Opinion Adam Goodes

[rodney hoo]

Was Goodes concerned about the headspace of that child he fingered in that rather quaint and contrived piece of theatre at the MCG?
It was a disgraceful and he is rightly getting a bollocking for it

I reckon he would not have known if she was 13 or 20 , all he heard was the abuse, the person getting the bollocking to use your phrase is the mother for letting her get away with it.

 

[Tazmania]

Was Goodes concerned about the headspace of that child he fingered in that rather quaint and contrived piece of theatre at the MCG?
It was a disgraceful and he is rightly getting a bollocking for it

I'm assuming you believe it was improper because of the girls' age?

So at what age does it stop being ok to call someone a racist term like "ape"?

 

[ydraw]

In Japan's case that was certainly true. As nationalist and right wing as any government you'd see. Same with the Nazis (although there is a trend among moron right wingers to claim that the atavistic Nazis were socialists based on their name).

Right Wing = Fascist, I see what you did there.

I don't remember Hirohito bombing Pearl Harbor in an aggressive push to lower taxation and the minimum wage.

Right Wing to me means liberal, in the small l sense of the word. But there's little point arguing that point because we all know exactly where everyone in this thread stands on the issue of anyone who doesn't vote Labor being a white supremacist redneck who kicks puppies.

 

[Moo]

I reckon he would not have known if she was 13 or 20 , all he heard was the abuse, the person getting the bollocking to use your phrase is the mother for letting her get away with it.

I'm assuming you believe it was improper because of the girls' age?

So at what age does it stop being ok to call someone a racist term like "ape"?

It's not about this, it's just an excuse to keep this crap going.

I have no issue with people not liking the pointing out issue, however it has largely become nothing more than an excuse to keep vilifying Goodes.

I'm beginning to think there are a number of people in denial about their own prejudices.

 

[Mr Fonebone]

I reckon he would not have known if she was 13 or 20 , all he heard was the abuse, the person getting the bollocking to use your phrase is the mother for letting her get away with it.

He knew her age after the game and well before the presser the next day when he called her the face of Australian racism.He is a grub.
Also why does he not point the finger at his own kind. There are many whites who have put up with racial insults from aboriginals, including myself.

 

[Moo]

He knew her age after the game and well before the presser the next day when he called her the face of Australian racism.He is a grub.
Also why does he not point the finger at his own kind. There are many whites who have put up with racial insults from aboriginals, including myself.

sleiwos What should he have said .......It's not her fault, she's 13, she's still so innocent, I don't put any blame on her?

 

[Lach72]

How hard is this? Aboriginal man gets made Australian of the year and makes comment about the experience of indigenous people since settlement or invasion depending on your perspective and also calls out a girl who belittled him in a racist fashion by calling him an ape.

White Australia gets all offended saying things like he's dividing Australia and not being inclusive. They're coopting his/Aboriginal Australia's experience and giving it a whole "hey what about us" thing. "We're now offended so you just sit the hell down Adam and by the way that all happened a long time ago so doesn't mean anything"
In other words, "you're being an uppity aboriginal saying these uncomfortable things so how about you sit down and shut up and let us tell you what you should be feeling"
"And furthermore Adam if you don't talk in a way that's acceptable to us all your points are null and void and...hey get this, we're going to harass you and make your life so miserable you'll wish you'd never spoken"
Here's a tip. Adam's experience and those of Aboriginal people are NOT about you unless you're indigenous. It is largely because of white Australia that this has happened.YOU have no right to demean, comment or otherwise tell him to pipe down, be quiet, or otherwise denigrate. About time people stopped flapping their jaws and LISTENED.

He knew her age after the game and well before the presser the next day when he called her the face of Australian racism.He is a grub.
Also why does he not point the finger at his own kind. There are many whites who have put up with racial insults from aboriginals, including myself.

 

[rodney hoo]

He knew her age after the game and well before the presser the next day when he called her the face of Australian racism.He is a grub.
Also why does he not point the finger at his own kind. There are many whites who have put up with racial insults from aboriginals, including myself.

That's your point of view and your entitled to, but disagree 100% with it, Adam Goodes is standing up just like Casius Clay did all them years ago.

 

[Mr Fonebone]

sleiwos What should he have said .......It's not her fault, she's 13, she's still so innocent, I don't put any blame on her?

If he was man enough he should have said " Im sorry I got it wrong. She was only a child and she says she did not intend to make a racist remark and I believe her. Her treatment by the police and ground staff where a child was held and interrogated without her parents present was deplorable and was counter to every reasonable principle as to the treatment of children"

If he had said that there would be no drama now. However he chose to exploit for his own purposes.

