EDFL Premier Division

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Shadow Master said:
Totally agree with you there 'ItsAllAboutMe', maybe I was being a little bit disrespectful to the remaining three clubs in Premier Division as I'm sure the volunteering administrators at Maribyrnong Park, Northern Saints and West Coburg are doing all they can to get there CLUB structure in a position to be able to compete with the other clubs in Premier Division on a consistent basis.

Maribyrnong Park are very close to recruiting three past premiership players back in to their environment for the 2015 season, so they are definitely striving to ensure that their club is amongst the group of clubs vying for a spot in the finals series for the 2015 season.

I'm not to sure whether I agree with your suggestion of the EDFL increasing available finals spots to five in the foreseeable future as this would mean that fifty percent of the competition would play finals on a yearly basis! By leaving the finals system in it's current status of a final four, the focus will definitely shift towards, and intensify, on the volunteering administrators of each club to get their individual CLUB structures right as they strive for sustainability and tactical advantages over opposing clubs in an ever increasingly competitive environment, whilst striving for the ultimate success.

This would definitely create an environment for a very interesting competition, with many questions to be answered, rather than, the only question being just which clubs have the biggest player payment budgets.

INTERESTING TIMES AHEAD FOR SOME CLUBS.
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Can someone please give me a quick unbiased run down on the northern saints?
Competitiveness, club culture and supporters, predictions for next year?
 
hank2 said:
Can someone please give me a quick unbiased run down on the northern saints?
Competitiveness, club culture and supporters, predictions for next year?
Click to expand...

i am unbiased.

My Northern Saints opinion - lacking "football" people, low support network for coaches, boys playing in a mans league is an analogy that springs to mind with them being in Prem Division. Will compete and try their hardest but both on and off the field they are out of their depth when the whips start cracking. they'll be good for a half or 3 qtrs etc.... i feel sorry for them, no doubt they have some great people there, just not enough of them. their culture has been decimated in recent years with club stalwarts leaving due to the direction the club was going with a certain type of recruitment policy (or lack of). right now if someone asked me where the club would be in 10 years i would say defunct. i hope they prove me wrong though because this area needs a footy club. the area they are in lack 'footy" people and by that i mean they can find blokes that can play the game, but can't find blokes interested in seeing the club grow. not many parents are involved because half of the players' parents wouldn't even know what their kids are doing on saturdays. hard to build a club and see it thrive when there are hardly any supports/parents/fans/locals etc...that get to the club and make it their 2nd home. i have been involved with many clubs and seen others operate and i feel that getting a "footy club feel" with more "footy people" back to the club is that club's only chance of survival. my suggestion to them would be simple: recruit people that will stay at the club, not those that will play a season then drop a division (or two) to play at an easier level. pay players for attendance to after match functions....then they'll see who actually wants to be there. care more about the club and give players a reason to care about it, then hopefully results follow. also do your homework thoroughly before signing players, get to know the other club's committee's and ask them for a reference for that player before signing them. it seems the saints attract players that have left their prev club for behavioral or lack of professionalism issues.

that's my take, but i'll finish with this. i do not know the inner workings of that club, i am unbiased outsider, although i live in the area and have been to the club on matchdays....feels very lonely and flat compared to other clubs. i am sure there are great people that work their backsides off for that club and i hope i do not offend any of them. they need to put the call out to their mates that are bludging on the club right now and get them involved or there will be no club in 5-10 years. i do not know their new coach but i wish him all the best, it's probably the hardest job in the prem division and he needs all the support he can get, especially as hes coming in from coaching under 15's in 2013 and before that only div 3 in the NFL....i think hes in for a very, very hard year.
 

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1992edfl2012 said:
i am unbiased.

