Moved Thread Ben Griffiths Contract Discussion - SIgned

[Calcium Man]

I am at 80:20

 

[DontArgue4]

Lets just say 60/40 is still where we are still at

 

[Damo80]

This is where you have missed the point. It's what other teams are prepared to offer which will be the testing material
Creamieri is not worth $450 k , but he's getting it
Welcome to the world of free agency Tiger

I've finally figured out why we're going in circles. You're arguing on a different point to nearly everyone else here.

There are two issues at hand:
- what Ben can earn if he shops his services around to other clubs
- what RFC should be offering him.

Most seem to be looking at the second point, but you're more concerned about the first. I couldn't really care less about the first point - and yes, I'm well aware it does have an impact on the second - but at some point Ben needs to decide if he wants to stick with the club, or if he wants to take the easy and more lucrative way out.

Simply put, we can't pay every player on our list going market rates. The salary cap simply doesn't allow it. I'd rather our club offer a fair price, and develop a list of players who choose to stay despite the opportunity to go elsewhere for that little bit extra money. Griff is no different... The ball is in his court.

 

[partycorolla]

I've finally figured out why we're going in circles. You're arguing on a different point to nearly everyone else here.

There are two issues at hand:
- what Ben can earn if he shops his services around to other clubs
- what RFC should be offering him.

Most seem to be looking at the second point, but you're more concerned about the first. I couldn't really care less about the first point - and yes, I'm well aware it does have an impact on the second - but at some point Ben needs to decide if he wants to stick with the club, or if he wants to take the easy and more lucrative way out.

Simply put, we can't pay every player on our list going market rates. The salary cap simply doesn't allow it. I'd rather our club offer a fair price, and develop a list of players who choose to stay despite the opportunity to go elsewhere for that little bit extra money. Griff is no different... The ball is in his court.

Finally, some sanity!

 

[TigerImposter]

I've finally figured out why we're going in circles. You're arguing on a different point to nearly everyone else here.

There are two issues at hand:
- what Ben can earn if he shops his services around to other clubs
- what RFC should be offering him.

Most seem to be looking at the second point, but you're more concerned about the first. I couldn't really care less about the first point - and yes, I'm well aware it does have an impact on the second - but at some point Ben needs to decide if he wants to stick with the club, or if he wants to take the easy and more lucrative way out.

Simply put, we can't pay every player on our list going market rates. The salary cap simply doesn't allow it. I'd rather our club offer a fair price, and develop a list of players who choose to stay despite the opportunity to go elsewhere for that little bit extra money. Griff is no different... The ball is in his court.

yes thats why its a discussion and I don't care about the second point or first point.
its the fact that its not really what Ben wants,but what clubs are prepared to offer him and what do we do and get for him IF we let him go?
Its discussion and thats it, but its intriguing on what people think.Welcome to the world of blood sucking managers and little loyalty between players and clubs.
Really IF our original offer to BEN is not modified he will be left with little option,but to leave.
Which then to me the club is at fault for under valuing his potential.
Remember its opinion

 

[TigerImposter]

Finally, some sanity!

Hmmmmmmmmmmm.It's all sane if you agree PC.

 

[partycorolla]

Hmmmmmmmmmmm.It's all sane if you agree PC.

The above post was spot on..... Market value is always higher (well mostly) outside the club.... you have to pay more to lure a player over.... simple. You agree with that, surely?

You can't honestly expect Griff to be paid just less than Martin? Martin has won a heap of games by himself whereas Griff.....?? Not yet, not saying he won't but until he does he shouldn't expect to get paid as much as someone who does....

 

[Frank Grimes]

Griffiths has shown glimpses of good potential and I voted for 250,000-300,000 over two years. If he becomes consistent over his next contract then that's when he should be expecting $500,000+ coin.

We can't be over paying players based on potential because down the line it may mean Ellis or Miles will not get their fair value and leave instead.

