Competitive Pokemon (VGC, Smogon)

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FlowersByIrene

FlowersByIrene

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Apr 29, 2012
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Are you a Pokemon Master?
To be the best you have to master them all 6v6 Smogon Singles, 3v3 Battlespot, 4v4 VGC, Doubles, Triples, Singles, Random, OU, UU, Ubers, NU, RU, PU, Little Cup

This is a thread designed to talk tactics, organise battles, organsie tourneys, share sets, post your favourite battles, give hints and tips to become better competitive pokemon players. The metagame is constantly evolving, regardless of whether you've been top tier since Gen 4 or started with ORAS come in here and have some fun.

Resources
Simulators
http://play.pokemonshowdown.com/
Pokemon Showdown, a smogon based online simulator, with moving sprites and battle animations, also hosts random battles, VGC simulations and much more.

http://pokemon-online.eu/
Old school emulator, fast pased with less sprite/animation that Showdown, it was once the top online simulator but has since become second tier to Showdown

Research
http://www.smogon.com/
A complete and in depth website for all your competitive pokemon knowledge, guides, competitive pokedex, forums and heaps more.

http://gamut-was-taken.github.io/
An ORAS updates damage calc, input your spread and your oponents and know what chance you have to OHKO that thing.

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So I had a thought last night.

How can I bring E-Killer (Arceus + Swords Dance + Extreme Speed + STAB + Silk Scarf = Kill everything) to the lower tiers.

I did some research and outside of Arceus, Linoone is the only Normal Type to learn Extreme Speed, Dragonite, Lucario etc learn it but they don't get the STAB bonus which, when combined with Silk Scarf really turns up the power.

The beauty of STAB E-speed is such:
Extreme Speed 80 Base Power, x1.5 for STAB x 1.2 for Silk Scarf = 144 Base Power move. With +2 Priority that is pretty insane

Non STAB it loses it's shin a little
Extreme Speed 80 Base Power, x.12 for Silk Scarf = 96

So I tried to make Linoone work in PU, the beauty of Linoone is that it has Belly Drum. Which gives it max attack at x4. Meaning E-Speed is putting out. 576 Base Power. The only problem is Linoone is pretty frail and it's hard to get a Belly Drum up.

I tried to make a set with Max Speed and Max Attack work but I couldn't pull it off. I'm going to try a set with a Sitrus Berry instead of Silk Scarf (which loses a bit of power but at x4 it shouldnt matter, also Gluttony helps with the Berry) and running max HP instead of either max attack or max speed.


If Linoone can't work I think the closest thing you can get to E-Killer would probably be Dragonite, Weakness Policy + Max HP & Mutli Scale means you can pull off a Dragon Dance and then Extreme Speed away at x2.5, only problem is Silk Scarf would be a bit redunant due to the speed boost from Dragon Dance and the benefit of using Dragon Claw or EQ when the matchup is there, which is almost always. And at this point I've bastardised the E-Killer idea to the point that it's just a regular Weakness Policy DNite.

Unfortunately E-Killer might remain stuck in Ubers :(
 
FlowersByIrene said:
What set?
Click to expand...
Modest, scarfed.
Move set: leaf storm, magical leaf, sludge bomb and hidden power ice

I know hp fire and dazzling gleam are usually preferred over hp ice and one of the grass moves.. But hp ice one shots landerous and mega Salamance which are two big threats to my team I intend to use my Roserade with.
Also everytime I see Landerous on battle spot I lead roserade and kill it first shot.. This has literally happened every single time I've seen a landerous lol
I like having both grass stabs, you don't always want to be locked into leaf storm as your only grass move
 
nahnah said:
Modest, scarfed.
Move set: leaf storm, magical leaf, sludge bomb and hidden power ice

I know hp fire and dazzling gleam are usually preferred over hp ice and one of the grass moves.. But hp ice one shots landerous and mega Salamance which are two big threats to my team I intend to use my Roserade with.
Also everytime I see Landerous on battle spot I lead roserade and kill it first shot.. This has literally happened every single time I've seen a landerous lol
I like having both grass stabs, you don't always want to be locked into leaf storm as your only grass move
Click to expand...
Yeah that's a quality set. Quick question is how much a modest, leaf storm do to Lando? does it ohko?
Because without HP fire you're walled by Scizor very hard
 
nahnah said:
I've never tried so I'm not sure

Yeah walled by scizor, but I usually use it with 3 other pokes that handle it well, ferrothorn is more of a problem for me
Click to expand...
A Modest 252 Sp.A Leaf Storm does 71-84% to a physically defensive Landorus T. Which obviously isn't good enough.

However if you ran Specs over Scarf you have a guaranteed chance to OHKO and if you ran max speed modest you would outspeed denfisive landorus's and you'd even outspeed any landorus without a positive speed nature and max speed.

Could be a consideration. You'd need some sort of wall to switch into after your leaf storm, as you obviously get a big drop and are choiced, something that can take a fire, psychic or ice attack. You'd want it to have some sort or phasing/statusing/stat resetting capabilities incase they send in a set up Pokemon predicting your switch.
A Weezing with clear smog would handle everything but a psychic attack well.
Rotom W with will-o-wisp would be perfect
 

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I feel rain has so much more support than hail/sand.

You've got all the recovery types, dry skin, rain dish, hydration etc. Then all the swift swimmers.
Not to mention you get an automatic resistance to fire.
Perfect accuracy hurricanes. Makes scizor/ferrothorn even bigger beasts.

Politoed - for obvious reasons
Kingdra, Mega Swampert - sweepers
Toxicroak, Heliolisk, Goodra, etc - recovery/repair/defense
Ferro/Scizor
Tornadus, Dragonite etc - Hurricane


It has a lot of weapons does rain
 
FlowersByIrene said:
I feel rain has so much more support than hail/sand.

