reserves but make things more even. Don't make Port a leper. Long term, Port Magpies return to stand-alone status as within 5-10 years there will be AFL Reserves comp. Heck, have both Port and Crows SANFL teams as stand alones - still aligned as one club, but stand alone.

From what I'm reading the Crows are currently looking at having Adelaide Uni as their only feeder club, and ditching the current arrangement of borrowing players from other teams. Their current model is too basic. Port is obviously a different scenario in the sense they are an already established team.
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????????????????? The members are the football clubs they can control who runs their club and who doesn't. If the board members decided stuff the club members , I will doing what's best for in my opinion for SA football, or in your opinion the Port Adelaide football club, but don't put their clubs members first. They will not be re elected so what ever they think is right will not be implemented and the new elected members will control the club. If who ever is elected had half a brain they would realise that they need to satisfy their members first to enable them to actually serve on the board.

I don't understand why the need for my club and the other 7 clubs to retain the AFL reserves we have established income streams for the SANFL in terms of the SMA and licences being sold to the AFL clubs, they still own AAMI and the league should have sufficient income from all those sources to service its needs. The only lost income will be that of some reduced crowd numbers, which want drop by 50% or anything like that and the $400,000 the crows pay as a licence fee.

Its not hard, but I fear the alternative which will happen has the same impact on the league which will be make both AFL reserves identical and weaken them which wont assist the league, it will make a lot of members happy because both AFL teams will be fairly weak. But as you can see the board members will have its members happy and the system will go on. My opinion has both AFL teams out purely because its impossible to keep all parties happy it makes the league a handicapped competition that can favour AFL reserves or SANFL clubs, but as the SANFL clubs control own and run the league, which way do you think it will go??
 
Heardy_101 said:
Just a thread about potential or planned SANFL expansion teams.

The SANFL "expanded" this year with the inclusion of the Adelaide Crows Reserves as the 10th League side, albeit playing all their games as the away side, the only exception is that they host Port Adelaide in Clare once a year (first game was this year, I believe they are doing so again next year)

Anyway, should the SANFL expand further to include more teams from across the State, given they are the South Australian NATIONAL Football League.

Given the Adelaide Hills, Gawler and the Barossa are expanding areas, (Roseworthy will allegedly have 30,000 + people within 15-20 years), is it feasible that these areas could field League sides?

Also to be considered could be Mount Gambier or the Spencer Gulf region.
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I don’t think Gary Hocking has realized the situation of the SANFL competition. To be quoted in the advertiser this morning saying that his priority for his SANFL team was to develop players and aim at winning an AFL grand final. Then once that business is taken care of he will look at the SANFL Grand Final. Is this guy kidding SANFL supporters I certainly hope all Board members of the SANFL clubs read such an article, which I have no doubt they would have.
Articles like this and quotes from the Coach of the AFL reserves team will go a long way to determining what the SANFL clubs will decide on at year end with the AFL reserves teams. If his priority isn’t to win the flag its pretty simple what to do with the team!!!!!!!

Now there maybe a couple of vacancies for the Spencer gulf and country teams to join the league.
 

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Heardy_101 said:
I will agree there, a bad comment from Buddha although I'm fairly sure he said that at the start of the year as well.
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Oh thats ok then, letting everyone know he couldnt give a toss about the SANFL, its all about the AFL, as long as he is consistant!!
 
grassrootsfooty said:
I don’t think Gary Hocking has realized the situation of the SANFL competition. To be quoted in the advertiser this morning saying that his priority for his SANFL team was to develop players and aim at winning an AFL grand final. Then once that business is taken care of he will look at the SANFL Grand Final. Is this guy kidding SANFL supporters I certainly hope all Board members of the SANFL clubs read such an article, which I have no doubt they would have.
Articles like this and quotes from the Coach of the AFL reserves team will go a long way to determining what the SANFL clubs will decide on at year end with the AFL reserves teams. If his priority isn’t to win the flag its pretty simple what to do with the team!!!!!!!

Now there maybe a couple of vacancies for the Spencer gulf and country teams to join the league.
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Surely that'd be very disrespectful to all of the Magpies fans out there?
 
Surely PAFC turning the Magpies into a Power reserves team is disrespectful to Magpies supporters, that the One Club promise that this would never happen was ignored only a couple of years after the merger is a complete disgrace.
However, none of this has anything to do with SANFL expansion.
 
It maybe a hijacked thread but you gotta laugh at Gary Hocking basically telling them he couldn't give a s**t if he won or lost the GF as long as he developed AFL players for them to have the best shot at winning the AFL.

No wonder there is an anti afl feeling amongst them.

WTF was he thinking, why couldn't he keep his trap shut.

I think there is going to be a fair bit of consideration amongst the SANFL clubs come year end when the man in charge of the SANFL team shows that much disrespect for the league he is coaching in.
 
Chazwazza: I don't enjoy bantering with flogs like GRF. The bloke will cause an argument and then wonders why people retaliate; his attitude is "I'm right and everyone else is wrong" and won't hear another word that contradicts what he says.

