Analysis When will we actually address our staggering recent record in crunch games?

[Seeds]

Our performances when the season is on the line have been disastrous if not comical since 2011. Here is what has happened for those who have forgotton or pretend otherwise in our last 8 finals/season knockout games? Its unbelievable when put together.

2012. Freo final at the MCG and we were almost unbackable favourites and got jumped at the start. Never in it at all.
2013. Again Freo final. We were clear favourits again at Geelong and got done in the second half. Atleast we showed up at the start though. That has been rare as the rest of the story shows.
2013. Port. We won. Just. But were clear favourites and four goals down at half time. We simply did not rock up in the first half.
2013. Hawthorn Prelim. Probably our best knockout game since 2011. The only one we can be proud of. But again. 3 goals up at 3qtr time and got run down. When that is the best performance it just shows how staggeringly bad we have been.
2014. Hawthorn Final. Just weren't really in this game at all. You can say it was cos we weren't good enough but we beat them earlier in the year and gave them a massive jump just two weeks earlier before we put the cue in the rack after Mission was Accomplished.
2014. Kangeroos knock out final . Simply didn't show up at the start for a knockout final again. Again. Came back with a wet sail and were clearly better than the roos (we beat them earlier in the year convincingly) but to late.
2015. Must win the last 3 games to make finals. Play two bottom sides out of finals contention and get jumped at the start both weeks. Show basically zero intensity (just two weeks earlier against the Swans we showed amazing intensity but when the season is truly on the line we show nothing in the intensity department) Last game no longer matters. Probably will win in a cantour now.

Why do our players not get up for the knockout games? We can't pretend this isn't an issue anymore. 2011 is long and dusted now. Does anyone have any reason why this might be occurring or is it just a coincidence? Is it the coaches, is it luck, is it the players lack of drive? And most importantly, does anyone have any ideas how the club rectifies this?

 

[catters05]

Our performances when the season is on the line have been disastrous if not comical since 2011. Here is what has happened for those who have forgotton or pretend otherwise in our last 8 finals/season knockout games? Its unbelievable when put together.

2012. Freo final at the MCG and we were almost unbackable favourites and got jumped at the start. Never in it at all.
2013. Again Freo final. We were clear favourits again at Geelong and got done in the second half. Atleast we showed up at the start though. That has been rare as the rest of the story shows.
2013. Port. We won. Just. But were clear favourites and four goals down at half time. We simply did not rock up in the first half.
2013. Hawthorn Prelim. Probably our best knockout game since 2011. The only one we can be proud of. But again. 3 goals up at 3qtr time and got run down. When that is the best performance it just shows how staggeringly bad we have been.
2014. Hawthorn Final. Just weren't really in this game at all. You can say it was cos we weren't good enough but we beat them earlier in the year and gave them a massive jump just two weeks earlier before we put the cue in the rack after Mission was Accomplished.
2014. Kangeroos knock out final . Simply didn't show up at the start for a knockout final again. Again. Came back with a wet sail and were clearly better than the roos (we beat them earlier in the year convincingly) but to late.
2015. Must win the last 3 games to make finals. Play two bottom sides out of finals contention and get jumped at the start both weeks. Show basically zero intensity (just two weeks earlier against the Swans we showed amazing intensity but when the season is truly on the line we show nothing in the intensity department) Last game no longer matters. Probably will win in a cantour now.

Why do our players not get up for the knockout games? We can't pretend this isn't an issue anymore. I. 2011 is long and dusted now. Does anyone have any reason why this might be occurring or is it just a coincidence? Is it the coaches, is it luck, is it the players lack of drive? And most importantly, does anyone have any ideas how the club rectifies this?

Okay, I am going to try think positive about tonight's result, I think our club is just cooked. This will be a great way of letting go of the past now. The media can stop banging on about it.

I hope we give some great send offs next week to some absolute legends of the club as they deserve it. Yep, some have fallen away, but they have given so much to us.

I hope our club focuses on building a great team again rather then trying to Moneyball one. We have some talent, but lets build a game plan around our talent that will work.