 

[jedi mind tricks]

Was Goodes concerned about the headspace of that child he fingered in that rather quaint and contrived piece of theatre at the MCG?
It was a disgraceful and he is rightly getting a bollocking for it

And when do you think people should stop booing him. When he's 50, 60 or when he's dead. Hey why don't you just go and lynch him.

 

[Moo]

If he was man enough he should have said " Im sorry I got it wrong. She was only a child and she says she did not intend to make a racist remark and I believe her. Her treatment by the police and ground staff where a child was held and interrogated without her parents present was deplorable and was counter to every reasonable principle as to the treatment of children"

If he had said that there would be no drama now. However he chose to exploit for his own purposes.

That's pretty specific.

So just saying not her fault and don't blame her - gets what a 6/10?

 

[Lach72]

If he was man enough he should have said " Im sorry I got it wrong. She was only a child and she says she did not intend to make a racist remark and I believe her. Her treatment by the police and ground staff where a child was held and interrogated without her parents present was deplorable and was counter to every reasonable principle as to the treatment of children"

If he had said that there would be no drama now. However he chose to exploit for his own purposes.

"I've got no doubt in my mind she's got no idea what she was calling me last night."

"It's not a witch hunt. I don't want people to go after this girl."

 

[Lach72]

That's pretty specific.

So just saying not her fault and don't blame her - gets what a 6/10?

Yeah...Laughable stuff...should've held a review over police treatment...ffs

 

[ydraw]

Yeah...Laughable stuff...should've held a review over police treatment...ffs

The real issue is that Goodes somehow got the blame for the police treatment of the girl. The police should have got the blame.

If the AFL had come out all that time ago and said "we have issues with the way the Victorian police treated the supporter etc" instead of digging in their heels and suggesting they were acting on AFL orders, then the blame for that incident would have been directed where it should have been: The Victorian Police.

Instead, the way it came out in the media suggested that it was Adam Goodes' fault that the police did what they because nobody was willing to stand up and say that the police acted inappropriately (which they did).

 

[jmadrox]

As a footballer, I dislike some of what he has done in the past, but he will be inducted into the Hall of fame, and might well reach legend status. So I have to respect for him as a footballer. As such, i'd never boo him on the field (unless he had just sniped one of ours or something immediately deserving of a boo, such as kicking for goal after the siren for the win). I my opinion, The "spear throw" is him celebrating his heritage (and Jetta) and I thought it was great. Fans can shout abuse (non racial) with no repercussions, and I thought that was much more tasteful than what I have heard at games.

With respect to him Championing Indigenous rights, i applaud him for what he does. He gets the spot light, and is in a position to highlight these issues to the wider community. I guess I have a real issue with racism, and in the "multicultural" country Australia, has no place.

I grew up in the country, Morawa (Chris Lewis / Mainwaring), Tambellup (Jeff Farmer), and then Albany. My sister and I were friends with many aboriginal kids, visiting their houses and them ours. 99% of the Australian community would have no idea what it is like in these towns / families. Jeff Farmer was constantly criticized and scrutinized for his actions, but by those with no understanding. I wonder how many people know his parents we born on a reservation out side of the town with no power etc? I wonder how many people have met and spoken to members of the stolen generation? There was an aboriginal aid at the School who was one of the stolen generation, pretty sure her name was Hazel (20 years ago now) and she tried so hard to help the kids in the community. It is just so hard when there are constant bad influences from those they look up to, it makes the cycle so hard to break.

I cant claim to understand how indigenous people must feel, but the little insight that I have gives me some empathy.

Racism is till strong in Australia. Be it aboriginals, Muslims, Asians or Africans. I work in Africa, and have seen what it is like first hand in South Africa, and we aren't at that scale, but also, we dont have such a high proportion of indigenous people.

Quite simply, the opportunities that most aboriginal children have are far less than the wider community. This inequality needs to be addressed, but there is no quick fix. The socialist approach of the government has been tried, but now has created a rod for the own back. They need to find a way to elevate the communities, based on their cultural values and beliefs, which happen to be so different from the western / white cultural ideals and value of possession, there is a huge disconnect.