My Northern Saints opinion - lacking "football" people, low support network for coaches, boys playing in a mans league is an analogy that springs to mind with them being in Prem Division. Will compete and try their hardest but both on and off the field they are out of their depth when the whips start cracking. they'll be good for a half or 3 qtrs etc.... i feel sorry for them, no doubt they have some great people there, just not enough of them. their culture has been decimated in recent years with club stalwarts leaving due to the direction the club was going with a certain type of recruitment policy (or lack of). right now if someone asked me where the club would be in 10 years i would say defunct. i hope they prove me wrong though because this area needs a footy club. the area they are in lack 'footy" people and by that i mean they can find blokes that can play the game, but can't find blokes interested in seeing the club grow. not many parents are involved because half of the players' parents wouldn't even know what their kids are doing on saturdays. hard to build a club and see it thrive when there are hardly any supports/parents/fans/locals etc...that get to the club and make it their 2nd home. i have been involved with many clubs and seen others operate and i feel that getting a "footy club feel" with more "footy people" back to the club is that club's only chance of survival. my suggestion to them would be simple: recruit people that will stay at the club, not those that will play a season then drop a division (or two) to play at an easier level. pay players for attendance to after match functions....then they'll see who actually wants to be there. care more about the club and give players a reason to care about it, then hopefully results follow. hardest job in the prem division and he needs all the support he can get, especially as hes coming in from coaching under 15's in 2013 and before that only div 3 in the NFL....i think hes in for a very, very hard year.
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Such a ridiculous comment, Since the merger they have been a very well run club and won a flag after dominating B grade and in there first year in Premier managed to avoid relegation which was a huge effort and were competitive against all of the top sides, not 100% sure but I don't remember them ever losing by more than 10 goals.
 
ItsAllAboutMe said:
Such a ridiculous comment, Since the merger they have been a very well run club and won a flag after dominating B grade and in there first year in Premier managed to avoid relegation which was a huge effort and were competitive against all of the top sides, not 100% sure but I don't remember them ever losing by more than 10 goals.
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Yes, I think Norhern Saints performed extremely well first season up in the top grade. Belted Abers in 1 match, ran Strathmore and Avondale very close in 2 others. Hopefully they can build on that. They did tail off in 2nd half of season, including 18 and 16 goal losses to Greenvale and Abers. But they won the one that counted in round 18.

Budget is always an issue in Premier division, and it will be hard to achieve sustained success without having the cash to recruit quality players.
 
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hank2 said:
Can someone please give me a quick unbiased run down on the northern saints?
Competitiveness, club culture and supporters, predictions for next year?
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I'd like to give you an unbiased opinion, but I'd be telling fibs.

My family and I were involved in the club for a while and from day 1 they were absolutely sensational. Sure they lacked onfield success, but you couldn't help but meet a better bunch of people. To this day many of those same people are still involved at the club. We still visit the club on game days when we can.

There's no doubt it has a multicultural feel about it and as a Kiwi this was probably a good thing. That culture remains today and there's no doubt that doesn't sit well with some people. Survived Premier league with essentially their B grade Premiership side. IIRC, now have 6 junior sides which is a testament to the hard work done at committee level since they moved to Charles Mutton reserve.

I will admit they've suffered from the actions of a couple of idiots who have hurt the club.

If you were looking for a winning season in a dominant team, you probably won't find it at Northern, but if you want to go to a club with a supporter base full of good honest hard working local people trying their hardest to build a successful club, then Northern is a great option and you wouldn't be disappointed.
 
bulls07 said:
speaking to people from watsonia and thomastown where he has been previously, could quite possibly be the worst coach in victoria. good luck to the saints.
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Gday bud,

There was a lot of envy at Thomastown, with a lot of young blokes that he couldn't get on his side.

Nevertheless, I think it might be a bit of a risk in signing him as he doesn't have the credentials.

All your mates are under the age of 25 and have a bad habit of bad mouthing people because they don't get what they want.

Like I said its a risk in signing him, but give the bloke a fair go. This is a club where he does not know any one, therefore cannot be automatically judged by word of mouth. If he fails, I will eat my words, come back on here and say you are right.

With that being said he has taken the hardest job in the prem div in my opinion. If he succeeds and keeps Northern up then I would expect you to come back on this forum and eat your words.



bulls07 said:
speaking to people from watsonia and thomastown where he has been previously, could quite possibly be the worst coach in victoria. good luck to the saints.
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KeepItSimple said:
Good Call!

One slight hitch as the rumour goes is that Kyabram & Pascoe Vale FC both got a shock as late as last week, it turns out Rochester & Mansfield were on Justin's shopping list, the only problem was he didn't tell any of them he was in the middle of a 2 year contract and had accepted big $ sign ons and help with medical expenses from Pascoe Vale.

The PR train at Ky ground to a halt under intrigue and confusion, lets just say there are a few unhappy campers all round and hardly a done deal.