We have a hulk of a full forward, lets leave him down there, get some guns around him like SJ and Menzel in 2016. See a backline compete with that...

Lets get some grunt help for Selwood, lets get some anger management into Selwood for how to deal with a hard tag, lets have a plan of what to do with Selwood if he is being defeated by his hard tag.....etc

Lets work better on player management and fingers crossed injuries will be less, Good times ahead!

Also, it will be great when the Sub disappears.... I was unsure why Walker was subbed, was he injured?

 

[Catatonic Shock]

Did you know it took Geelong from 1995 until 2004 to win a final? (winning 1 out of 3 BTW) It took until 2007 for us to have a "winning" finals record!
See what happens when an era finishes and a new one starts, you drop off from the pack, when that happens you don't tend to win finals.
Now luckily for us we have some amazing Champions who could still do enough to ensure we got there, but for want of either form, injury (geez dude go check out 2013 again, we should have won the flag if not for some shocking luck) or simply not being good enough.

If this was the result from a team where Duncan, Caddy, Guthrie, Motlop etc are all 150-200 gamers and Gregson, Murdoch, Lang etc are all well over 100 games then yes there is a worry, but when you have either a handful of 270+game/30+year old tired Champions or a huge amount of 18-23 year old/sub 80 gamers then guess what, we're not going to be winning flags.

The Saints had a similar age bracket not too long ago, their result was a wooden spoon.
* me we are doing alright.

 

[SkittleCats]

2013 was the one that got away.

The rest we simply haven't been good enough to do much more. Luck/injuries/lack of experience have all played there part to contribute to that. It's not a story that is unique to Geelong, every club goes through something similar at some point.

8 years is a fantastic run, and also shouldn't be forgotten, we have been on a fantastic ride.

We'll be back next year, we aren't "Moneyballing" it as some have suggested. The draft in the AFL is a s**t show of speculation and character assessments. And we arent rebuilding, Taylor, Selwood, and Hawkins are the tentpoles. To be in a rebuild implies (ala Carlton/Brisbane) that we are absent players such as that. We need the pieces to fit around those guys, thats why FA/Trading is important now. All the guys we are linked with are in the perfect age bracket, we arent bringing in 29+ year olds. But guys who are 25-26 and in their prime with the majority of their careers ahead of them. Add to that the natural progression of players like Duncan/Motlop/Caddy/Bews/Thurlow/Kolo/Blicavs/Lang/Menzel/Vardy/Gurthie (off the top of my head) and thats a solid group about to enter the 75-150 game mark.

We'll be fine, 9th is us bottoming out, not the beginning of something worse. Thats what it means to be a quality club, which we are.

 

[Bobby_]

Coach is doing a wonderful job. Not one of the available coaches who were interviewed in 2010 could have taken that team to finals, let alone another grand final when there were only ever three teams capable of doing any damage.

Blokes like Chapman (29), Corey (29), Ottens (31), Bartel (27), Selwood (23), Johnson (28), Kelly (27), Taylor (25), Scarlett (32), Enright (30), Milburn (33), Hawkins (23), Ling (30), Podsiadly (30), Wojak (31), Stokes (26), Lonergan (27) . . . they were all cooked! Even the blokes who were 28, 29 years of age were finished at the end of 2010 but somehow, someway, Chris Scott found a way to spark them into action again. It was incredible watching Bartel turn back the clock to the kind of football he was playing one year previously, same with Chappy.

Our coaching staff have been pro active in ensuring our list remains ahead of the pack. They have brought in players no other club ever thought about bringing in. Blokes like Rivers (a once in a generational defender), Stephenson (arguably the greatest VFL ruckman to have ever played the game), McIntosh; Now what a player this guy was (at 24), Clark. His impact in 2015 will never be forgotten, thank you Mitch! Delaney. Brad Scott is losing his mind helping out his brother like this. No wonder North Melbourne are filthy and have been going down hill these last couple of years ('oh wait a minute').

We took a punt on Rhys Stanley, even though he was no longer best 22, and playing in one of the worst lists in the competition at the time, there is no denying this trade will trump any other trade we have done in recent times.
So we said goodbye to Christensen, Toohey, Hamling, Varcoe, (Motlop?) and we continue to revolutionize the game by bending over during trade week and taking it up the a**. It's a sight to behold what has transpired at Cat land in recent times.

