Player Watch Jackson Ramsay (Delisted 2017)

Will he or won't he?

  • Yes

    Votes: 106 60.6%

  • No

    Votes: 52 29.7%

  • Maybe at another club

    Votes: 17 9.7%
  • Total voters
    175

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Knightmare said:
Still not a best 22 player with Scharenberg/Langdon/Seedsman/Toovey/Williams as general defends all better. Probably Oxley also and maybe Maynard when developed. So it's still hard to see long term how he makes it on this list if/when we get a fully healthy group back.

But credit to Ramsay for putting in the work to improve by foot and also credit to him for playing his role when in the AFL side. He certainly isn't out of his depth.

With Ramsay's progress I would at this point be advocating that he receive another season, with a few others I'm looking at to delist first. So that is the element regarding my position with him that has changed. And credit to Ramsay for putting forward good performances.

The real test for Ramsay and really the entire group will be after the bye with the easy part of the draw, drawing to an end after the bye. That will better show exactly where Ramsay and the rest of the playing group are at.
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You have one spot left on our list. Ramsay or Sinclair get a contract?
 

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Knightmare said:
Still not a best 22 player with Scharenberg/Langdon/Seedsman/Toovey/Williams as general defends all better.
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Scharenberg, Langdon and Seedsman are different players who play different roles to Ramsay. Toovey will be gone when Ramsay is at his peak. As a hard nosed defender likely to match up on the quick elusive types. Williams is his only competition and there is clearly room for both of them. He looks like a great prospect to me who is already best 22 on current form.
 
The great majority of us are just happy and relieved that Ramsay is showing something. As a VFL watcher I was hopeful he would make it, without being fully convinced.

Its OK if people had a different view prior to this season, that happens and views can change. I think we're all pretty happy, without it being a competition about who was right, wrong or indifferent. Good luck to the kid. Hine, Bucks and the coaches spotted what was there and have worked on it. Thats their job, and they appear to be good at it.:D
 
PepperFace said:
You have one spot left on our list. Ramsay or Sinclair get a contract?
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Ramsay for me gets the contract. He is younger, improving at a faster rate. Both are good stoppers but Ramsay is a better stopper. Ramsay is the more efficient and reliable kick. Both can run and Sinclair is quicker. But more ticks in Ramsay's box.

sr36 said:
Scharenberg, Langdon and Seedsman are different players who play different roles to Ramsay. Toovey will be gone when Ramsay is at his peak. As a hard nosed defender likely to match up on the quick elusive types. Williams is his only competition and there is clearly room for both of them. He looks like a great prospect to me who is already best 22 on current form.
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You are correct in saying Scharenberg, Langdon and Seedsman are all different players to Ramsay in terms of role. And you won't have anyone dispute that.

In saying that I'm not seeing the automatic transition from Toovey when he hits 30-33 or whenever he calls it a day, straight to Ramsay. Maynard we may see as a backman and he could be contesting for that position. Brenden Abbott I actually advocate playing in the back half and personally for me, if he can develop, he would be a heck of a choice in a back pocket along with Williams.

So in terms of selection today and selection lets call it 5 years from now, even if Toovey has retired by then. Ramsay will have to earn his position. He is definitely not so talented that the position will for the next 10 years just be given to him.
 

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I have to wonder where the knocks on his kicking are coming from? He has the odd monumental brain fade that makes his kicking look a lot worse than it actually is, IMO. On the whole I don't view him as a difference maker by foot ala Seedsman or Pendles, but it's no worse than Langdon's for mine and has been better than Kennedy's at senior level.
 
Scodog10 said:
I have to wonder where the knocks on his kicking are coming from? He has the odd monumental brain fade that makes his kicking look a lot worse than it actually is, IMO. On the whole I don't view him as a difference maker by foot ala Seedsman or Pendles, but it's no worse than Langdon's for mine and has been better than Kennedy's at senior level.
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Ramsay was below average by foot as a junior. And I would certainly through last year have classed him the same. Going mostly safe options, but also missing his fair share of targets.

This year he is still playing it safe, which with his limitations he really needs to, but there are less blunders, less poor kicks. So he has put in the work and it's starting to show at AFL level which is the key to him staying in the senior side.
 
Knightmare said:
Ramsay was below average by foot as a junior. And I would certainly through last year have classed him the same. Going mostly safe options, but also missing his fair share of targets.

This year he is still playing it safe, which with his limitations he really needs to, but there are less blunders, less poor kicks. So he has put in the work and it's starting to show at AFL level which is the key to him staying in the senior side.
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I think the key for him is that it's improvement year on end.

As you said a below average kick as a junior, to an average kick taking safe options across his first two seasons at the club and now after adjusting to the tempo he's hitting those safe options with more consistency.

I'd like to therefore see what he's doing with 30-40 games under his belt because my feel is that he'll continue that trajectory in a way that Johnson did.

