Saga should be over soon.

[Ancient Tiger]

You know they were given the records. The dispute is what "peptide thymosin" on one occasion.

So what is Thymosin?
Why wasn't the exact type put on the consents? You do know consent forms must be as specific as humanly possible, don't you?
You do know thymomodulin, Thymosin alpha 1 and Thymosin beta 4 are all very different peptides, don't you?

 

[BlueWorld]

Because the ADRVP only needs the possibility of a doping violation.

Well which is it? Either you can prove there were no doping violations or you're screwed.

 

[Broken_Chairs]

No
Transcripts of interviews can easily rum to 150+ pages

source

 

[Tiger2709]

The supplements given were only ever about lactic acid removal and keeping the immune system strong ... as well as vitamin c + b ... I swear by daily beroccas.

Spike is that you?

 

[The Scales]

Can you explain why they pleaded guilty to poor governance if they did keep all records? No reasonable person would accept that they were innocent of that, yet you seem to. Why? Apart from supporting your team, have you rational explanations to this logic?
I'd like to hear your side of the story.

http://www.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/EssendonFC-notice-of-charges.pdf
(b) disregarded standard practices involving the human resources department when employing Robinson and Dank at the Club;
(c) failed to conduct routine, systematic pre-employment checks in respect of Robinson and Dank;
(d) failed to ensure that persons with the necessary integrity, reputation, qualifications and training were engaged by the Club to implement the program;
(e) failed to ensure that those implementing the program were adequately supervised;
(f) failed to devise or implement any adequate system or process to ensure that all substances provided to and used by players were safe and were compliant with the AFL Anti-Doping Code and the World Anti-Doping Code.

The relevant points as to the guilty of poor governance charges, AFAIK. There has been no concrete evidence in the public domain that proves EFC handed over no records, just allegations as to the inadequacy of them.

 

[gavaniacono]

Thymomodulin is one drug used by athletes to boost the immunity system.

 

[ZergMinion]

Are we there yet?

 

[Seadog]

Are we there yet?

No no no no no no no
yes


no

 

[MaddAdam]

Yep didn't think you could suggest anything meaningful lol

Let's be honest here. I am restraining myself. Your last onfield game was a final in which my footy team beat yours on a six goal comeback. You guys have been huffing and puffing about court cases and blah blah blah for literally years now. You went to court. The court laughed at you. ASADA is so far up your arse it can taste TB4. Surely the time has come to just throw your hands up and at least say "Whatever happens happens".

You're not kicking with the wind here.

 

[nineteen eighty]

are you seriously suggesing a dramatic increase in weights program wont build muscle?

It's almost impossible to bulk up AND lose weight in a short space of time. To bulk up they would be eating plenty to gain muscle mass. That however, isn't conducive to the lean mass we see on sportsmen these days. They just couldn't do it in such a short time frame AND stay as lean as they need to be.

That's where the PED's come in to play. Remarkable drugs they are. Bulk you up, keep you lean, allow you to recover and improve your running...all at the same time.

Where were they when I was running around getting smashed.

 

[MaddAdam]

the program beganlate 2011 and the ST injuries didnt really start on mass until 7 months later. Yeah, im sure the tied the two together instantly. Not to mention the fact all players undertook heavier weight programs than ever before which would have a substantial affect on body shape

A crueller poster would ...

 

[Perry Pie]

http://www.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/EssendonFC-notice-of-charges.pdf
(b) disregarded standard practices involving the human resources department when employing Robinson and Dank at the Club;
(c) failed to conduct routine, systematic pre-employment checks in respect of Robinson and Dank;
(d) failed to ensure that persons with the necessary integrity, reputation, qualifications and training were engaged by the Club to implement the program;
(e) failed to ensure that those implementing the program were adequately supervised;
(f) failed to devise or implement any adequate system or process to ensure that all substances provided to and used by players were safe and were compliant with the AFL Anti-Doping Code and the World Anti-Doping Code.

The relevant points as to the guilty of poor governance charges, AFAIK. There has been no concrete evidence in the public domain that proves EFC handed over no records, just allegations as to the inadequacy of them.

What happened to a) on your list? What does it say?

 

[The_Wookie]

What happened to a) on your list? What does it say?

(a) engaged in practices that exposed players to significant risks to their health and safety as well as the risk of using substances that were prohibited by the AFL Anti-Doping Code and the World Anti-Doping Code

 

[Ancient Tiger]

http://www.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/EssendonFC-notice-of-charges.pdf
(b) disregarded standard practices involving the human resources department when employing Robinson and Dank at the Club;
(c) failed to conduct routine, systematic pre-employment checks in respect of Robinson and Dank;
(d) failed to ensure that persons with the necessary integrity, reputation, qualifications and training were engaged by the Club to implement the program;
(e) failed to ensure that those implementing the program were adequately supervised;
(f) failed to devise or implement any adequate system or process to ensure that all substances provided to and used by players were safe and were compliant with the AFL Anti-Doping Code and the World Anti-Doping Code.

The relevant points as to the guilty of poor governance charges, AFAIK. There has been no concrete evidence in the public domain that proves EFC handed over no records, just allegations as to the inadequacy of them.

