ASADA case against Essendon hanging by a thread (The Age, 1 Nov 14)

[Magruder]

My bet is ASADA know this and have more evidence.

I think we agree on this.

and FWIW, you and every EFC supporter/membner out there has my sympathy for the level of crap the club has been through over the last couple of years. You guys, (the supporters), didn't do anything wrong and yet you may have to suffer the consequences. It's a s**t sandwich for the supporters no doubt.

 

[Magruder]

People keep repeating this, however, it seems pretty clear to me that Essendon do believe it was TA1 and feel their evidence supports that. All there is that is contrary to that is that one batch which ASADA thinks was TB4 .. and Essendon doesn't even think was at the club.

Ok then. That's all good

 

[Higgins2Waite]

Do essendon posters have a roster on here or something?

Those trying to persuade or reason with giganator might as well save their energy. Many have tried but failed. He calls it winning, others call it repetitive dribble until you're forced to run head first into a wall.

I can't believe some still think that photo carries and weight.

 

[jj1978]

So the players have admitted to taking injections.... now can someone at Essendon tell us what the contents of those injections were? Oh that's right it's on Dank's spreadsheet/computer that he's not providing to clear all this up.... So until that is done... lets look at this logically...

1. Players admitted to receiving injections (texts recorded b/n players talking about receiving thymo injections as well).
2. ASADA investigations reveal only Thymo paper trail is TB4
3. Texts and communications between Hird, Dank and Co... talk about TB4 usage patterns and capabilities..
4. Can't see receipts or paper trails in existance for at least other substances that could of possibly been injected...
5. Although shady to a degree there have been recorded interviews from Charter and Alavi about a few things... most likely including tb4 hence ASADA going for it.
6. The one man who can clear this up with his spreadsheet is not doing so....why is that? What's he hiding...
7. No other documentation from Essendon can guarantee exactly what the players were given.

So from a logical perspective just not knowing what the players were given is enough for a good slap on the wrist and some form of penalty... now if all was Kosher, Dank, Alavi, Charter would front up and show proof to the players innocence (in fact if Essendon knew they had this magic evidence they would force these cretins to provide the evidence). If innocent I know I wouldn't spend millions in legal fees and time wasting by trying to stall or dismiss the whole process.

Now I'm just an everyday Joe.. and from the above for crying out loud if you can't see that the players got given something they shouldn't have been given then you're in denial.

 

[Go_Blues!]

absolutley agree

IF Asada prove that Tb4 was on the premises than Essendon are goneskies.

Perhaps. But surely we would not want them only to show it was on the premises but also it was there in quantities that support the dosage program that was allegedly run and it was there at a time that correlates with when the program was supposed to be taking place. I expect ASADA will be able to show that Essendon paid for whatever it was which does place it at the club but still the hard thing to do is to demonstrate that it was TB4. This may come down to a lot of things lining up for ASADA or Essendon being able to counter some of the claims.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

I think we agree on this.

and FWIW, you and every EFC supporter/membner out there has my sympathy for the level of crap the club has been through over the last couple of years. You guys, (the supporters), didn't do anything wrong and yet you may have to suffer the consequences. It's a s**t sandwich for the supporters no doubt.

I dont think Essendon deserves sympathy too be honest. They put themselves in the situation

I do however think they should be treated fairly which alot of people on this board dont seem too fond of..

 

[LoungeLizard]

no because we would give you a blood test reading to determine it.

By your anology Essendon could do the same and we could blood test them?

Oh wait they passed that with no results shown,...........


look im just saying there is no defifintive proof essendon took tb4 until it all comes out, so at this point its fairly likely they are innocent.

Fairly likely in your eyes.
Me i am of the opinion ASADA think they took 1 or more banned drugs.
so you think they are innocent, i think they have a case to answer to before i will think the same.
No photo will change my mind, infact the photo makes me more suspicious.
A question: do you think any legal in their right mind would produce that photo as evidence?
I would have a guess and say that photo was produced for the gullible

 

[hfchfc]

more proof thymo was ther than tb4 was

at least physically.