Looks like Justin sold the candy one too many times, so to speak;)

Although once the grown ups took over, level heads will see it resolved.

As usual in these situations two sets of good people volunteering administrators at both clubs get stuck in the middle of a selfish ex AFL Player thinking that the rules don't apply to them.

Granted it is a bit of a shock for those boys coming out of the AFL system but ethics and common-sense come from within, even if maturity is yet to make its presence known!

All the best to all parties including Justin Sherman, onwards and upwards for all concerned.

Apparently Pascoe Vale and Kyabram have a regular pre season practice match, they will be selling tickets to that one.
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What's the status on Sherman transfer?
Can anyone update.
 
The Milk Man said:
You would think Northern Saints have done there homework before appointing him. I have heard Jarrod Carey has committed to an assistant coaching role.
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Have heard it to be gospel that Jarrod Carey has signed on as an assistant coach. Looks like the Saints have gone for a very NFL feel at coaching level. Also heard that they will be targeting youth from the NFL rather than going for high priced ex AFL or EDFL players. Jarrod Carey used to be the Operations Manager for the NFL and spent 6 years at Collingwood in the thick of things, so perhaps they are finally starting to get the football people they are desperately needing.
 

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shagshouli said:
What's the status on Sherman transfer?
Can anyone update.
Click to expand...
Called into the blue brick on Sunday to place a few bets & saw the young sherminator talking to a few older men in bomber jackets & also signing a few papers & the barmen said they will making the announcement on Tuesday that the sherminator is coaching ky
 
We all knew this and I doubled checked but apparently Gavin Urquardt is a definite Panther as well.

Seems like the president is keeping a lid on it which is good. Premier Division is so tough that it might seem like they may be finals chance but all the clubs will be doing heaps of recruiting in the off season. Sometimes you have to improve just to stand still in this Semi Professional EDFL Era.

Good on them for having a crack I say. Also good for us spectators who like to go to the game of the round games, as some silky talent will be on display.

http://leader.newspaperdirect.com/e...05/8a0cd8e7-52f5-4435-b2a6-401134164f05//true
milkman99 said:
Called into the blue brick on Sunday to place a few bets & saw the young sherminator talking to a few older men in bomber jackets & also signing a few papers & the barmen said they will making the announcement on Tuesday that the sherminator is coaching ky
Click to expand...

On the money from my sources.

"also signing a few papers" mmm interesting, lets just say the Sherminator might need a new stage name .....at the rate he is terminating two & three year deals at his last three clubs the Terminator may get a run up bush:)

Tale of the Tape:

Bulldogs:
http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/ju...western-bulldogs/story-fnelctok-1226503963253
"WESTERN Bulldogs line-breaker Justin Sherman has left the club and will seek a third home via the pre-season draft despite having a year to run on his existing contract.

The former Brisbane Lion was not traded during October's player movement frenzy and the Dogs today declared they had reached a "mutual agreement" with Sherman."

Williamstown:
http://www.williamstownfc.com.au/williamstown-press-release-justin-sherman/
The Williamstown Football Club would like to announce that Justin Sherman has been released from his 2014 contract.

Justin joined Williamstown Football Club last year and initially signed for two seasons (2013 and 2014). A knee injury which required surgery ended his 2013 season after only 3 games.

Justin has experienced on going problems with the knee and off field he’s very busy with his upcoming wedding and the birth of his child.

Williamstown Football Club CEO Brendan Curry stated the following:

“Justin spoke to us in the New Year about his knee and upcoming wedding and fatherhood. He felt he couldn’t commit to VFL Football in 2014 and we decided to support his decision. Justin hopes to play some football at a local level in 2014 once his knee improves. We wish him all the best. “

Pascoe Vale:
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/...ning-back-on-vfl/story-fngnvocb-1226816884602
The last line of this article has proven to be prophetic "For me at the moment, that's where I'm at." Might be a good business card slogan?

Justin signed another 2 year deal 2014 & 2015 with sign on's. Justin was named Captain of the Pascoe Vale FC.

Justin played Round 1 of the 2014 season then succumb to further knee trouble which required club subsidised surgery and missed the next 13 games and then I'm told he returned for Round 14 then missed the do or die relegation game against Marby with a sore neck, Pascoe Vale lost by 1 point, then played the last 3 games of the year.