Thanks for that.
Points a) and f) are obviously the big ones in that group. The one that caused Essendon to be removed from the finals series as without a) andf) the others become less relevant.
Having said that, I find it impossible for your club to say it knows what substances were injected into the players, just not what went into who. If Essendon knew exactly what drugs were given then a) and f) do not apply and the club should never have accepted the sanctions it got.

 

[The_Wookie]

http://www.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/EssendonFC-notice-of-charges.pdf
(b) disregarded standard practices involving the human resources department when employing Robinson and Dank at the Club;
(c) failed to conduct routine, systematic pre-employment checks in respect of Robinson and Dank;
(d) failed to ensure that persons with the necessary integrity, reputation, qualifications and training were engaged by the Club to implement the program;
(e) failed to ensure that those implementing the program were adequately supervised;
(f) failed to devise or implement any adequate system or process to ensure that all substances provided to and used by players were safe and were compliant with the AFL Anti-Doping Code and the World Anti-Doping Code.

The relevant points as to the guilty of poor governance charges, AFAIK. There has been no concrete evidence in the public domain that proves EFC handed over no records, just allegations as to the inadequacy of them.

Previous poster bought up a good question. Points b through f say nothing, h though k directly contract the last statement you made

(h) failed to identify and record the source from which all substances used by playerswere obtained;
(i) failed to adequately monitor and record the use of substances;
(j) failed to audit or monitor all substances held on the premises of the Club;
(k) failed to implement a system for recording and storing all substances held on the premises of the Club

Theres no concrete evidence that proves Essendon handed over no records, the AFL alleged that they didnt bother keeping any.

 

[Gigantor]

source

you might have a 240 minute interview
how many minutes of blabbering per page?
depends on the rapidity of speech
depends on thinking time between questions
depends on spacing
there's the obligatory I said, he said
headers and footers on the transcript, e.g. there might be large signature blocks per page
additional comments for time, breaks, whether people have entered or exited the room, for how long, descriptions of gestures, etc
so yes, interview transcripts can be very long

 

[Gigantor]

It's almost impossible to bulk up AND lose weight in a short space of time. To bulk up they would be eating plenty to gain muscle mass. That however, isn't conducive to the lean mass we see on sportsmen these days. They just couldn't do it in such a short time frame AND stay as lean as they need to be.

That's where the PED's come in to play. Remarkable drugs they are. Bulk you up, keep you lean, allow you to recover and improve your running...all at the same time.

Where were they when I was running around getting smashed.

I recall one of your players getting his jumper pulled over his head to expose and extremely flabby belly
actually, you were playing my team?
he was so embarassed he king hit one of our blokes
there is no doubt that he could have done with a bit of AOD, being the miracle cure that it is

 

[Gigantor]

Thanks for that.
Points a) and f) are obviously the big ones in that group. The one that caused Essendon to be removed from the finals series as without a) andf) the others become less relevant.
Having said that, I find it impossible for your club to say it knows what substances were injected into the players, just not what went into who. If Essendon knew exactly what drugs were given then a) and f) do not apply and the club should never have accepted the sanctions it got.

but isn't it a case that the club knows what was meant to have been administered
and ASADA are making the case that Dank in fact did not administer the recorded items?
one of the governance failures being that they did not keep a close enough eye on Dank

 

[Dave]

Can you explain why they pleaded guilty to poor governance if they did keep all records?

The governance issues had to do with inadequate control of the supplements program, not a lack of records.

No reasonable person would accept that they were innocent of that, yet you seem to. Why? Apart from supporting your team, have you rational explanations to this logic? I'd like to hear your side of the story.

I've stated more than once that I thought the club stuffed up, that doesn't mean I accept everything the AFL and media have said about the saga.

 

[chelseacarlton]

View attachment 89042

Had to see this again!!

 

[MaddAdam]

The governance issues had to do with inadequate control of the supplements program, not a lack of records.

Magical stuff.

 

[chelseacarlton]

They don't pump a lot of weights during the year and this was a massive increase after the repeat sprint 400m style training that McCormak had them doing.
They also had a massive increase in dietry intake. Thompson had them eating all day!!

The supplements given were only ever about lactic acid removal and keeping the immune system strong ... as well as vitamin c + b ... I swear by daily beroccas.

BS
They were being injected with a concoction of illegal and non TGA drugs,designed specifically in conjunction with each other to aid recovery and performance!!.

 

[boncer34]

Theres no concrete evidence that proves Essendon handed over no records, the AFL alleged that they didnt bother keeping any.

The use of "All" doesn't scream out to you that there are some records?

 

[Argy]

You're assuming it's only 105 common pages. As for the rest, I'd say the players interviews would all be different, that hardly makes them earth shattering.

I am assuming nothing. Hargreaves, the players lawyer said 105 of the 350 pages were identical. The remaining 245 were unique to each of the 34 players. That means there are a total of about 8,500 unique pages of summary to wade through.

 

[tesla1962]

Let's be honest here. I am restraining myself. Your last onfield game was a final in which my footy team beat yours on a six goal comeback. You guys have been huffing and puffing about court cases and blah blah blah for literally years now. You went to court. The court laughed at you. ASADA is so far up your arse it can taste TB4. Surely the time has come to just throw your hands up and at least say "Whatever happens happens".

You're not kicking with the wind here.

Still nothing meaningful to say about the sensible route the aflpa players association suggested
Just more irrelevant nonsense
Back to trolling on twitter with all the other pimply faced schoolboys for you I reckon