If the Bulldogs want to pay him $500,000 then I don't blame him for taking it. If it comes to that I think a fair trade would be Griff and our 2nd round for the Bulldogs 1st round pick. If they are willing to pay a player $500,000 then they can't argue that they don't think he is worth a top 10 pick.

My preference is to keep Griff, but if it comes to it I could live with another top 10 pick.

 

[blaisee]

Griffiths has shown glimpses of good potential and I voted for 250,000-300,000 over two years. If he becomes consistent over his next contract then that's when he should be expecting $500,000+ coin.

We can't be over paying players based on potential because down the line it may mean Ellis or Miles will not get their fair value and leave instead.

If the Bulldogs want to pay him $500,000 then I don't blame him for taking it. If it comes to that I think a fair trade would be Griff and our 2nd round for the Bulldogs 1st round pick. If they are willing to pay a player $500,000 then they can't argue that they don't think he is worth a top 10 pick.

My preference is to keep Griff, but if it comes to it I could live with another top 10 pick.

Griff on potential is a unique prospect. He is a 200cm centre half forward that can ruck. He is quick, has amazing ground skills and is starting to clutch big contested marks all around the ground. He also has a weapon , X factor long long kicking, that cannot be parallelled in the league. If he clicks, and plays to his potential consistently we go from a middle of the road club, to a top 4 club.

Now the question is , Will he be able to play at this level consistently ?

As far I am concerned , why not? He is just getting better and believing in himself, and most importantly the players themselves are believing in him. It would be insane to let him leave, he's too good and they won't . Griff is worth a top 10 pick right now, no problem at all. He is worth that because he is the afl's rarest commodity , Kurt Tippett x 2

There is no other player in the league that has Griffs god given gifts. Did you know that his V02 max number is higher than that of Mathew Richardson ?

Unbelievable talent, and we are just scratching the surface

 

[The Rusty Trombone]

The biggest concern is that he can make his way to either The Saints, Brisbane , Doggies and Carlton through the PSD so we don't have the bargaining power for a trade which sucks. I voted for 3 x 350 a year and I reckon that would be super cheap for years 2 and 3 of that contract . As for why he'd leave . Go back and watch the first 15 rounds of this season and have a good hard think why other clubs have sown the seed.

It's not his fault. He he walks through the PSD Shaun Hampson for our second rounder last year all of a sudden gets a hell of a lot more expensive for a bloke that can't hold down first ruck in the VFL over a 31 year old Orren Stevenson. Griff did everything asked of him in the off season and worked real hard with Choco. Was he rewarded or given the same opportunity as others ?

Computer says no! Let's hope he finishes strong and signs on. Go Griff !!!!!

 

[The Rusty Trombone]

The biggest concern is that he can make his way to either The Saints, Brisbane , Doggies and Carlton through the PSD so we don't have the bargaining power for a trade which sucks. I voted for 3 x 350 a year and I reckon that would be super cheap for years 2 and 3 of that contract . As for why he'd leave . Go back and watch the first 15 rounds of this season and have a good hard think why other clubs have sown the seed.

It's not his fault. If he walks through the PSD to another club Shaun Hampson for our second rounder last year all of a sudden gets a hell of a lot more expensive for a bloke that can't hold down first ruck in the VFL over a 31 year old Orren Stevenson. Griff did everything asked of him in the off season and worked real hard with Choco his intent was first class from round 1. Was he rewarded or given the same opportunity as others ? No he was subbed out of the game. The poor bugger was mismanaged even further after that but the last month shows the club has started to take him seriously which could be too little too late .

Let's hope he finishes strong and signs on. Go Griff !!!!!

 

[TigerImposter]

The above post was spot on..... Market value is always higher (well mostly) outside the club.... you have to pay more to lure a player over.... simple. You agree with that, surely?

You can't honestly expect Griff to be paid just less than Martin? Martin has won a heap of games by himself whereas Griff.....?? Not yet, not saying he won't but until he does he shouldn't expect to get paid as much as someone who does....