Justin mid contract applied to Rochester, Mansfield & Kyabram and it looks like Kyabram won the lottery. Justin signs a, don't tell me, 2 year contract with Kyabram ;)

Then Kyabram are alerted to the fact Justin is under contract and are going to announce Justin as Captain Coach anyway, making Justin technically the Captain of both the Pascoe Vale and Kyabram FC's at the same time.

Summary
3 Two or Three Year Contracts Signed by Justin Sherman in 3 years
2012 10 Games Bullies Signed for 3 Stayed for 2
2013 3 Games Willy Signed for 2 Stayed for 1
2014 5 Games Paco Signed for 2 Stayed for 1

Now from where I come from that's what you call Good Work if you can get it.

Go get em Justin you seem to have a good thing going here.

The whisper is this one could end up being a LONG drawn out affair with AFL Victoria in the the thick of proceedings.

Good Luck to all parties "touch gloves "!
 
KeepItSimple said:
We all knew this and I doubled checked but apparently Gavin Urquardt is a definite Panther as well.

Seems like the president is keeping a lid on it which is good. Premier Division is so tough that it might seem like they may be finals chance but all the clubs will be doing heaps of recruiting in the off season. Sometimes you have to improve just to stand still in this Semi Professional EDFL Era.

Good on them for having a crack I say. Also good for us spectators who like to go to the game of the round games, as some silky talent will be on display.

http://leader.newspaperdirect.com/e...05/8a0cd8e7-52f5-4435-b2a6-401134164f05//true


On the money from my sources.

"also signing a few papers" mmm interesting, lets just say the Sherminator might need a new stage name .....at the rate he is terminating two & three year deals at his last three clubs the Terminator may get a run up bush:)

Tale of the Tape:

Bulldogs:
http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/ju...western-bulldogs/story-fnelctok-1226503963253
"WESTERN Bulldogs line-breaker Justin Sherman has left the club and will seek a third home via the pre-season draft despite having a year to run on his existing contract.

The former Brisbane Lion was not traded during October's player movement frenzy and the Dogs today declared they had reached a "mutual agreement" with Sherman."

Williamstown:
http://www.williamstownfc.com.au/williamstown-press-release-justin-sherman/
The Williamstown Football Club would like to announce that Justin Sherman has been released from his 2014 contract.

Justin joined Williamstown Football Club last year and initially signed for two seasons (2013 and 2014). A knee injury which required surgery ended his 2013 season after only 3 games.

Justin has experienced on going problems with the knee and off field he’s very busy with his upcoming wedding and the birth of his child.

Williamstown Football Club CEO Brendan Curry stated the following:

“Justin spoke to us in the New Year about his knee and upcoming wedding and fatherhood. He felt he couldn’t commit to VFL Football in 2014 and we decided to support his decision. Justin hopes to play some football at a local level in 2014 once his knee improves. We wish him all the best. “

Pascoe Vale:
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/...ning-back-on-vfl/story-fngnvocb-1226816884602
The last line of this article has proven to be prophetic "For me at the moment, that's where I'm at." Might be a good business card slogan?

Justin signed another 2 year deal 2014 & 2015 with sign on's. Justin was named Captain of the Pascoe Vale FC.

Justin played Round 1 of the 2014 season then succumb to further knee trouble which required club subsidised surgery and missed the next 13 games and then I'm told he returned for Round 14 then missed the do or die relegation game against Marby with a sore neck, Pascoe Vale lost by 1 point, then played the last 3 games of the year.

Justin mid contract applied to Rochester, Mansfield & Kyabram and it looks like Kyabram won the lottery. Justin signs a, don't tell me, 2 year contract with Kyabram ;)

Then Kyabram are alerted to the fact Justin is under contract and are going to announce Justin as Captain Coach anyway, making Justin technically the Captain of both the Pascoe Vale and Kyabram FC's at the same time.

Summary
3 Two or Three Year Contracts Signed by Justin Sherman in 3 years
2012 10 Games Bullies Signed for 3 Stayed for 2
2013 3 Games Willy Signed for 2 Stayed for 1
2014 5 Games Paco Signed for 2 Stayed for 1

Now from where I come from that's what you call Good Work if you can get it.

Go get em Justin you seem to have a good thing going here.

The whisper is this one could end up being a LONG drawn out affair with AFL Victoria in the the thick of proceedings.