I cannot wait until Matthew Krezuer says to Carlton "Guys, it's been swell but I'm off" This is when Geelong do their best work. These choices are ensuring we slowly but surely rise back up the ladder in the same way the Western Bulldogs, Port Adelaide and St Kilda did by backing in their youth/development systems.

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Coach is doing a wonderful job. Not one of the available coaches who were interviewed in 2010 could have taken that team to finals, let alone another grand final when there were only ever three teams capable of doing any damage.

Blokes like Chapman (29), Corey (29), Ottens (31), Bartel (27), Selwood (23), Johnson (28), Kelly (27), Taylor (25), Scarlett (32), Enright (30), Milburn (33), Hawkins (23), Ling (30), Podsiadly (30), Wojak (31), Stokes (26), Lonergan (27) . . . they were all cooked! Even the blokes who were 28, 29 years of age were finished at the end of 2010 but somehow, someway, Chris Scott found a way to spark them into action again. It was incredible watching Bartel turn back the clock to the kind of football he was playing one year previously, same with Chappy.

Our coaching staff have been pro active in ensuring our list remains ahead of the pack. They have brought in players no other club ever thought about bringing in. Blokes like Rivers (a once in a generational defender), Stephenson (arguably the greatest VFL ruckman to have ever played the game), McIntosh; Now what a player this guy was (at 24), Clark. His impact in 2015 will never be forgotten, thank you Mitch! Delaney. Brad Scott is losing his mind helping out his brother like this. No wonder North Melbourne are filthy and have been going down hill these last couple of years ('oh wait a minute').

We took a punt on Rhys Stanley, even though he was no longer best 22, and playing in one of the worst lists in the competition at the time, there is no denying this trade will trump any other trade we have done in recent times.
So we said goodbye to Christensen, Toohey, Hamling, Varcoe, (Motlop?) and we continue to revolutionize the game by bending over during trade week and taking it up the a**. It's a sight to behold what has transpired at Cat land in recent times.

I cannot wait until Matthew Krezuer says to Carlton "Guys, it's been swell but I'm off" This is when Geelong do their best work. These choices are ensuring we slowly but surely rise back up the ladder in the same way the Western Bulldogs, Port Adelaide and St Kilda did by backing in their youth/development systems.

I'm not sure what to make of this.

I'll just sit here and shake my head until it falls free from my neck.

 

[Partridge]

Why do our players not get up for the knockout games? We can't pretend this isn't an issue anymore. 2011 is long and dusted now. Does anyone have any reason why this might be occurring or is it just a coincidence? Is it the coaches, is it luck, is it the players lack of drive? And most importantly, does anyone have any ideas how the club rectifies this?

I'd say yes to coaches, yes to players, no to luck (I don't believe in it, and blaming luck means you won't look for something you can actually try to fix).

 

[Bobby_]

I'm not sure what to make of this.

I'll just sit here and shake my head until it falls free from my neck.

and speaking of revolutionizing the game, how's the recruiting of blokes like Lucey, Luxford, Bathie, Blicavs (big win there). I think we need to look for a high jumper in the next draft. Someone who can move into the ruck to help Walker and Blicavs. They don't have to be tall but they have to be able to jump around 42 inches in the air.
I'm telling you Nakia, we are one of only a few teams that consistently thinks outside the box.

 

[Seeds]

Coach is doing a wonderful job. Not one of the available coaches who were interviewed in 2010 could have taken that team to finals, let alone another grand final when there were only ever three teams capable of doing any damage.

Blokes like Chapman (29), Corey (29), Ottens (31), Bartel (27), Selwood (23), Johnson (28), Kelly (27), Taylor (25), Scarlett (32), Enright (30), Milburn (33), Hawkins (23), Ling (30), Podsiadly (30), Wojak (31), Stokes (26), Lonergan (27) . . . they were all cooked! Even the blokes who were 28, 29 years of age were finished at the end of 2010 but somehow, someway, Chris Scott found a way to spark them into action again. It was incredible watching Bartel turn back the clock to the kind of football he was playing one year previously, same with Chappy.