I also can't help wondering if he's the one that Buckley is grooming to replace Shaw because I'm not seeing the Toovey comparisons. Is he the right option for that role? Like some I'm not convinced, but I think he'll be given every opportunity because of his desire to hunt the ball and contest. His work against quality opposition will tell us a lot because he made a lot of clutch errors v Essendon so I'm not keen to buy in too much just yet.
 
Scodog10 said:
I have to wonder where the knocks on his kicking are coming from? He has the odd monumental brain fade that makes his kicking look a lot worse than it actually is, IMO. On the whole I don't view him as a difference maker by foot ala Seedsman or Pendles, but it's no worse than Langdon's for mine and has been better than Kennedy's at senior level.
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Agree, and after all of 7 senior games.
 
Scodog10 said:
I think the key for him is that it's improvement year on end.

As you said a below average kick as a junior, to an average kick taking safe options across his first two seasons at the club and now after adjusting to the tempo he's hitting those safe options with more consistency.

I'd like to therefore see what he's doing with 30-40 games under his belt because my feel is that he'll continue that trajectory in a way that Johnson did.

I also can't help wondering if he's the one that Buckley is grooming to replace Shaw because I'm not seeing the Toovey comparisons. Is he the right option for that role? Like some I'm not convinced, but I think he'll be given every opportunity because of his desire to hunt the ball and contest. His work against quality opposition will tell us a lot because he made a lot of clutch errors v Essendon so I'm not keen to buy in too much just yet.
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The upward trajectory is the key with Ramsay. Year one he didn't look great. Year two he became a reliable shutdown player after that not being an obvious aspect of his game previously. And this year he is cleaning bits and pieces up and building that consistency of performance into his game at AFL level so that you can week on week back him in to play his role. So he has shown that improvement year on year and it needs to continue, as he is still a questionmark at this stage.

Ramsay can provide some run and carry. And has excellent endurance. So that is an element hopefully he incorporates more into his game at AFL level more regularly as that next stage of his development, with that something I really liked of him as a junior.

Shaw is that absolute best case scenario. And his game has some similarities. Not a great kick, but can get the job done 1v1, provide some run, maybe take the odd intercept mark. But in really all those categories, you're hardly looking at the same level of quality as you're talking about with Shaw.

Just when you have someone like Seedsman who from a meters gained perspective offers a lot more with more extreme run and carry ability as the likely competition leaders in running bounces if he plays every game and plays a central role, then has a longer and more damaging kick to him as someone who can better generate offense. Then you've got some really high level ball readers and intercept marks in Scharenberg and Langdon who can in a big way capitalise off our up the field pressure game.
And it's hard to see Ramsay even competing for a rebounding role or lets call it a Heath Shaw style rebounding role.

What you'd hope for with Ramsay is maybe in a back pocket he can offer a balanced shutdown/run and rebound game and continue his safe ball use. And that type of thing would probably compliment a Toovey or Williams deep in the back half. But it's likely that building on those two elements - the running and then the continued development of his shutdown game. Then maybe if he can get a few more intercept marks and continue to get better knowing when he needs to leave his man. He can probably then be considered as a possible long term piece.
 
I have no idea why everyone was so impatient and quick to write this kid off.

I am pretty sure he was the second youngest player in his draft year. In his first year he was younger than nearly all other first year players and was placed on the long term injury list after breaking his wrist. In his second year he was closer in age to more first year players than he was to people in his own year.

Ramsay was always going to take longer than most and with his injury in his first season, an even longer bedding in process was expected. Yet, having only just turned 20 he has played all five games this year, is performing well and has blanketed nearly every opponent he has played on. He does not turn 21 until after the season's finished. He is well ahead of schedule in my opinion.
 
Has been great. Seems willing to take ppl on. Has an excellent side step.


One thing I did notice was that he can't kick on his left. He had to make a kick near the boundary line on ANZAC day and went on his left (right decision), but looked like it was the first time he'd ever used his left! He belted it out on the full. Needs to improve that a bit.
 
ClaytonM said:
But you said he WOULD BE delisted at the end of the year. If you were not so quick to write player off then maybe people wouldn't highlight all the times you are wrong.

I have doubt in the long run he will be best 22 when Sharon, Maynard and others mature, but I would not be stating he should be delisted any time soon. Tooves is a good example of a much maligned player who has forged a very good career. No reason Ramsey cannot do similar.
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Yeh a very strange view (call) by kap i think as it seems very unlikely to come true.
The kid played well on number one draft pick in the country in Lachie Whitfield in under 18's coming back from injury so he must have something in him.
He has good evasiveness and vision twisting and turning with the ball to hand it off to someone else witch i like in only 8 games played compared to sinkers 48 games who sprints 20 meters bounce and kick.
 
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Scodog10 said:
I have to wonder where the knocks on his kicking are coming from? He has the odd monumental brain fade that makes his kicking look a lot worse than it actually is, IMO. On the whole I don't view him as a difference maker by foot ala Seedsman or Pendles, but it's no worse than Langdon's for mine and has been better than Kennedy's at senior level.
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Agree his kicking I would compare of someone like Tarks. Low and flat and pretty fast foot.
 
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