List Mgmt. 2014 Draft + DFA Talk Part II

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theflea

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Sure i agree you never know and there are so many unpredictables that could influence development, But if you have a look at what a player like Cockatoo has in his kit bag Speed,Size,Leap,agility and combine these with what his junior coaches say about the character of the kid and how hungry he is to become a elite afl player and how coachable he is. I think 1 of his coaches actually described him as like a sponge and just so hungry to soak up any information he can about the tactics and game plans, Added to this his father and uncles being former players and guiding him through aswell as having all this going for him he is 1 of the youngest players in this draft.

This kid actually was still taken overseas when he was injured and couldnt play just to be a possitive influence on the team and become the runner taking drinks out to his peers and giving encoragment and advise.

Too many ticks to ignore
Yeah agree he has many good traits, but just making the point you cant argue the potential of 1 player and in the same breath poo poo another players' potential as not being able to ever get to the same level straight out of junior footy.
 

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Dec 28, 2007
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I understand the defence of Ellis and actually don't mind him but IMO there'll be significantly better options at 12. I'd take any of Durdin, Duggan, De Goey, Weller or Ahern before him in a heartbeat and at least one of those will surely be available. Ellis would've been a great option if the Trengove trade had gone through.

Exactly my point, Well said Stylo

I know as well as anybody that we will not select Cockatoo with #12 & I have been a massive fan of Ahern for over 6 months and would also love to have either Weller,Laverde,Pickett and Even Duggan,Durdin,De Goey over Ellis

There are better players available at #12 than Ellis
 
Dec 28, 2007
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Yeah agree he has many good traits, but just making the point you cant argue the potential of 1 player and in the same breath poo poo another players' potential as not being able to ever get to the same level straight out of junior footy.
Im not poo pooing Ellis potential and even went as far as to compare him to 2 Tiger stalwarts in Newman/Bowden but i just see that something special in cockatoo that could make him a special player e.g Goodes,Wells,Rioli,Dusty,Delidio etc

There is just something about a player thats 190+ ( i know cocky is 188 but he will grow another couple oc cm in the next 2 years being just turned 18)
Thats extremely solid and express speed that makes the opposition sh!t themselfs when they are around the ball.

With time his tackling will be ferocious and electric speed with a big body and solid marking with good kicking, Just have to teach him the disciplines of team game plan not to try to do everything himself and take the 1st option.
 

theflea

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Im not poo pooing Ellis potential and even went as far as to compare him to 2 Tiger stalwarts in Newman/Bowden but i just see that something special in cockatoo that could make him a special player e.g Goodes,Wells,Rioli,Dusty,Delidio etc

There is just something about a player thats 190+ ( i know cocky is 188 but he will grow another couple oc cm in the next 2 years being just turned 18)
Thats extremely solid and express speed that makes the opposition sh!t themselfs when they are around the ball.

With time his tackling will be ferocious and electric speed with a big body and solid marking with good kicking, Just have to teach him the disciplines of team game plan not to try to do everything himself and take the 1st option.
Yeah don't disagree with the sentiment, but just think you cant limit 1 players potential, yet predict the stars for another. It just hardly ever works out that way. I do understand that is the art in drafting tho.:)
 
Mar 1, 2010
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He might only be 17 but he is still much bigger than the opposition which at this level makes the game much easier. Wait until he comes up against people his own size and see how well he does. Cause his sloppy skills and decision making will become much more evident than what it currently is, which is why he isn't in the same consideration as the likes of Duggan, Ahern and Degoey.

Personally I have him at a similar level to Atley from North who is similarly good athlete but disposal is inconsistent so unless Cockatoo can improve his disposal then I don't think he will ever be the player you think he can become and whilst I have only seen a small sample of Cockatoos game it was noticeable that he lacked good to very good ball use.

Though I'm probably talking to a brick wall here.


He is clearly ahead of Atley. For starters he has a superior leap, arguably better smarts and sticky fingers. I believe he has superior agility as well!