Our coaching staff have been pro active in ensuring our list remains ahead of the pack. They have brought in players no other club ever thought about bringing in. Blokes like Rivers (a once in a generational defender), Stephenson (arguably the greatest VFL ruckman to have ever played the game), McIntosh; Now what a player this guy was (at 24), Clark. His impact in 2015 will never be forgotten, thank you Mitch! Delaney. Brad Scott is losing his mind helping out his brother like this. No wonder North Melbourne are filthy and have been going down hill these last couple of years ('oh wait a minute').

We took a punt on Rhys Stanley, even though he was no longer best 22, and playing in one of the worst lists in the competition at the time, there is no denying this trade will trump any other trade we have done in recent times.
So we said goodbye to Christensen, Toohey, Hamling, Varcoe, (Motlop?) and we continue to revolutionize the game by bending over during trade week and taking it up the a**. It's a sight to behold what has transpired at Cat land in recent times.

I cannot wait until Matthew Krezuer says to Carlton "Guys, it's been swell but I'm off" This is when Geelong do their best work. These choices are ensuring we slowly but surely rise back up the ladder in the same way the Western Bulldogs, Port Adelaide and St Kilda did by backing in their youth/development systems.

That may be fine but this is about out performances in finals and knockout games. Why are they so bad compared to the games that aren't as critical?

 

[Willo_]

and speaking of revolutionizing the game, how's the recruiting of blokes like Lucey, Luxford, Bathie, Blicavs (big win there). I think we need to look for a high jumper in the next draft. Someone who can move into the ruck to help Walker and Blicavs. They don't have to be tall but they have to be able to jump around 42 inches in the air.
I'm telling you Nakia, we are one of only a few teams that consistently thinks outside the box.

So you have an issue with us using the last spot on the list to try a different category rookie?

 

[Bobby_]

That may be fine but this is about out performances in finals and knockout games. Why are they so bad compared to the games that aren't as critical?

Your guess is as good as mine.

 

[Bobby_]

So you have an issue with us using the last spot on the list to try a different category rookie?

sure Shane
Let's go back to recruiting blokes who kicked the footy around throughout all their childhood as opposed to recruiting blokes who picked up the footy at age 16 or 17.

Although, I wouldn't mind a high jumper.

 

[Seeds]

Did you know it took Geelong from 1995 until 2004 to win a final? (winning 1 out of 3 BTW) It took until 2007 for us to have a "winning" finals record!
See what happens when an era finishes and a new one starts, you drop off from the pack, when that happens you don't tend to win finals.
Now luckily for us we have some amazing Champions who could still do enough to ensure we got there, but for want of either form, injury (geez dude go check out 2013 again, we should have won the flag if not for some shocking luck) or simply not being good enough.

If this was the result from a team where Duncan, Caddy, Guthrie, Motlop etc are all 150-200 gamers and Gregson, Murdoch, Lang etc are all well over 100 games then yes there is a worry, but when you have either a handful of 270+game/30+year old tired Champions or a huge amount of 18-23 year old/sub 80 gamers then guess what, we're not going to be winning flags.

The Saints had a similar age bracket not too long ago, their result was a wooden spoon.
**** me we are doing alright.

We finished equal top of the ladder twice since 2011 and played plenty of games where we were clear favourites Freo twice, port, North and then the two recent games. Between 1995 and 2004 we only lost one finals game where we were favourites (the nth game where we got monstered by carey in the wet).

 

[Seeds]

I did get engaged on the day of the 2012 finals game versus Freo and since then our finals record has gone from amazing to beyond pathetic. Does anyone believe in jinxes?

 

[Catatonic Shock]

We finished equal top of the ladder twice since 2011 and played plenty of games where we were clear favourites Freo twice, port, North and then the two recent games. Between 1995 and 2004 we only lost one finals game where we were favourites (the nth game where we got monstered by carey in the wet).