Good Luck to all parties "touch gloves "!
Click to expand...

Sounds like certain other local footy player.
 
Reece miles to airport west
Had heard he was signing at avondale, must have backflipped and joined airport west, big get!
 
KeepItSimple said:
We all knew this and I doubled checked but apparently Gavin Urquardt is a definite Panther as well.

Seems like the president is keeping a lid on it which is good. Premier Division is so tough that it might seem like they may be finals chance but all the clubs will be doing heaps of recruiting in the off season. Sometimes you have to improve just to stand still in this Semi Professional EDFL Era.

Good on them for having a crack I say. Also good for us spectators who like to go to the game of the round games, as some silky talent will be on display.

http://leader.newspaperdirect.com/e...05/8a0cd8e7-52f5-4435-b2a6-401134164f05//true


On the money from my sources.

"also signing a few papers" mmm interesting, lets just say the Sherminator might need a new stage name .....at the rate he is terminating two & three year deals at his last three clubs the Terminator may get a run up bush:)

Tale of the Tape:

Bulldogs:
http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/ju...western-bulldogs/story-fnelctok-1226503963253
"WESTERN Bulldogs line-breaker Justin Sherman has left the club and will seek a third home via the pre-season draft despite having a year to run on his existing contract.

The former Brisbane Lion was not traded during October's player movement frenzy and the Dogs today declared they had reached a "mutual agreement" with Sherman."

Williamstown:
http://www.williamstownfc.com.au/williamstown-press-release-justin-sherman/
The Williamstown Football Club would like to announce that Justin Sherman has been released from his 2014 contract.

Justin joined Williamstown Football Club last year and initially signed for two seasons (2013 and 2014). A knee injury which required surgery ended his 2013 season after only 3 games.

Justin has experienced on going problems with the knee and off field he’s very busy with his upcoming wedding and the birth of his child.

Williamstown Football Club CEO Brendan Curry stated the following:

“Justin spoke to us in the New Year about his knee and upcoming wedding and fatherhood. He felt he couldn’t commit to VFL Football in 2014 and we decided to support his decision. Justin hopes to play some football at a local level in 2014 once his knee improves. We wish him all the best. “

Pascoe Vale:
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/...ning-back-on-vfl/story-fngnvocb-1226816884602
The last line of this article has proven to be prophetic "For me at the moment, that's where I'm at." Might be a good business card slogan?

Justin signed another 2 year deal 2014 & 2015 with sign on's. Justin was named Captain of the Pascoe Vale FC.

Justin played Round 1 of the 2014 season then succumb to further knee trouble which required club subsidised surgery and missed the next 13 games and then I'm told he returned for Round 14 then missed the do or die relegation game against Marby with a sore neck, Pascoe Vale lost by 1 point, then played the last 3 games of the year.

Justin mid contract applied to Rochester, Mansfield & Kyabram and it looks like Kyabram won the lottery. Justin signs a, don't tell me, 2 year contract with Kyabram ;)

Then Kyabram are alerted to the fact Justin is under contract and are going to announce Justin as Captain Coach anyway, making Justin technically the Captain of both the Pascoe Vale and Kyabram FC's at the same time.

Summary
3 Two or Three Year Contracts Signed by Justin Sherman in 3 years
2012 10 Games Bullies Signed for 3 Stayed for 2
2013 3 Games Willy Signed for 2 Stayed for 1
2014 5 Games Paco Signed for 2 Stayed for 1

Now from where I come from that's what you call Good Work if you can get it.

Go get em Justin you seem to have a good thing going here.

The whisper is this one could end up being a LONG drawn out affair with AFL Victoria in the the thick of proceedings.

Good Luck to all parties "touch gloves "!
Click to expand...
YAWN!!!!!

Laughable. You talked about hard working committee men. How would you like to be an APW hard working loyal person. You've poured blood sweat and tears to pay those three ***** over 100K over two years only to see them line up against them this year for an even greater amount!!!

It's one thing to leave (everyone can) but to all leave to a rival club in the same division says a lot.

Don't poor Pacco us on here. Last year you sacked two coaches and then when some of the players they recruited tried to leave you asked for their sign on plus a release fee to be paid.