You've got all the recovery types, dry skin, rain dish, hydration etc. Then all the swift swimmers.
Not to mention you get an automatic resistance to fire.
Perfect accuracy hurricanes. Makes scizor/ferrothorn even bigger beasts.

Politoed - for obvious reasons
Kingdra, Mega Swampert - sweepers
Toxicroak, Heliolisk, Goodra, etc - recovery/repair/defense
Ferro/Scizor
Tornadus, Dragonite etc - Hurricane


It has a lot of weapons does rain
Click to expand...
Is heliolisk any good never battled one ?
I've never heard of anyone making a hail team, does hail to anything other than damage non Ice pokemon?
 
nahnah said:
Is heliolisk any good never battled one ?
I've never heard of anyone making a hail team, does hail to anything other than damage non Ice pokemon?
Click to expand...

In hail Blizzard will never miss, unfortunately it doesn't do much good aside from that.. it's easier to make a Rain/Sun team because the weather won't hurt you unless you're a dry skin Toxicroak in the Sun.
 
Got 2 battles for you to watch if you wish

First: 84LW-WWWW-WWXH-K67B
Why did he forfiet when I switched roserade back in? I would have waited to see if Roserade could handle the Venasaur first...

Second: SM7G-WWWW-WWXH-K6CX
I didn't deserve to win this battle, I was hoping so bad for a crit and got it.. If only I had realised earlier that knock off was super effective lol my bad
 
Also I kinda feel bad for the first guy, I was making predictions non stop lol I usually don't predict much at all

Edit: technically I should feel bad for the second guy more than the first but that mummy/Egyptian pokemon (can't remember its name) is annoying as hell and he should feel bad for using it
 
Last edited:
nahnah said:
Is heliolisk any good never battled one ?
I've never heard of anyone making a hail team, does hail to anything other than damage non Ice pokemon?
Click to expand...
Snow cloak and snow veil are things. Can't remember what they do though. Think it makes Blizzard perfectly accurate too

Heliolisk puts in work in the lower tiers. It's currently getting suspect tested in RU I think at the moment
 
nahnah said:
Also I kinda feel bad for the first guy, I was making predictions non stop lol I usually don't predict much at all

Edit: technically I should feel bad for the second guy more than the first but that mummy/Egyptian pokemon (can't remember its name) is annoying as hell and he should feel bad for using it
Click to expand...
Cofagrigous is a beast

I'll watch them in the morning bro!
 
So i tried out the NU tier today on showdown, i didn't really know what i was doing but thought i made a really annoying team lol i won both matches because my opponents both quit, heres the third one. I wasn't really concentrating either, if i keep winning i might actually breed a team similar to this on ORAS to use. Also i had no idea Kecleon got access to all these new moves, I use to use Kecleon a lot on battle spot when XY first came out
This team has too much weakness to dark and water, might swap Braxien with Cacturne or something else

Edit: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/nu-216666594 - this battle was longer

im 3/3 with this team lol

Edit: Alright so i swapped in Cacturne and now i have a fire weakness

also look at this gen 1 battle i had....the hax....
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen1randombattle-216737745
 
Last edited:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-262264130

Freaking amazing battle here, this guys team was really unique.
I realised i was in trouble when my normal Tran counter got ohkoed by a HP ice, when that happenned I realised I didn't have anythign for tran, I was this close to forfeiting. HP Ice/FireBlast/EP air baloon tran destroys my Weavile, Thundurus, Venusaur and Scizor.
Eventually my Venusaur ended in against the tran and I thought * it and hit a giga drain to pop his balloon. Got lucky and had a fireblast miss. Clicked Earthquake and got lucky again with another fireblast miss.

The rest of the match kept kinda going in circles. I'd switch Talonflame into his Saur, he'd go to rotom-w and volt switch, eventually I just swords danced and rooste dup on his switch. i realised if I could get some damage off on Lando and Rotom weavile could sweep.

I got that damage and weavile came in after a thundurus sack to rotom.

Icile crash on a defensive Mandibuzz does 80% - i got a crit, in my had i'm thinking gg, Rotom dies to a shard, lando dies to a shard (may have already been dead can't remember) and I had Venusaur in range of icicle crash to knock out for certain. I shard rotom, say gg... and then promptly miss the Icicle Crash for the win and get blown back by a sludge bomb

Epic game, amazing chances, dissapointing result
 
FlowersByIrene said:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-262264130

Freaking amazing battle here, this guys team was really unique.
I realised i was in trouble when my normal Tran counter got ohkoed by a HP ice, when that happenned I realised I didn't have anythign for tran, I was this close to forfeiting. HP Ice/FireBlast/EP air baloon tran destroys my Weavile, Thundurus, Venusaur and Scizor.
Eventually my Venusaur ended in against the tran and I thought **** it and hit a giga drain to pop his balloon. Got lucky and had a fireblast miss. Clicked Earthquake and got lucky again with another fireblast miss.

The rest of the match kept kinda going in circles. I'd switch Talonflame into his Saur, he'd go to rotom-w and volt switch, eventually I just swords danced and rooste dup on his switch. i realised if I could get some damage off on Lando and Rotom weavile could sweep.

I got that damage and weavile came in after a thundurus sack to rotom.

Icile crash on a defensive Mandibuzz does 80% - i got a crit, in my had i'm thinking gg, Rotom dies to a shard, lando dies to a shard (may have already been dead can't remember) and I had Venusaur in range of icicle crash to knock out for certain. I shard rotom, say gg... and then promptly miss the Icicle Crash for the win and get blown back by a sludge bomb

Epic game, amazing chances, dissapointing result
Click to expand...
do you battle in UU?
 
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