If you truly believe we were a genuine shot for the Flag last year, or even to win 2 finals, then you may as well delete this thread.
I presume the other year is 2013, surely even the most optimistic person could see we limped into that finals series and last 2 months of the year.
Seriously in 2013 we had zero rucks, zero key forwards, lost Enright and Chapman and STILL almost beat the eventual Premiers after having everything go for them, and everything against us.

 

[Seeds]

I'm not sure what to make of this.

I'll just sit here and shake my head until it falls free from my neck.

Lol just read bobbys post properly. Wow. I can't believe anyone could believe that. All our gun players were cooked at 27???? Despite finishing equal top of the ladder in the past year and having one bad game where our tactics were destroyed.

 

[dazbroncos]

I did get engaged on the day of the 2012 finals game versus Freo and since then our finals record has gone from amazing to beyond pathetic. Does anyone believe in jinxes?

It IS your fault!

A hex, a hex on you!.

Go Catters.

(not really)

 

[Seeds]

If you truly believe we were a genuine shot for the Flag last year, or even to win 2 finals, then you may as well delete this thread.
I presume the other year is 2013, surely even the most optimistic person could see we limped into that finals series and last 2 months of the year.
Seriously in 2013 we had zero rucks, zero key forwards, lost Enright and Chapman and STILL almost beat the eventual Premiers after having everything go for them, and everything against us.

Since when was I talking about flags???? I'm talking about getting jumped in finals against teams that we were clearly favoured to beat. You can't pretend that we were clearly playing superior opponents otherwise you should of made a fortune betting against the bookies.

 

[catempire]

Stop the presses: average quality list finishes mid-table.

 

[cynical]

the club is too reactive not proactive

clubs like the saints and bulldogs have gone past us

they realised quickly that they weren't good enough to win a flag and got on the front foot turning over their lists and getting kids

having 9 guys over 30 in 2015 yet getting rid of hunt/hamling/brown/varcoe and picking up a washed up kpf/ruck and giving up a 10 year player (hugh goddard) for a project ruckman is a joke

the club has gone backwards since 2011 (and not because of ladder position)

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

I'm telling you Nakia, we are one of only a few teams that consistently thinks outside the box.

That goes without saying because there's certainly not much thinking going on inside the box.

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Lol just read bobbys post properly. Wow. I can't believe anyone could believe that. All our gun players were cooked at 27???? Despite finishing equal top of the ladder in the past year and having one bad game where our tactics were destroyed.

I'm still assuming it was full of sarcasm... Anyway need to go, my head is hanging on by a thread.

 

[shadow cat]

Did you know it took Geelong from 1995 until 2004 to win a final? (winning 1 out of 3 BTW) It took until 2007 for us to have a "winning" finals record!
See what happens when an era finishes and a new one starts, you drop off from the pack, when that happens you don't tend to win finals.
Now luckily for us we have some amazing Champions who could still do enough to ensure we got there, but for want of either form, injury (geez dude go check out 2013 again, we should have won the flag if not for some shocking luck) or simply not being good enough.

If this was the result from a team where Duncan, Caddy, Guthrie, Motlop etc are all 150-200 gamers and Gregson, Murdoch, Lang etc are all well over 100 games then yes there is a worry, but when you have either a handful of 270+game/30+year old tired Champions or a huge amount of 18-23 year old/sub 80 gamers then guess what, we're not going to be winning flags.

The Saints had a similar age bracket not too long ago, their result was a wooden spoon.
**** me we are doing alright.

most clubs would have given up but we have stayed up the ladder for a long time and that is a great effect buy the club we should be very proud i agree we could have won 2013 freo were terrible that day.

 

[Bobby_]

I'm not sure what to make of this.

I'll just sit here and shake my head until it falls free from my neck.

Lol just read bobbys post properly. Wow. I can't believe anyone could believe that. All our gun players were cooked at 27???? Despite finishing equal top of the ladder in the past year and having one bad game where our tactics were destroyed.

That goes without saying because there's certainly not much thinking going on inside the box.

yeh' my attempt as sarcasm has clearly traveled well over your heads

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

yeh' my attempt as sarcasm has clearly traveled well over your heads

Not mine.