If a Mobile fwd that chops out the ruckmen is needed by a club more than midfield/ small powerful fwd then yes you pay
It's not about names and titles. If we have that philosophy then we may as well dissolve. Your logic is fan boy mentality which doesn't work

 

[blaisee]

The biggest concern is that he can make his way to either The Saints, Brisbane , Doggies and Carlton through the PSD so we don't have the bargaining power for a trade which sucks. I voted for 3 x 350 a year and I reckon that would be super cheap for years 2 and 3 of that contract . As for why he'd leave . Go back and watch the first 15 rounds of this season and have a good hard think why other clubs have sown the seed.

It's not his fault. If he walks through the PSD to another club Shaun Hampson for our second rounder last year all of a sudden gets a hell of a lot more expensive for a bloke that can't hold down first ruck in the VFL over a 31 year old Orren Stevenson. Griff did everything asked of him in the off season and worked real hard with Choco his intent was first class from round 1. Was he rewarded or given the same opportunity as others ? No he was subbed out of the game. The poor bugger was mismanaged even further after that but the last month shows the club has started to take him seriously which could be too little too late .

Let's hope he finishes strong and signs on. Go Griff !!!!!

agree rusty, rating Vickery above Griffiths this season has cost the club dearly.

Griffiths needs to played, and told he is Wayne Carey

 

[partycorolla]

If a Mobile fwd that chops out the ruckmen is needed by a club more than midfield/ small powerful fwd then yes you pay
It's not about names and titles. If we have that philosophy then we may as well dissolve. Your logic is fan boy mentality which doesn't work

Or fact that has always been Talk about fan boy.... he's played two good games and you are going all Richo over him!!!

 

[Calcium Man]

There is no other player in the league that has Griffs god given gifts. Did you know that his V02 max number is higher than that of Mathew Richardson ?

I thought he had poor endurance. Where did you hear/find his VO2 stats?

 

[partycorolla]

The biggest concern is that he can make his way to either The Saints, Brisbane , Doggies and Carlton through the PSD so we don't have the bargaining power for a trade which sucks. I voted for 3 x 350 a year and I reckon that would be super cheap for years 2 and 3 of that contract . As for why he'd leave . Go back and watch the first 15 rounds of this season and have a good hard think why other clubs have sown the seed.

It's not his fault. If he walks through the PSD to another club Shaun Hampson for our second rounder last year all of a sudden gets a hell of a lot more expensive for a bloke that can't hold down first ruck in the VFL over a 31 year old Orren Stevenson. Griff did everything asked of him in the off season and worked real hard with Choco his intent was first class from round 1. Was he rewarded or given the same opportunity as others ? No he was subbed out of the game. The poor bugger was mismanaged even further after that but the last month shows the club has started to take him seriously which could be too little too late .

Let's hope he finishes strong and signs on. Go Griff !!!!!

This is the worry.... I agree Rusty. We can't match what they'll offer so we have to hope that he chooses to stay and deliver the faith many have in him (and that we offer him a fair and reasonable contract.... one that is slightly over what we want to pay him but not ridiculous as some have suggested....)

 

[blaisee]

I thought he had poor endurance. Where did you hear/find his VO2 stats?

take it as fact.

 

[The Rusty Trombone]

agree rusty, rating Vickery above Griffiths this season has cost the club dearly.

Griffiths needs to played, and told he is Wayne Carey

Vickery should of been playing Ruck all ore season and competing with Hampson for that position. Any footballer in any league would love to be going head to head for a spot in the team against Shaun Hampson.

Griff should of been settling down all year at CHF with the tutorlidge of Wayne Carey.

No favouritism and gifting games to Hampson would of solved everything but Hardwick coached on hope

 

[partycorolla]

Vickery should of been playing Ruck all ore season and competing with Hampson for that position. Any footballer in any league would love to be going head to head for a spot in the team against Shaun Hampson.