You bring blokes in with the money they will leave for the money. Not rocket science. Take some responsibility and don't get on here with your sob stories. Did you expect anything different with Sherman. If you did then jokes on you. Next week we''ll have Abers kids on here surprised that Remiers is leaving

Whisper is that AFL VIC are sick of the sight of your club
 
Craig Hutchy said:
YAWN!!!!!

Laughable. You talked about hard working committee men. How would you like to be an APW hard working loyal person. You've poured blood sweat and tears to pay those three ***** over 100K over two years only to see them line up against them this year for an even greater amount!!!

It's one thing to leave (everyone can) but to all leave to a rival club in the same division says a lot.

Don't poor Pacco us on here. Last year you sacked two coaches and then when some of the players they recruited tried to leave you asked for their sign on plus a release fee to be paid.

You bring blokes in with the money they will leave for the money. Not rocket science. Take some responsibility and don't get on here with your sob stories. Did you expect anything different with Sherman. If you did then jokes on you. Next week we''ll have Abers kids on here surprised that Remiers is leaving

Whisper is that AFL VIC are sick of the sight of your club
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FYI Hutchy I'm not Pacco but have a soft spot for them as I do for a few other clubs. In fact all clubs have a real go, just love the footy.

Fair call Hutchy can't argue with how APW would be feeling. Don't know the ins and outs re the $$ or what happened at APW but either way you carve it up you have a right to feel gutted.

No poor Pacco Hutchy, your right its been a very patchy few years down at Pacco and stability hasn't been their strongest suit no doubt.

Even your comment about bring blokes in for money not being rocket science, can't argue, that's 80% of the battle that defines finals success in EDFL Premier I agree, sad but true and Pacco has never won that battle against the marquee clubs and Pacco didn't get to a prelim like APW first year up either, not even finals.

So maybe I've drunk a little to much of the Panther pre season coolaid ;) Point taken

A couple of points I disagree on are the playing by the contract rules, I reckon all of the clubs have a right to fight to make players stand by their contracts and should use all of their available rights to protect themselves from being taken for sign ons paid over 2 years, then have the player bailing in 1 year.

All clubs end up on both sides of that dance and I reckon clubs should all hold players to account regards their contracts. If that gives AFL Victoria the shits then they should stop demanding clubs use their standard player contracts and make it a free for all? Not sure what the practical point your trying to make on this one is Hutchy?

Regards Pacco taking some responsibility regards Sherman and what else did they expect? I'm not following you on that one, are you claiming the APW boys were under contract?

Uncontracted players leaving is not the issue a Club has a right to complain about, but a player leaving mid contract is an issue in my view. I honestly think your getting the issues mixed up.

Your confusing general frustration at paying and developing good players who leave when they fall out of contract and go to a rival club (frustrating I know) with players leaving whilst under contract and taking sign ons without being held to account.

Two totally separate matters, one is just the ruff and tumble of footy business but still within the rules and the other is a form of stealing/cheating a club by an employee of a club. Chalk & Cheese in my opinion.

Each to their own Hutchy but will slow down on the coolaid all the same;)
 
KeepItSimple said:
FYI Hutchy I'm not Pacco but have a soft spot for them as I do for a few other clubs. In fact all clubs have a real go, just love the footy.

Fair call Hutchy can't argue with how APW would be feeling. Don't know the ins and outs re the $$ or what happened at APW but either way you carve it up you have a right to feel gutted.

No poor Pacco Hutchy, your right its been a very patchy few years down at Pacco and stability hasn't been their strongest suit no doubt.

Even your comment about bring blokes in for money not being rocket science, can't argue, that's 80% of the battle that defines finals success in EDFL Premier I agree, sad but true and Pacco has never won that battle against the marquee clubs and Pacco didn't get to a prelim like APW first year up either, not even finals.

So maybe I've drunk a little to much of the Panther pre season coolaid ;) Point taken

A couple of points I disagree on are the playing by the contract rules, I reckon all of the clubs have a right to fight to make players stand by their contracts and should use all of their available rights to protect themselves from being taken for sign ons paid over 2 years, then have the player bailing in 1 year.

All clubs end up on both sides of that dance and I reckon clubs should all hold players to account regards their contracts. If that gives AFL Victoria the shits then they should stop demanding clubs use their standard player contracts and make it a free for all? Not sure what the practical point your trying to make on this one is Hutchy?