If you think about racism and integration in other indigenous communities, Australia is still relatively early in the development. Brits colonized the America's in the 1600's. Thats ~ 20 generations assuming a new generation every 20 years. Australia was in 1788, roughly 11 generations ago, the scars are a lot fresher. For perspective, it was about 13 generations between the British colonization of America and the American Indian Wars of the 1800's. The Australian frontier was (less of a war, more of a slaughter) stretched until 1934! Some scars will be very fresh in deed.

I dont know what the silver bullet is, or if there even is one, but what Adam has done to bring these issues to the fore front of discussion is great. Some times the truth hurts. Until we admit the wrongs which were done against the indigenous people, they will have trouble moving past it.

People will sit back and say, " it wasnt me, it was done years ago, i had nothing to do with it" but in my opinion, it doesnt matter, we all still benefit from what was done, and we have to be aware that what we are grateful for has come at the cost of others.

 

[Mr Fonebone]

"I've got no doubt in my mind she's got no idea what she was calling me last night."

"It's not a witch hunt. I don't want people to go after this girl."

And when do you think people should stop booing him. When he's 50, 60 or when he's dead. Hey why don't you just go and lynch him.

People will stop will stop disrespecting him if he does two things :

1. Acknowledges that he got it terribly wrong at the MCG and apologises for it.
2. Acknowledges that most Aussies are not racists.

By plucking some random person from the crowd who made a remark that MAY have been racist and tell the world that they are the face of australian racism his message was clear: The crowd at the MCG was composed almost entirely composed of racist rednecks. This is a gross insult to many ordinary decent folk who turn up each week and pay the dollars that he lives rather well on.

And, finally, it would take a lot convince me that this piece of theatre wasn't contrived by Goodes or his associates himself.

I mean c'mon, reconciliation round? All of a sudden he fingers someone in the crowd for saying something that would have heard directed at him and other players by opposition fans a hundred times before. The whole thing was a sham.

 

[Moo]

People will stop will stop disrespecting him if he does two things :

1. Acknowledges that he got it terribly wrong at the MCG and apologises for it.
2. Acknowledges that most Aussies are not racists.

By plucking some random person from the crowd who made a remark that MAY have been racist and tell the world that they are the face of australian racism his message was clear: The crowd at the MCG was composed almost entirely composed of racist rednecks. This is a gross insult to many ordinary decent folk who turn up each week and pay the dollars that he lives rather well on.

And, finally, it would take a lot convince me that this piece of theatre wasn't contrived by Goodes or his associates himself.

I mean c'mon, reconciliation round? All of a sudden he fingers someone in the crowd for saying something that would have heard directed at him and other players by opposition fans a hundred times before. The whole thing was a sham.

Can we rename this thread ...Sometimes Wadjilas Say the Darndest Things?

 

[rodney hoo]

As a footballer, I dislike some of what he has done in the past, but he will be inducted into the Hall of fame, and might well reach legend status. So I have to respect for him as a footballer. As such, i'd never boo him on the field (unless he had just sniped one of ours or something immediately deserving of a boo, such as kicking for goal after the siren for the win). I my opinion, The "spear throw" is him celebrating his heritage (and Jetta) and I thought it was great. Fans can shout abuse (non racial) with no repercussions, and I thought that was much more tasteful than what I have heard at games.

With respect to him Championing Indigenous rights, i applaud him for what he does. He gets the spot light, and is in a position to highlight these issues to the wider community. I guess I have a real issue with racism, and in the "multicultural" country Australia, has no place.

I grew up in the country, Morawa (Chris Lewis / Mainwaring), Tambellup (Jeff Farmer), and then Albany. My sister and I were friends with many aboriginal kids, visiting their houses and them ours. 99% of the Australian community would have no idea what it is like in these towns / families. Jeff Farmer was constantly criticized and scrutinized for his actions, but by those with no understanding. I wonder how many people know his parents we born on a reservation out side of the town with no power etc? I wonder how many people have met and spoken to members of the stolen generation? There was an aboriginal aid at the School who was one of the stolen generation, pretty sure her name was Hazel (20 years ago now) and she tried so hard to help the kids in the community. It is just so hard when there are constant bad influences from those they look up to, it makes the cycle so hard to break.

I cant claim to understand how indigenous people must feel, but the little insight that I have gives me some empathy.

Racism is till strong in Australia. Be it aboriginals, Muslims, Asians or Africans. I work in Africa, and have seen what it is like first hand in South Africa, and we aren't at that scale, but also, we dont have such a high proportion of indigenous people.