Griff should of been settling down all year at CHF with the tutorlidge of Wayne Carey.

No favouritism and gifting games to Hampson would of solved everything but Hardwick coached on hope

Almost right.... he should have been competing with Orren for that spot!!

Griff should be thanking Vickery though right now as should RFC.... If he hadn't have belted Cox, we'd never have seen Griff play his best two games for the club, he'd definitely have left and we'd never have known what he could become as a footballer.

He might not ever make it.... At least now though, the club has the option of trading him for higher value (if he wants to go) or paying him a little bit more to stay.... Here's hoping Griff isn't satisfied with 2 good games out of 32 at Tigerland and wants to be a player who made a difference in returning this club to greatness....

 

[The Rusty Trombone]

Or fact that has always been Talk about fan boy.... he's played two good games and you are going all Richo over him!!!

In fairness you can't call hindsight on TI he's rated him for a long time. It's others that haven't seen his potential. Read Blaise"s post and that is exactly what we have got on our hands and other clubs have realised it. We could be to late. I got a feeling the cats will make a play at him also. Who's there CHF ? to Tomahawk needs support

 

[The Rusty Trombone]

Almost right.... he should have been competing with Orren for that spot!!

Griff should be thanking Vickery though right now as should RFC.... If he hadn't have belted Cox, we'd never have seen Griff play his best two games for the club, he'd definitely have left and we'd never have known what he could become as a footballer.

He might not ever make it.... At least now though, the club has the option of trading him for higher value (if he wants to go) or paying him a little bit more to stay.... Here's hoping Griff isn't satisfied with 2 good games out of 32 at Tigerland and wants to be a player who made a difference in returning this club to greatness....

I'm pointing out the team wasn't picked on form and certainly wasn't picked on development, Hampson is the poster child for this and everyone reckons Orren is past it so we could of developed Vickery and Griff at the same time not had them clogging up the forward line trying to do Terry's triangle

 

[partycorolla]

In fairness you can't call hindsight on TI he's rated him for a long time. It's others that haven't seen his potential. Read Blaise"s post and that is exactly what we have got on our hands and other clubs have realised it. We could be to late. I got a feeling the cats will make a play at him also. Who's there CHF ? to Tomahawk needs support

No doubting his potential, that's why he was drafted.... his ability to compete and keep his body right has always been the issue. The ball is in BG's court.... will he chase coin or stay? That's all I care about....

 

[partycorolla]

I'm pointing out the team wasn't picked on form and certainly wasn't picked on development, Hampson is the poster child for this and everyone reckons Orren is past it so we could of developed Vickery and Griff at the same time not had them clogging up the forward line trying to do Terry's triangle

Yeah, I know what you were trying to say, I was merely taking a cheapie at Hampson!!! I still think we can play 3 in the same team... provided they are clear on what their roles are... Ivvy rucking, TV deep, JR not as deep and BG roaming from 45 - wing.... Ivvy can rotate off the ground sometimes when the bench goes back to 4 players and we get in trouble we swing BG back as a loose man.... anyway, probably a discussion for the off-season or do you think they might try it next week?

 

[The Rusty Trombone]

Yeah, I know what you were trying to say, I was merely taking a cheapie at Hampson!!! I still think we can play 3 in the same team... provided they are clear on what their roles are... Ivvy rucking, TV deep, JR not as deep and BG roaming from 45 - wing.... Ivvy can rotate off the ground sometimes when the bench goes back to 4 players and we get in trouble we swing BG back as a loose man.... anyway, probably a discussion for the off-season or do you think they might try it next week?

It would be a silly coach that brings Vickery back after 4 weeks out against the swans

 

[partycorolla]

It would be a silly coach that brings Vickery back after 4 weeks out against the swans

So that's a yes from you, as you believe the coach is silly

Might stretch them down back though..... Who have they got, Richards, Grundy and ????