His bloodlines are superior as well suggesting he has a lot higher ceiling. Eg. He could be the closest to Judd since Judd.

Their is a lot of hype, I do admit, but his abilities are all present. Bottom line is he can be a forward threat, backline menance as well as midfield gun. With that type of versatility and elite potential it would be foolish to ignore him unless there was a real solid prospect of real quality as an alternative option.

Potentially Cockatoo could be the best player of the 2014 draft even if others live up to their hype!!
 

DustinsGuns

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Cockatoo. No thanks. 2 min clips don't interest me. Reeks of the recruitment of JON.

Need to pick someone who has played consistently well of a period of 12+ games
 

Stylo

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He is clearly ahead of Atley. For starters he has a superior leap, arguably better smarts and sticky fingers. I believe he has superior agility as well!

His bloodlines are superior as well suggesting he has a lot higher ceiling. Eg. He could be the closest to Judd since Judd.

Their is a lot of hype, I do admit, but his abilities are all present. Bottom line is he can be a forward threat, backline menance as well as midfield gun. With that type of versatility and elite potential it would be foolish to ignore him unless there was a real solid prospect of real quality as an alternative option.

Potentially Cockatoo could be the best player of the 2014 draft even if others live up to their hype!!

Let me ask you one thing, is the only footage you've seen of Cockatoo that 2 minute highlight package taken from 1 match? Or have you seen him play on other occasions?
 

coryne

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For those interested in the PD for which I am picking for Richmond my picks to date have played out as

#12. Duggan. Classy all-round midfielder
#33. Cavka. VERY outside midfielder with pace
#52. Maynard. Hard edged, predominently inside player


Next pick will be a small forward/midget midfielder/Robinson to make GUN happy.


What do people think ??? Have I done well or stuffed it up completely ???
 

Stylo

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For those interested in the PD for which I am picking for Richmond my picks to date have played out as

#12. Duggan. Classy all-round midfielder
#33. Cavka. VERY outside midfielder with pace
#52. Maynard. Hard edged, predominently inside player


Next pick will be a small forward/midget midfielder/Robinson to make GUN happy.


What do people think ??? Have I done well or stuffed it up completely ???

Good haul, especially Maynard at 52. If someone like Lonie/McLean/Daniel happen be on the board at our next pick I'd jump on it
 

coryne

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Good haul, especially Maynard at 52. If someone like Lonie/McLean/Daniel happen be on the board at our next pick I'd jump on it


Toby McLean went at #35 and Caleb Daniel went at #47 (he was the player I was gunning for with #52). Was tossing up between Lonie and Maynard with #52 so he is still (currently) in play.
 

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For those interested in the PD for which I am picking for Richmond my picks to date have played out as

#12. Duggan. Classy all-round midfielder
#33. Cavka. VERY outside midfielder with pace
#52. Maynard. Hard edged, predominently inside player


Next pick will be a small forward/midget midfielder/Robinson to make GUN happy.


What do people think ??? Have I done well or stuffed it up completely ???
I'd do naked laps of Punt Rd with that haul.
 

Stylo

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Touk Miller with a later pick to fill the small forward spot for me

I really like Miller for 33 but I wonder if he's a bit too similar to Miles? Might be better going for someone like Neal-Bullen or Gore if either are available.
 

Stylo

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Nov 17, 2011
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1. Saints - Petracca
2. Dees - Brayshaw
3. Dees - Lever
4. GWS - Wright
5. Pies - McCartin
6. GWS - Laverde
7. GWS - Duggan
8. GC - Pickett
9. Pies - Moore
10. Cats - Durdin
11. WCE - De Goey
12. Tigers - Weller
 
Dec 28, 2007
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Ellis is better than Cockatoo. Cockatoo was playing 16-17 year olds in that one game lol
True But there is also another way you can look at this

Cockatoo was also 17 - so effectively against his own age group bar 3-4 months

Playing cream 17 year olds from next years crop

Also Just have a look at the other boys that were involved in the game like Heeney,Weller,Steele
I really like Miller for 33 but I wonder if he's a bit too similar to Miles? Might be better going for someone like Neal-Bullen or Gore if either are available.
Agrre with you stylo but think your other 2 are better at our #33
 