Garry Hocking made a bad call saying what he said; after all it was in the conditions that both Port and the Crows must take the SANFL seriously and be competitive. Well, they're definitely competitive, but as for saying he only cares about developing AFL players he should of kept his trap shut, and I reckon Kochie and co. will probably pull him up on it as well.

Meanwhile Younie at the Crows has said similar stuff in the past, but it was more indirect than the way Buddha said it.
 
Chazwazza: I don't enjoy bantering with flogs like GRF. The bloke will cause an argument and then wonders why people retaliate; his attitude is "I'm right and everyone else is wrong" and won't hear another word that contradicts what he says.

Garry Hocking made a bad call saying what he said; after all it was in the conditions that both Port and the Crows must take the SANFL seriously and be competitive. Well, they're definitely competitive, but as for saying he only cares about developing AFL players he should of kept his trap shut, and I reckon Kochie and co. will probably pull him up on it as well.

Meanwhile Younie at the Crows has said similar stuff in the past, but it was more indirect than the way Buddha said it.
 
Heardy_101 said:
Chazwazza: I don't enjoy bantering with flogs like GRF. The bloke will cause an argument and then wonders why people retaliate; his attitude is "I'm right and everyone else is wrong" and won't hear another word that contradicts what he says.

Garry Hocking made a bad call saying what he said; after all it was in the conditions that both Port and the Crows must take the SANFL seriously and be competitive. Well, they're definitely competitive, but as for saying he only cares about developing AFL players he should of kept his trap shut, and I reckon Kochie and co. will probably pull him up on it as well.

Meanwhile Younie at the Crows has said similar stuff in the past, but it was more indirect than the way Buddha said it.
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To be fair to the SANFL campaigners there argument has now been totally backed up by what Gary Hocking has said and now confirmed. The reason for AFL teams not wanted in the SANFL is are they taking the comp seriously or is it purely to Develop players for the grand plan. This thread is about what action will the SANFL take. And really up until now its been hear say if the AFL reserves teams want to win the comp or not, or are playing for the same reasons as the 8 SANFL club, because having a goal of winning a competition is what all competitions are about whether it be soccer, hockey netball or softball. Yes the SANFL has a reserves comp that actually develop players as such for their league comp but every team in that competition has the same ideals not 8 want to win and two want to develop. It changes the fabric of the competition which what people have been saying since day dot

It may have been a bad call and KT and Koch may tell him off, but the damage is done, both AFL reserves teams have not directly called their intentions like Budha did this week. I seriously cant see how the SANFL can leave things the way they are when the senior coach of an SANFL team says what he has.
 
chazwazza said:
Surely PAFC turning the Magpies into a Power reserves team is disrespectful to Magpies supporters, that the One Club promise that this would never happen was ignored only a couple of years after the merger is a complete disgrace.
However, none of this has anything to do with SANFL expansion.
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How is it a disgrace? The whole One club thing would make more sense when all of the players play in the same team. Thus having the magpies as a team for the power players that don't get picked. Disrespectful to magpies supporters? Yeah if the players were bad, the ladder position says they are fine.
 
RED ONE said:
How is it a disgrace? The whole One club thing would make more sense when all of the players play in the same team. Thus having the magpies as a team for the power players that don't get picked. Disrespectful to magpies supporters? Yeah if the players were bad, the ladder position says they are fine.
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I suppose its actually not a disgrace if the team you are following is the AFL power, if you are a true and passionate Port Adelaide Magpies person who only cares for the SANFL team and its competition then its downright disgusting. Gary Hocking has declared its about the AFL first and foremost, so these supporters that built the club from when they were born and have no interest in the AFL have been let down seriously. Those AFL Power supporters and the majority of them couldn't care a toss about the Magpies and the SANFL it doesn't matter. The reason I say the majority is there are 50000 plus supporters but the Port reserves play sturt for a top of the table clash and you get 2500 there .

I suppose peoples feelings are of the hypocrisy that comes from the Port Power supporters "never tear us apart" our "rich tradition", that tradition was built in the SANFL and the desperation to want this year to be part of this true tradition of win at all costs, clearly has been declared to not be the case by the coach himself.
 
Or they could view it as the Port Adelaide football club has been good enough to take it self to the national comp and are able to still have a team in the SANFL. Common sense would say that obviously the AFL competition is number one priority. I love my Magpies but the bottom line is being best in the country gets priority over being best in the state.
 
RED ONE said:
Or they could view it as the Port Adelaide football club has been good enough to take it self to the national comp and are able to still have a team in the SANFL. Common sense would say that obviously the AFL competition is number one priority. I love my Magpies but the bottom line is being best in the country gets priority over being best in the state.
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Yep stuff the SANFL and its integrity of competition "its all about the AFL" isn't that what Gary said. Oh but yes you still want to play in the competition. MMMMMM makes you wonder what the SANFL are currently thinking or will do at year end.
 
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