Quite simply, the opportunities that most aboriginal children have are far less than the wider community. This inequality needs to be addressed, but there is no quick fix. The socialist approach of the government has been tried, but now has created a rod for the own back. They need to find a way to elevate the communities, based on their cultural values and beliefs, which happen to be so different from the western / white cultural ideals and value of possession, there is a huge disconnect.

If you think about racism and integration in other indigenous communities, Australia is still relatively early in the development. Brits colonized the America's in the 1600's. Thats ~ 20 generations assuming a new generation every 20 years. Australia was in 1788, roughly 11 generations ago, the scars are a lot fresher. For perspective, it was about 13 generations between the British colonization of America and the American Indian Wars of the 1800's. The Australian frontier was (less of a war, more of a slaughter) stretched until 1934! Some scars will be very fresh in deed.

I dont know what the silver bullet is, or if there even is one, but what Adam has done to bring these issues to the fore front of discussion is great. Some times the truth hurts. Until we admit the wrongs which were done against the indigenous people, they will have trouble moving past it.

People will sit back and say, " it wasnt me, it was done years ago, i had nothing to do with it" but in my opinion, it doesnt matter, we all still benefit from what was done, and we have to be aware that what we are grateful for has come at the cost of others.

Excellent post,

 

[The Anchorite]

People will stop will stop disrespecting him if he does two things :

1. Acknowledges that he got it terribly wrong at the MCG and apologises for it.
2. Acknowledges that most Aussies are not racists.

By plucking some random person from the crowd who made a remark that MAY have been racist and tell the world that they are the face of australian racism his message was clear: The crowd at the MCG was composed almost entirely composed of racist rednecks. This is a gross insult to many ordinary decent folk who turn up each week and pay the dollars that he lives rather well on.

And, finally, it would take a lot convince me that this piece of theatre wasn't contrived by Goodes or his associates himself.

I mean c'mon, reconciliation round? All of a sudden he fingers someone in the crowd for saying something that would have heard directed at him and other players by opposition fans a hundred times before. The whole thing was a sham.

Your avatar is one-eyed; I suspect you are completely blind.

 

[Lach72]

So...we can see who really has the problem then

 

[Lach72]

People will stop will stop disrespecting him if he does two things :

1. Acknowledges that he got it terribly wrong at the MCG and apologises for it.
2. Acknowledges that most Aussies are not racists.

By plucking some random person from the crowd who made a remark that MAY have been racist and tell the world that they are the face of australian racism his message was clear: The crowd at the MCG was composed almost entirely composed of racist rednecks. This is a gross insult to many ordinary decent folk who turn up each week and pay the dollars that he lives rather well on.

And, finally, it would take a lot convince me that this piece of theatre wasn't contrived by Goodes or his associates himself.

I mean c'mon, reconciliation round? All of a sudden he fingers someone in the crowd for saying something that would have heard directed at him and other players by opposition fans a hundred times before. The whole thing was a sham.

I mean you didn't read any of the post I quoted you in did you?

 

[Clems Knee]

People will stop will stop disrespecting him if he does two things :

1. Acknowledges that he got it terribly wrong at the MCG and apologises for it.
2. Acknowledges that most Aussies are not racists.

By plucking some random person from the crowd who made a remark that MAY have been racist and tell the world that they are the face of australian racism his message was clear: The crowd at the MCG was composed almost entirely composed of racist rednecks. This is a gross insult to many ordinary decent folk who turn up each week and pay the dollars that he lives rather well on.

And, finally, it would take a lot convince me that this piece of theatre wasn't contrived by Goodes or his associates himself.

I mean c'mon, reconciliation round? All of a sudden he fingers someone in the crowd for saying something that would have heard directed at him and other players by opposition fans a hundred times before. The whole thing was a sham.

you're kidding, right? you're having a lend?

The person wasn't random. the person was close to the fence, and was audible to Goodes. Anyone back from the fence would not be heard.

He didn't get it wrong. He pointed at the person who made the comment. Franklin has copped some racist comments in Tasmania, a Gold Coast player also has. But in many cases the player doesn't hear, or doesn't know where the abuse comes from. Goodes got it right.

Goodes was very upset it was a young girl making the call. He talked about his feelings when he realised the person calling out the abuse was so young. You are being disingenuous by quoting and making a big deal of "the face of Australian racism".

If you really believe that Goodes would have heard racial abuse hundreds of times, I am very concerned at the level of racism at the games you go to. Most likely you are making s**t up. In the last five years I can only remember one incident. A teenage (18 or so) boy (eagles fan) yelled a racist remark at Walters during a preseason match. Walters would not have heard, but I did. I stared the kid down ( I have a good line in hairy eyeballs) and he gulped and said nothing more.