Dec 28, 2007
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1. Saints - Petracca
2. Dees - Brayshaw
3. Dees - Lever
4. GWS - Wright
5. Pies - McCartin
6. GWS - Laverde
7. GWS - Duggan
8. GC - Pickett
9. Pies - Moore
10. Cats - Durdin
11. WCE - De Goey
12. Tigers - Weller

Would be fantastic, The noise about west coast and de Goey is getting stronger it seems
 

Blinger

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I just hope to god if Weller is there, we take him.
Richardson said on the website a few weeks ago, we will take best available with our 1st pick. I would imagine they would think the likes of Weller would be gone by our pick. As he said they have the players ranked & would take the highest ranked player according to their rankings.
 
Mar 1, 2010
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Let me ask you one thing, is the only footage you've seen of Cockatoo that 2 minute highlight package taken from 1 match? Or have you seen him play on other occasions?


Let me ask you a question. Why are you even asking me the question? You know the answer or you should. Of course I haven't but nor do I have to. If you know what you are doing you have seen almost enough anyway. Thats probably why the AFL insiders told him don't worry about playing a couple of matches up at NT at the back end of the season particularly when some surely would have seen him pre-injury!

Fact is Cockatoo has a higher ceiling than any other player in the draft I have seen in the highlights which includes all of the so-called guns. If you cannot see that you have no idea period!!! He may not get there for various reasons some of which have a sound basis but the potential remains. Clearly, in the clip his disposal was not elite at times and he was caught out a touch a times as well with tempo, but there is no denying the raw talent on show unless you are clueless!! Cockatoo is young, hasn't played a lot of footy recently and there are different sound reasons why some of his perceived deficiencies cannot be ironed out over time with more footy, experience and development!! The bottom line is if you are so dissuaded about the lack of footy Cockatoo hasn't played to disregard him from the first round as a prospect, IMO, your footy knowledge is severely limited no matter who you are!!

Cockatoo is a terrific prospect to help sort out who knows what they are talking about. Yes he has deficiencies atm, yes he is raw, yes he is young, so based on this and your knowledge of footy where do you put him??? I rate him highly. Not so high as he would break top 10 but pretty high in terms of raw ability and potential. Now others will not. Then there will be others who IMO, do not know enough to make a rating with a great deal of confidence as others will from what they can see in prospects over time. Cockatoo is no certainty either way, but he is a great test to get a better guide of how certain attributes should be valued compared to others even though all recruiters should know every players scrutinized is done so on a cases by case basis, nothing is homogeneous!!


I will say this Francis Jackson and co might know what they are talking about. But I have yet to be convinced I have seen anything in footy terms and selections to suggest they necessarily do know what they are talking about. Here is what I know, Francis was a teacher and then he was a recruiter. His selections have been up and down like many others IMO. I have not seen anything to suggest within his selections a superior eye for talent than anyone else in the industry period!!! That is not to say he may not be good, I am just saying thats my perception.

If I told you that if I went through the drafts with RFC we would have ended up with Franklin, Heppell, Parker and so for does that make me a gun if chosen beforehand with others?? Probably not but the bottom line is atm, their is no reason to suggest the current so-called professionals are recruiting superstars!! They are not alone, many will tell you there are plenty of financial planners are out there who have no idea either!!The fact plenty of scrutiny been placed around some of these professionals has been raised over the years tends to support the notion their track record does not lend itself to a perception that, despite the extra analysis, they make decisions vastly superior to some of the more amateur so-called experts!!

I care about RFC and its success, and I know it is not in my interest nor RFC's interest to follow people blindly like sheep without any appropriate risk management put in place including human resource expertise!! If you don't like my views, tough t***ies, lets see what the players do on the field to demonstrate what players can and will do over time as the prospects develop into or out of AFL footy players!!
 
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