Wow, you just got runners up in the "stupidest post of the year" award!! You are on fire!!

 

[Cronos]

People keep repeating this, however, it seems pretty clear to me that Essendon do believe it was TA1 and feel their evidence supports that. All there is that is contrary to that is that one batch which ASADA thinks was TB4 .. and Essendon doesn't even think was at the club.

If Essendon had any evidence to support that it was TA1, then the Show Cause stage would have been a fantastic time to show it, and it would have by far been the fastest way to make it all end, and at the same time remove the stigma amassing on the players as we type.

EFC instead decided that court action was the fastest way, then showing zero evidence to support their case at the Show Cause stage.

Unusual actions from the parties who want it all to end.

 

[Magruder]

I dont think Essendon deserves sympathy too be honest. They put themselves in the situation

I do however think they should be treated fairly which alot of people on this board dont seem too fond of..

I think the poor schmucks who fork out to support their club derserve sympathy and some understanding.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

So the players have admitted to taking injections.... now can someone at Essendon tell us what the contents of those injections were? Oh that's right it's on Dank's spreadsheet/computer that he's not providing to clear all this up.... So until that is done... lets look at this logically...

1. Players admitted to receiving injections (texts recorded b/n players talking about receiving thymo injections as well).
2. ASADA investigations reveal only Thymo paper trail is TB4
3. Texts and communications between Hird, Dank and Co... talk about TB4 usage patterns and capabilities..
4. Can't see receipts or paper trails in existance for at least other substances that could of possibly been injected...
5. Although shady to a degree there have been recorded interviews from Charter and Alavi about a few things... most likely including tb4 hence ASADA going for it.
6. The one man who can clear this up with his spreadsheet is not doing so....why is that? What's he hiding...
7. No other documentation from Essendon can guarantee exactly what the players were given.

So from a logical perspective just not knowing what the players were given is enough for a good slap on the wrist and some form of penalty... now if all was Kosher, Dank, Alavi, Charter would front up and show proof to the players innocence (in fact if Essendon knew they had this magic evidence they would force these cretins to provide the evidence). If innocent I know I wouldn't spend millions in legal fees and time wasting by trying to stall or dismiss the whole process.

Now I'm just an everyday Joe.. and from the above for crying out loud if you can't see that the players got given something they shouldn't have been given then you're in denial.

please link me the that paper trail of Tb4 which links Essendon.

That is the killer blow in your argument and i think you are a little confused about a paper trail between charters/dank etc and between essendon.

They only trail that counra for anything. if it doesnt link it to Essendon than it does not mean a thing.

 

[fishardansin]

If Essendon had any evidence to support that it was TA1, then the Show Cause stage would have been a fantastic time to show it, and it would have by far been the fastest way to make it all end, and at the same time remove the stigma amassing on the players as we type.

EFC instead decided that court action was the fastest way, then showing zero evidence to support their case at the Show Cause stage.

Unusual actions from the parties who want it all to end.

They do. The contention is one batch.

 

[Cronos]

They do. The contention is one batch.

...and you know this how?

If they don't have evidence of even one batch, why would they think they have evidence to support that it was TA1 as you stated? Especially when there's no evidence that has been publicly released at all of a single source of Thymo-anything other than Thymosin Beta 4?

 

[LoungeLizard]

They do. The contention is one batch.

is TA1 the same as thymomodulin? because i was of the opinion they are 2 separate things.
Dank says he used thymomodulin, so where in the hell does TA1 fit in?

 

[Ancient Tiger]

They do. The contention is one batch.

Are you saying thymodulin is now somehow TA1?

 

[Cronos]

is TA1 the same as thymomodulin? because i was of the opinion they are 2 separate things.
Dank says he used thymomodulin, so where in the hell does TA1 fit in?

