2015 wooden spoon

[tigers_of_old_08]

Needs more then two options

At least an "OTHER" option. Geez.

 

[KillaKanga]

At least an "OTHER" option. Geez.

Unless of course the OP wants to know your opinion on who is more likely out of the 2 mentioned teams.


Who's more likely to make the GF in 2015? North Melb or Port? That doesn't mean they're the only 2 options but the question is interested in who you think out of the 2 options is more likely.

 

[tigers_of_old_08]

Unless of course the OP wants to know your opinion on who is more likely out of the 2 mentioned teams.


Who's more likely to make the GF in 2015? North Melb or Port? That doesn't mean they're the only 2 options but the question is interested in who you think out of the 2 options is more likely.

Then perhaps the question ought to be re-phrased, 'who's more likely to end up lower on the ladder'.

 

[KillaKanga]

Then perhaps the question ought to be re-phrased, 'who's more likely to end up lower on the ladder'.

Nothing wrong with 'who is more likely to win the wooden spoon'. Makes perfect sense

 

[HawkAussie]

I think St Kilda is the more likely than the Dogs

 

[Olian]

The thing is that we are probably the only team in the comp who aren't really that fussed about winning games yet. It's all about the long game for us and development (hence not giving Gwilt another contract, despite him coming 8th in our B&F this year and possibly having 3-4 more good years in him, and only targeting those under about 23yo during trade period), whereas every other team in the comp is wanting to move up the ladder and are really keen to win games. We have budgeted for at least 12 months now to finish very low in both 2014 and 2015.

Sorry but by not being fussed about winning isn't this akin to tanking.

Saints had to turn over the list but when you delist players who still can contribute to the team and replace them with a young player (who may not be ready for senior football) and with little emphasis on winning. What message does that bring?

Against Fremantle the Saints showed what they are capable of with a mix of young/old in their team.
Young players need to learn how win not just how to play. Otherwise you end up in the precarious position like the Demons where they have lost all self-belief to win.

Bombers to win the spoon. ASADA penalties will hurt them.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I think the difference between what we will be doing and what say Melbourne were doing is that we won't be going out of our way to "engineer losses", by making dodgy positional moves, taking someone off the ground who is doing well if we think it will help us to lose and so-on. If wins are there for the taking I imagine we'll gratefully accept them, but we won't be putting short-term winning ahead of the long term goals.

 

[tigers_of_old_08]

Nothing wrong with 'who is more likely to win the wooden spoon'. Makes perfect sense

There is if you believe neither one of the teams is likely to come last. It's a flawed poll.

 

[aussierulesrules]

While I expect we'll have the spoon comfortably in the bag unless something pretty extraordinary happens, it will be interesting to see just how WB go next year, without Griffen (19 games this year), Cooney (18), Higgins (20) and Giansiricusa (15) and with Boyd, Murphy and Morris all due to turn 33yo next year and Minson 30. Like us, they probably wouldn't want to get too many injuries, or they could be in a bit of a world of hurt!

 

[TheFVK]

Hard not to say St Kilda, just based on history if nothing else

 

[Sentinel]

While I expect we'll have the spoon comfortably in the bag unless something pretty extraordinary happens, it will be interesting to see just how WB go next year, without Griffen (19 games this year), Cooney (18), Higgins (20) and Giansiricusa (15) and with Boyd, Murphy and Morris all due to turn 33yo next year and Minson 30. Like us, they probably wouldn't want to get too many injuries, or they could be in a bit of a world of hurt!

Agree- it's easy to shrug off the loss of Griffen, Cooney and Higgins (along with Gia) by saying they're past it/injured, but they were still 3-4 of our most experienced and talented players and are only replaced by teenagers. Combined with the older blokes getting older again, I struggle to see how we won't dip next year (the improvement of our youngsters I think is unlikely to offset the loss and decline of others). Teams below us this year- Brisbane, Melbourne, GWS- should all improve, St Kilda might slightly improve but still remain low. It all depends on how far we drop and how far those below improve, but the Dogs are definitely a big chance for the spoon if things don't go our way.

 

[sverik25]

Hard not to say St Kilda, just based on history if nothing else

Don't think our history will play a part. In the AFL era, we have been reasonably successful for the most part without winning a premiership. I would be surprised if what happened in the VFL days affected many, if any, of our players when it comes to wooden spoons.

What will likely see us collect the spoon IMO will be our lack of talent in the right age group.

 

[Adam H]

Don't think our history will play a part. In the AFL era, we have been reasonably successful for the most part without winning a premiership. I would be surprised if what happened in the VFL days affected many, if any, of our players when it comes to wooden spoons.