Many Australians are racists. I don't think Goodes has put a number on it, but you have said its less than 50%. Not much to be proud of.

 

[Mr Fonebone]

Goodes would not have heard 100's of racist taunts. He would have heard 100"s of plain ordinary garden variety taunts "you ape" "you animal" "you mongrel" etc etc. If he chooses to he could be offended by any one of them. Normally he would not just like all the other players. This time he chose to be offended for reasons relating to it being reconciliation round.
Call me cynic but that is how I see it.

 

[holy diver]

As a footballer, I dislike some of what he has done in the past, but he will be inducted into the Hall of fame, and might well reach legend status. So I have to respect for him as a footballer. As such, i'd never boo him on the field (unless he had just sniped one of ours or something immediately deserving of a boo, such as kicking for goal after the siren for the win). I my opinion, The "spear throw" is him celebrating his heritage (and Jetta) and I thought it was great. Fans can shout abuse (non racial) with no repercussions, and I thought that was much more tasteful than what I have heard at games.

With respect to him Championing Indigenous rights, i applaud him for what he does. He gets the spot light, and is in a position to highlight these issues to the wider community. I guess I have a real issue with racism, and in the "multicultural" country Australia, has no place.

I grew up in the country, Morawa (Chris Lewis / Mainwaring), Tambellup (Jeff Farmer), and then Albany. My sister and I were friends with many aboriginal kids, visiting their houses and them ours. 99% of the Australian community would have no idea what it is like in these towns / families. Jeff Farmer was constantly criticized and scrutinized for his actions, but by those with no understanding. I wonder how many people know his parents we born on a reservation out side of the town with no power etc? I wonder how many people have met and spoken to members of the stolen generation? There was an aboriginal aid at the School who was one of the stolen generation, pretty sure her name was Hazel (20 years ago now) and she tried so hard to help the kids in the community. It is just so hard when there are constant bad influences from those they look up to, it makes the cycle so hard to break.

I cant claim to understand how indigenous people must feel, but the little insight that I have gives me some empathy.

Racism is till strong in Australia. Be it aboriginals, Muslims, Asians or Africans. I work in Africa, and have seen what it is like first hand in South Africa, and we aren't at that scale, but also, we dont have such a high proportion of indigenous people.

Quite simply, the opportunities that most aboriginal children have are far less than the wider community. This inequality needs to be addressed, but there is no quick fix. The socialist approach of the government has been tried, but now has created a rod for the own back. They need to find a way to elevate the communities, based on their cultural values and beliefs, which happen to be so different from the western / white cultural ideals and value of possession, there is a huge disconnect.

If you think about racism and integration in other indigenous communities, Australia is still relatively early in the development. Brits colonized the America's in the 1600's. Thats ~ 20 generations assuming a new generation every 20 years. Australia was in 1788, roughly 11 generations ago, the scars are a lot fresher. For perspective, it was about 13 generations between the British colonization of America and the American Indian Wars of the 1800's. The Australian frontier was (less of a war, more of a slaughter) stretched until 1934! Some scars will be very fresh in deed.

I dont know what the silver bullet is, or if there even is one, but what Adam has done to bring these issues to the fore front of discussion is great. Some times the truth hurts. Until we admit the wrongs which were done against the indigenous people, they will have trouble moving past it.

People will sit back and say, " it wasnt me, it was done years ago, i had nothing to do with it" but in my opinion, it doesnt matter, we all still benefit from what was done, and we have to be aware that what we are grateful for has come at the cost of others.

Really good post.

 

[XXRL]

The idea that the young girl is the victim and Goodes is the bully doesn't stand up to scrutiny nor does it accord with what Goodes said afterwards:

“To be able to make a stand myself and say ‘racism has a face’ last night and, you know, it was a 13-year-old girl but it’s not her fault. She's 13, she's still so innocent, I don’t put any blame on her. Unfortunately it’s what she hears, the environment she’s grown up in that has made her think it’s okay to call people names. I can guarantee you right now she would have no idea, you know, how it makes anyone feel by calling them an ape … But I think the person that needs the most support is the little girl, you know. People need to get around her, she's 13, she’s uneducated.”

Hardly the words of someone trying to victimise a young girl, but more likely a proud Aboriginal man highlighting a broader societal issue. And good on him for that!

If the police handled things poorly then they should be held to account for that, not Adam Goodes.