Thymomodulin is not Thymosin Alpha 1 which is not Thymosin Beta 4. How people who apparently understand these drugs can confuse them is anyone's guess (unless of course you were deliberately trying to create confusion)

 

[Cronos]

Are you saying thymodulin is now somehow TA1?

The vial photo of Thymomodulin is completely at odds with any suggestion that they had used Thymosin Alpha 1. (Not to mention with all those confusing names going around, Dean Wallis surely would have copied the drug name off a vial for his spreadsheet - how did he end up with Thymodulin?

 

[LoungeLizard]

Thymomodulin is not Thymosin Alpha 1 which is not Thymosin Beta 4. How people who apparently understand these drugs can confuse them is anyone's guess (unless of course you were deliberately trying to create confusion)

sounds like it doesn't it?
there are a lot of people changed from thymomodulin to TA1.
anything, as long as it's not TB4 hey?

 

[Go_Blues!]

Its a photo of a bottle that's all.
No proof of date of manufacture, not even where the photo was taken.
If i was accused of drinking on the job, carrying a photo of pepsi would make it all good hey?

That is a great analogy!! Made me laugh anyway. One would hope that Essendon are not relying on that photo for the cornerstone of their defense but I am sure they are not.

 

[neutralguy]

And what places Tb4 at windy hill?

If you think Essendon will get done only for a dosage program you are going to be sadly mistaken.

My bet is ASADA know this and have more evidence.

So as Dank is one of the people being heard by the Tribunal at the moment and he has been charged with administering TB4 to the players, Dank doesn't show up t the Tribunal and is found guilty of a myriad of charges (one being administering TB4 to players). The presence of TB4 at EFC has been established the players would then need to disprove that?

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Fairly likely in your eyes.
Me i am of the opinion ASADA think they took 1 or more banned drugs.
so you think they are innocent, i think they have a case to answer to before i will think the same.
No photo will change my mind, infact the photo makes me more suspicious.
A question: do you think any legal in their right mind would produce that photo as evidence?
I would have a guess and say that photo was produced for the gullible

I do not know. I do not know how they package suppkements. Maybe all the info is on the back beats me?

But how about this. When i see a receipt, invoice, purcahse order, delivery docket or a photo of tb4 that links to Essendon ill admit there was tb4.

But at the end of the day me and you are the ones that need to be conviced. There is panel that know alot more than both of us that need to prove that essendon comfortably took a banned substance.

From your point of view it seems you think ASADA can, from mine i think they cant.

Lets see what happens.

 

[Ancient Tiger]

is TA1 the same as thymomodulin? because i was of the opinion they are 2 separate things.
Dank says he used thymomodulin, so where in the hell does TA1 fit in?

The problem Essendon have is unwinding the spin they have put out.

They have interchangeably used the drugs TA1 and thymomodulin as if they're the same drug. Clearly they are not. There is some sketchy documentation on a spreadsheet that "thymodulin" was used but no links to it via GL Biochemicals. Then they have tenuous link to a "thymosin" from GL which they are claiming is TA1 I believe, but zero documentation it was given.

This is all smoke and mirrors stuff.

 

[blackshadow]

more proof thymo was ther than tb4 was

at least physically.

I truly pity you if you really believe that.

 

[LoungeLizard]

That is a great analogy!! Made me laugh anyway. One would hope that Essendon are not relying on that photo for the cornerstone of their defense but I am sure they are not.

IMO it was a photo for the gullible, and it seems to have worked

 

[HirdsTheWord]

So as Dank is one of the people being heard by the Tribunal at the moment and he has been charged with administering TB4 to the players, Dank doesn't show up t the Tribunal and is found guilty of a myriad of charges (one being administering TB4 to players). The establishment of TB4 at EFC has been established the players would then need to disprove that?[/QUOTE]

that doesnt make sense?