Regards Pacco taking some responsibility regards Sherman and what else did they expect? I'm not following you on that one, are you claiming the APW boys were under contract?

Uncontracted players leaving is not the issue a Club has a right to complain about, but a player leaving mid contract is an issue in my view. I honestly think your getting the issues mixed up.

Your confusing general frustration at paying and developing good players who leave when they fall out of contract and go to a rival club (frustrating I know) with players leaving whilst under contract and taking sign ons without being held to account.

Two totally separate matters, one is just the ruff and tumble of footy business but still within the rules and the other is a form of stealing/cheating a club by an employee of a club. Chalk & Cheese in my opinion.

Each to their own Hutchy but will slow down on the coolaid all the same;)
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I imagine he meant that (as you highlighted previously) Sherman has a rep for this kind of thing. It's similar to how if a girl cheats to be with you, you can't really complain if she does the same to you.
As for players leaving, by all means make sure that you get back a sign on before clearing them but it was widely discussed that Paco were actually looking at profiting off a couple of the departing players.
 
So pacco think they are Man United and
want transfer fees for contracted players, let's be honest contracts in local footy are worthless & until a player runs out in your jumper round 1 you shouldn't believe you have signed him
 
G
milkman99 said:
So pacco think they are Man United and
want transfer fees for contracted players, let's be honest contracts in local footy are worthless & until a player runs out in your jumper round 1 you shouldn't believe you have signed him
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Guys lets stay rational here this is where forums become a waste of time for everyone, at least me.

I take your point milkman its often the way things roll, but I reckon in life you don't have to give up and follow the lowest common denominator.

In sport, business and society in general what defines the quality of a country/community/sport is the rule of law, a structure that enables people to deal with each other reliably so we can make plans, investments and generally run our lives because we trust the system to stand up for our collective rights when an individual chooses to break those agreements/laws. As opposed to a lawless society where contracts and the paper they are written on are worthless and everyone gives up trying to hold people to account through the law and it turns into a corrupt, violent society, think lots of African nations, Afghanistan etc.. etc.. Then people can't trust each other and only the most violent and corrupt in society win.

Contracts matter in all walks of life, including the EDFL Premier League, they allow all clubs to make plans and trust that the parties will see each others end of the bargain out. As always there will be people/businesses/clubs in society who choose to flaunt the system and all of the community in this instance the local footy clubs and the administrative bodies like AFL Victoria have a responsibility to enforce the system that we all use to give us stability.

As I'm typing what seems to me to be the ABC's of footy business at all levels, I feel myself slipping into the classic Forum disease of the pyrrhic victory but for the sake of bonhomie I will take one for the Forum.!

My personal rules for protection from the Forum disease of the Pyrrhic Victory:
  • Stay on point, don't use obscuration as a tool to win a debate.
  • Use the art/tool of Analogy properly, if it is miss used and people start drawing long bows or ones that have no correlation to the facts at hand, that signals the death of any real intelligent debate, from there it becomes school yard mud slinging. Who yells the loudest wins crap.
Exhibit 1.1
So pacco think they are Man United and want transfer fees for contracted players
What do you think a club should do when a contracted player says I want to leave mid contract, you think if they give the sign on back the contract should evaporate? If you say yes you are really saying lets not have contracts at all because they would form no binding function on one of the parties. A transfer fee is hurdle/compensation for the party disadvantaged by having a contract broken and happens in all areas of society. e.g exit fees on all sorts of contracts in life exist because there needs to be a hurdle for the person or entity breaking the contract otherwise all contracts would be worthless.

Exhibit 1.2
let's be honest contracts in local footy are worthless
No they are not worthless at all that's just an emotional statement with no grounding, there have been many cases at AFL Victoria that I have been personally privy to where the player contract, when used correctly has been ruled to be binding, in fact AFL Victoria welcome these opportunities because they see it as a chance to send a signal to people like yourself that hold the view that contracts are not worth the paper they are written on.

Milkman and anyone else reading this, this is where Forums lose a chance to facilitate good debate and make good reading for us all. I have been sucked in here and spent too much time ;) trying to counter what really is just a nothing comment/post but what usually happens anyone who has got a rational opinion looks at the junk responses that get thrown up at people and think TOO HARD I will leave that to the Forum mugs.

Lift the the level of debate fellas and we all win!
 
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