What will likely see us collect the spoon IMO will be our lack of talent in the right age group.

Given we have traded to be in the position we are in I would hope we are around 18th next year.

 

[TheFVK]

Don't think our history will play a part. In the AFL era, we have been reasonably successful for the most part without winning a premiership. I would be surprised if what happened in the VFL days affected many, if any, of our players when it comes to wooden spoons.

What will likely see us collect the spoon IMO will be our lack of talent in the right age group.

I think St Kilda are building their list nicely for the record- but they've got this strange propensity for picking up the wooden spoon any time they're within spitting distance of it. While I'm not an advocate for exclusively using the past to predict the future, this strange phenomenon still puts them at the top of the likelihood ladder for mine.

 

[Adam H]

I think St Kilda are building their list nicely for the record- but they've got this strange propensity for picking up the wooden spoon any time they're within spitting distance of it. While I'm not an advocate for exclusively using the past to predict the future, this strange phenomenon still puts them at the top of the likelihood ladder for mine.

Its called player management these days.

 

[ManOfClay]

Given we have traded to be in the position we are in I would hope we are around 18th next year.

Barracking for St Kilda to go the tank?

 

[aussierulesrules]

I think St Kilda are building their list nicely for the record- but they've got this strange propensity for picking up the wooden spoon any time they're within spitting distance of it. While I'm not an advocate for exclusively using the past to predict the future, this strange phenomenon still puts them at the top of the likelihood ladder for mine.

There's no way in hell we would have gotten the spoon this year if we hadn't been poleaxed by injuries, especially around the early/middle part of the year. We were progressing nicely in the first 6 rounds, with 3 wins and also a 3 point loss (that we had every chance to win) but Riewoldt aggravated his knee early in that game and he went from the dominant force he had been since the beginning of the year to really struggling physically and then it all went downhill for us from there, getting injury after injury and we lost all momentum and confidence and were struggling to put a competitive team out on the park. The number of broken bones and stress type fractures we had was ridiculous.

Late in the year we had 10 listed as "season" on the injury list, which was almost a quarter of our list and more than any other team in the comp. Makes it pretty bloody hard to not finish bottom when you're in full rebuild mode, don't play any of the previous year's bottom 4 teams twice for the season and then get that number of injuries!

 

[Adam H]

Barracking for St Kilda to go the tank?

Wont be tanking but when you delibrately choose to trade star mature age players to get lower picks and more of them finishing last is the result. Injuries on top of that helped last season.

 

[ManOfClay]

Wont be tanking but when you delibrately choose to trade star mature age players to get lower picks and more of them finishing last is the result. Injuries on top of that helped last season.

Who were these star mature players you traded?

Crazy logic. And it's tanking no matter how you spin it. Deliberately modifying external factors to maximise chances of losing. Is that what Fortius Quo Fidelis stands for?

 

[Adam H]

Who were these star mature players you traded?

Crazy logic. And it's tanking no matter how you spin it. Deliberately modifying external factors to maximise chances of losing. Is that what Fortius Quo Fidelis stands for?

Goddard DalSanto McEvoy and to a lesser extent Stanley this season.

 

[ManOfClay]

Goddard DalSanto McEvoy and to a lesser extent Stanley this season.

Did you trade Goddard and Dal Santo? I thought at least one of those two was a FA?

Same point though. You are advocating St Kilda tank, it's disgraceful. I wonder if your fellow supporters would support your view?

 

[Adam H]

Did you trade Goddard and Dal Santo? I thought at least one of those two was a FA?

Same point though. You are advocating St Kilda tank, it's disgraceful. I wonder if your fellow supporters would support your view?

Im not in charge there so Im not advocating anything. I can see what there doing and it looks like it is working.

 

[Donakebab]

There is if you believe neither one of the teams is likely to come last. It's a flawed poll.

If you were to make a ladder prediction with X finishing 15th and Y finishing 17th, then obviously you think that Y is more likely to finish last than X.

 

[Sidebottom2Beams]

Saints.
The only bonus they had this year is they got rid of that scrub Stanley.
That can only help next year.

 

[Collingwoodity]

You would say that's where we are though. I'd say the same about Collingwood. But I, as you have done, would be ignoring the facts.

Magpies , from premiers , to runners up , to finals also rans , to middle of the road ...... Even joffa could work out this trend !!

Collingwood the smokey.

I call delusion.

Pendlebury Cloke and Swan will get Collingwood at least 5/6 wins alone.

Carlton are a lot closer to utterly bottoming out than most sides.

Eagles fans shouldn't be smirking either, they should try to win a game against a competitive side before taking cheap shots.